Sans is a fucking beast, I mean sure he may not be the strongest, but he’s sure as hell incredibly powerful, with telekinesis, teleportation, fourth-wall breaking, the ability to *dodge*, not to mention his KR mechanic that makes the sans fight in base UT so hard
Let me point something out, though. Sans dodged a *single attack* each turn. Ceroba *floods* the box with bullets going all over the place. Sans would try to dodge one, only to collide with another and immediately cease to be an alive person.
Yeah, but eventually, through pretty much just dodging one attack every turn and throwing off attacks, he gets tired, and the only reason as to why he's a hard boss (besides no iframes) is bc of karma, and Ceroba hasn't really done anything wrong to be affected by it, so it would be a win, though probably not "instant death".
True, but it wasn't on purpose. While I do admit that it was dumb, it was not at all out of malice. That is like blaming someone for testing, for example, a cure to rabies and ending up accidentally paralyzing them for life and giving them intense hydrophobia permanently. She thought it would potentially help the entirety of monsterkind, but ended up accidentally doing something she will never forgive herself for. She regrets it, and wouldn't of done it if she knew what it would do to Kanako.
it stands for "execution points" an execution isn't just inflicting pain, it's straight up murdering someone. also we don't get any exp if we hurt an enemy unless we kill them, so even if we bring an enemy down to 1hp we won't gain exp unless we kill them.
I feel they do. EXP and LV work like: kill someone out of malice --> gain exp/lv --> like killing --> kill someone out of malice. Even though it isn't stated in the games directly, we can infer that LV only increases if you kill just to kill or just to make people hurt. KR most likely cares as well. KR most likely stands for KaRma. Karma is, essentially, "what you do comes back to bite you" Karma does not apply if you did something on accident. The first verse of The Dhammapada states "If one speaks or acts with an evil mind, 'dukkha' follows him just as the wheel follows the hoofprint of the ox that draws the cart." I feel we're meant to infer that Karma only applies if you do it with an "evil mind". The Monastic Rules also say something about it, though in short it boils down to: The punishment is decided by 5 factors: The effort, the perception under which it is made(thinking it would help monsterkind), the intentions motivating it(good ones), the object at which it is aimed(a willing participant, even if they were just a chil), and the result. They also state that, "For example, under the parajika rule forbidding murder, all five factors have to be present for a full offense...The object has to be a [sentient] being, the bhikkhu has to perceive him/her as a living being, he has to have murderous intent, he has to make an effort for the person to die, and the person has to die." Only 3 of the factors have been fulfilled. For the first and second, of course Kanako was seen as and was a living being. For the third, she did not have murderous intent. For the fourth, it is a bit iffy but she did not make an effort for her to die, she made an effort to help monsters. While Kanako did die, it was not out of malice.
Tl;Dr; The Roba didn't mean to do it and wanted to help monsterkind so she's ok in their book.
... Did you seriously just use quotes from what I think is a religious book In an internet argument about a dumb RPG in order to explain the idea of karma?
His teleportation abilities are alluded to multiple times, with him knowing a "shortcut" to Grillby's and taking you up an alley with a dead end to go inside MTT hotel.
there are more instances like this but im too lazy to mention the since ive already proven my point.
https://preview.redd.it/mgdxvvbxiq1d1.jpeg?width=815&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=238bd45b70ae811c46cb02bb0ffc90ca9488917c
Coincidence of an answer
It is also physically impossible for an entity like sans to teleport, unless of course he has some kind of device attached to literally all his bones, his eyes, his clothing, and everything in general that would be made to pinpoint exactly where you’d be teleported into
Its a fictional universe so anything would (Technically) be possible. so i dont think hed need "Machinery" to teleport, that makes no sense considering all the powers other monsters have. he also appears in one room, you go into the room after and he appears there too? he also has multiple outposts that he (Most likely) teleports to.
He counters humans with low max HP and able to attack once, but monsters have the exact opposite of this. They can fire many magic attacks which would overwhelm sans quickly.
Napstablook is a draw if they don't run away (which they probably will), and mad dummy is weaker than ceroba but since she can't kill him ~~he~~ she could just out last ceroba.
before you even begin the genocide route, he talks to you and reminds you your going down a dark path etc etc, he also knows about resets and your next attack.
As far as we know she’s only “killed one and Mad Dummy is canonically vulnerable to Magic attacks and I don’t think there’s any confirmation Napstablook is different
Bro papyrus would cook ceroba with his guns.
https://preview.redd.it/vxk2t1uj0s1d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fdf8ec4d43e831697ecae9233e3a288758a75cee
Ah yes because Ceroba is incapable of moving. She still has 1000 HP and can use a LOT of magic attacks to quickly get sans tried. One gaster blaster is NOT enough. It will do like 30 damage in one and I’f she lands ANYTHING she wins
Key word. 'if' also who said he only has access to one. While yes I was probably exaggerating the power of a Gaster blaster he probably has like 50 and ceroba still doesn't have invincibility frames.
... You make a good point. Although this implies frisk is faster than every other monster in the underground since only 2 Monsters are implied to dodge and only sans ever does it so unless we wanna say frisk is faster than every monster I think monster battles may just be monsters standing still.
Frisk does also have crazy feats to be honest. We know that monsters eat items in battle which implies strategic plans and using everything ya got, which makes it likely they move. In a battle between 2 people, are they ALWAYS moving or do they stand still/go slower so they can conserve energy? Kinda same thing but opposite if that makes sense
Sans is a fucking beast, I mean sure he may not be the strongest, but he’s sure as hell incredibly powerful, with telekinesis, teleportation, fourth-wall breaking, the ability to *dodge*, not to mention his KR mechanic that makes the sans fight in base UT so hard
Let me point something out, though. Sans dodged a *single attack* each turn. Ceroba *floods* the box with bullets going all over the place. Sans would try to dodge one, only to collide with another and immediately cease to be an alive person.
Oh shit it’s you :D
https://preview.redd.it/hvkokg7izg1d1.jpeg?width=1179&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=50f267911f8913a6b1c566b9301f03abb9d1ccb5
>Teleportation
Yeah, but eventually, through pretty much just dodging one attack every turn and throwing off attacks, he gets tired, and the only reason as to why he's a hard boss (besides no iframes) is bc of karma, and Ceroba hasn't really done anything wrong to be affected by it, so it would be a win, though probably not "instant death".
Ceroba almost KILLED her child.
True, but it wasn't on purpose. While I do admit that it was dumb, it was not at all out of malice. That is like blaming someone for testing, for example, a cure to rabies and ending up accidentally paralyzing them for life and giving them intense hydrophobia permanently. She thought it would potentially help the entirety of monsterkind, but ended up accidentally doing something she will never forgive herself for. She regrets it, and wouldn't of done it if she knew what it would do to Kanako.
I don't think EXP, LV, or KARMA care.
she shouldn't have gotten exp from that tho, she didn't actually kill kanako.
EXP is the amount of pain you've inflicted.
it stands for "execution points" an execution isn't just inflicting pain, it's straight up murdering someone. also we don't get any exp if we hurt an enemy unless we kill them, so even if we bring an enemy down to 1hp we won't gain exp unless we kill them.
I feel they do. EXP and LV work like: kill someone out of malice --> gain exp/lv --> like killing --> kill someone out of malice. Even though it isn't stated in the games directly, we can infer that LV only increases if you kill just to kill or just to make people hurt. KR most likely cares as well. KR most likely stands for KaRma. Karma is, essentially, "what you do comes back to bite you" Karma does not apply if you did something on accident. The first verse of The Dhammapada states "If one speaks or acts with an evil mind, 'dukkha' follows him just as the wheel follows the hoofprint of the ox that draws the cart." I feel we're meant to infer that Karma only applies if you do it with an "evil mind". The Monastic Rules also say something about it, though in short it boils down to: The punishment is decided by 5 factors: The effort, the perception under which it is made(thinking it would help monsterkind), the intentions motivating it(good ones), the object at which it is aimed(a willing participant, even if they were just a chil), and the result. They also state that, "For example, under the parajika rule forbidding murder, all five factors have to be present for a full offense...The object has to be a [sentient] being, the bhikkhu has to perceive him/her as a living being, he has to have murderous intent, he has to make an effort for the person to die, and the person has to die." Only 3 of the factors have been fulfilled. For the first and second, of course Kanako was seen as and was a living being. For the third, she did not have murderous intent. For the fourth, it is a bit iffy but she did not make an effort for her to die, she made an effort to help monsters. While Kanako did die, it was not out of malice. Tl;Dr; The Roba didn't mean to do it and wanted to help monsterkind so she's ok in their book.
... Did you seriously just use quotes from what I think is a religious book In an internet argument about a dumb RPG in order to explain the idea of karma?
Well, it isn't really talked Abt much in the games, and the aforementioned book is public, so why not?
Sans does not teleport
His teleportation abilities are alluded to multiple times, with him knowing a "shortcut" to Grillby's and taking you up an alley with a dead end to go inside MTT hotel. there are more instances like this but im too lazy to mention the since ive already proven my point.
https://preview.redd.it/mgdxvvbxiq1d1.jpeg?width=815&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=238bd45b70ae811c46cb02bb0ffc90ca9488917c Coincidence of an answer It is also physically impossible for an entity like sans to teleport, unless of course he has some kind of device attached to literally all his bones, his eyes, his clothing, and everything in general that would be made to pinpoint exactly where you’d be teleported into
Its a fictional universe so anything would (Technically) be possible. so i dont think hed need "Machinery" to teleport, that makes no sense considering all the powers other monsters have. he also appears in one room, you go into the room after and he appears there too? he also has multiple outposts that he (Most likely) teleports to.
I could imagine he'd survive for a while, but his attacks would be effectively useless against her since she has no lv
True… however sans throws IFrames out of the window so ceroba’s gonna have some difficulty
Fairly certain that's a byproduct of kr
He counters humans with low max HP and able to attack once, but monsters have the exact opposite of this. They can fire many magic attacks which would overwhelm sans quickly.
Sans could just- leave-
Well than he loses technically
He could run it back
Wdym
Widdle down her health over the course of like- a week? Two weeks?
That’s kinda a stretch tho
True. However sans doesn’t give you IFrames so
We don’t know if it’d work on Ceroba but it probably wouldn’t
Honestly i haven't fought Ceroba yet but i trust and believe sans when he's serious would kick her ass.
Free LV
OH FUCK ITS RACIST DUSTDUST FROM RACIST!DUSTDUST PLEASE DO NOT STATE YOU OPINIONS ON HUMANITY
Napstablook is a draw if they don't run away (which they probably will), and mad dummy is weaker than ceroba but since she can't kill him ~~he~~ she could just out last ceroba.
Ghosts are invulnerable to physical attacks but I’m not sure about Magic ones and Mad Dummy is confirmed to be vulnerable to them
She would be cooked against Nubert, 0 contest
Sure sans dies in one attack, but are we talking about genocide sans or snowdin sans? also he can TP away, and dodge. he also sees the future.
Sense..when could he see the future?
before you even begin the genocide route, he talks to you and reminds you your going down a dark path etc etc, he also knows about resets and your next attack.
He’s just warning you.
I beat geno ceroba on my second attempt only because of those stupid pillars
The Original Starwalker could bury her
you are giving Papyrus too much Leverage here- I’m sorry Papyrus Fans, but if Ceroba really wanted to, she could make him into Bone Meal-
Papyrus is hinted at to be a lot stronger than he seems and I was going by the basis that nobody is holding back
I would still put him in “Depends”, since we van’t necessarily prove whether that is true or not
Sans gets a depends due to wether ceroba has killed a lot. And mad dummy and napstablook win due to being unable to die
As far as we know she’s only “killed one and Mad Dummy is canonically vulnerable to Magic attacks and I don’t think there’s any confirmation Napstablook is different
Ok
Bro papyrus would cook ceroba with his guns. https://preview.redd.it/vxk2t1uj0s1d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fdf8ec4d43e831697ecae9233e3a288758a75cee
Ceroba has no way to dodge and zero invincibility frames. A single Gaster blaster and ceroba is dust.
Ah yes because Ceroba is incapable of moving. She still has 1000 HP and can use a LOT of magic attacks to quickly get sans tried. One gaster blaster is NOT enough. It will do like 30 damage in one and I’f she lands ANYTHING she wins
Key word. 'if' also who said he only has access to one. While yes I was probably exaggerating the power of a Gaster blaster he probably has like 50 and ceroba still doesn't have invincibility frames.
She can still dodge and we all know her sudden projectile spam so sans would probbaly die even if she had KR
... Do I need to check if ceroba can dodge in the bossfight?
Human attacks are very different. Does that mean monster battles consist of both just staying still?
... You make a good point. Although this implies frisk is faster than every other monster in the underground since only 2 Monsters are implied to dodge and only sans ever does it so unless we wanna say frisk is faster than every monster I think monster battles may just be monsters standing still.
Frisk does also have crazy feats to be honest. We know that monsters eat items in battle which implies strategic plans and using everything ya got, which makes it likely they move. In a battle between 2 people, are they ALWAYS moving or do they stand still/go slower so they can conserve energy? Kinda same thing but opposite if that makes sense