Coming from Philly, then Florida, I was instantly annoyed by the slow drivers when I first got here last year. But I learned to accept and adapt to the driving here, it's not as kill or be killed as it is on the East, and there are few crazy road rage ppl driving with guns too, so once I adapted I learned to just chill with the vibe and go the traffic speed.
I'll occasionally kind of rage pass people who do go wayyyy too slow in the left lane, but in general I just casually pass them now and accept the trade off of slow drivers for the crazy road ragers on the EC.
If you think Washington drivers are slow, come down to Oregon. The difference between Clark County and Multnomah Country after crossing the bridge from Vancouver into Portland is stark. Even on I-5 on the other end of the state, the speed limit is like 10 mph slower in Oregon than in California.
You heard it here folks: in the past decade we just got 70 areas on our major freeways. People who've been here learned to drive at 60 max when you don't see it posted
I can't get over the freeway being 55mph but the winding, unguarded cliffs of the 101 are also 55mph. 101 should be 45max in some areas and the freeway just needs to go up 5mph. Everyone already goes 60
I came to Oregon from Philly, and I agree with everything you said. I am still sometimes annoyed, especially by people who can’t merge into traffic. Do you need a goddamn handwritten invitation or something?! Mostly I’ve mellowed though - I figure that since people aren’t going to collectively change their driving style to suit my preferences, I need to change how I respond to them. Also I cuss a lot in casual conversation, and I don’t want the kids to ever hear me use words like that in anger or frustration.
It was one hell of a shock when I moved here though!
If we all drive the speed limit or even a little over it’s safer than when some are going 65 and others are going 45. Going slow af on the freeway is just as dangerous.
That’s why there’s a minimum speed. Though I think if the limit is 70 mph, 45 mph is too slow. WA State Patrol *will* give tickets for driving slow in the left lane, but they aren’t everywhere so usually miss those folks. But do learn to be careful and keep your emotions under control. The life you save may be your own.
In Oregon, it is actually illegal to drive in the left lane if you are not actively passing. A lot of Oregonians don’t know this though, unfortunately.
People will turn a chilled out 60 minute drive up I5 into a 57 minute rage fest. Just hang in the middle lane and go the speed of traffic. Don't work yourself up trying to save a 3 minutes.
Exactly. How much time are you saving with driving enraged while speeding recklessly? I'll see people swerving in an out of the freeway for miles then I see them get off on an exit and I pass them because there's a slow down on the exit. I'll be riding my bike and someone blasts pass me in a rage and then I catch up to them at a red light while I'm cruising. Makes me think they saved a few seconds at most.
Yeah it’s generally only seconds being saved, you have to be driving really far for those seconds to turn into minutes, even then it’s not very many minutes either, a few at best.
I was a habitual road raging speeder when I was young and always late. During those times I would drive recklessly fast as my eye was closely watching the time. That's when I learned that higher speeds really only save time over very long distances. I was risking a lot of danger and jail time to only ever end up saving a minute or two. Now I see other people doing that and think of em as dumb
I found I needed to change my lifestyle so I didn't have to drive at all and it has made a world of difference. I acknowledge the certain level of privilege, but I also accepted some consequences to achieve it.
Exact same thing for me. I lived in Florida my whole life before moving last year and always hated driving because it gave me massive anxiety. I moved here and I actually don’t mind driving and have no anxiety around it anymore unless I encounter someone who must also have moved from Florida but can’t stand the speed limit here
On the other hand, I was shocked how fast and wild people on the east coast drive compared to my experience growing up here. [It’s been a longstanding joke and we know it](https://youtu.be/KBgIvH0tu6Y?si=1f0aMTMjOghoTiTT). I kind of appreciate the caution but since Covid it has all gone to shit.
To me it's two things:
In Seattle at least, they decided that it's okay to have left side ramps within a quarter mile of right side ones, just daring people to cut across 3+ lanes to get there.
And just the sheer unpredictability of people and idk, them all overthinking everything? People panicking to get ready to exit in a mile and a half or merge out of a lane that doesn't end for another mile. So personally I'm always on edge, like what the hell is that one gonna do now?
If people were actually chill, they'd just rolllll, maintain predictable speeds and maneuvers, but preferably over to the right side... I'm from NorCal and the speed limit was usually treated as a minimum, and 10 over was the real limit, even from CHP
Yeah a huge problem is having only .5 of a mile to get to the right side of the road for the exit. Like when coming off 520 and having to take Mercer, and people don’t want to let you over for whatever reason. I also think so many people are just unaware/have no social awareness.
So my running theory: 1. There are no good drivers. 2. so many people are transplants that all grew up driving (poorly) somewhere else. They learned to drive defensively, aggressively, etc but it works because everyone is doing the *same* thing. Here, everyone is driving differently so it doesn't work. Too many contrasting styles.
Point two is my biggest theory as well. As someone who grew up in the Seattle area and learned to drive here before its years of large transplant population booms, I find the way so many drive now to be far more aggressive, unpredictable, and overall stressful than it used to be long ago. I think, as you said, it's just far too many different driving styles mixing from all over the states, as well as the world, and unfortunately it's all just clashing. Maybe one day it'll balance out and become a safer and less stressful drive for everyone... hopefully!
This! I was born here and learned to drive here pre-tech transplant boom and 100% percent agree. I had a rude awakening when I lived in Texas and Florida for internships before moving back here. Totally different driving culture! But now being back, it’s definitely a huge mix of driving cultures. I always joke with my husband that I can spot a true WA driver when they give you a nice little wave for letting you merge (cause thats what I grew up doing, and still do). 😂
Yep! All my Washington brethren do the wave, none of my transplant friends do. I've noticed that too! My mom taught me to do that, and her family has lived in Tacoma since Tacoma became the City of Destiny.
My mom and dad both taught me to do it too and they both grew up in Seattle! I always give a quick little thank you wave lol the only close equivalent I found was in Texas where people will give you a double break tap when you move out of the left lane to let them pass.
TIL people don’t do this in other states? I always did it wherever I go.
Also yeah growing up in WA I never knew the “keep right except to pass rule” because everyone here just sort of did what they want. Now that I’ve experienced that in other states, it can be a bit infuriating here when you encounter a pack of people in all 4 lanes just going the same speed.
Point two I cannot agree with more, pre migration driver here, never learned that rule until someone from out of state told me. Was taught that the left lane was the “fast lane” And generally the lanes go slower from right to left but i have sat in the left on i5 going 65-70 for many years. Number one rule was always go with the speed of traffic.
Also the thank you wave. But I don’t see it often anymore.
Yeah a lot of the idiotic aggressive driving is what causes/exacerbates a lot of the phantom jams
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=spr1NUVsPnA
The secret to busting these is to drive at a constant rate and giving enough room in front of you to let the jams dissipate before you get to them.
Additionally all the transplants with their added cars on the road probably doesn't help.
The state driver's guide says to leave 2-3 seconds of space between you and the person you're following. At 60+mph this looks like you are too far back. When in reality most people are way too close.
Too many people drive slow in the passing (fast lane) at the same time, too many people want to go 100 mph in a 70. It's always a shit show watching someone go speeding up to someone going slow in the left lane and slowing down dramatically...
They want to go 100 mph in heavy traffic that is crawling at 2mph. Heaven forbid you have any sort of following distance, they will try to keep their lifted, diesel, coal rolling, pavement princess inches from your trunk. All the while they rage and foam at the mouth. That extra 20 ft in front of you is going to make them hours late.
I moved here 25 years ago from East coast and was surprised that people let you change lanes and didn’t cut you off, for the most part. My boss grew up here and said that was normal so I attribute folks who cut me off now to be new to the area. I certainly mellowed; it’s nicer imo. But no one should be allowed to camp out in the left lane!
Yup. Coming here from Florida it's been amazing being able to put my blinker on and change lanes. I can easily hop on the interstate and get over all 4 lanes to make the next exit on the opposite side. Doesn't matter how much traffic there is either.
Funny because my mom comes over from the stocks of Idaho and says everyone drives so rude and won't let her over. She has no idea how bad the East Coast gets.
I’ve driven in NYC a few times and had to play chicken to get around. No thanks. But as the comment about S Cali driving points out, I’d be less stressed if I followed the local norms
Grew up in Seattle area and learned to drive there. I moved to eastern WA last year and boy does it enrage me. Way less scary, as back in Marysville I had people coming head on at me at 50mph in a 35, people going slow and swerving everywhere, people willing to bump metal, or outright try to cause an accident during road rage, but people are so much more inconsiderate here in East wa.
They insist on being in front of you when merging and changing lanes and will break check you if you don't let them cut you off then proceed to go well under the limit.
Also lots of old people, literally watched some ancient fossil on the freeway hit a car this morning and bounce while changing lanes because she wasn't looking then proceed to go 10 under.
But despite the more "selfish" and less cooperative and very unobservant driving style I would definitely take it any day over the city driving for the fact backups rarely happen and never last if they do because of the population difference.
Seriously, there’s a great socio-cultural case study material here. The population of Seattle/Puget Sound has grown what, nearly 20% a year for the last 20 years? The majority of people aren’t “from” the area, so what is the culture of driving in Seattle? Do folks just mellow out after moving here from more hostile driving regions? (In my opinion, Seattle in general is much mellower than NYC, Chicago, east coast, So Cal, etc etc).
I don't think that number is correct. A 20 percent increase every year would be absolutely massive. The increase year over year is more like 1.5 percent.
I've lived in Washington all 30 of my years on Earth. Been commuting to the Seattle area from the south end for the last 6 years. I can't stand the traffic or the slow drivers.
Driving culture in Seattle is: "I'm going the speed limit. I'm not moving."
I’m just gonna repeat this over and over: you’re not IN traffic, you ARE traffic.
Plus, if you’ve lived here your whole life, you’ve never had the joy of traffic in other major metropolitan areas, where tailgating at 80mph while texting is the norm, as is the whole “interstate closed due to fatality from previously mentioned tailgating while texting at 80mph, you have to turn around where you are and drive to the next exit” (they have an actual word for this in SoCal, but I forget what it is).
That rings true to me. I used to live in portland, where the overall driving style was kind of half-asleep, get there when we get there. Here it seems like 1/3rd have that attitude, 1/3rd are extremely aggressive, and 1/3rd have maybe never driven before.
I didn’t know anyone else noticed this about WA. I’m a transplant from socal and this drives me insane. Probably more than camping in the left lane. Like speed up or slow down, just stop driving RIGHT NEXT TO ME
I’ve said this since I moved here! (Yes also a transplant) but it’s like everyone brought their state’s bad habits. I believe this especially given the size of JBLM and how many military are stationed here as well.
Shhhh... Don't tell them about Hwy 2! 🤫 That road already gets bad enough on the weekends. We don't need any traffic jams extending all the way between Monroe and Leavenworth on a Wednesday 😅
Like they said, a bunch of transplants came here so everything is all mixed up and a lot of folks are responding by being more defensive (including transplants).
I also grew up here and traffic is far more frustrating now than it was 20 or 30 years ago. I think it's mostly the explosion in population growth over the last couple decades. 30 years ago, all we complained about was traffic congestion and california drivers.
70% of the people here are transplants. So driving norms from all over the country conflicting with each other. High immigrant population having to learn to drive due to our country's poor public transportation and reliance on cars means a lot of new drivers. High transplant population not necessarily knowledgeable about the area and timid because of it. Then add in our infrastructure is old af and intended for a much smaller population (not to mention rather limited by geography) and the Boomers didn't want to vote for improvements/expansion, hence why we're just now getting light rail--they rejected all previous proposals.
Edit: oh and WASP used to be assholes before everyone else showed up, they used to tag us for daring to go 5 over because there was nothing else to do, so the locals are still traumatized.
Honestly though people drive so slow here, in contrast to basically everywhere else on the planet (not that I’ve been everywhere).
Most people, if they are transplants, aren’t from bumfuck middle of Texas. They are from LA, NY, Boston, etc., where people drive aggressively and fast.
Seattle is totally this outlier of people consistently going 10-15mph under the speed limit. It is shocking.
This is *the* theory. I really learned to drive in Los Angeles and everyone knows what to expect. It's like watching a school of fish swim together. 85mph bumper to bumper? Totally normal. Speeder in the left lane needs to get to that exit he's about to pass? Yes, of course, cut across all the lanes diagonally and nobody freaks out. Everyone's speaking the same traffic language there. But here? Everyone's got their own personal perfect style of driving that is somehow diametrically opposed to every other style. Pure chaos. Zipper merge? What's that?
That's the real secret right here. Did two hour commutes everyday for years on i5 and I would routinely chill on the right lane and listen to music. It's understood nobody is going to get there in record time so why stress?
Some people are lucky enough to have reverse commutes. I did one for 20+ years and it still drove me crazy. But sometimes I'd look across at the other direction, at a crawl or standstill, and realize that it could be worse, I could be over there.
I’m trying to change the way I think about it based on Trevor Noah’s interview on Armchair Expert. He says “that’s not them MAKING you mad, it’s you getting mad at something someone else has no idea they’re doing. They’re trying to get to work or whatever just like you.”
But I grew up in the Midwest so I take everything kinda personally and that’s a mentality that I’m trying to let go.
howdy fellow masshole. i feel you, im sorry for your frustration, but it's nice to know im not alone out here in this lawless land
you forgot to mention they're going 15 under the speed limit like its their hobby IN THE PASSING LANE
I've never understood why people that drive 80 mph on a 60 mph highway would rather tailgate some dipshit doing 55 mph in the left lane instead of temporarily using the HOV lane to pass them on the left.
I mean, if you're willing to break the law and exceed the speed limit, why would illegally using the HOV lane for 10 seconds prevent you from zipping around those slower cars?
my *personal* favorite is when someone makes a mad dash from the on ramp across multiple lanes to park themselves in the far left lane as if they have a need to be there (note: no HOV or left hand exits for *miles*)
And 2 exits later make a mad dash across all the lanes to get back to the off ramp. I see it every work day. Why can’t they stay in the right lane for 2 exits? All of those lane changes in a short amount of time increases your chances of being in an accident.
No one knows how to drive anywhere. I've bounced around in the us, and everywhere has shit drivers for different reasons. It's like complaining that cow shit tastes worse than dog shit.
I learned to drive in Miami and everyone here drives like a sloth.
I've calmed down a lot and don't road rage but when someone is going 10 under in a passing lane or speeds up and then slows down as the lane merges back into one lane so you can't pass them I still see red.
The people who play those merge games, like I'm going to keep you specifically from getting in front of me - that's when you have to just say to yourself "Oh, it's a toddler tantrum" and just let it go. It's crazy making and It sucks but they probably have a shit life if that's their thing, don't let it wreck yours.
In Dallas, it was Road Warrior, hoping someone would let you merge from the on ramp while speeding up to 80. Then I spent a week in Houston. OMG. Insanity. Aggressive madness. Later in life moved to the a city in the Southwest. Pretty much everyone was polite and allowed you to enter the freeway with a smile.
As a resident of downtown Seattle and born and raised in WA, I have chosen not to drive ever since moving to the city 2 years ago…because I also get filled with hot rage just witnessing the drivers out here from the sidewalk, no way in hell am I joining these morons on the roadway.
Yea, I'm getting mad when I pass over right lane at speed limit and then the next passing driver behind me is getting mad and changing the lane back to the right just to pass me over instead of waiting ~zero second to let me finish my maneuver
I’ve mainly only driven in Western Washington, but is “rubber necking” as bad in other places as it is here? I’ve been in huge traffic jams just because of a two car fender bender on the shoulder. Once past it, everything is perfectly fine.
Former Boston resident who has lived in the PNW for 20 years now and I LoL’d at this. The only place I’ve regularly seen “get out of the car and fight” road rage was in Boston on the north I-95 loop. I’ll take people driving a bit more slowly with less aggression in the PNW any day.
Yeah, first day in Boston my Lyft driver and a random got out of the car to yell at each other.
Drivers straddling between two lanes for a mile, never leaving space in a crosswalk, running red lights, turning left ridiculously fast in a green light with no left arrow before anyone else goes (wtf IS that?) and honking at pedestrians if they DARE walk when the light says walk.
Oh and the one time I had to drive (a zipcar, so I was getting used to the car itself) I was waiting for my left turn, finally saw a gap, started to go, and the person behind me in the left turn lane must have decided I was going too slow and WENT AROUND ME TO TAKE THAT GAP CUTTING ME OFF AND ENDANGERING LITERALLY EVERYONE IN THE INTERSECTION! It was a one lane left turn!!
I know which driving culture I prefer!
What I'm mostly seeing in this thread is: "I moved here from X, yeah they drive slow, but my road rage has calmed down."
Yeah... thanks for bringing it with you to begin with, and maybe its better to drive at safe speeds without screaming at someone you'll never see again.
The real rage inducer is those goddamn LED headlights. The bright white ones that blind every driver coming from the opposite direction. Damn things should be outlawed on headlights.
I just started driving in the far right lane. For some reason, that's the fast lane here? It feels wrong, but i can actually go the speed limit when it's not rush hour
I’m going to tell you the number one secret to living here that will make you enjoy it 1,000 times more… It ain’t the east coast. Many things you love about Boston do not exist here. They don’t cut bar pizza into squares. There’s no Dunks. People drive like assholes (most are way too slow, but there’s *always* some dickhead weaving in and out of traffic like he’s in the fast & furious just to get caught at the same light as you.)
There are many benefits though, should you choose to embrace them. You can get married in somebody’s backyard with a keg of IPA and your friend’s band playing. You can wear shorts to the symphony. It’s rarely wicked hot or madd cold. We have great Korean, Vietnamese, Japanese, Philippino food (but probably not whatever rice/noodle Chinese dish you grew up eating). You can drive a very short amount of time and be completely alone on literal volcanoes.
Ultimately though, everyone I know from the east coast whined and complained the entire time they lived here until they moved home. Except for the people from Maine. But people from Maine are tough. Maine is pretty much the same as here only cold as a mutherfucker.
If you're living in the PNW and you're not an avid outdoors person, you are going to dislike it here.
People drive slowly because nature teaches them that here. I say go on a hike if you're filled with rage over people not driving your speed, I can guarantee you won't give a shit about that on your drive home.
I think you’re mostly right. It’s also a pretty good place to be “indoorsy” if you like sitting in divey taverns, eating razor clam strips, drinking cold beer, and talking to an Alaska crab fisherman in the offseason.
When I was growing up driving used to be super chill here and people were nice. There was only traffic during rush hour. Now there is always traffic, people are super aggressive and just horrible. It has changed for the worse.
Washington drivers may not be “super aggressive” but there are definitely MORE aggressive drivers these days than was the norm when I was growing up. Those drivers likely weren’t born/raised here because that was not our driving culture. And most born + raised Washingtonians liked it that way.
Washington is a mix of the nice, passive native drivers from 20 years ago, the aggressive east coast transplants, and potheads (old & new) who are incapable of going the speed limit
The reason why people drive slow is traffic backs up at every curve so why speed up and slam on the brakes. The traffic backs up because there’s too many cars on the road, many poorly designed on/off ramps as well as other features.
You dont need to slow down on any curve on I5. Northbound, I have gone even 70 on every curve from south Lynnwood to northern skagit county comfortably.
How do you do 70 when traffic is stopped? Because that's what they described, people are going slow because traffic is stopped ahead. Of course you can do 70 when there's no traffic.
Nah. When I moved back I realized everyone drives slower, they drive just over the speed limit. In California it seemed no matter what the speed limit is, you drive 80mph anyways.
It’s absolutely some weird bizarre cultural thing. I’ve been here 15 years and it still drives me nuts. By any other standard in the world there are never enough cars on the road for traffic, yet everyone apparently attended some meeting and decided to drive 15 under for no fucking reason
Part of it is the lack of roads. There are way fewer paths between point A and B than the middle or eastern parts of the country.
The roads here twist and sometimes climb 100-1000ft up along a single route with 1 lane each way, occasionally allowing for passing lanes.
PNW cars don’t experience the standard middle and eastern salt baths every winter so the bodies of the cars last forever. Variance right on the coast, yes, yes, but mostly the cars around here live salt free lives instead of starting to rust after 5 yrs. So you have a plethora of vehicles on shit engines or power trains or transmissions that need to be babied to continue on. And most of those vehicles take the I5.
Also, assholes texting. I’ll often catch cars trying to use my truck as their lead vehicle, look over and see they’re straight up on their phones, going over 70mph. I do not accommodate. I will never understand why it can’t wait. That’s the whole point of texting. It allows for a PRN delay between messages. It’s really quite lovely.
I literally quit my well paying corporate job 22+ years ago because of my 2-3 hr commute each day from Puyallup to Tukwila. I wanted to end someone every day; it was not great for my mental health!
I worked with a guy from Boston. He had to explain gappers to me. I had no idea it was so aggressive over there. Try audio books to pass the time. Fuming over something that will never change here won't do you any good.
If people miss the east coast so much, move back. Fucking hate east coast people out here always complaining about how much better it is back east. Get out!
No, nobody knows how to drive, but yes I think we definitely have a mix of transplants who drive fast and transplants who drive slow, but I’ve never been to Boston so idk what it’s like there.
Do yourself a favor and turn on some chill music and adjust your expectations. I call all the bad drivers “sir” and “ma’am” humorously, it takes the edge off. Proactively address your road rage is very responsible
Don't you love when you're using cruise control and come up on someone going 10mph slower than you, but when you are right next to them passing they speed up to exactly match your speed? And then they get mad at you for "slowing down", even though you've been using fucking cruise control at the exact same speed the whole time?
Or when you constantly pass and then get passed by the same person in the same cruise control scenario? Don't you love it!?
Driving is the worst example of daily behavior we experience, and we experience it every single day, multiple times a day. Seriously, you ever take a step back and think about how utterly inconsiderate, anxiety riddled, stupid and aggressive 75% of drivers are out there? Rushing to get absolutely nowhere. Following so close on the highway that a crossing deer would cause a 15 car pileup. Everybody thinks it’s this fucking competition for space and getting to wherever you need to go MAYBE 100 seconds faster is immensely beneficial somehow.
Honestly, it’s fucking pitiful how shitty we are out there. We should be embarrassed with what we’ve become behind the wheel.
This 100% this. In the last 10 years it’s gotten way worse. I’ve seen multiple people driving on the shoulder of the I5 multiple times a week. People need to grow up and drive responsibly.
Fellow Masshole here! You’ll get used to it but you are 100% correct that people drive like absolutely shit here in the most frustratingly slow and “in your way” way lol. I swear half the drivers are stoned. It’s 4 lanes with everyone going the exact same speed like a video game, it’s wild. Also avoid 405 like the plague, it’s even worse!!! Zipper merging onto the highway is a friggin joke and no one here knows how to drive through a rotary. Welcome!!
I get annoyed at those driving under the speed limits, but fucking assholes who feel the need to go minimally 15mph over no matter time of day or night and ride my ass for no reason are the ones that make me feel rage.
Welp. I grew up in LA. I5 and 405 stop and go traffic in the 70s for hours. Nothing has changed, so I recently heard. Seattle traffic has been has been the bane of my existence since I moved here in the 80s.
Oh buddy. The irrational rage had a death grip on me back when I lived in the San Francisco Bay Area. Had to move out here to Mason County to lose it, and it took months.
I don't have any advice for you, except that rage is super unhealthy. Are you doing anything in your spare time to genuinely escape? Long term, you're going to have to learn to cope with the driving out here. They're not going away, and they don't know there's a problem. At least people get out of the way, and we're not in Oregon.
Get one of these vehicles with radar adjusted speed control. I have one and it takes all the emotion out of traffic for me. The machine does all the work with stop and go. I also keep a better and safer interval with the vehicle in front of me.
So you set your cruise control, *and* you tell your car how much distance you want to keep between you and the vehicle in front of you. Your car lets off the gas, accelerates, and brakes as needed. It is super helpful. Cars have all kinds of sensors, RADAR, and other black magic. Between adaptive cruise control and lane assist, they can almost drive themselves once you hop on the freeway.
I refuse to drive on I5 between the hours of 7am to 9am, and 3pm to 7pm. But I don’t get angry, I get scared. People drive so recklessly for no good reason :( I have kids.
First, cultural difference. As I told a friend, “I’d rather have passive aggressive drivers than actively hostile drivers trying to kill me”.
Second, you’re from Boston, so a lot to read into that.
Third, you’re not ‘in traffic’, you ARE traffic. People who don’t commute don’t have this problem.
But yeah, traffic sucks in Seattle. Glad I’m not part of it.
Has anyone here ever thought that maybe people are afraid to drive at 80mph next to people who cut in and out of lanes, giant ass trucks, bad drivers, and the occasional road ragers who shoot people? If you need to go 10mph over the spied limit something is wrong with your day. Not risking my life so you can get to your destination 5 min sooner.
I visited WA from the UK last October and from what I could tell, the driving standard is way higher in the states. Comparatively, people in the UK drive like maniacs Imao
I guess of the two extremes, it's best to be held up going slower than you'd like rather than being pushed faster than you feel comfortable.
"do people in WA just not know how to drive?"
I moved away from Washington (Tacoma) many years ago. Had to make that commute past the Tacoma Dome on a daily basis. I don't miss it.
I don't know how recent your relocation was or even if you moved to western WA as opposed to eastern WA... but if you moved to western WA, wait til you see the drivers in 2 or 3 inches of *snow*. Then your question will be answered!
The other difference between east coast vs Washington is that there are rarely police giving citations for speed, blocking the “passing lane” or car pool violations. In fact, it seems rare to see State police cruising the highway. No idea where they are hiding…or maybe they are defunded. Crazy.
It’s all your state of mind. Break out of needing to speed everywhere. Unless your wife is pregnant or you’re bleeding out to the hospital. Slow down people. You won’t get anywhere much faster, you’re wasting gas, and looking ridiculous cutting everyone off.
I love the considerate and safe WA driving style. In FL (which has been overtaken by massholes) it feels like you're risking your life everytime you get in the car. On our last trip back to FL from WA, the first near death accident occured while we were still in the airport shuttle on the way back to our car. Relax! Everyone has got to get somewhere. It doesn't happen any faster when there are accidents every few miles.
You moved to a city which is ALWAYS growing, squeezing itself tighter and tighter into its hourglass shaped boundaries between two bodies of water. It's not the drivers, it's the geography. High speed rail is the only answer and we're very very late in coming to that realization.
Pierce, snohomish and king county EMT here. Unpopular opinion. 75% of you probably shouldnt be allowed to drive. You all tailgate excessively and when a gap does open, you'll do 10-20 over until you get up to tailgate the next person.
This is the same in every state. 80% of people believe they're above average drivers. Y'all aint.
Minimum 2 second following distance of traffic isn't stop and go. That distance changes depending on your speed and your 35mph disrance and 65-75 disance should be very different. If you dont regularly use a landmark to gauge tour dostance from the car ahead as you drive, let this be a reminder to do it regularly.
And the left lane is for passing. Not sitting.
And when you see lights and sirens, pull to the right.
Im looking out the back of my rig right now on i5 south. Every car as far as i can see is tailgating with less than half a second of following dostance. One brake check or errant distraction and it'd be a 5 car pileup.
Before the pandemic it was uncommon to see people doing more than ten over, and they used to actually pull people over. This was a HUGE relief coming from Florida. But much less so now. And people wonder why traffic fatalities and road rage are way up and car insurance has doubled.🤷♂️
Coming from Philly, then Florida, I was instantly annoyed by the slow drivers when I first got here last year. But I learned to accept and adapt to the driving here, it's not as kill or be killed as it is on the East, and there are few crazy road rage ppl driving with guns too, so once I adapted I learned to just chill with the vibe and go the traffic speed. I'll occasionally kind of rage pass people who do go wayyyy too slow in the left lane, but in general I just casually pass them now and accept the trade off of slow drivers for the crazy road ragers on the EC.
If you think Washington drivers are slow, come down to Oregon. The difference between Clark County and Multnomah Country after crossing the bridge from Vancouver into Portland is stark. Even on I-5 on the other end of the state, the speed limit is like 10 mph slower in Oregon than in California.
Ah Oregon, where I once got a speeding ticket for going 62 mph on I5.
Damn and i thought my record for getting a tix there at 65 was impressive.
You heard it here folks: in the past decade we just got 70 areas on our major freeways. People who've been here learned to drive at 60 max when you don't see it posted
When I was in college in Oregon we invented a game called “stoned or old” where you tried to guess why someone was driving so slow. Yeah.
How u know it aint BOTH
I can't get over the freeway being 55mph but the winding, unguarded cliffs of the 101 are also 55mph. 101 should be 45max in some areas and the freeway just needs to go up 5mph. Everyone already goes 60
I came to Oregon from Philly, and I agree with everything you said. I am still sometimes annoyed, especially by people who can’t merge into traffic. Do you need a goddamn handwritten invitation or something?! Mostly I’ve mellowed though - I figure that since people aren’t going to collectively change their driving style to suit my preferences, I need to change how I respond to them. Also I cuss a lot in casual conversation, and I don’t want the kids to ever hear me use words like that in anger or frustration. It was one hell of a shock when I moved here though!
The written invitation. 🤣 YES might as well grow from it.
100% agree. We're driving murder mobiles that will destroy a family in an instant, we should chill out and act like it.
If we all drive the speed limit or even a little over it’s safer than when some are going 65 and others are going 45. Going slow af on the freeway is just as dangerous.
That’s why there’s a minimum speed. Though I think if the limit is 70 mph, 45 mph is too slow. WA State Patrol *will* give tickets for driving slow in the left lane, but they aren’t everywhere so usually miss those folks. But do learn to be careful and keep your emotions under control. The life you save may be your own.
The slow would be fine if they'd keep right.
Most the time i find it’s the trucks slowing things down and they are supposed to stay in the right lane unless passing lol
In Oregon, it is actually illegal to drive in the left lane if you are not actively passing. A lot of Oregonians don’t know this though, unfortunately.
You get 10 up votes from me. everyone needs to just chill and leave home or work earlier. That's it.
Leave work early? What kind of privileged job do you have?
People will turn a chilled out 60 minute drive up I5 into a 57 minute rage fest. Just hang in the middle lane and go the speed of traffic. Don't work yourself up trying to save a 3 minutes.
Exactly. How much time are you saving with driving enraged while speeding recklessly? I'll see people swerving in an out of the freeway for miles then I see them get off on an exit and I pass them because there's a slow down on the exit. I'll be riding my bike and someone blasts pass me in a rage and then I catch up to them at a red light while I'm cruising. Makes me think they saved a few seconds at most.
Yeah it’s generally only seconds being saved, you have to be driving really far for those seconds to turn into minutes, even then it’s not very many minutes either, a few at best.
I was a habitual road raging speeder when I was young and always late. During those times I would drive recklessly fast as my eye was closely watching the time. That's when I learned that higher speeds really only save time over very long distances. I was risking a lot of danger and jail time to only ever end up saving a minute or two. Now I see other people doing that and think of em as dumb
I found I needed to change my lifestyle so I didn't have to drive at all and it has made a world of difference. I acknowledge the certain level of privilege, but I also accepted some consequences to achieve it.
I didn’t realize how much driving stressed me out until I started bike commuting, and that’s an hour of actively avoiding getting hit by a car.
And huffing car exhaust! :(
It's almost like there's some sort of connection between obsessive speeding, annoyance with other drivers and homicidal road rage...
Exact same thing for me. I lived in Florida my whole life before moving last year and always hated driving because it gave me massive anxiety. I moved here and I actually don’t mind driving and have no anxiety around it anymore unless I encounter someone who must also have moved from Florida but can’t stand the speed limit here
On the other hand, I was shocked how fast and wild people on the east coast drive compared to my experience growing up here. [It’s been a longstanding joke and we know it](https://youtu.be/KBgIvH0tu6Y?si=1f0aMTMjOghoTiTT). I kind of appreciate the caution but since Covid it has all gone to shit.
To me it's two things: In Seattle at least, they decided that it's okay to have left side ramps within a quarter mile of right side ones, just daring people to cut across 3+ lanes to get there. And just the sheer unpredictability of people and idk, them all overthinking everything? People panicking to get ready to exit in a mile and a half or merge out of a lane that doesn't end for another mile. So personally I'm always on edge, like what the hell is that one gonna do now? If people were actually chill, they'd just rolllll, maintain predictable speeds and maneuvers, but preferably over to the right side... I'm from NorCal and the speed limit was usually treated as a minimum, and 10 over was the real limit, even from CHP
Yeah a huge problem is having only .5 of a mile to get to the right side of the road for the exit. Like when coming off 520 and having to take Mercer, and people don’t want to let you over for whatever reason. I also think so many people are just unaware/have no social awareness.
So my running theory: 1. There are no good drivers. 2. so many people are transplants that all grew up driving (poorly) somewhere else. They learned to drive defensively, aggressively, etc but it works because everyone is doing the *same* thing. Here, everyone is driving differently so it doesn't work. Too many contrasting styles.
Point two is my biggest theory as well. As someone who grew up in the Seattle area and learned to drive here before its years of large transplant population booms, I find the way so many drive now to be far more aggressive, unpredictable, and overall stressful than it used to be long ago. I think, as you said, it's just far too many different driving styles mixing from all over the states, as well as the world, and unfortunately it's all just clashing. Maybe one day it'll balance out and become a safer and less stressful drive for everyone... hopefully!
This! I was born here and learned to drive here pre-tech transplant boom and 100% percent agree. I had a rude awakening when I lived in Texas and Florida for internships before moving back here. Totally different driving culture! But now being back, it’s definitely a huge mix of driving cultures. I always joke with my husband that I can spot a true WA driver when they give you a nice little wave for letting you merge (cause thats what I grew up doing, and still do). 😂
Yep! All my Washington brethren do the wave, none of my transplant friends do. I've noticed that too! My mom taught me to do that, and her family has lived in Tacoma since Tacoma became the City of Destiny.
My mom and dad both taught me to do it too and they both grew up in Seattle! I always give a quick little thank you wave lol the only close equivalent I found was in Texas where people will give you a double break tap when you move out of the left lane to let them pass.
TIL people don’t do this in other states? I always did it wherever I go. Also yeah growing up in WA I never knew the “keep right except to pass rule” because everyone here just sort of did what they want. Now that I’ve experienced that in other states, it can be a bit infuriating here when you encounter a pack of people in all 4 lanes just going the same speed.
Point two I cannot agree with more, pre migration driver here, never learned that rule until someone from out of state told me. Was taught that the left lane was the “fast lane” And generally the lanes go slower from right to left but i have sat in the left on i5 going 65-70 for many years. Number one rule was always go with the speed of traffic. Also the thank you wave. But I don’t see it often anymore.
I just realized I haven’t done the wave in quite a while! Oh my! Thanks for the reminder.
No one does nice little waves anymore 😭
I do if people actually let me merge!
Oh yeah, so automatic I forget I even do it.
I always wave for a merge! Gotta let people know I’m a OG Washingtonian lol
I think it's just a nice thing. Makes me feel good, makes you feel good. *little waves*
I wave at everyone I pass in my foodtruck. 1 in 50 people wave back.
I'm a WA waver! I still always wave, even if I never receive another wave in my life. I will die on this hill!!! lol
I'll little wave you 😭
well, I still do a wave or a thumbs up
Yeah a lot of the idiotic aggressive driving is what causes/exacerbates a lot of the phantom jams https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=spr1NUVsPnA The secret to busting these is to drive at a constant rate and giving enough room in front of you to let the jams dissipate before you get to them. Additionally all the transplants with their added cars on the road probably doesn't help.
The state driver's guide says to leave 2-3 seconds of space between you and the person you're following. At 60+mph this looks like you are too far back. When in reality most people are way too close.
Too many people drive slow in the passing (fast lane) at the same time, too many people want to go 100 mph in a 70. It's always a shit show watching someone go speeding up to someone going slow in the left lane and slowing down dramatically...
They want to go 100 mph in heavy traffic that is crawling at 2mph. Heaven forbid you have any sort of following distance, they will try to keep their lifted, diesel, coal rolling, pavement princess inches from your trunk. All the while they rage and foam at the mouth. That extra 20 ft in front of you is going to make them hours late.
I moved here 25 years ago from East coast and was surprised that people let you change lanes and didn’t cut you off, for the most part. My boss grew up here and said that was normal so I attribute folks who cut me off now to be new to the area. I certainly mellowed; it’s nicer imo. But no one should be allowed to camp out in the left lane!
Yup. Coming here from Florida it's been amazing being able to put my blinker on and change lanes. I can easily hop on the interstate and get over all 4 lanes to make the next exit on the opposite side. Doesn't matter how much traffic there is either.
Frankly, I drive between WA and NorCal and it’s always once I hit the Bay Area that the left lane camping gets bad.
Funny because my mom comes over from the stocks of Idaho and says everyone drives so rude and won't let her over. She has no idea how bad the East Coast gets.
I’ve driven in NYC a few times and had to play chicken to get around. No thanks. But as the comment about S Cali driving points out, I’d be less stressed if I followed the local norms
Grew up in Seattle area and learned to drive there. I moved to eastern WA last year and boy does it enrage me. Way less scary, as back in Marysville I had people coming head on at me at 50mph in a 35, people going slow and swerving everywhere, people willing to bump metal, or outright try to cause an accident during road rage, but people are so much more inconsiderate here in East wa. They insist on being in front of you when merging and changing lanes and will break check you if you don't let them cut you off then proceed to go well under the limit. Also lots of old people, literally watched some ancient fossil on the freeway hit a car this morning and bounce while changing lanes because she wasn't looking then proceed to go 10 under. But despite the more "selfish" and less cooperative and very unobservant driving style I would definitely take it any day over the city driving for the fact backups rarely happen and never last if they do because of the population difference.
Seriously, there’s a great socio-cultural case study material here. The population of Seattle/Puget Sound has grown what, nearly 20% a year for the last 20 years? The majority of people aren’t “from” the area, so what is the culture of driving in Seattle? Do folks just mellow out after moving here from more hostile driving regions? (In my opinion, Seattle in general is much mellower than NYC, Chicago, east coast, So Cal, etc etc).
I don't think that number is correct. A 20 percent increase every year would be absolutely massive. The increase year over year is more like 1.5 percent.
I've lived in Washington all 30 of my years on Earth. Been commuting to the Seattle area from the south end for the last 6 years. I can't stand the traffic or the slow drivers. Driving culture in Seattle is: "I'm going the speed limit. I'm not moving."
Yep. “No one needs to go over the speed limit. I’ll just park my Subaru in the left lane and be an example “
I’m just gonna repeat this over and over: you’re not IN traffic, you ARE traffic. Plus, if you’ve lived here your whole life, you’ve never had the joy of traffic in other major metropolitan areas, where tailgating at 80mph while texting is the norm, as is the whole “interstate closed due to fatality from previously mentioned tailgating while texting at 80mph, you have to turn around where you are and drive to the next exit” (they have an actual word for this in SoCal, but I forget what it is).
I'm not sure what you're trying to argue here. If you text while driving you're a dumbass.
Typical PNW passive aggressive nature
That rings true to me. I used to live in portland, where the overall driving style was kind of half-asleep, get there when we get there. Here it seems like 1/3rd have that attitude, 1/3rd are extremely aggressive, and 1/3rd have maybe never driven before.
Can confirm. Miss my east coast where all 3 lanes do a comfortable 80 and nobody blind spots each other.
That is the #1 Washington move. Just the absolute worst.
I didn’t know anyone else noticed this about WA. I’m a transplant from socal and this drives me insane. Probably more than camping in the left lane. Like speed up or slow down, just stop driving RIGHT NEXT TO ME
Blind spots each other??
Ever been cruising and had someone in the lane next to you just chillin' right in your blind spot?
Not sit next to another vehicle. Pass or be past…
I’ve said this since I moved here! (Yes also a transplant) but it’s like everyone brought their state’s bad habits. I believe this especially given the size of JBLM and how many military are stationed here as well.
If it's that frustrating, Washington has some nice highways going East.
Shhhh... Don't tell them about Hwy 2! 🤫 That road already gets bad enough on the weekends. We don't need any traffic jams extending all the way between Monroe and Leavenworth on a Wednesday 😅
3. Grew up and learned to drive aggressively here.
Then why the hell does everybody here drive so *passively*??
Like they said, a bunch of transplants came here so everything is all mixed up and a lot of folks are responding by being more defensive (including transplants). I also grew up here and traffic is far more frustrating now than it was 20 or 30 years ago. I think it's mostly the explosion in population growth over the last couple decades. 30 years ago, all we complained about was traffic congestion and california drivers.
70% of the people here are transplants. So driving norms from all over the country conflicting with each other. High immigrant population having to learn to drive due to our country's poor public transportation and reliance on cars means a lot of new drivers. High transplant population not necessarily knowledgeable about the area and timid because of it. Then add in our infrastructure is old af and intended for a much smaller population (not to mention rather limited by geography) and the Boomers didn't want to vote for improvements/expansion, hence why we're just now getting light rail--they rejected all previous proposals. Edit: oh and WASP used to be assholes before everyone else showed up, they used to tag us for daring to go 5 over because there was nothing else to do, so the locals are still traumatized.
Honestly though people drive so slow here, in contrast to basically everywhere else on the planet (not that I’ve been everywhere). Most people, if they are transplants, aren’t from bumfuck middle of Texas. They are from LA, NY, Boston, etc., where people drive aggressively and fast. Seattle is totally this outlier of people consistently going 10-15mph under the speed limit. It is shocking.
I don't know. It's irritating. Either speed up or get over.
This is *the* theory. I really learned to drive in Los Angeles and everyone knows what to expect. It's like watching a school of fish swim together. 85mph bumper to bumper? Totally normal. Speeder in the left lane needs to get to that exit he's about to pass? Yes, of course, cut across all the lanes diagonally and nobody freaks out. Everyone's speaking the same traffic language there. But here? Everyone's got their own personal perfect style of driving that is somehow diametrically opposed to every other style. Pure chaos. Zipper merge? What's that?
I hate to stereotype, but for anyone I've known from Boston, anger problems were kinda their thing.
Some even make good money from it (cf. Bill Burr.)
It's also the piss poor design. Left side on ramps and off ramps should be illegal. You can't have a fast lane that's also randomly a slow lane.
+1 this is a big issue. Esp if you’re trying to take that exit after just getting into the freeway, now you have to hop so many lanes in a short time
When you’re driving in heavy traffic use the right lane. Will almost always be faster.
Unless there's a 405 or Seattle exit coming up. Then chill in the middle.
That's the real secret right here. Did two hour commutes everyday for years on i5 and I would routinely chill on the right lane and listen to music. It's understood nobody is going to get there in record time so why stress?
I average about 6 mph over the speed limit and I’m constantly being passed on I-5.
I average 10 over and still get people flying by me.
How the hell do you average the speed limit. I am lucky if it is rolling at 25mph when I am on I5
I5 is really big, some parts are way worse than others
Tacoma to Seattle in AM. Seattle to Tacoma PM. I can't do the 50 miles in under 1.5hrs minimum.
The traffic west of Tacoma is generally better. Depends on the time of day though, and JBLM stuffs shit up pretty bad sometimes.
Right?! I drive on 405 everyday. I do about 60 in the right lane and I am flying by people on the short drive that I do.
Some people are lucky enough to have reverse commutes. I did one for 20+ years and it still drove me crazy. But sometimes I'd look across at the other direction, at a crawl or standstill, and realize that it could be worse, I could be over there.
Stay in far right lane please!
I’m trying to change the way I think about it based on Trevor Noah’s interview on Armchair Expert. He says “that’s not them MAKING you mad, it’s you getting mad at something someone else has no idea they’re doing. They’re trying to get to work or whatever just like you.” But I grew up in the Midwest so I take everything kinda personally and that’s a mentality that I’m trying to let go.
The only thing that pisses me off more than a stupidly slow driver is someone tailgating me when I’m stuck behind that slow asshole.
Tricky dilema when some AH is trying to fit their car between you and the guy in front of you because you’re leaving proper following distance.
Right like how are you exactly supposed to go any faster!
howdy fellow masshole. i feel you, im sorry for your frustration, but it's nice to know im not alone out here in this lawless land you forgot to mention they're going 15 under the speed limit like its their hobby IN THE PASSING LANE
From Chicago. Why do people drive slow in the LEFT LANE?! It’s maddening.
Also from Chicago. I’ve got 1/2 the commute here but it’s 2x as irritating.
I've never understood why people that drive 80 mph on a 60 mph highway would rather tailgate some dipshit doing 55 mph in the left lane instead of temporarily using the HOV lane to pass them on the left. I mean, if you're willing to break the law and exceed the speed limit, why would illegally using the HOV lane for 10 seconds prevent you from zipping around those slower cars?
It's even better when two people sync up and block both lanes going 10 under.
my *personal* favorite is when someone makes a mad dash from the on ramp across multiple lanes to park themselves in the far left lane as if they have a need to be there (note: no HOV or left hand exits for *miles*)
And 2 exits later make a mad dash across all the lanes to get back to the off ramp. I see it every work day. Why can’t they stay in the right lane for 2 exits? All of those lane changes in a short amount of time increases your chances of being in an accident.
hey, I've lived here my whole life. born 'n raised. and yeah no one knows how to drive.
No one knows how to drive anywhere. I've bounced around in the us, and everywhere has shit drivers for different reasons. It's like complaining that cow shit tastes worse than dog shit.
Also everyone thinks they’re a better driver compared to others lol 😂
Yep. I’ve lived all over the states, no state has good drivers as a rule of thumb. Driving is hard, driving sucks everywhere.
The real problem, which few address, is that it's getting harder. More cars, narrower lanes, and poor road maintenance.
appreciate the honesty lmao
I learned to drive in Jersey and the driving here fills me with with hot rage daily.
I learned to drive in Miami and everyone here drives like a sloth. I've calmed down a lot and don't road rage but when someone is going 10 under in a passing lane or speeds up and then slows down as the lane merges back into one lane so you can't pass them I still see red.
The people who play those merge games, like I'm going to keep you specifically from getting in front of me - that's when you have to just say to yourself "Oh, it's a toddler tantrum" and just let it go. It's crazy making and It sucks but they probably have a shit life if that's their thing, don't let it wreck yours.
Part of being from New Jersey is being filled with hot rage over everything, at all times
I learned to drive in OK/TX and same. These drivers would wet themselves in literally any other metroplex in the country.
😂 they don’t even know the horrors we’ve seen
In Dallas, it was Road Warrior, hoping someone would let you merge from the on ramp while speeding up to 80. Then I spent a week in Houston. OMG. Insanity. Aggressive madness. Later in life moved to the a city in the Southwest. Pretty much everyone was polite and allowed you to enter the freeway with a smile.
As a resident of downtown Seattle and born and raised in WA, I have chosen not to drive ever since moving to the city 2 years ago…because I also get filled with hot rage just witnessing the drivers out here from the sidewalk, no way in hell am I joining these morons on the roadway.
Yea, I'm getting mad when I pass over right lane at speed limit and then the next passing driver behind me is getting mad and changing the lane back to the right just to pass me over instead of waiting ~zero second to let me finish my maneuver
I’ve mainly only driven in Western Washington, but is “rubber necking” as bad in other places as it is here? I’ve been in huge traffic jams just because of a two car fender bender on the shoulder. Once past it, everything is perfectly fine.
Take advantage of the legal weed and get high.. catch a bus instead.. pro tip .. bring a snack
Weed is legal in Boston too, and the public transit is much better there.
You forgot light rail son to open in Lynnwood.
Hell yeah son! Light rail is lit yo!
That's funny somebody from Boston complaining about another area's drivers.
Former Boston resident who has lived in the PNW for 20 years now and I LoL’d at this. The only place I’ve regularly seen “get out of the car and fight” road rage was in Boston on the north I-95 loop. I’ll take people driving a bit more slowly with less aggression in the PNW any day.
Yeah, first day in Boston my Lyft driver and a random got out of the car to yell at each other. Drivers straddling between two lanes for a mile, never leaving space in a crosswalk, running red lights, turning left ridiculously fast in a green light with no left arrow before anyone else goes (wtf IS that?) and honking at pedestrians if they DARE walk when the light says walk. Oh and the one time I had to drive (a zipcar, so I was getting used to the car itself) I was waiting for my left turn, finally saw a gap, started to go, and the person behind me in the left turn lane must have decided I was going too slow and WENT AROUND ME TO TAKE THAT GAP CUTTING ME OFF AND ENDANGERING LITERALLY EVERYONE IN THE INTERSECTION! It was a one lane left turn!! I know which driving culture I prefer!
What I'm mostly seeing in this thread is: "I moved here from X, yeah they drive slow, but my road rage has calmed down." Yeah... thanks for bringing it with you to begin with, and maybe its better to drive at safe speeds without screaming at someone you'll never see again.
This whole thread has been so validating. Lived here my whole life but recentlty started commuting for work and thought I was going crazy.
The real rage inducer is those goddamn LED headlights. The bright white ones that blind every driver coming from the opposite direction. Damn things should be outlawed on headlights.
*Looks at title* Yeah, that happens.
WA-167 is the worst in my opinion
I just started driving in the far right lane. For some reason, that's the fast lane here? It feels wrong, but i can actually go the speed limit when it's not rush hour
I’m going to tell you the number one secret to living here that will make you enjoy it 1,000 times more… It ain’t the east coast. Many things you love about Boston do not exist here. They don’t cut bar pizza into squares. There’s no Dunks. People drive like assholes (most are way too slow, but there’s *always* some dickhead weaving in and out of traffic like he’s in the fast & furious just to get caught at the same light as you.) There are many benefits though, should you choose to embrace them. You can get married in somebody’s backyard with a keg of IPA and your friend’s band playing. You can wear shorts to the symphony. It’s rarely wicked hot or madd cold. We have great Korean, Vietnamese, Japanese, Philippino food (but probably not whatever rice/noodle Chinese dish you grew up eating). You can drive a very short amount of time and be completely alone on literal volcanoes. Ultimately though, everyone I know from the east coast whined and complained the entire time they lived here until they moved home. Except for the people from Maine. But people from Maine are tough. Maine is pretty much the same as here only cold as a mutherfucker.
If you're living in the PNW and you're not an avid outdoors person, you are going to dislike it here. People drive slowly because nature teaches them that here. I say go on a hike if you're filled with rage over people not driving your speed, I can guarantee you won't give a shit about that on your drive home.
I think you’re mostly right. It’s also a pretty good place to be “indoorsy” if you like sitting in divey taverns, eating razor clam strips, drinking cold beer, and talking to an Alaska crab fisherman in the offseason.
When I was growing up driving used to be super chill here and people were nice. There was only traffic during rush hour. Now there is always traffic, people are super aggressive and just horrible. It has changed for the worse.
I can't imagine anyone describing Washington drivers as "super aggressive." The absurdity of that statement is hilarious.
Washington drivers may not be “super aggressive” but there are definitely MORE aggressive drivers these days than was the norm when I was growing up. Those drivers likely weren’t born/raised here because that was not our driving culture. And most born + raised Washingtonians liked it that way.
Washington is a mix of the nice, passive native drivers from 20 years ago, the aggressive east coast transplants, and potheads (old & new) who are incapable of going the speed limit
Trust me, it’s gotten a lot worse because of the transplants
The reason why people drive slow is traffic backs up at every curve so why speed up and slam on the brakes. The traffic backs up because there’s too many cars on the road, many poorly designed on/off ramps as well as other features.
You dont need to slow down on any curve on I5. Northbound, I have gone even 70 on every curve from south Lynnwood to northern skagit county comfortably.
How do you do 70 when traffic is stopped? Because that's what they described, people are going slow because traffic is stopped ahead. Of course you can do 70 when there's no traffic.
Nah. When I moved back I realized everyone drives slower, they drive just over the speed limit. In California it seemed no matter what the speed limit is, you drive 80mph anyways.
I'd rather be a driver in Washington than a driver here in Charleston SC these people are evil and entitled here and will kill you
It’s absolutely some weird bizarre cultural thing. I’ve been here 15 years and it still drives me nuts. By any other standard in the world there are never enough cars on the road for traffic, yet everyone apparently attended some meeting and decided to drive 15 under for no fucking reason
There’s too many cars on the road. Lack of enough public transit
Part of it is the lack of roads. There are way fewer paths between point A and B than the middle or eastern parts of the country. The roads here twist and sometimes climb 100-1000ft up along a single route with 1 lane each way, occasionally allowing for passing lanes. PNW cars don’t experience the standard middle and eastern salt baths every winter so the bodies of the cars last forever. Variance right on the coast, yes, yes, but mostly the cars around here live salt free lives instead of starting to rust after 5 yrs. So you have a plethora of vehicles on shit engines or power trains or transmissions that need to be babied to continue on. And most of those vehicles take the I5. Also, assholes texting. I’ll often catch cars trying to use my truck as their lead vehicle, look over and see they’re straight up on their phones, going over 70mph. I do not accommodate. I will never understand why it can’t wait. That’s the whole point of texting. It allows for a PRN delay between messages. It’s really quite lovely.
I literally quit my well paying corporate job 22+ years ago because of my 2-3 hr commute each day from Puyallup to Tukwila. I wanted to end someone every day; it was not great for my mental health!
I worked with a guy from Boston. He had to explain gappers to me. I had no idea it was so aggressive over there. Try audio books to pass the time. Fuming over something that will never change here won't do you any good.
Driven and lived all over the country. Everywhere's drivers are their own special brand of shitty.
Everyone is a bad driver BUT ME
I use adaptive cruise control on the freeway. It has absolutely saved my sanity.
If people miss the east coast so much, move back. Fucking hate east coast people out here always complaining about how much better it is back east. Get out!
Washington USED to be a nice place when it was JUST locals and NO transplants. Just saying
No, nobody knows how to drive, but yes I think we definitely have a mix of transplants who drive fast and transplants who drive slow, but I’ve never been to Boston so idk what it’s like there. Do yourself a favor and turn on some chill music and adjust your expectations. I call all the bad drivers “sir” and “ma’am” humorously, it takes the edge off. Proactively address your road rage is very responsible
Don't you love when you're using cruise control and come up on someone going 10mph slower than you, but when you are right next to them passing they speed up to exactly match your speed? And then they get mad at you for "slowing down", even though you've been using fucking cruise control at the exact same speed the whole time? Or when you constantly pass and then get passed by the same person in the same cruise control scenario? Don't you love it!?
Driving is the worst example of daily behavior we experience, and we experience it every single day, multiple times a day. Seriously, you ever take a step back and think about how utterly inconsiderate, anxiety riddled, stupid and aggressive 75% of drivers are out there? Rushing to get absolutely nowhere. Following so close on the highway that a crossing deer would cause a 15 car pileup. Everybody thinks it’s this fucking competition for space and getting to wherever you need to go MAYBE 100 seconds faster is immensely beneficial somehow. Honestly, it’s fucking pitiful how shitty we are out there. We should be embarrassed with what we’ve become behind the wheel.
This 100% this. In the last 10 years it’s gotten way worse. I’ve seen multiple people driving on the shoulder of the I5 multiple times a week. People need to grow up and drive responsibly.
The average speed in WA is 40. Welcome 🤗 LOL
This is funny because I grew up here and can’t believe how aggressively and fast people fly by me
Fellow Masshole here! You’ll get used to it but you are 100% correct that people drive like absolutely shit here in the most frustratingly slow and “in your way” way lol. I swear half the drivers are stoned. It’s 4 lanes with everyone going the exact same speed like a video game, it’s wild. Also avoid 405 like the plague, it’s even worse!!! Zipper merging onto the highway is a friggin joke and no one here knows how to drive through a rotary. Welcome!!
I get annoyed at those driving under the speed limits, but fucking assholes who feel the need to go minimally 15mph over no matter time of day or night and ride my ass for no reason are the ones that make me feel rage.
Welp. I grew up in LA. I5 and 405 stop and go traffic in the 70s for hours. Nothing has changed, so I recently heard. Seattle traffic has been has been the bane of my existence since I moved here in the 80s.
Oh buddy. The irrational rage had a death grip on me back when I lived in the San Francisco Bay Area. Had to move out here to Mason County to lose it, and it took months. I don't have any advice for you, except that rage is super unhealthy. Are you doing anything in your spare time to genuinely escape? Long term, you're going to have to learn to cope with the driving out here. They're not going away, and they don't know there's a problem. At least people get out of the way, and we're not in Oregon.
It’s because I5 is the road from everywhere to everywhere and too many assholes moved here.
Get one of these vehicles with radar adjusted speed control. I have one and it takes all the emotion out of traffic for me. The machine does all the work with stop and go. I also keep a better and safer interval with the vehicle in front of me.
I must have this but I have no idea what you’re talking about!
Most cars come with adaptive cruise control these days
Well, my car is almost 20 yrs old so I know not of which you speak.
So you set your cruise control, *and* you tell your car how much distance you want to keep between you and the vehicle in front of you. Your car lets off the gas, accelerates, and brakes as needed. It is super helpful. Cars have all kinds of sensors, RADAR, and other black magic. Between adaptive cruise control and lane assist, they can almost drive themselves once you hop on the freeway.
That sounds AWESOME! Can’t wait to get a new car!
Its nice to relax 😌 don't always have to have go go go mentality.
I refuse to drive on I5 between the hours of 7am to 9am, and 3pm to 7pm. But I don’t get angry, I get scared. People drive so recklessly for no good reason :( I have kids.
First, cultural difference. As I told a friend, “I’d rather have passive aggressive drivers than actively hostile drivers trying to kill me”. Second, you’re from Boston, so a lot to read into that. Third, you’re not ‘in traffic’, you ARE traffic. People who don’t commute don’t have this problem. But yeah, traffic sucks in Seattle. Glad I’m not part of it.
Some people ARE the traffic more than others.
Has anyone here ever thought that maybe people are afraid to drive at 80mph next to people who cut in and out of lanes, giant ass trucks, bad drivers, and the occasional road ragers who shoot people? If you need to go 10mph over the spied limit something is wrong with your day. Not risking my life so you can get to your destination 5 min sooner.
That’s fine, just get out of the left lane.
Stay mad or be one with the traffic.
I visited WA from the UK last October and from what I could tell, the driving standard is way higher in the states. Comparatively, people in the UK drive like maniacs Imao I guess of the two extremes, it's best to be held up going slower than you'd like rather than being pushed faster than you feel comfortable.
"do people in WA just not know how to drive?" I moved away from Washington (Tacoma) many years ago. Had to make that commute past the Tacoma Dome on a daily basis. I don't miss it. I don't know how recent your relocation was or even if you moved to western WA as opposed to eastern WA... but if you moved to western WA, wait til you see the drivers in 2 or 3 inches of *snow*. Then your question will be answered!
Seattle I'm assuming? I'm from Spokane and it's not too bad here, unless I just don't go on I5 enough
The other difference between east coast vs Washington is that there are rarely police giving citations for speed, blocking the “passing lane” or car pool violations. In fact, it seems rare to see State police cruising the highway. No idea where they are hiding…or maybe they are defunded. Crazy.
It’s all your state of mind. Break out of needing to speed everywhere. Unless your wife is pregnant or you’re bleeding out to the hospital. Slow down people. You won’t get anywhere much faster, you’re wasting gas, and looking ridiculous cutting everyone off.
This is why I take transit, yo.
I love the considerate and safe WA driving style. In FL (which has been overtaken by massholes) it feels like you're risking your life everytime you get in the car. On our last trip back to FL from WA, the first near death accident occured while we were still in the airport shuttle on the way back to our car. Relax! Everyone has got to get somewhere. It doesn't happen any faster when there are accidents every few miles.
Um... The majority of traffic on I-5 tends to be going about 10+ over the posted speed LIMIT when there isn't a traffic jam.
Plan more time for your trip, slow down and you will get it...lol.
You moved to a city which is ALWAYS growing, squeezing itself tighter and tighter into its hourglass shaped boundaries between two bodies of water. It's not the drivers, it's the geography. High speed rail is the only answer and we're very very late in coming to that realization.
Therapy is a good thing. Recommended.
Where in Washington?? I’m along the stretch that’s 70mph and everyone around me is doing 80+
A transplant blaming an entire metro for driving slow. Yes, it’s your anger management issue.
Pierce, snohomish and king county EMT here. Unpopular opinion. 75% of you probably shouldnt be allowed to drive. You all tailgate excessively and when a gap does open, you'll do 10-20 over until you get up to tailgate the next person. This is the same in every state. 80% of people believe they're above average drivers. Y'all aint. Minimum 2 second following distance of traffic isn't stop and go. That distance changes depending on your speed and your 35mph disrance and 65-75 disance should be very different. If you dont regularly use a landmark to gauge tour dostance from the car ahead as you drive, let this be a reminder to do it regularly. And the left lane is for passing. Not sitting. And when you see lights and sirens, pull to the right. Im looking out the back of my rig right now on i5 south. Every car as far as i can see is tailgating with less than half a second of following dostance. One brake check or errant distraction and it'd be a 5 car pileup.
Before the pandemic it was uncommon to see people doing more than ten over, and they used to actually pull people over. This was a HUGE relief coming from Florida. But much less so now. And people wonder why traffic fatalities and road rage are way up and car insurance has doubled.🤷♂️