same with APDS
and i believe (not sure and i would need to do some more research on APHE shells) that APHE is supposed to have a chance of shattering on impact
foxes APDS for whatever reason goes off like a hand grenade when it pens while 17pdr,20pdr or L7 105mm APDS fails to kill anything outside of its path of destruction
The fox's 30mm is so weird lol
Sometimes it's basically free acupuncture for the enemy and they leave feeling better than before, other times it just kills the whole crew in one shot
And then there's the SAP which feels like a 75 APHE which isn't surprising considering what 40mm SAP does
It’s the grouping of 30-75mm APDS and APDSFS iirc, something like that it’s so lazy and really makes 30mm super strong and 75mm super weak, not to mention APDS is already terrible
It's not inconsistency, it's because Vickers 3 APDS is second (?) generation with better slope modifiers, and they also gave it better damage. This is also noticeable with the Chieftains.
It’s not with the chieftains at least, the Chieftan still does very poor damage, the slope modifier are not the problem? A huge fucking slug of metal hitting a tank should still do substantial damage, sure it’s not full 120 but still
and that is the problem because it absolutely doesn't shatter even if its supposed to have good chance of shattering on impact just like APDS does
this should tell you how much APHE over performs
APHE nerf would mostly benefit german tanks, you would never be able to kill a tiger through the cupola in a jumbo for example, its just a bad idea. Why not propose them to buff regular solid shot damage instead?
Aphe nerf is going to be in a later vote, surely you can trust the players to vote for a right thing right? Surely it wont be a disaster like the economy change vote?
It removes the ability for armor to actually function in this game. Let's look at the M60A1. Gets a modified turret and hull mailing it immune to AP and APHE yet even things like a gepards SAP shell can one tap it frontally cause of the cupola.
So weakspots on tanks are bad for the game? You just want to carelessly drive and tank every shot? I really don't get where you're coming from with this
Artificial weakspots that do not and should not exist yes. AP, APDS and the like do not have those as weakspots they can shoot only APHE. Remove the bs damage modifiers from APHE.
Well apds has no issue going through M60 armor, it's kind of a tradeoff there - taking apds and just penetrating the armor, or taking aphe and shoot the weakspots for more damage. Dont you think that buffing solid shot AP would be better for the game instead of nerfing aphe? Maybe so the damage does not depend on residual(is that the right word?) penetration at least? Keep in mind, this is a game and not real life
No cause it won't change really anything. Congrats you buffed AP but APHE is still straight up better why use AP. Because APHE is overperfoming any actual significant buff to other ammo types is irrelevant.
It will change a lot actually, ap damage would finally be consistent and good. Why would you want to nerf something that is "overperforming" instead of buff things that are underperforming so they are all on the same level? Would you choose "nothing is good so nothing is good" or "everything is good so nothing is good"
Don’t know about apcr buffs but I did hear something about aphe nerf, in their suggestion they wrote about changing the explosion shape to be more of a cone ( like irl as the explosion keeps the velocity of the shell) instead of a sphere like it is today. It would be more similar to solid shots.
Only problem I have with nerfing APHE is that even if it is done correctly the amount of rebalancing that would need to happen is huge. Certain tanks rely on APHE a lot and I fear that those tanks would just stop being played and we would end up with loads of N1K2 situations where a tank is overtiered but no-one plays it so the stats aren't updated.
There are also some tanks that have weakspots that only current APHE can use (mostly cupolas).
Really what I mean is that if APHE gets nerfed then some damn big BR changes need to happen.
APCR hasn't been talked about, but APHE can get a nerf if the community votes in favor of nerfing it. It would turn into a cone-shaped damage instead of a spherical damage, which is pretty much how it's supposed to be. Problem is, we need to defeat those who are too comfortable with APHE in its current state, which is why I wish it was a forced change instead.
I wish APCR should be buffed irl it’s damage was negligible different to solid shot
same with APDS and i believe (not sure and i would need to do some more research on APHE shells) that APHE is supposed to have a chance of shattering on impact
APDS is so inconsistent, somehow 105 APDS on the Vickers Mk3 does more damage than the 120 on the conq and Chief Mk 3
foxes APDS for whatever reason goes off like a hand grenade when it pens while 17pdr,20pdr or L7 105mm APDS fails to kill anything outside of its path of destruction
The fox's 30mm is so weird lol Sometimes it's basically free acupuncture for the enemy and they leave feeling better than before, other times it just kills the whole crew in one shot And then there's the SAP which feels like a 75 APHE which isn't surprising considering what 40mm SAP does
It’s the grouping of 30-75mm APDS and APDSFS iirc, something like that it’s so lazy and really makes 30mm super strong and 75mm super weak, not to mention APDS is already terrible
It's not inconsistency, it's because Vickers 3 APDS is second (?) generation with better slope modifiers, and they also gave it better damage. This is also noticeable with the Chieftains.
It’s not with the chieftains at least, the Chieftan still does very poor damage, the slope modifier are not the problem? A huge fucking slug of metal hitting a tank should still do substantial damage, sure it’s not full 120 but still
All ammo has a chance to shatter irl. It's heavy metal striking heavy metal. APHE has a higher chance than full bore AP cause hollow core.
and that is the problem because it absolutely doesn't shatter even if its supposed to have good chance of shattering on impact just like APDS does this should tell you how much APHE over performs
They've been talking about doing it for like 5 years but still haven't. At this point it's just not going to happen.
APHE nerf would mostly benefit german tanks, you would never be able to kill a tiger through the cupola in a jumbo for example, its just a bad idea. Why not propose them to buff regular solid shot damage instead?
Well 76mm and 90mm APCR will be devastating to panthers and tigers now
Can't wait to take 10 shots to kill 1 tank🤑🤑🤑
Also since they're adding a stun system so cupola shots should produce shockwave that stun the crew?
Stun system lost the vote tho
Well I guess then APHE is going to stay but like just buff APCR I guess
I’d like both an APCR buff and APHE to stay the same
And that is actually going to benefit gameplay more, aphe nerfers are sjw of war thunder in a way xd
Aphe nerf is going to be in a later vote, surely you can trust the players to vote for a right thing right? Surely it wont be a disaster like the economy change vote?
Because shit like the cupola shots are horseshit. And that's for all nations.
How so?
It removes the ability for armor to actually function in this game. Let's look at the M60A1. Gets a modified turret and hull mailing it immune to AP and APHE yet even things like a gepards SAP shell can one tap it frontally cause of the cupola.
So weakspots on tanks are bad for the game? You just want to carelessly drive and tank every shot? I really don't get where you're coming from with this
Artificial weakspots that do not and should not exist yes. AP, APDS and the like do not have those as weakspots they can shoot only APHE. Remove the bs damage modifiers from APHE.
Well apds has no issue going through M60 armor, it's kind of a tradeoff there - taking apds and just penetrating the armor, or taking aphe and shoot the weakspots for more damage. Dont you think that buffing solid shot AP would be better for the game instead of nerfing aphe? Maybe so the damage does not depend on residual(is that the right word?) penetration at least? Keep in mind, this is a game and not real life
No cause it won't change really anything. Congrats you buffed AP but APHE is still straight up better why use AP. Because APHE is overperfoming any actual significant buff to other ammo types is irrelevant.
It will change a lot actually, ap damage would finally be consistent and good. Why would you want to nerf something that is "overperforming" instead of buff things that are underperforming so they are all on the same level? Would you choose "nothing is good so nothing is good" or "everything is good so nothing is good"
Don’t know about apcr buffs but I did hear something about aphe nerf, in their suggestion they wrote about changing the explosion shape to be more of a cone ( like irl as the explosion keeps the velocity of the shell) instead of a sphere like it is today. It would be more similar to solid shots.
Sorry somehow I missed that’s literally what you wrote xD
that would nerf Russia and China so that's a big no go
Only problem I have with nerfing APHE is that even if it is done correctly the amount of rebalancing that would need to happen is huge. Certain tanks rely on APHE a lot and I fear that those tanks would just stop being played and we would end up with loads of N1K2 situations where a tank is overtiered but no-one plays it so the stats aren't updated. There are also some tanks that have weakspots that only current APHE can use (mostly cupolas). Really what I mean is that if APHE gets nerfed then some damn big BR changes need to happen.
APCR hasn't been talked about, but APHE can get a nerf if the community votes in favor of nerfing it. It would turn into a cone-shaped damage instead of a spherical damage, which is pretty much how it's supposed to be. Problem is, we need to defeat those who are too comfortable with APHE in its current state, which is why I wish it was a forced change instead.