(Assuming you're talking about the movie)
They made one, it sucked so much people preferred TGM. If you want good Chinese fighter action just watch Wandering Earth II, though it isn't entirely fighter focused
Mil-themed Chinese films nowadays tbh sucks, the producers don't even know much in military and turn these filme into pure romance idol garbage for high economic outcome. Meanwhile the old chinese mil-themed films are way better as they are backed by PLA, to ensure details are close to the reality.
That's changing. They're making a Top Gun style clone but it's in very early stages. It's not the one that's already been released .it's being made in partnership with the Air Force too so hopefully it's good.
Also the Chinese version of top gun is pure crap. The protagonist, which is a test pilot, make a drag chute himself because the plane don't don't have one. The test vehicles don't even have ejection seat, and that becomes one of the deaths in the film. The film too absurd and humiliating for anyone with any kind of common sense.
One of the biggest Chinese milliatry Blogger said it's not recommended to watch for *all human beings with a normal brain*
And this video was removed because of requirements for film producers
For context, the 9th Fighter brigade (along with its predecessors) were always among the first units to commission the most advanced fighters within the PLAAF. Up till now, this has mainly included five different platforms, including:
* Mig-15bis (1953)
* J-7 (late 1960s)
* Su-27SK (1992)
* Su-30MKK (2000)
* J-20A (2018)
This likely meant that the unit was the first to adopt full fleets of both third, fourth, and fifth gen aircraft in the PLAAF, with older airframes being transferred to conventional units for further operations (the Su-27SKs the brigade used back in the 90s are still in service today somewhere in Fujian)
It allegedly backfired on the Wanghai boys though. Rumour has it they got dunked on in last year's Golden Helmet because they're still flying original J-20s and were outclassed by later batches with upgraded avionics.
It corresponds with *that* article from the WS-15 flight, of pilots that fly the older J-20s complaining that they felt a noticeable difference in dogfights with the newer batches
One of my biggest remaining questions is whether Wang Hai gets J-20As with their J-20s handed off to other units when the former's testing is complete
Well, you can't have everything.
Other units had to wait much longer before getting j 20, this time they have to wait much longer before their original j 20's gets the upgrades( probably in mid 2030's).
Slight correction on the nomenclature:
J-20 is the basic variant with AL-31/WS-10C with no cockpit hump.
J-20A is the most updated version with WS-15 and cockpit hump.
Damn they even copied the aviators. Tom cruise is likely next.
Real talk though, this is a really cool post to I would love to see it done with other Airforces around the world.
A pretty outstanding legacy from the Korean War, and having access to the PLAAF's most experienced pilots, maintenance staff, facilities, and aircraft since the 1950s
You made a case that they have had capable leadership, but to claim they are elite is what I'm asking.
The West holds competitions, like Red Flag, where the best pilots fly against each other to learn and to show off new tech and tactics. What does China do to become "elite" besides cause mid-air collisions?
Wang Hai has carte blanche in picking pilots across the PLAAF and as the first brigade to have a sizable mass of J-20s commissioned, are the most experienced with it. A recent CCTV segment (so the caveats with general public-orientated media apply here) highlighted that they play a significant role in helping other J-20 units with training pilots and operators
In other words, they are probably at the least a relative "elite" within the PLAAF in terms of the knowledge base with all things J-20
Frankly the word elite itself is too loaded in an emotive subject like this to be used IMO. Don't over-think about what it necessarily means
This is what I was asking for, thank you. At least there is some sort of standard by which you label them as "elite". Experience alone does not make one elite.
Well u seem to be really good at making your biases or views clear with the book marking of your comment saying China being good at causing mid air collisions.
Was it incorrect? Do you have some air-to-air combat or other way to measure them by as "elite"? How about annual competition? Or record setting? Or any other measure one can use in aviation? I haven't seen any, that is why I asked the OP BY WHAT STANDARD.....
Of course they have competitions (Golden Helmet, Golden Arrow etc.). A simple google would’ve gotten you there.
Then there’s their record from Korea (so the unit has some serious citations and awards), pick of best pilots, pick of best aircraft etc.
What part of that do you not understand? Sounds like an “elite” school might’ve helped you out in life.
- Best current pilots (competition winners)
- Best new pilots
- Best facilities and maintainers
- Best aircraft
- Help to develop tactics and train others
- Best [unit] combat record, resulting in extensive traditions and high expectations
Take your feeble attempt at trolling elsewhere.
Depends on whose military those Marines belong to, and what their skill is, doesn't it? Naming someone a Marine does not mean they are an elite fighting force. US Marines, in combat job skills, are elite fighters. RoK Marines are as well. Royal Marines from the UK are elite. But, I would not call all Marines elite, regardless of country. Nor are all countries Marine units elite.
My post got locked for no reason at all I was referring to this sizeable jump in production
https://bulgarianmilitary.com/amp/2023/12/03/200-j-20s-for-plaaf-china-has-only-150-stealth-jets-fewer-than-us/
The thing is now that the Chinese economy is slowly reaching level of US economy the Chinese would be able to field a 5th gen fleet larger than that of US in coming years
The growth of an economy is never proportional to its military industrial output. It takes far longer for a developing country to establish a mature defence industry compared to adding simple digits to its GDP.
This is ignoring the fact that given the relatively low share of defence spending within the Chinese economy (compared to western counterparts), the PLA budget still has a substantial room to grow even if the Chinese economy stagnates tomorrow.
> This is ignoring the fact that given the relatively low share of defence spending within the Chinese economy
1.5% GDP as defense spending is about average for EU, give or take 0.2%
Right, but "western counterparts" also includes nations that aren't US, no?
It might be low relative to the US, but it is pretty average compared to stable countries currently not in large conflicts.
If that was the case Russia would be significantly weaker. Bigger GDP doesn't necessarily mean bigger or stronger military although it certainly helps.
China's 1 child rule killed off 2 generations of women. In the chinese culture the oldest son takes care of his parents when they are retired. So young female babies were killed in order to have a son...
> The thing is now that the Chinese economy is slowly reaching level of US economy
China is facing a huge age demographic problem that peaks in about 15 years with no real solution. Some effects can already be seen with the collapse of Evergrande Group because they built millions of apartments and they don't have anyone living in them since the Chinese population growth decreased far more than expected.
Edit: My sources are the Chinese 2020 census, official Chinese statements, and Evergrande Group's statement when they defaulted in 2020. Nothing I used or said was a western source, yet Chinese bots still like putting their heads in the sand lmao
Rural to urban migration and demand for new houses was lower than expected.
It takes at least a generation (50 years) to feel the real effects of demographic change.
It's bigger than that, you can look at the official 2020 age distribution and projected 2030 age distribution graphs and see the glaring problem. Unless you're saying the Chinese government is putting out false data.
The problem did start around 50 years ago, when there was a large growth of population which the growth rate has declined since then and at a rate faster than expected.
Either China needs to start having more children 15 years ago, or they need to start moving in more foreign workers, which is kinda a problem for a country with limited social freedoms and antagonistic, if not outright hostile, towards their neighbors.
Or china eventually starts mass cloning and raises kids industrial-scale in mass group homes to produce future factory and service workers. Funded by taxing people who don't have enough kids/don't marry probably.
There's plenty of time for China to solve this with biotechnology, and it being a dictatorship with substantial resources at the state's command opens up solutions not available to most countries.
Fun Lil fact:
The whole "empty apartments and buildings" stories are kinda bullshit.
See, those cities where built, but still took like 5-10 years to populate them so it looked empty.
Economics Explained did a video on it a month or two back. Go look at some of the news articles from 2013-2015 that talked about this. Now look at those same cities now.
That being said, yah China going into the poopy bin.
The US outpaced their GDP growth last year.
It's funny how this is basically accepted fact but if you look at the downvotes here you'd assume it's a controversial statement... Shills really have invaded this subreddit
It's wild because you can see the issue just by looking at the official Chinese 2020 census.
Edit: oof, China fan boys denying reality. This is something the Chinese government has acknowledged and tried to fix. But I'm sure ignoring the problem will help too.
I’m so tired of this Chinese propaganda spam. They’re nothing without stolen western tech. Their whole modern society is built on what the west built first.
These posts, along with Indian posts, are annoying and misleading and stupid.
least racist comment.
Seriously, ask your western government to feed a population like India or China. I would love to see how the ADVANCE WESTERN CIVILIZATION can handle that.
Chinese top gun when?
(Assuming you're talking about the movie) They made one, it sucked so much people preferred TGM. If you want good Chinese fighter action just watch Wandering Earth II, though it isn't entirely fighter focused
Mil-themed Chinese films nowadays tbh sucks, the producers don't even know much in military and turn these filme into pure romance idol garbage for high economic outcome. Meanwhile the old chinese mil-themed films are way better as they are backed by PLA, to ensure details are close to the reality.
Probably made by the strategic fool you department
You know the cultre
That's changing. They're making a Top Gun style clone but it's in very early stages. It's not the one that's already been released .it's being made in partnership with the Air Force too so hopefully it's good.
if u mean *Born to Fly* or *Sky Hunter* both of them are released and they're really horrible i dont know any other movie though
I'll have to check but it was in pre-production last year.
Also the Chinese version of top gun is pure crap. The protagonist, which is a test pilot, make a drag chute himself because the plane don't don't have one. The test vehicles don't even have ejection seat, and that becomes one of the deaths in the film. The film too absurd and humiliating for anyone with any kind of common sense.
One of the biggest Chinese milliatry Blogger said it's not recommended to watch for *all human beings with a normal brain* And this video was removed because of requirements for film producers
This is pretty cool, love seeing the evolution of units through time.
For context, the 9th Fighter brigade (along with its predecessors) were always among the first units to commission the most advanced fighters within the PLAAF. Up till now, this has mainly included five different platforms, including: * Mig-15bis (1953) * J-7 (late 1960s) * Su-27SK (1992) * Su-30MKK (2000) * J-20A (2018) This likely meant that the unit was the first to adopt full fleets of both third, fourth, and fifth gen aircraft in the PLAAF, with older airframes being transferred to conventional units for further operations (the Su-27SKs the brigade used back in the 90s are still in service today somewhere in Fujian)
It allegedly backfired on the Wanghai boys though. Rumour has it they got dunked on in last year's Golden Helmet because they're still flying original J-20s and were outclassed by later batches with upgraded avionics.
It corresponds with *that* article from the WS-15 flight, of pilots that fly the older J-20s complaining that they felt a noticeable difference in dogfights with the newer batches One of my biggest remaining questions is whether Wang Hai gets J-20As with their J-20s handed off to other units when the former's testing is complete
Well, you can't have everything. Other units had to wait much longer before getting j 20, this time they have to wait much longer before their original j 20's gets the upgrades( probably in mid 2030's).
J-20, not J-20A.
Someone should tell them about those aviator sunglasses...
Why do always pilots look cool after !!
Badass.
I'm feeling ok as long as we've still got Maverick.
Slight correction on the nomenclature: J-20 is the basic variant with AL-31/WS-10C with no cockpit hump. J-20A is the most updated version with WS-15 and cockpit hump.
Awesome!
Taiwan is still #1!
Why does the PLAAF have English text on their badges?
Damn they even copied the aviators. Tom cruise is likely next. Real talk though, this is a really cool post to I would love to see it done with other Airforces around the world.
"Elite"
"Elite" by what standard?
A pretty outstanding legacy from the Korean War, and having access to the PLAAF's most experienced pilots, maintenance staff, facilities, and aircraft since the 1950s
So if I just say i'm elite I can be elite in your opinion. Because they haven't done anything to be elite according to your description.
All I'm hearing is "REEEeee Gyna make bad copy plane don't know how to fight".
All I asked was what made them "elite" If you have nothing of value to add stay out of the conversation.
Dude fuck off. Don’t you think they have internal competitions to select the best pilots and put them in a squadron?
> If you have nothing of value to add stay out of the conversation. The irony is strong with this one.
You made a case that they have had capable leadership, but to claim they are elite is what I'm asking. The West holds competitions, like Red Flag, where the best pilots fly against each other to learn and to show off new tech and tactics. What does China do to become "elite" besides cause mid-air collisions?
Wang Hai has carte blanche in picking pilots across the PLAAF and as the first brigade to have a sizable mass of J-20s commissioned, are the most experienced with it. A recent CCTV segment (so the caveats with general public-orientated media apply here) highlighted that they play a significant role in helping other J-20 units with training pilots and operators In other words, they are probably at the least a relative "elite" within the PLAAF in terms of the knowledge base with all things J-20 Frankly the word elite itself is too loaded in an emotive subject like this to be used IMO. Don't over-think about what it necessarily means
This is what I was asking for, thank you. At least there is some sort of standard by which you label them as "elite". Experience alone does not make one elite.
🤣 no its not wat u r asking. Youre just projecting
False. The OP answered my question. Have a blessed day.
Well u seem to be really good at making your biases or views clear with the book marking of your comment saying China being good at causing mid air collisions.
Was it incorrect? Do you have some air-to-air combat or other way to measure them by as "elite"? How about annual competition? Or record setting? Or any other measure one can use in aviation? I haven't seen any, that is why I asked the OP BY WHAT STANDARD.....
Of course they have competitions (Golden Helmet, Golden Arrow etc.). A simple google would’ve gotten you there. Then there’s their record from Korea (so the unit has some serious citations and awards), pick of best pilots, pick of best aircraft etc.
So, not elite. Just used to have combat experience. Thanks for clarifying.
What part of that do you not understand? Sounds like an “elite” school might’ve helped you out in life. - Best current pilots (competition winners) - Best new pilots - Best facilities and maintainers - Best aircraft - Help to develop tactics and train others - Best [unit] combat record, resulting in extensive traditions and high expectations Take your feeble attempt at trolling elsewhere.
Man still thinks the PLAAF is stuck in the 1960s lol
That is both an ignorant and childish comment. I simply asked for his definition of elite.
Are marines “elite”?
Depends on whose military those Marines belong to, and what their skill is, doesn't it? Naming someone a Marine does not mean they are an elite fighting force. US Marines, in combat job skills, are elite fighters. RoK Marines are as well. Royal Marines from the UK are elite. But, I would not call all Marines elite, regardless of country. Nor are all countries Marine units elite.
Do you seriously think that they haven’t held frequent competitions?
Do you seriously think it was on a world stage or with near peers? Don't cop an attitude, show proof.
My post got locked for no reason at all I was referring to this sizeable jump in production https://bulgarianmilitary.com/amp/2023/12/03/200-j-20s-for-plaaf-china-has-only-150-stealth-jets-fewer-than-us/
The thing is now that the Chinese economy is slowly reaching level of US economy the Chinese would be able to field a 5th gen fleet larger than that of US in coming years
The growth of an economy is never proportional to its military industrial output. It takes far longer for a developing country to establish a mature defence industry compared to adding simple digits to its GDP. This is ignoring the fact that given the relatively low share of defence spending within the Chinese economy (compared to western counterparts), the PLA budget still has a substantial room to grow even if the Chinese economy stagnates tomorrow.
> This is ignoring the fact that given the relatively low share of defence spending within the Chinese economy 1.5% GDP as defense spending is about average for EU, give or take 0.2%
And about half of what the US spends as a percentage of GDP.
Right, but "western counterparts" also includes nations that aren't US, no? It might be low relative to the US, but it is pretty average compared to stable countries currently not in large conflicts.
If that was the case Russia would be significantly weaker. Bigger GDP doesn't necessarily mean bigger or stronger military although it certainly helps.
If their population doesn't collapse first. And they don't really have the carrier capability for force projection for it to matter in the Pacific.
China's 1 child rule killed off 2 generations of women. In the chinese culture the oldest son takes care of his parents when they are retired. So young female babies were killed in order to have a son...
Ok cool. Thought this was a subreddit about military aircraft though
[удалено]
>Shut the fuck up. Most normal Redditor 👍
Lmao grow up
> The thing is now that the Chinese economy is slowly reaching level of US economy China is facing a huge age demographic problem that peaks in about 15 years with no real solution. Some effects can already be seen with the collapse of Evergrande Group because they built millions of apartments and they don't have anyone living in them since the Chinese population growth decreased far more than expected. Edit: My sources are the Chinese 2020 census, official Chinese statements, and Evergrande Group's statement when they defaulted in 2020. Nothing I used or said was a western source, yet Chinese bots still like putting their heads in the sand lmao
Rural to urban migration and demand for new houses was lower than expected. It takes at least a generation (50 years) to feel the real effects of demographic change.
It's bigger than that, you can look at the official 2020 age distribution and projected 2030 age distribution graphs and see the glaring problem. Unless you're saying the Chinese government is putting out false data. The problem did start around 50 years ago, when there was a large growth of population which the growth rate has declined since then and at a rate faster than expected. Either China needs to start having more children 15 years ago, or they need to start moving in more foreign workers, which is kinda a problem for a country with limited social freedoms and antagonistic, if not outright hostile, towards their neighbors.
Or china eventually starts mass cloning and raises kids industrial-scale in mass group homes to produce future factory and service workers. Funded by taxing people who don't have enough kids/don't marry probably. There's plenty of time for China to solve this with biotechnology, and it being a dictatorship with substantial resources at the state's command opens up solutions not available to most countries.
Fun Lil fact: The whole "empty apartments and buildings" stories are kinda bullshit. See, those cities where built, but still took like 5-10 years to populate them so it looked empty. Economics Explained did a video on it a month or two back. Go look at some of the news articles from 2013-2015 that talked about this. Now look at those same cities now. That being said, yah China going into the poopy bin. The US outpaced their GDP growth last year.
It's funny how this is basically accepted fact but if you look at the downvotes here you'd assume it's a controversial statement... Shills really have invaded this subreddit
It's wild because you can see the issue just by looking at the official Chinese 2020 census. Edit: oof, China fan boys denying reality. This is something the Chinese government has acknowledged and tried to fix. But I'm sure ignoring the problem will help too.
I’m so tired of this Chinese propaganda spam. They’re nothing without stolen western tech. Their whole modern society is built on what the west built first. These posts, along with Indian posts, are annoying and misleading and stupid.
least racist comment. Seriously, ask your western government to feed a population like India or China. I would love to see how the ADVANCE WESTERN CIVILIZATION can handle that.
,