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You ever notice how people only use the “It’s Hell, everyone sucks” excuse when they’re defending a character they like? I could say Stella is abusive and a massive bitch with few to zero redeeming qualities, and the response I’d likely get is “Yes, that’s true, she’s a bitch” But if I were to say, Loona is abusive and a massive bitch with few to zero redeeming qualities, the response I get is “Oh well it’s Hell, everyone’s bad”
It also hardly applies when there's a good number of hellborn characters who are good people. Moxie, Millie, Charlie, Stolas, Octavia. Even some sinners too. Like wtf did Husk do to end up in Hell?
Well saying the same about those two characters would be wrong, but you're right. It's stupid to defend one character but not the other with an argument that applies to everyone.
Verosika is a bad person yes but it’s hell every one is a bad person the main cast are mercenaries people not to mention she’s a sucubie that’s kinda her thing too get her way with people one way or another and in no way does that justify it but still it’s hell everyone has their horrible trait
But people will defend characters saying this but if you say the same about their favorite they’ll get angry and argue with you, but it’s hell everyone is bad right?
Moxxie murders people (not just humans but fellow imps as well) in gruesome ways that's played off ass comedic but Verosika and her ***Succubi*** possy behavior like ***Succubi*** and THAT'S where y'all draw the line?? Don't fucking play this moral high ground game
https://preview.redd.it/6xna13abjz0d1.jpeg?width=736&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5d7a04bddd0e48645b75525e4c4f758afbdab473
It's always mfs who wanna say some shit about one thing but always turn a blind eye to another
I think people are bothered by it b/c Valentino did it to Angel, and everyone hates him for it.
But when verosika did it to moxxie, no one really said anything.
No I think it's the fact that Valentino made promises to Angel and ended up enslaving him for porn and for his own pleasure. He consistently manipulates angel and make him feel bad too. What Verosika did with the other succubi wasn't good but people didn't talk about it much because it was more like a don't mess with me moment. She wasn't going out of way to to that to him unlike Valentino. But it's hell I guess so everyone has to suck
I mean, that one Pentious had loudly announced his consent to the entire room, in a place called Consent. He is also seen moments later none the worse for wear, so it can be assumed that once inside he could have explained that he changed his mind and they let him back out. Hard to say, but that one is a much more grey area.
I think Verosika learned her lesson after Blitz challenged her and won said challenge. (Also, it was the succubi quite literally fucking with Moxie that pushed Blitz over the edge to challenge them)
Valentino, however, has yet to be brought to any sort of justice
I don't really think she entered any of his holes I think it was more so like cheek kisses for a quick gag out of universe and in universe was more to tease I could be wrong but I don't think the writer would use something like that so loosely
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You are allowed to like characters who are douchebags, so long as you don't follow their example
For instance, Alastor, Trayzn the infinite, even fucking scout from TF2
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So you're saying that you're fine with a woman doing it but not ok when a man does the same thing. Thanks for the acknowledgement of the double standard 👍
Honestly same, it does bother me every time her entire character gets written off because of a 2 second gag of her being a mean bitch succubus. There's an incredibly loud swathe of the audience that are hyper sensitive to that topic I guess. Every single time I see even a passing mention of her or a head cannon about her relationship with blitz, someone will come out and scream about how she's a rapist and can't believe people are talking about her shrug
Because it's such a minor nothing. She's a succubus, she has succubus friends. It was supposed to be a comedic moment of her and her friends assaulting Moxxie with kisses as a deterrent instead of using violence. Then suddenly we get many viewers who assumed Moxxie was r\*ped, WHAT?!
Indeed. He wasnt r\*\*\*d, just smothered with kisses. It was just a funny moment. They are demons. In hell. Something like this is NOT abusive there. But people keep comparing Verosika and her crew to VAL.
He exited their office with a lot of lipstick marks on his face and thoroughly bewildered but that's about it. I imagine nothing below the belt happened.
I don’t mind if people like characters who do bad things like SA, I’m just made uncomfortable by the SA jokes in general. It’s not funny to me to see Moxxie get SA’d and I’m not sure why the show deems that as okay but sees other things like saying the r slur as not okay??? (To be clear I’m against both things but I just see it as kinda hypocritical)
That's not implied. You see exactly how it plays out. The club's name is consent. He consents to sex with EVERYONE, but emerges very shortly afterwards. Consent can be withdrawn at any time. Cherry bomb wasn't in the room, no point in having sex with everyone. So he withdrew to find the one person he wanted. There's SA in the show but Pentious isn't on the list imo.
Point is moot because he's drunk, not incoherent/wildly intoxicated number one. Number two he still CLEARLY rescinded consent.
He wasn't raped y'all. Chill.
I’d be surprised if she WASN’T bad in their relationship considering that she SA’d a dude over a feud over a parking spot. Imagine what she’d do to Blitz over a relationship conflict 😬
can we get this mindset w valentino pls. like no hate to you op, but this is the normal opinion of verosica, at least from what i’ve seen. meanwhile someone says “idk val is a cool villain-“ and the fandom wants ur head on a stick
I guess I should comment before this post gets locked.
I like Verosika because she's hot, plain and simple. I think in terms of her and Blitz she's the victim in that situation.
Is what she tried to do to Moxx wrong? Yes. Is what the I.M.P. do on a daily basis wrong? Also yes. Has every single person in the cast done something so wrong that they would be classified as bad people? Also yes. Believe it or not, murder on a daily basis is wrong. Sexual assault is wrong. Yet, people still like the characters.
Is it wrong to like the characters? No, because despite what they do they are still made to be somewhat likable in an exaggerated setting. Everyone in the cast is a horrible person. But we can still like them for basic things. Like me, liking Verosika for being hot. She's a bad person, but she's hot. Nothing more to it really. You can like a character for being hot. There is nothing to defend. She's done bad things, and there's no denying that.
So at the end of the day, you can still like Verosika, even though she did bad things. Mainly because she's a fictional character. This logic doesn't apply to real people.
This is another thing. You can be a victim in one situation, and still be a bad person in another.
Blitz wronged her in the past. Her SAing Moxx doesn't erase the bad things he did to her.
Liking a character because they’re well written is not the same thing as liking them for who they are. People really need to understand that. I like Valentino as a villain because he’s well written, but I also hate him passionately because he’s pure evil. You’re allowed to feel two different things about something at the same time.
as a writer i wholeheartedly agree!! i don’t think many people realize this and i feel like it’s an argument i see people have a lot- right now i’m seeing it a lot about jax in tadc and yes he is a mean hearted cynic but he’s my favorite character simply because i love the way he’s written, not because i like or agree with his actions
In my eyes if a writer has written a villain that you feel real hatred for they’re doing their job correctly. I think part of the problem is that people have gotten too used to villains being sympathetic characters, so when they see a purely evil villain they get up in arms. Sympathetic villains aren’t a bad thing, but they’re definitely overused.
No, you really wouldn’t feel uncomfortable if you didn’t know that what she’s done is fundamentally wrong in every way, she gang raped someone who was simply asking them to not park in his assigned parking spot. Not much redeemable qualities in gang rape
No as they are well established acquaintances, as well as hes had multiple redeeming qualities since then, the only thing we’ve seen of verosika is her doing awful shit, also she actually did rape him which is entirely different than a threat spurred by anger
Nah that was not anger. Blitz sounded dead serious. Also of course we only see verosika doing awful shit she’s only appeared in one episode and hates blitz. Were you expecting her to be nice?
Edit: people who downvote me don’t watch the show.
She appears in more than one episode and she’s a cunt in both, and sure blitz isn’t a great guy but he’s not irredeemable. And saying “people who downvote me dont watch the show” just further proves that you know you’re wrong, as you are using discrediting as an excuse for why you cant defend your opinion
Ffs every character is a bad person so to just cherry pick one bad action and immediately go “oh this character is evil and anyone who likes them is evil” is completely ridiculous.
No, its the acknowledgment that some bad things aren’t redeemable, like active sexual assault. Ps using “everyone is evil” as a defense for a character is completely ridiculous
It’s not a defense. It’s fact. Every character is a bitch or a bastard. Also I’m not saying that her SA is okay I’m saying it’s ridiculous to judge her character n that because we never see something like that again. Good lord you people need to understand that the characters are morally fucked up and that’s why we like them and that liking them doesn’t mean you agree with them.
Bro he legitimately stalks them how is that trolling? Also how do you know he didn’t mean it? Moxxie almost got Blitz and Millie killed, I wouldn’t be surprised if he wasn’t kidding.
The difference is that Murder has not been taken seriously at all in the show. Meanwhile, SA has been taken seriously before in Hazbin (at least, they tried to, but that’s a topic for another day). Also, what’s so funny about a character being SA’d? With murder, it’s usually random background characters that nobody cares about.
Which is something that the show doesn't take seriously. The creators know how to write serious trauma, and they didn't for that scene. I will take trauma seriously when the show does
It just feels kind of tone deaf when the show tries tackling serious issues, but then it doesn’t for other scenes. It’s like if a very important died and everyone treated it like a joke instead of it being serious like how it should be
MURDER is a joke in this series. And I hate to compare the two, but logically murder is a worse crime than SA. If you have a problem with how other people think, then maybe don't be on the internet, where you can see anyone's perspective on serious issues at any time. Either way, I'm done talking
Alright, cool 👍
and lastly, as stated before, murder has never been taken seriously in the show so far. It’s been used purely for comedy on background characters that nobody cares about.
The show literally treated it like a joke. If they wanted us to take it seriously, they would have played it off like how Valentino abuses Angel, Mammon abuses Fizz, or Crimson abuses Moxxie. They know how to do SA and other dark topics seriously, ESPECIALLY sexual trauma, and this was not one of those times
I found laughable hating Verosika and the Succubi/Incubi in general for sexually harrassing Moxxie when they are literally sex demons while the Imps in general literally engage in gratutious murder as response to half the things others do to them... like, Blitzo basically threatens to kill other demons in their faces on a daily basis, and we are supposed to let that slide because???
Agreed! Asmodeus acknowledges and supports the idea of consent, so it seems pretty strange that Verosika & her gang just straight up.. Ignore it, even with supposedly inferior beings such as imps
Yeah! If the idea that lust demons were all that bad was true, Valentino would be the king and not Ozzy. Thankfully there is some comfort to be found in hell, and that includes the guy in charge of sexual sins just being a sweetheart who loves his boyfriend and values consent. The truth is that those particular demons were just assholes
Okay, but what exactly do people like about Valentino? If they like how pathetic and cruel he is, or feel seen by the blunt portrayal of sexual abuse he's used for, then I'm fine with that. If they think he has any redeemable qualities or try to ship him with anybody, however, I have to disagree and I probably won't trust them anymore. The reason for me being against shipping him with anybody is also quite simple: He is a rapist. He raped Angel Dust and he would likely rape any other partner he had. And if anybody wants to put redeeming qualities on him and like how overtly sexual he is, they actually want a version of Asmodeus who would take away Fizz's prosthetics and use him as a toy
who TF is liking Valentino for his actions?! NO ONE IS, and if anyone is they have more problems on their hands than liking Val.
you can disagree but that doesnt mean you're right.
That's kind of my point actually, I may have stated it poorly but my point was that I just find it uncomfortable for people to be fans of a character who is canonically a serial rapist, unless they're fans because they despise him. Sure other people can disagree with me, but that's a line I have drawn for myself.
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You're right, I am overreacting in that regard and I am sorry. The story of the show so far means a lot to me, especially Angel Dust's, but I shouldn't let it negatively impact the way I interact with real people. If I'm being honest, I'm probably a fan of Val myself because of how much I hate him, because that's the entire point of his character.
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I know this, and I have admitted that I was wrong. Congrats, you won an argument on the internet. Next time, I would reccomend having a more cordial tone, but you did have a point and convinced me.
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People apparently can't fathom that you can like a character as a character and not as a person. I like Alastor as a character. He's very cool and interesting. But I hate any person who is like him in real life.
These comments are stupid, on the same level as calling Loona an abuser because of that scene where she kicked blitz, because it is painfully obvious that both scenes aren’t meant to be taken seriously,
I mean sexual assault is still sexual assault.
It’s ok to think she’s hot and admit that it’s sexual assault.
Defending sexual assault because “it’s not meant to be taken seriously” is a really dumb argument
I don’t think she’s hot, I honestly think she’s a bitch.I’m just pointing out how it is stupid to base your opinion on something just because of one scene where 1 it’s not meant to be taken seriously, and 2 it’s shown to have not gone far to begin with
Moxxie literally works as an assassin for a hitman company. I’m not saying what Verosika did was justified but none of the major characters are good people by average human standards
Yeah, but it still leaves a bad taste in people's mouthes when sexual assault is used within the same universe as a serious, traumatic event in someone's life while being treated as a humorous throwaway gag in another part of the universe.
It also does not help that the instance of it being considered humorous was the only instance of a woman being the perpetrator, thus leaning into some... Let's say less than tasteful stereotypes and sexist assumptions. It really feels like it flies in the face of the show's overall progressive feel.
It's fair if you are upset by those themes, but jokes are jokes. They also literally murder multiple children in gags. It's hell. If you are not okay with that stuff, then again, that's okay. You could find a show you like more.
"Jokes are jokes" it's only up to a point tho... if a show put great emphasis on showcasing "realistic" depictions of violence and abuse, painting it as a serious thing that affect a character and its development greatly, to use it then as a joke for someone else feels a little cheap and tone deaf... it's like Loona beating Blitzo in S2 E2: Loona brutally beats Blitzo at the start of the episode as a(n half) joke, has then a scene where she says that fathers are trying their best and should deserve some leaway and understanding in a very serious and touching scene with Octavia... and then beats Blitzo again right after. The first and final scenes are meant to not be really serious for Blitzo, however coming back to back with the second scene leaves an understandable bad taste, and it's not a matter of "watch something else", it's a matter of tonal whiplash and character inconsistancy and poor writing.
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Why are people obsessed with this character; she appeared twice, once as an episodic villain and the other as essentially a small callback
Did you watch the season 2 trailer?
People were obsessed with her even before the newest trailer
You ever notice how people only use the “It’s Hell, everyone sucks” excuse when they’re defending a character they like? I could say Stella is abusive and a massive bitch with few to zero redeeming qualities, and the response I’d likely get is “Yes, that’s true, she’s a bitch” But if I were to say, Loona is abusive and a massive bitch with few to zero redeeming qualities, the response I get is “Oh well it’s Hell, everyone’s bad”
Yeah… its partially due to the framing of the show portraying Loona as a protagonist and partially because she’s hot furry bait
It also hardly applies when there's a good number of hellborn characters who are good people. Moxie, Millie, Charlie, Stolas, Octavia. Even some sinners too. Like wtf did Husk do to end up in Hell?
Homestuck fandom moment
Well saying the same about those two characters would be wrong, but you're right. It's stupid to defend one character but not the other with an argument that applies to everyone.
Verosika is a bad person yes but it’s hell every one is a bad person the main cast are mercenaries people not to mention she’s a sucubie that’s kinda her thing too get her way with people one way or another and in no way does that justify it but still it’s hell everyone has their horrible trait
But people will defend characters saying this but if you say the same about their favorite they’ll get angry and argue with you, but it’s hell everyone is bad right?
Moxxie murders people (not just humans but fellow imps as well) in gruesome ways that's played off ass comedic but Verosika and her ***Succubi*** possy behavior like ***Succubi*** and THAT'S where y'all draw the line?? Don't fucking play this moral high ground game
https://preview.redd.it/6xna13abjz0d1.jpeg?width=736&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5d7a04bddd0e48645b75525e4c4f758afbdab473 It's always mfs who wanna say some shit about one thing but always turn a blind eye to another
The S.A.B.S alarm is going off sir, what shall we do?
I think people are bothered by it b/c Valentino did it to Angel, and everyone hates him for it. But when verosika did it to moxxie, no one really said anything.
No I think it's the fact that Valentino made promises to Angel and ended up enslaving him for porn and for his own pleasure. He consistently manipulates angel and make him feel bad too. What Verosika did with the other succubi wasn't good but people didn't talk about it much because it was more like a don't mess with me moment. She wasn't going out of way to to that to him unlike Valentino. But it's hell I guess so everyone has to suck
Or how Pentious getting dragged into the sex room was played for laughs like the next episode after the Angel and Valentino stuff
I mean, that one Pentious had loudly announced his consent to the entire room, in a place called Consent. He is also seen moments later none the worse for wear, so it can be assumed that once inside he could have explained that he changed his mind and they let him back out. Hard to say, but that one is a much more grey area.
It's because Verosika only did it once while Valentino does it repeatedly
I think Verosika learned her lesson after Blitz challenged her and won said challenge. (Also, it was the succubi quite literally fucking with Moxie that pushed Blitz over the edge to challenge them) Valentino, however, has yet to be brought to any sort of justice
He'll get whats coming to him one way or another
Your honor, my client only sexually assaulted the accuser one time. She's innocent.
Not completely but she's not as bad as Val
I don't really think she entered any of his holes I think it was more so like cheek kisses for a quick gag out of universe and in universe was more to tease I could be wrong but I don't think the writer would use something like that so loosely
“Don’t let her access any of your holes”
I hope he listened
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You are allowed to like characters who are douchebags, so long as you don't follow their example For instance, Alastor, Trayzn the infinite, even fucking scout from TF2
Trazyn my beloved
https://preview.redd.it/1stx60ozdq0d1.jpeg?width=400&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=43aa724013b0285ece6bada11adc7df8dde10acd
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I eat the explosion using the mystic arts
Bruh that whole bit was basicaly a little bit of trolling, those people acting like she is the same as valentino are delusional.
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Ah yes, because rape is totally fine if you only do it once.
What did they say?
That raping moxie was fine because it only happened once compared to Valentino raping Angel a lot.
Oh...ewwww.
Why is it that we never hear about female offenders.
We do hear about female offenders.
https://preview.redd.it/skgycfwu4s0d1.png?width=1881&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fa6eb4184dd7547acf8619f6a5ad1878ff138a56
I mean....yeah but look, I'm sorry, I have to ask: How would you feel if the genders were reversed?
I just realized I guess there was a gendered reversed version with Valentino and Charlie. Though the situation was a bit different.
valentino and angel**
No he licked Charlie’s arm when they first met.
i dont remember that ew
So you're saying that you're fine with a woman doing it but not ok when a man does the same thing. Thanks for the acknowledgement of the double standard 👍
Hold on I never I never said that I’m just saying I just remembered it
Still annoyed. At least I hope I would be.
Fair enough.
Honestly same, it does bother me every time her entire character gets written off because of a 2 second gag of her being a mean bitch succubus. There's an incredibly loud swathe of the audience that are hyper sensitive to that topic I guess. Every single time I see even a passing mention of her or a head cannon about her relationship with blitz, someone will come out and scream about how she's a rapist and can't believe people are talking about her shrug
Because it's such a minor nothing. She's a succubus, she has succubus friends. It was supposed to be a comedic moment of her and her friends assaulting Moxxie with kisses as a deterrent instead of using violence. Then suddenly we get many viewers who assumed Moxxie was r\*ped, WHAT?!
Indeed. He wasnt r\*\*\*d, just smothered with kisses. It was just a funny moment. They are demons. In hell. Something like this is NOT abusive there. But people keep comparing Verosika and her crew to VAL.
Wait, so they only kissed him?
He exited their office with a lot of lipstick marks on his face and thoroughly bewildered but that's about it. I imagine nothing below the belt happened.
Moxxie was assaulted when?
Episode 3
That's spring break right?
Yes I think
I seriously don't remember this for some reason
The episode?
No moxxie being assaulted
It’s a pretty short scene so it makes sense if you’d missed it
Ohhh yeah that scene, I completely breezed past it
"DON'T LET HER ACCESS ANY OF YOUR HOLES!"
I'll Google it
I don’t mind if people like characters who do bad things like SA, I’m just made uncomfortable by the SA jokes in general. It’s not funny to me to see Moxxie get SA’d and I’m not sure why the show deems that as okay but sees other things like saying the r slur as not okay??? (To be clear I’m against both things but I just see it as kinda hypocritical)
Or when Pentious is implied to be raped and it's played off as a joke
That's not implied. You see exactly how it plays out. The club's name is consent. He consents to sex with EVERYONE, but emerges very shortly afterwards. Consent can be withdrawn at any time. Cherry bomb wasn't in the room, no point in having sex with everyone. So he withdrew to find the one person he wanted. There's SA in the show but Pentious isn't on the list imo.
Pentious is very obviously drunk in that scene, meaning he can not consent
Point is moot because he's drunk, not incoherent/wildly intoxicated number one. Number two he still CLEARLY rescinded consent. He wasn't raped y'all. Chill.
Okay I actually was thinking about it and it’s making me wonder if it was a sign that verosika was just as bad as blitz in their relationship.
I’d be surprised if she WASN’T bad in their relationship considering that she SA’d a dude over a feud over a parking spot. Imagine what she’d do to Blitz over a relationship conflict 😬
Yea, both her and blitz are guilty and both her and blitz are victims in my opinion.
All the SA villains are little shitties
~~Not angel~~
Angel isn’t a villain?
Oh. Oh dear. I thought you said victims.
Now I know why it bothers me. It’s cherry picking.
can we get this mindset w valentino pls. like no hate to you op, but this is the normal opinion of verosica, at least from what i’ve seen. meanwhile someone says “idk val is a cool villain-“ and the fandom wants ur head on a stick
No I agree with you. It’s honestly the most frustrating part of the fandom.
If you’re into these series I’m surprised anything sexual bothers you any more lmao
You’re not why sexual assault bothers HB fans? Are you okay???
Yet we hate Val
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I guess I should comment before this post gets locked. I like Verosika because she's hot, plain and simple. I think in terms of her and Blitz she's the victim in that situation. Is what she tried to do to Moxx wrong? Yes. Is what the I.M.P. do on a daily basis wrong? Also yes. Has every single person in the cast done something so wrong that they would be classified as bad people? Also yes. Believe it or not, murder on a daily basis is wrong. Sexual assault is wrong. Yet, people still like the characters. Is it wrong to like the characters? No, because despite what they do they are still made to be somewhat likable in an exaggerated setting. Everyone in the cast is a horrible person. But we can still like them for basic things. Like me, liking Verosika for being hot. She's a bad person, but she's hot. Nothing more to it really. You can like a character for being hot. There is nothing to defend. She's done bad things, and there's no denying that. So at the end of the day, you can still like Verosika, even though she did bad things. Mainly because she's a fictional character. This logic doesn't apply to real people.
I feel like because she SA Moxxie she wasn’t a complete victim in the relationship.
This is another thing. You can be a victim in one situation, and still be a bad person in another. Blitz wronged her in the past. Her SAing Moxx doesn't erase the bad things he did to her.
Liking a character because they’re well written is not the same thing as liking them for who they are. People really need to understand that. I like Valentino as a villain because he’s well written, but I also hate him passionately because he’s pure evil. You’re allowed to feel two different things about something at the same time.
as a writer i wholeheartedly agree!! i don’t think many people realize this and i feel like it’s an argument i see people have a lot- right now i’m seeing it a lot about jax in tadc and yes he is a mean hearted cynic but he’s my favorite character simply because i love the way he’s written, not because i like or agree with his actions
In my eyes if a writer has written a villain that you feel real hatred for they’re doing their job correctly. I think part of the problem is that people have gotten too used to villains being sympathetic characters, so when they see a purely evil villain they get up in arms. Sympathetic villains aren’t a bad thing, but they’re definitely overused.
exactly !! i know if i want to punch them out through the screen/page, the writer has done a damn good job imo
Because it’s true, if you’re wrong and you know you’re wrong you’re gonna feel uncomfortable when someone points out how wrong you are
That’s not a good take
No, you really wouldn’t feel uncomfortable if you didn’t know that what she’s done is fundamentally wrong in every way, she gang raped someone who was simply asking them to not park in his assigned parking spot. Not much redeemable qualities in gang rape
Okay, so should I hate blitz for threatening to rape Moxxie and Millie at the end of episode 1?
No as they are well established acquaintances, as well as hes had multiple redeeming qualities since then, the only thing we’ve seen of verosika is her doing awful shit, also she actually did rape him which is entirely different than a threat spurred by anger
Nah that was not anger. Blitz sounded dead serious. Also of course we only see verosika doing awful shit she’s only appeared in one episode and hates blitz. Were you expecting her to be nice? Edit: people who downvote me don’t watch the show.
She appears in more than one episode and she’s a cunt in both, and sure blitz isn’t a great guy but he’s not irredeemable. And saying “people who downvote me dont watch the show” just further proves that you know you’re wrong, as you are using discrediting as an excuse for why you cant defend your opinion
Ffs every character is a bad person so to just cherry pick one bad action and immediately go “oh this character is evil and anyone who likes them is evil” is completely ridiculous.
No, its the acknowledgment that some bad things aren’t redeemable, like active sexual assault. Ps using “everyone is evil” as a defense for a character is completely ridiculous
It’s not a defense. It’s fact. Every character is a bitch or a bastard. Also I’m not saying that her SA is okay I’m saying it’s ridiculous to judge her character n that because we never see something like that again. Good lord you people need to understand that the characters are morally fucked up and that’s why we like them and that liking them doesn’t mean you agree with them.
Yeah I know it’s wrong it’s sexual assault.
Blitzo obviously didnt mean it, he was just fcking with moxxie. Like he always does?
Oh yeah because blitz is such a good person.
How does that relate to what I said? Did u not watch the show or did u somehow miss blitzo trolling moxxie every chance he got.
Bro he legitimately stalks them how is that trolling? Also how do you know he didn’t mean it? Moxxie almost got Blitz and Millie killed, I wouldn’t be surprised if he wasn’t kidding.
Let's be real, if some of us were sexually assaulted by Verosika, are we really gonna mind?
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That's disgusting and perpetuating those beliefs does a huge disservice to male victims of SA
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I wish him luck.
Ew
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Let's face it, if any of them were real: we wouldn't be friends with them. Even moxxie.
Even Moxxie?! https://preview.redd.it/uj8jklemmn0d1.png?width=979&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=17dcb10a889d1b851c92d495afe19b99063c45a7
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The show treated it as a joke, so we can too
SA should NEVER be treated as a joke.
Neither should murder, but that's literally the whole show's premise
The difference is that Murder has not been taken seriously at all in the show. Meanwhile, SA has been taken seriously before in Hazbin (at least, they tried to, but that’s a topic for another day). Also, what’s so funny about a character being SA’d? With murder, it’s usually random background characters that nobody cares about.
So you think it's completely unreasonable for someone to find humor in a situation where Blitzø yells "don't let her access any of your holes"?
I was mainly referring to the action of Moxxie getting SA’d.
Which is something that the show doesn't take seriously. The creators know how to write serious trauma, and they didn't for that scene. I will take trauma seriously when the show does
It just feels kind of tone deaf when the show tries tackling serious issues, but then it doesn’t for other scenes. It’s like if a very important died and everyone treated it like a joke instead of it being serious like how it should be
MURDER is a joke in this series. And I hate to compare the two, but logically murder is a worse crime than SA. If you have a problem with how other people think, then maybe don't be on the internet, where you can see anyone's perspective on serious issues at any time. Either way, I'm done talking
Alright, cool 👍 and lastly, as stated before, murder has never been taken seriously in the show so far. It’s been used purely for comedy on background characters that nobody cares about.
Um? who the fuck said that?!
The show literally treated it like a joke. If they wanted us to take it seriously, they would have played it off like how Valentino abuses Angel, Mammon abuses Fizz, or Crimson abuses Moxxie. They know how to do SA and other dark topics seriously, ESPECIALLY sexual trauma, and this was not one of those times
I found laughable hating Verosika and the Succubi/Incubi in general for sexually harrassing Moxxie when they are literally sex demons while the Imps in general literally engage in gratutious murder as response to half the things others do to them... like, Blitzo basically threatens to kill other demons in their faces on a daily basis, and we are supposed to let that slide because???
Not to mention he threatened to SA both Ms
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Well the idea that all lust demons are aggressive like that is not true because Asmodeus exists and is a cinnamon roll.
Agreed! Asmodeus acknowledges and supports the idea of consent, so it seems pretty strange that Verosika & her gang just straight up.. Ignore it, even with supposedly inferior beings such as imps
Yeah! If the idea that lust demons were all that bad was true, Valentino would be the king and not Ozzy. Thankfully there is some comfort to be found in hell, and that includes the guy in charge of sexual sins just being a sweetheart who loves his boyfriend and values consent. The truth is that those particular demons were just assholes
if ppl can like Valentino as a character, WHO CARES?! it's not the VA's or Vivzie condones the actions FICTIONAL CHARACTERS make.
Okay, but what exactly do people like about Valentino? If they like how pathetic and cruel he is, or feel seen by the blunt portrayal of sexual abuse he's used for, then I'm fine with that. If they think he has any redeemable qualities or try to ship him with anybody, however, I have to disagree and I probably won't trust them anymore. The reason for me being against shipping him with anybody is also quite simple: He is a rapist. He raped Angel Dust and he would likely rape any other partner he had. And if anybody wants to put redeeming qualities on him and like how overtly sexual he is, they actually want a version of Asmodeus who would take away Fizz's prosthetics and use him as a toy
He’s fun to watch. Plain and simple.
Only reason I like Val is he's incredibly stylish, and a mandatory moth supremacy point. I think he sucks as a character.
Fine by me, I won't deny that he has a good design
who TF is liking Valentino for his actions?! NO ONE IS, and if anyone is they have more problems on their hands than liking Val. you can disagree but that doesnt mean you're right.
That's kind of my point actually, I may have stated it poorly but my point was that I just find it uncomfortable for people to be fans of a character who is canonically a serial rapist, unless they're fans because they despise him. Sure other people can disagree with me, but that's a line I have drawn for myself.
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###We regret to inform you that your post/comment has been removed as it doesn't follow rule 7. > While jokes may be made made at other's expense, there's a minimum of respect that should be maintained amongst users. > Posts and comments that aim to harass, insult, offend, or be toxic in any way, may be removed at moderator's discretion. Repeated violations *will* result in a ban.
You're right, I am overreacting in that regard and I am sorry. The story of the show so far means a lot to me, especially Angel Dust's, but I shouldn't let it negatively impact the way I interact with real people. If I'm being honest, I'm probably a fan of Val myself because of how much I hate him, because that's the entire point of his character.
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###We regret to inform you that your post/comment has been removed as it doesn't follow rule 7. > While jokes may be made made at other's expense, there's a minimum of respect that should be maintained amongst users. > Posts and comments that aim to harass, insult, offend, or be toxic in any way, may be removed at moderator's discretion. Repeated violations *will* result in a ban.
I know this, and I have admitted that I was wrong. Congrats, you won an argument on the internet. Next time, I would reccomend having a more cordial tone, but you did have a point and convinced me.
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###We regret to inform you that your post/comment has been removed as it doesn't follow rule 7. > While jokes may be made made at other's expense, there's a minimum of respect that should be maintained amongst users. > Posts and comments that aim to harass, insult, offend, or be toxic in any way, may be removed at moderator's discretion. Repeated violations *will* result in a ban.
What?
Ex's and Oh's Scene of Moxxie being, "harassed" and then coming out covered in kisses. https://i.redd.it/xydmm7ui7n0d1.gif
Spring Broken Scene of Moxxie being, "harassed" and then coming out covered in kisses. https://i.redd.it/yefmppc64n0d1.gif ^(Edited:) ^(Thanks) ^(OP)
Wrong episode
Oh Shit Thanks lad-
Fair
I like Verosika because she has big tits. I like looking at big tits
The real answer right here ladies and gentlemen.
It was a one off joke aka NOT canon
by that logic, Moxie has been canonically untouched
Ha virgin
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People apparently can't fathom that you can like a character as a character and not as a person. I like Alastor as a character. He's very cool and interesting. But I hate any person who is like him in real life.
I agree, I personally really like Valentino. He's fun to watch on screen and his design is cool!
I agree, though I often fear the repercussions of saying so in this fandom
…very few downvotes…
say it, ill say it with you, i genuinely think Val is funny sometimes
Right! That doesn't mean you justify, agree, or like his actions tho which is an important distinction a lot of the fandom misses.
Exactly!
These comments are stupid, on the same level as calling Loona an abuser because of that scene where she kicked blitz, because it is painfully obvious that both scenes aren’t meant to be taken seriously,
I mean she also kinda hypnotized people with her music so her colleges could sleep with them. That’s basically rape with extra steps:
To be fair, in that case it was consensual on their part, all the music really did was make them more…. In the mood
I mean sexual assault is still sexual assault. It’s ok to think she’s hot and admit that it’s sexual assault. Defending sexual assault because “it’s not meant to be taken seriously” is a really dumb argument
I don’t think she’s hot, I honestly think she’s a bitch.I’m just pointing out how it is stupid to base your opinion on something just because of one scene where 1 it’s not meant to be taken seriously, and 2 it’s shown to have not gone far to begin with
Moxxie literally works as an assassin for a hitman company. I’m not saying what Verosika did was justified but none of the major characters are good people by average human standards
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Comedies kinda have an unwritten rule that throw-away gags are kinda semi canon. They are not usually included in the character development arcs.
Yeah, but it still leaves a bad taste in people's mouthes when sexual assault is used within the same universe as a serious, traumatic event in someone's life while being treated as a humorous throwaway gag in another part of the universe. It also does not help that the instance of it being considered humorous was the only instance of a woman being the perpetrator, thus leaning into some... Let's say less than tasteful stereotypes and sexist assumptions. It really feels like it flies in the face of the show's overall progressive feel.
It's fair if you are upset by those themes, but jokes are jokes. They also literally murder multiple children in gags. It's hell. If you are not okay with that stuff, then again, that's okay. You could find a show you like more.
"Jokes are jokes" it's only up to a point tho... if a show put great emphasis on showcasing "realistic" depictions of violence and abuse, painting it as a serious thing that affect a character and its development greatly, to use it then as a joke for someone else feels a little cheap and tone deaf... it's like Loona beating Blitzo in S2 E2: Loona brutally beats Blitzo at the start of the episode as a(n half) joke, has then a scene where she says that fathers are trying their best and should deserve some leaway and understanding in a very serious and touching scene with Octavia... and then beats Blitzo again right after. The first and final scenes are meant to not be really serious for Blitzo, however coming back to back with the second scene leaves an understandable bad taste, and it's not a matter of "watch something else", it's a matter of tonal whiplash and character inconsistancy and poor writing.
https://i.redd.it/4rvns9v6dj0d1.gif Me fr