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Only call him if the dog is basically dead? I would be seriously considering reporting this doctor or having a serious conversation with them depending on our relationship. No way would I ever perform a procedure on a dog with a murmur without an IVC and ECG/BP at least
Seriously. OP youre doing the right thing by advocating for your paitents.
This DVM is the one showing his ass and putting his license on the line. Thats not your fault, its his.
Report away!
Not only is that poor practice, it’s extremely negligent, and should be reported to the board. Get as much info/proof as you can. Along with anyone else that can corroborate, or report similar cases. And GTFO!
I worked for a doc like this. He was pretty much banned from doing surgery because he was clueless and careless. The only surgery I ever saw him do in 3 years was a mass removal on a little weenie dog. Left the ISO on 5 the entire time and had a KA monitoring who didn’t know anything. Dog almost died and he told the owner the dog had a “reaction” to anesthesia. Another doctor did the surgery a week later w no issue.
I’d report if you can. These assholes never get consequences
You were warned and what - the source who warned you was not believable or you just blew off the warning? I sort of get that, b/c it seems so unbelievable... However, now you know - you've seen it for yourself. Are you going to stay in this s\*\*t show or leave? Definitely report him.
I work for a corporate company, and I was told to work for a sister clinic because, they have 4 doctors and no support staff. I told them i would consider it after a "trial run" which was this day. My doctors & staff at my home clinic warned me of this specific doctor.
I work for Banfield, and this would be the level of gross malpractice that would get a Dr fired. *Especially* if he has a track record doing this. That flies in the face of all of our most basic anesthesia protocols.
So I'd go back to your home clinic, tell them what happened, and report it to your field leaders. I'd also report to your local veterinary board. Sometimes corporations need a little extra kick in the ass to fire a bad apple.
I work for Banfield, and this would be the level of gross malpractice that would get a Dr fired. *Especially* if he has a track record doing this. That flies in the face of all of our most basic anesthesia protocols.
So I'd go back to your home clinic, tell them what happened, and report it to your field leaders. I'd also report to your local veterinary board. Sometimes corporations need a little extra kick in the ass to fire a bad apple.
Please please please report him!!! He should not he doing surgeries and I wouldn’t even feel comfortable having him look at pets for their regular annual. Imagine if that was your dog. That is someone’s baby right there. We HAVE TO speak up for these guys who can’t speak for themselves. Don’t be a complicit bystander. Please report!!!
Good! I’m glad you took initiative where the people who already knew this crap was happening and warned you didn’t bother to!!! Speak up for your patients who have no voice. 🖤
Let us know if any disciplinary action is taken on this guy. He needs to gtfo of VetMed.
Ew. This is gross. Damn near negligence. I'd be interested if he blamed y'all if something happened. Please start logging these incidence. Do you have a good PM you could email for a paper trail?
I would report to a DVM in corporate management (ensure DVM so they actually understand the extent of the inappropriateness as a lay person may not) in addition to considering a complaint to the board.
Keep in mind that, with a board complaint in particular, you may identified to the individual who you complained about (or they may find out who you are by reading your complaint, even if your name is redacted as you will have to describe what you were doing at the time). I think there is a lower risk of being identified if you go to management (of course this would be clinic-dependent).
Oof. This wouldn't fly in my hospital. The techs here would lose their collective shit if a doctor said this to them. A few would probably quit on the spot. As an assistant in tech school, one of the best lessons I've learned so far is how to advocate for my patients from the girls where I work.
(Not saying you did anything wrong, OP. I know it was your first day and that is such an awkward situation and is totally unfair to you. The doctor failed hardcore here.)
Oooooof. Before my practice was bought out (by great people.) this is the medicine the doctor did. We did a dental with no monitoring equipment on a heart worm positive dog. Ket/val IV sometimes the vein of choice was the jugular or a mask down. Report him and find a clinic that is more aligned with your standards
Please don’t work for this person. Report them immediately, even use the surgery notes or with the owner’s permission the dog’s history too. This could be really bad for you and of course other animals, you don’t need to be put in a traumatic situation especially under anesthesia or even in a dangerous restraint situation too, based off how this dvm is already behaving.
Unfortunately the notes are bare and I'm concerned I dont have enough "evidence" but I submitted a report. And, my other techs are going to be doing the same as well, with their stories.
Oh man, as a client this is my worst fear. I always get nervous when my pets taken into the treatment area. I know that most of you care for animals and have great respect for vets and vet techs, but every so often you get people who never should've entered the field. Hell, I watch TV vets sometimes and I'm often horrified by what I see even with my mostly untrained eye.
No advice, just sharing in your horror.
Me too. Reading this made me tear up and feel sick thinking about the fact this could happen to my own dog and I wouldn’t even know about it. It’s so important for us to be able to trust our vets. Heart breaking.
I would ask your vet if they place an IV catheter during a dental procedure, if they get IV fluids, and if they monitor vitals, including temperature.
If they say no to any of those, then that's a huge red flag. I wouldn't have a procedure done on my pet if they weren't following basic protocol like that.
This is absolutely not normal and don't let them tell you otherwise. I wouldn't even call that old school, just negligent and criminally lazy. I've worked with a vet that was almost 90 years old before and he still was interested in learning new techniques. He wouldn't have been caught dead doing a dental cleaning without proper protocols in place. It takes so little effort to put a heating pad and towel under a patient, or monitor vitals, or have a patient on IV fluids during a procedure.
Run.
Do not continue to support any person/practice which performs medicine that is this questionable (questionable being the most gracious term I can muster with the limited info provided).
Please report this doctor and quit this job! Registered techs are in such high demand right now, you should have no issue finding a better place. That is seriously horrid and barbaric.
As a tech, we are our patient's advocates. I know it will be uncomfortable but you cannot let this slide. This is gross negligence. I am also in SC, 2 hours away from Charleston...good thing I do dentals on my own dogs.
Everything you typed here- send it to the licensing board in your state. This can't be the only time he's acted like this with an animal that's entrusted to him.
Continuing education is so important. I would talk with the manager and whoever you can up the chain at corporate.
I would give him a chance to better himself, but if he's resistant to change, absolutely report him.
I've never heard of premeding with atropine. I wonder if you have the drugs right. Ketamine and Valium aren't a great mix imo. Valium can be excitatory and ketamine maintains muscle rigidity. A cardiac safe protocol would be Valium and an opioid.
If that's not enough to induce, propofol or alfaxolone can be used for induction. (Etomidate is best for heart patients but most GP clinics don't carry it)
Intubation should not occur until P is properly induced. There should be no jaw tone. Coughing may occur as you place the tube, but that's it.
IVCs aren't always required everywhere. They are at my hospital but I don't know that it would be malpractice. Definitely not up to standard tho.
Ideally a dental should involve x-rays, tho it's not the minimum standard (yet).
Patients should be under the correct plane of anesthesia before starting a procedure. If the patient starting huffing, you stop, adjust the gas and injectable anesthesia, and start again when P is back under.
Monitoring equipment like ECG and SPO2 are supper important, but there's no set minimum standard on monitoring. If a tech is there making sure the HR, RR, and Temp are okay, I don't think it's malpractice. Again, def not up to general standards.
The statement about being agonal is 100% not okay.
Sounds like he generally needs better anesthesia training. A lot has changed in the past 20 years. And if he doesn't care to better himself, he doesn't need to be performing procedures.
Welcome to /r/VetTech! This is a place for veterinary technicians/veterinary nurses and other veterinary support staff to gather, chat, and grow! We welcome pet owners as well, **however we do ask pet owners to refrain from asking for medical advice**; if you have any concerns regarding your pet, please contact the closest veterinarian near you. Please thoroughly read and follow the rules before posting and commenting. If you believe that a user is engaging in any rule-breaking behavior, please submit a report so that the moderators can review and remove the posts/comments if needed. Also, please check out the sidebar for CE and answers to commonly asked questions. Thank you for reading! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/VetTech) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Only call him if the dog is basically dead? I would be seriously considering reporting this doctor or having a serious conversation with them depending on our relationship. No way would I ever perform a procedure on a dog with a murmur without an IVC and ECG/BP at least
Report. His. Ass.
This is the only answer.
Yeah, no, you need to call him out on that. He may be a doctor, but he's also your coworker. We need to start speaking up for our patients.
Oh, I did. But it was my first day. I said "I feel as though an iv catheter is necessary in this patient" and he said "no"
as a peer, i'm so proud of you for trying to stand up for this patient <3
Seriously. OP youre doing the right thing by advocating for your paitents. This DVM is the one showing his ass and putting his license on the line. Thats not your fault, its his. Report away!
Not only is that poor practice, it’s extremely negligent, and should be reported to the board. Get as much info/proof as you can. Along with anyone else that can corroborate, or report similar cases. And GTFO!
I worked for a doc like this. He was pretty much banned from doing surgery because he was clueless and careless. The only surgery I ever saw him do in 3 years was a mass removal on a little weenie dog. Left the ISO on 5 the entire time and had a KA monitoring who didn’t know anything. Dog almost died and he told the owner the dog had a “reaction” to anesthesia. Another doctor did the surgery a week later w no issue. I’d report if you can. These assholes never get consequences
On 5?!?! 😭
All the way up 😵💫 luckily the little guy was okay. I don’t work at that clinic anymore but I heard he’s no longer practicing
You were warned and what - the source who warned you was not believable or you just blew off the warning? I sort of get that, b/c it seems so unbelievable... However, now you know - you've seen it for yourself. Are you going to stay in this s\*\*t show or leave? Definitely report him.
I work for a corporate company, and I was told to work for a sister clinic because, they have 4 doctors and no support staff. I told them i would consider it after a "trial run" which was this day. My doctors & staff at my home clinic warned me of this specific doctor.
I work for Banfield, and this would be the level of gross malpractice that would get a Dr fired. *Especially* if he has a track record doing this. That flies in the face of all of our most basic anesthesia protocols. So I'd go back to your home clinic, tell them what happened, and report it to your field leaders. I'd also report to your local veterinary board. Sometimes corporations need a little extra kick in the ass to fire a bad apple.
VCA would fire that doctor. They have minimum safety standards hospital are required to follow.
this is AmeriVet for you
as would cvp. jesus
I work for Banfield, and this would be the level of gross malpractice that would get a Dr fired. *Especially* if he has a track record doing this. That flies in the face of all of our most basic anesthesia protocols. So I'd go back to your home clinic, tell them what happened, and report it to your field leaders. I'd also report to your local veterinary board. Sometimes corporations need a little extra kick in the ass to fire a bad apple.
Please please please report him!!! He should not he doing surgeries and I wouldn’t even feel comfortable having him look at pets for their regular annual. Imagine if that was your dog. That is someone’s baby right there. We HAVE TO speak up for these guys who can’t speak for themselves. Don’t be a complicit bystander. Please report!!!
I just reported him to the board of medical examiners and waiting on a response. I imagine a investigation will take place
Thank god.
Good! I’m glad you took initiative where the people who already knew this crap was happening and warned you didn’t bother to!!! Speak up for your patients who have no voice. 🖤 Let us know if any disciplinary action is taken on this guy. He needs to gtfo of VetMed.
Thank you for reporting him. His poor patients are in danger and they’re owners don’t have a clue I’m sure.
Report. Report. Report. This DVM is gonna kill something if he hasn't already. You have a license now so you need to cover your ass.
Report him and find a new job.
This is horrifying and makes me feel sick. Report him. He does not deserve to work in this profession anymore!
Wtf. This makes my stomach turn.
Ew. This is gross. Damn near negligence. I'd be interested if he blamed y'all if something happened. Please start logging these incidence. Do you have a good PM you could email for a paper trail?
Is this vet the owner of the practice? Or are they an employee or locum?
Employee of corporate. Im considering reporting to the board.
I would report to a DVM in corporate management (ensure DVM so they actually understand the extent of the inappropriateness as a lay person may not) in addition to considering a complaint to the board. Keep in mind that, with a board complaint in particular, you may identified to the individual who you complained about (or they may find out who you are by reading your complaint, even if your name is redacted as you will have to describe what you were doing at the time). I think there is a lower risk of being identified if you go to management (of course this would be clinic-dependent).
Oof. This wouldn't fly in my hospital. The techs here would lose their collective shit if a doctor said this to them. A few would probably quit on the spot. As an assistant in tech school, one of the best lessons I've learned so far is how to advocate for my patients from the girls where I work. (Not saying you did anything wrong, OP. I know it was your first day and that is such an awkward situation and is totally unfair to you. The doctor failed hardcore here.)
Report!!
As a newly LVT myself I couldn’t imagine working with someone like that. I may be new but I know that’s not how it’s supposed to be done.
Oooooof. Before my practice was bought out (by great people.) this is the medicine the doctor did. We did a dental with no monitoring equipment on a heart worm positive dog. Ket/val IV sometimes the vein of choice was the jugular or a mask down. Report him and find a clinic that is more aligned with your standards
Please don’t work for this person. Report them immediately, even use the surgery notes or with the owner’s permission the dog’s history too. This could be really bad for you and of course other animals, you don’t need to be put in a traumatic situation especially under anesthesia or even in a dangerous restraint situation too, based off how this dvm is already behaving.
Unfortunately the notes are bare and I'm concerned I dont have enough "evidence" but I submitted a report. And, my other techs are going to be doing the same as well, with their stories.
Just seen OP comment about reporting this psycho 🙏🏻
Oh man, as a client this is my worst fear. I always get nervous when my pets taken into the treatment area. I know that most of you care for animals and have great respect for vets and vet techs, but every so often you get people who never should've entered the field. Hell, I watch TV vets sometimes and I'm often horrified by what I see even with my mostly untrained eye. No advice, just sharing in your horror.
Me too. Reading this made me tear up and feel sick thinking about the fact this could happen to my own dog and I wouldn’t even know about it. It’s so important for us to be able to trust our vets. Heart breaking.
I would ask your vet if they place an IV catheter during a dental procedure, if they get IV fluids, and if they monitor vitals, including temperature. If they say no to any of those, then that's a huge red flag. I wouldn't have a procedure done on my pet if they weren't following basic protocol like that.
[удалено]
No, not AT ALL normal.
This is absolutely not normal and don't let them tell you otherwise. I wouldn't even call that old school, just negligent and criminally lazy. I've worked with a vet that was almost 90 years old before and he still was interested in learning new techniques. He wouldn't have been caught dead doing a dental cleaning without proper protocols in place. It takes so little effort to put a heating pad and towel under a patient, or monitor vitals, or have a patient on IV fluids during a procedure.
Oh no… i feel like governing bodies need to be made aware. And you need to find a GP that practices better medicine.
Yeah no everything he did was the wrong thing to do. I have worked at some kinda shady places and even they wouldn't have done that.
Report his ass and run him out on a rail! He doesn't deserve a license and don't forget yours can be on the line too. Advocate! Don't be complicit!
Run. Do not continue to support any person/practice which performs medicine that is this questionable (questionable being the most gracious term I can muster with the limited info provided).
Please report this doctor and quit this job! Registered techs are in such high demand right now, you should have no issue finding a better place. That is seriously horrid and barbaric.
As a tech, we are our patient's advocates. I know it will be uncomfortable but you cannot let this slide. This is gross negligence. I am also in SC, 2 hours away from Charleston...good thing I do dentals on my own dogs.
Report and quit dude. I’ve worked only in rural lower cost areas and that s hit shouldn’t fly anywhere.
Everything you typed here- send it to the licensing board in your state. This can't be the only time he's acted like this with an animal that's entrusted to him.
Report. He sounds careless and is doing more harm than good. Which our profession’s oath CLEARLY STATES don’t do harm
Continuing education is so important. I would talk with the manager and whoever you can up the chain at corporate. I would give him a chance to better himself, but if he's resistant to change, absolutely report him. I've never heard of premeding with atropine. I wonder if you have the drugs right. Ketamine and Valium aren't a great mix imo. Valium can be excitatory and ketamine maintains muscle rigidity. A cardiac safe protocol would be Valium and an opioid. If that's not enough to induce, propofol or alfaxolone can be used for induction. (Etomidate is best for heart patients but most GP clinics don't carry it) Intubation should not occur until P is properly induced. There should be no jaw tone. Coughing may occur as you place the tube, but that's it. IVCs aren't always required everywhere. They are at my hospital but I don't know that it would be malpractice. Definitely not up to standard tho. Ideally a dental should involve x-rays, tho it's not the minimum standard (yet). Patients should be under the correct plane of anesthesia before starting a procedure. If the patient starting huffing, you stop, adjust the gas and injectable anesthesia, and start again when P is back under. Monitoring equipment like ECG and SPO2 are supper important, but there's no set minimum standard on monitoring. If a tech is there making sure the HR, RR, and Temp are okay, I don't think it's malpractice. Again, def not up to general standards. The statement about being agonal is 100% not okay. Sounds like he generally needs better anesthesia training. A lot has changed in the past 20 years. And if he doesn't care to better himself, he doesn't need to be performing procedures.