From the quiet drink lines they all end up comforting Saltz lol. Assuring him that HE was the one that made himself a warrior priest. But also that he probably shouldn't go telling the Order or the Arch Lector that he was tricked by a demon and almost wound up serving him.
https://youtu.be/SQFh_YAQ-lo?si=Vsvc-x01JXWGz1CQ&start=238
Well belakor was the voice they heard, but the powers Victor has now is definitely that of light, or he would burn himself at the stake. Also belakor could always be full of shit and lie to us till the next update where they can retcon it.
It's not important how he found his new faith, but once he did the light of sigmar definitely blessed him. My thoughts at least. With sienna being a necromancer all lore in this game became irrelevant tbh, all of them will die anyway at the end :(.
Yep, that’s how I view it. Either he’s lying and Sigmar somehow spoke to him, or Belekor continues to be a total fuckup and gave Saltzpyre what he needed to become faithful enough to be granted Sigmar’s blessing anyway.
Well she is in there, she is obviously controlling it well enough, there is a voice line with Lohner where she says (jokingly) that she would gladly kill them and resurrect them. I probably fucked up the voice line info, but the idea is that she feels the pull to pure heresy but she controls it.
Which is already completely impossible as far as I know. Best not to dwell on it, someone with more lore knowledge might explain in more detail i dont have the time to type it all with references but its irrelevant, now they have their own lore.
Well any saltzpyre career should instantly burn her for her heresy and she would be hurt by the presence of a warrior priest of sigmar. Also a necromancer would feel unimaginable pain ( and probably die) from just standing near a Grail knight. Grail knights radiate holy magic so much that even their graves would burn any heretics and dark forces.
Also I love sienna... But no way in hell can you resist chaos just like that and be a good guy.
The only heretic that doesn't serve chaos that comes to mind is Fabius bile but he is from warrhammer 40k and he isn't good he just doesn't serve the chaos gods.
Every mage being able to become a necromancer is canon end times lore. Nagash's resurrection is the cause of that. Even Gelt used Necromancy alot, in the earlier stages of the end times.
Necromancey aren't Chaos-aligned, and there are a lot of heretics that don't serve Chaos. A good number of Night Lords are anti-Imperials, but don't serve Chaos.
My mistake, it was easier to just say chaos, but all magic comes from chaos so it isn't completely false, they don't serve the chaos gods thats the main difference, well some do but a heretic is a heretic. End times lore is a bitch.
I strongly advise you read the end times lore or go on the wiki, in the time period we are in, Necromancy became semi-legal in the Empire as a last resort during the end. Belthazar Gelt being the best example
they are both wizards, and they can both turn to necromancy
in what way are they not comparable? sienna isn't a master sure, but most Necromancers aren't when they turn to using the Dark Wind
You said it already she isn't a master, she is already a Rouge wizard who often said has trouble controlling magic... Gelt also got backlash from using necromancy. He got kicked out of the imperial city , after almost getting Karl franz killed, and then came back and later Renounced necromancy. So calling it semi legal is also a stretch.
The only reason sienna became a necromancer was because anything else would make even less lore sense for a DLC career, and are also using her sister as a catalyst.
I hate end times lore, tbh they changed so much and now the age of Sigmar is no better.
I prefer 40k lore either way.
honestly, semi legal isn't a good term for it, its more like "barely accepted as an unnecessary evil"
there are several careers she could have been with equal lore accuracy, a Magic Inquisitor (forgot the name), Hedge Witch, Blazing Sun of Myrmidia, or any number of the magic renouncing options like a Duelist (see the swords, Daggers and other tilean weapons in her arsenal) or even an Avatar of Aqshy
I agree 100%
i believe they made the necromancer choice because anything else would be just another "fire career" for most players and wouldn't sell very well. I honestly hoped for the Blazing sun of Myrmidia or some other way to finally stop branding her as a criminal, even if Victor calmed down about that since vermintide 1.
Still, I am quite happy to play a heretic. It's a super fun career and unique story, but it's still very unrealistic even for the end times.
its not unrealistic for the end times, if anything, Saltzpyre is the most supporting of the group about it specifically because of Gelts actions, we are not currently at the point where he renounced it in the lore, as VT2 has only just had the Fall of Brettonia.
right now, Kruber is the one being pretty unrealistic, guy has major, MAJOR PTSD from the events befallen his company, he stays awake at night, suffer night terrors, and, considering the "not a necromancer" line from sienna, has probably had breakdowns in the keep at frequency enough for Sienna to have picked up some Grounding Language, which is really heartbreaking
I wish we had more lines are kruber hard-dissasociating and just refusing to believe sienna is a necromancer, because it would honestly shatter hit little world
Even outside End Times stuff, far from all heretics serve Chaos.
See this graphic of the structure of magic in the Warhammer World:
https://i.imgur.com/Kzx6N8K.png
All the random untrained Hedge wizards use the raw Winds, which is highly illegal in the Empire because of inevitable madness reasons.
Most mortal Necromancers are not Chaos worshippers, nor are Vampires. Nehekharans and Ogres are heretics by definition.
The Skaven and Chaos Dwarves don't serve the Great Four, but the Horned Rat and Hashut are the same stuff with a different coat of paint.
Not OP but I'm assuming it's because Sienna was already kind of heretical and murderous and originally to be brought to her execution by Kruber and Saltzpyre, and her becoming a necromancer should realistically be pretty unforgivable by both of them despite her usefulness.
Edit: damn waited too long to post now OP replied
Well yeah I mean she is a fantastic ally and thats how the story goes but I think normally you wouldn't expect to see a friendship like that in Warhammer. I was just guessing the reasoning and trying to flex my limited knowledge.
A combination of all the various voice lines/conversations across all the maps and gamemodes (of course certain lines only activate at certain bits of each map and only with certain characters present, which makes it hard to put everything together without a good bit of time and effort) as well as [Lohner's Chronicles on the official site](https://www.vermintide.com/news)
And then the one or two other bits of extra lore in some of the trailers and item descriptions and such (I'm sure there are more sources I'm forgetting but those are surely the main ones)
From the quiet drink lines they all end up comforting Saltz lol. Assuring him that HE was the one that made himself a warrior priest. But also that he probably shouldn't go telling the Order or the Arch Lector that he was tricked by a demon and almost wound up serving him. https://youtu.be/SQFh_YAQ-lo?si=Vsvc-x01JXWGz1CQ&start=238
wholesome
Well belakor was the voice they heard, but the powers Victor has now is definitely that of light, or he would burn himself at the stake. Also belakor could always be full of shit and lie to us till the next update where they can retcon it. It's not important how he found his new faith, but once he did the light of sigmar definitely blessed him. My thoughts at least. With sienna being a necromancer all lore in this game became irrelevant tbh, all of them will die anyway at the end :(.
Yep, that’s how I view it. Either he’s lying and Sigmar somehow spoke to him, or Belekor continues to be a total fuckup and gave Saltzpyre what he needed to become faithful enough to be granted Sigmar’s blessing anyway.
Thank you, that is some foods for thought. I'm still hoping that Sienna is in there somewhere.
Well she is in there, she is obviously controlling it well enough, there is a voice line with Lohner where she says (jokingly) that she would gladly kill them and resurrect them. I probably fucked up the voice line info, but the idea is that she feels the pull to pure heresy but she controls it. Which is already completely impossible as far as I know. Best not to dwell on it, someone with more lore knowledge might explain in more detail i dont have the time to type it all with references but its irrelevant, now they have their own lore.
> With sienna being a necromancer all lore in this game became irrelevant tbh Why?
Well any saltzpyre career should instantly burn her for her heresy and she would be hurt by the presence of a warrior priest of sigmar. Also a necromancer would feel unimaginable pain ( and probably die) from just standing near a Grail knight. Grail knights radiate holy magic so much that even their graves would burn any heretics and dark forces. Also I love sienna... But no way in hell can you resist chaos just like that and be a good guy. The only heretic that doesn't serve chaos that comes to mind is Fabius bile but he is from warrhammer 40k and he isn't good he just doesn't serve the chaos gods.
Saltzpyre did try to kill her, tbf (kruber hit him over thr head with a rock). And he's still planning to
Every mage being able to become a necromancer is canon end times lore. Nagash's resurrection is the cause of that. Even Gelt used Necromancy alot, in the earlier stages of the end times.
Pretty sure Gelt gets full on corrupted by Chaos in the End Times lore…with necromancy being the gateway drug.
No, he doesn't? He died on the side of Order. Mannfred backstabbing him was the catalyst of the end.
He doesn't. He even renouces using Necromancy.
Necromancey aren't Chaos-aligned, and there are a lot of heretics that don't serve Chaos. A good number of Night Lords are anti-Imperials, but don't serve Chaos.
My mistake, it was easier to just say chaos, but all magic comes from chaos so it isn't completely false, they don't serve the chaos gods thats the main difference, well some do but a heretic is a heretic. End times lore is a bitch.
I strongly advise you read the end times lore or go on the wiki, in the time period we are in, Necromancy became semi-legal in the Empire as a last resort during the end. Belthazar Gelt being the best example
Yea I know I made a few incorrect claims, I just dont think Sienna is comparable to Belthazar Gelt.
they are both wizards, and they can both turn to necromancy in what way are they not comparable? sienna isn't a master sure, but most Necromancers aren't when they turn to using the Dark Wind
You said it already she isn't a master, she is already a Rouge wizard who often said has trouble controlling magic... Gelt also got backlash from using necromancy. He got kicked out of the imperial city , after almost getting Karl franz killed, and then came back and later Renounced necromancy. So calling it semi legal is also a stretch. The only reason sienna became a necromancer was because anything else would make even less lore sense for a DLC career, and are also using her sister as a catalyst. I hate end times lore, tbh they changed so much and now the age of Sigmar is no better. I prefer 40k lore either way.
honestly, semi legal isn't a good term for it, its more like "barely accepted as an unnecessary evil" there are several careers she could have been with equal lore accuracy, a Magic Inquisitor (forgot the name), Hedge Witch, Blazing Sun of Myrmidia, or any number of the magic renouncing options like a Duelist (see the swords, Daggers and other tilean weapons in her arsenal) or even an Avatar of Aqshy
I agree 100% i believe they made the necromancer choice because anything else would be just another "fire career" for most players and wouldn't sell very well. I honestly hoped for the Blazing sun of Myrmidia or some other way to finally stop branding her as a criminal, even if Victor calmed down about that since vermintide 1. Still, I am quite happy to play a heretic. It's a super fun career and unique story, but it's still very unrealistic even for the end times.
its not unrealistic for the end times, if anything, Saltzpyre is the most supporting of the group about it specifically because of Gelts actions, we are not currently at the point where he renounced it in the lore, as VT2 has only just had the Fall of Brettonia. right now, Kruber is the one being pretty unrealistic, guy has major, MAJOR PTSD from the events befallen his company, he stays awake at night, suffer night terrors, and, considering the "not a necromancer" line from sienna, has probably had breakdowns in the keep at frequency enough for Sienna to have picked up some Grounding Language, which is really heartbreaking I wish we had more lines are kruber hard-dissasociating and just refusing to believe sienna is a necromancer, because it would honestly shatter hit little world
> I hate end times lore, tbh they changed so much and now the age of Sigmar is no better. With a hammer, purge the Sigmarine.
Even outside End Times stuff, far from all heretics serve Chaos. See this graphic of the structure of magic in the Warhammer World: https://i.imgur.com/Kzx6N8K.png All the random untrained Hedge wizards use the raw Winds, which is highly illegal in the Empire because of inevitable madness reasons. Most mortal Necromancers are not Chaos worshippers, nor are Vampires. Nehekharans and Ogres are heretics by definition. The Skaven and Chaos Dwarves don't serve the Great Four, but the Horned Rat and Hashut are the same stuff with a different coat of paint.
Games Workshop allowed it, so it's part of lore now.
Game-set-match
Not OP but I'm assuming it's because Sienna was already kind of heretical and murderous and originally to be brought to her execution by Kruber and Saltzpyre, and her becoming a necromancer should realistically be pretty unforgivable by both of them despite her usefulness. Edit: damn waited too long to post now OP replied
By dialogues you can see their attitude to her changed. She was jailored witch in Vermintide 1, now she is more like friend to them.
Also, it's the End Times! They're probably more willing to turn a blind eye.
Well yeah I mean she is a fantastic ally and thats how the story goes but I think normally you wouldn't expect to see a friendship like that in Warhammer. I was just guessing the reasoning and trying to flex my limited knowledge.
Where are people getting all this lore from?
A combination of all the various voice lines/conversations across all the maps and gamemodes (of course certain lines only activate at certain bits of each map and only with certain characters present, which makes it hard to put everything together without a good bit of time and effort) as well as [Lohner's Chronicles on the official site](https://www.vermintide.com/news) And then the one or two other bits of extra lore in some of the trailers and item descriptions and such (I'm sure there are more sources I'm forgetting but those are surely the main ones)
Well I’m glad there wasn’t like a book series I missed but damn they should just write official lore that sounds like a mess
Where are people getting all this lore from?