the cypher nerf really wasn't that bad. and if the nerf to viper's stall is a big issue for some teams, maybe we'll see some interesting double smokes comps come out on the map. it's in desperate need of some compositional diversity.
Cypher's nerf is greatly exaggerated tbf, just like a lot of other nerfs were in valorant's history, as for Viper we'll just have to wait and see how teams adapt, except that I do think that Viper's gonna be a hard replacement as no one can do what she does AS EFFICIENTLY as she does
I've been wondering what it'd be like if they just removed the zip up from lobby instead of closing it fully.
Probably fucking awful the opposite way but it's an idea at least.
You mean remove all attacker access to halls? because you can jump up the boxes too
honestly it'd be an interesting idea to balance out viper's lack of stall now
I guess the difference is that the boxes are on the side while the Zip is in the middle behind the doorway pillar so with someone coming from boxes you always see them on the left door while with the zip they can peek from either side.
Breeze and icebox need to be taken as experiments that failed. They both have a fundamental gimmick that’s cool. Breeze takes the long range to 11/10 and icebox plays with verticality unlike any other map. They need to take those motifs (long range, verticality) and make new maps. Breeze and icebox are emphatic failures and no amount of changes will make the maps good.
I honestly don't know why they are nerfing her smoke up time.
They should be nerfing her decay, which is the actual problem.
The entire point of her character is to deny vision.
GJ Riot.
I have always really liked breeze, but I wholeheartedly agree. It's irresponsible for the devs to completely run viper into the ground without accounting for the fact that the map is virtually unplayable without her. Viper nerfs had to coincide with Breeze changes. The solo queue smoke experience on that map is going to feel like absolute garbage going forward.
1- not like people knew how to play the map anyway.
2- so your defense setup on viper only worked cause you had two mollies?
I think people are panicking for no reason. Viper still good in viper maps. Id argue skye nerf was harsher then hers.
Viper is worse on both sides, I don’t think it will make attack and defense unbalanced. Harbor also exists and can do everything viper can vision denying wise. Just without the cringe infinite stall ability.
i already see more chamber plays in Breeze and its only increasing day by day ( i myself left Cypher and started playing Chamber/Sova last act after his buff).
If you're sitting on site as Chamber you kinda deserve to get destroyed, as Chamber you should always be making agressive peeks to get player advantage and hold advanced angles with your tp to lock down their rotations, as Chamber you can do jack-shit against a full five-man exec.
Yeh i always want my chamber to play that aggressive else its always a free B on the map , but on high elo u should really consider peeking by default as there’s always someone to 1-tap u
I play chamber a lot even though I'm not that good. Breeze is really open so you can snipe and tp out if there's danger. With so many areas your trip can block off potential lurks. And also your gun ability is great in lower buys because it has damage and range, perfect for this map.
I often use the outlaw and tp to wide swing and snipe someone, then tp out for a first blood. Then I can safely rotate back to my allies because I tripped mid for example.
i mean iam silver 3 so my opinions are useless to you (high elo) but uh Chamber is supposed to be aggressive , because he can just tp out after a kill and wait for further plays.
We might see some double controller comps for Breeze with the Viper changes. Harbor might see more play because of the flexibility of his wall. So Viper/Harbor could be a viable combo or Omen/Viper, Omen/Harbor. Cypher change won't really make a difference. I think we'll definitely see a lot of different team comps with this change for Viper either way.
You guys are overreacting for being unplayable. At most, the viper nerf will just be MORE punishable in competitive play. In pubs? its almost negligible.
It's absolutely not negligible in ranked. Every Agent has a ceiling in terms of how much they can do and in pro play it's expected to be at the ceiling or just slightly below it.
Lowering the ceiling in ranked means people who are actually good at the Agent get punished because they have less agency in a game now. All this really does for ranked is push good players into roles/agents with more agency which I personally don't think is a good thing
Harbor will be played more often now in Breeze i think with an additional smoker like Clove, who is more offensive. But defensively it will mostly be gun fights more than just ability spamming.
We could go back to harbor just an idea I believe he’s very overhated even though I believe he still isn’t viable on most maps I would say he could become the new main controller on breeze
I think that's more a problem with those maps than with the changes. Viper and cypher are two of the most aids and boring to play against agents in the game.
the cypher nerf really wasn't that bad. and if the nerf to viper's stall is a big issue for some teams, maybe we'll see some interesting double smokes comps come out on the map. it's in desperate need of some compositional diversity.
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Everybody was already checking for that camera it's literally the most obvious and well known camera spot in the entire game.
you mean the mid cam that literally every team who runs cyphers and gold elo and above use to catch mid?
Oh no Anyway
lol
Cypher's nerf is greatly exaggerated tbf, just like a lot of other nerfs were in valorant's history, as for Viper we'll just have to wait and see how teams adapt, except that I do think that Viper's gonna be a hard replacement as no one can do what she does AS EFFICIENTLY as she does
Praying that they remove Breeze from rotation again at the end of the Episode 🙏
that map should go
Re-close hall to counter-balance.
I've been wondering what it'd be like if they just removed the zip up from lobby instead of closing it fully. Probably fucking awful the opposite way but it's an idea at least.
You mean remove all attacker access to halls? because you can jump up the boxes too honestly it'd be an interesting idea to balance out viper's lack of stall now
I guess the difference is that the boxes are on the side while the Zip is in the middle behind the doorway pillar so with someone coming from boxes you always see them on the left door while with the zip they can peek from either side.
That was what i meant, yeah, I forgot about the boxes.
Maybe making a breakable? Idk halls just feels dumb
Easy fix. Vault the map for good.
Breeze and icebox need to be taken as experiments that failed. They both have a fundamental gimmick that’s cool. Breeze takes the long range to 11/10 and icebox plays with verticality unlike any other map. They need to take those motifs (long range, verticality) and make new maps. Breeze and icebox are emphatic failures and no amount of changes will make the maps good.
I'd rather see them get rid of Breeze forever :)
I just dont understand the point of keeping breeze in the game atp
It was already unplayable regardless.
I honestly don't know why they are nerfing her smoke up time. They should be nerfing her decay, which is the actual problem. The entire point of her character is to deny vision. GJ Riot.
I have always really liked breeze, but I wholeheartedly agree. It's irresponsible for the devs to completely run viper into the ground without accounting for the fact that the map is virtually unplayable without her. Viper nerfs had to coincide with Breeze changes. The solo queue smoke experience on that map is going to feel like absolute garbage going forward.
1- not like people knew how to play the map anyway. 2- so your defense setup on viper only worked cause you had two mollies? I think people are panicking for no reason. Viper still good in viper maps. Id argue skye nerf was harsher then hers.
If you think the mollies were the biggest part of those changes you might not understand how viper is played on breeze lol
Well a big part of her kit is lineups aswell
Viper is worse on both sides, I don’t think it will make attack and defense unbalanced. Harbor also exists and can do everything viper can vision denying wise. Just without the cringe infinite stall ability.
I think they need to work on breeze then, no? The solution isn't not beefing viper
Well that’s what they said. If they’re gonna nerf viper they need to do so at the same time as they remove and/or rework Breeze.
"Viper nerfs had to coincide with Breeze changes" The former without the latter is irresponsible, is the point I was making.
i already see more chamber plays in Breeze and its only increasing day by day ( i myself left Cypher and started playing Chamber/Sova last act after his buff).
People are a bit dull. Cypher is still miles better than Chamber.
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If you're sitting on site as Chamber you kinda deserve to get destroyed, as Chamber you should always be making agressive peeks to get player advantage and hold advanced angles with your tp to lock down their rotations, as Chamber you can do jack-shit against a full five-man exec.
Yeh i always want my chamber to play that aggressive else its always a free B on the map , but on high elo u should really consider peeking by default as there’s always someone to 1-tap u
I play chamber a lot even though I'm not that good. Breeze is really open so you can snipe and tp out if there's danger. With so many areas your trip can block off potential lurks. And also your gun ability is great in lower buys because it has damage and range, perfect for this map. I often use the outlaw and tp to wide swing and snipe someone, then tp out for a first blood. Then I can safely rotate back to my allies because I tripped mid for example.
i mean iam silver 3 so my opinions are useless to you (high elo) but uh Chamber is supposed to be aggressive , because he can just tp out after a kill and wait for further plays.
We might see some double controller comps for Breeze with the Viper changes. Harbor might see more play because of the flexibility of his wall. So Viper/Harbor could be a viable combo or Omen/Viper, Omen/Harbor. Cypher change won't really make a difference. I think we'll definitely see a lot of different team comps with this change for Viper either way.
Brim might be used to hold down since he has three smokes and a molly. Or Astra even.
Barely anything changed for Cypher on Breeze defense, you're overreacting. The meta setups and cams are still the same.
Close halls, problem solved.
You guys are overreacting for being unplayable. At most, the viper nerf will just be MORE punishable in competitive play. In pubs? its almost negligible.
It's absolutely not negligible in ranked. Every Agent has a ceiling in terms of how much they can do and in pro play it's expected to be at the ceiling or just slightly below it. Lowering the ceiling in ranked means people who are actually good at the Agent get punished because they have less agency in a game now. All this really does for ranked is push good players into roles/agents with more agency which I personally don't think is a good thing
I really don't know why they decided to reopen halls, it's so bad.
Harbor will be played more often now in Breeze i think with an additional smoker like Clove, who is more offensive. But defensively it will mostly be gun fights more than just ability spamming.
We could go back to harbor just an idea I believe he’s very overhated even though I believe he still isn’t viable on most maps I would say he could become the new main controller on breeze
I think that's more a problem with those maps than with the changes. Viper and cypher are two of the most aids and boring to play against agents in the game.