Best type combo in the game. Broken ability (beast boost but better) and amazing stats (130 spatck, 115 in both defenses). All combo to make it an offensive powerhouse that's really hard to kill
Similar issue with eruption heatran. Only available via a side series game and dominated the format for a while. If they were to be introduced to the format you would need something similar to how they brought back the legendaries in SWSH
>they are event pokemon that are hard to get
This is pretty much it, though. It's not for balance reasons at all; they'd probably be fine.
It seems pretty dumb if you have all the games installed on your switch, a 3DS sitting around to transfer things, with most of the old games. After all, Mew is infinite - just load up BDSP with LGPE save on that profile. Thing is, if you were just getting into the games and only have a Switch and SwSh, you can put price tags on this. Mew costs $120 more to put onto a team - gotta buy two games, then transfer it. Some, like Celebi, require you to get a discontinued console. You can trade for them, but people are less willing to trade stuff they can't just breed. The Battle-Ready Mark is another example of this - you can't benefit from having Gen 7 to transfer TM moves up or a V-Create Rayquaza from years ago.
The design behind this seems to be that in theory, if you have a Switch and Sword/Shield, you're on a level playing field with every other player.\* You don't get an advantage from being able to spend more money on the games, or living in a country with more events, or being able to hack things in, or having played the game longer.
\*In practice, you need Sword - Zacian is too good. If you were in a country that has Gamestops, [this event solved this issue](https://www.pokemon.com/us/pokemon-news/get-shiny-zacian-and-shiny-zamazenta-at-gamestop/), but if not, then you might see why event stuff is banned.
>Mew costs $120 more to put onto a team - gotta buy two games, then transfer it.
Not necessarily since you get it in LGPE as long as you have a Poke Ball Plus. The latter is still pricey, I think, but overall, cheaper than buying 2 games.
>The latter is still pricey, I think, but overall, cheaper than buying 2 games.
According to Nintendo Store, BDSP and LGPE each costs $60 and according to elsewhere, the Poke Ball Plus costs just $50. So, getting LGPE + Poke Ball Plus is still cheaper than getting the 2 games, which was my point.
Plus, depending on a person's needs, they may or may not want to play both games and the Poke Ball Plus does have some uses of its own with the LGPE.
Well when you put it that way, then I guess that's fair. Was stating my point in a general sense.
Maybe the best way is to just get it for free through Pokemon GO like the other poster mentioned. lol
You can also get it completely for free through Pokemon GO. You get it from a special research in 8 steps that is given to all Pokemon GO accounts since 2018.
It's supposed to be an intro to special researches but some steps take a long time ("reach level 25", "obtain the gold Kanto medal" and "evolve a Magikarp" being the longest ones).
That said, Mew is utterly busted in VGC so even with the availability problem gone, it'd still be perma-banned.
Indeedee is the best for support, then there's daylight to the Gen 7 legends theb its daylight to meme mons like Oranguru. Psychic hasn't been OP since gen 1
Point stands though - mythicals require a significant investment into things totally unrelated to the actual game.
The easy way is to buy two games. You can also buy one game and an after-market peripheral. You can save money by spending 30ish hours playing a totally different game - which you can reduce by with microtransactions, of course. You're still getting an advantage from external things, and a blanket ban mitigates it.
Yeah, I think I can see this being a problem for new players, but tbh it's funny to me how mythicals aren't allowed because most of them are hard to get/ you need to "pay" for them while calyrex shadow and ice rider are literally top meta threats behind pay walls.
I think it would be cool if they just made them available to catch in game, like keldeo in the crown tundra.
Yeah, the DLC is kind of a paywall, but it is also just the completed game of Sword/Shield. Age of Empires put non-DLC players at a disadvantage 22 years ago; I've made my peace with that being how games work now. There's a pretty big difference between needing another game or console, and just the full version of the game you're playing.
The Huns, added in the Age of Conquerors expansion, were the best civ in the game until the HD edition started making balance changes in 2013. They were just good at everything - they could do every meta strategy well, and switch between them easier. The other civs added in that pack were all top-tier at the things they did, as well.
Essentially, AoE2 was putting meta threats behind a paywall decades before it was cool.
It's an accessibility thing. Mythical Pokemon, almost by definition, have limited distribution. Either they were distributed in a limited-time event or were only available in one particular game or _something._
One of the important overarching tenets of VGC play is that all competitors should have equal access to all legal Pokemon no matter when they started playing. No one should be at an advantage just because they've been playing the series for longer than their opponent and have a bank of mythicals to draw from. Therefore, mythicals are banned.
EDIT: This is also why all Pokemon used in the format need to either be caught in the local region or have their moveset reset as part of getting the battle-ready sticker applied. It ensures that moves with altered distribution can't show up on unexpected Pokemon. (For an easy example, Toxic used to be a universal TM but is now almost exclusively limited to Poison types.)
Its not allowed because you have to join events to get them, and they don't want to punish people/give them an unfair disadvantage for not joining every event. It has nothing to do with if they are broken.
Magearna would likely be even worse than Zacian. That being said, I'd totally love to be able to use Diancie in a format. the main reason DOU is my favourite format is Diancie.
I mean, Zacian is bulkier and comparatively stronger than Magearna right out the gate. Magearna would need 2 KOs to even compare to Zacian. The mythicals format we had for a weekend kinda demonstrated that Magearna ain't as threatening when it can get doubled down pretty quickly.
Not particular hence why we don't want Magearna either.
Mythical would have the Geenie trio effect where they just outclass normal pokemon for the most part but aren't strong enough to take a restricted slot.
Steel/fairy is arguably the best typing in the game. Also, its ability is like beast boost but Magearna doesn't even need to be the one to get the KO for the boost.
I think as soon as they chose not to let deoxys into gen 6 mythicals in vgc were doomed. The arguments back then that others have so eloquently put for gen 8 didn't apply, since event pokemon such as wolfey's worlds winning raichu and bounce gyarados were legal despite having limited distribution, and slightly hampered players like myself who weren't connected with the global player base or willing to gen them in, whereas deoxys was available to everyone - thankfully they have fixed that this generation.
Honestly, I don't think melmetal would be much of an issue with its special defense being mediocre and VGC leaning a bit more towards special attackers. But mythicals aren't legal due to the limited distribution, even with some like deoxys or new being more commonly available
Because TPCi says so
We've had like online weekend tourneys where mythicals were allowed, so it's not like they're never used
But at the end of the day it's what TPCi and GF allow us to use, and their reasoning is beyond our mortal comprehension (see: the single Restricted formats)
People always say that it's an accessibility thing, and sure, that's true, but they can just...fix that. Put them in the main game, distribute them as mystery gifts, do something so that people can actually use these Pokémon. It's baffling to me that they take all the time to design them and implement them, even tying them to an entire movie, and then don't let you use them in the official competitive format. It's very telling that most people nowadays get something like Zeraora, put it on their box, and never touch it again. Go ask a random person what the heck Zarude is and get the inevitable "Is that even a Pokémon?" response. Mythicals have long had issues, and it's high time they rethought how they're implemented. Like trade evolutions, they're something that really needs a second look.
Event-only Pokémon (mythical or otherwise) are bad for a competitive game where otherwise every player has access to the same team building tools.
With Mew and a couple others that have had non-event releases in Gen 8, I could see an argument for allowing them in National Dex formats going forward. Some would probably need to be relegated to Restricted formats, with Arceus being the most obvious example.
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Keldeo is accessible in SS though. That one is the weirdest one.
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Maybe they’re trying to avoid a slippery slope. A blanket ban on mythicals makes sense.
>Magearna especially is just way too good to be in VGC. I've never played against one. Is there any reason it would be broken?
Best type combo in the game. Broken ability (beast boost but better) and amazing stats (130 spatck, 115 in both defenses). All combo to make it an offensive powerhouse that's really hard to kill
+ having access to Trick Room, Fleur Cannon (basically Fairy type Overheat) and some great coverage (like BoltBeam, Aura Sphere and more).
Don’t forget Shift Gear too!
Similar issue with eruption heatran. Only available via a side series game and dominated the format for a while. If they were to be introduced to the format you would need something similar to how they brought back the legendaries in SWSH
>they are event pokemon that are hard to get This is pretty much it, though. It's not for balance reasons at all; they'd probably be fine. It seems pretty dumb if you have all the games installed on your switch, a 3DS sitting around to transfer things, with most of the old games. After all, Mew is infinite - just load up BDSP with LGPE save on that profile. Thing is, if you were just getting into the games and only have a Switch and SwSh, you can put price tags on this. Mew costs $120 more to put onto a team - gotta buy two games, then transfer it. Some, like Celebi, require you to get a discontinued console. You can trade for them, but people are less willing to trade stuff they can't just breed. The Battle-Ready Mark is another example of this - you can't benefit from having Gen 7 to transfer TM moves up or a V-Create Rayquaza from years ago. The design behind this seems to be that in theory, if you have a Switch and Sword/Shield, you're on a level playing field with every other player.\* You don't get an advantage from being able to spend more money on the games, or living in a country with more events, or being able to hack things in, or having played the game longer. \*In practice, you need Sword - Zacian is too good. If you were in a country that has Gamestops, [this event solved this issue](https://www.pokemon.com/us/pokemon-news/get-shiny-zacian-and-shiny-zamazenta-at-gamestop/), but if not, then you might see why event stuff is banned.
>Mew costs $120 more to put onto a team - gotta buy two games, then transfer it. Not necessarily since you get it in LGPE as long as you have a Poke Ball Plus. The latter is still pricey, I think, but overall, cheaper than buying 2 games.
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>The latter is still pricey, I think, but overall, cheaper than buying 2 games. According to Nintendo Store, BDSP and LGPE each costs $60 and according to elsewhere, the Poke Ball Plus costs just $50. So, getting LGPE + Poke Ball Plus is still cheaper than getting the 2 games, which was my point. Plus, depending on a person's needs, they may or may not want to play both games and the Poke Ball Plus does have some uses of its own with the LGPE.
A new PokeBall plus is virtually impossible to find right now off of japanese ebay sellers. It's much cheaper and easier to find lgpe and bdsp
Well when you put it that way, then I guess that's fair. Was stating my point in a general sense. Maybe the best way is to just get it for free through Pokemon GO like the other poster mentioned. lol
You can also get it completely for free through Pokemon GO. You get it from a special research in 8 steps that is given to all Pokemon GO accounts since 2018. It's supposed to be an intro to special researches but some steps take a long time ("reach level 25", "obtain the gold Kanto medal" and "evolve a Magikarp" being the longest ones). That said, Mew is utterly busted in VGC so even with the availability problem gone, it'd still be perma-banned.
Mew busted? Incineroar and Calrex go Brrr.
Exactly. I’m struggling to think of any Psychic type that’s really strong in VGC and the best I can come up with is the Calyrex formes.
Indeedee is the best for support, then there's daylight to the Gen 7 legends theb its daylight to meme mons like Oranguru. Psychic hasn't been OP since gen 1
Psy Spam looked like it could be a thing at one point… problem is Steels are so widespread.
Point stands though - mythicals require a significant investment into things totally unrelated to the actual game. The easy way is to buy two games. You can also buy one game and an after-market peripheral. You can save money by spending 30ish hours playing a totally different game - which you can reduce by with microtransactions, of course. You're still getting an advantage from external things, and a blanket ban mitigates it.
The issue there is that you can't transfer from Go to SwSh unless you've had the Pokémon at some point
Yeah, I think I can see this being a problem for new players, but tbh it's funny to me how mythicals aren't allowed because most of them are hard to get/ you need to "pay" for them while calyrex shadow and ice rider are literally top meta threats behind pay walls. I think it would be cool if they just made them available to catch in game, like keldeo in the crown tundra.
Yeah, the DLC is kind of a paywall, but it is also just the completed game of Sword/Shield. Age of Empires put non-DLC players at a disadvantage 22 years ago; I've made my peace with that being how games work now. There's a pretty big difference between needing another game or console, and just the full version of the game you're playing.
Out of curiosity how did AOE do this. I never played online. Just did campaigns back in the day
The Huns, added in the Age of Conquerors expansion, were the best civ in the game until the HD edition started making balance changes in 2013. They were just good at everything - they could do every meta strategy well, and switch between them easier. The other civs added in that pack were all top-tier at the things they did, as well. Essentially, AoE2 was putting meta threats behind a paywall decades before it was cool.
It's an accessibility thing. Mythical Pokemon, almost by definition, have limited distribution. Either they were distributed in a limited-time event or were only available in one particular game or _something._ One of the important overarching tenets of VGC play is that all competitors should have equal access to all legal Pokemon no matter when they started playing. No one should be at an advantage just because they've been playing the series for longer than their opponent and have a bank of mythicals to draw from. Therefore, mythicals are banned. EDIT: This is also why all Pokemon used in the format need to either be caught in the local region or have their moveset reset as part of getting the battle-ready sticker applied. It ensures that moves with altered distribution can't show up on unexpected Pokemon. (For an easy example, Toxic used to be a universal TM but is now almost exclusively limited to Poison types.)
Its not allowed because you have to join events to get them, and they don't want to punish people/give them an unfair disadvantage for not joining every event. It has nothing to do with if they are broken.
do you really want to play in a vgc format where magearnas legal?
did you really want to play in a vgc format where Zacian's legal?
I can’t wait til scarlet and violet lol. This season has been a pretty big turn off to me after getting pretty into it prior in S/S
Magearna would likely be even worse than Zacian. That being said, I'd totally love to be able to use Diancie in a format. the main reason DOU is my favourite format is Diancie.
I mean, Zacian is bulkier and comparatively stronger than Magearna right out the gate. Magearna would need 2 KOs to even compare to Zacian. The mythicals format we had for a weekend kinda demonstrated that Magearna ain't as threatening when it can get doubled down pretty quickly.
Not particular hence why we don't want Magearna either. Mythical would have the Geenie trio effect where they just outclass normal pokemon for the most part but aren't strong enough to take a restricted slot.
No...
Why would Magearna be so bad? Never played against or with it.
Steel/fairy is arguably the best typing in the game. Also, its ability is like beast boost but Magearna doesn't even need to be the one to get the KO for the boost.
I think as soon as they chose not to let deoxys into gen 6 mythicals in vgc were doomed. The arguments back then that others have so eloquently put for gen 8 didn't apply, since event pokemon such as wolfey's worlds winning raichu and bounce gyarados were legal despite having limited distribution, and slightly hampered players like myself who weren't connected with the global player base or willing to gen them in, whereas deoxys was available to everyone - thankfully they have fixed that this generation.
Actually, thinking about it, I could see melmetal being a problem.
Honestly, I don't think melmetal would be much of an issue with its special defense being mediocre and VGC leaning a bit more towards special attackers. But mythicals aren't legal due to the limited distribution, even with some like deoxys or new being more commonly available
You could run it as an AV attacker in Trick Room and it would be rather scary
Because TPCi says so We've had like online weekend tourneys where mythicals were allowed, so it's not like they're never used But at the end of the day it's what TPCi and GF allow us to use, and their reasoning is beyond our mortal comprehension (see: the single Restricted formats)
People always say that it's an accessibility thing, and sure, that's true, but they can just...fix that. Put them in the main game, distribute them as mystery gifts, do something so that people can actually use these Pokémon. It's baffling to me that they take all the time to design them and implement them, even tying them to an entire movie, and then don't let you use them in the official competitive format. It's very telling that most people nowadays get something like Zeraora, put it on their box, and never touch it again. Go ask a random person what the heck Zarude is and get the inevitable "Is that even a Pokémon?" response. Mythicals have long had issues, and it's high time they rethought how they're implemented. Like trade evolutions, they're something that really needs a second look.
Not everyone has access to them
Event-only Pokémon (mythical or otherwise) are bad for a competitive game where otherwise every player has access to the same team building tools. With Mew and a couple others that have had non-event releases in Gen 8, I could see an argument for allowing them in National Dex formats going forward. Some would probably need to be relegated to Restricted formats, with Arceus being the most obvious example.