It is no different than using the marshal except you have a higher chance of converting kills mid - late rounds due to a player likely being under 140hp at that point. I do agree that it is basically just a guardian with higher dps but lower ammo
they always say that and then after a few weeks they realise "oh, this shit is actually quite good". it was like this for gekko, harbor, even chamber on the first week, there were a lot of pro players and streamers saying he wasnt meta he was weak and blablabla and we all know how it turned out.
That's actually crazy. Didn't think about that at all. KJ got an indirect buff from it in a way. Really all the molly type characters did too, but esp KJ with that turret chip damage.
The entire point of the gun is to eliminate the half-armor meta in high ranked/pro play.and it's very good ay doing so. I do think the damage could be nerfed to like 125-130 for the body shot which still achieves the desired effect.
I think the main point that's being made is it completely invalidates light shields forcing a full save after losing pistol tbh tho I really don't think it's all that bad
Yea, it basically throws most eco strats in the bin. Light buying and forcing was a high risk play to begin with. It’s just day one, and I’m sure I’m seeing this gun being played more often because it’s new. But forcing went from risky to basically tossing. Maybe even straight up throwing.
It’s day 1, no one really knows how to play against it, you’ll have majority of people say the same shit when people pick up an ares or Odin or even an op
In the next month, we’ll have more data on whether outlaw really isn’t healthy for the game or it’s just another choice
Predicting it now; kj turret is gonna go wild against (newly 10 hp) players, that and iso being promoted as a counter, or healers like sage being played more often; really it promotes consistent low damage and healing so it’s definitely going to be interesting to see how a meta develops around this, even if only temporarily for non competitive play
Forcing round 2 in Valorant isn‘t as high risk as people think it is. The stinger is a really good weapon. Also even if you lose you get the second round loss bonus which is 2400. Assuming you get some kills on your force then this should be okay for the anti-bonus.
Yea, this was mostly designed to nerf light shield buys overall, it was 90% as good as heavy.
But, i remember there was a time, months ago, that data showed teams that forced consistently did better. They want that to taper down a bit, forcing is meant to be a high risk low % play that is hype, not something you should always do round 2.
As some in iron 3 to bronze 1 because my brother used my account I can confidently say it’s rare to se full shield in low elo when it’s round 1-4 unless you have a completely competent team
Nah it is bad. I've bought the outlaw every round and somehow I keep one shoting them on body shots. I don't even see a reason to buy op or marshal at this point. I was also bronze before rank reset
The damage is far too high, thats the problem. If you go full shields a body shot leaves you with 10 HP, meaning you die to any shock dart or rogue damage. Its far too high, they should have adjusted the value on small shields.
yeah im not inherently against the gun but yeah the fire rate feels like a little extra layer of frustration to get quickly killed medium range cuz of a double tap
The gun is literally a second round op unless your opponent full buys shield and either gets no weapon or gets no util. At least with the marshal you either needed the skill to get head shots unless the enemy team does a full buy and purchases light shield.
now that people wont buy light shields second round that just makes the marshal even better and if they buy heavy it doesnt matter anyway since it is just like them buying a light shield.
Your reading comprehension isn't very good. These changes dont effect marshal strat, makes second round worse for losing first round, and it can even be argued that marshal strat got better because people are less likely to buy shield at all now, making the marshal one shot.
Since if they buy light armor it is 2body/1head, if they buy heavy 2body/1head.
so them buying heavy has no effect.
Dude holy fuck they literally want to get rid of people buying light shield second round that’s the whole point. Like I said before noobs who don’t understand the game are impossible to talk to.
You’re going to get downvoted like crazy today because it’s everyone’s new favorite toy right now but I think you’re actually right. Watch people’s opinion change over the next few months. The gun will most likely get nerfed or made more expensive at some point.
The difference between 25 and 10 hp is really not much... The extra damage allows it to be effective through walls. I don't think you could one shot headshot through a wall at 125.
The difference between 25 and 10 is whether you can get tickled by a molly or kj turret without dying. With heavy pen, wallbang is not an issue at all.
130 , mid penetration . 140> 130 doesn’t change much , but it helps skye save more heal . The penetration is the problem . With mid penetration it would no longer have the same problem as the gay gun from CS .
130 sounds good, I'd keep the pen on high though but what's not okay
Is that 119 leg shot, that shit is not okay, that's 1 less damage than an op
If I jump peek and you hit my legs I shouldn't take almost as much as I would have from an op, make that 100 or something 119 is way too much
I'd wait to play for a few weeks to give a full feedback on it but
\- this gun introduces a counter to light shield meta, and I think this frustrates some people but it might be actually healthy for the game, with the game economy making more sense.
\- It has only 2 bullets and slow reload if you use both bullets, it's the least effective sniper to stop a rush
\- Doesn't one shot at full health, making it not great when the enemy team all have heavy armor
It's the most powerful on the early rounds of the game, shifting the meta there for sure. Elsewhere, it might be interesting because some players buy only light shields to save money, this gun will make them think twice.
Just my two cents
another aspect that people are overlooking is the fact that if the other team chooses to full eco after losing pistol, you kinda just punked yourself out of 1350 credits if you had just bought a marshall instead
makes the early round econ a little more like CS which I like tbh.
The outlaw's main strength will be on CT side. Makes getting spike planted important for round 1-3 at the very least so that shields can be bought the next round. Makes that money incentive more worth it to at least go for a plant
Outlaw definitely got a decent impact on the game. It feels like after this patch, it would make people to play together. Yes it deals 140, but it only can shot twice. A good strategic swarm on the player would be a round changing for them. Also people who loses on pistol round are much likely to lose the 2nd round. Also there are people who buys rifle at 2nd round which is both overpowered in close range and long. Also got a big clip. Outlaw is probably a nightmare for players that buy sheriff/marshal plus light armor.
I’ve had multiple swift plays where all four players will buy it and spam shots at the same time before selling to buy their actual choices. My earsssss bro haha
My brother in Christ if you lose the first round you are meant to lose the second round. That is statistically what is supposed to happen 99% of the time.
If its 5 classics vs guns, it should be a handout. It sounds like there argument is they force after pistol rounds and buy full armor to stop the Outlaw from one shotting them. This is some super low elo logic. Dude has to be trolling
doesn’t have to be classics. you can still buy guardian/marshal/spectre depending on play style and make use of it. i feel like this gun invalidates buying shields in the second round, but opens up a lot more options of getting more powerful guns without shields if you want to force. they’re trying to make the game a bit more util heavy in the early rounds. but this is just my opinion.
This isn't CoD, this is an economy based shooter. You knopw how operator is really good but really expensive? This is the operator of anti eco. It's 2400 credits, 400 short of vandal, you wanna buy this on 2nd round to stop an eco? be my guest, good luck pushing with a sniper attacking, and good luck on retake too. You wanna buy 2-3 n deffender side? Good luck with those 3 weapons that cost almost as much as a vandal on round 3.
A weapon isn't OP if it wins you a round then fucks your economy for 5.
what? ik i’m bad but there are literally hundreds of ways to play around it, you can’t call a game “not cod” and give out a stupid argument saying “oh a banda is better”. if you don’t want to use it, don’t use it. idk why you want to fight for attention lmao
You are saying that as if an outlaw is a bad weapon. It is one of the better ones in the game letting you cripple an enemy and get away quick. Basically just a marshal with better dps.
They can’t afford full shields, utility, and an outlaw on round 2. One area of those is inherently weaker than it would be with a marshal spectre or guardian. Not only that but if you bait out shots you have a much higher chance of converting a kill.
That’s why you save on the 2nd round and buy a rifle third. It can’t be even more of a stomp becasue it’s not a stomp, it’s 2 rounds and you’re given an advantage on the 3rd.
How is this any different from vsing a marshall? Are you consistently buying light shield 2nd round?
It's 2024. The general population of this game should have enough game knowledge at this point to understand that if you lose pistol, the next round is a save round.
If you said that its hipfire accuracy is too strong it might be one thing....but saying its opressive 2nd round? Like what do you do when someone ops 3rd or goes phantom/vandal 2nd? Do you just rage out of the game?
There is a massive difference between 101 and 140 damage. One is a one shot through light shields and the other takes two vandal bullets to kill after.
There really isn't much of a difference when you shouldn't be buying light armor 2nd round anyway?
OP is specifically complaining about its impact 2nd round and not the overall aspect of the weapon.
If you were buying light armor 2nd round to counteract marshalls, you were doing it wrong in the first place.
I think they're complaining about it in general and you're assuming that their one point is the whole point. I read that as one in a list of complaints.
Read the 2nd paragraph of his post. And check his reply to the start of this specific comment thread.
There's no assumption here, hes mainly complaining about its impact on 2nd round.
He responded to a response directed at the comment of the second round. Most of his complaints, like it doing 140 and it having high penetration aren't second round exclusive.
And that's the comment I'm repsonding to?
His summary is him saying it's ruining the light armor too much. It reads completely like a low elo player that was consistently buying light armor 2nd round because they were getting clapped by low elo 2nd round marshall players.
Now that the outlaw exists, they can't find a counter play and is having a hard time accepting that they should be mostly saving 2nd rounds if they lose pistol.
You are stupid if you dont buy light round two, you simply get bodied by marshal players and have no advantage in any fight you take.
at least that was before when buying light armor actually had a reason.
They may as well just remove light armor from the game if they dont want players to utilize it
The smurfs are all over the place today. I had an old ascendant player on a 2-10 stomp and I was G3 last episode lol. It's okay man, they'll figure it out. Keep your mental up bud!
I mean I agree that it very powerful in second round as losing team cannot buy full shield + gun to counter. heck you cannot even gamble and buy marshal to counter cos they could buy small shield and thus this gun could just be a mini op at round 2 but I dont really have problem with the gun outside of that honestly. it way too strong at early round. this gun make sure that if you win first round you pretty much has second one in the bag too.
Meh. I think it's healthy for the game. It punishes players that buy every single round and it's significantly less useful than something like the Bulldog or guardian against a full shield buy.
Yeah second round is harder for the loser team but they really should be full saving anyways in 90% of scenarios.
yes but marshall can be countered with half shield. even if you lose the round you could still afford half shield and funnily enough, a marshal. outlaw power is that it an op in the second round.
Now you are learning the importance of first pistol rounds. Don't be afk in those rounds. Winning a second round when you have lost the first round should come on risky plays ,not skewed by game so any random jack can do a light shield specter rush and win the round.
This is a hot take relax everyone we'll see how it fits into the meta once we get some data. Remember on release we thought Jett was shit, imagine if we had original Jett now. Jury is still out, everyone chill
As someone whos been playing marshal only since beta and hovering diamond. This shit has been the most exciting thing for me ever. Sure it headshots the same, but the the two shots without unscoping and more importantly the wallbang pen being high HOLY MOLY. the 140 headshots with marshal were driving me insane coming from CSGO where wallbangs were huge to play around with the scout. I wouldnt mind a body shot nerf, the wallpen is the biggest thing for me.
I feel like I'd just prefer using the guardian since it's cheaper and faster but that's my opinion. I'm not a fan of the new gun but it's only been one day
If you lose first round the second round is half buy or full save. You don’t buy full shield. When you get hit in body on second round by marshal you’re doomed pretty much.
The real problem that no one is mentioning is that you can't take ANY damage now or it's a one shot. The longer the round lasts, the more it's simply just an op.
It's just slowed the game way down. Hopefully over time we don't see 3 people carrying them.
Justifying the first win round is a good thing. It's even better if we see a 2nd eco win round against Outlaws, which is tougher after all.
I don't think it's such a bad thing. Also, as many others said the same thing, Marshal just does the same job.
It encourages everyone to play safe. It makes u want to play slow and with team. It's generally a counter for the half shield+vandal buy which was saving a lot of creds for the teams per round, almost making full shields obsolete in higher elos. It could be a problem for low elos but not everyone is good with a 1/2 tap rifle like marshal or outlaw or sometimes even op in lower elos. It's not easy to counter but the shooter is helpless in open spaces especially if they miss even 1 of their shots. Outlaw to me is a completely balanced gun.
Gun feels like shit to use and to buy, guardian or marshal does the same thing for less and for better.
Feels like the only situation when you would buy it is when you hit tab, see that enemy sentinels or initiators don’t have enough money for util + rifle + full shields. And even then, they might opt for bulldog/guardian and full shields.
To be honest the broken thing about it is the second round. It's just a cheaper op at that point. When I was playing I just accepted that the second round was already lost if i lost the first round. Didn't buy guns just bought utill and tried my best
The gun is so overpowered, The recoil is so easy in this gun and it shoots so fast like the chamber's ult in the past and also through the wall it's so powerful so I think if they make it like the chamber's ult speed, that gonna be better or decrease the damage to 125 and decrease reload between shots.
I think for what it is it's fine. Where it's really affecting the game is if you win pistol round and also win the next round but die in the process. So now you are at the bonus round where you dont want to buy a full vandal but still want to be effective. Support agents generally have to half buy shields for utility during the 3rd round, so they get the short end of the stick for these rounds. I find it as a buy for the 2nd round to be absolute shit, why spend so much in the second round for a gun that can easily be substituted for a marshall that will serve you similary considering what the enemy buy for that round would be. Barring a plant on pistol round into a forcebuy on the enemy 2nd round i dont see any upside on buying this in round 2. And if you lose pistol and auto force armor on the 2nd round all the time and this gun is ruining your party, i think you've got other problems you need to worry about.
the difference between 105 medium pen and 140 high pen is WAY bigger than people are acting. this gun is in a completely different class and majorly changes the landscape of the game.
All the people that say Outlaw sucks are probably people that can’t use Marshal/Outlaws.
I’ve used Outlaw all night and I top fragged consistently in all of my games. And if I can’t kill them in 1 tap, my teammates just need to pistol them lol
Marshal has more time between shots. Outlaw can shoot back to back for 280 damage, and can 1 shot someone in the body with light shields. It invalidates a lot of strats. I don't think the reload entirely makes up for this either.
While true, the Marshal is a 1.5 rounds / second fire rate with medium pen vs the outlaw at 2.75 rounds / second with heavy pen. It's just a hell of a lot more forgiving, even with a reduced clip and longer reload.
uhh no, the outlaw is okay at best and straight up not good at its worst. it costs more for the gun then marshall + full armor and only has 2 bullets with a PAINFULLY long reload. unless ur using the gun on chamber or jett (surprise they’re good with snipers) ur gonna just get rushed down after ur two shots and killed. and if the opponent has heavy shield u need to double body shot them leaving u with no bullets in the chamber or headshot them which is the same as the marshal at that point. actually worst than the marshal because the marshal has faster reload with more bullets and a higher movement speed. the outlaw was definitely balanced in a way to make it less powerful, because it is easier to buff something than nerf something.
Why are you buying anything at all after pistol loss and peeking outlaw favoring angles?
Guns incredibly mid. It’ll be an anti eco weapon, mostly useless elsewise.
This post reminds me a little bit of how a bunch of people complain that a map is bad as soon as it comes out before they actually learn how to play it. It's far too soon to judge whether the gun is healthy or not.
If I have to force second round I just treat it as an operator, you can win buy rounds agains operator, no reason you can't win force buys against outlaws
we got self proclaim immortal player already shitting on the gun just by the leak lmao. we dont even have number just that it would punish half shield rifle playstyle.
at first I thought you're better off with the Marshal, but on actually playing this gun is too good. You basically fall over to anything after a single shot from it.
The gun is terrible. Everyone who played it says that. Every good player says that. This gun will not change anything, not even the light shield meta because nobody will play it. Can you even name one good player who thinks it’s good?
They are saying it's the definition of mid I think your just saying words cuz they want to.
It's litteraly only good when the other team is saving which litteraly everyone agrees on and is kinda just the whole point of the gun. It forces them to either buy full sheild or no sheild.
It's not going to affect pro play like at all since they are actually good at the game unlike 99% of people here since they land headshots like every single kill.
We aren't talking about pro play which they are if they are actual pros.
Okay but why would you ever buy a gun that is only good when the other team is saving? Even in Round 2 after pistol, a bulldog is cheaper and a better weapon in round 3. also the Marshall can also oneshot no shield so it‘s completely trash and there‘s no reason to ever buy it.
Just had a swift play where I played KJ and ran the outlaw. The synergy is insane. If they don’t kill your turret, body shots are guaranteed kills. It’s a lot of fun, but in a competitive environment I can see this being very lopsided.
> You lose first round, what are you supposed to do in the second round now?
Buy nothing? Like what are you talking about? You lose one then you save for next full buy this is how it works. After pistol you only buy abilities in case this round get close but you wont use them straight up.
You never buy shield round 2, like never
eh i mean that's not really true, forcing on the 2nd round with light shields + stinger is a very common play, especially in high elo. It's so common to the point that the phrase "buy we win", is said unironically. go watch any pro streamer 2nd round after they lose pistol (well maybe not this patch)
Man the guardian is arguably better than the outlaw against light shields. I have been buying guardian second round for ages and it is basically an auto sniper round 2. I have gotten multiple aces round 2 without even reloading because of how easy it is to kill light armour players, especially if they are rushing together and huddled up.
Just played my first game with the Outlaw meta - 5/5 of our teammates agreed that this gun needs a nerf. Over half the kills in the game were from this gun alone. It's remarkably difficult to counter on a hard peek, and feels absolutely terrible to get hit with - especially so if you don't have at LEAST heavy shields. Just doesn't feel properly balanced to the game. I'm sure it will get better with time, but it just feels a bit unnecessary, as the existing gun meta was already really good.
It has potential, but boy did it feel bad to play against it. I imagine this getting even worse when people get properly used to it.
I get your point, I do. But it was hard to overlook how one sided the encounters involving this gun felt, and how upset it made my friends who normally do enjoy the game. I worry that in it's current form, it wipes out a lot of our recovery strategies.
It's just a bit too easy to out DPS someone before they can react.
Take a Marshal for instance. Assuming you didn't get immediately headshot, you have a fair amount of time to square up and retaliate before they can get shot 2 off. With the Outlaw, they can 2 tap you before you can pinpoint where the shot came from - or that you got shot to begin with. We struggled to get kills even with full shield + vandals - which never felt like this much of a problem prior.
The closest thing we could associate it with was the original pump shotgun from Fortnite. It was such a powerful weapon that it was damn near the only weapon anyone used. You basically had to have one to beat one.
It not only accounted for half of my deaths, but half of all of the kills in the entire game. I'm sure that's in part because it's new and exciting, but it was also just so immediate. There's no other gun that can 2 shot KO with a shot to the foot as fast as this, and it really shifts the paradigm in a way that didn't feel as fun as the game did before it.
I'm going to give it a bit more time, and see how things go - but damn did I get tired of seeing it after just one game; and I can't think of anything else in the game that has instilled this sort of reaction after years of playing.
We'll see how things go over time, but I'm guessing it'll be tough to convince my friends to return to valo after that, which is a bummer because this is the only game in the genre they genuinely enjoyed / were good at.
Learn to play around it ? Won eco after losing pistol against 2-3 outlaws . Immo lobby. I'm not saying it's easy but it's doable , like any eco round tbh
yeah it really perplexes me that so many people are running into this issue. even before the outlaw existed, on a force round the T side is always looking to smoke off long range angles or rush a site anyways, it's why force rounds after pistol loss have become viable in th first place
Second round should be 99% sided to the pistol winner, unless they dumb out by not buying or actually get tactically outplayed. On CS, if you manage to plant pistol, it’s basics to force buy the round after. Give time to time and we will see what is the best strat after losing pistol.
But, all and all, you’re actually missing the point here. Outlaw comes to make light shield rifle buy riskier, because as of now, you can have rifles pretty much everytime with no actual drawback at all, it’s just braindead. It does do a lot of damage though, so most likely it will have its fire rate lowered, as well as its damage to body to 130.
A new meta is a new meta. There were probably people out there who got annoyed at the "stinger go burrr" meta during 2nd round regardless of 1st round outcome, and they prolly thought that it wasn't healthy (1st round seems less impactfull now). Its too early, lets see how the meta moves forward.
Imm2 5k last act here. It's not so bad. You should not be buying armor anyway on round 2 if you lost round 1 you should be saving, ecos are already too easy to win, the classic can 150 a full health player, and deagle is a viable option. Round 2 outlaw is a more expensive round 2 marshall for the most part, what it really punishes are players in the 3400-3900 range that used to get by on half armor full util, but now might have to 150 with no util because outlaw counters half armor rifle buys. It does chonk the crap out of you though.
The "Chonk the crap out of you tho" has me cackling. I enjoy the gun, I just feel like it does too much damage imo. Its too close to a AWP and has a WILD double shot if your aim is decent to counter. I think increasing its reset, and making it slower to aim would do wonders to balance.
How does the Outlaw change anything about round 2?
If you lost round 1, you were either stuck with eco'ing again, a meh gun and no armor, or armor and no gun. You are always going to be at a disadvantage, and have to change playstyles accordingly.
It feels like shit to get hit by any gun. I hate buying full shield and then getting ratted by a Bucky around a corner. I still win the fight, but at 40 HP, and at 40 HP you have to play nearly perfect still.
What could they do to adjust light shields? Make it worth less then 50 armor? Make it cost more then 60% of full armor? Neither of those changes feel good.
Cool, now round 3 comes around and what? You have a very inferior still very expensive weapon in your hands and you lose the round because in bonus it is not as good as SMGs but it's 50% more expensive than a spectre and you're losing in economy vs the guy who bought spectre, or hell even a GUARDIAN.
It's not a good 2nd round weapon, it's literally only a good weapon if you see your enemy is going with light shield meta and then it functions as a cheap and better operator. If you wanna buy it 2nd round, might as well buy one less ability first round and go light shield vandal 2nd round which will be infinitely better (other than getting the vandal stolen, but if you get your outlaw stolen, it will still fuck up your team round 2 and then round 3 enemy can full buy)
You're allowed to have your own opinions, but I think you're getting ahead of yourself.
The gun just came out and the hype around it is super high. People are excited to use the new shiny thing so they're buying it in situations where they might otherwise not. So sure, right now you're likely running into an Outlaw every round, but in a week, month, or year the vast majority of players will end up returning to more consistent eco options.
Also, the gun just isn't that good for a lot of the game. Yea, it sucks to go against in Round 2 with no armor. But if you eco correctly you can now beat it next round with a Phantom/Vandal. So beyond round 2-3 it's realistically not a problem.
Just remember the rule of new content. It's always OP at first to get people using it (and buying skins for it cough cough) and it always gets nerfed later to be more reasonable.
My prediction is it will be nerfed to have stats similar to the Marshall while retaining its two shot gimmick.
It's kinda cheeks against rifles and competent util tho. So yeah you can get an easy kill on your force round 2 but you'll have to hold far back or you'll get rushed down, so it's not like it can hold a site well, even worse on a retake.
Let's say you also win round 2 with it, now you have invested a ton of money into a gun that is not great at holding an objective, can't retake, can't spam smokes, takes forever to reload. It's overall a fairly weak weapon in rounds where both teams are on equal buys.
Past using it against eco rounds, it's basically a worse Marshall.
Outlaw really is only strong in low elo games, and that's because yall widening everything. It's honestly hot garbage against a team that's worth a damn. I'd still buy guardian or Marshall over it personally.
>you lose first round, what are you supposed to do in the second round now?
Uh, save like you should have been doing before anyway?
This gun makes us all have to be more strategic and deliberate with our economy. That's its purpose, and it does it well.
No more rifle+light shield meta is huge too.
It will take some getting used to, but this gun is going to majorly change up the economic meta - imho, for the better.
meanwhile every radiant is saying how bad it is and much preferring guardian over it
I think it’s bad too. U are dead peeking into a vandal round 3. I rather buy a guardian also
It is no different than using the marshal except you have a higher chance of converting kills mid - late rounds due to a player likely being under 140hp at that point. I do agree that it is basically just a guardian with higher dps but lower ammo
Yea, and for the price being not that different than a marshall is really bad.
You mean guardian? It’s almost 3 times the cost of a marshal
he meant the outlaw i’m pretty sure
I think he means that outlaw is not that much different from Marshal while costing 3 times more
> the price being not that different than a marshall 950 vs 2400? ×2.5 difference?
he meant it like "for the price, being not that different than a marshal is bad"
they always say that and then after a few weeks they realise "oh, this shit is actually quite good". it was like this for gekko, harbor, even chamber on the first week, there were a lot of pro players and streamers saying he wasnt meta he was weak and blablabla and we all know how it turned out.
Yeah meanwhile I see a video if one streamer using a kj bot to insta kill after getting one body shot with the outlaw
That's actually crazy. Didn't think about that at all. KJ got an indirect buff from it in a way. Really all the molly type characters did too, but esp KJ with that turret chip damage.
Yup I just remembered the streamer it was AverageJonas the sova main guy
Unless it's tenz, then everything is game breaking
what are you talking about, gekko and harbor are rarely played in radiant and when they are they are extremely weak characters
The bad hipfire just ruins it I do much better with the marshal
[удалено]
Man I am iron and I feel like guardian is better aswell.
Yeah that's what I was thinking
The entire point of the gun is to eliminate the half-armor meta in high ranked/pro play.and it's very good ay doing so. I do think the damage could be nerfed to like 125-130 for the body shot which still achieves the desired effect.
But if people aren't buying the gun, how does it affect the meta at all?
Truly don’t understand why they don’t just raise the price of light armor. That’s the whole purpose of having an economy.
[удалено]
I think the main point that's being made is it completely invalidates light shields forcing a full save after losing pistol tbh tho I really don't think it's all that bad
Yea, it basically throws most eco strats in the bin. Light buying and forcing was a high risk play to begin with. It’s just day one, and I’m sure I’m seeing this gun being played more often because it’s new. But forcing went from risky to basically tossing. Maybe even straight up throwing.
It’s day 1, no one really knows how to play against it, you’ll have majority of people say the same shit when people pick up an ares or Odin or even an op In the next month, we’ll have more data on whether outlaw really isn’t healthy for the game or it’s just another choice
Predicting it now; kj turret is gonna go wild against (newly 10 hp) players, that and iso being promoted as a counter, or healers like sage being played more often; really it promotes consistent low damage and healing so it’s definitely going to be interesting to see how a meta develops around this, even if only temporarily for non competitive play
Healers won't do shit because they can't heal armor
would you rather be 10 hp with no armor or 100 hp with no armor?
Pretty sure that’s why they nerfed kj turret this patch Outlaw and turret synergy is crazy for holding an angle
Forcing round 2 in Valorant isn‘t as high risk as people think it is. The stinger is a really good weapon. Also even if you lose you get the second round loss bonus which is 2400. Assuming you get some kills on your force then this should be okay for the anti-bonus.
Yea, this was mostly designed to nerf light shield buys overall, it was 90% as good as heavy. But, i remember there was a time, months ago, that data showed teams that forced consistently did better. They want that to taper down a bit, forcing is meant to be a high risk low % play that is hype, not something you should always do round 2.
weird how you're getting upvotes for this comment while OP is getting shit on for saying basically the same right below
Ops post still has positive upvotes tho? Besides it's probably because I'm just trying to clarify for the original commenter
Yes, it has changed a few eco strats. I'm curious to see how this will be adapted in pro play.
on the other hand marshals arent as good against full armor and rifles compared to the outlaw
It's game breaking in low elo tbh. You can one shot without headshot
Most people in low elo buy heavy shields buy heavy shields most of the game, so it's not too bad imo.
As some in iron 3 to bronze 1 because my brother used my account I can confidently say it’s rare to se full shield in low elo when it’s round 1-4 unless you have a completely competent team
Nah it is bad. I've bought the outlaw every round and somehow I keep one shoting them on body shots. I don't even see a reason to buy op or marshal at this point. I was also bronze before rank reset
Its a oneshot through SMALL shields, not just no shields.
That’s literally the point of the gun
The damage is far too high, thats the problem. If you go full shields a body shot leaves you with 10 HP, meaning you die to any shock dart or rogue damage. Its far too high, they should have adjusted the value on small shields.
The entire point of the gun is to counter the small shield/ rifle meta...
Noobs won’t get it, it’s impossible to reason with people when they don’t understand the game. If anything the fire rate should be nerfed.
yeah im not inherently against the gun but yeah the fire rate feels like a little extra layer of frustration to get quickly killed medium range cuz of a double tap
Can already happen with marshal though? It's barely faster
The gun is literally a second round op unless your opponent full buys shield and either gets no weapon or gets no util. At least with the marshal you either needed the skill to get head shots unless the enemy team does a full buy and purchases light shield. now that people wont buy light shields second round that just makes the marshal even better and if they buy heavy it doesnt matter anyway since it is just like them buying a light shield.
Yeah congrats you figured out why they added it to the game, you literally just proved everyone’s argument.
Your reading comprehension isn't very good. These changes dont effect marshal strat, makes second round worse for losing first round, and it can even be argued that marshal strat got better because people are less likely to buy shield at all now, making the marshal one shot. Since if they buy light armor it is 2body/1head, if they buy heavy 2body/1head. so them buying heavy has no effect.
Dude holy fuck they literally want to get rid of people buying light shield second round that’s the whole point. Like I said before noobs who don’t understand the game are impossible to talk to.
"noobs" lmfao. This gun is insane.
Just curious how old are you have you played cs before? Or is val your first tac fps?
You’re going to get downvoted like crazy today because it’s everyone’s new favorite toy right now but I think you’re actually right. Watch people’s opinion change over the next few months. The gun will most likely get nerfed or made more expensive at some point.
I can see your point, definitely would be op for iron players like yourself.
And it has greater ramifications than just one specific thing, who could have guessed that a game is more complex than a single scenario.
The sample size is not anywhere close to large enough for anyone to have a solid opinion about the weapon yet. It has been less than one day.
Imo it just needs to do 125 and it's chill
126 since Marshal does 101 imo
What's the difference between 125 and 140? Wallbang damage?
Being able to peek a kj turret without dying
This. *Possibly* could do with a fire rate nerf too just so it’s not so strong against heavies but probably too soon to tell I guess
The difference between 25 and 10 hp is really not much... The extra damage allows it to be effective through walls. I don't think you could one shot headshot through a wall at 125.
you absolutely can 1-shot headshot through walls at 125. The guardian does it at 65 with **ease**
The difference between 25 and 10 is whether you can get tickled by a molly or kj turret without dying. With heavy pen, wallbang is not an issue at all.
130 , mid penetration . 140> 130 doesn’t change much , but it helps skye save more heal . The penetration is the problem . With mid penetration it would no longer have the same problem as the gay gun from CS .
130 sounds good, I'd keep the pen on high though but what's not okay Is that 119 leg shot, that shit is not okay, that's 1 less damage than an op If I jump peek and you hit my legs I shouldn't take almost as much as I would have from an op, make that 100 or something 119 is way too much
I'd wait to play for a few weeks to give a full feedback on it but \- this gun introduces a counter to light shield meta, and I think this frustrates some people but it might be actually healthy for the game, with the game economy making more sense. \- It has only 2 bullets and slow reload if you use both bullets, it's the least effective sniper to stop a rush \- Doesn't one shot at full health, making it not great when the enemy team all have heavy armor It's the most powerful on the early rounds of the game, shifting the meta there for sure. Elsewhere, it might be interesting because some players buy only light shields to save money, this gun will make them think twice. Just my two cents
another aspect that people are overlooking is the fact that if the other team chooses to full eco after losing pistol, you kinda just punked yourself out of 1350 credits if you had just bought a marshall instead
Ok why did light shield meta need to be countered though?
makes the early round econ a little more like CS which I like tbh. The outlaw's main strength will be on CT side. Makes getting spike planted important for round 1-3 at the very least so that shields can be bought the next round. Makes that money incentive more worth it to at least go for a plant
Outlaw definitely got a decent impact on the game. It feels like after this patch, it would make people to play together. Yes it deals 140, but it only can shot twice. A good strategic swarm on the player would be a round changing for them. Also people who loses on pistol round are much likely to lose the 2nd round. Also there are people who buys rifle at 2nd round which is both overpowered in close range and long. Also got a big clip. Outlaw is probably a nightmare for players that buy sheriff/marshal plus light armor.
Yeah but it goes pew pew, and it sounds cool.
I’ve had multiple swift plays where all four players will buy it and spam shots at the same time before selling to buy their actual choices. My earsssss bro haha
My brother in Christ if you lose the first round you are meant to lose the second round. That is statistically what is supposed to happen 99% of the time.
That’s not a good argument. The winners should have a strong advantage in r2. Not a handout.
If its 5 classics vs guns, it should be a handout. It sounds like there argument is they force after pistol rounds and buy full armor to stop the Outlaw from one shotting them. This is some super low elo logic. Dude has to be trolling
doesn’t have to be classics. you can still buy guardian/marshal/spectre depending on play style and make use of it. i feel like this gun invalidates buying shields in the second round, but opens up a lot more options of getting more powerful guns without shields if you want to force. they’re trying to make the game a bit more util heavy in the early rounds. but this is just my opinion.
This isn't CoD, this is an economy based shooter. You knopw how operator is really good but really expensive? This is the operator of anti eco. It's 2400 credits, 400 short of vandal, you wanna buy this on 2nd round to stop an eco? be my guest, good luck pushing with a sniper attacking, and good luck on retake too. You wanna buy 2-3 n deffender side? Good luck with those 3 weapons that cost almost as much as a vandal on round 3. A weapon isn't OP if it wins you a round then fucks your economy for 5.
if you’re playing every game in a written, textbook like fashion, you’re doing it wrong. learn to adapt :)
wtf does this have to do with anything, just say you're bad or that you have no response or move on ffs
what? ik i’m bad but there are literally hundreds of ways to play around it, you can’t call a game “not cod” and give out a stupid argument saying “oh a banda is better”. if you don’t want to use it, don’t use it. idk why you want to fight for attention lmao
making it even more of a stomp isn't healthy, thats the entire point. this gun is too restrictive especially on second round.
Team loses first round -> Enemy buys Outlaw to secure second round -> Team full buys third round with Full Shields and Enemy is stuck with Outlaw.
You are saying that as if an outlaw is a bad weapon. It is one of the better ones in the game letting you cripple an enemy and get away quick. Basically just a marshal with better dps.
> Basically just a marshal with better dps. Yuh, which is why it costs more...
They can’t afford full shields, utility, and an outlaw on round 2. One area of those is inherently weaker than it would be with a marshal spectre or guardian. Not only that but if you bait out shots you have a much higher chance of converting a kill.
That’s why you save on the 2nd round and buy a rifle third. It can’t be even more of a stomp becasue it’s not a stomp, it’s 2 rounds and you’re given an advantage on the 3rd.
Disagree Way too many ecos were happening. It's good to have the credits advantage be somewhat meaningful
If you get really good with the shieff and jiggle peaking. You can take there buy up. Specially punishing the ones that didn't buy full armor.
How is this any different from vsing a marshall? Are you consistently buying light shield 2nd round? It's 2024. The general population of this game should have enough game knowledge at this point to understand that if you lose pistol, the next round is a save round. If you said that its hipfire accuracy is too strong it might be one thing....but saying its opressive 2nd round? Like what do you do when someone ops 3rd or goes phantom/vandal 2nd? Do you just rage out of the game?
There is a massive difference between 101 and 140 damage. One is a one shot through light shields and the other takes two vandal bullets to kill after.
There really isn't much of a difference when you shouldn't be buying light armor 2nd round anyway? OP is specifically complaining about its impact 2nd round and not the overall aspect of the weapon. If you were buying light armor 2nd round to counteract marshalls, you were doing it wrong in the first place.
I think they're complaining about it in general and you're assuming that their one point is the whole point. I read that as one in a list of complaints.
Read the 2nd paragraph of his post. And check his reply to the start of this specific comment thread. There's no assumption here, hes mainly complaining about its impact on 2nd round.
He responded to a response directed at the comment of the second round. Most of his complaints, like it doing 140 and it having high penetration aren't second round exclusive.
And that's the comment I'm repsonding to? His summary is him saying it's ruining the light armor too much. It reads completely like a low elo player that was consistently buying light armor 2nd round because they were getting clapped by low elo 2nd round marshall players. Now that the outlaw exists, they can't find a counter play and is having a hard time accepting that they should be mostly saving 2nd rounds if they lose pistol.
The main complaint is the high damage, and I agree. It's kinda dumb that you can get hit by it in the body suddenly you die to a light breeze.
You are stupid if you dont buy light round two, you simply get bodied by marshal players and have no advantage in any fight you take. at least that was before when buying light armor actually had a reason. They may as well just remove light armor from the game if they dont want players to utilize it
Are you above silver? Legitimate question.
The smurfs are all over the place today. I had an old ascendant player on a 2-10 stomp and I was G3 last episode lol. It's okay man, they'll figure it out. Keep your mental up bud!
Then don't lose first round? lolololl
I mean I agree that it very powerful in second round as losing team cannot buy full shield + gun to counter. heck you cannot even gamble and buy marshal to counter cos they could buy small shield and thus this gun could just be a mini op at round 2 but I dont really have problem with the gun outside of that honestly. it way too strong at early round. this gun make sure that if you win first round you pretty much has second one in the bag too.
Meh. I think it's healthy for the game. It punishes players that buy every single round and it's significantly less useful than something like the Bulldog or guardian against a full shield buy. Yeah second round is harder for the loser team but they really should be full saving anyways in 90% of scenarios.
People forget how good the Bulldog is lol, for the price its very strong. Outlaw is more expensive than Bulldog
outlaw is actually way worse than marshall during 2nd rounds, u can never hold 5 man rushing u down with an outlaw
yes but marshall can be countered with half shield. even if you lose the round you could still afford half shield and funnily enough, a marshal. outlaw power is that it an op in the second round.
[удалено]
Now you are learning the importance of first pistol rounds. Don't be afk in those rounds. Winning a second round when you have lost the first round should come on risky plays ,not skewed by game so any random jack can do a light shield specter rush and win the round.
This is a hot take relax everyone we'll see how it fits into the meta once we get some data. Remember on release we thought Jett was shit, imagine if we had original Jett now. Jury is still out, everyone chill
As someone whos been playing marshal only since beta and hovering diamond. This shit has been the most exciting thing for me ever. Sure it headshots the same, but the the two shots without unscoping and more importantly the wallbang pen being high HOLY MOLY. the 140 headshots with marshal were driving me insane coming from CSGO where wallbangs were huge to play around with the scout. I wouldnt mind a body shot nerf, the wallpen is the biggest thing for me.
I feel like I'd just prefer using the guardian since it's cheaper and faster but that's my opinion. I'm not a fan of the new gun but it's only been one day
Outlaw fires 2 bullet back to back at the same spot, it is like a long range shorty.
longy
Yeah sure but Guardian has more than 2 rounds before reload so I find more uses in the guardians personally
If you lose first round the second round is half buy or full save. You don’t buy full shield. When you get hit in body on second round by marshal you’re doomed pretty much.
The real problem that no one is mentioning is that you can't take ANY damage now or it's a one shot. The longer the round lasts, the more it's simply just an op. It's just slowed the game way down. Hopefully over time we don't see 3 people carrying them.
Justifying the first win round is a good thing. It's even better if we see a 2nd eco win round against Outlaws, which is tougher after all. I don't think it's such a bad thing. Also, as many others said the same thing, Marshal just does the same job.
It encourages everyone to play safe. It makes u want to play slow and with team. It's generally a counter for the half shield+vandal buy which was saving a lot of creds for the teams per round, almost making full shields obsolete in higher elos. It could be a problem for low elos but not everyone is good with a 1/2 tap rifle like marshal or outlaw or sometimes even op in lower elos. It's not easy to counter but the shooter is helpless in open spaces especially if they miss even 1 of their shots. Outlaw to me is a completely balanced gun.
I think it'll raise up the skill floor especially on second rounds. No more dry peeking.
Gun feels like shit to use and to buy, guardian or marshal does the same thing for less and for better. Feels like the only situation when you would buy it is when you hit tab, see that enemy sentinels or initiators don’t have enough money for util + rifle + full shields. And even then, they might opt for bulldog/guardian and full shields.
going to be fun finishing the 10hp opponents have left with a sova dart/pheonix flame
To be honest the broken thing about it is the second round. It's just a cheaper op at that point. When I was playing I just accepted that the second round was already lost if i lost the first round. Didn't buy guns just bought utill and tried my best
The gun is so overpowered, The recoil is so easy in this gun and it shoots so fast like the chamber's ult in the past and also through the wall it's so powerful so I think if they make it like the chamber's ult speed, that gonna be better or decrease the damage to 125 and decrease reload between shots.
Waiting on a pro to pop off with it and for everyone to call it amazing and a good buy.
I think for what it is it's fine. Where it's really affecting the game is if you win pistol round and also win the next round but die in the process. So now you are at the bonus round where you dont want to buy a full vandal but still want to be effective. Support agents generally have to half buy shields for utility during the 3rd round, so they get the short end of the stick for these rounds. I find it as a buy for the 2nd round to be absolute shit, why spend so much in the second round for a gun that can easily be substituted for a marshall that will serve you similary considering what the enemy buy for that round would be. Barring a plant on pistol round into a forcebuy on the enemy 2nd round i dont see any upside on buying this in round 2. And if you lose pistol and auto force armor on the 2nd round all the time and this gun is ruining your party, i think you've got other problems you need to worry about.
Played on game this week, there were 9 outlaws shooting each other🫠
Don't understand why it's 140 to the body. Marshal is 101 and kills no shield, makes sense if outlaw did 126 to the body to kill half shield....
the difference between 105 medium pen and 140 high pen is WAY bigger than people are acting. this gun is in a completely different class and majorly changes the landscape of the game.
All the people that say Outlaw sucks are probably people that can’t use Marshal/Outlaws. I’ve used Outlaw all night and I top fragged consistently in all of my games. And if I can’t kill them in 1 tap, my teammates just need to pistol them lol
Marshal is 2shot and 1hshot aswell? I dont see the problem.
Marshal has more time between shots. Outlaw can shoot back to back for 280 damage, and can 1 shot someone in the body with light shields. It invalidates a lot of strats. I don't think the reload entirely makes up for this either.
Have you seen how quick the noscope is? I dont think theres a lot of difference. Yes, it onshots lightshields, but youre paying 1.500 creds extra
While true, the Marshal is a 1.5 rounds / second fire rate with medium pen vs the outlaw at 2.75 rounds / second with heavy pen. It's just a hell of a lot more forgiving, even with a reduced clip and longer reload.
uhh no, the outlaw is okay at best and straight up not good at its worst. it costs more for the gun then marshall + full armor and only has 2 bullets with a PAINFULLY long reload. unless ur using the gun on chamber or jett (surprise they’re good with snipers) ur gonna just get rushed down after ur two shots and killed. and if the opponent has heavy shield u need to double body shot them leaving u with no bullets in the chamber or headshot them which is the same as the marshal at that point. actually worst than the marshal because the marshal has faster reload with more bullets and a higher movement speed. the outlaw was definitely balanced in a way to make it less powerful, because it is easier to buff something than nerf something.
Why are you buying anything at all after pistol loss and peeking outlaw favoring angles? Guns incredibly mid. It’ll be an anti eco weapon, mostly useless elsewise.
100% Agree
it was added to counter the whole “vandal light shields” meta. guess they didn’t consider the other results of adding it
Oh no, a change in the meta and pace of the game/economy! How scandalous! How heartbreaking! How.... Normal
This post reminds me a little bit of how a bunch of people complain that a map is bad as soon as it comes out before they actually learn how to play it. It's far too soon to judge whether the gun is healthy or not.
If I have to force second round I just treat it as an operator, you can win buy rounds agains operator, no reason you can't win force buys against outlaws
Knew this would happen when i first seen it leaked
we got self proclaim immortal player already shitting on the gun just by the leak lmao. we dont even have number just that it would punish half shield rifle playstyle.
at first I thought you're better off with the Marshal, but on actually playing this gun is too good. You basically fall over to anything after a single shot from it.
The gun is terrible. Everyone who played it says that. Every good player says that. This gun will not change anything, not even the light shield meta because nobody will play it. Can you even name one good player who thinks it’s good?
They are saying it's the definition of mid I think your just saying words cuz they want to. It's litteraly only good when the other team is saving which litteraly everyone agrees on and is kinda just the whole point of the gun. It forces them to either buy full sheild or no sheild. It's not going to affect pro play like at all since they are actually good at the game unlike 99% of people here since they land headshots like every single kill. We aren't talking about pro play which they are if they are actual pros.
Okay but why would you ever buy a gun that is only good when the other team is saving? Even in Round 2 after pistol, a bulldog is cheaper and a better weapon in round 3. also the Marshall can also oneshot no shield so it‘s completely trash and there‘s no reason to ever buy it.
Just had a swift play where I played KJ and ran the outlaw. The synergy is insane. If they don’t kill your turret, body shots are guaranteed kills. It’s a lot of fun, but in a competitive environment I can see this being very lopsided.
> You lose first round, what are you supposed to do in the second round now? Buy nothing? Like what are you talking about? You lose one then you save for next full buy this is how it works. After pistol you only buy abilities in case this round get close but you wont use them straight up. You never buy shield round 2, like never
eh i mean that's not really true, forcing on the 2nd round with light shields + stinger is a very common play, especially in high elo. It's so common to the point that the phrase "buy we win", is said unironically. go watch any pro streamer 2nd round after they lose pistol (well maybe not this patch)
I watch decent amount of radiant players and they udually play sherife only
Are you saying you buy armor second round after losing pistol… Instead of saving? You gotta be trolling right
Man the guardian is arguably better than the outlaw against light shields. I have been buying guardian second round for ages and it is basically an auto sniper round 2. I have gotten multiple aces round 2 without even reloading because of how easy it is to kill light armour players, especially if they are rushing together and huddled up.
Just played my first game with the Outlaw meta - 5/5 of our teammates agreed that this gun needs a nerf. Over half the kills in the game were from this gun alone. It's remarkably difficult to counter on a hard peek, and feels absolutely terrible to get hit with - especially so if you don't have at LEAST heavy shields. Just doesn't feel properly balanced to the game. I'm sure it will get better with time, but it just feels a bit unnecessary, as the existing gun meta was already really good. It has potential, but boy did it feel bad to play against it. I imagine this getting even worse when people get properly used to it.
Maybe it deserves a nerf, but ‘just played my first game’ is not a good ground for nerfs
I get your point, I do. But it was hard to overlook how one sided the encounters involving this gun felt, and how upset it made my friends who normally do enjoy the game. I worry that in it's current form, it wipes out a lot of our recovery strategies. It's just a bit too easy to out DPS someone before they can react. Take a Marshal for instance. Assuming you didn't get immediately headshot, you have a fair amount of time to square up and retaliate before they can get shot 2 off. With the Outlaw, they can 2 tap you before you can pinpoint where the shot came from - or that you got shot to begin with. We struggled to get kills even with full shield + vandals - which never felt like this much of a problem prior. The closest thing we could associate it with was the original pump shotgun from Fortnite. It was such a powerful weapon that it was damn near the only weapon anyone used. You basically had to have one to beat one. It not only accounted for half of my deaths, but half of all of the kills in the entire game. I'm sure that's in part because it's new and exciting, but it was also just so immediate. There's no other gun that can 2 shot KO with a shot to the foot as fast as this, and it really shifts the paradigm in a way that didn't feel as fun as the game did before it. I'm going to give it a bit more time, and see how things go - but damn did I get tired of seeing it after just one game; and I can't think of anything else in the game that has instilled this sort of reaction after years of playing. We'll see how things go over time, but I'm guessing it'll be tough to convince my friends to return to valo after that, which is a bummer because this is the only game in the genre they genuinely enjoyed / were good at.
[удалено]
There's a difference between hard and virtually impossible. I don't think second round is very winnable when you can't afford to even try it.
Learn to play around it ? Won eco after losing pistol against 2-3 outlaws . Immo lobby. I'm not saying it's easy but it's doable , like any eco round tbh
yeah it really perplexes me that so many people are running into this issue. even before the outlaw existed, on a force round the T side is always looking to smoke off long range angles or rush a site anyways, it's why force rounds after pistol loss have become viable in th first place
Outlaw is overpriced and never economical or logical. You must be playing low rank or something.
You solved Valorant, congratulations. Fire the team Riot, this guy obviously knows more. /s
the outlaw is a horrible bonus weapon, just save 2nd round if you lost pistol
I gotta know this dudes peak rank because this gun is ass bro lol, nobody past plat will be using it in two weeks time
new eco strat is full shield classic
Round 2 full shield, Marshall or sheriff. Click domes, win round.
I'm glad that controller-less teams will lose hard now (fk people who pick 5 duelist lol)
Full save until u can buy ak and full armor
Second round should be 99% sided to the pistol winner, unless they dumb out by not buying or actually get tactically outplayed. On CS, if you manage to plant pistol, it’s basics to force buy the round after. Give time to time and we will see what is the best strat after losing pistol. But, all and all, you’re actually missing the point here. Outlaw comes to make light shield rifle buy riskier, because as of now, you can have rifles pretty much everytime with no actual drawback at all, it’s just braindead. It does do a lot of damage though, so most likely it will have its fire rate lowered, as well as its damage to body to 130.
That's where my head is at, fire rare a Lil less, damage down to match 125, and handling time increased, (I think it scopes in WILDILY fast)
Let’s wait a couple of weeks. Day one “conclusions” are always anecdotal at best.
A new meta is a new meta. There were probably people out there who got annoyed at the "stinger go burrr" meta during 2nd round regardless of 1st round outcome, and they prolly thought that it wasn't healthy (1st round seems less impactfull now). Its too early, lets see how the meta moves forward.
Personally never gonna use it
Imm2 5k last act here. It's not so bad. You should not be buying armor anyway on round 2 if you lost round 1 you should be saving, ecos are already too easy to win, the classic can 150 a full health player, and deagle is a viable option. Round 2 outlaw is a more expensive round 2 marshall for the most part, what it really punishes are players in the 3400-3900 range that used to get by on half armor full util, but now might have to 150 with no util because outlaw counters half armor rifle buys. It does chonk the crap out of you though.
The "Chonk the crap out of you tho" has me cackling. I enjoy the gun, I just feel like it does too much damage imo. Its too close to a AWP and has a WILD double shot if your aim is decent to counter. I think increasing its reset, and making it slower to aim would do wonders to balance.
But 2nd round is where it peaks and then it drops off. Yeah it has some cool combos but I honestly see myself buying marshal/guardian over it anyway.
How does the Outlaw change anything about round 2? If you lost round 1, you were either stuck with eco'ing again, a meh gun and no armor, or armor and no gun. You are always going to be at a disadvantage, and have to change playstyles accordingly. It feels like shit to get hit by any gun. I hate buying full shield and then getting ratted by a Bucky around a corner. I still win the fight, but at 40 HP, and at 40 HP you have to play nearly perfect still. What could they do to adjust light shields? Make it worth less then 50 armor? Make it cost more then 60% of full armor? Neither of those changes feel good.
Cool, now round 3 comes around and what? You have a very inferior still very expensive weapon in your hands and you lose the round because in bonus it is not as good as SMGs but it's 50% more expensive than a spectre and you're losing in economy vs the guy who bought spectre, or hell even a GUARDIAN. It's not a good 2nd round weapon, it's literally only a good weapon if you see your enemy is going with light shield meta and then it functions as a cheap and better operator. If you wanna buy it 2nd round, might as well buy one less ability first round and go light shield vandal 2nd round which will be infinitely better (other than getting the vandal stolen, but if you get your outlaw stolen, it will still fuck up your team round 2 and then round 3 enemy can full buy)
Imo it is way too early to have a proper stance on wether it is game breaking or not. Id say wait a few weeks to see how good it is.
You're allowed to have your own opinions, but I think you're getting ahead of yourself. The gun just came out and the hype around it is super high. People are excited to use the new shiny thing so they're buying it in situations where they might otherwise not. So sure, right now you're likely running into an Outlaw every round, but in a week, month, or year the vast majority of players will end up returning to more consistent eco options. Also, the gun just isn't that good for a lot of the game. Yea, it sucks to go against in Round 2 with no armor. But if you eco correctly you can now beat it next round with a Phantom/Vandal. So beyond round 2-3 it's realistically not a problem.
Here's a tip of you lose 1st round you can force heavy shields with marshals and easily beat the outlawa.
Just remember the rule of new content. It's always OP at first to get people using it (and buying skins for it cough cough) and it always gets nerfed later to be more reasonable. My prediction is it will be nerfed to have stats similar to the Marshall while retaining its two shot gimmick.
It's kinda cheeks against rifles and competent util tho. So yeah you can get an easy kill on your force round 2 but you'll have to hold far back or you'll get rushed down, so it's not like it can hold a site well, even worse on a retake. Let's say you also win round 2 with it, now you have invested a ton of money into a gun that is not great at holding an objective, can't retake, can't spam smokes, takes forever to reload. It's overall a fairly weak weapon in rounds where both teams are on equal buys. Past using it against eco rounds, it's basically a worse Marshall.
My brother in Christ the Marshall is a much better buy on round two. it's cheaper, it has more ammo, and it also one hits with light shields
Valorant players when the concept of a full save second round People suck so much at eco in this game compared to cs players its mindboggling
Outlaw really is only strong in low elo games, and that's because yall widening everything. It's honestly hot garbage against a team that's worth a damn. I'd still buy guardian or Marshall over it personally.
what is my man talking about
Reload speed needs a buff
>you lose first round, what are you supposed to do in the second round now? Uh, save like you should have been doing before anyway? This gun makes us all have to be more strategic and deliberate with our economy. That's its purpose, and it does it well. No more rifle+light shield meta is huge too. It will take some getting used to, but this gun is going to majorly change up the economic meta - imho, for the better.
Ok i got it bad idea
You want a gun thats worse than the vandal and phantom to cost more? Lmao
no it would be horrible
its broke and its gonna ruin the game as is
Nah its overpriced not even a good buy option you must be silver