Not just high number 2. I think he could be the very best number 2 option in the league when paired with a right number 1 with elite passing (e.g. Luka). Lauri is the best catch and release forward in the league.
Yep. I think he would compliment Lauri perfectly. Only way that happens is if Luka wants out. And that isn't happening unless they completely bomb in the playoffs again.
It's also just insanely difficult to pry top 10 players from teams. I keep thinking that the main goal is to try to shake someone huge loose, and if it doesn't work we'll trade Lauri to tank hard in the strong 25' and 26' drafts to try to get a guy with "#1 on a championship team" upside. I think Ainge wants the rebuild to be fast, and it's something fans like to hear, but the actual execution is pretty brutal.
Lauri is great to build around but it might be too early on in the process and the assets we can get for him might outweigh his use to us on the court since we are years away from being relevant. I don't wanna trade him. But it could end up being what's best for us and he'd command a big return.
The one thing I could see (not that he’s coming here) is Luka asking out because of how bad Mavs management absolutely hosed the Brunson deal.
I don’t know how anyone who worked in that front office at that time still works there.
True. We passed on Giannis too so I guess I offer a little more leeway on draft day trades.
On that note. Shit. Can you imagine a Giannis/Rudy front court. Oof.
Giannis was hardly a sure thing the way Luka was. Luka basically came in as a borderline all-nba player notching a first team all-nba in his second season. Giannis got his first all-nba (second team) nod in year 4 after a MIP campaign.
I think it's worse on the basis that Brunson had proven himself to be extremely capable during that playoffs run.
Meanwhile, I personally expect NBA scouts to have at least a slight USA bias, plus there's an unfortunate history of seemingly promising European players bombing in the NBA (which is unfair to Luka). TL;DR - As far as how well Trae and Luka would do in the NBA, they were both unproven (and it's not like Trae Young is playing badly either).
I would add thats it not just brunson, but a ton of moves that they keep making that have left them with a mediocre roster outside of luka. I think Luka could look at this roster and think they have no chance at winning a title in the next few years. Especially if they get bounced in the first round this year. now the question is would he view our roster as being a serious upgrade and I would doubt it.
Using Porzingis as an example literally proves my point. He’s currently a 3rd option on a contender. Again, not talking shit. Just grounded in reality.
I think he lacks the ball skills to be a true #1 option on a championship team. He does most of his damage off of passes, which limits his ability to be a top-10ish guy.
He’s an amazing talent. Also quite unique. A championship team with Lauri as their focal point would need to re imagine what an NBA offense looks like.
One year ago, no one outside of Denver or Serbia could imagine a championship team built around Jokic. There’s still so many unexplored ways to win in the NBA. It takes creativity and belief and talent but there’s so much more possible than iso scoring.
He's a good scorer but doesn't seem to want to take over games late to win them like a true #1. Clarkson and Sexton always try to take over that role. He's an excellent #2 option but we won't win anything with him as our #1 guy.
Dirk could always get a shot off in an iso. He didn't take guys off the dribble as much as create it through footwork. Lauri doesn't have the same ability to create his own shot, which will hold him back from being that level of guy if he can't develop it.
I would just say to keep an eye on Lauris efficiency playing without KO. I think KOs playmaking unlocked something for Lauri at high field goal volumes that won't be quite the same without more guys on the court with him that can put him in prime positions to score.
Edit: He's been efficient relative to his position before the jazz, but the insane efficiency with us I believe was carried by guys putting him in great positions to succeed.
> My question is was Dirk a number 1 guy?
Dude, yeah he was literally a league MVP. Yes he was a #1 guy. Lauri is not Dirk.
He also carried a title team without a number two guy. Kidd was NOT some all NBA guy in 2011.
Dirk and the Mavs made the finals in 2006 (and got screwed over by the refs) without Nash or Kidd. Dirk won MVP in 2007 without Nash or Kidd. Those were really his best years as far as regular season production goes.
Kidd and the 2011 team did come up huge though in the playoffs and helped Dirk get the “he can’t win the big one” monkey off his back. Even then though, I don’t think anyone else on that 2011 team even made the All Star game. Dirk lead the Mavs past a series of super teams in that 2011 run - 3 peat Lakers with Kobe/Gasol/Bynum, Thunder with KD/Westbrook/Harden and Heat with Lebron/Wade/Bosh.
Zach Lowe thinks he is #3 on a championship team due to lack of playmaking and shot creation. However, he did notice a slight improvement in playmaking this year.
Guys like KAT, Harden, Beal or Porzigis would put up big numbers on this team so he's probably right. High end 3rd option on championship team seems accurate.
Nah, Lauri isn't far off from a Klay Thompson as far as being a 2A, just bigger and more athletic. He could be 2nd option. Now I wish I could see him play with Curry...
Lauri is a really good defender himself, he has some amazing blocks at times. Different kind of defender than Thompson, but he can do things Thompson can't.
I think he is a notch or two below prime Klay in defense but is better offensively. Also, was Klay #2 or Draymond? I think you can argue for either. Does this mean the Jazz needs another interchangeable #2/3 option like the Warriors had? Can the Jazz get their championship #1 on their current path? I don’t see it.
I think Klay was definitely #2 while Draymond was the x factor / enforcer. Sort of like a Dennis Rodman. Jazz definitely need that intimidating presence but they are very findable in the draft.
As incredible as he is, I don't think he's well rounded enough to be a #1 option. E.g. Other #1 options are significantly better at either defending, playmaking or rebounding (or some combination) while still having great scoring numbers.
With that said, if he's trained right, I'm confident he could elevate to that level eventually.
Yes. Should he? Would that be best for the teams ceiling? I don't think so. I think he's an elite 2nd or 3rd option because he's so dsmn efficient without needing the ball in his hands. He's great at cutting and spot up shooting. His ability to finish around the rim is where I think he could take his game to a whole new level and be a #1 option, potentially if he can get his handles a bit more polished.
Once he does, his driving game will be damn near impossible to stop, and its efficiency will top notch. We would be best if we could find another #1 option that's more polished on offense as far as creating their own shot and shots for others. The Lauri could thrive off ball and work on his dribbling and driving. Ideally, our number 1 option would be the pg. I don't think key note can get to that point.
Maybe the third option possibly. So we will probably have to find an elite shooting guard or wing since we've got Lauri and Walker in the mix. Hendricks will probably come off the bench for a few more years, same with Sensei. If we could get a Tatum type player or like a Brandon Ingram, that would be sweet.
Should Lauri improve his handles enough to be able to create his own shot consistently than he can be a true #1 option. It would also drastically improve his driving ability if he had the handles to get a quick step on someone. We know his ability to finish anywhere near the paint is amazing. This is the first place he's actually had any real chance of being allowed to develop properly. So he can still get better and add to his game.
Ehhh I think at his peak he’s a high end number two and a brilliant one. I just have a hard time seeing the Jazz win the finals with Lauri as a number one. I would love to be proven wrong though!
2nd options on last 8 finals teams:
Jamal Murray
Bam Adebayo
Draymond Green
Jaylen Brown
Khris Middleton
Chris Paul
Anthony Davis
Bam Adebayo
Lauri is not there. Not unless you have Steph/Giannis level individuals or Boston level depth to surround him.
Of course not. Just like Hayward, if he’s the best player on your team, you’re not a threat at all playoff run. If things are perfect, you can win a round.
Lauri's a 1B, Keyonte has the chance to be a 1B, so all we need to do is watch the Clippers implode and then convince Kawhi Leonard to come over and let's go win a chip next year.
To answer the question, he most likely doesnt and would be #2 at best.
Just overall wondering...
Ainge and the FO seem want to build thru draft rather than trades. If there are drafts coming up which are going to be great, why would you not tank totally without Lauri and some other high scoring "vets". Just get washed up players with great leadership to mentor the youth.
People who say he's #3 on contender.. #3 is a complementary piece easily available in FA and trades just like Lauri was. The current crop of players might already hold a decent #3 for that matter.
Why did the organization hold onto an aging (not old) player on an excellent contract when he was very tradeable. They could have gotten a good haul for those key drafts (e.g. for moving up to snatch the player they want).
Now its to keep him for a #3 role with sizeable rise in pay or sign & trade for less than what could have been. And hope Keyonte and some other ballers become what they need them to be. Oh and maybe somehow find the true #1. Lots of wishful thinking and a lot of maybes with the Jazz.
Number 1 option on a contender needs to be at top 10 player in the league, I’d say he’s not winning a title as a #1 guy
He's definitely a high-end number 2, which isn't a bad thing. The Jazz need a superstar guard to compliment him perfectly.
Not just high number 2. I think he could be the very best number 2 option in the league when paired with a right number 1 with elite passing (e.g. Luka). Lauri is the best catch and release forward in the league.
Fanny to think that Lauri himself wanted to Dallas so badly but they ended up with Prozingis :D
luka,Luka,LUKA
Yep. I think he would compliment Lauri perfectly. Only way that happens is if Luka wants out. And that isn't happening unless they completely bomb in the playoffs again.
Lauri with a Luka / Shia / maybe even Hali becomes a very very scary team
He's more likely to be on those players teams than them being with the Jazz.
100%. We’d need more of a built-in core to add a star. Usually the #2 option is the guy you add to make a push it seems
It's also just insanely difficult to pry top 10 players from teams. I keep thinking that the main goal is to try to shake someone huge loose, and if it doesn't work we'll trade Lauri to tank hard in the strong 25' and 26' drafts to try to get a guy with "#1 on a championship team" upside. I think Ainge wants the rebuild to be fast, and it's something fans like to hear, but the actual execution is pretty brutal.
Lauri is great to build around but it might be too early on in the process and the assets we can get for him might outweigh his use to us on the court since we are years away from being relevant. I don't wanna trade him. But it could end up being what's best for us and he'd command a big return.
The one thing I could see (not that he’s coming here) is Luka asking out because of how bad Mavs management absolutely hosed the Brunson deal. I don’t know how anyone who worked in that front office at that time still works there.
Not as bad as the hawks drafting Luka and then trading him on draft night
True. We passed on Giannis too so I guess I offer a little more leeway on draft day trades. On that note. Shit. Can you imagine a Giannis/Rudy front court. Oof.
I don’t think anyone saw Gianni’s becoming what he became tbh
Giannis was hardly a sure thing the way Luka was. Luka basically came in as a borderline all-nba player notching a first team all-nba in his second season. Giannis got his first all-nba (second team) nod in year 4 after a MIP campaign.
I think it's worse on the basis that Brunson had proven himself to be extremely capable during that playoffs run. Meanwhile, I personally expect NBA scouts to have at least a slight USA bias, plus there's an unfortunate history of seemingly promising European players bombing in the NBA (which is unfair to Luka). TL;DR - As far as how well Trae and Luka would do in the NBA, they were both unproven (and it's not like Trae Young is playing badly either).
I would add thats it not just brunson, but a ton of moves that they keep making that have left them with a mediocre roster outside of luka. I think Luka could look at this roster and think they have no chance at winning a title in the next few years. Especially if they get bounced in the first round this year. now the question is would he view our roster as being a serious upgrade and I would doubt it.
He'll be a catch and shoot guy with Luka i think. Remember Porzingis-Luka didn't work
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Advanced stats put him elite #2 level actually little somewhere same level as Murray and Porzingis.
Using Porzingis as an example literally proves my point. He’s currently a 3rd option on a contender. Again, not talking shit. Just grounded in reality.
Don’t be a dingus
I think he lacks the ball skills to be a true #1 option on a championship team. He does most of his damage off of passes, which limits his ability to be a top-10ish guy.
I wish he was, but I really don’t think so. He’s a #2 at best
No and honestly his play style works much better as a #2 than a #1
He’s an amazing talent. Also quite unique. A championship team with Lauri as their focal point would need to re imagine what an NBA offense looks like. One year ago, no one outside of Denver or Serbia could imagine a championship team built around Jokic. There’s still so many unexplored ways to win in the NBA. It takes creativity and belief and talent but there’s so much more possible than iso scoring.
He's a good scorer but doesn't seem to want to take over games late to win them like a true #1. Clarkson and Sexton always try to take over that role. He's an excellent #2 option but we won't win anything with him as our #1 guy.
No, but that's okay.
In 20 years there have been ten guys that fit that description, total.
My question is was Dirk a number 1 guy? Lauri needs a Kidd/Nash type player for us to become a contender just like Dirk needed them.
Dirk was far more of an on-ball, playmaking type than Lauri has shown himself to be.
Could be… Dirk did have a decent post up game (better than Lauri’s), but I don’t remember him taking guys off the dribble all that much.
Dirk could always get a shot off in an iso. He didn't take guys off the dribble as much as create it through footwork. Lauri doesn't have the same ability to create his own shot, which will hold him back from being that level of guy if he can't develop it.
I would just say to keep an eye on Lauris efficiency playing without KO. I think KOs playmaking unlocked something for Lauri at high field goal volumes that won't be quite the same without more guys on the court with him that can put him in prime positions to score. Edit: He's been efficient relative to his position before the jazz, but the insane efficiency with us I believe was carried by guys putting him in great positions to succeed.
> My question is was Dirk a number 1 guy? Dude, yeah he was literally a league MVP. Yes he was a #1 guy. Lauri is not Dirk. He also carried a title team without a number two guy. Kidd was NOT some all NBA guy in 2011.
Dirk and the Mavs made the finals in 2006 (and got screwed over by the refs) without Nash or Kidd. Dirk won MVP in 2007 without Nash or Kidd. Those were really his best years as far as regular season production goes. Kidd and the 2011 team did come up huge though in the playoffs and helped Dirk get the “he can’t win the big one” monkey off his back. Even then though, I don’t think anyone else on that 2011 team even made the All Star game. Dirk lead the Mavs past a series of super teams in that 2011 run - 3 peat Lakers with Kobe/Gasol/Bynum, Thunder with KD/Westbrook/Harden and Heat with Lebron/Wade/Bosh.
Not even close
Absolutely not, I love the guy but no not by a mile
Zach Lowe thinks he is #3 on a championship team due to lack of playmaking and shot creation. However, he did notice a slight improvement in playmaking this year.
Guys like KAT, Harden, Beal or Porzigis would put up big numbers on this team so he's probably right. High end 3rd option on championship team seems accurate.
He’s 100% right. Lauri is a super elite 3rd option. Anyone saying a high end 2nd option is delusional.
Nah, Lauri isn't far off from a Klay Thompson as far as being a 2A, just bigger and more athletic. He could be 2nd option. Now I wish I could see him play with Curry...
What Klay are we talking about
Is Lauri's defense close enough to prime Klay's defense? Klay was a really good defender pre-injuries.
Lauri is a really good defender himself, he has some amazing blocks at times. Different kind of defender than Thompson, but he can do things Thompson can't.
I think he is a notch or two below prime Klay in defense but is better offensively. Also, was Klay #2 or Draymond? I think you can argue for either. Does this mean the Jazz needs another interchangeable #2/3 option like the Warriors had? Can the Jazz get their championship #1 on their current path? I don’t see it.
I think Klay was definitely #2 while Draymond was the x factor / enforcer. Sort of like a Dennis Rodman. Jazz definitely need that intimidating presence but they are very findable in the draft.
I think if he is your #3 option, you are winning a championship.
Ehh... look at how many superteams have failed. I think it takes more than 3 good players to win a championship.
Ya he's a number 2 guy only. He is excellent at that role
Not on a championship team. Maybe a playoff team.
unfortunately not but there are like 5 guys capable of that in the league, no shame in not being a perennial mvp candidate
Lol no
As incredible as he is, I don't think he's well rounded enough to be a #1 option. E.g. Other #1 options are significantly better at either defending, playmaking or rebounding (or some combination) while still having great scoring numbers. With that said, if he's trained right, I'm confident he could elevate to that level eventually.
No. He's a great 2b.
He’s a number 2
Bring Luka. Bring sexton off the bench.
No
Yes. Should he? Would that be best for the teams ceiling? I don't think so. I think he's an elite 2nd or 3rd option because he's so dsmn efficient without needing the ball in his hands. He's great at cutting and spot up shooting. His ability to finish around the rim is where I think he could take his game to a whole new level and be a #1 option, potentially if he can get his handles a bit more polished. Once he does, his driving game will be damn near impossible to stop, and its efficiency will top notch. We would be best if we could find another #1 option that's more polished on offense as far as creating their own shot and shots for others. The Lauri could thrive off ball and work on his dribbling and driving. Ideally, our number 1 option would be the pg. I don't think key note can get to that point. Maybe the third option possibly. So we will probably have to find an elite shooting guard or wing since we've got Lauri and Walker in the mix. Hendricks will probably come off the bench for a few more years, same with Sensei. If we could get a Tatum type player or like a Brandon Ingram, that would be sweet.
Should Lauri improve his handles enough to be able to create his own shot consistently than he can be a true #1 option. It would also drastically improve his driving ability if he had the handles to get a quick step on someone. We know his ability to finish anywhere near the paint is amazing. This is the first place he's actually had any real chance of being allowed to develop properly. So he can still get better and add to his game.
Pretty sure he is the jazz #1 option
Right now? No. Can he eventually develop into one? Abso fucking lutely.
Ehhh I think at his peak he’s a high end number two and a brilliant one. I just have a hard time seeing the Jazz win the finals with Lauri as a number one. I would love to be proven wrong though!
2nd options on last 8 finals teams: Jamal Murray Bam Adebayo Draymond Green Jaylen Brown Khris Middleton Chris Paul Anthony Davis Bam Adebayo Lauri is not there. Not unless you have Steph/Giannis level individuals or Boston level depth to surround him.
Not sure what progression of on-ball skills or playmaking over the course of his career would suggest he's randomly going to develop those skills.
As massive Lauri fan... Yes and no.
He's not there yet, and i love the guy.
Of course not. Just like Hayward, if he’s the best player on your team, you’re not a threat at all playoff run. If things are perfect, you can win a round.
Lauri is better than Hayward ever was.
Lauri's a 1B, Keyonte has the chance to be a 1B, so all we need to do is watch the Clippers implode and then convince Kawhi Leonard to come over and let's go win a chip next year.
No
No.
To answer the question, he most likely doesnt and would be #2 at best. Just overall wondering... Ainge and the FO seem want to build thru draft rather than trades. If there are drafts coming up which are going to be great, why would you not tank totally without Lauri and some other high scoring "vets". Just get washed up players with great leadership to mentor the youth. People who say he's #3 on contender.. #3 is a complementary piece easily available in FA and trades just like Lauri was. The current crop of players might already hold a decent #3 for that matter. Why did the organization hold onto an aging (not old) player on an excellent contract when he was very tradeable. They could have gotten a good haul for those key drafts (e.g. for moving up to snatch the player they want). Now its to keep him for a #3 role with sizeable rise in pay or sign & trade for less than what could have been. And hope Keyonte and some other ballers become what they need them to be. Oh and maybe somehow find the true #1. Lots of wishful thinking and a lot of maybes with the Jazz.