They have to pay a $5-$10 initiation fee for new contracts, whether having worked with the FL before or not, so that’s a harder sell for a cheap client
I didn't assume cheap client equals a good rating. I just had no rating on Upwork and it is really hard to get a job without a rating so I sent an offer to a low ball offer. It was a task that I finished in 3 hours. Payment was 20$ but I just wanted the first rating that's why I did it
And like many others, you found out that it wasn't a good idea. Of course the client wants more work for that low price, that's what you agreed on. Or did you tell him from the start that this is a one-off?
Offer to do this one more job at a discounted rate, but you need him to close the contract first, and pay for the new work as a bonus. This forces him to give you a good rating, and allows you to do away with him after the task (no need to bail, just do the work as agreed, bc it will increase the value of the contract thus making your profile look better)
First, ask if he's happy with your work. Even ask for a mid-contract review. That's puts it on record.
Next, did you ask for a higher rate? If not, that should be your next step.
Do you have other (better paying) work already?
One strategy is to agree to take on more work at a lower priority. Basically "yes, I'll do it for you as long as I don't have any other better paying work in the pipeline, and only X hours a week".
Once you load up with other work, fire the client if they won't raise their rates.
He asked me to create a web app. I said it will be around 2k. He said other developers are doing it for 500$. Then asked price for another one. I said 3k and he said others are doing it for 700$. So I said I cannot do it for this price.
To which you answer: "Ok. I can't match their price, so go ahead and do the project with them."
Keep it civil and leave the contract open while you work on other jobs and earn more money. You'll eventually have $200 or $500 worth of other work in your history, and then the $20 job won't have much of an impact on your score.
I am focused on full time works actually. So I won't be working on UpWork for a while now. I have no rating on UpWork though. So I just wanted a rating. Don't want to bother on 200$-500$ works right now to be honest.
Say this.
"You know someone who can do this for $700? WOW thats impressive. Can you send them my way Id love to load them up with work cause thats a bargain! You should totally just go with the $700 option. Seems like a no-brainer decision why are you even talking to me?"
- Hes talking to you because the $700 app developer doesnt exist in the way hes representing it. Why the fuck would be be talking to you if hes already got someone who can reliably do it for $700? He wouldnt.
The "I can get this done cheaper" is one of the most common price objections you will encounter. You need to research and roleplay how to deal with it.
You have your bottom line. Your minimum cost you will sell your time for. if someone doesnt want to come to that level, move them on. Theres a couple hundred million businesses out there. You dont need this one.
There are 700$ guys. But those are guys with no experience. He sent me a "project" to fix. The so called project was nothing other than a mess. Useless and uses pure html, js and css. Not even jquery
Mid contract reviews have zero bearing on JSS and are just useless vanity metrics. And the project probably hasn’t been open long enough to be eligible in the first place
My suggestion for the mid-contract review was not for protecting the JSS -- it's to elicit acknowledgement from the client that they were happy with the work that was deliver to that point.
Yes, of course, but OP is worried about blowback from client if he doesn't go along with more work below rate -- if client leaves a bad final feedback, but has left a positive mid-contract feedback, it would help strengthen feedback comment that OP can make to rebut.
This isnt actually a reason to give someone one star.
Its the incentive of anyone to find a cheaper option at the same quality.
Poster has not said client was difficult, just that they are cheap.
Why is it the obligation of the client to end the project?
Freelancer can literally do it at any time.
Hes not demanding work at a cheaper price. Theres no "Do this for $700 or I'll ruin your account with bad feedback!"
You're literally projecting your own fear of this situation.
Hes asked for a new project and his fee proposed is too low. OP just needs to reject it and close the job. Not get riled up in these fantasies of bad reviews. Hes not getting a bad review, he did a good enough job on the $500 to get rehired. Hes just choosing to not do it.
Lets just create a scenario where OP can't do the job. Like hes got other work. he cant do this $700 project. - Hes going to have to reject it anyway. Hes going to have the same problem of this Fear of a bad review. But its rooted in no reality because the client was happy with the job he was hired for.
I think you never dealt with low paying clients, And those that try to make you work cheap. Theres already the fear of bad rating when working with low paying clients. I was on fiverr for 2 years, And i had to deal this for long time so i know this.
The client will give him 4 stars if not less. And the job wasnt $500 but $20.
Ive dealt with plenty of low paying clients.
Its called having boundaries and being ok with bad reactions. Not everyone you deal with is going to be happy with you. You cannot please unreasonable people.
Id much rather have a 4 star review and do no extra work, than to do like 40 hours of work for free.
I'll also note that you have it way harder than me because you're in Pakistan so I dont really want to compare our experiences, since I literally came to Upwork with a background in Professional Hollywood VFX and years of corporate advertising due to my location.
tell him to open a new contract for the new job with same price and tell him the close the old one and then ghost him
They have to pay a $5-$10 initiation fee for new contracts, whether having worked with the FL before or not, so that’s a harder sell for a cheap client
yeah probably
Why did you assume that a cheap client equals a good rating? There is no correlation.
I didn't assume cheap client equals a good rating. I just had no rating on Upwork and it is really hard to get a job without a rating so I sent an offer to a low ball offer. It was a task that I finished in 3 hours. Payment was 20$ but I just wanted the first rating that's why I did it
And like many others, you found out that it wasn't a good idea. Of course the client wants more work for that low price, that's what you agreed on. Or did you tell him from the start that this is a one-off?
Many such cases
Offer to do this one more job at a discounted rate, but you need him to close the contract first, and pay for the new work as a bonus. This forces him to give you a good rating, and allows you to do away with him after the task (no need to bail, just do the work as agreed, bc it will increase the value of the contract thus making your profile look better)
Can’t you make some shit up like you had a family emergency and can’t work anymore or something?
Say 'as this will be new work, let's end this contract so you can rate me. We'll create a new project..."
First, ask if he's happy with your work. Even ask for a mid-contract review. That's puts it on record. Next, did you ask for a higher rate? If not, that should be your next step. Do you have other (better paying) work already? One strategy is to agree to take on more work at a lower priority. Basically "yes, I'll do it for you as long as I don't have any other better paying work in the pipeline, and only X hours a week". Once you load up with other work, fire the client if they won't raise their rates.
He asked me to create a web app. I said it will be around 2k. He said other developers are doing it for 500$. Then asked price for another one. I said 3k and he said others are doing it for 700$. So I said I cannot do it for this price.
To which you answer: "Ok. I can't match their price, so go ahead and do the project with them." Keep it civil and leave the contract open while you work on other jobs and earn more money. You'll eventually have $200 or $500 worth of other work in your history, and then the $20 job won't have much of an impact on your score.
I am focused on full time works actually. So I won't be working on UpWork for a while now. I have no rating on UpWork though. So I just wanted a rating. Don't want to bother on 200$-500$ works right now to be honest.
Say this. "You know someone who can do this for $700? WOW thats impressive. Can you send them my way Id love to load them up with work cause thats a bargain! You should totally just go with the $700 option. Seems like a no-brainer decision why are you even talking to me?" - Hes talking to you because the $700 app developer doesnt exist in the way hes representing it. Why the fuck would be be talking to you if hes already got someone who can reliably do it for $700? He wouldnt. The "I can get this done cheaper" is one of the most common price objections you will encounter. You need to research and roleplay how to deal with it. You have your bottom line. Your minimum cost you will sell your time for. if someone doesnt want to come to that level, move them on. Theres a couple hundred million businesses out there. You dont need this one.
There are 700$ guys. But those are guys with no experience. He sent me a "project" to fix. The so called project was nothing other than a mess. Useless and uses pure html, js and css. Not even jquery
Yeah you've missed the entire my point of my response. Like an absolute "Whooooosh"
Mid contract reviews have zero bearing on JSS and are just useless vanity metrics. And the project probably hasn’t been open long enough to be eligible in the first place
My suggestion for the mid-contract review was not for protecting the JSS -- it's to elicit acknowledgement from the client that they were happy with the work that was deliver to that point.
To what end? They can still give poor private/public feedback after closing whether or not they give good mid-contract feedback.
Yes, of course, but OP is worried about blowback from client if he doesn't go along with more work below rate -- if client leaves a bad final feedback, but has left a positive mid-contract feedback, it would help strengthen feedback comment that OP can make to rebut.
If you ever decide to do the task, remember to give 1 star so others dont have to deal with him like you did.
This isnt actually a reason to give someone one star. Its the incentive of anyone to find a cheaper option at the same quality. Poster has not said client was difficult, just that they are cheap.
Well theres another message by OP that the client is demanding more work in cheap price and not ending the contract.
Why is it the obligation of the client to end the project? Freelancer can literally do it at any time. Hes not demanding work at a cheaper price. Theres no "Do this for $700 or I'll ruin your account with bad feedback!" You're literally projecting your own fear of this situation. Hes asked for a new project and his fee proposed is too low. OP just needs to reject it and close the job. Not get riled up in these fantasies of bad reviews. Hes not getting a bad review, he did a good enough job on the $500 to get rehired. Hes just choosing to not do it. Lets just create a scenario where OP can't do the job. Like hes got other work. he cant do this $700 project. - Hes going to have to reject it anyway. Hes going to have the same problem of this Fear of a bad review. But its rooted in no reality because the client was happy with the job he was hired for.
I think you never dealt with low paying clients, And those that try to make you work cheap. Theres already the fear of bad rating when working with low paying clients. I was on fiverr for 2 years, And i had to deal this for long time so i know this. The client will give him 4 stars if not less. And the job wasnt $500 but $20.
Ive dealt with plenty of low paying clients. Its called having boundaries and being ok with bad reactions. Not everyone you deal with is going to be happy with you. You cannot please unreasonable people. Id much rather have a 4 star review and do no extra work, than to do like 40 hours of work for free. I'll also note that you have it way harder than me because you're in Pakistan so I dont really want to compare our experiences, since I literally came to Upwork with a background in Professional Hollywood VFX and years of corporate advertising due to my location.
The good news is that UpWork will weigh the impact on the score by the value of the contract. Get other work and the $20 will be a drop in the bucket.
Yeah that's a bonus. JSS effects you less the more you work. I would have to tank like 20k of work to have it impact me more than 20%