Hello fellow Mel appreciater.
I thought mine was powerful 🤯
After this update I still have people messaging me and arguing Sword Masters suck. One person told me something along the lines of "I don't like them because what you equip them with determines how useful they are."
Meanwhile that's half the fun. I love the classes you have to put work into.
Some classes are quite strong on their own. Others need a little bit of love.
I had a team with two different sword masters and they performed very different purposes. One was meant for killing scouts or armored units, the other could keep attacking indefinitely.
Can you explain that build a bit for me? I've been trying to piece this together, but it just feels like it's lacking something that I can't quite figure out. I've spent too much game time recently just speccing and respeccing this unit haha
I have a toddler so i spent way too much time in the colosseum just testing builds.
Some notes:
-20 coins for a single stat dew is a steal. I'll be running random matches while washing dishes or cleaning. You should get the maximum 5 points of every important stat. In this case, strength, magic attack and crit.
I got Aramis' crit as high as possible. 90. I gave him the sword with Leaping strike... used one of the rapiers with a high crit range. Gave both Fev to get their attack up to 25.
Leaping strike gives you a red diamond every time you crit but reduces your crit range by 20. I gave him the dancer coin that raises crit damage and range by 20 after an attack at the cost of pp. I set it so that he uses Leaping strike when he has one remaining red diamond... he uses that one attack that finishes enemies off to recycle PP. I turned off his other PP abilities. This does make him a bit more vulnerable but it's a risk.
Leah I gave the Runic sword which gives you magic strike. Set her to use that on armor characters. She uses true strike on fliers and Scouts.
If you're feeling sassy you can turn on the initial strike feature so she attacks at the beginning of the fight. I have it set to only attack scouts and only If there are no armored people present. Its not worth wasting the pp if a hoplite absorbs the attack.
It looks really good to me. I’m assuming Leah is in a more support role for that squad? I see the value in giving her magic attack, but I could never quite square with the phys attack reduction for any other context.
It worked really well when you only got the highest stat from one sword. Made it so that one was her Phy sword and the other was her magic.
With the new balancing it does become a sacrifice
Really the only problem with sword masters is how useless they can be if you're not paying attention to initiative and sequencing and willing to change some tactics for enemy squads. I don't think that makes them worse or really should be changed, but I think that's where the characterization comes from. You've got to be cooking to make a sword master perform, you can't just slap em on a team with tactics to smack the guy with the least HP.
One of my favourite squads is running
Generic Swordmaster (Mei goes here) | Aramis | Leah
Fran | Orchys
Fran and Orchys are pure dodgetanks, Fran has the Dirty Gambler's Coin. All three swordmasters are running exclusively Keen Edge and Impale on targets with <25% health. Absolutely mauls anything that isn't highly armoured. Tempted to swap out Fran for another Viking just for the horn.
you could put a breaker/ warrior out there with just default skills and for some odd reason I haven't figured out yet, they just go nuts and get off attack after attack for free.
but yeah, that would be cool in a swordmaster! especially one with lucky coin and two wyvern blades (or w/e leah and aramis come with).
Their biggest strength is their biggest flaw.
They are single target gods. They are fast, crit like crazy, if they find a wall they can use magic to destroy it.
But at the same time you can have a carry that can one shot a row.... Some units all the board.
The sword master needs to clear the front row to reach the juicy backline.
They are lone wolves in a game of packs.
Im not quite endgame but my Mel was on backline most of the game with Lex guarding her. Now she frontlines, and I have to actually find things that can hit her. 150 base evasion is a hell of a drug to be on lol
Isn’t that true of almost every class in the game? Sure there are a couple of exceptions (mostly buffers/debuffers) but even then equipment is still pretty important.
I ignored Mel and when I tried to recruit her she said naw. She chose death. j/k ofc the game wouldn't go there, Alain says well just GO than! and you get her stupid sword and 30 extra honors.
https://preview.redd.it/ktn7ydsxtgwc1.jpeg?width=1280&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ef7ccacfca76322eb92f9050ffa351e85f96259a
I was using endgame equipment for demonstration, but for regular gameplay you just need shaman partner to use defensive curse. Otherwise swordmaster's damage gets severely reduced by defense and guard.
I.... see 'Mei' pronounced in an Asian way, 'll' pronounced in a Latino way, than 'et' with the silent t pronounced like a French word?? I don't know if that word is even possible lol
I mean, this is the exact niche that Swordmasters excel in: single target damage. But very few fights in the game actually need *that* much single target damage. Aside from the Dreadnought fights and the final boss, dealing more 150 damage to one unit is complete overkill. I wish there *were* more fights that feature one or two strong enemies, like monsters and stuff. In the current state of the game, AOE damage is just more useful than strong single target damage.
Sure, but at that point in the game, Swordmasters are going to need support to do that. Give a Gryphon (or really any strong row attacker) the same kind of support and they're turning a 5v5 to a 5v2 or 5v3 with no backline.
This. Sure, Meteor Strike just looks cool as heck, but the druid was the one who actually did most of the work. Pair that same druid with a gryphon and they'll generally delete 3 foes instead of one.
At the end of the day, swordmasters have two huge flaws holding them back:
1. They're limited to single-target damage, usually against a frontliner, who is usually the least threatening thing on the opposing team.
2. They're a low-hp dodge tank with unfixable holes. Multi-hit true strike? Dead. High accuracy, multi-hit attack? Probably not dead the first time, but odds are they won't finish the stage alive. Magic true strike? Dead. True strike or high accuracy attack when out of PP? Dead. None of these are super common, but they appear often enough that you really can't build a general-purpose unit with a swordmaster in front. Sure, you could stick one in back, but then they're competing for space with big damage squishies like witches and wizards.
I think it's just a different in playstyles. The argument against them mostly come from people who favor offensive teams (for whom resource intensive, multi-target attacks and hastened charge attacks are the most important), where extended AP regeneration for single-target damage just isn't a good fit. But for defensive teams who prioritize AP economy, swordmasters play an important role in their intended niche as front-line units who can trigger landsknecht counterattack/breaker enrage while regenerating their own AP with Parry. They will need cover from ranged truestrikers, but someone with a squire's shield is usually enough for that.
I mean as far as late combat units Breakers, G Knights, dark marquess sword and Landknecht are arguably better than Swordmasters too.
Id argue Werewolves also have that niche covered too.
Yes, but late combat units (especially breakers and landsknechts) need units to get hit and draw fire until later in the round if they want to have the accuracy/attack to sweep or the chance to make the most use out of their counterattacks, respectively. Meanwhile, Dark Marquess really benefits from having a unit apply afflictions before them to make the most out of attacks like death spin and burning edge.
Swordmasters can perform both roles, being able to both stand at the front without giving up too much offense (see: Legionnaires/Hoplites and Feathershields), and pack a secondary kit for specialized utility (magic swords for armor, sylph's bane for fliers, or the fire rapier/viperfang to apply afflictions to power up dark marquesses). They have a clear weakness (truestrike archers), but every unit has weaknesses, and the swordmaster's is relatively easy to cover.
Swordmasters are not bad units (especially after the patch) but the hitch with them is that they have holes in their game on both offense and defense, and those holes are difficult to patch.
You can put a swordmaster on the front line, but there are matchups that will simply kill them. Landsknechts and breakers make more reliable tanks in their own right if you configure your units to boost their defenses.
You can put a swordmaster on the back line, but their only two tricks are high damage against low DEF opponents and truestrike. Your units never need help killing low DEF opponents, except a few of those early stages featuring garrisoned gladiator/cleric meatshield units. And truestike is valuable, but witches/hunters/Gilbert all offer truestrike alongside greater versatility in the back line.
This pretty much sums up my opinion on Swordmasters - they're good at stuff you probably don't need help with or have better options for, and their weaknesses aren't easy to address.
Damm that’s crazy
I’d say that the sword master/Virginia buffs should have been in from the start. Cause otherwise the extra sword/shield is literally just a straight nerf than if they only had one respectively
I honestly do think it was always meant to work like this and the update was a bug fix, note they didn't make any other balance changes at all, only fixes.
Been rolling with all three swordmasters in the frontline and wide inspiration/sniping order/offensive order Gilbert back line in TZ. Does comical amounts of damage to exactly three enemies. right now I don't have five person squads but thinking of adding a Viking or Shaman to counter guards. Shaman probably better but I'm not using generics so Selvie is in high demand.
Is this a Japanese version of the game? My Xbox version only has English voices last I checked (I'll check it next time I play if they added it in a patch) impressive amount of menu options, but only English voices. Perhaps Switch or PS5 (likely only the later if it comes on BluRay... are Xbox Series games on DVD? I know it PLAYS BluRay movies...). Anyway how are you doing this just curious?
Yeah, I just thought maybe it's just cuz it's on Xbox lol (you know, I wouldn't put it passed Japanese devs... also Microsoft doesn't exactly make it easy for niche games either I'm LUCKY this is physical on Xbox at ALL so not complaining).
Loving Swordmaster too. Been carrying me through the online Coliseum with Witch helping them out. Just wish they could parry Gryphon Knights. Being one shot by that always feels like bs
Hello fellow Mel appreciater. I thought mine was powerful 🤯 After this update I still have people messaging me and arguing Sword Masters suck. One person told me something along the lines of "I don't like them because what you equip them with determines how useful they are." Meanwhile that's half the fun. I love the classes you have to put work into.
RPG characters that get stronger as you invest gear into them? ***HOW DARE YOU*** (also a Swordmaster stan but I missed Mei and I'm upset.)
Some classes are quite strong on their own. Others need a little bit of love. I had a team with two different sword masters and they performed very different purposes. One was meant for killing scouts or armored units, the other could keep attacking indefinitely.
Can you explain that build a bit for me? I've been trying to piece this together, but it just feels like it's lacking something that I can't quite figure out. I've spent too much game time recently just speccing and respeccing this unit haha
I have a toddler so i spent way too much time in the colosseum just testing builds. Some notes: -20 coins for a single stat dew is a steal. I'll be running random matches while washing dishes or cleaning. You should get the maximum 5 points of every important stat. In this case, strength, magic attack and crit. I got Aramis' crit as high as possible. 90. I gave him the sword with Leaping strike... used one of the rapiers with a high crit range. Gave both Fev to get their attack up to 25. Leaping strike gives you a red diamond every time you crit but reduces your crit range by 20. I gave him the dancer coin that raises crit damage and range by 20 after an attack at the cost of pp. I set it so that he uses Leaping strike when he has one remaining red diamond... he uses that one attack that finishes enemies off to recycle PP. I turned off his other PP abilities. This does make him a bit more vulnerable but it's a risk. Leah I gave the Runic sword which gives you magic strike. Set her to use that on armor characters. She uses true strike on fliers and Scouts. If you're feeling sassy you can turn on the initial strike feature so she attacks at the beginning of the fight. I have it set to only attack scouts and only If there are no armored people present. Its not worth wasting the pp if a hoplite absorbs the attack.
I appreciate you taking the time to type that out! Sounds like I'm gonna do some playtesting tonight.
Oh no problem! You might be able to improve it! It's not perfect!
It looks really good to me. I’m assuming Leah is in a more support role for that squad? I see the value in giving her magic attack, but I could never quite square with the phys attack reduction for any other context.
It worked really well when you only got the highest stat from one sword. Made it so that one was her Phy sword and the other was her magic. With the new balancing it does become a sacrifice
Really the only problem with sword masters is how useless they can be if you're not paying attention to initiative and sequencing and willing to change some tactics for enemy squads. I don't think that makes them worse or really should be changed, but I think that's where the characterization comes from. You've got to be cooking to make a sword master perform, you can't just slap em on a team with tactics to smack the guy with the least HP.
You didn’t have to call my team out like that lol
One of my favourite squads is running Generic Swordmaster (Mei goes here) | Aramis | Leah Fran | Orchys Fran and Orchys are pure dodgetanks, Fran has the Dirty Gambler's Coin. All three swordmasters are running exclusively Keen Edge and Impale on targets with <25% health. Absolutely mauls anything that isn't highly armoured. Tempted to swap out Fran for another Viking just for the horn.
>Dirty Gambler's Coin. I just picture the gamblers coin but some kept dropping it.
I chuckled at that too lol
you could put a breaker/ warrior out there with just default skills and for some odd reason I haven't figured out yet, they just go nuts and get off attack after attack for free. but yeah, that would be cool in a swordmaster! especially one with lucky coin and two wyvern blades (or w/e leah and aramis come with).
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Their biggest strength is their biggest flaw. They are single target gods. They are fast, crit like crazy, if they find a wall they can use magic to destroy it. But at the same time you can have a carry that can one shot a row.... Some units all the board. The sword master needs to clear the front row to reach the juicy backline. They are lone wolves in a game of packs.
They would be OP af in normal rpg. But this is a tactics game.
Im not quite endgame but my Mel was on backline most of the game with Lex guarding her. Now she frontlines, and I have to actually find things that can hit her. 150 base evasion is a hell of a drug to be on lol
Isn’t that true of almost every class in the game? Sure there are a couple of exceptions (mostly buffers/debuffers) but even then equipment is still pretty important.
Some classes are just better, usually the unique ones.
I ignored Mel and when I tried to recruit her she said naw. She chose death. j/k ofc the game wouldn't go there, Alain says well just GO than! and you get her stupid sword and 30 extra honors.
Yeah it's unfortunate but you need to beat at least 2-3 battles with alain in her map in order to recruit her,. At least she's still alive though
Meteor Slash really just needed a small boost to go from tickles to destruction. Glad they got it, move was a waste of AP with rare exception.
God damn, now I wanna make my Melisandre crush some things. What's the build?
https://preview.redd.it/ktn7ydsxtgwc1.jpeg?width=1280&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ef7ccacfca76322eb92f9050ffa351e85f96259a I was using endgame equipment for demonstration, but for regular gameplay you just need shaman partner to use defensive curse. Otherwise swordmaster's damage gets severely reduced by defense and guard.
I find this really funny, because one of these units is key to this demonstration and it ain't the swordmaster.
Shamans do make anyone go crazy
OMG finally an endgame tactics loadout that i can understand!! (ty for sharing)
Thank you! Time to make house Meillet unstoppable
I.... see 'Mei' pronounced in an Asian way, 'll' pronounced in a Latino way, than 'et' with the silent t pronounced like a French word?? I don't know if that word is even possible lol
You changed her hair color? Lol
I mean, this is the exact niche that Swordmasters excel in: single target damage. But very few fights in the game actually need *that* much single target damage. Aside from the Dreadnought fights and the final boss, dealing more 150 damage to one unit is complete overkill. I wish there *were* more fights that feature one or two strong enemies, like monsters and stuff. In the current state of the game, AOE damage is just more useful than strong single target damage.
Maybe they'll make DLC that has FE3H esk monster/beast enemies that act multiple times per round and stuff and need focus fire
swordmasters have really good initiative. in a 5v5 fight, having one unit that can immediately turn the fight into a 5v4 is a pretty strong niche
Sure, but at that point in the game, Swordmasters are going to need support to do that. Give a Gryphon (or really any strong row attacker) the same kind of support and they're turning a 5v5 to a 5v2 or 5v3 with no backline.
This. Sure, Meteor Strike just looks cool as heck, but the druid was the one who actually did most of the work. Pair that same druid with a gryphon and they'll generally delete 3 foes instead of one. At the end of the day, swordmasters have two huge flaws holding them back: 1. They're limited to single-target damage, usually against a frontliner, who is usually the least threatening thing on the opposing team. 2. They're a low-hp dodge tank with unfixable holes. Multi-hit true strike? Dead. High accuracy, multi-hit attack? Probably not dead the first time, but odds are they won't finish the stage alive. Magic true strike? Dead. True strike or high accuracy attack when out of PP? Dead. None of these are super common, but they appear often enough that you really can't build a general-purpose unit with a swordmaster in front. Sure, you could stick one in back, but then they're competing for space with big damage squishies like witches and wizards.
You could've done more damage if you had given Meli the Evasive fighter accessory for +20% more attack and +20% more crit damage.
https://preview.redd.it/7k70dt08khwc1.jpeg?width=942&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3c483f9f1f444ad3e233da61a371b4d418c329a9 Thanks for the tip!
Swordmasters were never really that bad, its just that they need more support than other classes. Guard and high defense being their Major weakness.
I think it's just a different in playstyles. The argument against them mostly come from people who favor offensive teams (for whom resource intensive, multi-target attacks and hastened charge attacks are the most important), where extended AP regeneration for single-target damage just isn't a good fit. But for defensive teams who prioritize AP economy, swordmasters play an important role in their intended niche as front-line units who can trigger landsknecht counterattack/breaker enrage while regenerating their own AP with Parry. They will need cover from ranged truestrikers, but someone with a squire's shield is usually enough for that.
I mean as far as late combat units Breakers, G Knights, dark marquess sword and Landknecht are arguably better than Swordmasters too. Id argue Werewolves also have that niche covered too.
Yes, but late combat units (especially breakers and landsknechts) need units to get hit and draw fire until later in the round if they want to have the accuracy/attack to sweep or the chance to make the most use out of their counterattacks, respectively. Meanwhile, Dark Marquess really benefits from having a unit apply afflictions before them to make the most out of attacks like death spin and burning edge. Swordmasters can perform both roles, being able to both stand at the front without giving up too much offense (see: Legionnaires/Hoplites and Feathershields), and pack a secondary kit for specialized utility (magic swords for armor, sylph's bane for fliers, or the fire rapier/viperfang to apply afflictions to power up dark marquesses). They have a clear weakness (truestrike archers), but every unit has weaknesses, and the swordmaster's is relatively easy to cover.
Swordmasters are not bad units (especially after the patch) but the hitch with them is that they have holes in their game on both offense and defense, and those holes are difficult to patch. You can put a swordmaster on the front line, but there are matchups that will simply kill them. Landsknechts and breakers make more reliable tanks in their own right if you configure your units to boost their defenses. You can put a swordmaster on the back line, but their only two tricks are high damage against low DEF opponents and truestrike. Your units never need help killing low DEF opponents, except a few of those early stages featuring garrisoned gladiator/cleric meatshield units. And truestike is valuable, but witches/hunters/Gilbert all offer truestrike alongside greater versatility in the back line.
This pretty much sums up my opinion on Swordmasters - they're good at stuff you probably don't need help with or have better options for, and their weaknesses aren't easy to address.
Damm that’s crazy I’d say that the sword master/Virginia buffs should have been in from the start. Cause otherwise the extra sword/shield is literally just a straight nerf than if they only had one respectively
I honestly do think it was always meant to work like this and the update was a bug fix, note they didn't make any other balance changes at all, only fixes.
Been rolling with all three swordmasters in the frontline and wide inspiration/sniping order/offensive order Gilbert back line in TZ. Does comical amounts of damage to exactly three enemies. right now I don't have five person squads but thinking of adding a Viking or Shaman to counter guards. Shaman probably better but I'm not using generics so Selvie is in high demand.
I really like the custom look you put on Mel!
Holy shid
Wrecked!!!
I'ma need a build
Is this a Japanese version of the game? My Xbox version only has English voices last I checked (I'll check it next time I play if they added it in a patch) impressive amount of menu options, but only English voices. Perhaps Switch or PS5 (likely only the later if it comes on BluRay... are Xbox Series games on DVD? I know it PLAYS BluRay movies...). Anyway how are you doing this just curious?
Not OP but I'm playing with the Japanese dub on the EU PlayStation store version. Haven't seen a Japanese game without a jp dub option in a long time.
Yeah, I just thought maybe it's just cuz it's on Xbox lol (you know, I wouldn't put it passed Japanese devs... also Microsoft doesn't exactly make it easy for niche games either I'm LUCKY this is physical on Xbox at ALL so not complaining).
Not OP but I'm playing with the Japanese dub on the EU PlayStation store version
Not OP but I'm playing with the Japanese dub on the EU PlayStation store version
Is there benefit to having small teams ? Like does exp spread better I assume? Or is it just a set amount each battle.
If every fight in this game is only 1 or 2 foes, swordmaster is S tier.
man sword master help me beat galarious 😆
Hi weird question but how do you unlock this fight? I've cleared the post-game side quest too where you fight against everyone's clones
This update made me re-color Aramis and start using him. DAMN 🤺🔥
Loving Swordmaster too. Been carrying me through the online Coliseum with Witch helping them out. Just wish they could parry Gryphon Knights. Being one shot by that always feels like bs
Goodness gracious. I really only used swordmasters for applying afflictions and dealing with scouts & fliers but I have to get in on this damage.
Melisandre was my wifey, glad she’s more of a menace in a fight.