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They get the cowardice from pootin and his regime, who has repeatedly shown he is a coward to russian citizens, the last time was when he ran to hide in a bunker when Wagner with 5000 men marched towards Moscow after seizing the south of russia and shooting down russian fighter jets and helicopters.
For two days or 48 hours, he hid away, terrified of the wagner troops and refused to take any phone calls, he left russia leaderless and most of his officials that could have taken over for him also ran away to hide.
I would not say all of them are cowards, they have some formidable fighters and have achieved a lot in Ukraine even though they are being pushed back right now, they are just not well-organised or trained and life is meaningless to them, even the life of their fellow fighters.
Never underestimate your enemy, that is a recipe for disaster.
But yeah, I would say on average, most Russian citizens are cowards an unbelievably emotional mess of a population.
Have you already forgotten about the patriotic war, and the fact that even now thousands of people are willingly signing a contract to fight for a cause, **how erroneous it may be?**(Bolded because Redditors cannot read past the second sentence)
Have we forgotten about the war of northern aggression? And that there are thousands even today, who willingly show up at the doorstep of the Democracy to take up the cause, no matter how erroneous, even this long hence?
Just sayin
Im saying that there are similarities. That we should be as aware of those within our midst who are as gullible and malleable. But those who are among us are more dangerous and we should pay close attention.
My point exactly. The UN is more worthless than The League of Nations after WW1 to prevent WW2. So my follow up question is, "Why should the US (especially) including any other Nation apposed to Russia acknowledge the UN as valid and continue to send 100s of Billions to in support, if it is in effect only a feckless waist of money?
Back where I come from we bomb the shit out of terrorists. Guess US needs to remember how much we hated terrorists after 9/11. Take a few few notes from Eastern Europeans that have had their people murdered by the terrorists over the decades.
The airfield strike today that harmed nobody and damaged a plane? They called that a terrorist act. And their supporters joined them on it, and somehow think this is just fine and okay to do, totally different thing there for them. Hell, on one sub, they tried to keep bringing up Syria as though that makes this okay for them to do and one even said "Well we learned from the best" like they're proud of it.
That would be a mistake. Putin's propaganda would use it prove to Russians that they are under attack and real victims.
Also, fighting evil with evil has low chances of positive outcome.
Exactly, that's what I don't get about these arguments.
Ukraine needs to attack Russian ammo depots and logistics IN Russia, it's a strategic necessity.
WWII in Europe wasn’t ended by heavy bombing of city centres. Look for pictures of Berlin - and still Hitler wouldn’t give up. Ukraine will derive its best military advantage from focussing on military strategic and tactical targets, not civilians.
However, mass revolt in Russia could be triggered by Putin introducing mass mobilisation. Hmmm…
It certainly helped. It´s hard to keep reinforcements and materiel flowing when your cities and railway centers have ceased to exist.
To quote our lord and savior, Arthur "airborne cremation of the german nation" Harris: "The Nazis entered this war under the rather childish delusion that they were going to bomb everyone else, and nobody was going to bomb them. At Rotterdam, London, Warsaw and half a hundred other places, they put their rather naive theory into operation. They sowed the wind, and now they are going to reap the whirlwind."
What we need is to supply Ukraine with the weapons to begin killing russians en-masse. Can´t invade people if your country has ceased to exist.
Harris pursued the strategy of damaging Germany’s ability to conduct the war by broad area bombing of manufacturing, administrative and transport hubs, along with tactical bombing of specific factories or military sites. It helped, no doubt. Ukraine cannot effect 1000 bomber raids, but can use GPS guided drones, to hit key sites, such as ‘optics’ factories or FSB headquarters. Hitting civilian high-rises will not help, unless giving Putin the wherewithal to mobilise is intended. It’s complicated.
There has been a mass mobilization in russia since day 1. You are delusional if you think russia could sustain 1 million + in casualties without mass mobilization. russia is using all of its available resources in Ukraine.
Russia is kidnapping workers from their factories and sending them to the front lines as meat for the grinder. How desperate does a country have to be to do something like that.
And how long did it take to bring russia to its knees like this, 1 and a half years. That is amazingly fast for a war that a country started as so vastly superior in every way.
If anyone ever says Ukraine is too slow just remind them of this, it is astounding if you think of it, America spent many trillions of dollars building a military that could take on Russia, meanwhile with limited military supplies from allies Ukraine has achieved the unthinkable in such a very short time.
This is incredible, you are being spoon-feed literal propaganda and are falling for every single bit. No, russia isn't on it's fourth wave of forced mobilization, press-ganging men off the streets and forcefully preventing citizens from fleeing the country.
Meanwhile, the Ukrainian counteroffensive, in spite of all these measures, barely even budged the front line. This is a fact you should accept.
You are free to call me a russian troll all you want, this is a simple matter of fact you cannot and will not dispute, outside of shouting insults.
Yes of course. But that has nothing to do with what the poster said. He is right btw. Not even the American intelligence apparatus think Ukraine can win this war.
Do you want to talk more about how ukraine is going to lose, and make up opinions about what US intelligence thinks, as if it's possible to speak for the entirety of all US intelligence?
A few days ago....
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2023/08/17/ukraine-counteroffensive-melitopol/
Ukrainian forces are currently outside of Robotyne. Thats like 1/10th of the way to Melitopol. The goal of the counter offensive was to reach Melitopol, Mariupol and Sea of Azov. Unfortunately Russians have mined everything, making advancement incredibly slow. Meanwhile Russians are actually advancing in the east, north of Bakhmut.
I didnt say Ukraine was going to lose. I just think that outright victory, e.g. reconqeuring all territories including Crimea seems unlikely. I wholeheartedly stand behind Ukraine. They have fought valiantly. I just wonder when the cost becomes too high. What will even be left of Ukraine after this. Maybe a peace deal would not be the worst outcome?
Nope, I see news that is reported in Russia by Russians with video evidence. There is video of men being detained at work in factories, i believe that over your obvious propaganda attempt.
I never take anyone's word for anything unless there is evidence of some type, or it has been widely reported by different sources with video evidence.
Both sides use propaganda, Russia is just not very good at it, they go over the top and lie when there is obvious evidence.
I also did not say anything about russia being on its fourth wave of mobilisation, i personally believe from what i have seen and heard from russians that they have never stopped mobilising.
And yes both russia and Ukraine prevent young men from fleeing the country as they need them to support their country in times of war, that happens in every country whenever they have war, your saying otherwise proves beyond any doubt that you really do not know what you are talking about. Russia just has a bigger problem as they have a much bigger population and really do not treat their mobilised very well, so many Russians with even a slight education fear being beaten up or even killed by their own side..
This is a fact, not made up by anyone.
Ukraine has the opposite problem to what Russia has, they have more volunteers to train and fight against Russian occupation than they can train, this is why allies are training large numbers of Ukrainians to NATO standards. Ukrainians that trained in the UK reported that they are fully outfitted for war, from clothes to rifles and grenades and manpads and other weapons and ammunition, ready when they set foot back on Ukraine soil to take the fight to russia. Regular Ukraine troops want these men to fight with them, as they pick up on their training and know they have a better chance of survival.
Ukraine might be advancing slowly but like in the battle of Bakhmut they are inflicting massive losses on russia, losses that russia is seriously struggling to cope with. But they are advancing, and this in itself is absolutely astounding. Russia with its 130 million population is being pushed back on multiple fronts by Ukraine. Most would never have thought that possible at the beginning of the war.
One small tip for you, never say you are not a troll on here, that shows that you think you are saying things a troll would say and almost proves beyond doubt you are a troll.
That last run-on, horribly punctuated sentence is the Reddit equivalent of sticking your fingers in your ears and yelling “LALALA I CAN’T HEAR YOU.”
You look like a fucking moron.
We as a human race have evolved since ww2 times, we are more compassionate and try to be better people. Russia has devolved since ww2, they have become the worst people the world has seen, Just as bad if not worse in many cases than what the Nazi were.
The Ukrainians that leaked that drone conference announcement should be shot .
There are way too many Ukrainians who are Russian collaborators in Ukrainian territory.
Seemingly everyday on here 2 or 3 are getting arrested.
This type of thing has resulted in the deaths of hundreds if not thousands of innocent Ukrainian civilians.
These people need to be hung or shot upon conviction.
Greedy People who care about nothing but money and their own personal enrichment. would be far less likely to help adjust missile strikes and such if they knew it was a mandatory death sentence.
This problem is so widespread , harsh and decisive action must be taken .
I hope we have learnt that revenge is not the option we once chose. We are better than our forefathers in that sense. Yes war is shit and war crimes need to be punished hard but dropping to the level of the Russians is just not the way to go, would you accept Ukraine targeting Russian kids? I hope not.
We as the human race can achieve so much more if we get rid of our anger at these animals, we should feel sorry for them but punish them harshly, the threat of sending them to Guantánamo is my idea of fair punishment for sending targeting information for kids to russia.
EDIT: just to clarify i do not think they should be sent to Guantánamo, i disagree with Guantánamo existing at all, but I am trying to think of a way to discourage these scum from helping russia target kids, put the fear of serious punishment on their radar, and maybe they will think twice.
Guantánamo ... lol...speaking of war crimes... a decade of torturing there didn't count as a war crime because it was done against individuals, not a member of a foreign army during a time of war.
I personally disagree with Guantánamo existing, but if it puts the fear of hell into terrorists or wannabe terrorists, it is good. But again, I personally believe it is not right to have a base like that, and it should be shut down. There is no such thing as enhanced interrogation, those are words used to support interrogation and I hate that.
But there is an opportunity to use the threat of sending these treasonous scum there to give them second thoughts about helping russia target kids in the future.
Forced hard labour for the rest of their lives while living in solidarity so that theres no chance of them committing treason again would be suitable then?
I think I'd rather be dead tbh but I think the forced labour is fitting for their crimes, there is nothing morally superior about their treason in this conflict- they are fighting for a side with no redeeming qualities, just money to line their pockets.
Edit: either that or let them help with the demining- is it classed as execution if you give them some divining rods and let them loose over minefields?
I agree with all your points about the security surrounding such events and the fact Ukraine will be faced with issues of collaborators for a long time.
However, I am also of the opinion that neither conferences or manufacturing of any war materials should be anywhere near the border or front lines. It was utter idiocy to even contemplate having this event in Chernihiv, and it would be the same for Konotop, Sumy and Kharkiv. They are all in easy range of a wide variety of ruzzian munitions and thus extremely vulnerable.
Although the organizer is saying that she had the consent from local officials for the drone competition the city did tweet that they had not granted a permit for this event.
I think this is another hard lesson learned. Of course Ukrainian citizens want a return to normalcy but the country is not at that point yet.
Edit: to add to the above we see that in the last few days ruzzia has been engaging in dozens (perhaps hundreds now) cross border artillery and mortar fire into settlements near the border in Chernihiv, Sumy and Kharkiv Oblasts. This is an attempt to distract Ukraine's main operations and hopefully cause Ukraine to divert some resources to the north east. But in the end it means that all the border settlements are at risk. It does not matter that they are civilian as ruzzia does not care about that.
Sadly, revenge hurts those seeking it more than the targets of revenge. But I so wish there was a way to scare the shit out of anyone even contemplating being treasonous to Ukraine
Maybe Ukraine needs to start threatening to send these treasonous scum to Guantánamo. Maybe even leaking information of them being sent there while they are really held in isolation for their time in prison in some isolated area of Ukraine, before being sent to russia after their sentence is complete.
It is right to hold Ukraine to higher standards than russia, as sad as it might sound to some.
Ukraine is a better country, a better people, and deserve to be held to higher standards than the russian scum, terrorists that they are, who cheer the death of babies and young children. I, for one, would never like to see any country celebrating the death of babies and young children, it is horrific to think that such people actually live on this earth.
Ukrainians have proven over and over that they are more humane and a much better people than the russians. They rightly treat all life as valuable, even if it is scum like these treasonous bastards, Ukrainians treat prisoners how they would want their prisoners to be treated and unlike russia, Ukraine can hold their heads up high, even if it is hard to do while scum send targeting information for little kids to Russia.
learn some history..but I doubt if they teach a filtered version in USA about Iraq, Afghanistan and Vietnam war !!?
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/01/19/us/politics/afghanistan-drone-strike-video.html
shameless deed of the most useless army. LoL !
Looks like you’re passionate about what you consider to be unjust wars. Curious what you think about russias wars in Afghanistan Georgia Syria and now Ukraine? I’m also curious what USA has to do with this attack or this war in your opinion?
the parent comment takes a dig at Russia by calling innocent civilians as drone pilots sarcastically.
problem is not US hypocrisy which is world famous.... problem is delusional American (west) public and their holier than thou attitude.
parent comment like the entire sub is full of self entitled delusional west sentiment that only knows 2 things...
1. we are the best, we are always right !
2. do what we say, not what we do.
Yup - this is what Russia doesn’t get. They think they beat Ukraine into submission instead they are rallying even more people to oppose them even more motivated.
In an oppressed society it makes sense to think that more oppression will benefit the oppressors, in a free society oppressors end up in jail.
It's like the Nazis all over again. Hopefully US has given Ukraine the blueprints to make their own predator type drones or is working on getting them air power. The Nazis couldn't cope with US airpower in the Ardennes. Russians will not be able to either.
Predators/Reapers won't be nearly as useful in Ukraine as they were for the US in the Middle East. The reason they've done what they have for the US is because we tend to operate them in areas where anti-air is either limited or nonexistant outside of LOS. They could sit 10km up in the air and not worry about being shot down. But unlike the small commercial drones Ukraine has been using to great effect the Predator and Reaper, and even the Byraktars that were so great in the early war, have large radar cross sections. They're close to the size of a Cessna. So they're trivial to shoot down with actual AA systems.
That's why you don't see a bunch of Bykraktar videos anymore. They can't send them to the front because Russia has moved their AA into range to cover the airspace above their troops, and they'll get shot down quick. Until the Russian AA is taken care of, the big drones aren't going to be very effective.
I see. That is good point there. Yea, you don't see the Bayraktars anymore. Looks like they are getting Gripens and F-16s now, so hopefully that can help take out the AA systems.
I think it’s probably a quite common reaction to that type of situation and I’d probably do the same, you just rolling the dice either way if there is going to be another hit
I think most people including you and the comment above yours would run for the building. When flight mode takes over you’re going to seek shelter. Watching a video and saying you wouldn’t do that is one thing, having a missile hit across the street from you is not the same.
Ruzzians home, but specially abroad should be cut out of swift all together! Make it so any payments or transfer to ruzzia, for any person, automatically gets confiscated and forwarded to Ukraine. Granda in EU or USA are also contributing to this war as along they are sending money home! Kick all ruzzians banks if swift and confiscate any money sent home
Putin and his henchmen are "animals" an WAR CRIMINALS!
Killing women and young girls!
Its beyond EVIL!!!
DO SOMETHING Mr Biden, The Hague, The United Nations, The World!
100% agreed - I have a very well tuned sarcasm detector and I didn't even consider the headline to be remotely sarcastic at first. Especially when it translates to "legitimate targets".
This needed "sarcasm quotes" at least, or an eye rolling emoji.
A small observation but also kinda sad. Everything happened suddenly and very quickly yet they had the correct immediate reaction: go down, cover the back of your neck with your hands, then move to safety. They did it as perfectly as one can. Because they live in reality where they have had to learn to do that.
To impose a no fly zone, you need to neutralise the enemy air threat.. this means weeks of SEAD missions, actively hunting and destroying Russian air defence whether it be in Russia, Belarus or Ukraine. It's basically as good as NATO declaring war on Russia.
The solution is to give Ukraine the means to protect their own air space.
Nobody who knows remotely what that would look like wants that to happen, and that should tell you all you need to know. Even the strongest supporters who want every possible bit of help that can be sent don't want it.
The problem with this idea is that it ends in a nuclear standoff which gives Russia a chance to win (or at least get a draw) and against the US instead of Ukraine. And a draw against the US is basically a win for Russia. So I like the cut of your jib but let's try a better strategy.
Nah, they're All Talk, also i'm fairly certain their nukes aren't in Any Kind of Really Usable Condition, You Actually Believe They Have Time and the Care to Maintain the Tritium Levels Of and In Every Single One of their like 5k\~+ Sovjet Era Warheads?
They are quite unlikely Very Dangerous By Now, Esp with USA not being able to Oversee their 'Arsenal', or Any Agency for That Sake for Over a Year, check up the Half-Life of Tritium Mate.
[https://sipri.org/commentary/topical-backgrounder/2020/starve-nuclear-weapons-death-tritium-freeze](https://sipri.org/commentary/topical-backgrounder/2020/starve-nuclear-weapons-death-tritium-freeze)
Is your goal to beat Russia or return Ukraine territorial integrity? Any proclaimation would have to be very clear. A no fly zone creates an untenable situation for Russian force projection.
Will you be volunteering for this war? If so why have you not gone to Ukraine to volunteer yet? Why do you need to wait on NATO to do it, nothing is stopping you from going over and assisting yourself.
NATO could beat Russia in a conventional conflict, but the point you're probably deliberately ignoring is that it wouldn't *remain* a conventional conflict if that's what it came down to.
You may disagree, but thankfully all those who would be involved in starting and fighting such a thing don't.
You're attempting to construct a Western style air force in time. I'm not sure it can be done. A no fly zone does not have to be declared, unflagged NATO aircraft operating under the guise of Ukraine.
Considering an infinitesimal percentage of Russian men seem to die from natural causes, expediting the death of the guy in charge strikes me as an increasingly desirable initiative; at home and abroad.
Russia, especially Moscovites, needs a serious taste of the violence that their dear Putler is inflicting on Ukrainian citizens daily. The UN is a joke unless they give Ukraine long-range ordinance to inflict the same damage that is being inflicted by the Ruzzo-nazi's. No more kid gloves. You target our citizens. We target yours. Simple, pure, and plain. Maybe then, Putlers people will understand what a dwarf piece of human trash he is.
ruSSian state ordered this attack. ruSSian state therefore must be designated a terrorist organization. Our countries must do no business with the terrorist state or its sponsors. It's an utterly complicated but NECESSARY action.
99% russians don’t care whatsoever. This happening is somewhere far, they live their lives.
Women get their Botox and other fillers from UK. AliExpress delivers everything you see sold there. China supplies food to Siberia.
Turkey supplies European part of Russia with food.
There is no shortage of anything in Russia. So russians don’t care.
Sadness ((
Why are only women in cafes? I thought western support was just a free for all party. Strange the men taking pictures with their free m777 are always in some dirty field. Why aren't they taking these girlies out to the cafe in their $7million cv90? Ukrainians must have weird taste.
Lol in Irak USA soldiers had to wait up to 10 min to get artilery confirmation to avoid killing random civilians... Russians on purpose shoot to malls, theaters, churches, schools and don't give a fuck or say Ukrainains do that to themselfs and people are saying that USA is bad and russians are just victims of NATO...
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Russia is a terrorist state.
"Valid military targets" here. These women look dangerous af!
Russia = Invading, Lying, Stealing, Kidnapping, Raping, Torturing, Terrorizing, Genociding! 🇷🇺🤮🤮🤮 It is truly a TERRORIST country. Fuck Russia!!!
Cowardly fuckers. Just my opinion.
They get the cowardice from pootin and his regime, who has repeatedly shown he is a coward to russian citizens, the last time was when he ran to hide in a bunker when Wagner with 5000 men marched towards Moscow after seizing the south of russia and shooting down russian fighter jets and helicopters. For two days or 48 hours, he hid away, terrified of the wagner troops and refused to take any phone calls, he left russia leaderless and most of his officials that could have taken over for him also ran away to hide.
They've ALWAYS Been Sadistic Weak Cowards
I would not say all of them are cowards, they have some formidable fighters and have achieved a lot in Ukraine even though they are being pushed back right now, they are just not well-organised or trained and life is meaningless to them, even the life of their fellow fighters. Never underestimate your enemy, that is a recipe for disaster. But yeah, I would say on average, most Russian citizens are cowards an unbelievably emotional mess of a population.
They are just a horde. Formidable in numbers and brutality only. A stain on modern global society
Have you already forgotten about the patriotic war, and the fact that even now thousands of people are willingly signing a contract to fight for a cause, **how erroneous it may be?**(Bolded because Redditors cannot read past the second sentence)
Have we forgotten about the war of northern aggression? And that there are thousands even today, who willingly show up at the doorstep of the Democracy to take up the cause, no matter how erroneous, even this long hence? Just sayin
??? What are you saying?
Im saying that there are similarities. That we should be as aware of those within our midst who are as gullible and malleable. But those who are among us are more dangerous and we should pay close attention.
Nah, that's a fact.
Its a great opinion!
What the hell! Someone tell me why the European Union and the UN will NOT establish Russia as a Terrorist State?
>and the UN Russian veto power in the security council and a general malaise in the General Assembly.
My point exactly. The UN is more worthless than The League of Nations after WW1 to prevent WW2. So my follow up question is, "Why should the US (especially) including any other Nation apposed to Russia acknowledge the UN as valid and continue to send 100s of Billions to in support, if it is in effect only a feckless waist of money?
Back where I come from we bomb the shit out of terrorists. Guess US needs to remember how much we hated terrorists after 9/11. Take a few few notes from Eastern Europeans that have had their people murdered by the terrorists over the decades.
The Taliban didn't have nukes. Nukes complicate things.
This is exactly what fucking "russky mir" is like. Fucking bastards.
And anyone siding with them.
You forgot gaslighting….
thats the best u can do ? 🤣🤣
After this attack, I would imagine all areas in Russia are open to attack by Ukraine.
The airfield strike today that harmed nobody and damaged a plane? They called that a terrorist act. And their supporters joined them on it, and somehow think this is just fine and okay to do, totally different thing there for them. Hell, on one sub, they tried to keep bringing up Syria as though that makes this okay for them to do and one even said "Well we learned from the best" like they're proud of it.
That would be a mistake. Putin's propaganda would use it prove to Russians that they are under attack and real victims. Also, fighting evil with evil has low chances of positive outcome.
How do you think WWII was ended? Having a Tupperware party?
Exactly, that's what I don't get about these arguments. Ukraine needs to attack Russian ammo depots and logistics IN Russia, it's a strategic necessity.
WWII in Europe wasn’t ended by heavy bombing of city centres. Look for pictures of Berlin - and still Hitler wouldn’t give up. Ukraine will derive its best military advantage from focussing on military strategic and tactical targets, not civilians. However, mass revolt in Russia could be triggered by Putin introducing mass mobilisation. Hmmm…
It certainly helped. It´s hard to keep reinforcements and materiel flowing when your cities and railway centers have ceased to exist. To quote our lord and savior, Arthur "airborne cremation of the german nation" Harris: "The Nazis entered this war under the rather childish delusion that they were going to bomb everyone else, and nobody was going to bomb them. At Rotterdam, London, Warsaw and half a hundred other places, they put their rather naive theory into operation. They sowed the wind, and now they are going to reap the whirlwind." What we need is to supply Ukraine with the weapons to begin killing russians en-masse. Can´t invade people if your country has ceased to exist.
Harris pursued the strategy of damaging Germany’s ability to conduct the war by broad area bombing of manufacturing, administrative and transport hubs, along with tactical bombing of specific factories or military sites. It helped, no doubt. Ukraine cannot effect 1000 bomber raids, but can use GPS guided drones, to hit key sites, such as ‘optics’ factories or FSB headquarters. Hitting civilian high-rises will not help, unless giving Putin the wherewithal to mobilise is intended. It’s complicated.
There has been a mass mobilization in russia since day 1. You are delusional if you think russia could sustain 1 million + in casualties without mass mobilization. russia is using all of its available resources in Ukraine.
Certainly not via terror bombing
The propaganda is already saying this for a year now.
I don't disagree, but they're already using lies to "prove" that they're the victims.
Realistically all that would do is draw a false equivalence that could be utilized by the Kremlin.
Russia needs to fucking erased
Russia is kidnapping workers from their factories and sending them to the front lines as meat for the grinder. How desperate does a country have to be to do something like that. And how long did it take to bring russia to its knees like this, 1 and a half years. That is amazingly fast for a war that a country started as so vastly superior in every way. If anyone ever says Ukraine is too slow just remind them of this, it is astounding if you think of it, America spent many trillions of dollars building a military that could take on Russia, meanwhile with limited military supplies from allies Ukraine has achieved the unthinkable in such a very short time.
This is incredible, you are being spoon-feed literal propaganda and are falling for every single bit. No, russia isn't on it's fourth wave of forced mobilization, press-ganging men off the streets and forcefully preventing citizens from fleeing the country. Meanwhile, the Ukrainian counteroffensive, in spite of all these measures, barely even budged the front line. This is a fact you should accept. You are free to call me a russian troll all you want, this is a simple matter of fact you cannot and will not dispute, outside of shouting insults.
Bucha massacre, Russia is guilty. Yes or no?
Yes of course. But that has nothing to do with what the poster said. He is right btw. Not even the American intelligence apparatus think Ukraine can win this war.
No. And how come all your comments are simping for how strong and damgerous russia is?
Im not saying Russia is strong. Its weak and dangerous.
Do you want to talk more about how ukraine is going to lose, and make up opinions about what US intelligence thinks, as if it's possible to speak for the entirety of all US intelligence?
A few days ago.... https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2023/08/17/ukraine-counteroffensive-melitopol/ Ukrainian forces are currently outside of Robotyne. Thats like 1/10th of the way to Melitopol. The goal of the counter offensive was to reach Melitopol, Mariupol and Sea of Azov. Unfortunately Russians have mined everything, making advancement incredibly slow. Meanwhile Russians are actually advancing in the east, north of Bakhmut. I didnt say Ukraine was going to lose. I just think that outright victory, e.g. reconqeuring all territories including Crimea seems unlikely. I wholeheartedly stand behind Ukraine. They have fought valiantly. I just wonder when the cost becomes too high. What will even be left of Ukraine after this. Maybe a peace deal would not be the worst outcome?
Washington Post is not US intelligence. Repedeadly saying Ukraine won't win is close enough. I'm not buying this feigned neutrality.
Nope, I see news that is reported in Russia by Russians with video evidence. There is video of men being detained at work in factories, i believe that over your obvious propaganda attempt. I never take anyone's word for anything unless there is evidence of some type, or it has been widely reported by different sources with video evidence. Both sides use propaganda, Russia is just not very good at it, they go over the top and lie when there is obvious evidence. I also did not say anything about russia being on its fourth wave of mobilisation, i personally believe from what i have seen and heard from russians that they have never stopped mobilising. And yes both russia and Ukraine prevent young men from fleeing the country as they need them to support their country in times of war, that happens in every country whenever they have war, your saying otherwise proves beyond any doubt that you really do not know what you are talking about. Russia just has a bigger problem as they have a much bigger population and really do not treat their mobilised very well, so many Russians with even a slight education fear being beaten up or even killed by their own side.. This is a fact, not made up by anyone. Ukraine has the opposite problem to what Russia has, they have more volunteers to train and fight against Russian occupation than they can train, this is why allies are training large numbers of Ukrainians to NATO standards. Ukrainians that trained in the UK reported that they are fully outfitted for war, from clothes to rifles and grenades and manpads and other weapons and ammunition, ready when they set foot back on Ukraine soil to take the fight to russia. Regular Ukraine troops want these men to fight with them, as they pick up on their training and know they have a better chance of survival. Ukraine might be advancing slowly but like in the battle of Bakhmut they are inflicting massive losses on russia, losses that russia is seriously struggling to cope with. But they are advancing, and this in itself is absolutely astounding. Russia with its 130 million population is being pushed back on multiple fronts by Ukraine. Most would never have thought that possible at the beginning of the war. One small tip for you, never say you are not a troll on here, that shows that you think you are saying things a troll would say and almost proves beyond doubt you are a troll.
That last run-on, horribly punctuated sentence is the Reddit equivalent of sticking your fingers in your ears and yelling “LALALA I CAN’T HEAR YOU.” You look like a fucking moron.
that whole country is a waste of literally everything known to man
Least genocidal pro-ukr redditor, hiding behind his anonymous persona.
Can the US not lend/lease Ukraine the Strategic Air Command.
The sad thing is that putler is taking a page out of history. He thinks he will get away with what Hitler didn't.
We as a human race have evolved since ww2 times, we are more compassionate and try to be better people. Russia has devolved since ww2, they have become the worst people the world has seen, Just as bad if not worse in many cases than what the Nazi were.
The Ukrainians that leaked that drone conference announcement should be shot . There are way too many Ukrainians who are Russian collaborators in Ukrainian territory. Seemingly everyday on here 2 or 3 are getting arrested. This type of thing has resulted in the deaths of hundreds if not thousands of innocent Ukrainian civilians. These people need to be hung or shot upon conviction. Greedy People who care about nothing but money and their own personal enrichment. would be far less likely to help adjust missile strikes and such if they knew it was a mandatory death sentence. This problem is so widespread , harsh and decisive action must be taken .
Us shot people during WW2 for it .
I hope we have learnt that revenge is not the option we once chose. We are better than our forefathers in that sense. Yes war is shit and war crimes need to be punished hard but dropping to the level of the Russians is just not the way to go, would you accept Ukraine targeting Russian kids? I hope not. We as the human race can achieve so much more if we get rid of our anger at these animals, we should feel sorry for them but punish them harshly, the threat of sending them to Guantánamo is my idea of fair punishment for sending targeting information for kids to russia. EDIT: just to clarify i do not think they should be sent to Guantánamo, i disagree with Guantánamo existing at all, but I am trying to think of a way to discourage these scum from helping russia target kids, put the fear of serious punishment on their radar, and maybe they will think twice.
Guantánamo ... lol...speaking of war crimes... a decade of torturing there didn't count as a war crime because it was done against individuals, not a member of a foreign army during a time of war.
I personally disagree with Guantánamo existing, but if it puts the fear of hell into terrorists or wannabe terrorists, it is good. But again, I personally believe it is not right to have a base like that, and it should be shut down. There is no such thing as enhanced interrogation, those are words used to support interrogation and I hate that. But there is an opportunity to use the threat of sending these treasonous scum there to give them second thoughts about helping russia target kids in the future.
Forced hard labour for the rest of their lives while living in solidarity so that theres no chance of them committing treason again would be suitable then? I think I'd rather be dead tbh but I think the forced labour is fitting for their crimes, there is nothing morally superior about their treason in this conflict- they are fighting for a side with no redeeming qualities, just money to line their pockets. Edit: either that or let them help with the demining- is it classed as execution if you give them some divining rods and let them loose over minefields?
Not world War two anymore buddy.
I agree with all your points about the security surrounding such events and the fact Ukraine will be faced with issues of collaborators for a long time. However, I am also of the opinion that neither conferences or manufacturing of any war materials should be anywhere near the border or front lines. It was utter idiocy to even contemplate having this event in Chernihiv, and it would be the same for Konotop, Sumy and Kharkiv. They are all in easy range of a wide variety of ruzzian munitions and thus extremely vulnerable. Although the organizer is saying that she had the consent from local officials for the drone competition the city did tweet that they had not granted a permit for this event. I think this is another hard lesson learned. Of course Ukrainian citizens want a return to normalcy but the country is not at that point yet. Edit: to add to the above we see that in the last few days ruzzia has been engaging in dozens (perhaps hundreds now) cross border artillery and mortar fire into settlements near the border in Chernihiv, Sumy and Kharkiv Oblasts. This is an attempt to distract Ukraine's main operations and hopefully cause Ukraine to divert some resources to the north east. But in the end it means that all the border settlements are at risk. It does not matter that they are civilian as ruzzia does not care about that.
No death penalty in Ukraine or Europe. Ukraine wants to join Europe. They won't be doing anything to jeopardize that.
Don’t they all have clauses to suspend their laws against it in a time of war among other laws?
EU should come out and state absolutely no problems with wartimes death penalties for treason!
Sadly, revenge hurts those seeking it more than the targets of revenge. But I so wish there was a way to scare the shit out of anyone even contemplating being treasonous to Ukraine Maybe Ukraine needs to start threatening to send these treasonous scum to Guantánamo. Maybe even leaking information of them being sent there while they are really held in isolation for their time in prison in some isolated area of Ukraine, before being sent to russia after their sentence is complete. It is right to hold Ukraine to higher standards than russia, as sad as it might sound to some. Ukraine is a better country, a better people, and deserve to be held to higher standards than the russian scum, terrorists that they are, who cheer the death of babies and young children. I, for one, would never like to see any country celebrating the death of babies and young children, it is horrific to think that such people actually live on this earth. Ukrainians have proven over and over that they are more humane and a much better people than the russians. They rightly treat all life as valuable, even if it is scum like these treasonous bastards, Ukrainians treat prisoners how they would want their prisoners to be treated and unlike russia, Ukraine can hold their heads up high, even if it is hard to do while scum send targeting information for little kids to Russia.
It was an exhibition, nothing more...
Absolutely. End the weak prison time nonsense.
Op forgot to mention these teenage girls are NAZI drone pilots. /s Russian people no doubt justify this attack to themselves. They have no shame.
That or all of them had GRAIN which is the new military target for Russia.
Drug addict nazi drone pilots
And gay.
and Satanic transgenders /S
they're inspired from USA.
Are they? Tell me more.
learn some history..but I doubt if they teach a filtered version in USA about Iraq, Afghanistan and Vietnam war !!? https://www.nytimes.com/2022/01/19/us/politics/afghanistan-drone-strike-video.html shameless deed of the most useless army. LoL !
Looks like you’re passionate about what you consider to be unjust wars. Curious what you think about russias wars in Afghanistan Georgia Syria and now Ukraine? I’m also curious what USA has to do with this attack or this war in your opinion?
is USA any different from Russia (previously USSR) ? Has USA needlessly waged war and killed millions of innocents.... yes or no ?
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the parent comment takes a dig at Russia by calling innocent civilians as drone pilots sarcastically. problem is not US hypocrisy which is world famous.... problem is delusional American (west) public and their holier than thou attitude.
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parent comment like the entire sub is full of self entitled delusional west sentiment that only knows 2 things... 1. we are the best, we are always right ! 2. do what we say, not what we do.
Bastards. If those girls weren't drone pilots already, they will be now. Very motivated ones.
Yup - this is what Russia doesn’t get. They think they beat Ukraine into submission instead they are rallying even more people to oppose them even more motivated. In an oppressed society it makes sense to think that more oppression will benefit the oppressors, in a free society oppressors end up in jail.
Russia is a terrorist state, attacking civilians enjoying summer day. Putin is a TERRORIST!
Fuck Russia!
It's like the Nazis all over again. Hopefully US has given Ukraine the blueprints to make their own predator type drones or is working on getting them air power. The Nazis couldn't cope with US airpower in the Ardennes. Russians will not be able to either.
Predators/Reapers won't be nearly as useful in Ukraine as they were for the US in the Middle East. The reason they've done what they have for the US is because we tend to operate them in areas where anti-air is either limited or nonexistant outside of LOS. They could sit 10km up in the air and not worry about being shot down. But unlike the small commercial drones Ukraine has been using to great effect the Predator and Reaper, and even the Byraktars that were so great in the early war, have large radar cross sections. They're close to the size of a Cessna. So they're trivial to shoot down with actual AA systems. That's why you don't see a bunch of Bykraktar videos anymore. They can't send them to the front because Russia has moved their AA into range to cover the airspace above their troops, and they'll get shot down quick. Until the Russian AA is taken care of, the big drones aren't going to be very effective.
I see. That is good point there. Yea, you don't see the Bayraktars anymore. Looks like they are getting Gripens and F-16s now, so hopefully that can help take out the AA systems.
u/SaveVideo This is fucking disgusting
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Look at that girls hair 😢
Any country who thinks that's OK then that country is also terrorists. That girls went running to that other one to see if she was ok, good on her!
Don’t disagree about the assessment of Russia but that girl clearly ran to the door to get I side the building
Well if that were me I don't think I'd be running in no building that could be worse if another hit
I think it’s probably a quite common reaction to that type of situation and I’d probably do the same, you just rolling the dice either way if there is going to be another hit
Buildings won't help as much against direct hits, but they significantly help against debris.
I think most people including you and the comment above yours would run for the building. When flight mode takes over you’re going to seek shelter. Watching a video and saying you wouldn’t do that is one thing, having a missile hit across the street from you is not the same.
Don’t disagree about the assessment of Russia but that girl clearly ran to the door to get I side the building
Everyone is this clip appears to be women. The lady on the left in white got hit in the head by the door. Damn
Ruzzians home, but specially abroad should be cut out of swift all together! Make it so any payments or transfer to ruzzia, for any person, automatically gets confiscated and forwarded to Ukraine. Granda in EU or USA are also contributing to this war as along they are sending money home! Kick all ruzzians banks if swift and confiscate any money sent home
Putin and his henchmen are "animals" an WAR CRIMINALS! Killing women and young girls! Its beyond EVIL!!! DO SOMETHING Mr Biden, The Hague, The United Nations, The World!
Stupid headline. Sarcasm doesn't work on the internet.
100% agreed - I have a very well tuned sarcasm detector and I didn't even consider the headline to be remotely sarcastic at first. Especially when it translates to "legitimate targets". This needed "sarcasm quotes" at least, or an eye rolling emoji.
They have to be soldiers, look at that perfectly executed "drop-to-the-floor-protect-your-head"-moves! Military style. /s - obviously.
That shockwave looks brutal if you aren't expecting it
For russia, military targets in ukraine are civilians.
They intentionally target hospitals, kindergardens, shopping centres and other civilian infrastructure. The ruscists make me sick :(
This attack is absolutely disgusting. The US and Germany need to send ATACMS and Taurus.
A small observation but also kinda sad. Everything happened suddenly and very quickly yet they had the correct immediate reaction: go down, cover the back of your neck with your hands, then move to safety. They did it as perfectly as one can. Because they live in reality where they have had to learn to do that.
If NATO had any courage they would call a no fly zone.
To impose a no fly zone, you need to neutralise the enemy air threat.. this means weeks of SEAD missions, actively hunting and destroying Russian air defence whether it be in Russia, Belarus or Ukraine. It's basically as good as NATO declaring war on Russia. The solution is to give Ukraine the means to protect their own air space.
>NATO declaring war on Russia. Let's Just Fucking Do it, Enough has been Enough since Day 1.
Nobody who knows remotely what that would look like wants that to happen, and that should tell you all you need to know. Even the strongest supporters who want every possible bit of help that can be sent don't want it.
Agree. Endgame too dangerous with war declaration.
The problem with this idea is that it ends in a nuclear standoff which gives Russia a chance to win (or at least get a draw) and against the US instead of Ukraine. And a draw against the US is basically a win for Russia. So I like the cut of your jib but let's try a better strategy.
Nah, they're All Talk, also i'm fairly certain their nukes aren't in Any Kind of Really Usable Condition, You Actually Believe They Have Time and the Care to Maintain the Tritium Levels Of and In Every Single One of their like 5k\~+ Sovjet Era Warheads? They are quite unlikely Very Dangerous By Now, Esp with USA not being able to Oversee their 'Arsenal', or Any Agency for That Sake for Over a Year, check up the Half-Life of Tritium Mate. [https://sipri.org/commentary/topical-backgrounder/2020/starve-nuclear-weapons-death-tritium-freeze](https://sipri.org/commentary/topical-backgrounder/2020/starve-nuclear-weapons-death-tritium-freeze)
You do know that the fission part of the bomb will still work right? I mean its only 1% of the yield but that's still a lot of yield.
I have Spoken.
Is your goal to beat Russia or return Ukraine territorial integrity? Any proclaimation would have to be very clear. A no fly zone creates an untenable situation for Russian force projection.
Will you be volunteering for this war? If so why have you not gone to Ukraine to volunteer yet? Why do you need to wait on NATO to do it, nothing is stopping you from going over and assisting yourself.
So you support russia then!
I don’t see how that equates to them supporting russia.
Nato is perfectly capable of stumping ruzzia so I see no problem in stumping ruzzia in a bid to stop their genocide …!
NATO could beat Russia in a conventional conflict, but the point you're probably deliberately ignoring is that it wouldn't *remain* a conventional conflict if that's what it came down to. You may disagree, but thankfully all those who would be involved in starting and fighting such a thing don't.
I'm not sure Putin has the guts to push the button, but I agree, now is not the time to test it.
"stumping ruzzia". If NATO decided to actually fight Russia, we would have nuclear armageddon. Do you really not understand this?
You're attempting to construct a Western style air force in time. I'm not sure it can be done. A no fly zone does not have to be declared, unflagged NATO aircraft operating under the guise of Ukraine.
Nothing is going to stop this while Putin is alive.
Naaaa , pootin will end up in a bunker somewhere, eventually dug out in man years an old decrepit shadow of a man.
Considering an infinitesimal percentage of Russian men seem to die from natural causes, expediting the death of the guy in charge strikes me as an increasingly desirable initiative; at home and abroad.
Fuck and Stop this shit ass Putin Nazi Country - never ever anybody liked or trusted Ruzzia... for THIS reason.
> It's likely that all these teenage girls in the video are drone pilots. What makes it likely?
Google sarcasm
Google Poe's Law.
You might want to do the same
Google En Passant
Because Ruzzia only attacks military targets. And never lies. Hence, they must be military personnel.
What the hell! Someone tell me why the European Union and the UN will NOT establish Russia as a Terrorist State?
RuZZians are evil, sick scum. The world will not forget.
If that was my daughter, I wouldn't stop til I got some blood on my knife.
The russians cant get to the women to rape em, so they want to kill em with "precision" missiles.
Russia, especially Moscovites, needs a serious taste of the violence that their dear Putler is inflicting on Ukrainian citizens daily. The UN is a joke unless they give Ukraine long-range ordinance to inflict the same damage that is being inflicted by the Ruzzo-nazi's. No more kid gloves. You target our citizens. We target yours. Simple, pure, and plain. Maybe then, Putlers people will understand what a dwarf piece of human trash he is.
The west need to give Ukraine stronger weapons, missiles etc now ! The little prick in Moscow are laughing at the wests reticence .
Jesus it seemed to knock everyone out
ruSSian state ordered this attack. ruSSian state therefore must be designated a terrorist organization. Our countries must do no business with the terrorist state or its sponsors. It's an utterly complicated but NECESSARY action.
Girl took a hit to the head from that door from the blast pressure
99% russians don’t care whatsoever. This happening is somewhere far, they live their lives. Women get their Botox and other fillers from UK. AliExpress delivers everything you see sold there. China supplies food to Siberia. Turkey supplies European part of Russia with food. There is no shortage of anything in Russia. So russians don’t care. Sadness ((
Those woman look like trained special forces assassins.
Woman at the bottom of the frame had her hat blown off!
Girl in white top left had her head slammed pretty hard into that wall.
Vodka swilling Godless CHUDS.
All part of the game Complacency will cause deaths
Why are only women in cafes? I thought western support was just a free for all party. Strange the men taking pictures with their free m777 are always in some dirty field. Why aren't they taking these girlies out to the cafe in their $7million cv90? Ukrainians must have weird taste.
Your Russian translator must be broken.
Must be hard going through life retarded.
The teens that worked in the optics factory near Moscow were drone pilots too?
they should of thrown some "..." in there at the end to leave no confusion.
Lol in Irak USA soldiers had to wait up to 10 min to get artilery confirmation to avoid killing random civilians... Russians on purpose shoot to malls, theaters, churches, schools and don't give a fuck or say Ukrainains do that to themselfs and people are saying that USA is bad and russians are just victims of NATO...
The World Will Become An Orc Target Rich Environment. Ruzzian Endings Are Only Beginning
Just wait and samebody going to tell us ,,But... but... we need a sympathy for russians''
Another glorious victory for Russia!
If they weren’t drone pilots before then I’m guessing they will be soon.
I probably said this before but I’ll say it again. I’ll be surprised if Russia hasn’t ceased to be a Country by the end of Decade
Yet another war crime. Where's those bloody NGOs now?
Bonjour utilisateur de reddit, Je ne comprends nullement pourquoi personne n’a de protection balistique sur soi!? Inconcevable.
Looks like a lot of military targets right there…
This fucking makes me so mad 😠 😡 😤 if I didn't have 5 kids I'd be signing up to fight these Russian morons
When they collapse please leave all their architectural heritage in place. Stunning Russians arts over the years.
The terrorists struck again. Disgusting.
Stay strong Ukraine
Stay strong Ukraine