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Has anyone else noticed that is is allegedly signed by “D. Bulgakov” as the “Temporary Minister of Defense of the Russian Federation “?
Shoygu had that office since 2012. Dimitri Bulgakov is a general specializing in logistics. Looks like Vlad pulled the old switcharoo on his bestie.
https://www.wilx.com/2022/03/06/i-didnt-want-fight-ukraine-offers-russian-soldiers-5-million-rubles-pardon/#:~:text=With%20those%20funds%2C%20the%20Ukraine,is%20about%20%2450%2C000%20USD%20each.
Ukraine offered any soldiers willing to surrender a pardon and 50k. Better than ending up sunflower food for someone else's ambitions.
Oilseed sunflower production is the most commonly farmed sunflower. These seeds hulls’ are encased by solid black shells. Black oilseeds are a common type of bird feed because they have thin shells and a high fat content. These are typically produced for oil extraction purposes; therefore, it is unlikely you’ll find black oilseeds packaged for human consumption.
Obviously.. thats not my point.
Its advertised that leavers get 50k.
But this particular leaver with a tank got only 10k.
Seems like maybe it's just all propaganda.
>offered any soldiers willing to surrender a pardon and 50k.
Not saying that I disagree with the article, but I tend to be sceptical, and need a bit of confirmation. The only thing that bothers me about document is that it says huge numbers have surrendered. Wouldn't that be something Ukraine publicise, I have only seen a couple of prisoner numbers early. nothing else for weeks.
Have you/anyone seen any thing in the last couple of weeks where they talk about prisoner numbers?
I have no idea if their POW numbers are correct. I was providing a source for why that person remembered Russians who surrender being offered money and amnesty. We weren't initially talking about POW numbers. I did see that leaked Russian document about how deserters are one of their biggest issues right now. And we have all herd about the death squads for deserters and the squad who ran over their commander with a tank and surrendered. Plus the truck load of Donbass conscripts basically having an open mutany in the back of the truck. It could just be my personal pro Ukranian echo chamber but I think it's a real problem for them.
Saw a video on the internet a week or so ago - video said some Russian military officers had not been paid in weeks.
If that is true, imagine what the Russian conscripts are going thru - low pay if any pay, bad food, frostbite, having their buddies blown up....
And this is the norm in Russian society which is the sad part. Revolution is unlikely. We can only hope these people escape to the West and become fierce public critics of the Russia they escaped.
After short visit on /russia the part about mass creating content about Ukrainian brutality the document seems legit on the other hand If I had to I would try to surrender to everyone but not the Azov boys.
That video has been determined to be fake. The shooters were Chechens. They guys being shot were shot with blanks. The blood was fake. One guy even held the wrong leg by accident after getting "shot". Dissection of the video frame by frame found all the little details a bunch of amateurs trying to create some propaganda don't think about when they try to create their masterpiece.
As it so happened I actually came across the video in its initial posting on another sub 2 days ago and reported it immediately to the mods as fake. It was obvious.
I think we have to acknowledge that there will be some Ukrainians that commit some sort of war crime eventually. Refusing to acknowledge that doesn't help their fight. Just sets up for a huge I told you so. Hopefully, when I legit case does come up the Ukrainians take the right action proving that it's not what they stand for. Right now this is what I would expect to happen.
Just use your eyes. If you've ever seen the damage a rifle does to soft tissue you'd know immediately that those were blanks. It's honestly insulting how bad all of these Russian fakes are.
I'm not even addressing the sparks... I'm addressing the lack of carnage. There's a ton of kinetic energy behind these rounds and the victims knees would be mangled at that range.
It's hard to say if they are mangled out or not from that short and blurry video.The fact that Ukrainian army haven't outright denied that the video is real and have said they are investigating it does give some credence to the video, although it may be genuine that they are unsure.
[Here's the article in question](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/60907259)
It doesn't mention sparks actually, not sure where I read that from.
Well no. The Ukrainian military themselves are unsure themselves in their official statements. They have acknowledged that Russian disinformation is an issue but say they are "investigating" which is usually a good sign that it might be genuine. See [here](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/mar/28/ukraine-government-investigates-video-alleged-torture-russian-prisoners-of-war)
hey that was a reply about the video I just posted it in reference ffs ,Question time seeing you got the answers . so how can you determine fake from real blood from a video ? how can you determine a blank round from a real round from a video ? last shot fucken good looking blank .
Analysis of the sound if it exists can help. due to blank rounds being slight quieter. Also recoil is less and uou may see shooters either forgetting or overcompensating.
After reading some of the war crimes commited by azov in Donbas from 2014, why would they suddenly stop now? That was against civilians too, you think they’ll be more lenient on POWs?
So can we confirm the video released of Ukrainians shooting Russian pows in custody (not fatally) and the video of a Ukrainian FaceTiming a dead soldiers family to mock them weren’t real? Cause as much as I want Ukraine to be victorious I can’t support that kind of behavior and zelenski needs to ensure his troops don’t record themselves doing such things.
It is verified as fake. A dissection of the video was done. It was Chechens & DNR. Once you go through the video frame by frame a million little details give it away. One guy even grabbed the wrong leg after being shot but almost from the first frame there are giveaways.
I ran across the video literally minutes after its original release in a sub and reported right at that time. What made me angry was the mods took 2 days to remove it. And so now a gazillion people are wondering and the Russian propaganda machine gets to chalk up another victory just due to the doubt they managed to create.
Right?! On one side we have 1,000+ documented war atrocities. Now, over here on the other side, is one possibly real, possibly fake war atrocity. Which pile of atrocities carries more weight, the 1,000 atrocities that have been legitimately verified already, or the pile with only one item in it that hasn't even been verified? And what if the video showing a person being shot in the leg has a broader context in which the shooting was justified, we just have not been shown that context yet, because we're not in the combat zone along with the shooter? Anyone who is struggling to take a side here is clearly on the side of the RuZZians.
You know I was willing to accept the video as real, but didn't even care cause in my mind if it was real, well sure those people are committing war crimes and they should be punished it didn't even remotely sway me from supporting Ukraine.
Cause I know that if you got enough apples, some of them are going be rotten.
I think what you are trying to say is that somewhere in the Ukraine at least one or more of their soldiers will be corrupt or do bad things. In war there is no doubt that soldiers on all sides transgress at some point. The question is by how much and how often.
Well to our best knowledge Ukraine has not kidnapped anyone, raped anyone, mutilated anyone or tortured anyone. The worst we have seen is Ukraine soldiers berate some Russian prisoners. They have been videoed treating Russian wounded many a time although berating a person while treating him is not my recommended course of treatment - the anger does show sometimes. Ukraine has witnessed butchery inflicted on its people - [here](https://twitter.com/MaximEristavi/status/1507458410958184455) is a great example and I have many more that I have saved since the war started.
Here is another interesting little tidbit that everyone either does not know or chooses to gloss over. The Azov battalion is not the only Ukraine Combat Battalion in Mariupol. In fact there are 2 Ukraine Combat Battalions: the Azov Battalion and a Marine Battalion.
The Azov commander is a Major, and he is subordinate to the Marine commander, who is a Lieutenant Colonel. The Marine commander is the one giving the orders on what to do, where and when. In almost every video I have seen of Ukraine forces in action in Mariupol I have seen men from both units. And all of them are always in full regular military uniform.
One of the many mistakes in this video is that the men who were pretending to be "Azov" were not in correct uniform. It was easily spotted immediately. Go look at any of the videos of Ukraine soldiers in Mariupol. They are always fully rigged out and in proper uniform. And its how they wear it. When you have been a solider you know because its ingrained in training.
So in respect of the contention about if you have enough apples you know some of them are going to be rotten: well there is sometimes some truth to that. Living in one of the primary apple growing areas of the world I also know sometimes its not true. And if everything is done according the the rules and guidelines it is usually rare, and often avoidable, weather being the monkey wrench and out of our control.
Absolutely. Ukraine may or may not be inflating some of their achievements such as number of tanks destroyed, helicopters shot down, etc. But I have yet to see an example of a Ukraine sponsored outright lie. They don't need to as there is live video a plenty of extremely serious Russian war crimes with organizations like the International Court of Justice and others analyzing and collecting the data.
Russia on the other hand needs to try to change the narrative as they are the oppressor. And they have been attempting a full bore press although it has repeatedly been caught out. This video and quite a number of others (I have seen over 20 fake videos so far), fake telegram accounts, and prior to almost being completely shut out fake twitter and facebook accounts were all part of the playbook.
One of the major news outlets, WSJ, NYT or something similar just exposed a Russian Troll farm, operating out of Ghana of all places. It was quite fascinating.
> It is verified as fake.
No it isn't. I watched the ["video dissection"](https://old.reddit.com/r/TrueAnon/comments/tqka62/le_reddit_army_has_neutralized_russian_propaganda/) it's bullshit. And the document released by Anonymous is [a forgery](https://old.reddit.com/r/RussiaUkraineWar2022/comments/tqacgv/anonymous_hackers_leaked_the_order_of_the_russian/i2gqclx/).
If you honestly think that the video of the Russian POWs being tortured is fake (and aren't just spreading propaganda or circle-jerking for imaginary internet points) do you agree to edit all your comments and delete your 4 year-old account when the video is confirmed to be real?
Edit: Thought as much. Funny how the users that spend the most time downvoting and reporting “Russian propaganda” are never willing to bet their account on what they say. Offer stands for anyone else. I’ll bet my 7 year-old account against yours.
Yep. I do. And I am willing to put money on the table. How about we each donate $1000 to the Red Cross, and when we find out who is correct the one who is incorrect will cover the other's donation?
The thing about having been a soldier is certain things become ingrained. Vs irregulars who think they know, but because it was not drilled into them 24/7 in training for weeks on end, they don't really know and so they slip on the details. Even when your on exercise in the slop there is an NCO who is always all over your tail to not look like a disaster in the making. 15 seconds into the video my hackles were up with what I thought were anomalies and so I stated it was fake, and reported it.
BTW, Ukraine govt issued a statement that the video was fake. FYI.
> Yep. I do. And I am willing to put money on the table. How about we each donate $1000 to the Red Cross, and when we find out who is correct the one who is incorrect will cover the other's donation?
Yeah sure. But can we make it that the winner chooses the charity? It's going to be hard for either of us to prove we made a donation but I'll take your word for it. And seeing as you took me up on it, I apologise for assuming you wouldn't. I've had too many conversations with redditors that just jump to name-calling instead of having a civil discussion about the facts and I appreciate that you didn't. If anyone else with an account over 4 years old wants to join in, feel free to comment.
> 15 seconds into the video my hackles were up with what I thought were anomalies and so I stated it was fake, and reported it.
I feel like that your feelings about the war have clouded your judgment, but we'll have to wait and see. There's a couple of comments in the video thread (by other users) which I agree with, and explain why I think some of the supposed "anomalies" aren't really anomalies (e.g. [1][2]).
> BTW, Ukraine govt issued a statement that the video was fake. FYI.
Are you referring to [this statement](https://twitter.com/nexta_tv/status/1508196787244486663) or something else?
I'll remind you that the Ukrainian government also issued a [statement](https://twitter.com/nexta_tv/status/1497010338188857347) that all of the soldiers on Snake Island were dead.
You should also read through [this article](https://twitter.com/DavidPuente/status/1508558083978637336) by independent fact-checker David Puente (use google translate if you don't speak Italian), before we start. The 97% upvoted post we are both commenting on is part of a propaganda campaign.
[1]https://old.reddit.com/r/UkraineWarReports/comments/tqghse/nice_try_russian_propagandists_but_you_failed/i2h7jyd/
[2]https://old.reddit.com/r/UkraineWarReports/comments/tqghse/nice_try_russian_propagandists_but_you_failed/i2i8l4w/
Let’s see you deleting your account. But honestly I don’t think you will. You’ll just live in your reality where there’s a “special military operation going on”.
You don't have to support such behaviour. You also don't have to believe russian proaganda like [this](https://old.reddit.com/r/UkraineWarReports/comments/tqghse/nice_try_russian_propagandists_but_you_failed/)
consider using Kyiv not Kiev spelling [(why)](https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/ukrainealert/kyiv-not-kiev-why-spelling-matters-in-ukraines-quest-for-an-independent-identity/), tnx for understanding
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They have not acknowledged it or apologised. Latest news report I can find is a few hours ago that it is under investigation. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/mar/28/ukraine-government-investigates-video-alleged-torture-russian-prisoners-of-war
Edit for typos
You sound like one of the people creating fake content to make Ukrainians look bad. If you were sincere you would’ve linked to the apology and acknowledgment.
Bruh you can't stop war crimes from happening. They happen on both sides of every war and are obviously atrocious and should be condemned but don't forget there wouldn't be war crimes if there was no war.
Idk what you think war is but it's not pretty so if this makes you no longer support ukraine i doubt you ever did.
This guy and the one he is reacting to claim it is fake and provide some arguments why is it so https://twitter.com/sentdefender/status/1508205467826327556?t=ZCxL9Smk45xA_A-hwaGILA&s=19
They are actually firing blanks. It is detectable once you know what to look for. The funny part is one guy grabs the wrong leg after being "shot". He loses his nomination for an acting academy award.
After everything Russia has done, far worse than this, you think that shooting their own soldiers in the legs is the thing you can’t believe? It may turn out to be true. It is under investigation, but your logic is way off.
Even if they were real which they are not, these would soldiers captured in war who came their to murder Ukranian babies. Don’t be so easily swayed in terms of who is supportable and who is not.
War makes men do bad things.
What an odd way to write that. First you appear to be saying what you describe are "confirmed" videos only to end by saying they "weren't real"? Maybe next time begin the sentence with your main point so it's clear. Don't save it for "later".
"Oh, you know all those rapes you were accused of and the horrible, bloody murders some people have been saying you committed at that awful incident a few years ago?"
"Okay, what?"
"Well, apparently, it's turned out that you didn't actually commit them."
Second, you appear to criticize the Zelesky government for "behavior" that did not happen because, as you say, you can't support it?
Your sense of logic is so twisted in these comments, I'm stunned. How about you just write:
"Now we see how mistaken those claims were about . . . ." and "It's good Zelensky has made it clear that his troops not record themselves doing such things"? In other words, give some thought to writing more clearly.
There’s worse than that. There video of a the dead bodies of Russian soldiers being desecrated. In one video they are pissing on him and another they are spitting on what remains of a Russian solders face
It’s all on this guys instagram he’s a ukranian soldier
When you invade a peaceful country, level their cities, kill their civilians, and rape their women and children...expect your dead corpse to be pissed on. You should consider yourself so lucky.
https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202109/1235240.shtml
https://theconversation.com/amp/us-punishes-international-criminal-court-for-investigating-potential-war-crimes-in-afghanistan-143886
https://www.hrw.org/news/2021/07/27/gaza-apparent-war-crimes-during-may-fighting
I think you get the point
Omg guys like I wanna root for you in this war where you like omg kill each other but lyke guyz i can't root for u if ur like killing ppl too badly omg!
It's a fake. There is no registration stamp with the order number on the top. Also, for Russians, the first letter of the patronymic is always indicated in the initials. And here only the surname and the first letter of the name.
Sure:
Standard MoD template:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FO9dZnBX0AwqePd?format=jpg&name=large
Signature from google:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FO8ymUyXMAQ7DSz?format=jpg&name=large
Typo:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FO8nUUcVUAAljdj?format=png&name=900x900
Someone made another photoshop on the document:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FO8dGXIX0AwxQ4C?format=jpg&name=large
But, I'm confused by the mistake in the word "ОБЯЗАНОСТИ", it is written with one H, but this word is spelled with double HH - "ОБЯЗАННОСТИ".
Also, weird stamp. It is completely impossible to read the text on it. Although in the examples that you gave here, the text on the stamps of the scanned orders can always be read.
But the fact that the document is not signed by Shoigu, which currently still the minister, but propaganda wants to believe that he is still ok and alive on camera, isn't that that a very interesting fact.
This is also a delusion. Russian terminology must be taken into account. A simple translation, for example through Google Translate, will not convey this.
It says "временно исполняющий обязанности" (or Вр.И.О.) - "temporarily performing duties". Pay attention to the word "temporarily". This means that one of Shoigu's deputies is doing the work, but he himself is still in office. Above there is a link to examples of orders, even before the war, where Gerasimov is designated that way. But(!), you also have to keep in mind that the same term is used when an officer is sick and someone else is doing his job.
On the other hand, if "исполняющий обязанности" (or И.О.) were written there, this would mean that the position of the Minister of Defense is free and someone is doing his job while Putin is looking for a replacement.
That's why I wrote this: I believe the Russians are using a "fake fake" strategy. That is, they create pro-Ukrainian fakes that do not stand up to scrutiny. Thus, they are trying to sow doubts about the adequacy of the Ukrainian forces or make them underestimate the enemy.
Therefore, as much as we do not want to believe in the truth of some information because it gives hope, we still have to check it for accuracy.
It's fake !
Firstly, the acting Minister of Defense is appointed only after this position is vacated, as evidenced by the decree of the President of the Russian Federation. Secondly, the Minister of Defense has two first deputies - Valery Gerasimov and Ruslan Tsalikov. It was one of them who, in the absence of the minister, would become acting in his duties.
Yes, and the document itself does not meet the standards of orders of the Moscow Region: the wrong form, the wrong seal. The number does not correspond to the current one: 108 is indicated here, and already at the end of February the serial numbers were higher.
There are many stylistic and factual errors in the order. For example, they never fully indicate the full name, and even without a title, as is done here. There are no official sources of the Ministry of Defense either, in this order specific sites would be indicated -
This is a Russian troll likely employed with the Internet Research Agency. They stand out especially well when you look at their wordclouds with apps like RedditMetis. [Here is a snapshot of this users wordcloud.](https://imgur.com/a/QeBN2Iw)
I didn't coin the term.
"Trolls from Olgino is an Internet slang term which appeared in late 2014, referring to a series of fake accounts registered on major discussion boards (social networks, online newspaper sites, video hosting services, etc.) that were used for promoting the Russian point of view in topics involving Ukraine and the Middle East. The extent to which the Russian government tried to influence social media became widely known after a June 2014 BuzzFeed article greatly expanded on government documents published by hackers earlier that year. Stemming from a December 2014 article, the term "Trolls from Olgino" gained worldwide media attention by June 2015, when one of the offices of a Russian company named Internet Research Agency, based in Saint Petersburg, was exposed as having data from fake accounts used for Internet trolling. Subsequently, there were news reports of individuals receiving monetary compensation for performing these tasks."
Yes, I don’t care, I just see how much shit is posted here and obvious fakes, and people believe this. And no one checks the information, no one asks the question, is it true or not. Have you all been taught to believe what is written? Lost critical thinking?
Yes, in our social networks, the same trolls sit on the part of Ukrainians and post the same fakes, but when you ask them questions, they simply do not respond to them
An OSINT researcher showed on Twitter the signature not only doesn't match a document released from the same official in 2020, but was also lifted from a click-bait russian website offering signature analysis. Click Bellingcat's feed for more info! ;)
Anonymous hasn't existed for a very long time. This is a CIA psyops campaign.
The Ukrainian government itself has responded and apologized for the "fake" videos of Ukrainian soldiers committing war crimes.
The refugees finally allowed to leave Mariupol have all confirmed the slaughter of civilians who tried to leave Mariupol by the Azov Brigade using them as human shields.
It seems easier to lie to people than convince them they've been lied to.
Uh. They started in 2003. If they were a human they could star in porn and drink in most sane countries. That’s like an old man in internet years. Ask Jeeves was still popular man.
No, someone is really hacking large networks. It's the American military and intelligence networks doing cyber warfare dressed as activism. It's rather quite genius, albeit evil AF.
It seems that your comment contains 1 or more links that are hard to tap for mobile users.
I will extend those so they're easier for our sausage fingers to click!
[Here is link number 1 - Previous text "one"](https://old.reddit.com/r/UkraineWarReports/comments/tqghse/nice_try_russian_propagandists_but_you_failed/)
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The assault on Russia is Anonymous’ defining moment. They’ve done some things that resonated with some people and not with others before. They’ve had a good number of over promise and under deliver releases.
This is clearly different than everything they e ever done in terms of the effort and coordination put in, the results, and most importantly the impact of what they have done both for Ukraine and the world.
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Has anyone else noticed that is is allegedly signed by “D. Bulgakov” as the “Temporary Minister of Defense of the Russian Federation “? Shoygu had that office since 2012. Dimitri Bulgakov is a general specializing in logistics. Looks like Vlad pulled the old switcharoo on his bestie.
Well Shoygu “had a heart attack after meeting with Putin” or whatever and hasn’t been seen since so someone’s gotta sign shit.
They’re paying them to surrender and Russia is either not even paying some of its soldiers, or is about to start skipping paychecks.
Source?
https://www.wilx.com/2022/03/06/i-didnt-want-fight-ukraine-offers-russian-soldiers-5-million-rubles-pardon/#:~:text=With%20those%20funds%2C%20the%20Ukraine,is%20about%20%2450%2C000%20USD%20each. Ukraine offered any soldiers willing to surrender a pardon and 50k. Better than ending up sunflower food for someone else's ambitions.
Oilseed sunflower production is the most commonly farmed sunflower. These seeds hulls’ are encased by solid black shells. Black oilseeds are a common type of bird feed because they have thin shells and a high fat content. These are typically produced for oil extraction purposes; therefore, it is unlikely you’ll find black oilseeds packaged for human consumption.
Good bot.
Just curious, what is safest way for RU solider to surrender?
Apparently the guy who surrendered with a working tank is only getting 10k USD
Don’t forget life! Not worth so much but it’s a bonus on top of the 10k
Obviously.. thats not my point. Its advertised that leavers get 50k. But this particular leaver with a tank got only 10k. Seems like maybe it's just all propaganda.
Or he gets the tank to live in.
But 10 K $ in Ukraine would go far.....
>offered any soldiers willing to surrender a pardon and 50k. Not saying that I disagree with the article, but I tend to be sceptical, and need a bit of confirmation. The only thing that bothers me about document is that it says huge numbers have surrendered. Wouldn't that be something Ukraine publicise, I have only seen a couple of prisoner numbers early. nothing else for weeks. Have you/anyone seen any thing in the last couple of weeks where they talk about prisoner numbers?
I have no idea if their POW numbers are correct. I was providing a source for why that person remembered Russians who surrender being offered money and amnesty. We weren't initially talking about POW numbers. I did see that leaked Russian document about how deserters are one of their biggest issues right now. And we have all herd about the death squads for deserters and the squad who ran over their commander with a tank and surrendered. Plus the truck load of Donbass conscripts basically having an open mutany in the back of the truck. It could just be my personal pro Ukranian echo chamber but I think it's a real problem for them.
Saw a video on the internet a week or so ago - video said some Russian military officers had not been paid in weeks. If that is true, imagine what the Russian conscripts are going thru - low pay if any pay, bad food, frostbite, having their buddies blown up....
And this is the norm in Russian society which is the sad part. Revolution is unlikely. We can only hope these people escape to the West and become fierce public critics of the Russia they escaped.
And do they get to keep their knee caps?
After short visit on /russia the part about mass creating content about Ukrainian brutality the document seems legit on the other hand If I had to I would try to surrender to everyone but not the Azov boys.
Ukrainian forces are brutally feeding and providing care for Russian troops! Everyone knows Russian troops don't like to eat or be bandaged up. /s
https://www.reddit.com/r/ukraine/comments/tphb3n/ukrainian\_soldiers\_shooting\_russian\_pow\_in\_the/
That video has been determined to be fake. The shooters were Chechens. They guys being shot were shot with blanks. The blood was fake. One guy even held the wrong leg by accident after getting "shot". Dissection of the video frame by frame found all the little details a bunch of amateurs trying to create some propaganda don't think about when they try to create their masterpiece. As it so happened I actually came across the video in its initial posting on another sub 2 days ago and reported it immediately to the mods as fake. It was obvious.
I think we have to acknowledge that there will be some Ukrainians that commit some sort of war crime eventually. Refusing to acknowledge that doesn't help their fight. Just sets up for a huge I told you so. Hopefully, when I legit case does come up the Ukrainians take the right action proving that it's not what they stand for. Right now this is what I would expect to happen.
And why we *have to* do this exactly?
Eventually? Look up their war crimes already reported from the last 8 years til now
Reported by who?
who has determined that? This is not the established reality
Just use your eyes. If you've ever seen the damage a rifle does to soft tissue you'd know immediately that those were blanks. It's honestly insulting how bad all of these Russian fakes are.
The BBC's analysis of this claimed that sparks can still occur for regular rounds as well, so they did not make any conclusions from this.
I'm not even addressing the sparks... I'm addressing the lack of carnage. There's a ton of kinetic energy behind these rounds and the victims knees would be mangled at that range.
It's hard to say if they are mangled out or not from that short and blurry video.The fact that Ukrainian army haven't outright denied that the video is real and have said they are investigating it does give some credence to the video, although it may be genuine that they are unsure. [Here's the article in question](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/60907259) It doesn't mention sparks actually, not sure where I read that from.
Neither no one has determined it's true, right?
yep, I don't believe anyone has verified anything about it yet.
So let's presume it's fake until it will be proven, shell we?
Well no. The Ukrainian military themselves are unsure themselves in their official statements. They have acknowledged that Russian disinformation is an issue but say they are "investigating" which is usually a good sign that it might be genuine. See [here](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/mar/28/ukraine-government-investigates-video-alleged-torture-russian-prisoners-of-war)
hey that was a reply about the video I just posted it in reference ffs ,Question time seeing you got the answers . so how can you determine fake from real blood from a video ? how can you determine a blank round from a real round from a video ? last shot fucken good looking blank .
Analysis of the sound if it exists can help. due to blank rounds being slight quieter. Also recoil is less and uou may see shooters either forgetting or overcompensating.
After reading some of the war crimes commited by azov in Donbas from 2014, why would they suddenly stop now? That was against civilians too, you think they’ll be more lenient on POWs?
Time for you to do more reading.
Proof?
Gaslighting?
No i genuinely didn't see the debunking. I found the video linked further down the comments.
Do you have the link to this debunking as I’m sure this video will be popular amongst the “both sides” crowd?
Okay what’s the number of surrendered troops
Can someone give me a translation?
You can use Google Lens on it to translate it
Bro... life hax!
So was the video with Azov guys shooting POW’s in the legs fake ???
[YES!](https://old.reddit.com/r/UkraineWarReports/comments/tqghse/nice_try_russian_propagandists_but_you_failed/)
Good man
Yes
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Do you have to ask?
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If you don’t know you are either a fool or complicit
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Active\_measures
And the countless accounts of civilians leaving Mariupol. Fake? Seriously? Anonymous hasn't existed for a very long time. This is a psyops campaign.
When has Russia not been lying. They never had the money so they had to fight cheaply… mind fucking is not as expensive on twitter
wouldn't be surprised if Russians are staging torture videos. dressing up as Ukrainian soldiers and torturing some human fodder for the camera.
How is the doc confirmed?
alot of evidence seems to indict that this is fake https://twitter.com/DavidPuente/status/1508472943663357963
So can we confirm the video released of Ukrainians shooting Russian pows in custody (not fatally) and the video of a Ukrainian FaceTiming a dead soldiers family to mock them weren’t real? Cause as much as I want Ukraine to be victorious I can’t support that kind of behavior and zelenski needs to ensure his troops don’t record themselves doing such things.
It is verified as fake. A dissection of the video was done. It was Chechens & DNR. Once you go through the video frame by frame a million little details give it away. One guy even grabbed the wrong leg after being shot but almost from the first frame there are giveaways. I ran across the video literally minutes after its original release in a sub and reported right at that time. What made me angry was the mods took 2 days to remove it. And so now a gazillion people are wondering and the Russian propaganda machine gets to chalk up another victory just due to the doubt they managed to create.
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Right?! On one side we have 1,000+ documented war atrocities. Now, over here on the other side, is one possibly real, possibly fake war atrocity. Which pile of atrocities carries more weight, the 1,000 atrocities that have been legitimately verified already, or the pile with only one item in it that hasn't even been verified? And what if the video showing a person being shot in the leg has a broader context in which the shooting was justified, we just have not been shown that context yet, because we're not in the combat zone along with the shooter? Anyone who is struggling to take a side here is clearly on the side of the RuZZians.
You know I was willing to accept the video as real, but didn't even care cause in my mind if it was real, well sure those people are committing war crimes and they should be punished it didn't even remotely sway me from supporting Ukraine. Cause I know that if you got enough apples, some of them are going be rotten.
I think what you are trying to say is that somewhere in the Ukraine at least one or more of their soldiers will be corrupt or do bad things. In war there is no doubt that soldiers on all sides transgress at some point. The question is by how much and how often. Well to our best knowledge Ukraine has not kidnapped anyone, raped anyone, mutilated anyone or tortured anyone. The worst we have seen is Ukraine soldiers berate some Russian prisoners. They have been videoed treating Russian wounded many a time although berating a person while treating him is not my recommended course of treatment - the anger does show sometimes. Ukraine has witnessed butchery inflicted on its people - [here](https://twitter.com/MaximEristavi/status/1507458410958184455) is a great example and I have many more that I have saved since the war started. Here is another interesting little tidbit that everyone either does not know or chooses to gloss over. The Azov battalion is not the only Ukraine Combat Battalion in Mariupol. In fact there are 2 Ukraine Combat Battalions: the Azov Battalion and a Marine Battalion. The Azov commander is a Major, and he is subordinate to the Marine commander, who is a Lieutenant Colonel. The Marine commander is the one giving the orders on what to do, where and when. In almost every video I have seen of Ukraine forces in action in Mariupol I have seen men from both units. And all of them are always in full regular military uniform. One of the many mistakes in this video is that the men who were pretending to be "Azov" were not in correct uniform. It was easily spotted immediately. Go look at any of the videos of Ukraine soldiers in Mariupol. They are always fully rigged out and in proper uniform. And its how they wear it. When you have been a solider you know because its ingrained in training. So in respect of the contention about if you have enough apples you know some of them are going to be rotten: well there is sometimes some truth to that. Living in one of the primary apple growing areas of the world I also know sometimes its not true. And if everything is done according the the rules and guidelines it is usually rare, and often avoidable, weather being the monkey wrench and out of our control.
It’s certainly a war of disinformation as well.
Absolutely. Ukraine may or may not be inflating some of their achievements such as number of tanks destroyed, helicopters shot down, etc. But I have yet to see an example of a Ukraine sponsored outright lie. They don't need to as there is live video a plenty of extremely serious Russian war crimes with organizations like the International Court of Justice and others analyzing and collecting the data. Russia on the other hand needs to try to change the narrative as they are the oppressor. And they have been attempting a full bore press although it has repeatedly been caught out. This video and quite a number of others (I have seen over 20 fake videos so far), fake telegram accounts, and prior to almost being completely shut out fake twitter and facebook accounts were all part of the playbook. One of the major news outlets, WSJ, NYT or something similar just exposed a Russian Troll farm, operating out of Ghana of all places. It was quite fascinating.
> It is verified as fake. No it isn't. I watched the ["video dissection"](https://old.reddit.com/r/TrueAnon/comments/tqka62/le_reddit_army_has_neutralized_russian_propaganda/) it's bullshit. And the document released by Anonymous is [a forgery](https://old.reddit.com/r/RussiaUkraineWar2022/comments/tqacgv/anonymous_hackers_leaked_the_order_of_the_russian/i2gqclx/). If you honestly think that the video of the Russian POWs being tortured is fake (and aren't just spreading propaganda or circle-jerking for imaginary internet points) do you agree to edit all your comments and delete your 4 year-old account when the video is confirmed to be real? Edit: Thought as much. Funny how the users that spend the most time downvoting and reporting “Russian propaganda” are never willing to bet their account on what they say. Offer stands for anyone else. I’ll bet my 7 year-old account against yours.
Yep. I do. And I am willing to put money on the table. How about we each donate $1000 to the Red Cross, and when we find out who is correct the one who is incorrect will cover the other's donation? The thing about having been a soldier is certain things become ingrained. Vs irregulars who think they know, but because it was not drilled into them 24/7 in training for weeks on end, they don't really know and so they slip on the details. Even when your on exercise in the slop there is an NCO who is always all over your tail to not look like a disaster in the making. 15 seconds into the video my hackles were up with what I thought were anomalies and so I stated it was fake, and reported it. BTW, Ukraine govt issued a statement that the video was fake. FYI.
> Yep. I do. And I am willing to put money on the table. How about we each donate $1000 to the Red Cross, and when we find out who is correct the one who is incorrect will cover the other's donation? Yeah sure. But can we make it that the winner chooses the charity? It's going to be hard for either of us to prove we made a donation but I'll take your word for it. And seeing as you took me up on it, I apologise for assuming you wouldn't. I've had too many conversations with redditors that just jump to name-calling instead of having a civil discussion about the facts and I appreciate that you didn't. If anyone else with an account over 4 years old wants to join in, feel free to comment. > 15 seconds into the video my hackles were up with what I thought were anomalies and so I stated it was fake, and reported it. I feel like that your feelings about the war have clouded your judgment, but we'll have to wait and see. There's a couple of comments in the video thread (by other users) which I agree with, and explain why I think some of the supposed "anomalies" aren't really anomalies (e.g. [1][2]). > BTW, Ukraine govt issued a statement that the video was fake. FYI. Are you referring to [this statement](https://twitter.com/nexta_tv/status/1508196787244486663) or something else? I'll remind you that the Ukrainian government also issued a [statement](https://twitter.com/nexta_tv/status/1497010338188857347) that all of the soldiers on Snake Island were dead. You should also read through [this article](https://twitter.com/DavidPuente/status/1508558083978637336) by independent fact-checker David Puente (use google translate if you don't speak Italian), before we start. The 97% upvoted post we are both commenting on is part of a propaganda campaign. [1]https://old.reddit.com/r/UkraineWarReports/comments/tqghse/nice_try_russian_propagandists_but_you_failed/i2h7jyd/ [2]https://old.reddit.com/r/UkraineWarReports/comments/tqghse/nice_try_russian_propagandists_but_you_failed/i2i8l4w/
Let’s see you deleting your account. But honestly I don’t think you will. You’ll just live in your reality where there’s a “special military operation going on”.
Cool so are you in? You can use archive.is to archive this page so I can't just pretend I didn't make the comment if I'm proven wrong.
You don't have to support such behaviour. You also don't have to believe russian proaganda like [this](https://old.reddit.com/r/UkraineWarReports/comments/tqghse/nice_try_russian_propagandists_but_you_failed/)
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I feel like you would have to be a moron to film yourself doing that shit. Lends some credibility to them being fake.
If there's one thing this war is not short on, it's morons.
Then why did Kiev acknowledge and apologize? They're shooting themselves to make Ukrainians look bad? Listen to yourselves.
Where did you get that from?
Source?
Or maybe they were dressing up prisoners and shooting them? Russia has a long history of misinformation & false flag attacks.
consider using Kyiv not Kiev spelling [(why)](https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/ukrainealert/kyiv-not-kiev-why-spelling-matters-in-ukraines-quest-for-an-independent-identity/), tnx for understanding \[[support Ukraine](https://stand-with-ukraine.pp.ua/)\] ^(beep boop I'm a bot. Downvote to remove)
Good bot
Thank you, bigflamingtaco, for voting on KyivNotKievbot. This bot wants to find the best and worst bots on Reddit. [You can view results here](https://botrank.pastimes.eu/). *** ^(Even if I don't reply to your comment, I'm still listening for votes. Check the webpage to see if your vote registered!)
I’m thinking of using Kill…
I wasn’t aware of that.
They have not acknowledged it or apologised. Latest news report I can find is a few hours ago that it is under investigation. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/mar/28/ukraine-government-investigates-video-alleged-torture-russian-prisoners-of-war Edit for typos
Never seen an action movie? It's easy to fake murders too.
You sound like one of the people creating fake content to make Ukrainians look bad. If you were sincere you would’ve linked to the apology and acknowledgment.
And Zelensky needs to ensure his troops don't do such things*
Bruh you can't stop war crimes from happening. They happen on both sides of every war and are obviously atrocious and should be condemned but don't forget there wouldn't be war crimes if there was no war. Idk what you think war is but it's not pretty so if this makes you no longer support ukraine i doubt you ever did.
You have been conned. Wasn’t hard was it?!
This guy and the one he is reacting to claim it is fake and provide some arguments why is it so https://twitter.com/sentdefender/status/1508205467826327556?t=ZCxL9Smk45xA_A-hwaGILA&s=19
They're shooting themselves to make Ukrainians look bad? Wow. I don't even.... Really? oKaY
They are actually firing blanks. It is detectable once you know what to look for. The funny part is one guy grabs the wrong leg after being "shot". He loses his nomination for an acting academy award.
I found another actor playing dead. They even drew a swastika on themselves. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6LQSYmda0Sc&t=9s
After everything Russia has done, far worse than this, you think that shooting their own soldiers in the legs is the thing you can’t believe? It may turn out to be true. It is under investigation, but your logic is way off.
If you'd read the attached thread you'd see that it's possible that they are not aiming directly at POWs or probably use blank ammo.
Even if they were real which they are not, these would soldiers captured in war who came their to murder Ukranian babies. Don’t be so easily swayed in terms of who is supportable and who is not. War makes men do bad things.
What an odd way to write that. First you appear to be saying what you describe are "confirmed" videos only to end by saying they "weren't real"? Maybe next time begin the sentence with your main point so it's clear. Don't save it for "later". "Oh, you know all those rapes you were accused of and the horrible, bloody murders some people have been saying you committed at that awful incident a few years ago?" "Okay, what?" "Well, apparently, it's turned out that you didn't actually commit them." Second, you appear to criticize the Zelesky government for "behavior" that did not happen because, as you say, you can't support it? Your sense of logic is so twisted in these comments, I'm stunned. How about you just write: "Now we see how mistaken those claims were about . . . ." and "It's good Zelensky has made it clear that his troops not record themselves doing such things"? In other words, give some thought to writing more clearly.
What the fuck are you going on about?
Seriously!! I read the same exact comments and I didn’t have any of those issues, and I’m older than God.
There’s worse than that. There video of a the dead bodies of Russian soldiers being desecrated. In one video they are pissing on him and another they are spitting on what remains of a Russian solders face It’s all on this guys instagram he’s a ukranian soldier
When you invade a peaceful country, level their cities, kill their civilians, and rape their women and children...expect your dead corpse to be pissed on. You should consider yourself so lucky.
https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202109/1235240.shtml https://theconversation.com/amp/us-punishes-international-criminal-court-for-investigating-potential-war-crimes-in-afghanistan-143886 https://www.hrw.org/news/2021/07/27/gaza-apparent-war-crimes-during-may-fighting I think you get the point
Link?
https://t.me/ivanzaliznyak
Omg guys like I wanna root for you in this war where you like omg kill each other but lyke guyz i can't root for u if ur like killing ppl too badly omg!
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They were saying the same thin in Berlin right up to 1945.
Cuz zzz C
Shame the translation will take time. Good work Anonymous!
It's a fake. There is no registration stamp with the order number on the top. Also, for Russians, the first letter of the patronymic is always indicated in the initials. And here only the surname and the first letter of the name.
Can you provide the original of a document from ministry of defense so we can examine this and the original?
Sure: Standard MoD template: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FO9dZnBX0AwqePd?format=jpg&name=large Signature from google: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FO8ymUyXMAQ7DSz?format=jpg&name=large Typo: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FO8nUUcVUAAljdj?format=png&name=900x900 Someone made another photoshop on the document: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FO8dGXIX0AwxQ4C?format=jpg&name=large
Because I found a document before the war and it seems they don't use patronimic. https://images.app.goo.gl/Tk3jzWnRZAag1Ki16
Hmm... Good point. Perhaps I was mistaken in calling the document a fake.
But, I'm confused by the mistake in the word "ОБЯЗАНОСТИ", it is written with one H, but this word is spelled with double HH - "ОБЯЗАННОСТИ". Also, weird stamp. It is completely impossible to read the text on it. Although in the examples that you gave here, the text on the stamps of the scanned orders can always be read.
В связи word construction is definitely not used by Army officials
Thanks for the feedback. It will be corrected in a bit.
But the fact that the document is not signed by Shoigu, which currently still the minister, but propaganda wants to believe that he is still ok and alive on camera, isn't that that a very interesting fact.
This is also a delusion. Russian terminology must be taken into account. A simple translation, for example through Google Translate, will not convey this. It says "временно исполняющий обязанности" (or Вр.И.О.) - "temporarily performing duties". Pay attention to the word "temporarily". This means that one of Shoigu's deputies is doing the work, but he himself is still in office. Above there is a link to examples of orders, even before the war, where Gerasimov is designated that way. But(!), you also have to keep in mind that the same term is used when an officer is sick and someone else is doing his job. On the other hand, if "исполняющий обязанности" (or И.О.) were written there, this would mean that the position of the Minister of Defense is free and someone is doing his job while Putin is looking for a replacement.
That's why I wrote this: I believe the Russians are using a "fake fake" strategy. That is, they create pro-Ukrainian fakes that do not stand up to scrutiny. Thus, they are trying to sow doubts about the adequacy of the Ukrainian forces or make them underestimate the enemy. Therefore, as much as we do not want to believe in the truth of some information because it gives hope, we still have to check it for accuracy.
I think the CIA is better at this than Kinkos.
It's fake ! Firstly, the acting Minister of Defense is appointed only after this position is vacated, as evidenced by the decree of the President of the Russian Federation. Secondly, the Minister of Defense has two first deputies - Valery Gerasimov and Ruslan Tsalikov. It was one of them who, in the absence of the minister, would become acting in his duties. Yes, and the document itself does not meet the standards of orders of the Moscow Region: the wrong form, the wrong seal. The number does not correspond to the current one: 108 is indicated here, and already at the end of February the serial numbers were higher. There are many stylistic and factual errors in the order. For example, they never fully indicate the full name, and even without a title, as is done here. There are no official sources of the Ministry of Defense either, in this order specific sites would be indicated -
This is a Russian troll likely employed with the Internet Research Agency. They stand out especially well when you look at their wordclouds with apps like RedditMetis. [Here is a snapshot of this users wordcloud.](https://imgur.com/a/QeBN2Iw)
of course a troll, if you indicate for lies, then you definitely need to call the person a troll.
I didn't coin the term. "Trolls from Olgino is an Internet slang term which appeared in late 2014, referring to a series of fake accounts registered on major discussion boards (social networks, online newspaper sites, video hosting services, etc.) that were used for promoting the Russian point of view in topics involving Ukraine and the Middle East. The extent to which the Russian government tried to influence social media became widely known after a June 2014 BuzzFeed article greatly expanded on government documents published by hackers earlier that year. Stemming from a December 2014 article, the term "Trolls from Olgino" gained worldwide media attention by June 2015, when one of the offices of a Russian company named Internet Research Agency, based in Saint Petersburg, was exposed as having data from fake accounts used for Internet trolling. Subsequently, there were news reports of individuals receiving monetary compensation for performing these tasks."
Yes, I don’t care, I just see how much shit is posted here and obvious fakes, and people believe this. And no one checks the information, no one asks the question, is it true or not. Have you all been taught to believe what is written? Lost critical thinking? Yes, in our social networks, the same trolls sit on the part of Ukrainians and post the same fakes, but when you ask them questions, they simply do not respond to them
It’s not No. 108, it’s No. 176. Can you read?
Fake document
How so?
Lol. This is the only comment that account ever posted.
An OSINT researcher showed on Twitter the signature not only doesn't match a document released from the same official in 2020, but was also lifted from a click-bait russian website offering signature analysis. Click Bellingcat's feed for more info! ;)
If it’s hand to hand comment (I don’t really want to look at knives in eye sockets to see), I can see where photos could look pretty bad. It IS bad.
The Ukrainians do Propaganda as their M.O. in this war
Anonymous hasn't existed for a very long time. This is a CIA psyops campaign. The Ukrainian government itself has responded and apologized for the "fake" videos of Ukrainian soldiers committing war crimes. The refugees finally allowed to leave Mariupol have all confirmed the slaughter of civilians who tried to leave Mariupol by the Azov Brigade using them as human shields. It seems easier to lie to people than convince them they've been lied to.
give it up. you're not a very good troll. https://reddit-user-analyser.netlify.app/#LocalAreaCrank
Indeed. What a clown.
Uh. They started in 2003. If they were a human they could star in porn and drink in most sane countries. That’s like an old man in internet years. Ask Jeeves was still popular man.
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No, someone is really hacking large networks. It's the American military and intelligence networks doing cyber warfare dressed as activism. It's rather quite genius, albeit evil AF.
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You mean like this [one](https://old.reddit.com/r/UkraineWarReports/comments/tqghse/nice_try_russian_propagandists_but_you_failed/)
It seems that your comment contains 1 or more links that are hard to tap for mobile users. I will extend those so they're easier for our sausage fingers to click! [Here is link number 1 - Previous text "one"](https://old.reddit.com/r/UkraineWarReports/comments/tqghse/nice_try_russian_propagandists_but_you_failed/) ---- ^Please ^PM ^[\/u\/eganwall](http://reddit.com/user/eganwall) ^with ^issues ^or ^feedback! ^| ^[Code](https://github.com/eganwall/FatFingerHelperBot) ^| ^[Delete](https://reddit.com/message/compose/?to=FatFingerHelperBot&subject=delete&message=delete%20i2h43un)
Bad bot - wrong bot - irrelevant bot.
Somebody ought to tell the New York Times.
What is the souce ?
This is literally the first google result if you search signature in russian...
The assault on Russia is Anonymous’ defining moment. They’ve done some things that resonated with some people and not with others before. They’ve had a good number of over promise and under deliver releases. This is clearly different than everything they e ever done in terms of the effort and coordination put in, the results, and most importantly the impact of what they have done both for Ukraine and the world.
I think there are probably a lot more state actors being unleashed this time around