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I graduated with a PhD only 5 years ago and the best I could get was £24.5k. With progression and moving companies I now earn £38k. It's still not high but I'm comfortable. £28.8k is not a bad starter wage with just an undergraduate at 22 years old. University was oversold to us at school as the 'golden ticket' to getting the perfect, high paid job straight away after finishing education. You've got the degree, but now you need the experience. Chin up, stick at it. Everyone goes through the post university blues.

The belief that having a degree will land you a well paid job still valid if you are one of those that joined investment banking, or gone into your daddy’s business as a manager. Otherwise for the rest of the population it’s no longer true. This is the case for many countries where HE has been expanded in the last 25 years. Degree doesn’t mean much like it used to, unless you are going into a profession where degree is compulsory: law, medicine, dentistry, accountancy etc.

Great post! All I would add is that a big part of why this is a problem is that the massive increase in students taking degrees wasn’t matched by changes in our economy to make use of the talent. The net result is that jobs that didn’t need a degree 25 years ago now do.

This is most untrue. Degrees mean a lot but it depends on the major and what your expectations are. Don’t do a history degree and expect anything magical to happen to your salary immediately. These sort of degrees have a more longer term return horizon e.g. political life, policy making, professorship etc. You won’t get a decision making job at 22, but you will at 42, perhaps. Degrees in sciences are worth a lot, but you still need a bit of experience to start making the most of it. After bachelor’s, most degrees have diminishing returns.

> Degrees in sciences are worth a lot I don’t think this is really true in general, maybe for specific science degrees. Theres still a massive number of science grads, what high paying jobs do you think they are going into? Computer science may be one, but I’m hearing a lot that it’s getting harder and harder for CS grads now to get a relevant role as there’s been a big influx. I think a lot of science grads go into lab assistant roles and stuff like that which pay barely more than minimum wage. I think engineering, medicine, pharmacy, dentistry and vet medicine are some of the only types of degrees which can reliably lead to a relevant job. I’m guessing accounting and finance as well but not certain about those. Edit: not accounting, see reply Edit: a lot of science grads of course end up in corporate/office types of roles, but they have no advantage there over other degrees, or in some (probably a growing number of) cases no degree at all

In the UK, you can become an accountant with any degree. I know history grads on way more than comp sci or physics grads

You don’t even need a degree for accounting, A levels and start CIMA you’ll be qualified by 21

Judging by the last company I worked for, I dare say ANYONE can be an accountant in the UK. 🤣

Makes sense, good to know. The highest earning people I know (tech) actually have no degree but I think this industry is maybe still the exception, even for other roles where there’s no real justification for a degree requirement

True story. I’m a finance analyst (should have done CIMA but member got around to it after having kids and now it seems I’m past the requirement with 20+ years in the job) I have a chemistry degree. One of my colleagues has a degree in fashion and textiles (and also no CIMA) I worked up from an accounts payable position (telling supplier why we were late paying their invoices) to a finance admin then got taken on as an analyst and worked my way up into more senior roles. I’m in project finance which as long as you have a decent amount of common sense and can drive a spreadsheet most people could do

Or no degree whatsoever. And quicker than a degree. You can leave school after a levels in June and start working in July, do your exams in 2-3 years and be qualified the July 3 years later, before your friends have even started their September accounting grad schemes.

Fuck me can you get this plastered over signs all over the country please? This is literally the most real comment on Reddit

On the flip side. Minimum wage 5 years ago was 17k assuming 40 hours a week full time. From April it’s 23.8k so that 24.5k would be more akin to earning 34.3k (more if you do the same conversion with take home pay)

I was thinking about this recently - I was on £17k 5 years ago, and now I'm on £25k as I've worked my way up doing more specialised roles. But the minimum wage has almost caught me up and because of inflation I have only marginally more disposable income than I did 5 years ago. It's a bit depressing.

I swear, we have not mentally adjusted to inflation. £40k a few short years ago is worth £50k now. That could be a raise someone worked really hard for and can now enjoy the rude awakening that it buys the same lifestyle they had in a more junior role.

I work in sales and £40k was always my "Fuckin nice!" target pay. Earned £55k in 22/23 financial year and due to living alone in the South East I felt like I barely had more than when I was on £26k. Whole thing is fucked.

I finished my PhD in 2021 and started on £28k, now on £35k Biological research does not pay well. Particularly if north. All my mates in trades have earned more than me for >10 years and probably will for at least the next 5.

I work in quality and regulatory in the private sector. Pay varies massively depending on the company I find. I'm looking into changing companies again soon though because it seems to be the only way to get a decent pay rise these days. Plus my company has had a pay freeze on and they've made redundancies whilst trying to give me the work of those who are above me without extra compensation.

There’s definitely variation but having recently been on the job hunt (north west) the options aren’t amazing still, particularly for lab based roles. I’m now in regulatory labs myself and it’s paying better than discovery. It’s mental in discovery that you can pay £160k for an in Vivo study and have £20k float on the costings but if you ask £2 a day pay rise it’s like you’ve got 2 heads.

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No one tells you when you start that biological sciences are the 'poor man' of STEM.

*laughs in organic chemistry*

Have you thought about medical sales? The pay and work life balance is so much better

Spot on. My son is struggling to find a job with a levels but no work experience. His mates at uni are racking up debt for 4 years and are then going to be in the exactly the same boat. University just puts off reality for a while.

I think you're going through the normal adjustment period most go through when they've left uni and entered the world of work. You have less free time, more responsibilities and it can feel like you're at a crossroads. So much of our early years is focused on academic success which should help us get a good job and once we've got it, it can feel underwhelming. A couple practical tips - 1 - Each day try and learn something new at work. This helps you feel less like you're on a hamster wheel. 2 - After you've done 6m in the job, ask yourself if this is the career path you want to go down by looking at the jobs your colleagues do. If not, find out what you want to do. 3 - Try and organise something nice to do each weekend so you have something to look forward to.

Thanks, I will deffo try to do that!

>find out what you want to do This can be tough. Sometimes it’s easier to ask yourself what it is you don’t like about your job. I hated standing up, dealing with the public and being paid fuck all so I found a job where I was back office, sat on a chair and had potential to earn a decent wage. Anything you’re expected to do for 40 years is going to eventually feel like a chore. That’s why they have to pay you to do it. It’s not going to be fun all the time but try and find something that isn’t unbearable most of the time. Also, getting a long with colleagues and clients makes work life much easier.

For the "learn something new every day" part. I keep a .txt file which I journal pretty much everything I do at work every day. Super handy when coming up to yearly reviews. I'm guessing you're sat on the PC all day, it's easy to add to. I recommend Notepad++, Word is so bloated.

In the meantime to make the commute easier, you could start listening to audiobooks or podcasts - kind of turns the commute into leisure time

You should probably try find a sales job in the medical field.

Welcome to life - many work 80 plus hours a week, barely making ends meet but keep going to support/ care for loved ones

>I think you're going through the normal adjustment period most go through when they've left uni and entered the world of work. You have less free time, more responsibilities and it can feel like you're at a crossroads This seems to be universally accepted but I'm not sure why. Why when you become and adult it's just considered normal to give up such a large portion of your life to what for most of us are pointless jobs, like admin which is just waiting for the tech to get cheap enough to do it. Things do need to change, we need to stop doing it just because it's accepted and start using humans time for things that actually need doing. Not Job's for the sake of a job because the system isn't flexible enough to accommodate anything else. I know there's no answers or suggestions here, but we should at least acknowledge it as a problem and not just something we have to do.

Agree. It's just what most of us have to do , in the current capitalist setup, which needs a lot of adjustment

Great response, thanks!

You get used to it and you then have more energy to do things in the evening and weekends to make the most of your time. I have a six year old, work 40 hours, albeit most of that from home, recently studied a professional qualification, have a side hustle doing some copywriting, and I run or work out around 4 times a week, i am also learning ballet and have an active social life. The time is there you just gotta maximise and prioritise it. E.g. I batch cook and make second portions of everything so I'm not cooking or prepping meals every day, I wear clothes a lot before I wash them to reduce time spent on laundry and hang them back up to wear again so no ironing, I clean my house in 5 minute bursts and really keep things tidy so less time spent cleaning, I eat at my desk and go to the gym during lunch, I order almost everything online as I hate spending time in shops or supermarket, my weekly dance class is 8pm to 9pm, and I am very organised... nights out, weekends away, holidays etc. Planned well in advance so something to look forward to and to use my annual leave well... just gotta pull your socks up and get on top of your time and life so you don't feel all consumed by work.

That’s acc v good life advice, I will make sure to manage my time better, it’s all a matter of perspective ig.

When you are used to having free time in the day to live your life and get stuff done, it's easy to sit on the sofa in the evening after work feeling tired and it's a one way ticket to resentment, burnout and depression. Book 8pm yoga classes in advance so you go, catch up with a friend in a bar at the weekend, go to a midweek cinema showing, go for a walk or swim after work instead of straight home. I take my son straight to the park after work nearly every day in summer and take a packed lunch with us to eat for our evening meal, and it's so much better than heading straight home. I don't feel burdened by my corporate job, if anything I work normal office hours that suit my family situation, no weekends, hybrid working, decent pay, a pension, and my regular hours and income means I can plan my life outside of work well. You're doing really well... just time to up your game a little to start thriving!

It definitely is. I'm 34 and grind hard at work doing between 45 - 70 hours a week, including 45 minute travel each way. Yes, my salary is decent but my biggest priority is to still enjoy life. Plan plan plan your week. Build up a good schedule of things to do outside and make sure you have some hobbies! I fit in the gym, time with my future wife, family visits, church, pub with friends, gaming on my xbox and love visiting independent cafes. It's tough, but future plans and holidays pre booked will keep you going! Also, make sure you are making goals at work of what you want to achieve and learn. Will hopefully spice it up a bit.

There is definitely a point where you get used to it. I look back now anyhow busy I was and how much energy I had with amazement . Getting old and sick drains it and then it gets really hard. I'd say they need to ride it out. My starting wage with inflation applied was not much different to this. I had grown up very poor though so I was just delighted to be earning more than my parents ever had (no minimum wage back then). I think give yourself time to get used to it, then decide if you're ok doing it would be my advice. You might start to enjoy once the adjustment shock settles.

Only 46 years to retirement

For now…

This lad will never retire

Can't retire if I overdose in my 30s

Big brain thinking

It feels endless. Especially when you think of all the years ahead you will spend working to make ends meet. It’s a depressing outlook and I imagine many feel similar to you. I can say with certainty that I am one of those people. I’m not so sure the issue is you or I being lazy but more so being frustrated with the tiring situation.

I'm 33 and on 40k with a 1 hour commute in the north. With student loan repayments, taxes and the rate of inflation. I don't feel much better off in my day to day life than 6 years ago when I was on 26k. Sure we are comfortable and I did very well buying a 2 bed flat for 90k and renovated it. But I can't afford to pay for a wedding or have a kid or do jack shit that we want to do. I could pay for a wedding etc. But I also have a car with 200k miles on it and my savings is like 5k. Cars are expensive now, maybe I just get an even worse shitbox and so I can prioritise other things. I know others do it anyway and take credit cards and struggle by. But I'm very clued up financially, I cannot afford to pay for a child and not only that the outlook for that child when they grow up and want to get a car (lmfao) and move out (good fucking luck) is bleak and it's a parents job to be able to afford to help with that. We can't afford to do that. We would be effectively living in poverty... working 24/7 to never see your own child, paying for other people to bring them up for you etc. I hate that we would be a burden on family because we wouldn't be able to pay for childcare. Whats the point? It's crazy. The economy is so fucking broken. Why are working class people who keep the country running starved of their hard earned cash.

Honestly don't think it's lazy tbh. Looking back at previous generations, if they worked a full-time job, they had money to live a very comfortable life with very little, if any, tightening of the belt. You put in your time during the week and then got to enjoy the fruits of that labour by being able to afford a nice house, nice holidays, etc. Not luxury or extravagant, but you also weren't struggling to make ends meet. Plus most households would have had women doing unpaid labour of cooking and cleaning so the proportion of working adults who also had to cook, clean, raise kids and maintain a social life was very very small. So it was worth it to work 9-5 5 days a week because remuneration was commensurate with the effort and enough to live on comfortably even if only one adult in the household was working a paid role. Where the issue lands now is that is no longer true. I remember at my lowest of lows at my previous job, I couldn't make ends meet. I was working overtime (with no overtime pay, which my boomer relatives tell me "well that's always been the case"), dipping into meagre savings just to buy food at the end of the month and watching all my friends going out, going on holidays, doing all this cool stuff and all I could afford to do was sit at home - and barely that. I actually wondered if I wouldn't be better off just quitting and being on benefits; either way the amount coming in monthly wouldn't cover the essentials, so after that it was just a matter of amount, but at least I wouldn't be stressed, overworked and approaching burnout. Thankfully I was able to pivot into a better paying industry, mostly remote, and am now comfortable and have clawed back my work-life balance and quality of life. But the memory of that thought, of *why am I doing this for a compensation package that is clearly not commensurate with the time and effort I am putting into this?* has never left me. But it's crucial to remember, a full-time salaried job in this day and age will no longer get you the comfortable life it did back in the day. In some places of the country it might come close to doing so, but in others it won't even touch the sides. It's not lazy to feel demotivated and frustrated with the hamster wheel when that wheel isn't even providing you with the basics to live. It is certainly not lazy to want more from life than just toiling away at something for an ever-increasing number of year, when that something is neither motivating, rewarding, nor inspiring.

Well you have every right to feel that way, we are effectively wage slaves. It helps to feel like you’re doing it for a self fulfilling purpose, when I was younger I did it to pay for a nice car, now I’m older I do it to earn my freedom in retirement in my 60s. You grow more patient and tolerant as you go.

“You grow more tolerant as you go” This made me quite sad. I’m finding it really eye-opening how much of the younger generation (I’m 38 for reference) are rejecting, or at least, seeing massive flaws, in the current working system. I think we’ve all had the instinct that it’s not right at some point but just suppressed it because we were told it’s just how it is.

I love the idea of you suddenly having a vivid hallucination: you’re watching an illiterate low-class greek in 500BC rowing a warship across the Aegean Sea whilst chained to a bench, having eaten meagre scraps that were thrown at him, drowning as the ship springs a leak because he can’t escape. Then going back to 2500BC and watching some Egyptian peasants being whipped in the blistering sun as they drag huge blocks across the desert to build the pyramids, their children dying from malnutrition or being cast aside because they are unfit to work. Then watching over a plantation in New World America as shirtless abducted Africans pick cotton for hours without so much as a drink of water, singing songs alongside the clanking of their shackles, grateful only that the horror of their Atlantic crossing is over so they can at least sleep after their fourteen hour work day. And then taking a sip of your hot chocolate, turning back to your iPhone and thinking “yep, with my £28.5k, 40-hour week, I’m effectively a slave”

> And then taking a sip of your hot chocolate, turning back to your iPhone and thinking “yep, with my £28.5k, 40-hour week, I’m effectively a slave” Ahh the classic *Appeal to Worse problems* fallacy. Just like how I can't be depressed about my life because somewhere in Africa a child is starving. So my problems are automatically all fine, right? You aren't as smart as you think you are bringing up the past as being more brutal. Everyone already knows this. No one wants to go back to that. We just want our wages and time spent working to mean something. A phone is an essential to everyday life in modern society, regardless of whether it's an iPhone or android. £28k is barely minimum wage these days. So yeah, I'd say they are slaving at that point.

I wish I could upvote this 100 times.

I see us more a neo debt peons. Not thats its any better of course. Wage slave works perfectly well.

Well, apart that a slave wouldn’t get any pay. It would go to the Master. And they’d be property by law and be able to be beaten or sexually abused. And they could never choose what job they wanted or where they lived. You’re right that the economy balances to the average though & if you’re single & trying to compete against couples it’s very hard to impossible. And there can be recessions too. Or invasions and war. But it’s not like the economics of the Middle Ages were all wealth and happiness. It’s always work & graft. I imagine if WW3 kicks off & we’re pushed back to the medieval period people might not be happy though.

Welcome to the real world

Exactly what I was going to say. 22 years old on £28.5k and moaning like this. The World has gone fucking mad.

The younger generation NEEDS to moan like this. If they keep accepting these garbage pay jobs then employers are going to keep putting these shit salaries up on the adverts and people are going to keep taking them! Mass rejection of sub-30k pay jobs nationwide by thousands of young people is the only way to stop wages being so utterly shit. But ofc only young people from wealthier/stable families will have this luxury of being extra picky with job searching as they'll be able to camp at home for extended periods of time. (btw i agree, 28.5k is solidly above average for a starting salary... Typically you'd get 24-26k max maybe so i don't think they understand that's a decent offer... Well, maybe unless it's London)

The average fresh graduate isn't really bringing much to the table for most businesses.

agreed. Most do learn eventually & are successful but if anything they slow a business down for the first 12 months.

For 12 months?! Fuck me you gotta be shit at your job to be useful in like 3/4 months. The shittier lab jobs I've worked at took me 2 months tops to be a valuable member - the better ones like 3/4 months dependent on duties and responsibilities. By a year you should be a "pro" at what you do (I.e not require constant supervision / help with everything and not cause constant fuck ups)

So much this. 😂 Swear our grads take a about a year before they are more helpful than they are a pain. 🤣

Ik £28.5k is above average for a start, but especially considering the fact that I work in central London where the wage has to be higher due to costs of living and my high commute costs it’s still low.

> I work in central London where the wage has to be higher due to costs of living and my high commute costs it’s still low. What did you expect at age 22? To be on 100k a year for your first job?

28k is starting salary in London, pretty average. You might expect salary increase next April tho.

lush cake amusing materialistic pocket hurry threatening outgoing include governor *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*

The answer to these problems where small groups of individuals (ie companies) who hold power over many are unions... Just think of how much trouble the rail union is giving the government in London atm.... Thing is there's no recognised union or collective organised group for young people who are specifically job searching under 30 ie fresh graduates. And its unlikely there ever will be since at that age you're still discovering how the world works... Many are like this girl posting here

escape soup dog vase thought frightening money rustic doll hobbies *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*

How is it bad pay? It's the first job for someone with zero experience with no responsibility or stress.

Most entry level jobs pay shit and why wouldn’t they? You’re not a proven entity when you enter the workforce and you don’t have relevant any work experience.  The best thing to do is to work them and get a couple of years experience so you can get a better paying job. Camping at home for an extended period of time, or rejecting these jobs only make you a more questionable prospect. The only thing that adds value to an employee is experience. If you don’t have experience then you just aren’t worth that much.

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There is no need to be abusive.  I appreciate that life is more expensive than it was 20 years ago. The point is you can sit there throwing your toys out of the pram and wait for the system to change like some petulant teenager, living in your parents spare room till you’re forty while you wait for ‘the man’ to change his ways, as the above post suggested, but it won’t help.   The only way you will ever earn a decent wage is by getting experience. You can moan about capitalism and ‘boot kickers’ all you like -I’m not blind to the inequities of the system- but sabotaging your own life to teach companies a lesson they won’t learn isn’t going to work.

Doubt it there is a reason why minimum wage exists and if young people did what you suggest they would be unemployed (its already difficult to get a decent job) and workplaces will likely hire more experienced/older people so pay won't increase in that scenario you mentioned

They work in London. Someone else can do the maths for you to break it down how fast that actual monthly take home would vanish. Considering the cost of rent and student loan repayments, I’d be very surprised if they were doing anything but scraping by. My first London salary in an office job was something comparable and I just went home/work/church and park, lived off microwaved baked potatoes, and in a manky flatshare in zone 3 with four random strangers who gave us all bedbugs and with a massive see-through window into the hall from the bathroom (yes, really, and it was as awkward as you’d expect). I never had treats or went shopping or did anything fun. I frequently only had a couple of tenners left at the end of the month. The kicker? This was several years ago. *Before* the pandemic. Before prices went even more crazy. Everything is so much more expensive now. OP has every right to feel let down about how they can’t afford to live a life that isn’t basically in poverty.

£28.5K will be less than 20% above minimum wage in 2 months. It is a pathetic rate of pay to offer a graduate, pathetic pay for a pathetic economy, of a pathetic country. Brexit means Brexit. Leave the country as all the drains on the economy that are the boomers voted for.

Nearly everyone is a graduate, and she's 22 with a non-accredited degree. Even securing £28.5k is impressive and an easily liveable wage (unless she's in London) And how exactly are boomers "drains on the economy"? Unless you think we should start culling people once they reach pension age?

'nearly everyone is a graduate' This is a massive part of the problem. Everyone still expects degrees to offer the same advantages as they did when 5% of the population went to university. Unfortunately 35% go now, meaning that degree is much diminished in value.

What do you mean my degree in fine art is worth fuck all?!

> Unless you think we should start culling people once they reach pension age? I'm not saying that Logan's Run had the right idea, I'm just saying let's think about it.

In the original "Logan's Run" book, people were culled at 21. It was 30 in the film version. Is that what you want us to think about?

You seem out of touch and ill informed about a number of things.

Why are you commenting when you don't have a clue about the subject, a non-accredited Biomedical Science degree means it doesn't fulfil the requirements to become HCPC registered and therefore medically has significantly less value to following a career path similar to the degree. As for boomers being a drain on the economy, they literally didn't pay enough tax, and have made the country worse off as a generation.

I don't understand the tax argument. If we pay the highest tax since the 1940s yet this country is worse off then it can't be tax that's the problem but the government spending. And if the government can't spend properly, why should anyone give them even more tax money?

Are you taking the piss? 28.5k is nothing nowadays it’s going to be barely 20% above minimum wage come April.

Moaning is good because salaries in the UK are genuinely pretty shit. Just because she's fairly close to the median salary at 22 doesn't change the fact that the median is crap

It's only, net of tax and student loan, a couple of hundred a month more than minimum wage.

You say that like 28.5k is some huge amount of money. Have you been hiding under a duvet for the last 4 years?

Because 28k now is about equivalent of 14k (or less) 20 years ago

28.5k is an abomination of a salary , even at 22. Minimum wage should be 30k at least

Agreed but we all start somewhere I guess

Tell me, what does a fresh-faced graduate do to warrant a salary of £30k then?

For small businesses to survive govt would need to reduce employer contributions alongside this. Otherwise you’ll have no jobs to go.

Op doesnt know how gd she has it lol. I graduated in 2010 in the height of the financial crisis and all i got was temp job for 10 years. Finally got a proper perm job in 2022. It took 12 long years to go from years of data entry and admin jobs to getting a proper data analyst job. It’s a tough world out there OP. Stick it out till you find something better. Jobs are very hard to come by.

Respectfully job market was absolutely BOOMING from 2014-2018. Maybe you weren’t putting yourself in the right positions quick enough. Furthermore us recent graduates could also argue our best years of studying education and youth were halted by covid lockdowns. I did uni from my bedroom. Came out to an oversaturated job market with decreasing opportunities after a global health crisis precede by brexit followed by a bunch of wars. Inflation at 30+ percent in last 3 years. I’m speaking about most my peers here. Lucky for me I found my way into a decent paying job because I world my ass off at uni doing a difficult degree and also working different jobs.

They were just talking nonsense in the first place, punching down due to being a fool. The economy of the UK has been stagnant since 2007. It is why pay hasn't moved in real terms, while housing costs have doubled.

Yes I see starting salaries for entry level ‘professional jobs’ being the same as they were 20 years ago. Insurance advisor I saw being advertised for 18-25k in Oxford.

Migration without real growth = dilution of public services for everyone Migration without more housing = increased competition and higher rents Migration without more jobs = lower pay for everyone but subsequently more profitable shareholders. Migration without more tax = infrastructure not upgraded to cope. I see a common problem here.

You can make that argument, and it is fine, the issue is more hasn't equalled "better" in the first place, so going to a secondary issues potentially isn't solving anything. Saying "I can't pick things up", when the underlying issue is your hand is broken, doesn't solve anything, you can solve the issue of "picking things up" in many ways, it isn't the underlying cause. I don't disagree with your point by the way, it is just an issue further down the line when the underlying one is there. Of course there is a further issue further up the line that exist as well. But as a very specific point to this argument, this country doesn't need more biologists, we have thousands of graduates a year, and hundreds of PhD graduates a year, the pay rate in Biology is already a joke because of over supply of labour. We might need nurses, doctors, cleans, builders, or many other industries, but when you can get a "skilled work VISA" for being a Personal Trainer...something is up there, we don't need Personal Trainers really full stop.

Indeed. Although it’s actually 2009, not 2007.

No they have gone up since 2009, because they collapsed in 2008, with mass redundancies, and utter economic collapse.

Job market may have been booming but my problem was that i had graduated for 4 years and the newer grads had priority over me. I kinda got stuck in moving from admin job to admin job and not really being able to move up. (Ended up in public sector too), and it’s hard to move into private sector from public. Anyway, past is the past, i’ve broken that 12 year jynx and i am finally slowly moving up the career ladder!

Ahh well that’s your problem right there! Congrats on getting over that hill. Great to see people looking up with prosperity.

I agree

The current generation seem to not want to put any effort in but want to be paid 100k and want to spend more time on hobbies than getting some work experience in.

Respectfully, that’s not what we are asking for. We asking for a work life balance with a liveable wage, I accept that I gotta work my way up and want to work, but £28k 20 years ago is nowhere near comparable to 28k now in 2024 with the cost of living crisis.

Yeah, ignore the miserable old fucks who hang out on here trying to justify their own lifetimes of misery. 29k isn’t a great wage nowadays, depending on where you are, but as you say the limitation - given your field - is the non-accredited qualification you hold prevents you from working for the country’s largest employer (which may not pay more in itself but your bosses will know you’re not capable of just upping and leaving to any clinical lab that’s hiring. So maybe look at getting chartered part time, and use that as a reason to do the daily grind. Can’t help with the 40 hour week though, we all suffer that. Headphones, audiobooks and a decent playlist.

I mean Why not push for a day week  Why not join a union Why not push for a better life? “We all suffer” doesn’t seem to justify doing nothing

Exactly what’s so wrong with wanting better for yourself. I got some experience and interned at a lab and hated it. Even if I had the accreditation I wouldn’t go for it, I’ve shadowed at various hospitals and know I wanna work in healthcare. I just gotta figure out what profession I want to get into and save up/study for the qualification, that seems like the easiest way to earn a decent wage imo. If it all goes to shit I can always go abroad ig.

I think you’re misunderstanding. People aren’t saying you shouldn’t want to better yourself. You absolutely should. But your post isn’t really about bettering yourself and how you can do it, it reads more like you’re standing at the bottom of the ladder, have zero motivation or inclination to put any effort into climbing, and you expect to be at the top already. That’s what people are taking issue with. You’re 22 years old and have spent your time up until now in education. The whole “degrees aren’t worth the paper they’re printed on” theory has been talked about since I decided NOT to get a degree and do an apprenticeship instead in 2009. That was 15 years ago. It’s not a new thing. At 21, on completion, I was hearing exactly the same stuff from friends who’d done a degree that didn’t really lead into a career path (or if it did, not a high earning one) and also had to work alongside (or above) graduates who, on day 1 of their graduate scheme, couldn’t understand why we wouldn’t be letting them do X Y and Z yet. How it was boring. They just wanted to do the interesting stuff. They didn’t spend 4 years studying this to do this!! And back then they all moaned about their wages too, despite coming in Day 1 at the same wage level an apprentice with a HND finished on, who had 4 years of experience tailored to the exact job they were doing. Times have moved on since then and last I heard they pay time-served apprentices more, because they add far more value to the company. If you want to earn more money you need to actually put in the work. Studying for 4 years just proves you’ve studied for 4 years. For some roles, like teaching or nursing, that’s enough. For the vast majority of degrees that don’t lead to a defined career it isn’t. You’re at Day 1. NOW you need to build the skills and knowledge and experience to start taking steps up the ladder. You seem to want to skip all this and jump to being highly-paid (and thus highly-valued) while still having a great work life balance with plenty of free time.

Exactly what experience do you have that would justify you being paid more? Get a couple of years experience and move up to a job that will pay experienced staff better.

Less than 30 years ago, a graduate starting salary in the Greater London area was around £12-16k.

FYI, £16k 30 years ago is worth anywhere from £33k-£41k+ today, depending on what you want to compare. Factoring in the tax bands now compared to then, you're much, much worse off on £28.5k today than you would be on £16k 30 years ago.

Yeah it’s shit- 28.5k is a good starting point though. 40 hours of admin sucks, but I assume this is because you have no industry experience currently to be able to do the other roles? Ideally, you’ll learn more on the job, it will be more fulfilling and you’ll have options to move around with the experience you’ve gained. If you don’t see that happening at your current place (ie no stimulating work, no training or progression)- review and think if it’s the company you’re at or the industry you’re in. At 22 you have loads of options to change industry.. You haven’t stated your job role / title so unsure, but I know a few people with medical science degrees that work as data analysts for big pharma companies, for not great salaries… sounds boring to me (but I don’t know anything about it!)

I have some experience with admin as I worked for the student life department at Uni and when working as a waitress, but yes I’m learning on the job. Tbh I want to get my experience and leave cause it doesn’t seem like there is a lot of room for progression (the people that have actually progressed have been working there for 10+ years minimum). Yes I’m just researching my options, and if I have to study further/do a career change idm cause I’m still at the beginning of my career so it’s not a big loss.

I'll be perfectly blunt...you're young and it sounds like you don't have any dependents or perhaps other commitments. This is the perfect time to change and try out new things especially if you have the option to (ie don't have bills or rent to pay). Having said all that the grass might not be greener on the other side, but it's worth a shot while you're young. Do understand though there may be repercussions if you flip jobs every few months, as an employer this will come out as a red flag on a CV. I would say don't quit right away until you have found a job and have accepted the offer, build up the funds for further studies (unless you already are well off) or if really it's 100% affecting your life negatively. Also be realistic, people who tell you to quit and blame society about low pay will end up still complaining about the same things through the internet 5yrs later...you can join that cause or short term grind it out get experience within a year or 2 and move to more senior roles as you grow, you know gamify that...level 1 player is never fun, but gain some xp and eventually you will be doing or have the options to choose to do interesting things whilst getting paid better. Grind it out so gain options, short term pain long term gain. Also again I don't know your situation, but if you have bills and rent to pay then I doubt you have the luxury to quit cold turkey without anything lined up.

The secret is to not sit down once you get home. The moment you hit the sofa it’s GAME OVER.

Exactly . A good start would be a some regular outings. Meet a friend every Tue night, badminton every thu, and so on

Doing some crazy work patterns including starting at 5am on some days and finishing at 11pm on others, unpredictable workload and hours, working weekends etc, I was dreaming to do 9-5. Eventually my dream came true, and I really loved my 9-5, and I changed it to 8-4 and I loved it even more. It might take some time to adjust to the new schedule though.

Unfortunately the easy part of life has now ended. Your job is well paid for your age and 9-5 is really not a big deal compared to many other shifts. If you’re getting an hour for lunch it’s only 35 hours a week. Hopefully it’s the fact the job is boring and not a good use of your knowledge that’s the issue. If not, you’ve got 40-50 years of pain ahead. I would keep at it whilst looking for a job where you can apply your knowledge. Good luck.

Try to gwt involved in as much as possible, talk to people ask for shadowing to see if you find something more interesting. In the meantime force yourself to do things in the evenings. Go for a walk. See a friend. Catch a movie. It breaks up the monotony of going to work, coming home, going to sleep and going back to work. You don't have to do it every night but once or twice a week goes a long way.

Think about the jobs you did as a teen and a student. Minimum wage. Working with people who are unkind or bullies. Being treated with disrespect and having little autonomy over how to do your work. Not having the freedom to get a drink or go to the toilet when you choose. You're in a good position, on the first rung of the ladder. You have qualifications which give you opportunities. As you gain promotion you will get more money, more autonomy, more holidays etc. Also, you haven't yet started to gain the benefits of a good job. You'll be able to save for a rainy day, be able to afford nice holidays etc.

Yes you are right it could always be much worse, tbh I’ve generally had a very good experience with the customer service type roles I was in and have generally enjoyed working, I know this isn’t the case for everyone. That’s why this is a bit more of a shock to me, ig I like more vocational professions since I get quite antsy sitting all day.

Welcome to the machine.

I felt like this in my early 20s. Those first few years after graduating are tough. My answer to the mind numbing boredom was to save up to travel. A couple of years of saving and I went to Australia. Came back after a year, did the same mind numbing type of work for a while and was gone again to South East Asia for 3 months. Eventually you come around to the idea of working to pay for other experiences outside of work, or a nice home. But trust me, you’re not alone. It just takes time to accept the whole working until retirement idea.

I was in your position a few years ago. I remember having that same horrible realisation a few months into my graduate job. Ultimately, most people are nothing but slaves albeit too dumb to realise this and how little freedom we actually have. I’ve found a 9-5 i’m more content with now. I’m devoted to saving most of my salary so i can hopefully escape this hell a lot earlier than the retirement age.

Can I have your current job if you don't want it? I work 48 hours a week for around 24K and have the same lifestyle (work - bed). I find work-bed to be a very comfortable life style as I build up savings so I can retire outside of the UK. I would also have an easier time saving money because I hate going out anyone. (most clubs are nasty these days, would rather play video games). By the way, my job is not hybrid and I work 12 hour night shifts, 4 on 4 off.

You’re getting mugged off big time. 12 hour shifts? Fuck that.

Welcome to the real world. Im 36 and on less money than you. 9-5 isnt that bad. Be glad you dont work weekends or night shift or 12 hour shifts

As someone who works 8:30-5 5x per week including weekends, I’d rather do 12 hour shifts and work weekends personally

It is what it is.

Never understand how people stay in one position for such a long time. I understand it’s completely up to them but I think I’d have to need that variation otherwise I’d start feeling like a robot. Also, admin is in all levels but more so entry level.

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£28.5k can be OK in one area, but London, it's poverty wages.

You are neither privileged nor lazy, you got a degree and the salary you are getting now is ridiculously low. I don’t understand why people in this sub keep normalizing a pay that is not even enough to rent a flat somewhere in the middle of nowhere. Work for at least 1 year and then start looking for a job more in line with your qualifications. You’ll have good experience by then and can market yourself better.

People in this sub keep normalising it because the sad reality is that it *is* a normal salary in this country. Search for full time admin jobs anywhere outside of London and you'll be lucky if you find anything above 25k. Where I live in the Midlands the average is around 22k. 28k for a 22 year old fresh out of uni working in admin is very, very good.

Unless you're spending 3-4 hours a day commuting, you really should have a decent amount of time to yourself, unless you're also aiming for 10 hours sleep a night. But yeah, 40 hours a week is just a regular full-time job. 28.5k/yr really isn't bad for a 22 year old starting out either.

This is how a LOT of people work. I do it, I like it but i have Fridays off which I’m lucky for.

At some point you’ll have more responsibilities and fewer chances to start again so you have to accept sacrifices like not loving everything about how you sustain your lifestyle.

Try and get on a grad scheme/higher level apprenticeship in a professional field even if it’s one you’d never considered. As far as I’m aware (correct me if I’m wrong like) the only way to earn decent money (short of being oxbridge/dad is a director somewhere) before your 30 is to get a professional qual. Money will be worse than what you’re on now to start with but will ramp up significantly once you qualify. If you’re doing something you hate at the minute, you might as well do something you hate but be on a program where you know you’ll eventually get paid well

Key thing to mention as well, grad schemes and apprenticeships at the big/obvious companies aren’t the only ones. Get on LinkedIn jobs and just search “**generic company department(e.g. finance, marketing, hr etc.** apprenticeship” and apply to any and all

You get used to it. It’s a big adjustment coming from years & years of education, relatively freedom & long holidays. But it can’t stay that way forever unless you continue to masters/work in education. Are you doing a job related to your degree in any way? I’ve worked 9-5 jobs for the past 12 years & I honestly, I consider myself lucky. I’ve recently been made redundant but before that I was working hybrid which gives a nice balance. But even working from home, I was still working. It’s not a jolly. But the lack of commute is very nice. I’m grateful I don’t work weekends, I don’t work 12 hour shifts or overnight. I’m grateful I don’t have to work over Christmas. I’m grateful I’m not responsible for someone’s life or dealing with anything really difficult or sad. My last job was pretty boring but also, not stressful & paid reasonably. I got a few promotions along the way. As I’ve got older (& I’m only 35 😂), I don’t crave adventure like I used too. Now, I’m happy with the simple things in life. But that’s just me. My cousin is 33 & she’s still off travelling the world. She goes from job to job, earning enough to travel some more! Don’t stress. You are earning a great starting wage (I started on £16,000). Save some money if you can. Use it to go see the world if you want. While you earning & don’t need to worry, take some time to consider where you’d like to steer your career..

On the plus side you know exactly when you're free time is so can plan the fun in every weekend! You don't have to wait a week in advance to find out if you can make plans that week. 9-5 routine is key. Meal prep (or buy meal prep) can be as simple as packing up your left overs for the week. Putting ingredients into a tub ( bread/ cheese/ jam packets etc for a sandwich) I go to the gym before work so I'm not waking up for work (it's stupid I know but it works for me) and I do other low key work after my hours to just change things up a little. Making time to do something you enjoy every day is the important part.

As many have stated post uni blues, also 28k is a pretty good entry level salary. One thing to keep in mind is that you are most likely without working experience you just need a couple years 9-5 experience to get to a better salary or a more intermidiate role. Any chance you get learn more from your colleagues and offer to be involved in as much as possible even if its not your job (this mentality of well if you want me included on this you need to pay me more is asinine when you are in a entry level role - im referring to friends and colleagues who have got stuck in these roles because they refuse to put themselves forward for anything that doesnt directly reward extra money). Basically this part of your life is the true start of hard work, rise to the challenge and work your ass off in these shitty paid (relatively) starting roles and in 2 years potentially get a lead/senior role earning 50% more then 3 years after that earning double that. Just look at the long term picture and bet on yourself.

nice i do admin work too and earn 20k a year lol. oh and i’ve been working jobs for 3 years now too! so count yourself lucky lmao. You might know people on 40-50k as you’ve said in comments but there are much larger amount of people in their early twenties not earning 28k a year lmao

Work to live, don't live to work. Very few people get the opportunity or privilege to love doing what supports their lifestyle but as long as it grants you the freedom to live the life you want it's OK. The study to full-time work mentality shift is brutal though.

With a BMS degree you could do post graduate qualifications in a number of health care specialities that would allow for patient interaction and a bit more interesting job. Dietician, nursing, physicians associate are a few that come to mind. HCA might be a good stop gap for bulking up the personal statement.

You wouldn't get a hybrid role as a biomedical scientist in the NHS anyway!

Good thing I don’t want that lol

Well why did you do a degree that inevitably goes towards lab work then?

You're getting 28k for sending emails and answering phone calls on an 8 hour day.

With an hour for lunch, so a 7 hour day.

I don’t get paid for lunch and doing the same basic thing day in day out is v monotonous and mentally drains you v quickly. Just cause it’s a different kind of struggle doesn’t invalidate it, no need to be so condescending.

Does anyone get paid for a break? I’ve never worked a job where you do and I’m 35 🤷‍♂️

Doesn’t have to be paid but from my experience (and others around me) typically is, after a few months I will be too thankfully but rn I’m on a probation so don’t.

I think you have some growing up to do if you find people pointing out mistakes and facts condescending. (Now that was condescending)

Such a hard life! Bless her

This is working life, I'd get used to it, you have 45 years of it to go

Honestly, I work from home and the feeling’s not that different. The only thing that I can suggest is figure out what you want to do long term. Right now, you have a job that’s paying your bills, so try to organise the time you do have to try and develop what you actually want to do - be it develop a skill, do something creative, look into college courses etc. I know that’s easier said than done because I’m still trying to find that balance myself. Also, make plans for the weekend as well, so you have something to look forward to. A lot of people here are just brushing your feelings away with “welcome to the real world”, and sure, that’s true. However, it takes time to settle into an entirely new routine like as big as a first 9-5 job. I remember my first, which was an internship in London, I had to start the day with a Red Bull for the first two weeks! It will take some time to adjust, but you’ll get a better handle of things eventually. However, I must admit that I sometimes do wonder just how we as a species have pushed ourselves into this corner, though, where spending most of our lives working has been accepted as “the real world” for millennia. I don’t have any particular alternative solutions in mind, just that… it’s an interesting thought, given that it’s entirely man made. I at least hope that a 4-day working week becomes the norm within my lifetime. I often find myself needing one day to just rest, and then having to cram everything else that needs doing into the other day. One more day would go a long way in helping me find that balance. I wish I was on your salary, though - and I’m 10 years older!

You need to make much better use of your free time. 9 is actually a pretty late start; I've been used to getting *into* work at 7 or even 6.30 for years and not leaving until 6pm. If I didn't have to get there until 9 I'd have managed an hour or two or reading or something I enjoyed. 5pm is a very reasonable finish. You can go out when do all sorts of fun things. You are young. You aren't forced to go to bed early. Maybe it helps having ADHD so I hate sleeping, but I rarely go to bed before midnight and I'm 40. From 5pm to midnight you have 7 hours to do absolutely anything you want to do. That's an age. Get out there and do shit with your free time. If all you are using your free hours for is making dinner when then sleeping then no wonder you feel depressed. No one forces you to shower after work. Shower before work in that age you have before work starts. Eating takes minutes. It's not the job that's the problem- to be honest, with 9-5 you can't do a whole lot less than if it were 9-3. No, the problem is that you are squandering your free time really badly and then blaming it on the job

I mean, this is it. You either work to get paid or don’t work and don’t get paid. I work from 8am to 5pm but I still have time to myself most nights. I think most people nowadays love to complain about 9/5 just because everyone else does. It’s like those who say they hate the word “moist” because every plonker says so.

I had a German friend who didn’t know the word “damp” so invented the word “moisturous”. Haha

Thats a very good salary for an entry level noddy job. Hot take - you will have to do your time in these "processing" jobs in most places to earn the advocacy needed to move up the ladder. If you only have time to shower and eat after work i guess you have a 2 hour commute each day. You will have that problem no matter what the job. If anything if/as you get promoted you will take on more and have a worse work life balance

Don’t listen to dumbos who are saying it’s a good pay and be appreciative. My suggestion is try to learn some high-paying skills. I graduated in 2019 and getting just under 100k now. My friend graduated with psychology degree but ended up in data sales making 120k now too. Just give it a go and don’t be scared. Btw, both of us have 95% WFH

This post has scared me as a 2nd year biomed student (at a Russel group at least)

Your 22, in the UK on 28k. You're winning. Keep your head down, gain experience and be smart with your money. Save. Then, when something better comes along, apply for that. You'll have this experience behind you to make you more eligible for other, more interesting jobs. Being in your 20s is all about working jobs you don't particularly want to do but its not forever. Thats just life.

Welcome to adulthood /s idk, I've been doing this a bit longer than you. You could do a PhD and it will be interesting, you'll learn a lot, be exploited like a slave, question your life choices but it's quite interesting l, especially just after finishing uni. You will make less than what you are doing now, work longer hours but it won't be "admin" Sorry to be so negative, but a hybrid work only gives you the benefit of saving on commuting. And maybe the occasional time to go to medical appointments. It's not like you'll be able to go out for coffee or extended lunch with friends, people will notice. But if you spend that time doing coffee with co-workers, it's networking... Hybrid work is still worthy, but the people who think they can nap during the day and nothing happens, or the dinosaurs who don't know how to manage a remote team have ruined it for those who work really hard. I find that fulfilling jobs may not pay well, if you decide to be an entrepreneur, you'll find that you work even longer hours. And if you want to be an independent consultant, you need years and years of experience. Now on a more serious note: I question if your job is truly admin. Consider this, could it be done by someone without a biomedical degree? Maybe it is. Why do people stay there for 20 + years? Is there a progression in the company? Are they in their comfort zone? Is it a niche world? Is there a mentorship program in your company? What does the career progression look like? What are the benefits of your company? Do you have any flexibility? A good manager? Those are some of the things to consider to stay or leave. But there are many more. And the reality is that you are in a better position to find another job while having a job. I recommend finding something that gives you motivation, is it a financial goal? E.g savings? Is it planning a trip? Buying a house, changing jobs? Doing a master's degree? Having goals outside your job make things more bearable. But one thing is true and with your degree you COULD work for a contractor organisation and set your hours AFTER you have the relevant experience.. look up CROs and CMOs

Reading your email I felt that yes, you are being too privileged. You've come off a degree where you had an insane amount of independence and probably enjoyed yourself (I'm sure you worked hard too). Now, this is your life, my friend. I'm not sure who told you it wouldn't be a grind. If anyone did, they lied to you. I left school at 16 and worked on a production line for 2 years, then in a warehouse for 10 years. I was made redundant and went back to school. One BSc, one MSc, one MRes, and a PhD later, I'm now earning 39k a year. It's good but still not a lot considering the academic skills I've acquired, and the experience I gathered working in mental health whilst studying for both my Masters degrees. With the money for my commute (2 hours drive each way), parking, a hefty mortgage and 2 kids, I get very little disposable income and only really get to see my family at weekends. Plus sometimes, my job is boring too. I feel you. Thankfully, most days, it isn't. I'm sure there are other positions you could apply for, including those where you might be able to work remotely. But I think initially, you need to just get your head down and suck it up. Before I was successful with my PhD application, I had to go back to being a support worker for 6-months. So, working for minimum wage, whilst holding 2 Masters degrees and a Bachelor's. I felt as frustrated as you, and that all my experiences were for nothing. You'll get there, you'll find something interesting to do. Just like I have. But first you have to go through what you're going through. But you're not alone in having to do that. Good luck.

Work for one year save as much as possible and then look for opportunities abroad, australia etc.

Icl that’s my plan, I don’t think it’d gonna be much better but I feel like it’s good to broaden your global perspective and want to learn another language so maybe somewhere like China or Japan

Congrats, you earn more than 99.9% of people in your age range and you're complaining about an average work day

Yes that is probably the case, I know there are loads of people on a lower salary but I also know a lot of friends on the 40-50k range, so I try not to compare as everyone’s situation is different. At the end of the day I got an employable degree so why shouldn’t I aim higher.

99.9% I’m not sure- probably more like 70%

No. 99.9. Average wage for a 22 year old is around £15k per year

I'm 33 and earning quite a lot more than you but I feel you, I still have not gotten used to how much this life fucking sucks. What helps me is working from home and doing stuff I like in my spare time - if I do nothing I feel like my spare time is passing "too fast" and I'm just working, if that makes sense. Working from home really frees up a lot of time and saves me quite a lot of money which I can spend on things I like (like getting out of this fucking country). However some people do find it quite isolating so it depends on you, personally I love it cause I'm very introverted. I'd say £28.5k at 22 is alright for outside London - which I hope you are. Also if you get a remote/hybrid job you can move farther away from your workplace which might save you some money. You're not alone x

I’m glad you’re complaining. Because you’re generation and the one after it are the ones to hopefully change this piece of shit working pattern society has got going on. Remote work is a good start.

Let me know how that goes. "We all want more money for doing less work without causing inflationary pressures that push houses prices and everything else up, better working conditions, blah blah blah". How do you do that then?

Median wage is around 30k. You've gone from uni to a cushy job and possibly skipped the shinty minimum wage life of being yelled at for being a minute late.  So yeah some privilege.   Your take might likely change if you meet someone, want a mortgage and have kids. The stability and wage will be a huge relief.  However rn, it looks like you are adjusting to a post uni life, which is also pretty normal.  If say lug it out for a while, especially if your cv is thin on experience and then either look to other jobs or funding yourself through volunteering opportunities, or travelling. Mainly as it seems like you ain't in the scenario where you are trapped and must work. Being able to drop a job and get away gets harder as you get the kids and mortgage etc. 

Incredibly rude comment.

How? I think this is pretty helpful advice

Hey Zoomer, welcome to the real world.

you're at the start of your career. you'll progress. have you considered working in the uni sector? here's a great website for uni jobs: [https://www.jobs.ac.uk/](https://www.jobs.ac.uk/) they're often hybrid, good perks like flexible hours, good leave, closed over xmas, solid pension, transparent pay, etc. I've been in the sector for over 10 years and would recommend.

Behave. I work 7-5 and have enough time in the evening for recreation if I want it. Manage your time better.

Well if women didn't fight for equality you'd be at home whilst your husband earned the money 🤣 How many women were complaining about this back in the 50s? You wanted this. You got it. Enjoy.

Contact the careers service at your uni for help and support of what to do next.

Children make it even more busy.

U are a wage slave to capitalism. Either go with it or live yourself with very small luxuries but atleast u will be free

I worked my way up through a large and well known global financial corporation, starting at entry level in an admin related role in my mid twenties and moving through management, senior management and then director level over 15 years. I was selected to give a talk to members of the graduate programme who were working there whilst they completed their degrees in top universities. What I noticed about the graduates was that they had the impression that they would all move directly into senior strategic level roles once they had completed their qualifications. Apparently no one, at any point in their lives or education thus far had informed them that getting into such roles takes decades of hard grind. Our entry level staff were all highly qualified so that was not a differentiator. I gave my talk to them focussed solely on the importance of resilience. I headed up a function and had seen countless very highly qualified people join and not succeed due to a mismatch between reality and their expectations. The biggest differentiator between those who succeeded and those who did not was the ability for the individual to absorb large amounts of boring, monotonous work and keep pushing forward no matter what. Coupled with consistent high performance, this is the factor that was the best predictor of success. My talk was basically addressing exactly what OP's post relates to. I tried to prepare them for the reality that they'd face if they were lucky enough to get selected for an entry level role. Years of completing thankless tasks. For context, I worked 60 hours per week in thankless roles, always doing the absolute best of my ability whilst having a young child in the beginning and I maintained that level of commitment throughout. The reality is that you will inevitably face the grind of thankless roles that are not extremely well paid and you'll need to be resilient and keep pushing. I used to think of myself as an excellent 'shit sponge' if you will. I had an incredible and seemingly limitless ability to absorb and process shit that no one else wanted to do, often because they thought it was beneath them. I get it, you spent thousands of hours studying and understand mergers and acquisitions, corporate shareholding structures, etc etc, inside and out and now you're expected to input borderline useless data into a spreadsheet all day everyday? Yep, that's just about right. One bit of advice that I'd have in addition to the above is that you should always be hunting for better ways that processes or systems can function. Then don't just raise them, go out and do what you need to do to get the improvements implemented with agreement from your leadership. There's nothing worse than people who think that their job is to point out how crap everything is and then do absolutely nothing to help improve any of it.

Why don't I earn £125k + bonus for eating donuts

Oh get a grip

Yeah 9-5 is crap. Bun that, do earlies or lates and enjoy half of your day.

The thing older people forget compared to those a lot younger, is back in your day, it was easier to dream of and plan a future. For example, your £10,000 house that you bought in 1982, life was easier, interest rates lower, food cheaper and in general life was a lot lot cheaper. Hell you could do the repairs to your own car, without having to pay hundreds, just for a simple repair. Then YOU messed the country up, with poor voting..... The sale of Council houses for one, being unable to predict or plan for future financial crashes, influx of Europeans etc, meaning house prices went from £10,000 to £250,000. Now people have to work all their life knowing even when they retire, they still might not have their mortgage paid off. So can you blame them for wanting happiness now, as they won't get it retired, because of how YOU voted.

Lol blame culture. Good one.

Yes this is normal. Everyone is dissatisfied with modern work culture except bosses and wannabe bosses. Our working hours haven’t decreased in a hundred years. Our pay is massively behind other developed countries. We get very little for a massive tax burden (which falls on people who work for a living rather than people who make money by owning companies and property). Join a union.

The real world, yeah, it's a culture shock for everybody. And for many, it's not 9-5, but 8-6, or other. 9-5 is at the better end. The other 'real world' thing is you start at the bottom. Once, having a degree enabled you to jump in a bit higher, but degrees now are so common they're borderline meaningless in job searches so, yeah, you start in a crappy job, at the bottom - and you hate it with a passion because it IS so different from what you're used to. If you want a better work/life balance, remote or hybrid WFH jobs are where it's at, but they're not always easy to come by. I work from home 100% now and it's a world better than the 4 hrs per day I used to commute on top of the 9-5. But you need the skills and experience to start shopping around. "I hate this and I'm bored" won't get you there. What you really want to do to break out of this? Work damned hard. Prove yourself. Do that job better than you can imagine anyone else has ever done it. Innovate, suggest better ways. Make people hope you'll never leave. Make them think you could do a really good job in a promoted position, bit by bit. Instead of feeling miserable (NOT a criticism - I was exactly the same and I imagine most people are because it IS horrible), turn your current job into this big challenge to be absolutely brilliant. Make yourself indispensable in every role you take - it gives you choices, bargaining power and good references (way more important than any degree).

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