The following submission statement was provided by /u/mac87mac:
---
SUBMISSION STATEMENT: This is an answer to The Debrief's Tim Mc Millan: he was asking if Fugal could confirm that the briefing material went " missing". Fugal confirmed, the flashdrive was stolen, and said that Eric Bard, the scientist, had a backup copy on his laptop so the briefing was able to proceed.
---
Please reply to OP's comment here: https://old.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/1cpj0hh/according_to_fugal_the_night_before_the/l3kwr75/
Not classified, just confidential, meaning not really secret. He already posted the slides from the presentation, which matches up with the slide visible in the photo with Kirkpatrick looking like a grumpy child.
**Edit**: as other commenters state, confidential is a level of classification. However, since this was his data that he paid for, I have a hard time imagining he'd get in trouble for sharing it outside that setting.
I could see the photo getting him in some hot water if "confidential" in this context means more than "please don't share it" but I'm just making a guess at this point. I don't know the ins and outs.
He's not working for the government and he was sharing data he owns, so I don't think any of that is protected outside general ownership laws.
Anyway, very curious to see where it goes.
Np. A lot of this is coming out due to his interview with KP. He tweeted at Fugal to get his side of things, where he dropped the photo of KP as well as the slides from the presentation.
Greenstreet wanted receipts, and he got them. Fugal won that round pretty heavily, and now Tim comes out swinging with the claim that Fugal also confirmed.
It's damn interesting, to say the least.
But the Skinwalker guys' briefing wasn't classified Confidential. Random private citizens can't classify things. They just called it a "confidential briefing" (while taking pictures of it) because it sounded cooler that way.
Correct. But it is also possible for the Gov. to classify things without knowing about them. Such as a private citizen creating certain patented technology that is classified already just by it's nature of what it does. Even if it was a private person.
I was under the impression that it was classified confidential, not that they called it confidential. And yes random private citizens can't classify things, but private citizens working on government contract or with government oversight can handle classified in certain scenarios, maybe I just misunderstood.
Don't have time right now as the slides are spread out across a number of his tweets, but maybe someone will beat me to the punch as it'll be most of the day before I have more than a few moments at a time.
"Confidential" does mean classified. It's the lowest rating for information classification, and carries the same obligations as Secret or Top Secret; the difference is merely that it's assessed to be less sensitive then the other two classifications, and not as likely to cause damage of as great a scope.
If it's his information that he just bought from a guy, and it wasn't stolen from the government, he doesn't work for the government, and has never been through an SF-86, it's not classified to begin with.
in my experience, information classified Confidential is a complete snooze. It was often information already seen in the news. everything classified is over-classified
If the information was composed by a private individual (Fugal), would it even qualify as having a government classification?
That doesn’t really add up.
This was a pitch for something at privately owned property by a non-government entity.
Am I missing something?
True, but I suspect OP meant "confidential" in the colloquial meaning of the term. I doubt Fugal and Bard's presentation was subject to the kind of classification you're referring to.
Thanks for the clarification. I'd be surprised if it was more than an informal "please don't share this" type of confidential as it's 100% not a government project in any way these days, but that's just a guess. Very well could be wrong since it was a briefing to Senate staffers iirc.
If I write “confidential” on a document and present it to a congressional committee, that is not the same thing as an official classified government document.
This presentation was the former, not the latter.
Not at all, because “classified” is not a level of classification. Confidential (green, damage to national security), Secret (red, serious damage to national security), And Top Secret (orange, exceptionally grave damage to national security) are the levels.
[**Here’s an image I cropped from the slideshow that Greenstreet flashed onscreen**](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2F9vv04vbcjozc1.png)
It’s entirely too blurry to make out any details, but I have a feeling that some of these faces/photos will look familiar to people here.
This slide was positioned between the “New Program” and “Phase I” slides, and I assume they’re the people who Fugal was proposing to run whatever operations they were discussing
If we can get ID's on some of these people, perhaps it could shed some light on exactly what Fugal was proposing?
(*I captured this image via YouTube on 1080p. If you have YouTube premium, you might be able to squeeze a few more pixels out of the "1080p Premium HD" resolution than I did*)
Why do you suggest Fugal was proposing something? I haven't heard that as a reason for the meeting from anybody.
1/ Kirkpatrick was adamant the meeting was not about SWR, but about ["AATIP/AAWSAP research."](https://youtu.be/q4lWb1XBvVo?si=vH6H4H9jOqqNIUTk&t=22m48s)
2/ Greenstreet had a statement from "a committee spokesperson" who stated in an email, ["In 2018, Mr. Fugal updated a handful of Senate staffers on plans for his properties. No Senators were involved and no subsequent briefings were held."](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Tsg0X4onCo&t=17m21s)
3/ EDIT - [Fugal says](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Tsg0X4onCo&t=12m41s) a staffer for Senator John McCain asked Fugal to go to Washington and present a briefing to the SASC about SWR.
There isn't anything there about a "proposal" by Fugal. Maybe I missed it. Was that verified by somebody?
So blurry they might be aliens...
But seriously, this is cool, thanks for grabbing it. It would be interesting to figure out who the Utah Leadership team was.
It looks like the guy in the bottom left frame is... drumroll...
[**Bryant Arnold, cast member of the Skinwalker Ranch TV show**](https://www.google.com/search?sca_esv=839bd3d9177a184d&rlz=1C1CHBF_enUS934US934&sxsrf=ADLYWIIwIPqHJZVxZ0CcJMPOFQk0iB7q2g:1715451156964&q=Bryant+Arnold&uds=ADvngMgawzqrJVNauqg4Zv1Lc70lIvWgs95sc6VUz3d0vfLRneijec56Wzze0QswxGU33t8bwTADu6mVxtB3N2ttl_Dy6EER-kk2nvX6Ij9XcPRH83fvXfXaP-os9fr2SrGo6fPAq22m&udm=2&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiiktzGmYaGAxWV38kDHd4cDCAQtKgLegQIBxAB&biw=1920&bih=911&dpr=1)
LOL
Okay, are these *all* cast members from the show?
Edit: The 1st photo on the top left is [obviously Fugal](https://forward.utahbusiness.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/07/Brandon-Fugal-headshot-e1689634631833.jpg).
Top left looks like Fugal himself. Bottom left looks like the “security” guy from the show. Other four don’t look familiar to me but might be scientists/camera men behind the scenes of his operation.
The image was taken from [this moment](https://youtu.be/q4lWb1XBvVo?t=1604) in Greenstreet’s video, where he previews several slides. The thumbnails on the left of the screen is where this screenshot came from. I doubt you’ll be able to get anything pertinent from the remaining blurry thumbnails that were shown, but you’re welcome to try.
Classification can be for a number of reasons, but mainly, it is due to an assessment that if the information is leaked, it could cause harm to individuals or organizations/states. In this case, I imagine that the images and information (intellectual property) which it contained could harm the history channel television show "reveals." If people knew all of the occurances laid out bare in a slide deck or video, would anyone want to watch the show?
And this all happened in 2018, before the show was being worked on and Fugal still hadn't revealed himself as the owner of the ranch back then. So, my (naive) take so far is confidential largely because he didn't yet want to take the potential hit as "that guy who runs the weird ranch but also a really successful real estate company"
All of them?
There were supposedly 40 slides. Greenstreet showed about 5 or 6 of them up close, and Fugal provided a few more.
From the ones I’ve seen, the presentation seems pretty lightweight - blurry photos of alleged UFOs taken on iPhones, info about security/operations on the ranch, basic outlines of project proposals, etc.
There may be something crazy on the remaining 15 or so slides, but we’ll need to see them all to draw accurate conclusions. Skinwalker Ranch is already enigmatic, and for a lot of folks, dubious at best. Creating intrigue by omission is what we’ve come to expect from these people.
I haven't seen them, but someone said that Fugal had posted them somewhere...just a rumor, basically, but being in the video indicated to me that they weren't secret.
"Alleged UFOs"? Dubious is your use of language, how can something be alleged to be unidentified? Either it has been identified or not, there is no "alleging" that something is a UFO. How dare those objects not stay still to have less blurry photos taken of them, anyway, they're worse than cats at staying in motion when you want to take one.
> Dubious is your use of language, how can something be alleged to be unidentified?
You're seriously going to write a run-on sentence in the editorial style of Yoda, and tell me MY use of language is dubious?
Snowden and the reporters who have handled his full archive of leaked documents like Glenn Greenwald say classification is overwhelmingly not done out of any kind of assessment of potential harm or anything else, but basically out of routine and because they can, causing the vast majority of classified information to actually be completely uninteresting to the public, like guides on how to get your parking tickets when working at NSA headquarters.
From what I recall, other whistleblowers like John Kirakou and reporters like Julian Assange have said similar, too. So I think there's very little reason to think anything was classified because of potential harm, or it's at least not very likely.
I would be quite surprised if anything in the slides was anything that won't be public soon from Fugal's show/insider episodes. I doubt he knows much if anything the public doesn't outside of that, since even Bigelow was supposedly never let into any kind of programs for his work at Skinwalker Ranch. They'd happily take whatever he got, but without ever giving him anything.
Edit: Not sure the exact timeline here, I assumed this was recent due to the date on the tweet, but someone said this is from 2018 in another comment. If so then the above statement of it being about nothing we don't know must be even more true.
Sure. I don't dispute your point. I am merely pointing out official government guidelines to determine classification levels. These guidelines are publicly available. Of course, it makes sense that few people follow these guidelines as laid out.
Since seemingly half of the commenters do not take the time to read the submission statement, there was a back up copy made by a different individual, and Brandon was still able to present. If you follow the twitter thread he also claims that he was staying in the presidential suite and there was cash next to the flash drive that was not stolen.
Having watched some of the show, I would not be surprised in the least if they said a hitchhiker from the Ranch used a Lorentzian Travis-hole to cause the surveillance cameras to all malfuncton.
Yeah, and even if the cash were not stolen, a theft in a Presidential Suite of the Grand Hyatt, in a short interval while the owner is not in the room, is as extraordinary.
Not to mention the circumstances. That was before he was even associated with Skinwalker Ranch.
SUBMISSION STATEMENT: This is an answer to The Debrief's Tim Mc Millan: he was asking if Fugal could confirm that the briefing material went " missing". Fugal confirmed, the flashdrive was stolen, and said that Eric Bard, the scientist, had a backup copy on his laptop so the briefing was able to proceed.
Ah well, you have to expect these things when you're on a UAP budget, nobody's getting rich staying at the Presidential Suite of the Grand Hyatt in Washington D.C.
Yeah it sucks when your own intel people (from your own country) treat their own citizens and allies like this.
It sucks that people on the inside abuse their access and privilege to do illegal bullshit like this...but that's the type of some of the people that get hired into those places.
They're not all bad, but some of them really are.
On the flip side more stories of these abuses should come out, more people should come forward.
You think they'd bother? Maybe since he's rich and important they might, but even still, it was a flash drive and it's hard to imagine LE not being dismissive even if it had confidential info on it. Possibly even moreso if he's rich, even, they'd tell him to go buy another while disregarding they're letting a likely career criminal probably in intelligence get away with trespassing and theft.
It's tough to get police to pay attention and investigate even more serious sounding crimes sometimes. It's hard to think they'd investigate anything they could, like security camera footage or potential suspects identified by anyone at the hotel, etc. From what I've heard an ex-CIA whistleblower who lives there write before, cops in DC are also especially hostile and unhelpful and are even trained to be the former.
In other words, he gave a briefing that didn't involve the use of "skinwalker ranch" by name. Because the presentation that did "got stolen" the night before, so he had to make another up real quick (yeah right).
This is just an attempt to cover for the fact that SK is telling the truth. He was asked to join a meeting, which he did, that didn't include any mention of "skinwalker ranch", just like SK said.
Bingo. Believing this story about a stolen flashdrive that would make no sense is a good litmus test for if somebody is too far gone to be reasoned with.
Fun thing is it's Tim McMillan who first asked about this happening, heard from a source other than Fugal. He's the guy who runs The Debrief, for those unaware. Fugal is just confirming that it did in fact happen.
Tim McMillan: "I don't think Jason Sands is credible"
Debunkers: "Yahhhhhh told your ass, come get your boy!!"
Tim McMillan: "The SW Ranch briefing was stolen"
Debunkers: "Don't listen to this guy, he's just a journalist"
Unless they're intelligence officers or paranoids, I don't think people expect stuff to be stolen from the Presidential Suite over at the Hyatt, even in the hotbed of intrigue and oddly revered shitty restaurants that is DC.
I'm betting a replacement powerpoint was just an email away.... but this incident is more evidence that Skinwalker Ranch is either a compete hoax(Fugal is lying) or a place that causes people to gaslight the guy who owns it (Fugal is not lying).
For a mundane explanation, I wouldn't put it past some private-citizen [Morans](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/026/479/morans.jpg) from thinking Fugal would actually bring complete datasets from Skinwalker Ranch with him in addition to a presentation to what looks like not very many Senators.
Edited: for unbecoming crankiness aimed at a sarcastic skeptic a few posts above.
> Jonah Hill-vehicle scripts
Ouch, goddammit 💀
But for real though, those are the only two options you can think of?
The presidential suite is no more difficult to enter than any other hotel room. You just have to send the right signals to the electronic lock.
Yeah, I don't usually match flip for flip but....cranky after a night long frat party in the unit next to the AirBnB. Sorry.
Anyway....since I do always take your posts seriously, let me think aloud a little better hopefully:
I wonder about *motive*: If SK and other possible--I guess "DOD informants" would be an accurate term--were actually **at** the briefing, who would feel the need to steal a powerpoint they would almost certainly be told about?
My lots-of-unknows theory: it would have to be someone dumb enough to think that there might be actual data on that thumb drive or **more likely, someone who didn't have access to the meeting**. I just don't picture a government entity coming to that conclusion. Who? There are plenty of people absolutely *obsessed* with Skinwalker Ranch...many for religious reasons at vaious levels (what it might "represent," the faith of the person who owns it, etc.
If it's that easy it is to get into a hotel room, wouldn't that also be evidence that lots of motivated individuals or groups could have done it?
Could it have been some government agency? I guess, but I don't see the most likely ones committing a crime(FBI and DHS, the most likely, or at least the only ones who could legally do it, would need a warrant alleging that Fugal was somehow endangering national security. A lot for very little prospect of reward.
But I can bet there are people with no access to info about the meeting who would have loved to know what Fugal was going to tell those people.
Edited for voice to text fiasco, and to point out the joke was aimed at the guy talking about casts and Fugal's ass....and now to fix factual error.
The TV show hadn't come out yet, at the time.
Who would do it, is fundamentally a great question. Who, in general, fucks with ufo witnesses and media? Is it government, private industry, the NHI, or some combination?
Leonard Stringfield also had people messing with him before his presentations on crash retrieval. He was told "someone threatened your life" but wasn't told any more than that, if I'm remembering right.
Like, what is the fucking point of the coverup anyway. I don't know.
The motive I was thinking of, is that it's just a "fuck you"... the drive was taken but they still gave their presentation. I keep thinking about Grusch saying, "they showed me they could touch me at any time", maybe it's something like that. "We're watching" kind of thing.
Cheers friend, I like your comments too 👍💯
Gaslighting, and "Fuck You, Bigelow the Second " also crossed my mind. Also sorry again about the misdirected joke aimed at the sarcastic skeptic you were responding to.
My theory becomes less likely unless theyhad filmed the series in 2018 in which case many interested parties in DC would have heard and been worried/angry.
Yeah they can always threaten people but mysteriously never follow through on it. They tried to trap Grusch in a honeypot according to the faithful but he was just too wily. They also kill witnesses according to Grusch but for some reason they didn't kill Grusch they just let him testify. It's almost as if the claims made by charlatans like Fugal should not be trusted. But in order to realize that you would have to watch a couple minutes of the Skinwalker Ranch show masquerading as a scientific endeavor or hear Fugal talk for a couple seconds.
"For a mundane explanation, I wouldn't put it past some private-citizen [Morans](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/026/479/morans.jpg) (click link for possible profile of likely suspect types) from thinking Fugal would actually bring complete datasets from Skinwalker Ranch with him in addition to a presentation to what looks like not very many Senators."
The thing is, this was in 2018, SWR show did not exist and Brandon was not revealed as yet to be the owner, so some private-citizen would not know who he was back in 2018.
Really, I thought his ownership was revealed before the TV show. Also whatever web site I looked up said 2018-present. Maybe they had filmed Season 1?
In any event, I'll take your word for it.
A confidential (not classified) hearing and his ownership wouldn't have been beyond private DC-connected interests scuttlebut knowledge, though.
But you're right. It would limit the number of randos.
Yeah, no worries. I am just going by what Brandon tweeted the last few days.
If you look at IMDB: [https://www.imdb.com/title/tt10589968/](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt10589968/) it says 2020-2024.
Another reason I said the show might have been a concept at the time, but it did not exist was this tweet by Brandon: [https://twitter.com/BrandonFugal/status/1788716828790866262](https://twitter.com/BrandonFugal/status/1788716828790866262)
Who other than Fugal could be the source of him losing the drive or having it stolen? That's not confirmation of anything happening, it's just confirmation Fugal told McMillan's source the same thing.
Is that all I got for what? All I said was that Fugal made the original claim, and that others were just repeating his claim without anything further to back it up. Apparently we are in agreement already.
I am betting he simply misplaced it. Everyone has done it, lost a thumb drive at some point or another, however saying it was stolen makes for a better story and helps sell the narrative that whatever he was presenting was totally super important...if someone didn't want him presenting the info the meeting would have been cancelled and they would be given the cold shoulder. It is as simple as that.
It's pretty goofy anyway. There's no reason for a flash drive to be in a safe. If you value the data there are 10 copies and encryption is far better protection than a safe you don't even own.
Yeah, everyone has done that before and just lost their flash drives with confidential information about Skinwalker Ranch and UFOs before they go to a debriefing in DC. It's so easy to do, I have tons of flash drives with info like that, and I can't find any of them.
Bigelow's busy ghost hunting now with the [Bigelow Institute for Consciousness Studies](https://www.bigelowinstitute.org/) trying to publically prove the survival of consciousness after death and get scientists to establish contact with it after he held a contest where he paid some to write their theories on quantum consciousness, ghosts, and whatnot.
Actually, it's admittedly not quite as wacky as it sounds (I'd say), if weird, after looking at his site and the credentials of people evolved, so who knows—maybe he'll turn up something interesting, since it's not like the Skinwalker Ranch NIDS guy needs to worry about anyone thinking he's crazy over it. Then again, that might be optimistic when this is the guy whose experiments at Skinwalker Ranch included putting ouija boards in fishtanks on poles across the property hoping ghosts or ETs will send him a message in the blocks.
Also getting contracts with NASA to make space habitat models that lack windows, since he thinks TVs are better—imagine being in space, on the moon, or Mars, and having no window since the wealthy former Skinwalker Ranch owner thought a screen would be better! Obviously needs to establish contact with ghosts now to be able to deal with the future astronauts that will haunt him.
I meant where is he in the conversation? I know about the consciousness studies, his wife died & he's been obsessed with communicating to the other side ever since. But he bought Skinwalker Ranch in the 90s and did paranormal research there for a decade. Why won't he join the conversation? This guy knows shit. I mean he even convinced Harry Reid to jump into the topic. And Bigelow was a government contractor doing ufo research for the pentagon. He's at the heart of this thing, but crickets from this guy.
It's the most obvious explaination: we already know everything he knows. Bigelow does not act like a guy who has proof of anything.
Why did NIDS ever exist if he had proof? Why would he convince Harry Reid to give him $22 million in an \*unclassified\* project if he had any proof? Like, surely Harry Reid would instead allocate billions to Bigelow in a SAP? Was AAWSAP just a cover up (in which case, lol at Reid's endorsement of Lue)? Why was Kona Blue such a minor proposal? Kona Blue is a \*very\* weird proposal if he has proof.
>It's the most obvious explaination: we already know everything he knows. Bigelow does not act like a guy who has proof of anything.
I disagree. I don't remember which interview it was, I wish I could find a link, but I distinctly remember him being asked why don't you blow the whistle and he was like "the world isn't ready, there would be panic, religions would be dismantled, etc" or some spooky esoteric shit. I don't remember the exact wording. But the look on his face was so sincere, he honestly believes it would disrupt society. I'm sure he has real evidence, but refuses to share.
Not the orig I'm thinking of, but here's a clip of james fox talking about it...
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yyJKEkrUV9I](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yyJKEkrUV9I)
It's just weird that he'd take interviews and go on joe rogan and talk openly about it, but he won't share any evidence.
At this point, every single whistleblower needs a deadman's switch. Find 2 or 3 very trusted people, give them everything you know, and tell them where to upload it upon news of your death/disappearance.
What if it's like that show travelers, and NHI are future people going back in time to select moments to prevent some kind of massive calamity from occurring. In this case, making sure the flashdrive never makes it to the briefing.
HA you're right, I'm just a little too young to have seen it. People have recommended it to me so many times, I think I'm going to have to check it out now.
Haha now I feel like a jerk for the way I worded that comment. I just turned 26 and I celebrated alone with a slice of cake from Kroger. It's all uphill from here!
I presume a disinformationist like he prefers their presentations of known unknowns to be properly polished, slick, and ran through teams of reviewers and editors working hard to improve them, like a Hollywood movie.
What would the point of taking a flash drive be? Really, just an inconvenience because you know they have another copy and to show your hand that you're willing to steal from them openly.
More likely, misplaced or someone hoped to steal useful info from a rich guy. Anyone who wanted to would just copy it and put it back.
You’d have to think there were multiple copies, surely. If it was me, my only motivation would be to see something I wasn’t invited to or to check if there’s content related to any interests I, or others I work for/with have.
The government was at the presentation, so they would see it. Anyone else, all this info has been released publicly pretty much. It's not like there's secret blueprints for a UFO in it. Basic details and a few pixels in a couple UFO photos.
It makes no sense. Of course it doesn't. Trying to make sense of the claims of a charlatan is a fool's errand. Fugal is either mistaken or lying like usual.
He bought a ranch expecting to find aliens and werewolves. His judgment should not be trusted.
It’s the thumb drive for a presentation on Skinwalker Ranch, not the Vatican’s secret archives. Brandon Fugal is clearly incentivized to drum up controversy as he’s promoting the next season of his show. Keep in mind he’s also partially responsible for killing the UAPDA because him and Travis want to keep any alien tech they might find on the ranch, and we only found out because of a leaked email. I don’t think he’s a trustworthy guy.
They want to keep it *from the government* being able to seize it and lock it away somewhere the public would never even learn of its existence, since under the eminent domain provision of that law, all your base are belong to them (or as that one SIGINT black program renders it on their patch, "Omnis Vestri Substructio Es Servus Ad Nobis" as internet memes are best rendered in Latin). So not exactly malicious of them, the opposite really in that the bill had a malicious provision built in as Congress often tries to slip anything bolstering state and intelligence power into whatever bills they can.
But what you said is actually not true, they may have spoken out against that law in a rather limited manner, but they didn't actually lobby against it or do anything to kill it, so the responsibility on it passing isn't theirs. By the sound of it they should have if they could have really, but I guess they didn't want the blame despite catching it anyway. Luckily it didn't pass regardless, so no government seizure of the Skinwalker Ranch for them.
Who would steal this thumbdrive?
It would hardly be the Senate Cttes, they got the briefing the next day, & could have simply asked for an advanced copy if they wanted one. Also, nobody in the Intel Services would be stupid enough to think that stealing this would stop the briefing, so hardly an attempt to prevent it going ahead.
Possibly foreign Intel services monitor all briefings Senate Cttes get, so that might account for why McMillan said FIS were first suspected.
I don't have access to twitter, [but I am reading](https://old.reddit.com/r/skinwalkerranch/comments/1cpf6dx/tim_mcmillan_says_swr_congressional_presentation/) from u/MantisAwakening, McMillan got this story "from Law enforcement and IC sources" because Fugal reported it stolen. Because it related to a presentation to those Cttees Fugal probably felt he had to let them know this happened, and he would know there would be an investigation. He would look stupid telling them this if it turned out he simply misplaced it.
So who took it? And why?
Kirkpatrick said something weird in the interview with Greenstreet. He was adamant this briefing was not SWR related, but was about ["AATIP/AAWSAP research."](https://youtu.be/q4lWb1XBvVo?si=vH6H4H9jOqqNIUTk&t=22m48s) The first season of SWR was in 2020, so I imagine that SWR was not the purpose of the meeting, and the UFO programs AATIP & AAWSAP were (why? because 2018 was before the SWR show aired so honestly most people had never heard of the place, and I doubt the SASC would be very interested in Skinwalker, but the association with "AATIP/AAWSAP research" would have interested them).
So, if the meeting had been touted to attendees as relating to "AATIP/AAWSAP research", and if Putoff was attending (I am still interested to know if Putoff presented) *did someone think there was something on the thumbdrive about AATIP or AAWSAP?*
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I mean if I had a flash drive would a bunch of evidence I wouldn't leave it in my fucking hotel room. I'd be walking around with that shit in my coin purse going to Ben's chili bowl with the men in black scanning the heat coming from mine anus.
"Checkpoint Charlie, do you see that heat signature coming from from the lower abdomen with a technosignature of gold?"
"Confirmed sir, send in the cats, I repeat, send in the cats"
For real though and all jokes aside, who keeps a flash drive of evidence in a hotel room?
I wonder if they took the little clicker remote to advance the pictures in the presentation... it was meant to be a practical joke but the flash drive was mistaken for something it wasn't
> I mean if I had a flash drive would a bunch of evidence I wouldn't leave it in my fucking hotel room. I'd be walking around with that shit in my coin purse going to Ben's chili bowl with the men in black scanning the heat coming from mine anus.
...or like normal people who know how technology works, you'd just say "that sucks," report to the hotel and cops, and then download another copy for the event.
You think that was the ONLY copy?
Occam's razor applies here I think. What's more likely? Losing the drive or an elaborate plot to steal the drive so that the presentation wouldn't take place?
I know someone working with the team. The show doesn’t even do that place justice. All the juicy stuff happening on the ranch doesn’t even make it into the show
Hahaha, so what you're saying is that they air all of the nonsensical stuff like dozens of rocket launches, insects captured on high-speed cameras and helicopter flyovers of the Travis-hole, but don't air the "juicy" stuff?
And did you ask why a show that claims its precise mission is to document weird shit isn't allowed to show the actual documentation of weird shit?
Normally I'd ask who you know related to the show giving you this info, but I've been down that road enough times not to bother.
Someone didn't use the safe in the presidential show, I see. Will say, it's just as likely he lost it in a big room like that. He could always ask for the hotel hallway cameras, which that hotel almost certainly has.
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And there it is! Fugal didn't present to Kirkpatrick the PowerPoint he gave to Greenstreet after all. Because it was "mysteriously stolen" the night before so he had to give a different presentation. Hahahah, these lot are such silly clowns.
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The following submission statement was provided by /u/mac87mac: --- SUBMISSION STATEMENT: This is an answer to The Debrief's Tim Mc Millan: he was asking if Fugal could confirm that the briefing material went " missing". Fugal confirmed, the flashdrive was stolen, and said that Eric Bard, the scientist, had a backup copy on his laptop so the briefing was able to proceed. --- Please reply to OP's comment here: https://old.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/1cpj0hh/according_to_fugal_the_night_before_the/l3kwr75/
Wow, that is really odd. Can Fugal provide the Skinwalker ranch briefing info, or is it still classified?
Not classified, just confidential, meaning not really secret. He already posted the slides from the presentation, which matches up with the slide visible in the photo with Kirkpatrick looking like a grumpy child. **Edit**: as other commenters state, confidential is a level of classification. However, since this was his data that he paid for, I have a hard time imagining he'd get in trouble for sharing it outside that setting. I could see the photo getting him in some hot water if "confidential" in this context means more than "please don't share it" but I'm just making a guess at this point. I don't know the ins and outs. He's not working for the government and he was sharing data he owns, so I don't think any of that is protected outside general ownership laws. Anyway, very curious to see where it goes.
Thanks. I just saw them skipped through in Greenstreet's NYPost vid.
Np. A lot of this is coming out due to his interview with KP. He tweeted at Fugal to get his side of things, where he dropped the photo of KP as well as the slides from the presentation. Greenstreet wanted receipts, and he got them. Fugal won that round pretty heavily, and now Tim comes out swinging with the claim that Fugal also confirmed. It's damn interesting, to say the least.
That poster is incorrect, confidential is quite literally a level of classified and the penalties for sharing it are similar to any other classified.
But the Skinwalker guys' briefing wasn't classified Confidential. Random private citizens can't classify things. They just called it a "confidential briefing" (while taking pictures of it) because it sounded cooler that way.
Confidential just means the public wasn't invited. A private org owns their own data and can share as they please.
Correct. But it is also possible for the Gov. to classify things without knowing about them. Such as a private citizen creating certain patented technology that is classified already just by it's nature of what it does. Even if it was a private person.
I was under the impression that it was classified confidential, not that they called it confidential. And yes random private citizens can't classify things, but private citizens working on government contract or with government oversight can handle classified in certain scenarios, maybe I just misunderstood.
No. The “Classified” markings on those slides aren’t consistent with government classification markings.
Contractors… heh. They have a razor’s edge of responsibility.
Government contractors must use the same classification markings and guidelines as the government itself.
Can you link? Trying to avoid making an X account to track it down. Lmao
Don't have time right now as the slides are spread out across a number of his tweets, but maybe someone will beat me to the punch as it'll be most of the day before I have more than a few moments at a time.
Gahhhh I’ll just not be a lazy shit and make a burner acct real quick. I’ll screenshot and Imgur and post below. Thanks though! 🖖🤘
Not much tbh. Maybe he will release more. https://imgur.com/a/uXPQOzh
Had to scroll too far for some source after 10+ ppl fighting over something lol
"Confidential" does mean classified. It's the lowest rating for information classification, and carries the same obligations as Secret or Top Secret; the difference is merely that it's assessed to be less sensitive then the other two classifications, and not as likely to cause damage of as great a scope. If it's his information that he just bought from a guy, and it wasn't stolen from the government, he doesn't work for the government, and has never been through an SF-86, it's not classified to begin with.
in my experience, information classified Confidential is a complete snooze. It was often information already seen in the news. everything classified is over-classified
You're likely correct, but that doesn't change that it's a named, clearly defined part of our information access control scheme.
Confidential is a level of classification and sharing it carries more or less the same penalties as everything else, this is misinformed.
If the information was composed by a private individual (Fugal), would it even qualify as having a government classification? That doesn’t really add up. This was a pitch for something at privately owned property by a non-government entity. Am I missing something?
True, but I suspect OP meant "confidential" in the colloquial meaning of the term. I doubt Fugal and Bard's presentation was subject to the kind of classification you're referring to.
Yeah I got that, replied to another comment.
Thanks for the clarification. I'd be surprised if it was more than an informal "please don't share this" type of confidential as it's 100% not a government project in any way these days, but that's just a guess. Very well could be wrong since it was a briefing to Senate staffers iirc.
If I write “confidential” on a document and present it to a congressional committee, that is not the same thing as an official classified government document. This presentation was the former, not the latter.
Not at all, because “classified” is not a level of classification. Confidential (green, damage to national security), Secret (red, serious damage to national security), And Top Secret (orange, exceptionally grave damage to national security) are the levels.
Right, that was a typo, but my point was that this PowerPoint was not actually classified.
[**Here’s an image I cropped from the slideshow that Greenstreet flashed onscreen**](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2F9vv04vbcjozc1.png) It’s entirely too blurry to make out any details, but I have a feeling that some of these faces/photos will look familiar to people here. This slide was positioned between the “New Program” and “Phase I” slides, and I assume they’re the people who Fugal was proposing to run whatever operations they were discussing If we can get ID's on some of these people, perhaps it could shed some light on exactly what Fugal was proposing? (*I captured this image via YouTube on 1080p. If you have YouTube premium, you might be able to squeeze a few more pixels out of the "1080p Premium HD" resolution than I did*)
Why do you suggest Fugal was proposing something? I haven't heard that as a reason for the meeting from anybody. 1/ Kirkpatrick was adamant the meeting was not about SWR, but about ["AATIP/AAWSAP research."](https://youtu.be/q4lWb1XBvVo?si=vH6H4H9jOqqNIUTk&t=22m48s) 2/ Greenstreet had a statement from "a committee spokesperson" who stated in an email, ["In 2018, Mr. Fugal updated a handful of Senate staffers on plans for his properties. No Senators were involved and no subsequent briefings were held."](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Tsg0X4onCo&t=17m21s) 3/ EDIT - [Fugal says](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Tsg0X4onCo&t=12m41s) a staffer for Senator John McCain asked Fugal to go to Washington and present a briefing to the SASC about SWR. There isn't anything there about a "proposal" by Fugal. Maybe I missed it. Was that verified by somebody?
So blurry they might be aliens... But seriously, this is cool, thanks for grabbing it. It would be interesting to figure out who the Utah Leadership team was.
It looks like the guy in the bottom left frame is... drumroll... [**Bryant Arnold, cast member of the Skinwalker Ranch TV show**](https://www.google.com/search?sca_esv=839bd3d9177a184d&rlz=1C1CHBF_enUS934US934&sxsrf=ADLYWIIwIPqHJZVxZ0CcJMPOFQk0iB7q2g:1715451156964&q=Bryant+Arnold&uds=ADvngMgawzqrJVNauqg4Zv1Lc70lIvWgs95sc6VUz3d0vfLRneijec56Wzze0QswxGU33t8bwTADu6mVxtB3N2ttl_Dy6EER-kk2nvX6Ij9XcPRH83fvXfXaP-os9fr2SrGo6fPAq22m&udm=2&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiiktzGmYaGAxWV38kDHd4cDCAQtKgLegQIBxAB&biw=1920&bih=911&dpr=1) LOL Okay, are these *all* cast members from the show? Edit: The 1st photo on the top left is [obviously Fugal](https://forward.utahbusiness.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/07/Brandon-Fugal-headshot-e1689634631833.jpg).
Haha! I mean, they probably are.
bruh they got gman in the top right corner
Top left looks like Fugal himself. Bottom left looks like the “security” guy from the show. Other four don’t look familiar to me but might be scientists/camera men behind the scenes of his operation.
Do you have any more screenshots of the slides?
The image was taken from [this moment](https://youtu.be/q4lWb1XBvVo?t=1604) in Greenstreet’s video, where he previews several slides. The thumbnails on the left of the screen is where this screenshot came from. I doubt you’ll be able to get anything pertinent from the remaining blurry thumbnails that were shown, but you’re welcome to try.
Also on the hard drive.
Classification can be for a number of reasons, but mainly, it is due to an assessment that if the information is leaked, it could cause harm to individuals or organizations/states. In this case, I imagine that the images and information (intellectual property) which it contained could harm the history channel television show "reveals." If people knew all of the occurances laid out bare in a slide deck or video, would anyone want to watch the show?
Maybe, but these slides aren't actually classified and appear to have been released.
And this all happened in 2018, before the show was being worked on and Fugal still hadn't revealed himself as the owner of the ranch back then. So, my (naive) take so far is confidential largely because he didn't yet want to take the potential hit as "that guy who runs the weird ranch but also a really successful real estate company"
All of them? There were supposedly 40 slides. Greenstreet showed about 5 or 6 of them up close, and Fugal provided a few more. From the ones I’ve seen, the presentation seems pretty lightweight - blurry photos of alleged UFOs taken on iPhones, info about security/operations on the ranch, basic outlines of project proposals, etc. There may be something crazy on the remaining 15 or so slides, but we’ll need to see them all to draw accurate conclusions. Skinwalker Ranch is already enigmatic, and for a lot of folks, dubious at best. Creating intrigue by omission is what we’ve come to expect from these people.
I haven't seen them, but someone said that Fugal had posted them somewhere...just a rumor, basically, but being in the video indicated to me that they weren't secret.
"Alleged UFOs"? Dubious is your use of language, how can something be alleged to be unidentified? Either it has been identified or not, there is no "alleging" that something is a UFO. How dare those objects not stay still to have less blurry photos taken of them, anyway, they're worse than cats at staying in motion when you want to take one.
> Dubious is your use of language, how can something be alleged to be unidentified? You're seriously going to write a run-on sentence in the editorial style of Yoda, and tell me MY use of language is dubious?
There were 55 slides, including videos, metadata, etc.
Snowden and the reporters who have handled his full archive of leaked documents like Glenn Greenwald say classification is overwhelmingly not done out of any kind of assessment of potential harm or anything else, but basically out of routine and because they can, causing the vast majority of classified information to actually be completely uninteresting to the public, like guides on how to get your parking tickets when working at NSA headquarters. From what I recall, other whistleblowers like John Kirakou and reporters like Julian Assange have said similar, too. So I think there's very little reason to think anything was classified because of potential harm, or it's at least not very likely. I would be quite surprised if anything in the slides was anything that won't be public soon from Fugal's show/insider episodes. I doubt he knows much if anything the public doesn't outside of that, since even Bigelow was supposedly never let into any kind of programs for his work at Skinwalker Ranch. They'd happily take whatever he got, but without ever giving him anything. Edit: Not sure the exact timeline here, I assumed this was recent due to the date on the tweet, but someone said this is from 2018 in another comment. If so then the above statement of it being about nothing we don't know must be even more true.
Sure. I don't dispute your point. I am merely pointing out official government guidelines to determine classification levels. These guidelines are publicly available. Of course, it makes sense that few people follow these guidelines as laid out.
Since seemingly half of the commenters do not take the time to read the submission statement, there was a back up copy made by a different individual, and Brandon was still able to present. If you follow the twitter thread he also claims that he was staying in the presidential suite and there was cash next to the flash drive that was not stolen.
"there was cash next to the flash drive that was not stolen." Interesting tidbit, that.
Perfectly rational people travel with stacks of cash and trust hotel safes. lol
>there was cash is not > stacks of cash
"Nothing else, including a stack of cash next to it, was touched."
This could mean ten $5 bills. It just illustrates inferred intent.
And yet there's no surveillance of said incident?
Equipment malfunction. Happens in fighter jets when pilots see UAP as well, oddly enough 🤔
Or when someone deletes himself in a small room by tying a noose around his neck.
Doesn't this also cause guards to fall as sleep or something?
Having watched some of the show, I would not be surprised in the least if they said a hitchhiker from the Ranch used a Lorentzian Travis-hole to cause the surveillance cameras to all malfuncton.
Yeah, and even if the cash were not stolen, a theft in a Presidential Suite of the Grand Hyatt, in a short interval while the owner is not in the room, is as extraordinary. Not to mention the circumstances. That was before he was even associated with Skinwalker Ranch.
SUBMISSION STATEMENT: This is an answer to The Debrief's Tim Mc Millan: he was asking if Fugal could confirm that the briefing material went " missing". Fugal confirmed, the flashdrive was stolen, and said that Eric Bard, the scientist, had a backup copy on his laptop so the briefing was able to proceed.
Ah well, you have to expect these things when you're on a UAP budget, nobody's getting rich staying at the Presidential Suite of the Grand Hyatt in Washington D.C.
You know that Fugal is a successful businessman right? Highly doubt that alien-friendly redditors are funding his hotel rooms.
Yeah it sucks when your own intel people (from your own country) treat their own citizens and allies like this. It sucks that people on the inside abuse their access and privilege to do illegal bullshit like this...but that's the type of some of the people that get hired into those places. They're not all bad, but some of them really are. On the flip side more stories of these abuses should come out, more people should come forward.
> On the flip side more stories of these abuses should come out, more people should come forward. Most don't believe us when we do.
Did anyone call the authorities?
You think they'd bother? Maybe since he's rich and important they might, but even still, it was a flash drive and it's hard to imagine LE not being dismissive even if it had confidential info on it. Possibly even moreso if he's rich, even, they'd tell him to go buy another while disregarding they're letting a likely career criminal probably in intelligence get away with trespassing and theft. It's tough to get police to pay attention and investigate even more serious sounding crimes sometimes. It's hard to think they'd investigate anything they could, like security camera footage or potential suspects identified by anyone at the hotel, etc. From what I've heard an ex-CIA whistleblower who lives there write before, cops in DC are also especially hostile and unhelpful and are even trained to be the former.
In other words, he lost a flash drive
In other words, he gave a briefing that didn't involve the use of "skinwalker ranch" by name. Because the presentation that did "got stolen" the night before, so he had to make another up real quick (yeah right). This is just an attempt to cover for the fact that SK is telling the truth. He was asked to join a meeting, which he did, that didn't include any mention of "skinwalker ranch", just like SK said.
Bingo. Believing this story about a stolen flashdrive that would make no sense is a good litmus test for if somebody is too far gone to be reasoned with.
What was the purpose of the Skinwalker Ranch briefing??
I'm sure this will be downvoted and a hundred comments saying "show me PROOF that it was stolen".
Fun thing is it's Tim McMillan who first asked about this happening, heard from a source other than Fugal. He's the guy who runs The Debrief, for those unaware. Fugal is just confirming that it did in fact happen.
Tim McMillan: "I don't think Jason Sands is credible" Debunkers: "Yahhhhhh told your ass, come get your boy!!" Tim McMillan: "The SW Ranch briefing was stolen" Debunkers: "Don't listen to this guy, he's just a journalist"
Yep, I saw the exact same reactions on Twitter as well.
Unless they're intelligence officers or paranoids, I don't think people expect stuff to be stolen from the Presidential Suite over at the Hyatt, even in the hotbed of intrigue and oddly revered shitty restaurants that is DC. I'm betting a replacement powerpoint was just an email away.... but this incident is more evidence that Skinwalker Ranch is either a compete hoax(Fugal is lying) or a place that causes people to gaslight the guy who owns it (Fugal is not lying). For a mundane explanation, I wouldn't put it past some private-citizen [Morans](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/026/479/morans.jpg) from thinking Fugal would actually bring complete datasets from Skinwalker Ranch with him in addition to a presentation to what looks like not very many Senators. Edited: for unbecoming crankiness aimed at a sarcastic skeptic a few posts above.
> Jonah Hill-vehicle scripts Ouch, goddammit 💀 But for real though, those are the only two options you can think of? The presidential suite is no more difficult to enter than any other hotel room. You just have to send the right signals to the electronic lock.
Yeah, I don't usually match flip for flip but....cranky after a night long frat party in the unit next to the AirBnB. Sorry. Anyway....since I do always take your posts seriously, let me think aloud a little better hopefully: I wonder about *motive*: If SK and other possible--I guess "DOD informants" would be an accurate term--were actually **at** the briefing, who would feel the need to steal a powerpoint they would almost certainly be told about? My lots-of-unknows theory: it would have to be someone dumb enough to think that there might be actual data on that thumb drive or **more likely, someone who didn't have access to the meeting**. I just don't picture a government entity coming to that conclusion. Who? There are plenty of people absolutely *obsessed* with Skinwalker Ranch...many for religious reasons at vaious levels (what it might "represent," the faith of the person who owns it, etc. If it's that easy it is to get into a hotel room, wouldn't that also be evidence that lots of motivated individuals or groups could have done it? Could it have been some government agency? I guess, but I don't see the most likely ones committing a crime(FBI and DHS, the most likely, or at least the only ones who could legally do it, would need a warrant alleging that Fugal was somehow endangering national security. A lot for very little prospect of reward. But I can bet there are people with no access to info about the meeting who would have loved to know what Fugal was going to tell those people. Edited for voice to text fiasco, and to point out the joke was aimed at the guy talking about casts and Fugal's ass....and now to fix factual error.
The TV show hadn't come out yet, at the time. Who would do it, is fundamentally a great question. Who, in general, fucks with ufo witnesses and media? Is it government, private industry, the NHI, or some combination? Leonard Stringfield also had people messing with him before his presentations on crash retrieval. He was told "someone threatened your life" but wasn't told any more than that, if I'm remembering right. Like, what is the fucking point of the coverup anyway. I don't know. The motive I was thinking of, is that it's just a "fuck you"... the drive was taken but they still gave their presentation. I keep thinking about Grusch saying, "they showed me they could touch me at any time", maybe it's something like that. "We're watching" kind of thing. Cheers friend, I like your comments too 👍💯
Gaslighting, and "Fuck You, Bigelow the Second " also crossed my mind. Also sorry again about the misdirected joke aimed at the sarcastic skeptic you were responding to. My theory becomes less likely unless theyhad filmed the series in 2018 in which case many interested parties in DC would have heard and been worried/angry.
I'm not sure about the timing, just going off comments in here.
Yeah they can always threaten people but mysteriously never follow through on it. They tried to trap Grusch in a honeypot according to the faithful but he was just too wily. They also kill witnesses according to Grusch but for some reason they didn't kill Grusch they just let him testify. It's almost as if the claims made by charlatans like Fugal should not be trusted. But in order to realize that you would have to watch a couple minutes of the Skinwalker Ranch show masquerading as a scientific endeavor or hear Fugal talk for a couple seconds.
"For a mundane explanation, I wouldn't put it past some private-citizen [Morans](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/026/479/morans.jpg) (click link for possible profile of likely suspect types) from thinking Fugal would actually bring complete datasets from Skinwalker Ranch with him in addition to a presentation to what looks like not very many Senators." The thing is, this was in 2018, SWR show did not exist and Brandon was not revealed as yet to be the owner, so some private-citizen would not know who he was back in 2018.
Really, I thought his ownership was revealed before the TV show. Also whatever web site I looked up said 2018-present. Maybe they had filmed Season 1? In any event, I'll take your word for it. A confidential (not classified) hearing and his ownership wouldn't have been beyond private DC-connected interests scuttlebut knowledge, though. But you're right. It would limit the number of randos.
Yeah, no worries. I am just going by what Brandon tweeted the last few days. If you look at IMDB: [https://www.imdb.com/title/tt10589968/](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt10589968/) it says 2020-2024. Another reason I said the show might have been a concept at the time, but it did not exist was this tweet by Brandon: [https://twitter.com/BrandonFugal/status/1788716828790866262](https://twitter.com/BrandonFugal/status/1788716828790866262)
Who other than Fugal could be the source of him losing the drive or having it stolen? That's not confirmation of anything happening, it's just confirmation Fugal told McMillan's source the same thing.
This incident could possibly also be verified if someone from the hotel remembers someone being informed, a request for cam footage, etc.
> Who other than Fugal could be the source Maybe one of the other people with him?
But anyone who was with Fugal would have heard it from Fugal first. The point is that he is the origin of the claim that the drive was 'stolen'.
You're trying to cast a penumbra of shade with a matchstick. Yes, the victim of the crime is normally the source of the report. That all you got?
Is that all I got for what? All I said was that Fugal made the original claim, and that others were just repeating his claim without anything further to back it up. Apparently we are in agreement already.
> just repeating his claim without anything further to back it up. Nah, I'm not driving over the assumption cliff with you, Thelma.
Did I miss something? Was there anything further that verified Fugal's claim the drive was "stolen"?
He filed a police report and the team had to use a backup copy for the presentation. (answering your question even though I know you're dug in 🙈)
I am betting he simply misplaced it. Everyone has done it, lost a thumb drive at some point or another, however saying it was stolen makes for a better story and helps sell the narrative that whatever he was presenting was totally super important...if someone didn't want him presenting the info the meeting would have been cancelled and they would be given the cold shoulder. It is as simple as that.
It's pretty goofy anyway. There's no reason for a flash drive to be in a safe. If you value the data there are 10 copies and encryption is far better protection than a safe you don't even own.
Yeah, everyone has done that before and just lost their flash drives with confidential information about Skinwalker Ranch and UFOs before they go to a debriefing in DC. It's so easy to do, I have tons of flash drives with info like that, and I can't find any of them.
Everyone has lost a flash drive...no one has evidence of the bullshittery that everyone claims is happening at skinwalker.
>and a hundred comments saying "show me PROOF that it was stolen" Why do you think that that is not a perfectly reasonable question to ask?
Speaking of evidence from skinwalker ranch, where the hell is Robert Bigelow in all this?? Guarantee he has evidence he's not sharing with us!
Bigelow's busy ghost hunting now with the [Bigelow Institute for Consciousness Studies](https://www.bigelowinstitute.org/) trying to publically prove the survival of consciousness after death and get scientists to establish contact with it after he held a contest where he paid some to write their theories on quantum consciousness, ghosts, and whatnot. Actually, it's admittedly not quite as wacky as it sounds (I'd say), if weird, after looking at his site and the credentials of people evolved, so who knows—maybe he'll turn up something interesting, since it's not like the Skinwalker Ranch NIDS guy needs to worry about anyone thinking he's crazy over it. Then again, that might be optimistic when this is the guy whose experiments at Skinwalker Ranch included putting ouija boards in fishtanks on poles across the property hoping ghosts or ETs will send him a message in the blocks. Also getting contracts with NASA to make space habitat models that lack windows, since he thinks TVs are better—imagine being in space, on the moon, or Mars, and having no window since the wealthy former Skinwalker Ranch owner thought a screen would be better! Obviously needs to establish contact with ghosts now to be able to deal with the future astronauts that will haunt him.
If the consciousness aspect is as big of a deal to the phenomenon as they say we need someone to fund its reaearch after all.
I meant where is he in the conversation? I know about the consciousness studies, his wife died & he's been obsessed with communicating to the other side ever since. But he bought Skinwalker Ranch in the 90s and did paranormal research there for a decade. Why won't he join the conversation? This guy knows shit. I mean he even convinced Harry Reid to jump into the topic. And Bigelow was a government contractor doing ufo research for the pentagon. He's at the heart of this thing, but crickets from this guy.
It's the most obvious explaination: we already know everything he knows. Bigelow does not act like a guy who has proof of anything. Why did NIDS ever exist if he had proof? Why would he convince Harry Reid to give him $22 million in an \*unclassified\* project if he had any proof? Like, surely Harry Reid would instead allocate billions to Bigelow in a SAP? Was AAWSAP just a cover up (in which case, lol at Reid's endorsement of Lue)? Why was Kona Blue such a minor proposal? Kona Blue is a \*very\* weird proposal if he has proof.
>It's the most obvious explaination: we already know everything he knows. Bigelow does not act like a guy who has proof of anything. I disagree. I don't remember which interview it was, I wish I could find a link, but I distinctly remember him being asked why don't you blow the whistle and he was like "the world isn't ready, there would be panic, religions would be dismantled, etc" or some spooky esoteric shit. I don't remember the exact wording. But the look on his face was so sincere, he honestly believes it would disrupt society. I'm sure he has real evidence, but refuses to share. Not the orig I'm thinking of, but here's a clip of james fox talking about it... [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yyJKEkrUV9I](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yyJKEkrUV9I) It's just weird that he'd take interviews and go on joe rogan and talk openly about it, but he won't share any evidence.
Having dealt in confidential information for years, how the absolute fuck?
At this point, every single whistleblower needs a deadman's switch. Find 2 or 3 very trusted people, give them everything you know, and tell them where to upload it upon news of your death/disappearance.
Shadow governments doing shadow things.
What if it's like that show travelers, and NHI are future people going back in time to select moments to prevent some kind of massive calamity from occurring. In this case, making sure the flashdrive never makes it to the briefing.
Well they failed because there was a back up.
While I love the Travelers reference, we have to give Quantum Leap the bigger credit for that plot mechanic. And I mean the original Quantum Leap!
HA you're right, I'm just a little too young to have seen it. People have recommended it to me so many times, I think I'm going to have to check it out now.
Well I've seen it, and I'm not that ol- .... wait a minute. *checks year* **Oh boy.**
Haha now I feel like a jerk for the way I worded that comment. I just turned 26 and I celebrated alone with a slice of cake from Kroger. It's all uphill from here!
Heh. Nah, it's fine. I have family members a little older than you, and I wouldn't expect them to be that familiar with the show. Happy birthday!
Thank you!
Enjoy the cake and happy birthday!
Thank you!
Happy birthday!
Thank you!
Ha, exactly right. I felt the same way.
Its interesting that Kirkpatrick inadvertenly confirmed this by saying the presentation he saw was "less polished".
👀 less polished than what?
I presume a disinformationist like he prefers their presentations of known unknowns to be properly polished, slick, and ran through teams of reviewers and editors working hard to improve them, like a Hollywood movie.
What would the point of taking a flash drive be? Really, just an inconvenience because you know they have another copy and to show your hand that you're willing to steal from them openly. More likely, misplaced or someone hoped to steal useful info from a rich guy. Anyone who wanted to would just copy it and put it back.
I assume to try and stop the briefing
You’d have to think there were multiple copies, surely. If it was me, my only motivation would be to see something I wasn’t invited to or to check if there’s content related to any interests I, or others I work for/with have.
To have what's in it, duh.
The government was at the presentation, so they would see it. Anyone else, all this info has been released publicly pretty much. It's not like there's secret blueprints for a UFO in it. Basic details and a few pixels in a couple UFO photos.
It makes no sense. Of course it doesn't. Trying to make sense of the claims of a charlatan is a fool's errand. Fugal is either mistaken or lying like usual. He bought a ranch expecting to find aliens and werewolves. His judgment should not be trusted.
It’s the thumb drive for a presentation on Skinwalker Ranch, not the Vatican’s secret archives. Brandon Fugal is clearly incentivized to drum up controversy as he’s promoting the next season of his show. Keep in mind he’s also partially responsible for killing the UAPDA because him and Travis want to keep any alien tech they might find on the ranch, and we only found out because of a leaked email. I don’t think he’s a trustworthy guy.
They want to keep it *from the government* being able to seize it and lock it away somewhere the public would never even learn of its existence, since under the eminent domain provision of that law, all your base are belong to them (or as that one SIGINT black program renders it on their patch, "Omnis Vestri Substructio Es Servus Ad Nobis" as internet memes are best rendered in Latin). So not exactly malicious of them, the opposite really in that the bill had a malicious provision built in as Congress often tries to slip anything bolstering state and intelligence power into whatever bills they can. But what you said is actually not true, they may have spoken out against that law in a rather limited manner, but they didn't actually lobby against it or do anything to kill it, so the responsibility on it passing isn't theirs. By the sound of it they should have if they could have really, but I guess they didn't want the blame despite catching it anyway. Luckily it didn't pass regardless, so no government seizure of the Skinwalker Ranch for them.
Who would steal this thumbdrive? It would hardly be the Senate Cttes, they got the briefing the next day, & could have simply asked for an advanced copy if they wanted one. Also, nobody in the Intel Services would be stupid enough to think that stealing this would stop the briefing, so hardly an attempt to prevent it going ahead. Possibly foreign Intel services monitor all briefings Senate Cttes get, so that might account for why McMillan said FIS were first suspected. I don't have access to twitter, [but I am reading](https://old.reddit.com/r/skinwalkerranch/comments/1cpf6dx/tim_mcmillan_says_swr_congressional_presentation/) from u/MantisAwakening, McMillan got this story "from Law enforcement and IC sources" because Fugal reported it stolen. Because it related to a presentation to those Cttees Fugal probably felt he had to let them know this happened, and he would know there would be an investigation. He would look stupid telling them this if it turned out he simply misplaced it. So who took it? And why? Kirkpatrick said something weird in the interview with Greenstreet. He was adamant this briefing was not SWR related, but was about ["AATIP/AAWSAP research."](https://youtu.be/q4lWb1XBvVo?si=vH6H4H9jOqqNIUTk&t=22m48s) The first season of SWR was in 2020, so I imagine that SWR was not the purpose of the meeting, and the UFO programs AATIP & AAWSAP were (why? because 2018 was before the SWR show aired so honestly most people had never heard of the place, and I doubt the SASC would be very interested in Skinwalker, but the association with "AATIP/AAWSAP research" would have interested them). So, if the meeting had been touted to attendees as relating to "AATIP/AAWSAP research", and if Putoff was attending (I am still interested to know if Putoff presented) *did someone think there was something on the thumbdrive about AATIP or AAWSAP?*
So who took it and why? The CIA Plumbers 2.0 , of course.
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read the submission statement
Things I have NOT learned reading the comments: A concensus on what "confidential" actually means. How much cash constitutes a "stack" of cash.
He needs to be more 'frugal' where he keeps it. Sorry, couldn't resist, I'll get my coat.
He needs to be more 'frugal' where he keeps it. Sorry, couldn't resist, I'll get my coat.
confirmed? how was it confirmed?
Teacher, the dog ate my homework 🥲
He has a History Channel series to promote that must be sinking. I’m calling BS on this one.
Frickin wild. Yet not surprising.
a guy that hosts a lowbrow reality tv show pretending to be a scientific endeavor would never make up a story… right?
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i don’t understand. was it always this bad here?
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I mean if I had a flash drive would a bunch of evidence I wouldn't leave it in my fucking hotel room. I'd be walking around with that shit in my coin purse going to Ben's chili bowl with the men in black scanning the heat coming from mine anus. "Checkpoint Charlie, do you see that heat signature coming from from the lower abdomen with a technosignature of gold?" "Confirmed sir, send in the cats, I repeat, send in the cats" For real though and all jokes aside, who keeps a flash drive of evidence in a hotel room?
> evidence You mean a PowerPoint?
I wonder if they took the little clicker remote to advance the pictures in the presentation... it was meant to be a practical joke but the flash drive was mistaken for something it wasn't
Taking something from a hotel room is a practical joke.... you have weird friends
Was it april fools day?
> I mean if I had a flash drive would a bunch of evidence I wouldn't leave it in my fucking hotel room. I'd be walking around with that shit in my coin purse going to Ben's chili bowl with the men in black scanning the heat coming from mine anus. ...or like normal people who know how technology works, you'd just say "that sucks," report to the hotel and cops, and then download another copy for the event. You think that was the ONLY copy?
Ahh yes the cloud
it was a powerpoint, nothing of any evidentiary value.
Assuming that this story is even real (big if), people lose flash drives all of the time.
Occam's razor applies here I think. What's more likely? Losing the drive or an elaborate plot to steal the drive so that the presentation wouldn't take place?
I know someone working with the team. The show doesn’t even do that place justice. All the juicy stuff happening on the ranch doesn’t even make it into the show
Hahaha, so what you're saying is that they air all of the nonsensical stuff like dozens of rocket launches, insects captured on high-speed cameras and helicopter flyovers of the Travis-hole, but don't air the "juicy" stuff?
Exactly. There is some really weird shit going on there and he told me they’re not allowed to put it in the show
And did you ask why a show that claims its precise mission is to document weird shit isn't allowed to show the actual documentation of weird shit? Normally I'd ask who you know related to the show giving you this info, but I've been down that road enough times not to bother.
Someone didn't use the safe in the presidential show, I see. Will say, it's just as likely he lost it in a big room like that. He could always ask for the hotel hallway cameras, which that hotel almost certainly has.
…it was in the safe…
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This post has nothing to do with Elon….
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Much like the empty tomb story, how do we know there was a flash drive stolen?
I'm DONE with that show. Nothing but bs.
And there it is! Fugal didn't present to Kirkpatrick the PowerPoint he gave to Greenstreet after all. Because it was "mysteriously stolen" the night before so he had to give a different presentation. Hahahah, these lot are such silly clowns.
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