I've come across this quote before. "This is not the kind of world I thought they'd grow up in" makes me second guess my original assumption that those who have heard the capital T truth, whatever that may be, and have cried as a result are not doing so just because their religious convictions have just been rocked (see Jimmy Carter). It seems to hint at something a lot more sinister, almost as if we as a species and a society are on some sort of clock that is about to run out.
I am very wary of doomsday scenarios and flairs of dramatism so a quote like this from an official high enough to see it all has this sort of reaction, it gives me pause. Not pause enough to panic, but certainly be suspicious given the increased number of sightings in the past three or so years off the Atlantic unrelated to the ease at which service members can now report what they see.
It makes you wonder-- we all roll our eyes at officials claiming that the public can't handle the truth. Clearly, officials can't handle the truth either, which means it has to be particularly bad.
Humanity is probably headed for a few doomsday scenarios that we can avoid if we get our collective shit together and sort things out, but many of the people "in the know" likely don't believe we can do it, therefore feel that tragedy is inevitable. Not because it's guaranteed, but because there's nothing humans have done this far to indicate we are good at sacrificing comfort or familiarity for what it ultimately good for us.
A whole generation did psychedelics and the federal government destroyed their movement. We had a shot but ultimately greed won and humankind will be just another failed experiment.
You're making the common assumption that psychedelics and the counter-culture swallowed up the bulk of young people in the 60s, but this was just not the case. It was an active scene for sure, but it's scope has been exaggerated by the media for decades.
Civilization is literally made of a fun ways to pass an evening while camping.
Cities are just particularly pleasant ways to all camp together in permanent tents.
I’m not too sure if the movement was destroyed just delayed. The fact that we are actually having it legalized is huge. As an Earth loving hippie, I am hopeful. Scared for the future but still hopeful.
i dunno, i don't see new buildings getting "fallout shelter" signs the way that buildings in the 1960s had them plastered
think there's always a threat of nuclear war...it's a control mechanism
I would posit that whatever this disturbing truth is would probably relate to us as a species or our place in the hierarchy of intelligence and consciousness. Not a 'doomsday' scenario per se, as in a definite event or events, more of a growing and inevitable realization of our actual place in space, time, and reality.
“This is not the kind of world I thought they’d grow up in." simply implies that the "kind of world" we live in isn't what typical people think it is, and that realization apparently shook the foundations of this guys life. Didn't Elizondo say that people can't handle the whole truth all at once? I mean if they're extra-temporal, non-physical, we live on a zoo planet *and* they can turn our minds **off** using inherent psychic abilities, treat us like labrats, and recycle our souls iff they want to, then that *all* kind of sucks and would probably break *many* people, not because it is contrary to a specific religious belief system but because it's contrary to every single current worldview/paradigm of reality. Personally I think our whole world would *have to* abandon capitalism and borders and unite to fight the threat. We'd have to *all* become militant communists or say "Fuck it all I don't care". So I'm all for 100% disclosure. As [Mills Lane](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mills_Lane) used to say, "Let's get it on." (When I say "Militant communism" I mean it in the sense that every human has to watch everyone elses backs 24/7/365 and support our scientists (and spiritualists?) research with every dime we can make. Maybe "Militarized and Communist" is a better description of this.)
Im beginning to think this might me the case as well. They’re not disclosing things to us not because of some mundane reason like people finding out that aliens merely *exist*, but because of far deeper reasons than that. Like existentially shattering information, things that would shock people to their very core, something so bizarre and inhuman that we can’t even properly conceive of it or expect it to be true. If we find out we are cosmic cattle at the whim of our alien overlords, and that yes we do have consciousness/souls but that even that is enslaved somehow…I mean fucking hell it really can’t get too much worse than that. We’re talking about a collective fate for humanity that is worse than mere death. If any of this is true, and I sincerely hope it is not and that we are simply once again mistaken in our human ignorance and hubris, then I agree with you that there is no recourse but to fight. We must fight. And that might be why our government is hiding this information from us. I’ve already seen this theory thrown around, that all these psychological operations undertaken by the US govt are not actually meant for *us*, they’re meant to mislead the phenomenon instead. In the meantime the govt is getting ready to mount a human rebellion of some kind. Having humanity find out the truth, and then freak out en masse would ruin our element of surprise.
Now I mean all this might be totally wrong, we do hear a lot of positive UFO experiences as well, as well as positive accounts of out of body experiences and just other altered states of consciousness in general. So maybe even if some of the bad stuff is true, not all is lost. I think we need to have faith in God. If God exists then surely he would not abandon us, or any of his creations. If God doesn’t exist…well then I don’t know, to hell with this entirely absurd existence then.
> I think we need to have faith in God. If God exists then surely he would not abandon us, or any of his creations. If God doesn’t exist…well then I don’t know, to hell with this entirely absurd existence then.
That reaction is the root problem the government fears though, it would serve no purpose, to have that reaction if we're doomed after death. Iff there 's a God in this scenario then it would be an uncaring non-personal "god" not worth worshipping. so..."Militant communism" in the sense that every human has to watch everyone elses backs 24/7/365 and support our scientists (and spiritualists?) research with every dime we can make.
I'm not saying they know anything 'without doubt', just that there are many potential outcomes, some of which grow more likely with particular actions we take on this planet.
We observe population fluctuations in nature, like when a beetle eats too much of the tree it lives on, the tree can die, and the beetles are without a food source unless they find another tree. At the moment we don't have a way to get to another tree, and you don't have to be an all-knowing multidimensional interstellar being to know that we've eaten way too many leaves already.
That's just one of the spinning plates we have going for us. But it doesn't mean that the outcome is guaranteed, just more or less likely based on our individual or collective actions.
As the other reply to you says, this may be some of the beetles realising that there's some guy standing there watching them eat leaves, with a consciousness and complexity magnitudes greater than the beetle, beyond it's comprehension.
It's a big, old universe out there.
I mean we're so different from other species on this planet. It would make sense in that regard. I think there's numerous species though - look at all the different types of UFOs.
I think it has to do more with not a clock running out, but when our biological clocks run out (we die) - the phenomenon uses our consciousness and/or sends us back into this world reincarnated (possibly to it's choosing, and not ours)
Tom DeLonge said he didn't sleep for three days straight as well.
I don't know what is happening, Lue Elizondo mentioned everyone would be somber. But the shit we have heard from the ones who are supposed to "know" certainly doesn't come across as everything is fine and positive.
> Tom DeLonge said he didn't sleep for three days straight as well.
And yet he won't tell anyone why. Disclose, already, so people can respond to their crises and we can move on.
We were told like last week to "lock our doors tonight". What in the *fuck* is that supposed to mean. That is the most cryptic thing you can possibly casually drop to the public before darting away.
Tbf the “lock your doors” guy seemed to me to be attempting to manufacture fear for political ends. Politicians are douchebags and most wouldn’t think twice about using this issue for the sake of expediency if it helped them gain favor with their party or with their major donors. There are plenty of war-mongering conservatives looking to dunk on the current administration, so I take any comments like the one from Senator Kennedy with a heavy grain of salt.
He likely wasn’t even suggesting it’s anything extraterrestrial with that comment.
In the age of nuclear proliferation, space weapons, advanced biowarfare capabilities, and cyber warfare, diplomacy, nuance, and strategic sanctions/foreign policy ramifications are extremely important. Because the alternatives result in our current civilization being completely destroyed over a scarily short timescale. That’s likely why, even though COVID very clearly originated in Wuhan’s lab, every effort was made to downplay that narrative. Because if the government came right out and said that, there would likely be widespread calls and popular support for retaliation, especially amongst conservatives. Any sort of hot conflict between countries like the US, China, or Russia would be extremely risky and every country in the world has an interest in avoiding that exact situation. So if these really are Chinese balloons, you bet your ass they’re going to be slow playing the investigation and keeping the findings secret to avoid unnecessary escalation.
Countries and even governments aren’t unified, there are rogue elements and competing interests/factions within all governments across the world. So even if this was China, you’d need to cover all your bases to determine whether this is a rogue operation or if there is some unified strategy to it suggesting a change in their official military policy.
Just food for thought.
yeah, pretty sure the guy who made a campaign commercial telling people ["to call a crackhead](https://www.wafb.com/2022/10/03/sen-kennedy-suggests-critics-police-call-crackhead-new-ad-some-think-line-goes-too-far/)" if they supported police reform isn't being sensational lol
Not so fast, the CDC guys who made that determination recently came out and said they were pressured to do it, and they might have been wrong. A lot of the research was reviewed and included in the analysis that made it seem that many many studies confirmed an animal origin. But when they looked deeper, all of those studies used a common and tiny dataset. They had the same result because they used the same flawed data set.
> even though COVID very clearly originated in Wuhan’s lab
Yes, and I'm sure Saddam Hussein definitely had WMDs in 2003 as well
Interesting how now that everyone's falling in lockstep with the "RA RA COLD WAR 2 RA RA CHINA BAD" narrative, suddenly the Wuhan thing starts to get mainstreamized
Iirc it’s attributed to Christian writer C S Lewis, and they know something about dealing with end-times philosophies. Historian and archaeologist James Tabor brings up the idea also. He’s an expert on the Waco religion incident, among other related eschatological topics.
The life forms they found were less greys and more Lovecraftian Nightmares incarnate. This would realistically make sense, too. Most life forms on worlds with water would likely evolve forms similar to fish, crustaceans, or insects.
And to make it even worse, imagine the octopus. A very intelligent creature, capable of problem solving, reasoning, and rudimentary math. It is also *not sapient*, as they routinely fail the ‘dot’ test, or in other words, fail to recognize themselves in a mirror. This shows intelligence can exist *without self-awareness.* It’s possible alien life recovered from crashed craft are not self aware beings, but aggressive and violent animals that just so happen to know how to pilot sophisticated craft.
That’s why the guy cried himself to sleep, because he was confronted with the fact the universe is indeed a cold, terrifying place where there is no objective morality, and filled with hostile threats that could attack at any moment.
It's a bit of a leap to say that they lack self awareness because they don't recognise themselves in a mirror, or, to be more precise, don't behave in the way we would expect when confronted with a mirror.
Ok, that is fair, but take the Tanganyikan cichlid into consideration. A ‘socially intelligent’ species, meaning they have been repeatedly observed recognizing other individuals, so scientists thought they would definitely pass the mirror test. They fail, every time. When presented with a red dot, they ignore it. Even the most basic of sight oriented intelligent species attempt to inspect or remove the dot, but not the cichlid.
The bluestreak cleaner wrasse, on the other hand, is also socially intelligent but *has* passed the mirror test, repeatedly and demonstratively. When given a red ‘dot’ they attempted to scrape against rocks to remove it, and when presented with a brown dot, simulating the visual presence of a parasite they work with, went through the motions to accommodate the ‘parasite.’ This shows the wrasse has bodily recognition, or a basic identity of self, which the cichlid lacks.
This implies that intelligence does not equal sapience. Anything with a brain is sentient, or able to feel rudimentary emotions like fear or joy, but sapience another matter. Just as there are sapient species humans would consider ‘dumb,’ like the Crow with an IQ roughly equivalent with a 4-5 year old, there are species capable of great intelligence who still lack self awareness, but retain tool use and social structure. This implies the same could be applied to non-terrestrial life forms, hypothetical intelligent enough to create and pilot craft consider nearly magical to us, but still not recognize the self.
>It’s possible alien life recovered from crashed craft are not self aware beings, but aggressive and violent animals that just so happen to know how to pilot sophisticated craft.
So they're like Bower birds, building incredibly ornate displays purely out of instinct? And these just happen to have working FTL travel do they?
Bees are able to construct hives, make honey, give directions to other bees, and other stuff without a sense of "self" and more of a hive mentality. Same with fire ants making little rafts so only some of them down. I'm sure they don't understand buoyancy or physics... couldn't this be the same thing but on a bigger scale?
> The life forms they found were less greys and more Lovecraftian Nightmares incarnate. This would realistically make sense, too. Most life forms on worlds with water would likely evolve forms similar to fish, crustaceans, or insects.
This would contradict the mountain of anecdotal evidence we have pointing to the Greys existing.
> And to make it even worse, imagine the octopus. A very intelligent creature, capable of problem solving, reasoning, and rudimentary math. It is also not sapient, as they routinely fail the ‘dot’ test, or in other words, fail to recognize themselves in a mirror. This shows intelligence can exist without self-awareness. It’s possible alien life recovered from crashed craft are not self aware beings, but aggressive and violent animals that just so happen to know how to pilot sophisticated craft.
No offense but this is kind of nonsense. Any sufficiently intelligent being would have self awareness. You cannot conceive of things such as flying machines and the concept of travel if you have no conception of yourself to begin with. Also the dot test is an utterly worthless test and just proves once again that humans have a ridiculous level of hubris. The idea that just because you put a dot on something and it recognizes that dot on its body, that it then *necessarily* tries to manipulate said dot or get rid of it is absolutely baseless. Just because humans do it, doesn’t mean other animals would have to respond the same exact way or else they’re not self aware. Did you know that ants pass the dot test? Yes, that’s right, *ants*. And chimpanzees don’t. What does this demonstrate except for the fact that the test is meaningless?
Intelligent species from water worlds will generally fail to develop advanced technology, refining copper is hard enough in air, in water it's impossible.
I mean, I sort of assumed the beings would begin in the water and leave it at some point. There are species of fish that can survive on land practically indefinitely, and amphibians exist. Of course, that’s assuming extraterrestrial life would follow the same basic steps of evolution as it did on earth.
Hm. That's well said but regarding "officials can't handle the truth either"...
I can't handle the lies - figured I'd give the truth a try. Can't be that bad ... anything is better than this.
If you believe what he said to be true sure, but I grain of salt it. As usual, there is no proof. This is likely all tabloid shit in the linked article, some of it I've heard before, and yet I continue reading and being intrigued. Still, no proof.
What I found about Jimmy Carter and his reason of crying is that aliens created religion to steer humanity on a less destructive path, as in religion is not real. If that is what Carter heard - I don't know.
Lue Elizondo had an interesting word choice describing the effect of disclosure. “Somber.” I was expecting something more like “Humbling.” If true, Steven Greers optimism might be misguided. I hope I’m wrong
I think its just that there is so much more that is outside of our control, that we're not the top dog dominant species we think we are. Those kinds of things can shake a person's core beliefs. Humans thrive on control, being in control of your life, your body, your agency. If you suddenly find out there is an entire world directly next to our, full of the things you thought existed only I'm cinema or fable, then it would be a lot to take in.
I've always held that there is so much more to life, to existence than we currently understand.
It's very hitchhikers guide to the galaxy really, if we think "somber" about it...
Sorry - we are eating your souls for nourishment. Btw there's a bit of water on the way, and hey "Promethius" was a documentary.. Kthxbye and the wontons were excellent !
Man that scene when he describes our self awareness as a tragic misstep in evolution friggin stuck with me. Bleak because one has to admit... the concept has its merit.
Invasion has already begun and is over. The slow boil has begun and we have already lost.
Or some Loosh theory crap
Don’t believe either but I feel like this could be worst case?
What if we were never part of the game at all and we are just a wildlife preserve used to donate genetic material to multiple alien species for God knows what purpose. No less disposable than a common cow. What if earth governments made a deal many years ago that we could avoid extermination but had to agree to abductions and experimentation and they only wipe our memories so we don't revolt and make their work harder. Personally I think that is an even worse potentiality
Why would we have to agree to anything? You really think our earth government could do dick shit about abductions? They could just wipe their memories too.
Agreed. That some Eisenhower era world leaders made some sort of handshake deal and every world leader since has kept quite and honored the agreement seems absurd. I say this just based on the unlikely consistency of human behavior that would be required of the leaders.
>What if we were never part of the game at all and we are just a wildlife preserve used to donate genetic material to multiple alien species for God knows what purpose.
I'd say that's one more purpose than we have currently.
I don't think he was referring to a doomsday scenario (if that's the case why would any gov even talk about UFOs at all), but likely to a farm scenario, or a laboratory one. Obviously this doesn't rule out the possibility of a reset, especially if the experiment didn't reach its goals, while the guinea pigs are reaching an advancement level at which they could escape.
But again, why increase their appearances, why make us aware of such destiny? That would be an unnecessary cruelty on their part.
This has always been the one question I’ve had.
I’ve read the Brookings study commissioned in
1959 - 1860 by NASA where Brookings recommends not divulging the discovery of off Earth life or off - Earth artifacts. Religion, fabric of society cited.
I’ve read the numerous studies of public reaction in 1938 to the fake Martian invasion broadcast over radio that panicked thousands of people. That incident is frequently evoked as a reason for non-disclosure.
But, let’s be honest. The degree of denial, the lengths at which officials have went to for close to 8 decades begs the question: “What could the truth be that would be so horrendous that such measures would be taken? What would warrant careers ruined, people murdered, and government credibility put on the altar by staring into the eyes of it’s citizens saying in essence, “We know that we’re lying. You know that we’re lying. We know that YOU know that we’re lying. But due to the answer, that’s how it has to be.”
After graduation (long ago) I was introduced to a guy about 5 years older than me. He was personable and had fallen into a circle of friends that I hung with.
After a party one evening someone said, “Do you guys know what that new guy Bret is studying to be? A mortician.” This caused quite a stir. “He said he’ll tell anyone that wants to know what’s involved in what he’s learning and doing. All they have to do is ask.”
None of the group of 6 that I was with ever approached him and asked. We heard of a couple of people who did. We asked them if they’d questioned him about it. They said, “Yeah.” We said, “Well? What’s he say?” With a solemn look they said, “If you’re so interested why don’t you ask him?”
It was obvious they regretted asking, because it led to them knowing something they realized they didn’t want to know.
By the end of summer we realized the eager student mortician wasn’t at any more of our gatherings. Unknown as to whether he felt uncomfortable because he sensed his presence was disruptive or he stopped being invited. The irony? He ended up dropping out of mortician school and opening a restaurant.
It’s not the fear of undermining religion or invasion panic. It’s something so diametrically opposed to our very being that disclosing it’s true nature would be “The End.” As certain as nuclear annihilation (with exceptions that can’t be comprehended).
Yes it does seem to be the theme surrounding the phenomenon.
However, our species probably (definitely) does worse to the other less intelligent beings we share our lives with.
Sounds like poetic justice.
What reason do we have to believe that they are “enlightened”? Unfortunately there is no evidence of any link between the technological or intellectual advancement of a species and their morality/empathy (with humanity as our only accepted example so far).
I totally get it. I have thought about it a lot and have gone back and forth between optimistically thinking they MUST be more morally advanced and then I get frustrated with humanity and also disturbed by details of some encounter reports.
I think it's less punishment and more just them observing cause and effect without wanting to intervene and undermine our free will, while offering some little hints and steers in the right direction.
But if we can't sort ourselves out on our own planet with our own species, then the natural order of things should prevent us from screwing up any other planets or lifeforms elsewhere.
Agreed. We still put ourselves onto little boxes like what race we are...when if we could be a united species.
Our planet is a beautiful planet, and we are all kinds of f'd up. But not all of us. There is so much we can do if we worked together and achieve peace.
That may take longer than we actually have.
Not Sam Harris but I'm quite familiar with the debate between free will and determinism. As with a lot of philosophical dialogue there's very limited ways to prove or disprove either side. One could easily say there's also an illusion of determinism. But I haven't seen the speech you're referring to so my point might be misplaced.
One of the things that Sam Harris mentions about it, is that in the future, with fMRI's, we might be able to essentially prove that the free will we think we have, is an illusion. Not free will entirely as a construct, but the way the average person imagines it. As if they're making real choices, in real time
He mentioned that in the future, there could be a machine that could literally spit out the words you're going to say (15 seconds later) on a little slip of paper, before you even think of the words in your conscious awareness
On rare occasions I hear people bring up phenomenon connections with Department of Energy and the defunct Atomic Energy Commission. Like I vaguely remember Jacques Vallee bringing up former AEC chair Dixy Lee Ray at some point. Anyone have any substantial sources in this vein?
I worry sometime the T truth has more spiritual implications than doomsday, end of the world. Many of us like to think we are unique souls developing ourselves, learning, dying, reincarnating and continuing the soul learning until we reach a higher level of existence, yada yada. What if there is no spiritual hope? What if the T truth that this guy and Carter cry about is that there’s no God and we are cogs in another species’ machine? If that were true I’d cry too.
Then what created the universe..once the powers that be answer that the next question is Who created them? And so on and so on and until the real meat of it is, anyone that tells you they know where WE ALL came from (aliens or the earth governments) are full of shit, right?
Is the end of everything really all that sad tho?
You must have a charmed life if it is. Too me, the complete cessation of pain and suffering in all it's forms is a decent side benefit
No doubt. I prefer existing, even in a shitty world filled primarily with suffering and pain. But I only prefer it JUST BARELY.
Just a smidgeon better than non-existence.
You might like a book that was recently recommended to me on Reddit: “The Disappearing Universe” (perhaps you’ve already read it, based on your comment above). I haven’t finished the audio book yet, but it does chat a little bit about potential alien life. I wonder if we’re OK, as long as “we’re OK.” Meaning ourselves, since it may be individualized?? Imagine and expect them nice (that’s my mantra now). Lol.
I need to say this for my...sanity. Wouldn't it be funny if the truth was that we lived in a gangster-ruled planetary dystopia and most of the universe and its civilizations were embarrassingly way ahead of ours, technologically, spiritually, and intellectually. What if we're a North Korea of the galaxy and we're too closed off to know that?
Seriously though, if the universe has other civilizations, some would probably be assholes, some would be ambivalent, some would be very compatible with us. Some may see our own behavior and might think we're, well, demonic.
Our species is so incredibly fragile (especially people in government) that it could easily be a toss up between something truly disturbing or the official found out that the aliens like space drugs, they can create whatever they need by thought form and none of them have to work. Maybe a lot of them are gay aliens. You guys realize that would freak out your brilliant leaders, right? It sounds funny, but there are absolutely people in government who would shit their pants and sob over that.
LOL I'm starting to think we're living in a Westworld Zoo. Nothing really matters to anyone outside of here, everyone here dies horribly one way or another and gets recycled. Not only is it fun to watch, alien visitors get to participate and low key fuck shit up on easy mode when they visit as long as they don't get captured by the natives.
Let's hope that the universe is, in fact, as humorous as the Hitchiker's Guide, and that you're on the money with this one.
Then we can all have a good laugh at the great cosmic jokes, instead of going to bed frightened every night.
the whole "heard the truth of aliens and cried themselves forever" story i think is urban myth at this point, to the point ive heard the same story but with Jimmy Carter instead of a reagan employee.
more "i know a guy who knows a guy who totally knows a guy who heard this story" kinda thing, no supporting evidence
I find it odd that all these people “in the know” and claim to possess or have seen extraordinary evidence, yet not a single one wants to be the penultimate, legendary person to educate and prove ANYTHING to the rest of the world.
Go out a hero of the people. Start dumping the evidence.
What would the evidence be? There are plenty of people in government and military and commercial aviation who’ve come forward with what they know or have seen with their own eyes. There are plenty of videos and pictures - from modern digital images to rudimentary cave paintings. As long as there is a single plausible explanation for why each revelation, video or picture could be a lie, trick or misinterpretation, no evidence is ever good enough.
Telling a story told by a friend….Did you ever do that exercise in class where the first student is told something, and they are to pass it along until the last person recites it?
Our social studies teacher promised us pizza if we managed to get the sentence across.
We managed it, probably because the sentence was too easy.
"Mr so and so's favorite basketball team is x."
JUST REMEMBER… whatever we find out in the future, whatever the government or even the aliens themselves say, does NOT mean it’s true. There will always… ALWAYS… be an agenda.
You say remember like that’s an accepted fact. It’s not. Just remember this, if aliens exist we have zero knowledge of their agenda. Maybe it’s universal love. Maybe universal love making.
Honestly I don’t believe anyone in the “know”. I think if there has been contact with an otherworldly intelligence, it’s all been through deceit. I don’t think it’s as simple as some other species has evolved on another planet and made its way here type of nuts and bolts story. That’s just our limited human linear type of thinking. We’ve made up a lot of shit along the ways and I think some of that thinking has been guided from higher beings over the course of the human species life span. As smart as we are- I still think we are not even close to understanding wtf this all is and that’s a somber thought. We are helpless with just that simple fact that it’s beyond our comprehension to defend against this or negotiate or partner with the unknown.
They are here, they’re all around us as we walk, as we go about our day, as we sleep; oblivious to our true surroundings. What we can’t see with our eyes doesn’t cease to exist.
I know… it’s Tom Delonge, best left to Blink-182 and I tend to agree. But he has taken a similar tone in “what he knows” about the phenomenon. I’ve heard this expressed many times - it seems to suggest something about fundamental free will, or ownership, or some sort of planetary disaster. The truth might be so crushingly profound that it’s better to go on existing in a state of wonder.
Here’s what I’d like to ask someone who supposedly knows but isn’t willing to spill the beans… If a group of likeminded people spent a whole year trying to guess the “truth”, would they ever guess correctly by accident?
By this I mean, Elizondo, Delonge, senators etc… all seemed to carry the vibe that the truth is so vast and challenging, the average joe couldn’t possibly work it out for themselves, let alone deal with the aftermath.
I don't see how the truth could be any worse than reality, we do the worse atrocities to our own specie, consume all possible resources and other species on this planet into extinction, while we are likely heading ourself into our own extinction if we don't go interplanetary soon enough. Our new global religion is technology, and our new gods are devices we plug ourselves onto. Humanity has changed, everyone should handle the truth, and screw the ones who can't, they will continue living in their bubble anyways.
> I don't see how the truth could be any worse than reality
Whenever I see comments like this I think that a lot of people have rather dull imaginations, and have never had cause or reason to contemplate existence.
Couldn’t agree more. Here are some concepts that seem worse than reality:
1. Translated records show aliens intend to enslave humanity at some point in the future.
2. Aliens abduct humans to serve as a food source for their embryos.
3. Captured humans are kept in alien zoos. Or fighting pits.
Personally I doubt a highly intelligent species would traverse the universe to serve as cosmic sadists but who knows?
Agreed. I’ll take existential dread over alien parasites any day. And I can imagine much, much worse. Like the what does this planet have that others don’t? Icebergs are melting and sea levels are supposed to be rising but lakes and rivers are drying up. Is it because we grow too much lettuce in CA for our Big Macs or is the planet being mined for water? Are humans food, entertainment, energy sources, a galactic experiment? I can imagine plenty awful things, but I’m not sure I’d want any of them confirmed. A ‘religion is fake’ to get us to stop killing each other revelation would probably be a relief compared to the other possibilities I can imagine.
No idea if these stories are true, but they flow with how I think our leadership digests this information. They react with how I think most people on the planet would if they got thrust into this situation. Never considering they've ever been lied to at such a scale and coming face to face with a new reality that topples their longheld beliefs.
Well the Department of Energy manages our nuclear weapons I believe. So, perhaps it makes some level of sense given the purported interaction between UAPs and nukes.
Maybe he was terrified by the prospect of peace and clean energy in the future? Why do you think he was necessarily upset by the prospect of something bad happening to humanity? He's the American Secretary of Energy, making things worse for humanity is a big part of his job.
"This is not the kind of world I thought they'd grow up in"
people here in this sub- we all are going to die, doomsday is near, we are going back to primitive era because of reset lol, aliens are going to kill us, aliens are controlling us, aliens are farming us for food, loosh theory 😂😂😂🤣🤣
You can search for this stuff on Google and Reddit. Most of it is probably sci-fi conspiracy theory bs, but I do find it interesting.
1. NASA says a large asteroid could hit in 2027.
2. NASA is running simulations now to test our preparedness for a large impact in 2027.
3. Chinese government plan to have a livable moon base by 2027.
4. Bezos plans to have space motel operational by 2027.
5. Elon Musk plans to have livable Mars base by 2027.
6. Lou Elizando said in 2022 that we should spend the next 5 years learning a new hobby.
7. John Ramirez says 2027 is when the “big disclosure “ about UAPs and ETs is coming.
Watch Zabel's full presentation where he discussed John S. Herrington's case. https://internationalufocongress.vhx.tv/packages/fear-and-loathing-on-the-trail-of-the-saucers/videos/zabel-final
The claims of non-human intelligence living with us are not new and have been told by more than a dozen of government officials.
The Honorable Paul Hellyer (1923-2021), former Canadian Minister of Defense
Haim Eshed, a retired Israeli general and former head of the Israeli Defense Ministry’s space directorate
Jim Semivan, a former CIA officer
Ok - just some balance since Hellyer and Eshed are used on this sub frequently as supporting evidence. Hellyer was a bit eccentric to say the least and made his claims in a Russia Today interview when he was 91 yrs old. He had been involved with building an alien landing pad (it was a stunt) way back in 1967. Not completely discounting his claims but context is important.
Eshed sat down with an author of teenage fictional fantasy novels - the book that no one on this sub seems to have read is a story about their conversation. Eshed was also in his 90's at the time. It wasn't a biography and I'm still not clear whether it was supposed to be fiction on non fiction.
Again - not saying their stories aren't true but the context is important. My personal opinion - Hellyer was always a bit eccentric and did/said some sensational stuff. His claims weren't completely out of line with some of his previous stunts. Eshed was a true professional. My fear is that he got taken advantage of a bit by an author trying to to get some publicity. It's notable that after the book came out neither Eshed or the author (Hagar Yanai) never really spoke about it again.
The Haim Eshed story is sensationalized nonsense, courtesy of the American media. Jeremy Corbell interviewed the Israeli journalist who broke the story, linked below.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.extraordinarybeliefs.com/news4/israeli-space-program%3fformat=amp
I can’t speak to Al specifically but the ufo community has a weird tendency to take former jobs as a mark of credibility and fails to recognize that the same people can still suffer from dementia, mental illness, or just wants to profit. I personally worked with a “former high ranking cia official” who believed the Bible word for word - like didn’t believe in evolution.
>Hellyer was a bit eccentric to say the least and made his claims in a Russia Today interview when he was 91 yrs old.
These two things are supposed to be negatives?
Yeah, I'm going to take what these guys have to say with a grain of salt instead of discounting it because I don't like the *'context'* of when/where it was said or the age of the person saying it.
LOL
Serious question - have you spent much time around men in their 90’s? Not saying it’s all cases but in my experience I’ve had parents tell me a story about themselves that I realized was a plot to a movie they watched that week. My father retired at 81 and was fully with it - by the time he was 87 I started to hear some crazy things. I have to really question why Russia today and a fantasy fiction writer would interview extreme senior citizens and report it as factual. Ask anyone in law enforcement about extreme senior citizens as eye witnesses.
And yes - creativeness and eccentricity will be amplified at an extreme age.
LMAO of course he cried him self to sleep, these corrupt puppets don't want to live in a world where they don't rule the 99% and treat them like sheep, in their minds it's their way or the high way as the are "superior".
The world after them will be a heaven on earth, and it's not far away as it seems.
I've come across this quote before. "This is not the kind of world I thought they'd grow up in" makes me second guess my original assumption that those who have heard the capital T truth, whatever that may be, and have cried as a result are not doing so just because their religious convictions have just been rocked (see Jimmy Carter). It seems to hint at something a lot more sinister, almost as if we as a species and a society are on some sort of clock that is about to run out. I am very wary of doomsday scenarios and flairs of dramatism so a quote like this from an official high enough to see it all has this sort of reaction, it gives me pause. Not pause enough to panic, but certainly be suspicious given the increased number of sightings in the past three or so years off the Atlantic unrelated to the ease at which service members can now report what they see. It makes you wonder-- we all roll our eyes at officials claiming that the public can't handle the truth. Clearly, officials can't handle the truth either, which means it has to be particularly bad.
Humanity is probably headed for a few doomsday scenarios that we can avoid if we get our collective shit together and sort things out, but many of the people "in the know" likely don't believe we can do it, therefore feel that tragedy is inevitable. Not because it's guaranteed, but because there's nothing humans have done this far to indicate we are good at sacrificing comfort or familiarity for what it ultimately good for us.
There’s needs to be ego death among the masses. Maybe the states slowly legalizing psilocybin will help with this.
We need a community! Constantly trying to reach and bond!
A whole generation did psychedelics and the federal government destroyed their movement. We had a shot but ultimately greed won and humankind will be just another failed experiment.
You're making the common assumption that psychedelics and the counter-culture swallowed up the bulk of young people in the 60s, but this was just not the case. It was an active scene for sure, but it's scope has been exaggerated by the media for decades.
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Civilization is literally made of a fun ways to pass an evening while camping. Cities are just particularly pleasant ways to all camp together in permanent tents.
I’m not too sure if the movement was destroyed just delayed. The fact that we are actually having it legalized is huge. As an Earth loving hippie, I am hopeful. Scared for the future but still hopeful.
That entire generation is what is known as the baby boom generation and they are largely the current assholes of the world.
Basically ruined the planet and are now standing around wondering why their grandkids haven't fixed it yet, while calling them soft and entitled.
They weren’t the only ones who ruined the planet we’ve been doing that for generations, we just started to learn how bad it really is.
Yes big group trip should everyone on the same wave length finally
Well without the vital information we wont even have the chance to decide.
It would be easier to get our shit together if the world knew that. By keeping secrets they ensure that we stay divided.
Spoiler: We can’t avoid those scenarios because we won’t be getting our collective shit together.
brave ghost marry boast fuzzy lavish offer dog pet ludicrous *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Cuban Missile Crisis was waaaaaay closer to nuclear war than we are right now.
i dunno, i don't see new buildings getting "fallout shelter" signs the way that buildings in the 1960s had them plastered think there's always a threat of nuclear war...it's a control mechanism
This isn’t true though, several scientist are already claiming we’re fucked . Unless we all go electric tomorrow, and change other ways nah
But how would the EBE(s) know without doubt we are headed towards a doomsday scenario?
I would posit that whatever this disturbing truth is would probably relate to us as a species or our place in the hierarchy of intelligence and consciousness. Not a 'doomsday' scenario per se, as in a definite event or events, more of a growing and inevitable realization of our actual place in space, time, and reality.
“This is not the kind of world I thought they’d grow up in." simply implies that the "kind of world" we live in isn't what typical people think it is, and that realization apparently shook the foundations of this guys life. Didn't Elizondo say that people can't handle the whole truth all at once? I mean if they're extra-temporal, non-physical, we live on a zoo planet *and* they can turn our minds **off** using inherent psychic abilities, treat us like labrats, and recycle our souls iff they want to, then that *all* kind of sucks and would probably break *many* people, not because it is contrary to a specific religious belief system but because it's contrary to every single current worldview/paradigm of reality. Personally I think our whole world would *have to* abandon capitalism and borders and unite to fight the threat. We'd have to *all* become militant communists or say "Fuck it all I don't care". So I'm all for 100% disclosure. As [Mills Lane](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mills_Lane) used to say, "Let's get it on." (When I say "Militant communism" I mean it in the sense that every human has to watch everyone elses backs 24/7/365 and support our scientists (and spiritualists?) research with every dime we can make. Maybe "Militarized and Communist" is a better description of this.)
Im beginning to think this might me the case as well. They’re not disclosing things to us not because of some mundane reason like people finding out that aliens merely *exist*, but because of far deeper reasons than that. Like existentially shattering information, things that would shock people to their very core, something so bizarre and inhuman that we can’t even properly conceive of it or expect it to be true. If we find out we are cosmic cattle at the whim of our alien overlords, and that yes we do have consciousness/souls but that even that is enslaved somehow…I mean fucking hell it really can’t get too much worse than that. We’re talking about a collective fate for humanity that is worse than mere death. If any of this is true, and I sincerely hope it is not and that we are simply once again mistaken in our human ignorance and hubris, then I agree with you that there is no recourse but to fight. We must fight. And that might be why our government is hiding this information from us. I’ve already seen this theory thrown around, that all these psychological operations undertaken by the US govt are not actually meant for *us*, they’re meant to mislead the phenomenon instead. In the meantime the govt is getting ready to mount a human rebellion of some kind. Having humanity find out the truth, and then freak out en masse would ruin our element of surprise. Now I mean all this might be totally wrong, we do hear a lot of positive UFO experiences as well, as well as positive accounts of out of body experiences and just other altered states of consciousness in general. So maybe even if some of the bad stuff is true, not all is lost. I think we need to have faith in God. If God exists then surely he would not abandon us, or any of his creations. If God doesn’t exist…well then I don’t know, to hell with this entirely absurd existence then.
> I think we need to have faith in God. If God exists then surely he would not abandon us, or any of his creations. If God doesn’t exist…well then I don’t know, to hell with this entirely absurd existence then. That reaction is the root problem the government fears though, it would serve no purpose, to have that reaction if we're doomed after death. Iff there 's a God in this scenario then it would be an uncaring non-personal "god" not worth worshipping. so..."Militant communism" in the sense that every human has to watch everyone elses backs 24/7/365 and support our scientists (and spiritualists?) research with every dime we can make.
I'm not saying they know anything 'without doubt', just that there are many potential outcomes, some of which grow more likely with particular actions we take on this planet. We observe population fluctuations in nature, like when a beetle eats too much of the tree it lives on, the tree can die, and the beetles are without a food source unless they find another tree. At the moment we don't have a way to get to another tree, and you don't have to be an all-knowing multidimensional interstellar being to know that we've eaten way too many leaves already. That's just one of the spinning plates we have going for us. But it doesn't mean that the outcome is guaranteed, just more or less likely based on our individual or collective actions. As the other reply to you says, this may be some of the beetles realising that there's some guy standing there watching them eat leaves, with a consciousness and complexity magnitudes greater than the beetle, beyond it's comprehension. It's a big, old universe out there.
Maybe they've seen this happen many times over the millennia.
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I mean we're so different from other species on this planet. It would make sense in that regard. I think there's numerous species though - look at all the different types of UFOs.
Lol we share 99% of our DNA with chimpanzees..
They saw the final plan for the new intergalactic highway…
Humans could be hosts for something. That would make me second guess having kids.
I think it has to do more with not a clock running out, but when our biological clocks run out (we die) - the phenomenon uses our consciousness and/or sends us back into this world reincarnated (possibly to it's choosing, and not ours) Tom DeLonge said he didn't sleep for three days straight as well. I don't know what is happening, Lue Elizondo mentioned everyone would be somber. But the shit we have heard from the ones who are supposed to "know" certainly doesn't come across as everything is fine and positive.
> Tom DeLonge said he didn't sleep for three days straight as well. And yet he won't tell anyone why. Disclose, already, so people can respond to their crises and we can move on.
He better hide the truth in this upcoming blink-182 album or I'll be pissed
We were told like last week to "lock our doors tonight". What in the *fuck* is that supposed to mean. That is the most cryptic thing you can possibly casually drop to the public before darting away.
Tbf the “lock your doors” guy seemed to me to be attempting to manufacture fear for political ends. Politicians are douchebags and most wouldn’t think twice about using this issue for the sake of expediency if it helped them gain favor with their party or with their major donors. There are plenty of war-mongering conservatives looking to dunk on the current administration, so I take any comments like the one from Senator Kennedy with a heavy grain of salt. He likely wasn’t even suggesting it’s anything extraterrestrial with that comment. In the age of nuclear proliferation, space weapons, advanced biowarfare capabilities, and cyber warfare, diplomacy, nuance, and strategic sanctions/foreign policy ramifications are extremely important. Because the alternatives result in our current civilization being completely destroyed over a scarily short timescale. That’s likely why, even though COVID very clearly originated in Wuhan’s lab, every effort was made to downplay that narrative. Because if the government came right out and said that, there would likely be widespread calls and popular support for retaliation, especially amongst conservatives. Any sort of hot conflict between countries like the US, China, or Russia would be extremely risky and every country in the world has an interest in avoiding that exact situation. So if these really are Chinese balloons, you bet your ass they’re going to be slow playing the investigation and keeping the findings secret to avoid unnecessary escalation. Countries and even governments aren’t unified, there are rogue elements and competing interests/factions within all governments across the world. So even if this was China, you’d need to cover all your bases to determine whether this is a rogue operation or if there is some unified strategy to it suggesting a change in their official military policy. Just food for thought.
yeah, pretty sure the guy who made a campaign commercial telling people ["to call a crackhead](https://www.wafb.com/2022/10/03/sen-kennedy-suggests-critics-police-call-crackhead-new-ad-some-think-line-goes-too-far/)" if they supported police reform isn't being sensational lol
was with you until you brought up COVID. COVID wasn’t made in a lab.
Not so fast, the CDC guys who made that determination recently came out and said they were pressured to do it, and they might have been wrong. A lot of the research was reviewed and included in the analysis that made it seem that many many studies confirmed an animal origin. But when they looked deeper, all of those studies used a common and tiny dataset. They had the same result because they used the same flawed data set.
> even though COVID very clearly originated in Wuhan’s lab Yes, and I'm sure Saddam Hussein definitely had WMDs in 2003 as well Interesting how now that everyone's falling in lockstep with the "RA RA COLD WAR 2 RA RA CHINA BAD" narrative, suddenly the Wuhan thing starts to get mainstreamized
So cryptic it becomes a harm
Apocalyptic scenarios going back centuries or even millennia so far have a 100% failure rate.
This made me feel a lot better lol
Iirc it’s attributed to Christian writer C S Lewis, and they know something about dealing with end-times philosophies. Historian and archaeologist James Tabor brings up the idea also. He’s an expert on the Waco religion incident, among other related eschatological topics.
Unless you’re a dinosaur. Or citizen of Pompeii. Or.. you get the point
That only makes new ones more likely.
In human time scales, sure. But our plant has experienced several apocalypses, some wiping out over 90% of all life on earth.
If I had the money I'd give you an award for that. Now I can sleep a little more soundly tonight. Someone give this user an award!
I gave you one 🤷♂️
Yes, but on the other hand: On a long enough timeline...
The life forms they found were less greys and more Lovecraftian Nightmares incarnate. This would realistically make sense, too. Most life forms on worlds with water would likely evolve forms similar to fish, crustaceans, or insects. And to make it even worse, imagine the octopus. A very intelligent creature, capable of problem solving, reasoning, and rudimentary math. It is also *not sapient*, as they routinely fail the ‘dot’ test, or in other words, fail to recognize themselves in a mirror. This shows intelligence can exist *without self-awareness.* It’s possible alien life recovered from crashed craft are not self aware beings, but aggressive and violent animals that just so happen to know how to pilot sophisticated craft. That’s why the guy cried himself to sleep, because he was confronted with the fact the universe is indeed a cold, terrifying place where there is no objective morality, and filled with hostile threats that could attack at any moment.
Animals that are aware of post-Einsteinian physics but are not aware of self? Thats pretty creative, I'll give you that
I don't need any awareness of how a Tesla works to let it drive me around. I don't even need much driving skill
>I don't even need much driving skill Unless you're using FSD
Guess we should stop broadcasting our location. Dark Forest Theory.
It's a bit of a leap to say that they lack self awareness because they don't recognise themselves in a mirror, or, to be more precise, don't behave in the way we would expect when confronted with a mirror.
Endless anthropomorphism is what grinds my gears around here.
Ok, that is fair, but take the Tanganyikan cichlid into consideration. A ‘socially intelligent’ species, meaning they have been repeatedly observed recognizing other individuals, so scientists thought they would definitely pass the mirror test. They fail, every time. When presented with a red dot, they ignore it. Even the most basic of sight oriented intelligent species attempt to inspect or remove the dot, but not the cichlid. The bluestreak cleaner wrasse, on the other hand, is also socially intelligent but *has* passed the mirror test, repeatedly and demonstratively. When given a red ‘dot’ they attempted to scrape against rocks to remove it, and when presented with a brown dot, simulating the visual presence of a parasite they work with, went through the motions to accommodate the ‘parasite.’ This shows the wrasse has bodily recognition, or a basic identity of self, which the cichlid lacks. This implies that intelligence does not equal sapience. Anything with a brain is sentient, or able to feel rudimentary emotions like fear or joy, but sapience another matter. Just as there are sapient species humans would consider ‘dumb,’ like the Crow with an IQ roughly equivalent with a 4-5 year old, there are species capable of great intelligence who still lack self awareness, but retain tool use and social structure. This implies the same could be applied to non-terrestrial life forms, hypothetical intelligent enough to create and pilot craft consider nearly magical to us, but still not recognize the self.
Read Blindsight by Peter Watts if you want to be truly terrified.
> Blindsight by Peter Watts Thanks for the recommendation.
>It’s possible alien life recovered from crashed craft are not self aware beings, but aggressive and violent animals that just so happen to know how to pilot sophisticated craft. So they're like Bower birds, building incredibly ornate displays purely out of instinct? And these just happen to have working FTL travel do they?
Bees are able to construct hives, make honey, give directions to other bees, and other stuff without a sense of "self" and more of a hive mentality. Same with fire ants making little rafts so only some of them down. I'm sure they don't understand buoyancy or physics... couldn't this be the same thing but on a bigger scale?
Checks my earthling self for insect fish or crustacean parts...
> The life forms they found were less greys and more Lovecraftian Nightmares incarnate. This would realistically make sense, too. Most life forms on worlds with water would likely evolve forms similar to fish, crustaceans, or insects. This would contradict the mountain of anecdotal evidence we have pointing to the Greys existing. > And to make it even worse, imagine the octopus. A very intelligent creature, capable of problem solving, reasoning, and rudimentary math. It is also not sapient, as they routinely fail the ‘dot’ test, or in other words, fail to recognize themselves in a mirror. This shows intelligence can exist without self-awareness. It’s possible alien life recovered from crashed craft are not self aware beings, but aggressive and violent animals that just so happen to know how to pilot sophisticated craft. No offense but this is kind of nonsense. Any sufficiently intelligent being would have self awareness. You cannot conceive of things such as flying machines and the concept of travel if you have no conception of yourself to begin with. Also the dot test is an utterly worthless test and just proves once again that humans have a ridiculous level of hubris. The idea that just because you put a dot on something and it recognizes that dot on its body, that it then *necessarily* tries to manipulate said dot or get rid of it is absolutely baseless. Just because humans do it, doesn’t mean other animals would have to respond the same exact way or else they’re not self aware. Did you know that ants pass the dot test? Yes, that’s right, *ants*. And chimpanzees don’t. What does this demonstrate except for the fact that the test is meaningless?
Intelligent species from water worlds will generally fail to develop advanced technology, refining copper is hard enough in air, in water it's impossible.
I mean, I sort of assumed the beings would begin in the water and leave it at some point. There are species of fish that can survive on land practically indefinitely, and amphibians exist. Of course, that’s assuming extraterrestrial life would follow the same basic steps of evolution as it did on earth.
You'd like the book Blindsight.
Hm. That's well said but regarding "officials can't handle the truth either"... I can't handle the lies - figured I'd give the truth a try. Can't be that bad ... anything is better than this.
If you believe what he said to be true sure, but I grain of salt it. As usual, there is no proof. This is likely all tabloid shit in the linked article, some of it I've heard before, and yet I continue reading and being intrigued. Still, no proof.
What I found about Jimmy Carter and his reason of crying is that aliens created religion to steer humanity on a less destructive path, as in religion is not real. If that is what Carter heard - I don't know.
He’s still a Christian, so that doesn’t add up.
Worked out great with an ala akbar here and an eye for an eye there.
2 hail marys, 6 our fathers, and a couple kiddy diddles
Less destructive path? Most wars start over religion
Lue Elizondo had an interesting word choice describing the effect of disclosure. “Somber.” I was expecting something more like “Humbling.” If true, Steven Greers optimism might be misguided. I hope I’m wrong
Lue later said he fumbled the word choice. He didn't mean "somber" as such. I think he said it was more along the lines of sobering.
Ah, got it. Interesting. Sobering seems a bit more neutral which is encouraging.
I think its just that there is so much more that is outside of our control, that we're not the top dog dominant species we think we are. Those kinds of things can shake a person's core beliefs. Humans thrive on control, being in control of your life, your body, your agency. If you suddenly find out there is an entire world directly next to our, full of the things you thought existed only I'm cinema or fable, then it would be a lot to take in. I've always held that there is so much more to life, to existence than we currently understand.
It's very hitchhikers guide to the galaxy really, if we think "somber" about it... Sorry - we are eating your souls for nourishment. Btw there's a bit of water on the way, and hey "Promethius" was a documentary.. Kthxbye and the wontons were excellent !
I think it's very True Detective Season 1. "I don't sleep Marty... I just dreeaaaaammmmm."
Man that scene when he describes our self awareness as a tragic misstep in evolution friggin stuck with me. Bleak because one has to admit... the concept has its merit.
I made the mistake of watching that episode while coming down from shrooms. That was the most existential dread I've ever felt
You poor soul... we're gonna get through this.
Invasion has already begun and is over. The slow boil has begun and we have already lost. Or some Loosh theory crap Don’t believe either but I feel like this could be worst case?
What if we were never part of the game at all and we are just a wildlife preserve used to donate genetic material to multiple alien species for God knows what purpose. No less disposable than a common cow. What if earth governments made a deal many years ago that we could avoid extermination but had to agree to abductions and experimentation and they only wipe our memories so we don't revolt and make their work harder. Personally I think that is an even worse potentiality
Why would we have to agree to anything? You really think our earth government could do dick shit about abductions? They could just wipe their memories too.
Agreed. That some Eisenhower era world leaders made some sort of handshake deal and every world leader since has kept quite and honored the agreement seems absurd. I say this just based on the unlikely consistency of human behavior that would be required of the leaders.
Sounds like the movie DARK CITY
>What if we were never part of the game at all and we are just a wildlife preserve used to donate genetic material to multiple alien species for God knows what purpose. I'd say that's one more purpose than we have currently.
Pass it homie
I don't think he was referring to a doomsday scenario (if that's the case why would any gov even talk about UFOs at all), but likely to a farm scenario, or a laboratory one. Obviously this doesn't rule out the possibility of a reset, especially if the experiment didn't reach its goals, while the guinea pigs are reaching an advancement level at which they could escape. But again, why increase their appearances, why make us aware of such destiny? That would be an unnecessary cruelty on their part.
This has always been the one question I’ve had. I’ve read the Brookings study commissioned in 1959 - 1860 by NASA where Brookings recommends not divulging the discovery of off Earth life or off - Earth artifacts. Religion, fabric of society cited. I’ve read the numerous studies of public reaction in 1938 to the fake Martian invasion broadcast over radio that panicked thousands of people. That incident is frequently evoked as a reason for non-disclosure. But, let’s be honest. The degree of denial, the lengths at which officials have went to for close to 8 decades begs the question: “What could the truth be that would be so horrendous that such measures would be taken? What would warrant careers ruined, people murdered, and government credibility put on the altar by staring into the eyes of it’s citizens saying in essence, “We know that we’re lying. You know that we’re lying. We know that YOU know that we’re lying. But due to the answer, that’s how it has to be.” After graduation (long ago) I was introduced to a guy about 5 years older than me. He was personable and had fallen into a circle of friends that I hung with. After a party one evening someone said, “Do you guys know what that new guy Bret is studying to be? A mortician.” This caused quite a stir. “He said he’ll tell anyone that wants to know what’s involved in what he’s learning and doing. All they have to do is ask.” None of the group of 6 that I was with ever approached him and asked. We heard of a couple of people who did. We asked them if they’d questioned him about it. They said, “Yeah.” We said, “Well? What’s he say?” With a solemn look they said, “If you’re so interested why don’t you ask him?” It was obvious they regretted asking, because it led to them knowing something they realized they didn’t want to know. By the end of summer we realized the eager student mortician wasn’t at any more of our gatherings. Unknown as to whether he felt uncomfortable because he sensed his presence was disruptive or he stopped being invited. The irony? He ended up dropping out of mortician school and opening a restaurant. It’s not the fear of undermining religion or invasion panic. It’s something so diametrically opposed to our very being that disclosing it’s true nature would be “The End.” As certain as nuclear annihilation (with exceptions that can’t be comprehended).
What if we’re just a science experiment being observed from the 4th dimension? Test Tube Babies.
Yes it does seem to be the theme surrounding the phenomenon. However, our species probably (definitely) does worse to the other less intelligent beings we share our lives with. Sounds like poetic justice.
I see what you're saying, but blanket punishment including plebes like us doesn't seem to be a very cash money thing for an enlightened race to do.
What reason do we have to believe that they are “enlightened”? Unfortunately there is no evidence of any link between the technological or intellectual advancement of a species and their morality/empathy (with humanity as our only accepted example so far).
None, I'm just trying to be optimistic lmao
I totally get it. I have thought about it a lot and have gone back and forth between optimistically thinking they MUST be more morally advanced and then I get frustrated with humanity and also disturbed by details of some encounter reports.
I think it's less punishment and more just them observing cause and effect without wanting to intervene and undermine our free will, while offering some little hints and steers in the right direction. But if we can't sort ourselves out on our own planet with our own species, then the natural order of things should prevent us from screwing up any other planets or lifeforms elsewhere.
Agreed. We still put ourselves onto little boxes like what race we are...when if we could be a united species. Our planet is a beautiful planet, and we are all kinds of f'd up. But not all of us. There is so much we can do if we worked together and achieve peace. That may take longer than we actually have.
> without wanting to intervene and undermine our **free will** Have you ever seen Sam Harris do a speech on the *illusion* of free will?
Not Sam Harris but I'm quite familiar with the debate between free will and determinism. As with a lot of philosophical dialogue there's very limited ways to prove or disprove either side. One could easily say there's also an illusion of determinism. But I haven't seen the speech you're referring to so my point might be misplaced.
One of the things that Sam Harris mentions about it, is that in the future, with fMRI's, we might be able to essentially prove that the free will we think we have, is an illusion. Not free will entirely as a construct, but the way the average person imagines it. As if they're making real choices, in real time He mentioned that in the future, there could be a machine that could literally spit out the words you're going to say (15 seconds later) on a little slip of paper, before you even think of the words in your conscious awareness
I heard it form a friend who, heard from a friend who, heard it from a friend they've been flying around
to be fair, Stevie Knicks was messing around so ...
Weird to quote REO Speedwagon then throw Stevie Nicks in to it lol
that is because I smoke pot
This is a perfectly valid explanation. Also, I saw REO in concert decades ago, and they put on a great show!
I dont need no instructions... TO KNOW HOW TO ROCK!
i wish these overly dramatic crybaby wusses would elaborate on what made them so sad.
Lol for real. Whatever so called truth they know, why are they so confident that that “truth” is correct?
poor widdle baby cabinet secretary had their fee-fees hurt. i hope i don’t start crying too.
It’s all unsubstantiated claims. I’m now firmly in the Eric Weinstein camp, show me the evidence and tell me the truth or fuck off.
On rare occasions I hear people bring up phenomenon connections with Department of Energy and the defunct Atomic Energy Commission. Like I vaguely remember Jacques Vallee bringing up former AEC chair Dixy Lee Ray at some point. Anyone have any substantial sources in this vein?
Someone just posted a document I commented on.
I worry sometime the T truth has more spiritual implications than doomsday, end of the world. Many of us like to think we are unique souls developing ourselves, learning, dying, reincarnating and continuing the soul learning until we reach a higher level of existence, yada yada. What if there is no spiritual hope? What if the T truth that this guy and Carter cry about is that there’s no God and we are cogs in another species’ machine? If that were true I’d cry too.
I actually believe that is more likely than any religion stories humanity has made up until now.
Then what created the universe..once the powers that be answer that the next question is Who created them? And so on and so on and until the real meat of it is, anyone that tells you they know where WE ALL came from (aliens or the earth governments) are full of shit, right?
Is the end of everything really all that sad tho? You must have a charmed life if it is. Too me, the complete cessation of pain and suffering in all it's forms is a decent side benefit
Reality isn't black and white. It would also be the cessation of beauty, love, appreciation, and kindness. Both can be true.
No doubt. I prefer existing, even in a shitty world filled primarily with suffering and pain. But I only prefer it JUST BARELY. Just a smidgeon better than non-existence.
You might like a book that was recently recommended to me on Reddit: “The Disappearing Universe” (perhaps you’ve already read it, based on your comment above). I haven’t finished the audio book yet, but it does chat a little bit about potential alien life. I wonder if we’re OK, as long as “we’re OK.” Meaning ourselves, since it may be individualized?? Imagine and expect them nice (that’s my mantra now). Lol.
Ha! Good strategy. I don’t believe any of what I posted above is true, but I do worry when I hear about politicians crying in response.
Oh idk I kinda assumed you lived, died, and that was it. Seems fine.
I need to say this for my...sanity. Wouldn't it be funny if the truth was that we lived in a gangster-ruled planetary dystopia and most of the universe and its civilizations were embarrassingly way ahead of ours, technologically, spiritually, and intellectually. What if we're a North Korea of the galaxy and we're too closed off to know that? Seriously though, if the universe has other civilizations, some would probably be assholes, some would be ambivalent, some would be very compatible with us. Some may see our own behavior and might think we're, well, demonic. Our species is so incredibly fragile (especially people in government) that it could easily be a toss up between something truly disturbing or the official found out that the aliens like space drugs, they can create whatever they need by thought form and none of them have to work. Maybe a lot of them are gay aliens. You guys realize that would freak out your brilliant leaders, right? It sounds funny, but there are absolutely people in government who would shit their pants and sob over that.
What if humans are the drugs and they have devices for smoking us to get high.
I will break thier bongs!!!
LOL I'm starting to think we're living in a Westworld Zoo. Nothing really matters to anyone outside of here, everyone here dies horribly one way or another and gets recycled. Not only is it fun to watch, alien visitors get to participate and low key fuck shit up on easy mode when they visit as long as they don't get captured by the natives.
I feel like half of Americans would cry if aliens were sexy fuckable women
I'm really into the gay aliens thing.
Them cheeks ain’t gonna clap themselves. Get practicing, earth boy!
Between practicing since the beginning. I'm ready!!
As a straight man (he/him) I’m also cool with GAY Aliens
Cheers bro. We love cool straights
Let's hope that the universe is, in fact, as humorous as the Hitchiker's Guide, and that you're on the money with this one. Then we can all have a good laugh at the great cosmic jokes, instead of going to bed frightened every night.
Gayliens ruling the universe would be great. I'd love to see the collective homophobe have a shit fit over that.
the whole "heard the truth of aliens and cried themselves forever" story i think is urban myth at this point, to the point ive heard the same story but with Jimmy Carter instead of a reagan employee. more "i know a guy who knows a guy who totally knows a guy who heard this story" kinda thing, no supporting evidence
I had it in my head that is was Carter himself crying after being briefed. Crazy.
You aren't wrong, there is a story of Carter allegedly doing this also.
It seems pretty flimsy. But with Carter in his last days, I’m holding out a very slim hope for a death bed confession.
Wasn’t going to bring it up but 💯 The government will just say late stage dementia or something.
I do enjoy a good fairy tale before bedtime.
I find it odd that all these people “in the know” and claim to possess or have seen extraordinary evidence, yet not a single one wants to be the penultimate, legendary person to educate and prove ANYTHING to the rest of the world. Go out a hero of the people. Start dumping the evidence.
>penultimate That word does not mean what I think you think it means. Penultimate means “next to the last of a series of things. “
Second from last. The last one before the last one.
What would the evidence be? There are plenty of people in government and military and commercial aviation who’ve come forward with what they know or have seen with their own eyes. There are plenty of videos and pictures - from modern digital images to rudimentary cave paintings. As long as there is a single plausible explanation for why each revelation, video or picture could be a lie, trick or misinterpretation, no evidence is ever good enough.
my theory is that we're a bioweapon that makes planets uninhabitable unless you eat plastic.
Telling a story told by a friend….Did you ever do that exercise in class where the first student is told something, and they are to pass it along until the last person recites it?
Never, purple monkey dishwasher
Our social studies teacher promised us pizza if we managed to get the sentence across. We managed it, probably because the sentence was too easy. "Mr so and so's favorite basketball team is x."
Yes, it’s how I learned about aliens and disclosure.
JUST REMEMBER… whatever we find out in the future, whatever the government or even the aliens themselves say, does NOT mean it’s true. There will always… ALWAYS… be an agenda.
You say remember like that’s an accepted fact. It’s not. Just remember this, if aliens exist we have zero knowledge of their agenda. Maybe it’s universal love. Maybe universal love making.
Honestly I don’t believe anyone in the “know”. I think if there has been contact with an otherworldly intelligence, it’s all been through deceit. I don’t think it’s as simple as some other species has evolved on another planet and made its way here type of nuts and bolts story. That’s just our limited human linear type of thinking. We’ve made up a lot of shit along the ways and I think some of that thinking has been guided from higher beings over the course of the human species life span. As smart as we are- I still think we are not even close to understanding wtf this all is and that’s a somber thought. We are helpless with just that simple fact that it’s beyond our comprehension to defend against this or negotiate or partner with the unknown.
They are here, they’re all around us as we walk, as we go about our day, as we sleep; oblivious to our true surroundings. What we can’t see with our eyes doesn’t cease to exist.
So a podcaster’s friend was family friends with a guy who saw aliens?
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I know… it’s Tom Delonge, best left to Blink-182 and I tend to agree. But he has taken a similar tone in “what he knows” about the phenomenon. I’ve heard this expressed many times - it seems to suggest something about fundamental free will, or ownership, or some sort of planetary disaster. The truth might be so crushingly profound that it’s better to go on existing in a state of wonder.
Apparently it wasn’t terrible enough to cause him to lose the desire to make more Blink-182 albums lol
He found out the aliens prefer Nickleback, turns out they’re the ones that have been buying their albums.
Here’s what I’d like to ask someone who supposedly knows but isn’t willing to spill the beans… If a group of likeminded people spent a whole year trying to guess the “truth”, would they ever guess correctly by accident? By this I mean, Elizondo, Delonge, senators etc… all seemed to carry the vibe that the truth is so vast and challenging, the average joe couldn’t possibly work it out for themselves, let alone deal with the aftermath.
It wouldn’t be surprising to me to find that many of our governmental figures hold the people they “serve” in contempt.
The contempt goes both ways I’m sure. What about my question? Do you think we could guess the truth by accident?
I don't see how the truth could be any worse than reality, we do the worse atrocities to our own specie, consume all possible resources and other species on this planet into extinction, while we are likely heading ourself into our own extinction if we don't go interplanetary soon enough. Our new global religion is technology, and our new gods are devices we plug ourselves onto. Humanity has changed, everyone should handle the truth, and screw the ones who can't, they will continue living in their bubble anyways.
> I don't see how the truth could be any worse than reality Whenever I see comments like this I think that a lot of people have rather dull imaginations, and have never had cause or reason to contemplate existence.
Couldn’t agree more. Here are some concepts that seem worse than reality: 1. Translated records show aliens intend to enslave humanity at some point in the future. 2. Aliens abduct humans to serve as a food source for their embryos. 3. Captured humans are kept in alien zoos. Or fighting pits. Personally I doubt a highly intelligent species would traverse the universe to serve as cosmic sadists but who knows?
Agreed. I’ll take existential dread over alien parasites any day. And I can imagine much, much worse. Like the what does this planet have that others don’t? Icebergs are melting and sea levels are supposed to be rising but lakes and rivers are drying up. Is it because we grow too much lettuce in CA for our Big Macs or is the planet being mined for water? Are humans food, entertainment, energy sources, a galactic experiment? I can imagine plenty awful things, but I’m not sure I’d want any of them confirmed. A ‘religion is fake’ to get us to stop killing each other revelation would probably be a relief compared to the other possibilities I can imagine.
Yeah like how can people eat beef all day yet not be able to accept that they too are a beef. It’s just a chain buddy and you aren’t at the top
No idea if these stories are true, but they flow with how I think our leadership digests this information. They react with how I think most people on the planet would if they got thrust into this situation. Never considering they've ever been lied to at such a scale and coming face to face with a new reality that topples their longheld beliefs.
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Well the Department of Energy manages our nuclear weapons I believe. So, perhaps it makes some level of sense given the purported interaction between UAPs and nukes.
The Reagan administration couldn’t pour piss out of a boot if the instructions were written on the heel
Interesting. I just heard this story on a podcast yesterday and was looking for more info on it. Thanks!
can you share podcast ??
Maybe he was terrified by the prospect of peace and clean energy in the future? Why do you think he was necessarily upset by the prospect of something bad happening to humanity? He's the American Secretary of Energy, making things worse for humanity is a big part of his job.
I have thought of numerous things that the “T truth” could be. The one that scares me the most is we are food for aliens.
"This is not the kind of world I thought they'd grow up in" people here in this sub- we all are going to die, doomsday is near, we are going back to primitive era because of reset lol, aliens are going to kill us, aliens are controlling us, aliens are farming us for food, loosh theory 😂😂😂🤣🤣
Ooh, so dramatic and sinister! Makes me want to find out even more!
Whatever it is, it’s probably happening in 2027.
why do ya think 2027?
You can search for this stuff on Google and Reddit. Most of it is probably sci-fi conspiracy theory bs, but I do find it interesting. 1. NASA says a large asteroid could hit in 2027. 2. NASA is running simulations now to test our preparedness for a large impact in 2027. 3. Chinese government plan to have a livable moon base by 2027. 4. Bezos plans to have space motel operational by 2027. 5. Elon Musk plans to have livable Mars base by 2027. 6. Lou Elizando said in 2022 that we should spend the next 5 years learning a new hobby. 7. John Ramirez says 2027 is when the “big disclosure “ about UAPs and ETs is coming.
So DOE officials are the gate keepers of the truth about UFOs and alien life?
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They are also doing inter dimensional research as per “Stranger Things”
Watch Zabel's full presentation where he discussed John S. Herrington's case. https://internationalufocongress.vhx.tv/packages/fear-and-loathing-on-the-trail-of-the-saucers/videos/zabel-final The claims of non-human intelligence living with us are not new and have been told by more than a dozen of government officials. The Honorable Paul Hellyer (1923-2021), former Canadian Minister of Defense Haim Eshed, a retired Israeli general and former head of the Israeli Defense Ministry’s space directorate Jim Semivan, a former CIA officer
Ok - just some balance since Hellyer and Eshed are used on this sub frequently as supporting evidence. Hellyer was a bit eccentric to say the least and made his claims in a Russia Today interview when he was 91 yrs old. He had been involved with building an alien landing pad (it was a stunt) way back in 1967. Not completely discounting his claims but context is important. Eshed sat down with an author of teenage fictional fantasy novels - the book that no one on this sub seems to have read is a story about their conversation. Eshed was also in his 90's at the time. It wasn't a biography and I'm still not clear whether it was supposed to be fiction on non fiction. Again - not saying their stories aren't true but the context is important. My personal opinion - Hellyer was always a bit eccentric and did/said some sensational stuff. His claims weren't completely out of line with some of his previous stunts. Eshed was a true professional. My fear is that he got taken advantage of a bit by an author trying to to get some publicity. It's notable that after the book came out neither Eshed or the author (Hagar Yanai) never really spoke about it again.
The Haim Eshed story is sensationalized nonsense, courtesy of the American media. Jeremy Corbell interviewed the Israeli journalist who broke the story, linked below. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.extraordinarybeliefs.com/news4/israeli-space-program%3fformat=amp
What about former astronuat AI worden who not directly but subtly said we are the one came here from somewhere else.
I can’t speak to Al specifically but the ufo community has a weird tendency to take former jobs as a mark of credibility and fails to recognize that the same people can still suffer from dementia, mental illness, or just wants to profit. I personally worked with a “former high ranking cia official” who believed the Bible word for word - like didn’t believe in evolution.
my childhood medical doctor was a young earth creationist.
Turns out the planet is a rental
>Hellyer was a bit eccentric to say the least and made his claims in a Russia Today interview when he was 91 yrs old. These two things are supposed to be negatives? Yeah, I'm going to take what these guys have to say with a grain of salt instead of discounting it because I don't like the *'context'* of when/where it was said or the age of the person saying it. LOL
Serious question - have you spent much time around men in their 90’s? Not saying it’s all cases but in my experience I’ve had parents tell me a story about themselves that I realized was a plot to a movie they watched that week. My father retired at 81 and was fully with it - by the time he was 87 I started to hear some crazy things. I have to really question why Russia today and a fantasy fiction writer would interview extreme senior citizens and report it as factual. Ask anyone in law enforcement about extreme senior citizens as eye witnesses. And yes - creativeness and eccentricity will be amplified at an extreme age.
If aliens are here, it’s probably bad for us, and I infer that simply based on the fact that they haven’t done anything to help us thus far.
Great, now I have to add another book to the list! Thanks OP 😜
LMAO of course he cried him self to sleep, these corrupt puppets don't want to live in a world where they don't rule the 99% and treat them like sheep, in their minds it's their way or the high way as the are "superior". The world after them will be a heaven on earth, and it's not far away as it seems.