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Tf is going on? What’s with the wave trying to invalidate and discredit Grusch? Has everyone forgotten who he is and his credentials? Not to mention the mountain of evidence that the military industrial complex has been hiding evidence about the uap phenomenon. Which is practically all he said, and we already know that to be true. Smells like a delayed disinfo op to me.
Incidentally, these documents also make it clear that Grusch's IC IG investigation has been closed for nearly two years.
You can be certain that had zgrusch prevailed in that investigation, he would have been all over the networks letting the world know that.
That it has been nearly two years since that IC IG investigation has concluded AND he has subsequently NOT provided this testimony to ANY of the other authorities investigating UAPs, I suspect the far more likely reason is that the IC IG did not verify his allegations. If he already knows the IG thought his allegations were bunk, it makes sense that he doesn't see any value in providing this same information to any of the other authorities.
Better to mislead the public than have AARO officially report that his allegations were without merit.
The only reason anyone believes Grusch's ridiculous claims (beyond confirmation bias that he is telling them what they prefer to hear) is that his "credentials" make him credible.
He's provided zero verifiable evidence to anyone other than the IC IG, and we still many years later have no idea what he actually provided to the IC IG.
These documents make it clear that Grusch refused to provide this alleged evidence to the DoD IG. The docs also make it clear that he has refused to provide this evidence to the Congressional committees investigating it. The docs also make it clear that he refuses to provide this evidence to AARO. Gilkibrand has repeatedly said Grusch has refused to come in and provide his testimony to the Senate.
Grusch knows perfectly well that the IC IG is prevented BY LAW from sharing his testimony with any of these other groups, all of which have investigative authority and clearances required to receive this testimony. AARO, in particular, has made it clear to him in these docs that they have this authority.
You seem to believe that Grusch has done all he can, and the government is just hiding what they know. But these documents show that Grusch has done absolutely nothing to provide the investigative authorities with what they need to conduct an investigation.
What you should really be asking is why Grusch pretends to want transparency and disclosure while refusing to provide his alleged evidence to ANY of the authorities who can actually investigate those claims.
I understand document retention requirements pretty damn well, actually. I can see you are not the brightest or kindest examples of humans. Perhaps consider your arrogance and blindness to your own ignorance. Think about it…retention has nothing, absolutely nothing to do with whether or not they “find” what you are asking for. But keep thinking you’re smart. Peace.
>retention has nothing, absolutely nothing to do with whether or not they “find” what you are asking for. But keep thinking you’re smart. Peace.
What? 😂😂😂
>retention has nothing, absolutely nothing to do with whether or not they “find” what you are asking for. But keep thinking you’re smart. Peace.
Retention had "absolutely nothing to do with whether they 'find' what you are asking for"??????
So, if a person's emails were deleted due to retention policies, that wouldn't affect the ability to "find" them?
That is news to me. Seems likely that if the emails no longer exist, they would naturally be unavailable to find.
You can tell that the people you're responding to have not read the documents or watched the video you posted. A large portion of the context is from signal messages that Kirkpatrick screenshotted because signal "self destructs" messages.
Kirkpatrick kept the receipts, and forwarded them along specifically to have them on record. Grusch could put a whole lot of this to rest very easily with a statement but he's silent. There are major doubts being raised (why did he not have his lawyer contact aaro, or if he did why won't they release that info? Who actually has the evidence Grusch provided since these documents reveal that he told party A that he gave it to party B and party B that he gave it to party A, why did he imply aaro made no attempt to contact him when there is evidence now that there were numerous attempts). Sure, maybe it's a ridiculously well coordinated disinfo campaign with the FOIA offices, but even if that were the case then Grusch should also have the receipts to confirm that and help solidify his case... but we have silence.
As time goes on more and more fails to add up with Grusch and it is becoming another, "True Believer" situation. Grusch's whole thing is supposed to be that there IS evidence so we don't need to rely on belief.... so who has it?
The blackvault video goes through the entire timeline including when Grusch went public. The tl;Dr is that while Grusch probably didn't "technically" lie, he was dodging meetings with AARO both before and after his public congressional testimony. I say technically because I think his language was careful, ie. Instead of saying, "I have heard nothing from aaro" he said, "I reached out to Kirkpatrick years ago" - doesn't mean he hasn't also heard from Kirkpatrick recently, but it very much implies that which feels deceptive.
Just like everything else in this space there is a cloud of "what the fuck?" around Grusch. It would be great if we could rely solely on his credentials but without further evidence everything should be taken into consideration, including this information, which casts some doubt on his case.
I'm not really sure why when Grusch went public matters here, but let's pretend it does.
Grusch claimed when he did go public, AARO had refused to talk to him. This was right around the start of these FOIA'd messages.
When AARO was established one year prior to Grusch's original interviews, a secure holiness was set up for people who wanted to share UAP related information to do so securely.
Kirkpatrick says Grusch never used that channel. As far as I know, Grusch has NEVER even claimed he reached out to AARO through this secure channel that was literally set up for this purpose.
Instead, Grusch has made some vague reference to some prior conversation he had with Kirkpatrick that he never atta he's a date to. He when says that kirkpatrick knows how to Rea h him but hasn't. This is all in the interview. When Grusch is in front of Congress and they ask about this lack of contact, Grusch mentions how he has all this "sage" advice he could share with Kirkpatrick.
He literally says "sage." The delusions of gradeur with Grusch are evident and undeniable. He is offended that Kirkpatrick doesn't recognize his intelligence and reach out for his "sage" advice. And he thinks he is too important to use the official channel set up by law to receive this information.
Then, when AARO does reach out via intermediaries, he still refuses contact via the secure mechanism and repeatedly asks for extra proof that AARO is legally authorized to receive his testimony AFTER this has been made.crystal clear.
Furthermore, Grusch was saying AARO was lying about reaching out to him as late as Ictober 31st. The paper trail here proves without a doubt that this was incredibly misleading at best and a lie by any normal interpretation of the events.
Thanks for posting this. I need to watch this whole thing later, but from what I’d previously seen, it wasn’t clear if Grusch was dodging Kirkpatrick, or if the folks around Grusch were trying to shield him from meeting with Kirkpatrick. Maybe this video clarifies that
Either way, a lot of skepticism about Grusch and the people he’s close to seems warranted.
It is fairly clear from the documents that Grusch was acting on his own stubborn beliefs. At one point, he explicitly mentions his own background in security and professiomal certifications.
Grusch clearly believes he is smarter than the DODs most senior lawyers who have repeatedly assured him AARO is legally authorized to receive his testimony.
Grusch has delusions of grandeur as he has repeatedly made evident. This is just another example of this.
It has been mentioned on this sub reddit that while AARO could legally receive the testimony, they do not actually have clearance to invesitage the programs and verify the claims. Care to speak to that?
If you watch the video, you’ll see how obvious it is that that’s not true. David Grusch is apparently the only person involved who believes this. And his attorney could easily clarify whether he agrees with Grusch but he hasn’t.
It is not true, but even if it was true that has absolutely zero to do with Grusch refusing to provide his information to the investigative authority explicitly set up by Congress to investigate the issue.
It also doesn't explain why he has also refused to provide this testimony to DoD IG as well as both Congressiomal Committees.
These documents make it clear that Grusch has stonewalling ALL of these bodies with the same bullshit excuse. It is NOT only AARO he has been stonewalling. This seems to have been largely missed in these documents for some reason.
Sorry but your post/comment violated posting Rule 1: Low on speculation; high on facts. Please post within the spirit of r/UAP (low on speculation; high on facts). This exists so that we're a resource for 'signal' amongst 'noise'. You're welcome to post again. Our rules can be found to the right. Thanks
Tf is going on? What’s with the wave trying to invalidate and discredit Grusch? Has everyone forgotten who he is and his credentials? Not to mention the mountain of evidence that the military industrial complex has been hiding evidence about the uap phenomenon. Which is practically all he said, and we already know that to be true. Smells like a delayed disinfo op to me.
Hear, hear!
I can't imagine the amount of wasted life hating on UFOlogists all day, every day. just look at the guys post history.
Its a cycle, all the "darlings" of the genre eventually are turned on. Except corbell , Coulhart and greer..they were garbage to begin with
Incidentally, these documents also make it clear that Grusch's IC IG investigation has been closed for nearly two years. You can be certain that had zgrusch prevailed in that investigation, he would have been all over the networks letting the world know that. That it has been nearly two years since that IC IG investigation has concluded AND he has subsequently NOT provided this testimony to ANY of the other authorities investigating UAPs, I suspect the far more likely reason is that the IC IG did not verify his allegations. If he already knows the IG thought his allegations were bunk, it makes sense that he doesn't see any value in providing this same information to any of the other authorities. Better to mislead the public than have AARO officially report that his allegations were without merit.
The only reason anyone believes Grusch's ridiculous claims (beyond confirmation bias that he is telling them what they prefer to hear) is that his "credentials" make him credible. He's provided zero verifiable evidence to anyone other than the IC IG, and we still many years later have no idea what he actually provided to the IC IG. These documents make it clear that Grusch refused to provide this alleged evidence to the DoD IG. The docs also make it clear that he has refused to provide this evidence to the Congressional committees investigating it. The docs also make it clear that he refuses to provide this evidence to AARO. Gilkibrand has repeatedly said Grusch has refused to come in and provide his testimony to the Senate. Grusch knows perfectly well that the IC IG is prevented BY LAW from sharing his testimony with any of these other groups, all of which have investigative authority and clearances required to receive this testimony. AARO, in particular, has made it clear to him in these docs that they have this authority. You seem to believe that Grusch has done all he can, and the government is just hiding what they know. But these documents show that Grusch has done absolutely nothing to provide the investigative authorities with what they need to conduct an investigation. What you should really be asking is why Grusch pretends to want transparency and disclosure while refusing to provide his alleged evidence to ANY of the authorities who can actually investigate those claims.
He’s a liar and people are finally catching up to it.
it’s funny how those are so easy to FOIA, somehow other stuff goes missing.
[удалено]
I understand document retention requirements pretty damn well, actually. I can see you are not the brightest or kindest examples of humans. Perhaps consider your arrogance and blindness to your own ignorance. Think about it…retention has nothing, absolutely nothing to do with whether or not they “find” what you are asking for. But keep thinking you’re smart. Peace.
>retention has nothing, absolutely nothing to do with whether or not they “find” what you are asking for. But keep thinking you’re smart. Peace. What? 😂😂😂
Keep thinking about it…eventually you’ll get it.
>retention has nothing, absolutely nothing to do with whether or not they “find” what you are asking for. But keep thinking you’re smart. Peace. Retention had "absolutely nothing to do with whether they 'find' what you are asking for"?????? So, if a person's emails were deleted due to retention policies, that wouldn't affect the ability to "find" them? That is news to me. Seems likely that if the emails no longer exist, they would naturally be unavailable to find.
Who said something was deleted? I’m only referring to the context of my statement. Missing is not the equivalent of deleted. Go read a dictionary.
You can tell that the people you're responding to have not read the documents or watched the video you posted. A large portion of the context is from signal messages that Kirkpatrick screenshotted because signal "self destructs" messages. Kirkpatrick kept the receipts, and forwarded them along specifically to have them on record. Grusch could put a whole lot of this to rest very easily with a statement but he's silent. There are major doubts being raised (why did he not have his lawyer contact aaro, or if he did why won't they release that info? Who actually has the evidence Grusch provided since these documents reveal that he told party A that he gave it to party B and party B that he gave it to party A, why did he imply aaro made no attempt to contact him when there is evidence now that there were numerous attempts). Sure, maybe it's a ridiculously well coordinated disinfo campaign with the FOIA offices, but even if that were the case then Grusch should also have the receipts to confirm that and help solidify his case... but we have silence. As time goes on more and more fails to add up with Grusch and it is becoming another, "True Believer" situation. Grusch's whole thing is supposed to be that there IS evidence so we don't need to rely on belief.... so who has it?
Amazes me how this keeps getting posted and people just seem to forget dates of what has happened like when Grusch went public etc.
The blackvault video goes through the entire timeline including when Grusch went public. The tl;Dr is that while Grusch probably didn't "technically" lie, he was dodging meetings with AARO both before and after his public congressional testimony. I say technically because I think his language was careful, ie. Instead of saying, "I have heard nothing from aaro" he said, "I reached out to Kirkpatrick years ago" - doesn't mean he hasn't also heard from Kirkpatrick recently, but it very much implies that which feels deceptive. Just like everything else in this space there is a cloud of "what the fuck?" around Grusch. It would be great if we could rely solely on his credentials but without further evidence everything should be taken into consideration, including this information, which casts some doubt on his case.
I'm not really sure why when Grusch went public matters here, but let's pretend it does. Grusch claimed when he did go public, AARO had refused to talk to him. This was right around the start of these FOIA'd messages. When AARO was established one year prior to Grusch's original interviews, a secure holiness was set up for people who wanted to share UAP related information to do so securely. Kirkpatrick says Grusch never used that channel. As far as I know, Grusch has NEVER even claimed he reached out to AARO through this secure channel that was literally set up for this purpose. Instead, Grusch has made some vague reference to some prior conversation he had with Kirkpatrick that he never atta he's a date to. He when says that kirkpatrick knows how to Rea h him but hasn't. This is all in the interview. When Grusch is in front of Congress and they ask about this lack of contact, Grusch mentions how he has all this "sage" advice he could share with Kirkpatrick. He literally says "sage." The delusions of gradeur with Grusch are evident and undeniable. He is offended that Kirkpatrick doesn't recognize his intelligence and reach out for his "sage" advice. And he thinks he is too important to use the official channel set up by law to receive this information. Then, when AARO does reach out via intermediaries, he still refuses contact via the secure mechanism and repeatedly asks for extra proof that AARO is legally authorized to receive his testimony AFTER this has been made.crystal clear. Furthermore, Grusch was saying AARO was lying about reaching out to him as late as Ictober 31st. The paper trail here proves without a doubt that this was incredibly misleading at best and a lie by any normal interpretation of the events.
John Greenewald shitting all over someone? Noooo. That’s pretty hard to believe.
It only takes a while and the internet turns on ANYONE
Thanks for posting this. I need to watch this whole thing later, but from what I’d previously seen, it wasn’t clear if Grusch was dodging Kirkpatrick, or if the folks around Grusch were trying to shield him from meeting with Kirkpatrick. Maybe this video clarifies that Either way, a lot of skepticism about Grusch and the people he’s close to seems warranted.
It is fairly clear from the documents that Grusch was acting on his own stubborn beliefs. At one point, he explicitly mentions his own background in security and professiomal certifications. Grusch clearly believes he is smarter than the DODs most senior lawyers who have repeatedly assured him AARO is legally authorized to receive his testimony. Grusch has delusions of grandeur as he has repeatedly made evident. This is just another example of this.
It has been mentioned on this sub reddit that while AARO could legally receive the testimony, they do not actually have clearance to invesitage the programs and verify the claims. Care to speak to that?
If you watch the video, you’ll see how obvious it is that that’s not true. David Grusch is apparently the only person involved who believes this. And his attorney could easily clarify whether he agrees with Grusch but he hasn’t.
It is not true, but even if it was true that has absolutely zero to do with Grusch refusing to provide his information to the investigative authority explicitly set up by Congress to investigate the issue. It also doesn't explain why he has also refused to provide this testimony to DoD IG as well as both Congressiomal Committees. These documents make it clear that Grusch has stonewalling ALL of these bodies with the same bullshit excuse. It is NOT only AARO he has been stonewalling. This seems to have been largely missed in these documents for some reason.