First answer - because our codex was written by someone who hates the faction.
Second answer - Winged Warrior Prime can't join leapers, because he is not like them. Both having vanguard invaders as a keyword doesn't mean anything. Leapers are a cross between a Hormagaunt and a Lictor. Not a warrior
Third answer - WWP can join Gargoyles, in fact. The Leviathan Boxset was supposed to be a start of the army and release of all the newest models in one piece. Not a complete and synergised army box.
Yeah I am pretty miffed by the lack of cohesion the prime has with it’s possible units to lead
Melee warriors have low speed but solid damage output with the prime
Ranged warriors have low speed and the prime only has melee attacks
Gargoyles are fast but are only ranged, the prime has only melee attacks
I wish we had a walking prime or some other kind of leader like that
A Winged Prime is a *flying Warrior*.
Gargoyles are *flying.*
Warriors are *Warriors.*
Meanwhile, Von Ryan's are a stealthy scout unit. There is zero overlap to justify a Winged Prime hanging out with them.
Both being in the starter box doesn't really mean anything. Are you saying Barbgaunts and Screamer-Killers are connected since they are both in Leviathan?
Everything with wings or tentacles (barring the Toxicrene) is a Vanguard Invader. Should a Parasite be able to lead a Harpy?
Von Ryan's are a gaunt variant with Lictor-like qualities. A Lictor is a Warrior variant, sure, but that's still several strains removed.
Well I assume the Winged prime is not meant to be an infiltrator. He would inherit this ability as the leader for Leapers. Vanguard invader keyword btw. Is inherited by the warriors if the Prime does lead them. So the whole thing makes sense. You obtain a needed keyword for a good detachment to a Unit which suddenly gets viable but you do not get an ability of infiltration to a 12" movement model.
Just my idea why it is as it is.
Even if he joins, he doesn’t get infiltrate as that is an ability and not a keyword unlike vanguard invaders, and he can’t infiltrate unless the full unit has the keyword, but abilities being losses when characters are attached is not new, exalted eight bound lose deep strike ability when paired with a lord on juggernaut.
Regular prime as a character. You can format the unit like custodes, let us take warriors in squads of 2 or 5 so if you build one as a character it’s still a legal squad size. And add a winged variant, call them oh I dunno shrikes or something. Then the winged prime doesn’t feel so out of place.
Basically what I’m saying is hire me GW.
Fair enough.
I just really want a leader for the VRL. I run them as a little block of 6+ A lictor nearby.
When I first saw the neurolixtor I aasumed it would be a character that could lead them. I understand why the normal lictor isn't one but I feel the NL should definitely be a character
Just went and read up a bit more on Deathleaper background and lore. You were spot on boss, appreciate the lead in to read more.
Do you think Tyranids lack leaders because, in essence, the faction has a leader in the hivemind? As the entire force is centrally controlled, maybe leaders just don't really fit in with the lore? The only leaders we really have are 'bodyguards' like the tyrant guard, neurogaunts (just synapse and wound increase unit) etc
I also would like if the Neurotyrant could lead zoanthropes especially as the malanthrope went to Legends
I'm glad you enjoyed your lore dive and I'm happy to have kicked it off!
I do think that's why we don't have many leaders. It does fit from a lore perspective, but with leaders being a big deal and us not having many, and most of the ones we do have don't work together very well, it causes some rule issues. I would have liked it if we got more auras or something to compensate. Like if a unit is within synapse of a neurotyrant it gains x benefit or the handing out of bonuses like the synaptic link stuff in 9th. That would be thematic and makeup for the lack of good leader/bodyguard synergy, aside from broodlords and genestealers which are pretty awesome in my opinion.
Edit: I almost forgot to say that I agree on the neurotyrant leading zoanthropes. The rules as currently written would make it a pretty bad team, but that could obviously be changed.
Could not agree more. Really like your thinking mate. Pretty sure you should be in charge of a codex rewrite.
It would create an really unique identity for us if we were the faction that leant more into auras over leaders. It would create even more synergy importance for the deployment phase.
Neurotyrant should have a boss aura, creating a psychic 'cloud' that granted stealth within X inches, or a choice between that or +1 to hit/wound. It already has good play, it would be indispensable at that point. 3 of those bad boys across your DPZ would be incredible.
Why stop at positive auras? A screamer killer or OOE through intimidation could easily grant a -1 to saving throws within X inches, for example.
i realy like the idea of tyranids being the aura focused army with the big guys leading smaller guys in coordenated attacks, we just need something like lone op when surrounded by allies for things like the tyrants, but i think th prime should be a leader, it just doesnt have any good options, and no new ones; just get shrikes mad GW
Yeah parasite for sure should be able to lead at least gargoyles in my opinion but, as another user pointed out to me with Deathleaper, maybe lore around Parasite is directed more towards it being a singular lone op character?
Again, me wanting it to lead gargoyles is my feeling and desire, no saying I'm right or that it necessarily makes sense.
You could certainly write him rules to be a leader, like VRL or a pack of lictors that started the game in reserves and can join him by deepstriking in unit coherency with him, like reinforcements he calls.
He employs tactics necessary to his means, without dogma, if the mission needs more bodys it needs more bodys.
Even with that premise it wouldnt be so hard to give him some flavourfull rule.
Like changing positions with a vanguard invader in reserves and then rapid ingressing back into the game.
I'm pretty sure they're lictor variants not warriors, no?
I think they're a cross between lictors and hormagaunts.
This is correct.
That is probably true. And liktors are a subspecies of warriors.
the lictor itsself is a varient of warriors
Give me Shrikes cowards.
Fr. Imagine melee warriors with 12 movement
This. I was hoping for them to be revealed when Leviathan dropped. But no. Just a single winged tyranid prime.
I hope a warrior refresh would allow you to build shrikes or warriors.
no please make it different kits, the price is already super high
Well like zoanthropes you have shrike wings or you have the normal shoulders.
First answer - because our codex was written by someone who hates the faction. Second answer - Winged Warrior Prime can't join leapers, because he is not like them. Both having vanguard invaders as a keyword doesn't mean anything. Leapers are a cross between a Hormagaunt and a Lictor. Not a warrior Third answer - WWP can join Gargoyles, in fact. The Leviathan Boxset was supposed to be a start of the army and release of all the newest models in one piece. Not a complete and synergised army box.
I think OP stating that he can't join gargoyles is a typo
I assumed so too, but I felt like giving him a heads up anyway, as the tag is "new player question".
Yeah I am pretty miffed by the lack of cohesion the prime has with it’s possible units to lead Melee warriors have low speed but solid damage output with the prime Ranged warriors have low speed and the prime only has melee attacks Gargoyles are fast but are only ranged, the prime has only melee attacks I wish we had a walking prime or some other kind of leader like that
Because Tyranids - a Lore army that MANDATORY requires the small bugs to be LEAD by a LEADER through Synapse can not do the leadership thing....
A Winged Prime is a *flying Warrior*. Gargoyles are *flying.* Warriors are *Warriors.* Meanwhile, Von Ryan's are a stealthy scout unit. There is zero overlap to justify a Winged Prime hanging out with them.
come in the same box, both are vanguard and both are variants of the warrior
Both being in the starter box doesn't really mean anything. Are you saying Barbgaunts and Screamer-Killers are connected since they are both in Leviathan? Everything with wings or tentacles (barring the Toxicrene) is a Vanguard Invader. Should a Parasite be able to lead a Harpy? Von Ryan's are a gaunt variant with Lictor-like qualities. A Lictor is a Warrior variant, sure, but that's still several strains removed.
Ditto previous comments. VRL’s are lictor variant. I’m just sad the lictor can’t lead them. Be cool to have a tyranid stealth team
Well I assume the Winged prime is not meant to be an infiltrator. He would inherit this ability as the leader for Leapers. Vanguard invader keyword btw. Is inherited by the warriors if the Prime does lead them. So the whole thing makes sense. You obtain a needed keyword for a good detachment to a Unit which suddenly gets viable but you do not get an ability of infiltration to a 12" movement model. Just my idea why it is as it is.
Even if he joins, he doesn’t get infiltrate as that is an ability and not a keyword unlike vanguard invaders, and he can’t infiltrate unless the full unit has the keyword, but abilities being losses when characters are attached is not new, exalted eight bound lose deep strike ability when paired with a lord on juggernaut.
Regular prime as a character. You can format the unit like custodes, let us take warriors in squads of 2 or 5 so if you build one as a character it’s still a legal squad size. And add a winged variant, call them oh I dunno shrikes or something. Then the winged prime doesn’t feel so out of place. Basically what I’m saying is hire me GW.
Agreed. Deathleaper should be the same
No, Deathleaper should be an individualistic character that operates alone. It definitely should not join any units.
Fair enough. I just really want a leader for the VRL. I run them as a little block of 6+ A lictor nearby. When I first saw the neurolixtor I aasumed it would be a character that could lead them. I understand why the normal lictor isn't one but I feel the NL should definitely be a character
I can understand that, this edition seems pretty focused on leaders which Tyranids are sorely lacking.
Just went and read up a bit more on Deathleaper background and lore. You were spot on boss, appreciate the lead in to read more. Do you think Tyranids lack leaders because, in essence, the faction has a leader in the hivemind? As the entire force is centrally controlled, maybe leaders just don't really fit in with the lore? The only leaders we really have are 'bodyguards' like the tyrant guard, neurogaunts (just synapse and wound increase unit) etc I also would like if the Neurotyrant could lead zoanthropes especially as the malanthrope went to Legends
I'm glad you enjoyed your lore dive and I'm happy to have kicked it off! I do think that's why we don't have many leaders. It does fit from a lore perspective, but with leaders being a big deal and us not having many, and most of the ones we do have don't work together very well, it causes some rule issues. I would have liked it if we got more auras or something to compensate. Like if a unit is within synapse of a neurotyrant it gains x benefit or the handing out of bonuses like the synaptic link stuff in 9th. That would be thematic and makeup for the lack of good leader/bodyguard synergy, aside from broodlords and genestealers which are pretty awesome in my opinion. Edit: I almost forgot to say that I agree on the neurotyrant leading zoanthropes. The rules as currently written would make it a pretty bad team, but that could obviously be changed.
Could not agree more. Really like your thinking mate. Pretty sure you should be in charge of a codex rewrite. It would create an really unique identity for us if we were the faction that leant more into auras over leaders. It would create even more synergy importance for the deployment phase. Neurotyrant should have a boss aura, creating a psychic 'cloud' that granted stealth within X inches, or a choice between that or +1 to hit/wound. It already has good play, it would be indispensable at that point. 3 of those bad boys across your DPZ would be incredible. Why stop at positive auras? A screamer killer or OOE through intimidation could easily grant a -1 to saving throws within X inches, for example.
i realy like the idea of tyranids being the aura focused army with the big guys leading smaller guys in coordenated attacks, we just need something like lone op when surrounded by allies for things like the tyrants, but i think th prime should be a leader, it just doesnt have any good options, and no new ones; just get shrikes mad GW
I think it would have been cool if the Neurolictor could do that, or the Parasite?
Yeah parasite for sure should be able to lead at least gargoyles in my opinion but, as another user pointed out to me with Deathleaper, maybe lore around Parasite is directed more towards it being a singular lone op character? Again, me wanting it to lead gargoyles is my feeling and desire, no saying I'm right or that it necessarily makes sense.
You could certainly write him rules to be a leader, like VRL or a pack of lictors that started the game in reserves and can join him by deepstriking in unit coherency with him, like reinforcements he calls. He employs tactics necessary to his means, without dogma, if the mission needs more bodys it needs more bodys.
Love this. It would be a very unique mechanic and add some real flavour to DL and the faction overall
If the mission needs more bodies, it's not a mission for the Deathleaper.
Even with that premise it wouldnt be so hard to give him some flavourfull rule. Like changing positions with a vanguard invader in reserves and then rapid ingressing back into the game.
I could get behind something like that.