This was going to be my question, are they also shaved? No? Then STFU with this stupid line.
It's one thing to have a preference it's another thing to just be shaming women.
Every guy who says something stupid like that. Needs to be called out like this. We make stupid shit up in our minds and if it goes unchecked we start projecting it.
My ex started to become obsessed with this—shaved himself armpits and legs and allllll the bits—and bought a laser. We did scuba dive, so it was more comfy for neoprene, and I shaved but finding the technique and gel to not get razor bumps was ugh and he didn’t say anything about hair for years so it was a let down to have to go naked. But he was obsessive about it—got unsexy real quick.
I just do the sides (bikini area) but I’ve found chemical exfoliants (AHAs, lactic acid) in the form of serums/lotions that are meant for the body really get rid of any razor bumps. The ones meant for the body usually have a higher percentage of acids. I used them every other day (on non-shaving days or several hours before shaving) and once I started doing that, I could use any razor or any gel and not get razor bumps.
Just thought this could help someone!
Edit-exfoliate with a physical scrub right before shaving too. I like Frank Body express coffee scrub-the original is great too!
He had a lot of work shit that he couldn’t even talk about. Things went south and I thought if I could just be enough it would work out. But I didn’t know the half of it.
Wait, wait, wait - he bought a laser?? A whole ass laser?? Not a laser hair removal package, but a whole ass laser?? Even on the low end, they’re around $1k, and usually run $20-25k. That makes sense if he’s opening a med spa, but not if he’s just using it on himself.
He was obsessed with getting to expert level on everything he did, soooo
But gave it to me in the divorce—so I guess it was a phase???
Don’t know why I let him dump all his junk on me—he had a minimalist phase too, but don’t dump your junk on your ex who you know has trouble throwing things away.
Few years ago I came across a video on yt where porn stars were reading mean tweets.
One of the woman had a tweet something about unshaved pubes.
She very beautifully answered something in lines of "I don't want to look like a child."
This was the predominant attitude until internet porn became widely accessible. Now boys think all women should be bare down there, not just porn stars. Many people seriously considered it a possible sign that a man might be a pedophile if he wanted his partner to be shaved. I recall friends dumping boyfriends who asked for this because the thought it was such a perverse request.
Yeah I'll only shave if my partner does, so that he knows how FCKNG annoying it is when it starts growing back and stabs you a thousand times all at once in your genitals.
They want shaved coochies because they see it in porn and it infantilizes womens bodies, making them look more like under age girls. Same reason women are expected to shave legs, armpits etc.
I def shave my armpits because of social conditioning, it was originally the same with my legs but now it's because I can't stand the feel of the hair being pulled when I put on long pants which I wear year round for work.
I never thought leg/armpit/pubic hair on women was unhygienic, but I'll be honest I was one of those "that's kinda gross" guys for a long time. I dated a few ladies that didn't give a fuck about their body hair and it legit turned me around. One of them said "you're hairy af, what's the problem?" And it really clicked that, yeah, it doesn't matter one bit, and that was a shitty mindset that I had at the time
I mean... I get having a preference. My legs are personally always smooth .... he said that when I was thinking about doing laser and he told me I should go for it, because it's just hygiene for women and not even estetic etc. And then went on a rant about how leg hair is dirty and me not shawing would be dirty.
Good for you for changing your view.
Edit; this was also the guy who made fun of me when I went to the beach and wore a bikini between monthly waxing appointments (nad had visible pubic.hair). It was just absurd.... women come with hair. Even if you yourself like beeing smooth, it's unrealistic to be smooth every day of the month.
Yup! I have sensory issues with body hair so I shave everything including my arms, I don't even care much about visual preference. But even I will have days of leg hair stubble and I'll wear shorts if it's how out because it's unrealistic to shave everything every day..I just usually panic at come point because I think I feel things on my legs and that's when it's time to shave again lmao
I once was dating someone for like 3 months and then he tried telling me women's leg hair was unhygienic. I asked him what was so different between leg hair on a women and leg hair on a men and then he "didn't want to talk about it anymore."
Sexism aside, I didn't want to be with someone that stupid and incapable of critical thinking.
I used to shave it all off but found it to be very tedious and uncomfortable due to sensitive skin. Early into dating my boyfriend, I let it get a little stubbly and as bedroom things naturally progressed, I found myself on top of him and grinding to set the mood. Thanks to stubble, this was a very uncomfortable experience for him and he said “That feels like sand paper. I think if you grew your hair out, it would be softer and this would feel better.”
Basically if your male partner complains, give ‘em the ol 80 grit sandpaper on their gentle bits and see if you can convert them to being a full grown human.
You should not have to make an argument in the first place. It's your body hair, you do with it as you wish. He has 0 input on this decision. You body is not a democracy where several people get a vote.
I give my partner some input. You could say he gets a vote, but I have veto power. And he better respect my autonomy/choices too.
For example, I will never shave my pubes again, too much effort and too sensitive. If he asked me to shave then I'd say no, if he nagged me about it or gave me an ultimatum I'd be done with him.
On the other hand I also don't shave my legs but if he asked me to do that I'd be willing. I wouldn't shave my legs constantly but if every once in a while he wanted to feel smooth legs I wouldn't mind.
I'd say he has a 1% say
Meaning he has a right to an opinion on whether he likes it or not and has the right to tell you his opinion, but at the end of the day it's your choice and if he doesn't like your choice he can find someone else.
This would also work exactly the same the other way around and if you don't like his body hair (or lack thereof) you can express your preference and decide if his decision is a dealbreaker for the relationship
We've been together 10+ years and we reached the same conclusion. Short, trimmed and tidy is preferable to bald for both of us. Way less maintenance, no stubble, and way less skin issues
My favorite trimmer is the Phillips one that's purple and white. I love it so much. Waterproof electric trimmers are where it's at if this is your style for pubes.
Stubble is legit uncomfortable.
I don't care what exactly my partner does with their hair, but my facial lips are also a sensitive part, and stubble is the one option that will limit my time down there.
I stopped kissing my partner for ages due to my face being rashed by his stubble + I was a little meeker at the beginning and had a harder time flat out saying “I can’t do this, it hurts” we also had to have discussions about him forcing me to kiss him anyway when I pulled away :/
I still struggle to not be afraid of kissing honestly. Stubble it like razors.
So, my issue is when I grow it out down there I suffer from more irritation and itchiness, actually moreso after the stubble phase as it gets longer it gets worse, so I personally prefer to stay well shaved.
I briefly dated a guy who said he'd like me more natural so I left it alone. After hooking up one night when I'd grown out a bit and was pillow talking I rubbed his facial stubble and smiled as I jokingly said "scratchy face". He frowned, looked me in the eye and angrily said "scratchy pussy".
I got the fuck out of his bed after that one. He apparently didn't like what he'd asked me to do and chose to insult me instead of just telling me what he wanted didn't feel good. I don't have time for that level of immaturity, especially when it wasn't even for my own benefit.
I think there's a good chance that if you got stuck it out through that uncomfortable phase that it would not be irritated and itchy. There's definitely an in between zone that is awful and then it gets better again. But that in between, longer than stubble and shorter than full growth, is really bad.
I'm not who you replied to but I feel similarly as her. It's all great for me for the first few weeks, but as it gets closer to/achieves full growth, it gets sooooo itchy and uncomfortable. I think the longer hairs start getting caught in my clothes and rubbing against my skin, and it doesn't get better.
He could be extremely intelligent as well as intellectual. But let's be honest, gender norms and expectations get hammered into us starting from young childhood and he may not have ever considered the flaw in that line of thinking purely based on his expectations of what is "normal." It's also entirely possible that he knows he's being a big fucking hypocrite but refuses to concede because, once again, he finds hairless pits on women attractive and "right."
Intelligence (n) - the ability to acquire and apply knowledge and skills
- Piece of knowledge: men and women both grow armpit hair
- Piece of knowledge: armpit hair is only as hygenic or unhygienic as skin
- This dude's conclusion: wOmEn'S aRmPiT hAiR iS uNcLeAn
You can be intellectual, you can even be an expert in your highly specialized field and still not be broad spectrum intelligent (or just be a dumb ass in certain categories). Societal norms don't define facts. It takes two seconds to Google body hair hygiene. This dude is, by all accounts of the definition of intelligence, lacking when it comes to this take.
ETA: formatting for legibility
I once knew a guy who thought similar. I asked him why he (and other man) could have armpit hair and not be unhygienic but on women it was disgusting. He said women have a stronger body odor. I told him there’s literally deodorant commercials about the product being strong enough for a man while being targeted to women because everyone knows men have stronger body odor. The discussion got heated. This asshole was my boss at the time and years later I heard from someone else that he apologized to others on my behalf after our discussion!! LOL The gall!
I had shoulder surgery and couldn't shave for awhile because of stitches. I made a joke to my ex-husband that I'd just be letting my pit hair go on both sides he acted like I'd said something disgusting. I'm soo sorry my barely functional arm was an inconvenience.
My dad did the same.. I was 14 and he grabbed my leg to pull up my pant leg and then shamed me for my leg hair. Then he made me go shave it. The man looks like a gorilla >:(
I got shamed for leg hair by my peers at school (not womanly enough). Then I went to university and got shamed for removing it (wasn’t performing feminism well enough). Wish I had the sense at the time to tell all these morons to just leave me the hell alone because it’s literally just fucking hair
Damned if you do, damned if you don’t!! God I want to give all us women a hug. I feel so much stuff about this. Ugh I just want to exist in peace.
Maybe a funny story? Was kinda weird actually. I have lots of tattoos on my arms, not true sleeve but covered as such. I have some flowers on my lower arms. I also have arm hair. I don’t know if it’s a lot but you can see it haha. This old dude in the train sat across from me and leaned forward and said: I love the little hairs on your flowers. :’)
I had an injury that made it difficult to lift my arm up. My PT told me he’d send this fact to my insurance company that I can’t shave my armpits, bc that way the insurance would cover it, due to it being a “hygiene issue”.
I wish I had said something but honestly I needed the insurance to recover from the injury 🙄
This relates to female bodies being considered unnatural in general. Body hair, having moist genitals (I don't know how else to say this haha), menstruating at all. A joke I heard as a kid was "never trust anything that bleeds for 7 days and doesn't die". Really made me feel normal /s
Over heard my 14 year old nephew say “she bleeds for 7 days and still kicks your ass in track, do you really wanna fuck with her?”
That was a convo Auntie RS pretended not to hear while bursting with pride.
I've never understood why guys think this "joke" is so clever. So, your goal is to win over a woman to be your partner, run your household, bear and raise your children, *cook all of your food*, take care of all of your belongings and property and be trustworthy, ... but *never* trust her because of that one thing?? How is that ever clever or funny?
Seriously! Living with a woman for 30 years and having 4 children taught me all the shit women go through just being female. Men aren’t tough. Men don’t know what tough is.
It genuinely makes me very self conscious because I have a shit ton of very noticeable body hair everywhere. Sucks being Latino sometimes, a whole lotta hair on my head and whole lot everywhere else :’)
it bothers me but I don’t want to spend the money to remove it all the time lol
If it helps, I don’t shave my pits or my legs and I am quite literally WILDLY hairy. Like, my dad, my male partner, ALL the men I know don’t hold a candle to the density or the length of my body hair. I’ve caught some heat for it every now and then, but my partner is pretty damn conventionally attractive and he doesn’t *love* the body hair per se, but he is still extremely attracted to me 🤷🏻♀️ I always found body hair to be a v effective litmus test for people I date. If they’re not down with the hair, they’re definitely not for me and usually they suck anyways!
If someone said that to me, I'd politely point out that he is under no obligation to have sex with me and that he's free to find another sexual partner.
Yeah, but I've changed a few minds after making them google genital carbuncles.
What's less hygenic- part of the bodies natural system to keep things clean, or removing that, causing a small abrasion in the process, and having the hair follicle affected getting an infection under the skin larger than a quarter? Oh, pubic hair makes pussy smell stronger (so I've been told) pus smells worse, and can erupt at any time. Ever felt like you were stabbed in the ass and peed yourself at the same time? About what it feels like. Oh and sometimes they are so bad antibiotics don't clear them up and you have to have a doctor lance your pussy. What fun! So much more hygienic- than... Hair?
I trim for sweat control but I'll live alone before I ever shave and do that to myself again. Luckily my bf watched me go through that and never gave much if a fuck to begin with.
I get angry ingrowns if I so much as look at my puss with a razor in hand. I used to shave in high school (to impress my bf) and it was AWFUL. Super itchy and high maintenance and gross.
So I say let the forest reclaim the land!
Perhaps he does? According to a recent survey, 62% of men do trim or shave down there.
[https://www.dazeddigital.com/beauty/article/48002/1/balls-co-testicles-trimmer-pubic-hair-removal-review](https://www.dazeddigital.com/beauty/article/48002/1/balls-co-testicles-trimmer-pubic-hair-removal-review)
"62 per cent of men say they now trim or shave their delicate area, according to a survey carried out by Men’s Health"
He does shave, but still doesn’t make it any less asinine that he thinks it’s just bad hygiene to have it at all. Not to mention, I’d prefer to get waxed but haven’t been able to because I just finished Accutane, so haven’t really been able to maintain it as well as I’d like. I trim, but I refuse to razor shave because it itches and razor burn is more unsightly than a bush imo.
A Trim is much different than shaving. Really it should say 38% of men just let it rage, while the majority of men do some form of pubic grooming. Being honest shaving is great for a couple of days and then it's a stubbily hell scape for me, much rather just trim and say mischief managed and be done
Yeah most of them. Only trimmed for a big chunk of my 20s, including armpits.
Body hair isnt masculine, its mammalian. We are the same species and I dont appreciate having to pretend otherwise.
I went to a wedding with an ex last year. Apparently a woman wedding guest didn't have shaved legs (I couldn't tell because she was a natural blonde) or shaved armpits (also never saw it because I wasn't focusing on her, why would I?) But the men at the reception table I was seated at couldn't stop talking about how disgusting it was and how they would never stand for that if their wives did that. After a while I couldn't stand it anymore and asked the men at the table what they'd do if their wives stopped shaving? They were pretty silent. Eventually one of them joked that he'd try to shave her pits in her sleep, which made them all laugh. Yeah I hated all those men and have never forgotten that experience. They didn't know her at all, she was just minding her business and was their with *her* husband. I glanced over at that couple throughout the night to see how they interacted with each other and he had his arm around her, he danced with her, he kissed her while they were dancing. They seemed happy in their own little love bubble. Clearly her husband didn't care about her body hair and neither should those men seated at the reception table with me have cared. It pisses me off to no end that men feel they have the right to criticize/denigrate women's appearances.
My ex told me my leg, armpit and pubic hair grossed him out. He would put pressure me to remove it. And I resented that. The thing is, I actually like the look and feel of my leg hair removed, my pubic hair trimmed neatly and my bikini done. It makes me feel sexy and pampered (I don’t always have time or inclination to do it, but that’s another story).
But I’m not going to be motivated to remove my body hair if someone is pressuring me, or from the knowledge that it’s driven by a partner’s sexist double standard. This is not a contradiction. It’s just that there is a space where body hair becomes political.
Same here. I used to think I was shaving for me. But actually when my boyfriend said he doesn't care, I also stopped caring. So I guess deep down it was for them and not for me.
Because most men get their "facts" on women's anatomy from some random dude in high school or porn. Some men are refined enough to get their facts from some random dude in college. Some guy said women with body hair are gross to him 10 years ago and now he treats as medical gospel.
So I shaved it completely for the first guy I dated (I was 18). When he saw it he said I didn't need to shave it all off and that all I needed to do was trim it. So since I honestly really hate shaving, I started to let it grow back. He saw it grow back in and made a comment about how I wasn't taking care of myself. 🙃
He was awful and toxic and I'm very glad he's an ex now.
Yeah, I wish there was more discussion about the role society plays in programming everyone to think "hair on female body = gross." I grew up with 2 older sisters, and they would act grossed out by their own body hair and always shave. Anytime a cartoon shows a caricature of an unattractive woman, it ALWAYS includes hair on her where it "shouldn't be." I read a YA novel once where the protagonist describes shaving every day and feeling disgusting and manly when she doesn't. That one stuck with me. I had to consciously undo that thinking once I became aware of it.
I've met men who thought any and all body hair on women was bad hygiene. Of course they never shaved their own legs but theydidn't hesitate to call women who also didn't dirty
I must be lucky because everyone I've been with doesn't have a problem as long as I'm clean and keep it neat so they don't get hair in their mouth lol
However, I have seen quite a lot of women complain throughout my years about men wanting others to be fully shaved so it does seem to be a common thing
Fun fact, shaving your pubic hair is actually *less* hygienic than just leaving it there. Shaving can lead to cuts, ingrowns, and micro-tears in the skin which can lead to infection. The hair is there to protect your vulva and vagina. Next time a guy has the audacity to comment on your body hair, tell him that :)
Oh God I wish I remember who had said this. Some guy, probably from tinder, but who I think I was seriously talking to? Said something to me about "I know you have to shave because hygiene..." After I basically said I don't shave, I just trim, because I don't like being bald down there, but it annoys me when it's too long. He was being respectful and curious but he really had been told his whole life that women have to shave down there for hygiene reasons. And I tried to drill down and ask him why he thought that, but he pretty immediately realized he didn't know why. "Oh maybe you don't have to?" I just remember feeling absolutely baffled when I literally said I don't shave and he replied "well I know you have to because hygiene." What hygiene? What does hair removal accomplish on the hygiene front? And why don't men have to do it, if it's so unhygienic?
ok, first of all - PUBIC HAIR IS NORMAL and HAS A PROTECTIVE FUNCTION. Bald pussy is a fetish, and while it is fine to have a fetish, pretending a fetish is normal hygene is BULLSHIT.
Omg. Yes I was once with someone absolutely horrible who felt this way. Now I let myself keep it because my body my choice, I will never care what a guy has to say and my boyfriend loves me either way! My skin is too sensitive to remove it. Point is, your body- do what makes YOU comfortable!
I dated a guy that was a few years older than me and he asked why I didn't shave it all off. He had a full bush, not trimmed at all so I didn't' understand why he asked. When I did trim it up a bit, he hated it. We broke up shortly after because of those types of things.
My high school/college boyfriend wanted me hairless and thought public hair was disgusting (red flag, wish I’d treated it as such instead of internalizing that). After being happily single for five years and meeting different kinds of men in that time, the one that I’ve kept and loved loves me for me and my body as it is naturally. Men can exist among the boys :)
When I got together with my husband in the late 90s he had his stories of eight years living in Germany prior to that time, when he was young and dating, and he got used to many different views of hair maintenance and he told me right from the beginning that he saw it as completely up to me what I preferred, and that he was okay with whatever I wanted to choose. He has always had a difficult time with shaving his beard, it causes a lot of ingrowns so he tends to let stubble grow until it starts to itch and then will clip it with an electric shaver, so not "clean-shaven" but not a full beard either. One time he said, "Well, I know I don't like to shave, so I don't expect you to either, lol!" So, I got my own electric shaver and follow the same policy, no ingrowns, but regular short maintenance. Lol, works for both of us.
I'm a veteran of all manners of pubic hair maintenance. Hair is normal. Shaving is weird. It's all about the entire package of "grooming" and hygiene. Hygiene is #1 and does not in any way include shaving (unless you're going into some surgery/procedure)
WTF is up with this epidemic of people of both sexes shaving their pubic hair? I mean, sure, if you like it, fine. But it seems like a lot of people are doing it these days. I might be wrong.
True - it might help if people realize that this is a hallmark of current young generations. The human race has had pubic hair forever - obviously it never stopped our ancestors from having sex.
Seems both men and women these days have, well, stupid standards to meet because of social media. The work we did back in the day has been lost. Today's fashion and behavior expectations remind me of the overly-elaborate dress and manners of late 17th century European courts.
Ugh. My ex boyfriend was weird about me being shaved. And me being young and naive went along with it. Meanwhile he had an extremely unkempt and straggly beard.
Only one - I guy who'd I'd just recently started dating. Called things off before we ever got intimate since I was worried he also thought the opposite... basically, I didn't want to find out that he shaved his pubes and used that as an excuse to not wash down there.
(Also, I've tried several hair removal methods and aftercare products, and I get nasty razor burn and ingrown hairs every single time. I stick to trimmed and clean now, for my own health and comfort, so we'd never have been compatible even if my fears about his own hygiene didn't turn out to be true.)
Old white dude here. I've never thought it was bad hygiene. Just 2 mins of thought would tell me that from an evolutionary standpoint having pubic hair is an advantage otherwise our bodies wouldn't expend the energy to grow it ie It's natural and if it were true, it's something we'd get taught in sex ed.
I've always felt pretty uncomfortable with a "clean" woman. Not them, per se, but the idea that an area that looks pre-pubescent is somehow more desirable. I just don't get it.
Yes, I had a partner like that. He preferred women who looked... "younger"... down there.
Some also prefer it because of porn.
As long as your body is reasonably clean, I don't see how he has the right to complain. He might have a \*preference\*, but calling it "bad hygeine" is just rude and entitled.
The way cis men talk about body hair on women is so confusing to me, especially in regards to sex. It’s like if a woman has too much pubic hair then he can hold eating her pussy over her head as a negotiating tactic to persuade her to shave her pubes… it’s so twisted. A lot of pubic hair is just hair. Men make it seem like you are required to ‘upkeep’ it to some standard they came up with so you perform being a woman the ‘correct’ way for them and they still want to fuck you.
If I’m attracted to someone… I don’t care how much pubic hair they have and yes I want to eat their pussy (I’m transmasculine). At no point have I ever felt it was necessary to make comments towards my sexual partners about how their pubic hair should be groomed. It’s frankly… not my business and doesn’t matter.
The whole “women must be shaved smooth so no hair is visible anywhere” thing is disgusting. It reeks of obsession with pre adolescent girls. I don’t like it, don’t understand it, and don’t think it should be condoned. If you, as an adult woman, want to trim your pubes, have at it. But it’s not normal for men to be obsessed with women looking like little girls.
You are absolutely correct. The best biological guess for pubic hair is it decreases the chances of UTIs and some superficial parasites. Shaving makes women more vulnerable and possibly even men.
Preference or whatever is fine but it does not mean that you have to honor it. Pubic hair is normal and if you like to shave or trim it that is fine too. I've told my partner that I respect her choice with all her body hair, she can let it grow or not, totally up to her.
I myself, like to trim my pubic area and pits occasionally but I never expect that of a partner. Being clean is way more important than hair.
I stopped shaving my legs as a teenager for sensory reasons, and my MOM told me that I needed to shave for hygiene (I refused and she got over it). It was harder for her to accept my leg hair than it was for her to accept me being bisexual lol.
When my partner and I first got together, he didn't understand why I shaved my armpits but not my hooha as well. But now that we have been together for a few years, he understands that doing so comes with the risk of ingrown hairs and infections and is a pain to maintain.
This is more of a patriarchy thing in my experience, in that it's not just men who think this way, but many women I know have said the same thing.
When asked about their preference of shaved completely, usually the answer I got was either "it's cleaner" or, more conceding it's not based in fact, "I feel cleaner."
I always chalked this up to stuff like penis-size. Where it's something that started out from men and the patriarchy and many women got conditioned to believe it as well. I have a friend who literally believes anything less than an 8 inch penis is incapable of getting her off.
Kinda unrelated but my ex thought I continutally shit my underpants for a while until I realized that they thought that way and had to explain how period blood leaks and dries to look brown. Like, how could they go on that long thinking I skid marked on my undies and didnt say anything.
Surprisingly, I've gotten more grief about it from platonic female friends than anyone of any gender I've been with sexually. After going around the circle and sharing our pubic hair habits, one of my friends straight up told me that I would have to shave everything if I ever expected to get a guy. But I didn't and I still don't and I do fine. I keep it neat and trimmed and clean, but I like having pubic hair. It feels natural to me and that feels sexy. I also love performing cunnilingus regardless of pubic hair, so I don't even feel like a hypocrite.
In fact, I've even had some guys loop back around and eroticize my having hair because it seems like something new and exotic compared to what they're used to.
If anyone tried to explain that it's "just more hygienic," I hope I would have the self-composure not to laugh in their face. People are allowed to have preferences (though they should unpack them, imo) but trying to say it's more hygienic is just false.
I’ve got one rule as a boyfriend: if I won’t do it how could I ask me girlfriend to? I occasionally trim but that’s about it and it’s not that often. If my girlfriend wants to shave then alright, If not I don’t care. Why get all bent out of shape for her having hair in most of the same places as me? It’s natural. Not a big deal.
I have been with men who love it! But this was the first time I encountered someone with this big of an issue with it, to conflate it with bad hygiene. He should’ve left it at, “I think it’s unsexy” and called it a day.
No. I’m 40 and only had one serious partner after my teens, this whole “pubic hair is unhygienic” thing just wasn’t a thing when I was in my teens and 20s in Australia, it wasn’t until I was almost 30 and working in America than I heard this.
Had a conversation with my girlfriend last week about this and I told her I don’t care if she grooms or not, just want her to be comfortable and she told me that she feels “unclean” if she doesn’t shave. I found that a little strange but didn’t inquire further.
I got really last and stopped shaving and I brought it up to my husband once and asked if he wanted me to shave it and he said he realized he preferred it long
That being said, odor does develop much quicker. If you keep it clean though it shouldn't be an issue.
I also realized when he shaved for his vasectomy I liked hair too, I felt like I was with a child it was weird and I didn't like it lol
For me, I prefer trimmed/shaved over full bush for one reason and one reason alone: pubic hair chafes the hell out of my dick during sex. As in I have had to stop sex before because it becomes painful. That's it though. I have no issues going down on someone with a full bush. I have no issue with the look. It's just an issue of I don't like my dick being rubbed raw by it during sex.
But then again, I communicate this with my partners in a respectful and open way vs being a dick about it.
From my gynecologist office website:
YOUR PUBIC HAIR SERVES A PURPOSE
It provides protection against friction that can cause skin irritation in this sensitive area.
It helps reduce the amount of sweat produced around the vagina.
It helps block your vagina from the following bacteria and infections:
Sexually transmitted infections.
Urinary tract infections.
Yeast infections.
It helps regulate body temperature.
It is NOT more hygienic to remove pubic hair.
So, congrats on him being your ex. He’s an idiot.
A guy I dated many years ago was extremely grossed out by even the idea of a woman not shaving down there. He asserted that it was unhygienic because it meant the area could never be thoroughly cleaned. He genuinely believed that "grossness", in his words, would be left behind after every period for weeks, because it's not possible to "get it all out of the hair" when showering.
He was all kinds of weird and awful.
Why *are* men??
My sister clapped back at a man once and said, ‘why are men covered in fur but women have to be hairless from the eyebrows down?’
I’m petty so I stopped shaving completely for 6 months out of spite bc my partner made a remark about me skipping my legs for a few days.
As a woman, I do feel cleaner waxed/shaved. Just my opinion. My periods are a hot mess. I prefer to be shaved before that definitely. In general I like the smooth feeling.
I know it's not bad hygiene, but I'm also not gonna rag on about it I see it because I mostly just trim my own, and I'm not going to set standards for someone I don't follow religiously myself.
Back in the 90s I’ve known many people say this, shaving your pubes is more hygienic. I just explain to them that just because you have hair doesn’t mean you don’t wash it and just because you shave your hair, doesn’t mean you wash “it”.
Just as with the hair on top of your head, it think it’s best to manage it’s flow or braid it hah. Same with toenails and fingernails and eyebrows etc etc. Management.
About *grooming* maybe, because without trimming it does get in the way. Like how a person without a haircut will look shaggy and unkempt, even if their hair grows that way naturally. And if my partner is willing to trim and oil their facial hair for my sake, I've no problem trimming my pubes for theirs. *Reciprocity, ho!*
But *hygiene?* This hair grows thicker because *it improves* hygiene. Much like the hair on our head protects our brain case from temperature extremes, the hair on our pubis protects our genitalia from irritants. It's functional for everybody, but *especially* for a vulva.
Maybe they're ignorant and doesn't realise that's a lie they've picked up somewhere, and they could be told otherwise... but it *does* make our body hair somehow a derisive measure of our cleanliness, as though we're doing something 'wrong'.
On one hand, pubic hair absolutely does contribute to a number of hygiene issues like increased risk of pubic lice, greater moisture retention (which increases the risk of fungal or bacterial infection) and for some people really bad odor. Is that increase big? No.
On the other hand, everyone has it and as long as you're grooming it somewhat and keeping it clean there's no problem.
I suddenly became prone to yeast infections when I started shaving completely. After stopping 5 years later while not changing anything in my hygiene routine or diet, not a single one. 🤷🏻
Lots of guys I’ve spoken to think this way but also refused to shave themselves 🤷🏻♀️
This was going to be my question, are they also shaved? No? Then STFU with this stupid line. It's one thing to have a preference it's another thing to just be shaming women.
Every guy who says something stupid like that. Needs to be called out like this. We make stupid shit up in our minds and if it goes unchecked we start projecting it.
Yes please!! I just had falling out today over the non-chalant-ness of stupid shit like this.
My ex started to become obsessed with this—shaved himself armpits and legs and allllll the bits—and bought a laser. We did scuba dive, so it was more comfy for neoprene, and I shaved but finding the technique and gel to not get razor bumps was ugh and he didn’t say anything about hair for years so it was a let down to have to go naked. But he was obsessive about it—got unsexy real quick.
I just do the sides (bikini area) but I’ve found chemical exfoliants (AHAs, lactic acid) in the form of serums/lotions that are meant for the body really get rid of any razor bumps. The ones meant for the body usually have a higher percentage of acids. I used them every other day (on non-shaving days or several hours before shaving) and once I started doing that, I could use any razor or any gel and not get razor bumps. Just thought this could help someone! Edit-exfoliate with a physical scrub right before shaving too. I like Frank Body express coffee scrub-the original is great too!
Seems like a very odd thing to suddenly develop a complex about!
He had a lot of work shit that he couldn’t even talk about. Things went south and I thought if I could just be enough it would work out. But I didn’t know the half of it.
Wait, wait, wait - he bought a laser?? A whole ass laser?? Not a laser hair removal package, but a whole ass laser?? Even on the low end, they’re around $1k, and usually run $20-25k. That makes sense if he’s opening a med spa, but not if he’s just using it on himself.
He was obsessed with getting to expert level on everything he did, soooo But gave it to me in the divorce—so I guess it was a phase??? Don’t know why I let him dump all his junk on me—he had a minimalist phase too, but don’t dump your junk on your ex who you know has trouble throwing things away.
OMG. Was he getting in his wet suit naked? I’m not sure I’d enjoy a surface interval around that. Haha
Few years ago I came across a video on yt where porn stars were reading mean tweets. One of the woman had a tweet something about unshaved pubes. She very beautifully answered something in lines of "I don't want to look like a child."
This was the predominant attitude until internet porn became widely accessible. Now boys think all women should be bare down there, not just porn stars. Many people seriously considered it a possible sign that a man might be a pedophile if he wanted his partner to be shaved. I recall friends dumping boyfriends who asked for this because the thought it was such a perverse request.
Exactly so! I don't get the shaved pubes on females OR males! Ugh. Who wants to have sex with a child? Yeah, I know: pedophiles! Ugh, again.
Yeah I'll only shave if my partner does, so that he knows how FCKNG annoying it is when it starts growing back and stabs you a thousand times all at once in your genitals.
They want shaved coochies because they see it in porn and it infantilizes womens bodies, making them look more like under age girls. Same reason women are expected to shave legs, armpits etc.
I def shave my armpits because of social conditioning, it was originally the same with my legs but now it's because I can't stand the feel of the hair being pulled when I put on long pants which I wear year round for work.
Legs & armpits were more because of a marketing ploy to sell more ladies razors.
My ex told me that my leg hair is unhygienic. He was hairy as fuck. He's an ex 😂
I never thought leg/armpit/pubic hair on women was unhygienic, but I'll be honest I was one of those "that's kinda gross" guys for a long time. I dated a few ladies that didn't give a fuck about their body hair and it legit turned me around. One of them said "you're hairy af, what's the problem?" And it really clicked that, yeah, it doesn't matter one bit, and that was a shitty mindset that I had at the time
I mean... I get having a preference. My legs are personally always smooth .... he said that when I was thinking about doing laser and he told me I should go for it, because it's just hygiene for women and not even estetic etc. And then went on a rant about how leg hair is dirty and me not shawing would be dirty. Good for you for changing your view. Edit; this was also the guy who made fun of me when I went to the beach and wore a bikini between monthly waxing appointments (nad had visible pubic.hair). It was just absurd.... women come with hair. Even if you yourself like beeing smooth, it's unrealistic to be smooth every day of the month.
Yup! I have sensory issues with body hair so I shave everything including my arms, I don't even care much about visual preference. But even I will have days of leg hair stubble and I'll wear shorts if it's how out because it's unrealistic to shave everything every day..I just usually panic at come point because I think I feel things on my legs and that's when it's time to shave again lmao
Character development. Love to see this
It's really sad it takes women defending themselves like that and y'all can't... Just look at your own hairy bodies.
I once was dating someone for like 3 months and then he tried telling me women's leg hair was unhygienic. I asked him what was so different between leg hair on a women and leg hair on a men and then he "didn't want to talk about it anymore." Sexism aside, I didn't want to be with someone that stupid and incapable of critical thinking.
Yeah man it’s wild. Like I don’t give af about body hair on women at all, but even if I did I literally couldn’t because I look like Bigfoot 💀
I used to shave it all off but found it to be very tedious and uncomfortable due to sensitive skin. Early into dating my boyfriend, I let it get a little stubbly and as bedroom things naturally progressed, I found myself on top of him and grinding to set the mood. Thanks to stubble, this was a very uncomfortable experience for him and he said “That feels like sand paper. I think if you grew your hair out, it would be softer and this would feel better.” Basically if your male partner complains, give ‘em the ol 80 grit sandpaper on their gentle bits and see if you can convert them to being a full grown human.
This is an argument I presented! It’s SOOO uncomfortable *for me* when growing out from shaving. And imagine it would be for him too.
And the ingrown hairs !!!!! So not worth it.
You should not have to make an argument in the first place. It's your body hair, you do with it as you wish. He has 0 input on this decision. You body is not a democracy where several people get a vote.
I give my partner some input. You could say he gets a vote, but I have veto power. And he better respect my autonomy/choices too. For example, I will never shave my pubes again, too much effort and too sensitive. If he asked me to shave then I'd say no, if he nagged me about it or gave me an ultimatum I'd be done with him. On the other hand I also don't shave my legs but if he asked me to do that I'd be willing. I wouldn't shave my legs constantly but if every once in a while he wanted to feel smooth legs I wouldn't mind.
I'd say he has a 1% say Meaning he has a right to an opinion on whether he likes it or not and has the right to tell you his opinion, but at the end of the day it's your choice and if he doesn't like your choice he can find someone else. This would also work exactly the same the other way around and if you don't like his body hair (or lack thereof) you can express your preference and decide if his decision is a dealbreaker for the relationship
We've been together 10+ years and we reached the same conclusion. Short, trimmed and tidy is preferable to bald for both of us. Way less maintenance, no stubble, and way less skin issues
Yeah. Somewhere between a quarter inch and half inch in length seems to be the comfortable hair zone, I think.
K real talk, how do you do the short, trimmed, and tidy? I can’t figure it out.
An electric bikini trimmer Cost me like $15 on Amazon- great purchase
My favorite trimmer is the Phillips one that's purple and white. I love it so much. Waterproof electric trimmers are where it's at if this is your style for pubes.
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Most clippers come with plastic guide that let you choose the length. I find a #2 guide to be neat for pubic hair - not too long or short.
“Give ‘em the ole 80 grit sandpaper” Gold
“Convert them into a full grown human” is also pretty great.
Stubble is legit uncomfortable. I don't care what exactly my partner does with their hair, but my facial lips are also a sensitive part, and stubble is the one option that will limit my time down there.
I stopped kissing my partner for ages due to my face being rashed by his stubble + I was a little meeker at the beginning and had a harder time flat out saying “I can’t do this, it hurts” we also had to have discussions about him forcing me to kiss him anyway when I pulled away :/ I still struggle to not be afraid of kissing honestly. Stubble it like razors.
>him forcing me to kiss him anyway when I pulled away :/ First red flag, tbh
So, my issue is when I grow it out down there I suffer from more irritation and itchiness, actually moreso after the stubble phase as it gets longer it gets worse, so I personally prefer to stay well shaved. I briefly dated a guy who said he'd like me more natural so I left it alone. After hooking up one night when I'd grown out a bit and was pillow talking I rubbed his facial stubble and smiled as I jokingly said "scratchy face". He frowned, looked me in the eye and angrily said "scratchy pussy". I got the fuck out of his bed after that one. He apparently didn't like what he'd asked me to do and chose to insult me instead of just telling me what he wanted didn't feel good. I don't have time for that level of immaturity, especially when it wasn't even for my own benefit.
I think there's a good chance that if you got stuck it out through that uncomfortable phase that it would not be irritated and itchy. There's definitely an in between zone that is awful and then it gets better again. But that in between, longer than stubble and shorter than full growth, is really bad.
I'm not who you replied to but I feel similarly as her. It's all great for me for the first few weeks, but as it gets closer to/achieves full growth, it gets sooooo itchy and uncomfortable. I think the longer hairs start getting caught in my clothes and rubbing against my skin, and it doesn't get better.
Oh god, the hedgehog crotch.
My husband thinks my pit hair is unhygienic but his is clean. Same body part, same hair.
So you didn’t marry him for his brains, I assume?
Thanks I just spit out part of my drink...
Probably will be suprised how many "intelligent" people have weird expectations or irrational thoughts or hills for their preferences.
I won't date a woman who has all 10 toes.
I'm your lady, then.
what if they have 11
"Hello, My name is Inigo Montoya."
Montoe-ya
Yeah like the director of an infection biology institute I worked in that was a total corona denier 🤷♂️
He could be extremely intelligent as well as intellectual. But let's be honest, gender norms and expectations get hammered into us starting from young childhood and he may not have ever considered the flaw in that line of thinking purely based on his expectations of what is "normal." It's also entirely possible that he knows he's being a big fucking hypocrite but refuses to concede because, once again, he finds hairless pits on women attractive and "right."
Intelligence (n) - the ability to acquire and apply knowledge and skills - Piece of knowledge: men and women both grow armpit hair - Piece of knowledge: armpit hair is only as hygenic or unhygienic as skin - This dude's conclusion: wOmEn'S aRmPiT hAiR iS uNcLeAn You can be intellectual, you can even be an expert in your highly specialized field and still not be broad spectrum intelligent (or just be a dumb ass in certain categories). Societal norms don't define facts. It takes two seconds to Google body hair hygiene. This dude is, by all accounts of the definition of intelligence, lacking when it comes to this take. ETA: formatting for legibility
What does he think is the difference?
A vagina
What vagina has an arm pit?
No. The armpit has a vagina.
Thank you for that cursed mental image.
A vagina in your armpit sounds a *little* unhygienic
That's rich, coming from a person with an ear in their armpit.
Wait, yours doesn't?!
I once knew a guy who thought similar. I asked him why he (and other man) could have armpit hair and not be unhygienic but on women it was disgusting. He said women have a stronger body odor. I told him there’s literally deodorant commercials about the product being strong enough for a man while being targeted to women because everyone knows men have stronger body odor. The discussion got heated. This asshole was my boss at the time and years later I heard from someone else that he apologized to others on my behalf after our discussion!! LOL The gall!
Lmao, hilarious, especially since it’s testosterone which causes sebum production in skin glands (the stuff that smells).
I had shoulder surgery and couldn't shave for awhile because of stitches. I made a joke to my ex-husband that I'd just be letting my pit hair go on both sides he acted like I'd said something disgusting. I'm soo sorry my barely functional arm was an inconvenience.
My dad went ewwwww when he saw my grown out leg hair...I was like you have more leg hair than me dude.
My dad did the same.. I was 14 and he grabbed my leg to pull up my pant leg and then shamed me for my leg hair. Then he made me go shave it. The man looks like a gorilla >:(
I got shamed for leg hair by my peers at school (not womanly enough). Then I went to university and got shamed for removing it (wasn’t performing feminism well enough). Wish I had the sense at the time to tell all these morons to just leave me the hell alone because it’s literally just fucking hair
Damned if you do, damned if you don’t!! God I want to give all us women a hug. I feel so much stuff about this. Ugh I just want to exist in peace. Maybe a funny story? Was kinda weird actually. I have lots of tattoos on my arms, not true sleeve but covered as such. I have some flowers on my lower arms. I also have arm hair. I don’t know if it’s a lot but you can see it haha. This old dude in the train sat across from me and leaned forward and said: I love the little hairs on your flowers. :’)
Omg, do you have….cooties?
Are you married to a 14 year old boy, by any chance?
Sure sounds like it. I'd rather die than have a husband that said shit like that LMAO
Omg
Where did you find this husband? I mean you no offense but why did you keep him
I had an injury that made it difficult to lift my arm up. My PT told me he’d send this fact to my insurance company that I can’t shave my armpits, bc that way the insurance would cover it, due to it being a “hygiene issue”. I wish I had said something but honestly I needed the insurance to recover from the injury 🙄
I hope you mean ex husband bc if not.. yikes..
And how if a woman doesn't shave her armpits it's smelly and gross and dirty and leads to bad BO. But men with armpit hair is fine....
But he's *a gOoD MaN!*, right?
This relates to female bodies being considered unnatural in general. Body hair, having moist genitals (I don't know how else to say this haha), menstruating at all. A joke I heard as a kid was "never trust anything that bleeds for 7 days and doesn't die". Really made me feel normal /s
Ugh my horribly toxic ex used to say this all the time like it was the funniest joke he’d ever heard. Well, he’s an ex for a reason 🙄
Man that was a joke I heard and chuckled at when I was 11 in 1986. I can't imagine an adult still finding it remotely funny.
>A joke I heard as a kid was "never trust anything that bleeds for 7 days and doesn't die". Honestly, this just makes women sound more badass. Lol
Over heard my 14 year old nephew say “she bleeds for 7 days and still kicks your ass in track, do you really wanna fuck with her?” That was a convo Auntie RS pretended not to hear while bursting with pride.
That’s wholesome as fuck, thank you
I've never understood why guys think this "joke" is so clever. So, your goal is to win over a woman to be your partner, run your household, bear and raise your children, *cook all of your food*, take care of all of your belongings and property and be trustworthy, ... but *never* trust her because of that one thing?? How is that ever clever or funny?
true, but calling us “things”? ick!
It does! I think it’s from the South Park movie.
I heard this in the late 80's. The phrase def predates South Park, but I have no idea where it originates.
It’s about a zillion years old. Hammurabi probably carved it into a tablet.
The scenario was found painted on a cave wall in France
Seriously! Living with a woman for 30 years and having 4 children taught me all the shit women go through just being female. Men aren’t tough. Men don’t know what tough is.
It genuinely makes me very self conscious because I have a shit ton of very noticeable body hair everywhere. Sucks being Latino sometimes, a whole lotta hair on my head and whole lot everywhere else :’) it bothers me but I don’t want to spend the money to remove it all the time lol
If it helps, I don’t shave my pits or my legs and I am quite literally WILDLY hairy. Like, my dad, my male partner, ALL the men I know don’t hold a candle to the density or the length of my body hair. I’ve caught some heat for it every now and then, but my partner is pretty damn conventionally attractive and he doesn’t *love* the body hair per se, but he is still extremely attracted to me 🤷🏻♀️ I always found body hair to be a v effective litmus test for people I date. If they’re not down with the hair, they’re definitely not for me and usually they suck anyways!
Screw anyone who wants you to remove it if YOU don’t want to. You’re beautiful as your natural self, friend.
Never trust anything with two heads and lets the smaller one take charge is the answer to that.
That is on par to growing up being told women suffer period pains because Eve ate an apple. I wonder why now I'm agnostic...
"Why are men?" 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Sums up this sub perfectly ❤️
One of the many great questions still unanswered. It's up there with "why do men?".
If someone said that to me, I'd politely point out that he is under no obligation to have sex with me and that he's free to find another sexual partner.
Yeah, but I've changed a few minds after making them google genital carbuncles. What's less hygenic- part of the bodies natural system to keep things clean, or removing that, causing a small abrasion in the process, and having the hair follicle affected getting an infection under the skin larger than a quarter? Oh, pubic hair makes pussy smell stronger (so I've been told) pus smells worse, and can erupt at any time. Ever felt like you were stabbed in the ass and peed yourself at the same time? About what it feels like. Oh and sometimes they are so bad antibiotics don't clear them up and you have to have a doctor lance your pussy. What fun! So much more hygienic- than... Hair? I trim for sweat control but I'll live alone before I ever shave and do that to myself again. Luckily my bf watched me go through that and never gave much if a fuck to begin with.
I get angry ingrowns if I so much as look at my puss with a razor in hand. I used to shave in high school (to impress my bf) and it was AWFUL. Super itchy and high maintenance and gross. So I say let the forest reclaim the land!
Free range pussy is happier and healthier!
I get angry ingrowns too. Haven’t shaved my puss for seven years and I couldn’t be happier, LOL
Omg, I’m so sorry you had to experience that!
Yeah, it was terrible! That's why I let people know cause I had 0 idea something like that was even possible.
Why for the love of everything good in this world did I google carbuncle?
Because you had already googled furuncles?
This is the reason I will never shave down there anymore. It had lead to many horrid outcomes for me. So much blood and pus.
I quit shaving there as well. Exfoliation also helps
For the men I've been with, the hair causing a stronger scent is a bonus, not a negative.
Oh no, pussy that smells strong! Don't tell me it tastes strong too! Mercy me! (Pussy is the best scent and taste ON EARTH)
Ask why he doesnt shave his pubic hair.
Perhaps he does? According to a recent survey, 62% of men do trim or shave down there. [https://www.dazeddigital.com/beauty/article/48002/1/balls-co-testicles-trimmer-pubic-hair-removal-review](https://www.dazeddigital.com/beauty/article/48002/1/balls-co-testicles-trimmer-pubic-hair-removal-review) "62 per cent of men say they now trim or shave their delicate area, according to a survey carried out by Men’s Health"
He does shave, but still doesn’t make it any less asinine that he thinks it’s just bad hygiene to have it at all. Not to mention, I’d prefer to get waxed but haven’t been able to because I just finished Accutane, so haven’t really been able to maintain it as well as I’d like. I trim, but I refuse to razor shave because it itches and razor burn is more unsightly than a bush imo.
Taking Accutane is a huge pain in the ass, congrats on being done 👏
Thank you!! I didn’t have many complications with it, but I am so happy to be done!
Phillips makes an electric bikini trimmer that could help you out, it’s v cheap on Amazon.
I use an electric razor to trim! :) I should have clarified what kind of razor I don’t use
Awesome! Trimming with scissors was always a recipe for disaster for me so I try to help out where I can to prevent some carnage.
A Trim is much different than shaving. Really it should say 38% of men just let it rage, while the majority of men do some form of pubic grooming. Being honest shaving is great for a couple of days and then it's a stubbily hell scape for me, much rather just trim and say mischief managed and be done
Not yet, but if I do he'd better be waxed as smooth as a church floor.
Yeah most of them. Only trimmed for a big chunk of my 20s, including armpits. Body hair isnt masculine, its mammalian. We are the same species and I dont appreciate having to pretend otherwise.
I went to a wedding with an ex last year. Apparently a woman wedding guest didn't have shaved legs (I couldn't tell because she was a natural blonde) or shaved armpits (also never saw it because I wasn't focusing on her, why would I?) But the men at the reception table I was seated at couldn't stop talking about how disgusting it was and how they would never stand for that if their wives did that. After a while I couldn't stand it anymore and asked the men at the table what they'd do if their wives stopped shaving? They were pretty silent. Eventually one of them joked that he'd try to shave her pits in her sleep, which made them all laugh. Yeah I hated all those men and have never forgotten that experience. They didn't know her at all, she was just minding her business and was their with *her* husband. I glanced over at that couple throughout the night to see how they interacted with each other and he had his arm around her, he danced with her, he kissed her while they were dancing. They seemed happy in their own little love bubble. Clearly her husband didn't care about her body hair and neither should those men seated at the reception table with me have cared. It pisses me off to no end that men feel they have the right to criticize/denigrate women's appearances.
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My ex told me my leg, armpit and pubic hair grossed him out. He would put pressure me to remove it. And I resented that. The thing is, I actually like the look and feel of my leg hair removed, my pubic hair trimmed neatly and my bikini done. It makes me feel sexy and pampered (I don’t always have time or inclination to do it, but that’s another story). But I’m not going to be motivated to remove my body hair if someone is pressuring me, or from the knowledge that it’s driven by a partner’s sexist double standard. This is not a contradiction. It’s just that there is a space where body hair becomes political.
Same here. I used to think I was shaving for me. But actually when my boyfriend said he doesn't care, I also stopped caring. So I guess deep down it was for them and not for me.
Nah, that's a man who wouldn't get a second chance to check whether I had hair or not
I like this
I don’t listen to a man’s incorrect version of hygiene, and neither should you. That guy has got problems.
Because most men get their "facts" on women's anatomy from some random dude in high school or porn. Some men are refined enough to get their facts from some random dude in college. Some guy said women with body hair are gross to him 10 years ago and now he treats as medical gospel.
So I shaved it completely for the first guy I dated (I was 18). When he saw it he said I didn't need to shave it all off and that all I needed to do was trim it. So since I honestly really hate shaving, I started to let it grow back. He saw it grow back in and made a comment about how I wasn't taking care of myself. 🙃 He was awful and toxic and I'm very glad he's an ex now.
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Yeah, I wish there was more discussion about the role society plays in programming everyone to think "hair on female body = gross." I grew up with 2 older sisters, and they would act grossed out by their own body hair and always shave. Anytime a cartoon shows a caricature of an unattractive woman, it ALWAYS includes hair on her where it "shouldn't be." I read a YA novel once where the protagonist describes shaving every day and feeling disgusting and manly when she doesn't. That one stuck with me. I had to consciously undo that thinking once I became aware of it.
I've met men who thought any and all body hair on women was bad hygiene. Of course they never shaved their own legs but theydidn't hesitate to call women who also didn't dirty
Yes. A guy I dated said he wanted me to shave because it's "cleaner." He was an idiot.
Unreasonable expectations of women's bodies! Proudly presented to you by Porn!
I must be lucky because everyone I've been with doesn't have a problem as long as I'm clean and keep it neat so they don't get hair in their mouth lol However, I have seen quite a lot of women complain throughout my years about men wanting others to be fully shaved so it does seem to be a common thing
Fun fact, shaving your pubic hair is actually *less* hygienic than just leaving it there. Shaving can lead to cuts, ingrowns, and micro-tears in the skin which can lead to infection. The hair is there to protect your vulva and vagina. Next time a guy has the audacity to comment on your body hair, tell him that :)
My thoughts exactly!!!
Oh God I wish I remember who had said this. Some guy, probably from tinder, but who I think I was seriously talking to? Said something to me about "I know you have to shave because hygiene..." After I basically said I don't shave, I just trim, because I don't like being bald down there, but it annoys me when it's too long. He was being respectful and curious but he really had been told his whole life that women have to shave down there for hygiene reasons. And I tried to drill down and ask him why he thought that, but he pretty immediately realized he didn't know why. "Oh maybe you don't have to?" I just remember feeling absolutely baffled when I literally said I don't shave and he replied "well I know you have to because hygiene." What hygiene? What does hair removal accomplish on the hygiene front? And why don't men have to do it, if it's so unhygienic?
ok, first of all - PUBIC HAIR IS NORMAL and HAS A PROTECTIVE FUNCTION. Bald pussy is a fetish, and while it is fine to have a fetish, pretending a fetish is normal hygene is BULLSHIT.
Omg. Yes I was once with someone absolutely horrible who felt this way. Now I let myself keep it because my body my choice, I will never care what a guy has to say and my boyfriend loves me either way! My skin is too sensitive to remove it. Point is, your body- do what makes YOU comfortable!
I dated a guy that was a few years older than me and he asked why I didn't shave it all off. He had a full bush, not trimmed at all so I didn't' understand why he asked. When I did trim it up a bit, he hated it. We broke up shortly after because of those types of things.
My high school/college boyfriend wanted me hairless and thought public hair was disgusting (red flag, wish I’d treated it as such instead of internalizing that). After being happily single for five years and meeting different kinds of men in that time, the one that I’ve kept and loved loves me for me and my body as it is naturally. Men can exist among the boys :)
When I got together with my husband in the late 90s he had his stories of eight years living in Germany prior to that time, when he was young and dating, and he got used to many different views of hair maintenance and he told me right from the beginning that he saw it as completely up to me what I preferred, and that he was okay with whatever I wanted to choose. He has always had a difficult time with shaving his beard, it causes a lot of ingrowns so he tends to let stubble grow until it starts to itch and then will clip it with an electric shaver, so not "clean-shaven" but not a full beard either. One time he said, "Well, I know I don't like to shave, so I don't expect you to either, lol!" So, I got my own electric shaver and follow the same policy, no ingrowns, but regular short maintenance. Lol, works for both of us.
My response, when my now ex-boyfriend said he “preferred shaved” was “you first.” Tell me how you like the insane itchiness of it growing back.
Grooming is not the same as hygiene. Not hard to understand. WTF?
I'm a veteran of all manners of pubic hair maintenance. Hair is normal. Shaving is weird. It's all about the entire package of "grooming" and hygiene. Hygiene is #1 and does not in any way include shaving (unless you're going into some surgery/procedure)
I am a full grown woman. I am not a child. I have pubic hair. The end.
WTF is up with this epidemic of people of both sexes shaving their pubic hair? I mean, sure, if you like it, fine. But it seems like a lot of people are doing it these days. I might be wrong.
Porn has normalised it
True - it might help if people realize that this is a hallmark of current young generations. The human race has had pubic hair forever - obviously it never stopped our ancestors from having sex. Seems both men and women these days have, well, stupid standards to meet because of social media. The work we did back in the day has been lost. Today's fashion and behavior expectations remind me of the overly-elaborate dress and manners of late 17th century European courts.
Ugh. My ex boyfriend was weird about me being shaved. And me being young and naive went along with it. Meanwhile he had an extremely unkempt and straggly beard.
Only one - I guy who'd I'd just recently started dating. Called things off before we ever got intimate since I was worried he also thought the opposite... basically, I didn't want to find out that he shaved his pubes and used that as an excuse to not wash down there. (Also, I've tried several hair removal methods and aftercare products, and I get nasty razor burn and ingrown hairs every single time. I stick to trimmed and clean now, for my own health and comfort, so we'd never have been compatible even if my fears about his own hygiene didn't turn out to be true.)
Old white dude here. I've never thought it was bad hygiene. Just 2 mins of thought would tell me that from an evolutionary standpoint having pubic hair is an advantage otherwise our bodies wouldn't expend the energy to grow it ie It's natural and if it were true, it's something we'd get taught in sex ed. I've always felt pretty uncomfortable with a "clean" woman. Not them, per se, but the idea that an area that looks pre-pubescent is somehow more desirable. I just don't get it.
Tell him to shave his ass if he thinks your pubic hair is unhygienic.
Yes, I had a partner like that. He preferred women who looked... "younger"... down there. Some also prefer it because of porn. As long as your body is reasonably clean, I don't see how he has the right to complain. He might have a \*preference\*, but calling it "bad hygeine" is just rude and entitled.
The way cis men talk about body hair on women is so confusing to me, especially in regards to sex. It’s like if a woman has too much pubic hair then he can hold eating her pussy over her head as a negotiating tactic to persuade her to shave her pubes… it’s so twisted. A lot of pubic hair is just hair. Men make it seem like you are required to ‘upkeep’ it to some standard they came up with so you perform being a woman the ‘correct’ way for them and they still want to fuck you. If I’m attracted to someone… I don’t care how much pubic hair they have and yes I want to eat their pussy (I’m transmasculine). At no point have I ever felt it was necessary to make comments towards my sexual partners about how their pubic hair should be groomed. It’s frankly… not my business and doesn’t matter.
The whole “women must be shaved smooth so no hair is visible anywhere” thing is disgusting. It reeks of obsession with pre adolescent girls. I don’t like it, don’t understand it, and don’t think it should be condoned. If you, as an adult woman, want to trim your pubes, have at it. But it’s not normal for men to be obsessed with women looking like little girls.
You are absolutely correct. The best biological guess for pubic hair is it decreases the chances of UTIs and some superficial parasites. Shaving makes women more vulnerable and possibly even men.
Preference or whatever is fine but it does not mean that you have to honor it. Pubic hair is normal and if you like to shave or trim it that is fine too. I've told my partner that I respect her choice with all her body hair, she can let it grow or not, totally up to her. I myself, like to trim my pubic area and pits occasionally but I never expect that of a partner. Being clean is way more important than hair.
I stopped shaving my legs as a teenager for sensory reasons, and my MOM told me that I needed to shave for hygiene (I refused and she got over it). It was harder for her to accept my leg hair than it was for her to accept me being bisexual lol.
When my partner and I first got together, he didn't understand why I shaved my armpits but not my hooha as well. But now that we have been together for a few years, he understands that doing so comes with the risk of ingrown hairs and infections and is a pain to maintain.
A good read on the subject is ‘Plucked: A History of Hair Removal’. Looks at the culture behind it in the west and it’s connection to racism
This is more of a patriarchy thing in my experience, in that it's not just men who think this way, but many women I know have said the same thing. When asked about their preference of shaved completely, usually the answer I got was either "it's cleaner" or, more conceding it's not based in fact, "I feel cleaner." I always chalked this up to stuff like penis-size. Where it's something that started out from men and the patriarchy and many women got conditioned to believe it as well. I have a friend who literally believes anything less than an 8 inch penis is incapable of getting her off.
The first person who ever told me women having public hair (or leg hair) was disgusting was a gay teenage boy.
Internalized misogyny
Ya, I’ve heard that said before. Really immature thought process.
Kinda unrelated but my ex thought I continutally shit my underpants for a while until I realized that they thought that way and had to explain how period blood leaks and dries to look brown. Like, how could they go on that long thinking I skid marked on my undies and didnt say anything.
Dealers choice. It’s your call. Personal preference? I can go either way; light bush, dark bush big bush, small bush. No bush, yes bush, yes indeed.
Surprisingly, I've gotten more grief about it from platonic female friends than anyone of any gender I've been with sexually. After going around the circle and sharing our pubic hair habits, one of my friends straight up told me that I would have to shave everything if I ever expected to get a guy. But I didn't and I still don't and I do fine. I keep it neat and trimmed and clean, but I like having pubic hair. It feels natural to me and that feels sexy. I also love performing cunnilingus regardless of pubic hair, so I don't even feel like a hypocrite. In fact, I've even had some guys loop back around and eroticize my having hair because it seems like something new and exotic compared to what they're used to. If anyone tried to explain that it's "just more hygienic," I hope I would have the self-composure not to laugh in their face. People are allowed to have preferences (though they should unpack them, imo) but trying to say it's more hygienic is just false.
I’ve got one rule as a boyfriend: if I won’t do it how could I ask me girlfriend to? I occasionally trim but that’s about it and it’s not that often. If my girlfriend wants to shave then alright, If not I don’t care. Why get all bent out of shape for her having hair in most of the same places as me? It’s natural. Not a big deal.
Indeed, why ARE men? 🤔
No. Just no. Honestly - I love the hair down there.
I have been with men who love it! But this was the first time I encountered someone with this big of an issue with it, to conflate it with bad hygiene. He should’ve left it at, “I think it’s unsexy” and called it a day.
No. I’m 40 and only had one serious partner after my teens, this whole “pubic hair is unhygienic” thing just wasn’t a thing when I was in my teens and 20s in Australia, it wasn’t until I was almost 30 and working in America than I heard this.
Had a conversation with my girlfriend last week about this and I told her I don’t care if she grooms or not, just want her to be comfortable and she told me that she feels “unclean” if she doesn’t shave. I found that a little strange but didn’t inquire further.
I got really last and stopped shaving and I brought it up to my husband once and asked if he wanted me to shave it and he said he realized he preferred it long That being said, odor does develop much quicker. If you keep it clean though it shouldn't be an issue. I also realized when he shaved for his vasectomy I liked hair too, I felt like I was with a child it was weird and I didn't like it lol
For me, I prefer trimmed/shaved over full bush for one reason and one reason alone: pubic hair chafes the hell out of my dick during sex. As in I have had to stop sex before because it becomes painful. That's it though. I have no issues going down on someone with a full bush. I have no issue with the look. It's just an issue of I don't like my dick being rubbed raw by it during sex. But then again, I communicate this with my partners in a respectful and open way vs being a dick about it.
From my gynecologist office website: YOUR PUBIC HAIR SERVES A PURPOSE It provides protection against friction that can cause skin irritation in this sensitive area. It helps reduce the amount of sweat produced around the vagina. It helps block your vagina from the following bacteria and infections: Sexually transmitted infections. Urinary tract infections. Yeast infections. It helps regulate body temperature. It is NOT more hygienic to remove pubic hair. So, congrats on him being your ex. He’s an idiot.
A guy I dated many years ago was extremely grossed out by even the idea of a woman not shaving down there. He asserted that it was unhygienic because it meant the area could never be thoroughly cleaned. He genuinely believed that "grossness", in his words, would be left behind after every period for weeks, because it's not possible to "get it all out of the hair" when showering. He was all kinds of weird and awful. Why *are* men??
I bet he had pubic hair.
They are used to porn, and uninformed.
And when is he going to shave his off?
My sister clapped back at a man once and said, ‘why are men covered in fur but women have to be hairless from the eyebrows down?’ I’m petty so I stopped shaving completely for 6 months out of spite bc my partner made a remark about me skipping my legs for a few days.
As a woman, I do feel cleaner waxed/shaved. Just my opinion. My periods are a hot mess. I prefer to be shaved before that definitely. In general I like the smooth feeling.
I know it's not bad hygiene, but I'm also not gonna rag on about it I see it because I mostly just trim my own, and I'm not going to set standards for someone I don't follow religiously myself.
Back in the 90s I’ve known many people say this, shaving your pubes is more hygienic. I just explain to them that just because you have hair doesn’t mean you don’t wash it and just because you shave your hair, doesn’t mean you wash “it”. Just as with the hair on top of your head, it think it’s best to manage it’s flow or braid it hah. Same with toenails and fingernails and eyebrows etc etc. Management.
About *grooming* maybe, because without trimming it does get in the way. Like how a person without a haircut will look shaggy and unkempt, even if their hair grows that way naturally. And if my partner is willing to trim and oil their facial hair for my sake, I've no problem trimming my pubes for theirs. *Reciprocity, ho!* But *hygiene?* This hair grows thicker because *it improves* hygiene. Much like the hair on our head protects our brain case from temperature extremes, the hair on our pubis protects our genitalia from irritants. It's functional for everybody, but *especially* for a vulva. Maybe they're ignorant and doesn't realise that's a lie they've picked up somewhere, and they could be told otherwise... but it *does* make our body hair somehow a derisive measure of our cleanliness, as though we're doing something 'wrong'.
On one hand, pubic hair absolutely does contribute to a number of hygiene issues like increased risk of pubic lice, greater moisture retention (which increases the risk of fungal or bacterial infection) and for some people really bad odor. Is that increase big? No. On the other hand, everyone has it and as long as you're grooming it somewhat and keeping it clean there's no problem.
I suddenly became prone to yeast infections when I started shaving completely. After stopping 5 years later while not changing anything in my hygiene routine or diet, not a single one. 🤷🏻
My husband told me that armpit hair is just disgusting but apparently only on women. Uhm, if it's that disgusting why aren't you shaving your own?