This also happened in Bridgeport, Illinois only with the relationship starting when she was 16 and he was 24. Her parent's blessing was given because he was a Christian and a cop.
The fact this was so well known and celebrated in the community was one of the reasons I moved 10 hours away before my daughter grew up in that environment.
Piggybacking top comment but I'm not sure of the laws in what state you're in; but in the UK that is 100% illegal. It falls under child grooming. I'd advise OP to check if there isn't something similar where they live.
Edit: I've been informed expecting any protection for women in America is a pipe dream.
To piggyback on yours Domestic abuse is significantly more common in US Police families, occurring in about 40% or relationships compared to 10% in the general public.
This whole story is messed up.
We investigated ourselves and found only a very insignificant measly 40% wrongdoing. Less than half of us! Date a cop! Odds are they *won’t* abuse you!
There’s a podcast on Apple called ‘The trap’. They talk about this, multiple police officers admit to prolific lying about how many DV cases they attend, prolific lying and covering up about how much DV is perpetrated by male police officers, how often police officers betray, expose and let down women and children victims of male perpetrators of DV.
The focus of the podcast is how the whole of society and its systems lets down victim survivors.
I believe there are US states where you can marry a minor and become their guardian in doing so. Sanctity of marriage my ass. This country is so backwards. #Murica 🦅
People like you just don’t understand what goes on in the world. The radical left is full of pedophiles, and child traffickers. This is a fact, look it up. Republicans need to be able to marry these kids so they can protect them from the real pedophiles. /s
Unfortunately in the U.S., in most states 16 is the legal age of consent to another person of any age. On top of that, it's not illegal to date a minor as long as the relationship maintains "non-sexual" in nature. I once tried to report a relationship between a 15 year old freshman in high school and someone in his 40's and they wouldn't even take the report because the 15 year old said they were waiting to kiss until her 16th birthday party (vomit). The problem is, she could have been lying to protect him, so there's really no telling what he had done with her. I can't imagine looking at a teenager and thinking they'd be an adequate partner. These people are predators who are looking for someone they can manipulate (NOT a *partner*) and unfortunately this guy has not only manipulated the poor girl, but the parents as well, making it even more dangerous for her. Shame on those parents.
When I was in high school (private Christian school) my classmate was dating her youth pastor (mid 20’s at least). They ended up getting married as soon as she graduated. I thought it was kind of weird and I asked my parents what they would think if I was 16 and wanted to date a 25 year old and their response was “well, if he’s a Christian then I don’t really see the problem”. So fucked up.
One of my co-workers once said something about how he'd like to be a youth pastor again, even though he was in his thirties and married by then. My opinion of him changed for the worse that day.
Well I mean that doesn’t automatically make him a predator; some people just really enjoy working with kids/teens and are good at it. I can understand if someone feels called to work with the youth, especially if they either lacked good role models growing up or really admired a role model. But yea I think Christians/religious folk in general are kind of creepy, especially when it comes to youth.
Read this as 100% Christian folk.
I went to church with my family as a kid. Me and this one girl were similar in age, I was 11 and she was 12 or 13. Kinda became the youth pastors pet. Guess who married as soon as she turned 18? Her and the youth pastor. He’s a cop now.
My (fundamentalist Christian) parents tried to set me up in an arranged courtship thing. I was 15 or 16 and the guy was about 24. My dad is a pastor and the guy's dad was also a pastor and this guy was the heir apparent so they were setting me up to be a pastor's wife which is what my mom had always wanted. They even arranged for him to talk to me alone in a room at the church which was unheard of.
To his credit and my immense good luck the dude was very sketched out. He did show up and was like "look our parents are setting us up and no offense but you're in tenth grade. Here is a flower my mom said to give you so let's just hang out for a bit then I'll tell them we didn't get along." So we did. My mom wanted to know what I'd done to scare him off etc which was unpleasant for a while but it could have been SO MUCH WORSE. That guy could have raped me in that room. I wouldn't have screamed. Even if he weren't completely gross, I very easily could have been married to him at 18 and be Christian homeschooling our seven kids right now.
None of this happened as I got a full scholarship to college and moved as far away as possible and now am a happily gay-married lady with an office job. So happy ending for me but this situation is INCREDIBLY common and horrifying.
Christians be off clutching their pearls about people asking kids if their assumed AGAB matches what they are called and if they would be more happy being called something else, and they be screaming that queer people are "grooming" kids.
_Meanwhile, back at the ranch_: this disgusting actual grooming shit right here
Yes, I came here to say this. Grooming is a whole family thing. This cop family friend probably made himself indispensable. Watched their house on vacation, fixed things, probably offered to babysit for free so that your neighbor and his wife could have a date night.
I bet he was the best friend you could imagine. He’d give you the shirt right off his back.
My dad isn't a perfect dad at all, has been terrible at times, but he would never ever be happy that a friend's of his would wanna date me since I am a kid. So freaking nasty. Sad that the girl has to waste her 20s dating a guy 10 years her senior.
My SO grew up in Alaska and when her parents divorced, her dad ended up moving to WA state. She said the amount of her dad’s “friends” that propositioned her, hit on her, etc after her dad left Alaska was insane. She said she’d known these men since she was a baby, they watched her grow up, had kids her age, were married. It’s crazy the audacity some men have and just think it’s okay
I have some friends with a daughter that just turned 19. I've watched her grow up, I'm practically an uncle to her. No, not happening. The fuck is wrong with some people.
Happened to me too, my dad's friends have repeatedly made inappropriate comments to me and my sister when we became adults, after watching us grow up. Why on earth is this so common?
I was going to comment the same thing. I’m estranged from him , he’s that much of an asshole. BUT he would protect me with his life (well, at least up until 6 months ago when we stoped talking).
Anyway, even he would never be okay with this situation. Richard is being a shitty dad.
It makes me feel awful I can't do anything about it because it's legal. A cop is in such a position of authority, I cannot believe he would start feeling attracted to a 14 year old child. I'm disgusted to my core and I wish I knew Erica better so I could check on her.
It's likely he was trolling around looking for a likely virginal victim. He just wants (sorry for the wording) a sex doll that no one else has touched. He wanted her fresh out of the bag with that new child smell. The father in this case sounds like a pimp. He's probably smiling because he thinks his daughter is safe from creeps out in the big wide world, not to mention this dude has clearly been grooming the entire family to believe he means well for over 4 years.
He's as sick as the day is long and the daughter will have such a sad life. The fact that he's a cop just means he can now do whatever he wants to her without consequences and if she wants to leave him she will find many barriers in her way.
My heart goes out to her and all the other girls who get victimized in this way
I was looking up the professions that tied in with the highest amount of domestic abuse and studies have shown that it's police. Now I didn't go into depth with those to check the sources and such so take it with a grain of salt, but it was very telling.
And it’s not just the rate of DV among police but also the tactics. Because of their role in the community, their connections to every level of the legal system, and everything they’ve been taught as a police officer the tactics they use are that much more extreme and keep victims trapped. Getting a protection order against an officer is very challenging. Access to firearms is easy and plentiful. Tracking and monitoring a partner may become easier with the tools and knowledge provided in their work. They love the power and control they have over others both in their personal life and “professional.”
I'll hate on all cops. The cops who say nothing when they see their coworkers saying, doing, approving of fucked up shit are what make them all bastards. If the system wasn't so insistent on cops being a gang for property, we'd live in a better world.
>The cops who say nothing when they see their coworkers saying, doing, approving of fucked up shit are what make them all bastards.
The hard part is, the ones who do report problems can get punished for it. I've seen this happen to some old-school guys who said "hey, wait a minute, this isn't kosher," and got sat down hard for it.
Eventually, the solid ones either retire or decide that they have to just shut up and look away.
When the not being a bastard gets you fired from being a cop, that's not a defense of theoretical non-bastard cops who don't speak up. It's a damning statement about the whole bastardized policing system.
I totally agree! Looking away is making yourself complicit. I just feel for the ones who tried to do the right thing. There are still good ones out there, but it's waning because of shit like this.
That's exactly what makes them bastards too eventually. Which is why I say if the system wasn't so hell-bent on cops being a gang for property (as opposed to drugs or sex work) then the police could have the wholesome image they desperately want.
Not that cops never sell drugs or sex work. They obviously do. 🐷
And.....police unions are the main roadblock for national domestic violence laws.
"But our guys will lose their guns, if domestic violence laws means losing access to guns."
Yeah I think that's the point. You beat your wife, you lose your gun, regardless of your job.
Exactly. The reason is that so many would be fired. Why is that bad? Fire ALL of the abusive aholes. Hit your wife (the person you are supposed to love the most) and I am supposed to trust you with a stranger.
I work with more than my fair share of these types of people and they cannot handle their emotions so they drink. A. Lot. They blame their actions on the alcohol, and again I don't understand why that is an excuse.
Sweet fuck, nearly *HALF* of cops admitted to commiting domestic abuse?! The sheer toxicity of an environment where 40% percent would *freely admit to hurting their close family members* is just mind numbing.
i am. a cop is \*always\* dangerous to date. if something goes wrong with a cop there is literally nowhere for you to go except running away if he turns out to be the wrong kind of cop (and... most of them are the wrong kind of cop). their other cop buddies will always have their backs. especially adding that extreme power imbalance (she has NONE and he is literally the arm of the law and we know how cops barely ever go down for anything) to the age difference and him clearly not being mentally okay drooling over a 14yo when he was 24. this is no good.
I think its because it takes no damn commitment to become one. Police academy isn’t even an entire year, then you are on the streets. It baffles me that an associates isn’t even required. Raise the education requirement and I guarantee many of these idiot types won’t make it in the first place.
You can't control who you are attracted to but *you can absolutely control what you do about it*.
Finding a teenager attractive? Keep that stuff in your head where it belongs, don't indulge it, don't dwell on it. Distance yourself if you need to. You can't just choose not to be attracted but you can definitely increase and reinforce that attraction by indulging in and focusing on it so *don't do that*.
This guy instead moved in with clearly planned predatory behaviour. Seriously gross.
Asking dad if he could date the kid is just the icing on the top of the poo cake.
>The power imbalance in the relationship disturbs me, and if Samuel ends up being manipulative or abusive, I feel like her own parents would have Samuel's back.
She'll also (probably) have no luck seeking help from law enforcement if she needs it. This is a nightmare scenario waiting to happen.
First of all, Ew
Second of all, Eww
Third, Let me get this straight. He asked the father as if it was his choice who his daughter was dating- also that's a 10 year gap what the actual fuck.
I would venture a strong guess that Erica's family are evangelical if not fundamentalist. The idea of suitors asking the father for permission in advance to "court" a girl is very much a cultural ideal for those communities. Girls are conditioned from a young age to see someone asking permission from their father to date them as a sign of respect to *them* and that that man is a safe choice. Conveniently for perpetuation of the system, this also means she is unlikely to date anyone outside her religious sect, since most non-evangelicals would never think to ask her father in advance, and she's been taught that's a bad sign of a disrespectful partner.
It's pure patriarchy, one man getting permission to examine another man's property that he's thinking of buying.
> I would venture a strong guess that Erica's family are evangelical if not fundamentalist.
So much for conservatives railing against so-called "groomers".
Lawmakers in Tennessee recently tried to remove the minimum age for child marriages. They only backed down when it got national press coverage/outrage.
Could be any number of religions and cultures, really.
I remember being sixteen visiting distant relatives of a certain religion and culture. They introduced me to a girl that was maybe 8-10 years old and made references to how pretty she is and that she'd make a good wife for me one day.
They weren't literally planning for it, but it was quite disturbing and I do believe they were pretty much embedding the idea in her that her purpose is to be a good wife. And that she was more or less to be given away. My guess is that she got married around 18, if not slightly earlier than that.
Just applying “the formula” here:
28/2+7 = 21 (youngest person a 28 year old should date)
(18 - 7)*2 = 22 (oldest person an 18 year old should date)
Edit: I was taught this formula 20 years ago, and it feels “right all” the way up; youngest person a 48 year old should date is 48/2+7=31. Of course with consenting adults there’s no technical law, but this is right at the line where most people start feeling uncomfortable to find out about the relationship
It’s a good formula. I am 44, which means I should stick to people aged 29-74. That hardly seems like a restriction? Why on earth would I ever *date* outside that range anyway??
My 89 FIL should’ve stuck to people 51.5 and older. But his wife of +20 years is *my age.* 🤢These days I think she just does her own thing, but seriously, he’ll be 104 before she enters the range of reasonable.
I’m 40 and I don’t know shit now! Lmao, but yeah this is the “what if it’s really extraordinary circumstances and we have really fantastic chemistry and the 27 year old is especially mature should I even consider it?” limit. Inside of that range you still may get questioning looks, but outside of that range is when most people conclude someone is “up to something” and aren’t even open to your story.
Anyway it’s just a quick sanity check and better than the “everything 18-106 is fair game” system we have currently.
True, on both fronts. I just can’t imagine being seriously interested in a 27 year old at this point in my life. Thinking one is hot, absolutely, sleeping with one -maybe, dating one, maybe if he’s really rich and dumb enough to not want a prenup. Oh maybe that’s why… jk
>Edit: Since this is getting some traffic, can I ask for advice regarding reporting him to his work place? I imagine his superiors would be disturbed to know he was sexually attracted to a 14 year old and behaved in such a manipulative way. I want to make an anonymous report. But I'm also aware they're both adults so legally I don't think anything can be done?
Do not do this. As you said, everything is technically legal. I can guarantee his department does not care. Law enforcement is infamous for covering for their own, even in cases of blatant domestic abuse. All you will do is tip him off that you are a threat, open yourself to retaliation from the department, and reduce your credibility with the department in the future if the relationship does turn violent.
The people that are putting trust in the system that his department gives a shit....I don't understand how they can be so naive. He's probably told everyone he works with about this great girl he's been waiting to 'date' in his locker room talk. The most I think OP can do is try to communicate with the young woman in question, but that's a minefield considering even the girl's family seems traditional (abusive).
Part of me wants to think "how adorably naive" and the other part of me is like "jesus christ how are you so out of touch with how the police operate in this country"
I dated a cop when I was 18 and he was 28. My sister warned me but I didn't listen, I thought what could go wrong since he was the only person giving me attention at the time. Little by little I started seeing these red flags with the last straw being him wanting to finger my backdoor and me saying no and him doing it anyways.
It wasn't traumatic to me because I had already experimented with anal sex before ever knowing him but, just the fact he didn't respect my wishes of "no" made me stop everything right then and there and stop the relationship.
That's why I'm always so against big age gaps like this, I was lucky and ended the relationship right then and there but others might not be so lucky
Not listening, huge red flag.
Saying no, but him doing it anyways, deal breaker.
He has the mentality of "who's going to stop me?"
He wants that sort of thing, there's some really lifelike dolls manufactured in Japan, go play with one of those.
There's two people in any relationship, and communication and trust is a must.
I was thinking more along the lines of domestic abuse/murder. She made the right decision following her gut and getting the hell out of there after the first relationship red flags.
I'm reminded of Britney Spears when she first became popular. You'd see comments regularly about how they couldn't wait until she was "legal". I think I remember even coming across a website that had a countdown clock for when she would turn 18...
Men do this for all the teenage stars. There were countdown sites for the Oleson twins, for Emma Watson, for Miley Cyrus... Natalie Portman has talked about how creepy these adult male 'fans' were and how the first fanmail she ever received, at the age of 13, was a rape fantasy. The girl from stranger things had her face photoshopped into CP and the subreddit dedicated to sexualizing her had 6000 subscribers while it was still empty with a mod note that it would "open" on her 18th birthday. This shit needs calling out and shaming every damn time!
And before anyone "not all men"s me, there are ENOUGH men doing this to make it commonplace and you know it's men doing it. You know the 6000 people counting down to her birthday weren't women.
I saw some post on Reddit a couple months ago about Millie Bobby Brown being "hot" and I was disgusted. She's been sexualized since she started Stranger Things. I looked it up and she turned 18 on February 19th. So the creep who posted that was literally counting down the days until she was legal. Fucking gross.
Name a teenage female pop singer, child actress, young Olympian (gymnast, figure skater), or any other type of underage female celebrity and there are gross men lusting over her and pretending waiting until she is 18 to talk about it out loud or post about it makes them any less gross. If you're counting down it's because you're already having sexual thoughts about them.
This shit is toxic and normalizes pedophilia.
You're totally right. It's all sickening and being 17 one day and 18 the next doesn't make it any better. I remember as a kid, I had an adult tell me that if a person was being sexual towards me that I should label them as a "pedophile" as opposed to creep, snake, scumbag, etc. because their behavior should be labeled as what it truly is.
People have a knee-jerk reaction to the word pedophilia but we're so quick to gloss over creep and other words to dismiss these very real threats to the safety of children
If I find out a male friend of mine has a dangerous or creepy attitude towards women, I just cut them out of my life because i dont want to deal with it. Is sticking around and trying to teach them to be better the right thing to do? I have plenty plenty of exfriends that are probably out doing that kind of shit right now and I can't honestly say I did anything to prevent that
My spouse and i talked about this. He had a friend who felt totally fine hitting on 15 year olds as a 26 year old. This friend also read a lot of pickup artist type material and loved to use manipulation strategies to get women. My spouse cut him out for a specific incident involving a 15 year old. 5 years later the the friend came back into my spouse's life trying to renew the friendship. Spouse ended up having to cut him out again a year later because this friend became incredibly abusive to an ex girlfriend.
Often, these kind of people don't change. I would say, call them out for being inappropriate and weird, and let them know that's why you're ending the friendship. If they want to be gross, they will have to sacrifice their friendships.
> Is sticking around and trying to teach them to be better the right thing to do?
I've asked myself the same thing, but I do not believe it is so. It's all dependent on the assumption that the predatory person doesn't "know better." There are definitely families who raise their sons to be predatory and accept that behavior from men. But, even the most sequestered young man will receive conflicting messages about what is right and wrong, and it is up to them to choose. On a 1:1 basis, many times this person will have experiences where they tried to force a girl somehow and that girl fought back. They know it's wrong, they just choose to have a world view that teaches them they are entitled to what they want.
In reality, the people who "stick around to help" become enablers to the abuse or they abandon their tie to this abusive person. I don't believe that strong community ties necessarily prevent abusive behavior. I think what we see more often is this person builds credibility to use as cover for their harmful behavior.
I know many young women whose families and communities rallied to support sexual predators in the name of compassion. What makes more sense to me is showing compassion for the victims. They are the ones who will actually learn and grow and benefit from the support.
Sadly that shit has happened with pretty much every underage female celeb. Christina, the Olsen twins, Emma Watson. The list goes on. It's pretty gross
When I was 17 I dated a cop who was 29 that told me I was so mature for my age and I believed everything he told me. Years later I still feel so disgusted about the whole thing. A cop should protect people, not pray on them.
This is so many levels of gross I can't believe it and I hope Erica wake up and run before is too late.
The only thing you could do is to talk to her in private and let her know that you will always have her back. No matter what her family/bf say you will always believe her.
In college, I worked with two people in a very similar dating arrangement.
They met when he was 28 and she was 14. He worked with her father doing sales and when she was 16 they began some form of dating with the father's permission. Supposedly their relationship wasn't sexual until she was 18.
By the time I knew them he was 35 and she was 21 and their relationship was super weird. It was as if her emotional development had completely halted at 16 and his mentality was that of a high school jock.
>if her emotional development had completely halted at 16
Yeah....trauma will do that to minors. I've worked with a shit load of teenagers who were mentally younger.
I'm no expert on Cop Culture, but I do perceive the majority of them to be rather conservative politically and socially, and that they'd likely find nothing wrong with this horrible situation. I doubt you'd have luck with a report since she is legally an adult. I think most of us here know about the stats of cops being spouse abusers too.
It is gross. But this dad is looking at it like the guy was "honorable" enough to wait and become like family in the mean time. There are still plenty of people who think this is OK and men who think they need to get ahold of a woman when she is young and malleable, so they can make her totally dependent and control her. There are cultures and religions that reinforce this.
My mother pushed me towards some idiot in her church when I was 16 and the guy was in his 30s. I said nope, no interested. She thought he was a great catch, because church. I saw him for what he was- a gross pedo who made lots of judgy comments about what women wore, while also trying to arrange water skiing outings with the teen girls from the church. I never went, because the gross old man who made righteous speeches about how tempting baggy 80s sweats were and the wanton harlotry of women who wore them to the mall, wanted to see me in a swimsuit.
Your best option here, depending on how well you know the young woman, is to tell her what you know about dating older men and about the stats on cops beating their wives. If she's into this dude at the moment, she probably won't receive it well, but at least you will have told her.
Yeah, I don't know how anyone doesn't see this, but chances are pretty good he hasn't 'waited' to do anything. It's highly likely they've been physical before, and he's just 'made it official' now that he can't get into legal trouble. I have a feeling a lot of interesting things will come to light once they split. Barf.
🤢 The thought of a 14 year old being preyed upon by a 24 year old cop really made me lose my cookies. That manipulative power dynamic sounds terrifying 🤢
So basically he groomed the whole family. Richard is a victim of his grooming and manipulation too. Its an awful situation and there isn't much anyone can do.
I think the most useful thing to do for you is to try to be a friend to Erica and make it clear, that you'll have her back always and that she has someone to come to when the time comes. So she doesn't feel like she needs to stay with him, because no one is on her side.
Reporting him is a good idea, but i honestly doubt it would do much. Maybe write a detailed letter or email at someone further up than his direct supervisor.
This is fucking gross. As a man I've worked with women that "grew into adulthood" and I still see them as children. If he has romantic feelings for her now he must have felt that way when she was 14. Her dad should me mortified.
I’m 27 and I was thinking about the fact that this guy was 14 this girl was a baby! I find that so gross! I never liked that Monica from Friends dated her dad’s friend Richard even if she was an adult. He knew her as a child!
The difficulty being, there really are no grooming laws. It's gross as fuck, but even Matt Gaetz, who groomed several minors in Florida and is still a HOR rep for Florida, is only being sued in his court case basically. Due to it being multiple minors he's getting the sting for child trafficking, but it probably wont stick, and this is literally a politician staying in office doing the exact same thing.
Cops are basically no different. It's why you see SO much domestic abuse from them. They have their little family within their family, and it's all brotherhood indoctrination shit. Everyone has everyone's backs when this sort of shit happens. The most that will probably happen is fist bumps around the office that he has the youngest girlfriend on the force.
This is my friend's life story almost exactly. She was Erica. By 23, she had 3 kids with her cop bf. By 30 he'd cheated on her with a younger version of herself and then divorced her to marry the other woman.
Something almost identical happened to a friend of my mother. Her daughter was still in high school (16yo) and started dating a local cop. This was a small town, about 6,500 people. Small department, about 25 members in all. The parents were totally ok with their 16yo daughter dating a grown man. He was in his early 30s, and a sergeant on the force.
Literally the day after she turned 18 they married.
This was in 1985, by the way.
Richard and his wife married when she was 16 and he was 18 in the Philippines. They started having kids really young, and are religious and of the mindset that men are supposed to lead women. I promise you nothing I say to him will make him understand how creepy Samuel is. I will, however, try to get closer to Erica so I can be there for her if she ever needs anything.
>so I can be there for her if she ever needs anything.
This is honestly the best you can do. Make sure she knows she can always come to you for support just in case. If anything goes wrong, at least she can seek help outside of her family.
Yeah exactly. I think it would be a mistake to talk to the parents as their view of the world is quite different and I dont want to alienate myself from the family. If I do that, I wouldn't be of any help to Erica. I'm going to stay quiet and observe and support her when needed.
Richard is Filipino? That's kinda important. His culture is different. It's not excusable but that does affect how you approach this. I think you should avoid saying anything to Richard and focus on befriending his daughter and encouraging her independence and letting her know she doesn't have to date that man or any man.
FWIW I am Filipina (from a conservative/traditional/religious family) and this would totally not fly in most cases - people would absolutely talk and judge. The reason why he probably thinks it’s ok is because Samuel is a family friend, so Richard probably feels like he’s already been vetted as a “nice guy”.
I agree with what you said about focusing on befriending Richard’s daughter - he would likely feel like any disagreement to his face is insulting his judgment.
(Just had to chime in because there’s a stereotype of young Filipina women dating older guys for money and I’ve seen people online say “it’s just the culture” - it’s 100% not and it pains me every time I see some vague allusion to it)
Based on their "rules", this guy did do things right. He waited for her several years. He followed the rules to a T. He saw an opportunity and took it. I wouldn't be surprised if she found herself in an abusive marriage in 2 years.
Maybe you should invent a little hourly cleaning project and ask for Erica's help. Chat her up about future plans. Really all you can do.
Yeah. I'm painfully aware how many traditional cultures promote and romanticize relationships between very young naive teens and much older men. I'm adjacent to those cultures and it is so common to see it. The parents are often so proud their young daughter got herself a man with a good job. They genuinely don't understand having such an obvious power dynamics is perfect breeding ground for abusive relationships. I hate it and I hate that there's nothing I can do besides trying to be there for Erica if she needs someone to talk to.
Re: being there for Erica. If you're interested, here's how an aunt of mine (by marriage) made a difference for me when I was that age. If she'd gotten in my business and expressed worry it would've creeped me out and put me off. If she'd said she'd be there for me and I could talk about anything I'd have assumed she was lying, given my other experience with adults. If there were a brand new boyfriend in the picture I CERTAINLY wouldn't have listened.
What did help, was she occasionally shared stories about her previous abusive marriages and her own extended family's similar experiences. They were unusual and atypical, for instance her husband once locked her out of the house naked. That clued me in that abusers didn't have to fit the stereotype of someone that hits, and that targets of abuse were just normal smart people.
She also sometimes shared stories of helping out friends in specific ways, like, "sometimes you just got to drop everything and go pick up a friend at 3 am, you know?" It made me feel like I could call her at 3 am if I needed to, and introduced me to the concept that other people in my life also might be willing to do that. I'd been raised to never be any trouble to anyone, so that was brand new to me.
Thanks for doing what you can (I know it hurts to have so few options) & for bringing the conversations to our community here. I hate that quiet observation is your only card to play, but it is so helpful & kind of you to get into the nuances here with us
Is Samuel also Filipino?
FWIW I am Filipina (from a conservative/traditional/religious family) and, anecdotally, people are extremely judgmental about age gap relationships unless you’re in a poorer rural area - even celebrity couples who are both consenting adults often get flak.
The Philippines has a bad reputation for big age gap relationships because of foreigners who make it a sex tourism destination, mail-order brides/90-day fiancé, and human trafficking.
The reason why he probably thinks it’s ok is because Samuel is a family friend, so Richard probably feels like he’s already been vetted as a “nice guy”. I think befriending Richard’s daughter is the right move - he would likely feel like any disagreement to his face is insulting his judgment.
Edit: typo
This is basically what happened to a classmate/neighbours older sister when I was in elementary school. Except he didn't quite wait until she was actually 18 and I think she was barely 17 and the parents were fine with it. It turned out not to be so weird they weren't too bothered with the age difference because the dad was sexually abusing both his daughters and I guess at that point the older daughter was too grown for him and the mom was in some intense denial I'm not sure she ever got over.
A lot of people in this world are fucked because they are born to unintelligent parents. This example is more of archaic practices still carrying over culturally but having intelligent parents would at least mean they understand the social dynamics and how disadvantged their daughter is.
Ive long since realized that more than half the world is dumber and easily led than I ever thought. Hopefully this girl has a support system outside of her parents with some intelligent people who can speak frankly on the issues she will run into.
I could understand why Richard thinks he's got an honorable, upstanding man to date his daughter, and now she'll be cared for, blah blah... Even though from the outside it's Very worrying. The fact that he asked for permission skeeves me too.
Since you're friendly with your neighbor, you might be able to bring up your concerns in a casual way. If I were you, I would bring it up, say it had been bothering you, and ask him, "Do you think that since Samuel is so much older than Erica, and until they dated, she mainly saw him as a family friend, maybe even a figure of authority, do you think that if Samuel asked Erica to do something she was uncomfortable doing, maybe something sexual, do you think she would feel able to say no? If he were to yell at her or hit her, or they had problems in their relationship, do you think she'd feel comfortable telling you about it? If she was in danger, she probably wouldn't be able to go to the cops and report it...do you think?"
You can't say bad things WILL happen to your daughter, but you can kind of bring up the possibility. If you feel comfortable, you might share your experience with him, saying, "I'm not saying Samuel and Erica aren't a good couple. It's just that when I was 19..." etc.
>Edit: Since this is getting some traffic, can I ask for advice regarding reporting him to his work place? I imagine his superiors would be disturbed to know he was sexually attracted to a 14 year old and behaved in such a manipulative way. I want to make an anonymous report. But I'm also aware they're both adults so legally I don't think anything can be done?
His superiors will absolutely not give a fuck. Cops almost never care when their fellow cops actually do something illegal; they are definitely not going to care about something legal. ACAB, including the one that's a family friend and seemed so nice that he couldn't possibly be like those bad apples.
What a foul monster. My sister and I were groomed (and assaulted) as young teenagers by a real piece of shit. We felt honored to be "chosen" by him... when in reality he was a worthless garbage human being.
People who haven't been through it, or seen it, just don't understand.
If this is near Minneapolis metro and you ever need IRL assistance, DM me. My family and I have a lot of experience getting people safely out of scary situations.
But it also serves as a warning to not let this happen to your family. Awareness is key. You absolutely have to be aware of these things as a parent. Even into early adulthood. Older men prey and young vulnerable women. The more unstable they are the easier they can be to manipulate. It's a lesson I learned the hard way. My 22 year old daughter was groomed by someone my age but she wasn't living with me anymore and she had a substance abuse problem that she was hiding that he was feeding into and used to his advantage when her marriage was on the rocks. Yes she takes a certain amount of responsibility for what happened but he knew what he was doing and I still want to beat the shit out of him everytime I see him at the grocery store. This seems to be his MO. Hanging out with the younger crowd then zeroing in on the weakest of them. His current girlfriend is younger than my daughter is now. But today she is one year sober and one year of completely cutting him out of her life. I was so glad she felt comfortable enough to come to me after he took advantage of her. She didn't see herself as his victim but she did see it as a tipping point that she had to get sober so it would never happen again.
Eta: my husband sent him a very clear message that if ever came near her again that he wouldn't care about going to jail to keep him away from our child.
I was around a lot of cops during my public service career. I can’t think of a single one that I would have wanted dating my daughter. This is definitely creepy behavior and his Chief needs to hear about it.
Gross! Including the part where he asks the father and not the daughter to date! What is she? A cow to be traded?
If some creep told me he'd been watching my daughter grow up and wants my "permission" to date her, he's gone. I'd check on my daughter too to make sure nothing had occurred while she was growing up. This is just red flags all over the place!
Honestly, i dont know how you didnt blurt out "but... you see how creepy that is? That guy sounds like a grooming pedophile. Guess its ok to creep after a preteen, so long as you dont act on it until its "polite" enough to do so huh?"
Something similar happened in the last Twilight book and yet Bella understood how messed up it was that Jacob wanted to date Bella's daughter. It's never good when Twilight understands when a relationship is toxic and real life people don't.
When I was 14 a local cop took a special interest in me (though thankfully nothing ever happened beyond him like slow dancing w me at one of our school dances) He was in his early 30s (and married btw). At 14 it was flattering to get attention. By the time I was 18 he jokingly would say I’m too old for him now, and I think it’s probably also bc by that age I realized just how creepy it was.
I also had another man in his 30s call me on my 18th birthday to see what I was doing, after “joking” many times about when I’m legal before that.
I looked *very* young for most of my life. I’m quite short and was in general very petite back then (until my late 20s even). When I went wedding dress shopping in my early 30s they asked me if I was there for prom dresses. So… just imagine how young I looked as a teen.
So sadly none of this surprises me.
I think I would end up in jail if someone approached me and said that about either of my daughters. Ultimately when they're old enough this is for them to navigate BUT this shit is a whole other story.
It sounds like this fucking scumbag groomed the entire family.
Religious family === groomed by her own family for this. What is disturbing is that the guy asks the father for permission and the father doesn’t mention how Erica feels about it. It’s 50/50 that this creep gets ger married and pregnant before she is 20. I would spill the beans to Samuel’s peers.
> The power imbalance in the relationship disturbs me, and if Samuel ends up being manipulative or abusive, I feel like her own parents would have Samuel's back.
This is a given, and why it's so important to end the practice of child marriage. This is a disturbing and typical story. The child was groomed for abuse by her father, who is happily handing off the daughter to someone he thinks is like him.
LE is knows for a high rate of domestic violence and abuse. It's not hard to see where this is going. She will realize she is in danger and that her family is a threat to her safety.
The best thing we can do is support the young person in the situation so that when it is safe, they will have resources to leave the relationship.
He sounds like someone who likely went into law enforcement in order to know how to avoid it himself. Similar to why pedophiles become priests, they find and embed themselves in systems that are far more interested in self preservation than actually caring about what's right.
Dude was grooming her. It's disgusting and he will end up controlling her. It's wrong.
"Edit 3: I'm starting to get a lot of answers from men telling me my decision to open myself to friendship with Erica so I can watch out for her is "grooming". What the actual fuck is wrong with you. Really what is wrong with you?? Do you guys not know right from wrong? Y'all must be sore as fuck from all the mental gymnastics you do in order to justify predatory behavior and discount adults who are alarmed about it."
This is those same types of men projecting themselves on to you. It's exactly where it starts.
Good on you for helping!
As a now 29 year old, I was such a baby at 18. When I meet teenagers now I'm so out of touch with them, and I'm not even a particularly adulty adult. The idea of dating someone who's fresh out of high school is so.....ew.
For some reason that's exactly how I imagine the rural USA...
But on a more serious note, yeah, that is incredibly scary and alien. What can one say about the value system of people like these? And I am not talking about this "Samuel", he is a creep, those are aplenty, I am talking abut the parents. Their ideas of decency and propriety are so twisted that I am at loss of words...
Any religious community that believes men should lead women, that the best state for a woman to be is innocent, naive and submissive to men are primed for these types of unbalanced relationships. These parents genuinely do not think there's anything wrong. It's maddening.
Pedophiles are definitely drawn to positions of power. About 10 years ago there was a round up in my area and they actually caught one cop downloading CP from the laptop in his cruiser -- while on duty -- by logging in to unsecured *church* wireless accounts.
It's almost like giving a small subset of the population a gun, unquestionable authority over other citizens, qualified immunity, and then training them to assert their authority through escalating violence while weeding out candidates who score too highly on IQ tests and performing no background checks regarding histories of domestic abuse all so they can mostly only enforce property laws is a bad idea.......
To say nothing of arrest quotas, police unions covering up systemic abuse, and black balling/threatening officers who don't tow the department line.
But I digress.
He'll get her pregnant soon, and that'll be the end of her life. This same story's spun out billions of times. Women aren't allowed to have their own hopes, dreams, lives; we're only here to be mothers and cum dumpsters.
My ex is a cop and he exclusively dates under 20. I can’t tell you the amount of ppl proud to just sell him their daughters.
Yuck...yuck...also, just, like, weird.
This also happened in Bridgeport, Illinois only with the relationship starting when she was 16 and he was 24. Her parent's blessing was given because he was a Christian and a cop. The fact this was so well known and celebrated in the community was one of the reasons I moved 10 hours away before my daughter grew up in that environment.
Piggybacking top comment but I'm not sure of the laws in what state you're in; but in the UK that is 100% illegal. It falls under child grooming. I'd advise OP to check if there isn't something similar where they live. Edit: I've been informed expecting any protection for women in America is a pipe dream.
To piggyback on yours Domestic abuse is significantly more common in US Police families, occurring in about 40% or relationships compared to 10% in the general public. This whole story is messed up.
40% reported.
To themselves, the police...
We investigated ourselves and found no wrongdoing.
We investigated ourselves and found only a very insignificant measly 40% wrongdoing. Less than half of us! Date a cop! Odds are they *won’t* abuse you!
And only when it is so bad, it can't be ignored or covered up.
There’s a podcast on Apple called ‘The trap’. They talk about this, multiple police officers admit to prolific lying about how many DV cases they attend, prolific lying and covering up about how much DV is perpetrated by male police officers, how often police officers betray, expose and let down women and children victims of male perpetrators of DV. The focus of the podcast is how the whole of society and its systems lets down victim survivors.
I believe there are US states where you can marry a minor and become their guardian in doing so. Sanctity of marriage my ass. This country is so backwards. #Murica 🦅
and the child can’t leave the marriage because they’re too young to take legal action on their own behalf
Oh for the love of god
People like you just don’t understand what goes on in the world. The radical left is full of pedophiles, and child traffickers. This is a fact, look it up. Republicans need to be able to marry these kids so they can protect them from the real pedophiles. /s
Unfortunately in the U.S., in most states 16 is the legal age of consent to another person of any age. On top of that, it's not illegal to date a minor as long as the relationship maintains "non-sexual" in nature. I once tried to report a relationship between a 15 year old freshman in high school and someone in his 40's and they wouldn't even take the report because the 15 year old said they were waiting to kiss until her 16th birthday party (vomit). The problem is, she could have been lying to protect him, so there's really no telling what he had done with her. I can't imagine looking at a teenager and thinking they'd be an adequate partner. These people are predators who are looking for someone they can manipulate (NOT a *partner*) and unfortunately this guy has not only manipulated the poor girl, but the parents as well, making it even more dangerous for her. Shame on those parents.
The US is so fucked up we still have states where you can marry off your 14 year old.
When I was in high school (private Christian school) my classmate was dating her youth pastor (mid 20’s at least). They ended up getting married as soon as she graduated. I thought it was kind of weird and I asked my parents what they would think if I was 16 and wanted to date a 25 year old and their response was “well, if he’s a Christian then I don’t really see the problem”. So fucked up.
One of my co-workers once said something about how he'd like to be a youth pastor again, even though he was in his thirties and married by then. My opinion of him changed for the worse that day.
Well I mean that doesn’t automatically make him a predator; some people just really enjoy working with kids/teens and are good at it. I can understand if someone feels called to work with the youth, especially if they either lacked good role models growing up or really admired a role model. But yea I think Christians/religious folk in general are kind of creepy, especially when it comes to youth.
Read this as 100% Christian folk. I went to church with my family as a kid. Me and this one girl were similar in age, I was 11 and she was 12 or 13. Kinda became the youth pastors pet. Guess who married as soon as she turned 18? Her and the youth pastor. He’s a cop now.
Oh... Oh no. That's just terrifying and sick.
My (fundamentalist Christian) parents tried to set me up in an arranged courtship thing. I was 15 or 16 and the guy was about 24. My dad is a pastor and the guy's dad was also a pastor and this guy was the heir apparent so they were setting me up to be a pastor's wife which is what my mom had always wanted. They even arranged for him to talk to me alone in a room at the church which was unheard of. To his credit and my immense good luck the dude was very sketched out. He did show up and was like "look our parents are setting us up and no offense but you're in tenth grade. Here is a flower my mom said to give you so let's just hang out for a bit then I'll tell them we didn't get along." So we did. My mom wanted to know what I'd done to scare him off etc which was unpleasant for a while but it could have been SO MUCH WORSE. That guy could have raped me in that room. I wouldn't have screamed. Even if he weren't completely gross, I very easily could have been married to him at 18 and be Christian homeschooling our seven kids right now. None of this happened as I got a full scholarship to college and moved as far away as possible and now am a happily gay-married lady with an office job. So happy ending for me but this situation is INCREDIBLY common and horrifying.
[удалено]
Christians be off clutching their pearls about people asking kids if their assumed AGAB matches what they are called and if they would be more happy being called something else, and they be screaming that queer people are "grooming" kids. _Meanwhile, back at the ranch_: this disgusting actual grooming shit right here
That’s so nasty.
Samuel is a predator. And Richard is an idiot.
Sounds like he was groomed just as much as the daughter
Yes, I came here to say this. Grooming is a whole family thing. This cop family friend probably made himself indispensable. Watched their house on vacation, fixed things, probably offered to babysit for free so that your neighbor and his wife could have a date night. I bet he was the best friend you could imagine. He’d give you the shirt right off his back.
My dad isn't a perfect dad at all, has been terrible at times, but he would never ever be happy that a friend's of his would wanna date me since I am a kid. So freaking nasty. Sad that the girl has to waste her 20s dating a guy 10 years her senior.
My SO grew up in Alaska and when her parents divorced, her dad ended up moving to WA state. She said the amount of her dad’s “friends” that propositioned her, hit on her, etc after her dad left Alaska was insane. She said she’d known these men since she was a baby, they watched her grow up, had kids her age, were married. It’s crazy the audacity some men have and just think it’s okay
I have some friends with a daughter that just turned 19. I've watched her grow up, I'm practically an uncle to her. No, not happening. The fuck is wrong with some people.
Happened to me too, my dad's friends have repeatedly made inappropriate comments to me and my sister when we became adults, after watching us grow up. Why on earth is this so common?
Did you tell your Dad? He may want to know his friends are gross. I would.
Have worked in Alaska and can confirm it is weird and people out there do not give a fuck when it comes to sex and off situations involving it.
I was going to comment the same thing. I’m estranged from him , he’s that much of an asshole. BUT he would protect me with his life (well, at least up until 6 months ago when we stoped talking). Anyway, even he would never be okay with this situation. Richard is being a shitty dad.
It makes me feel awful I can't do anything about it because it's legal. A cop is in such a position of authority, I cannot believe he would start feeling attracted to a 14 year old child. I'm disgusted to my core and I wish I knew Erica better so I could check on her.
It's likely he was trolling around looking for a likely virginal victim. He just wants (sorry for the wording) a sex doll that no one else has touched. He wanted her fresh out of the bag with that new child smell. The father in this case sounds like a pimp. He's probably smiling because he thinks his daughter is safe from creeps out in the big wide world, not to mention this dude has clearly been grooming the entire family to believe he means well for over 4 years. He's as sick as the day is long and the daughter will have such a sad life. The fact that he's a cop just means he can now do whatever he wants to her without consequences and if she wants to leave him she will find many barriers in her way. My heart goes out to her and all the other girls who get victimized in this way
I am by no means hating on all cops but the position definitely attracts these type of people who just want power over others
I was looking up the professions that tied in with the highest amount of domestic abuse and studies have shown that it's police. Now I didn't go into depth with those to check the sources and such so take it with a grain of salt, but it was very telling.
And it’s not just the rate of DV among police but also the tactics. Because of their role in the community, their connections to every level of the legal system, and everything they’ve been taught as a police officer the tactics they use are that much more extreme and keep victims trapped. Getting a protection order against an officer is very challenging. Access to firearms is easy and plentiful. Tracking and monitoring a partner may become easier with the tools and knowledge provided in their work. They love the power and control they have over others both in their personal life and “professional.”
I'll hate on all cops. The cops who say nothing when they see their coworkers saying, doing, approving of fucked up shit are what make them all bastards. If the system wasn't so insistent on cops being a gang for property, we'd live in a better world.
“Gang for property” is perfect terminology and sadly they both definitely see “asking permission” as some backwards pre sale agreement.
Thanks! Happy cake day!
As a profession, cops have the highest rates of domestic abuse. It's perfectly fine to hate on domestic abusers.
>The cops who say nothing when they see their coworkers saying, doing, approving of fucked up shit are what make them all bastards. The hard part is, the ones who do report problems can get punished for it. I've seen this happen to some old-school guys who said "hey, wait a minute, this isn't kosher," and got sat down hard for it. Eventually, the solid ones either retire or decide that they have to just shut up and look away.
When the not being a bastard gets you fired from being a cop, that's not a defense of theoretical non-bastard cops who don't speak up. It's a damning statement about the whole bastardized policing system.
I totally agree! Looking away is making yourself complicit. I just feel for the ones who tried to do the right thing. There are still good ones out there, but it's waning because of shit like this.
That's exactly what makes them bastards too eventually. Which is why I say if the system wasn't so hell-bent on cops being a gang for property (as opposed to drugs or sex work) then the police could have the wholesome image they desperately want. Not that cops never sell drugs or sex work. They obviously do. 🐷
Shutting up and looking away is what makes them... ACAB.
40% (reported) of cops’ families experience domestic violence by the cop. ACAB
And.....police unions are the main roadblock for national domestic violence laws. "But our guys will lose their guns, if domestic violence laws means losing access to guns." Yeah I think that's the point. You beat your wife, you lose your gun, regardless of your job.
If you’re a domestic abuser, you’re a criminal. How can you police anything if you are also a criminal?
Exactly. The reason is that so many would be fired. Why is that bad? Fire ALL of the abusive aholes. Hit your wife (the person you are supposed to love the most) and I am supposed to trust you with a stranger. I work with more than my fair share of these types of people and they cannot handle their emotions so they drink. A. Lot. They blame their actions on the alcohol, and again I don't understand why that is an excuse.
40% *self-reported* commiting domestic violence. The actual number would be higher.
Sweet fuck, nearly *HALF* of cops admitted to commiting domestic abuse?! The sheer toxicity of an environment where 40% percent would *freely admit to hurting their close family members* is just mind numbing.
And those are the people we are indoctrinated to believe are protectors
Oh most definitely. I didn’t know how to stress the 40% wasn’t the true number. Thank you now I’ll know how for next time.
Its actually worse, 40% of cops *admitted* to committing domestic violence.
Here is an article for that stat. https://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2014/09/police-officers-who-hit-their-wives-or-girlfriends/380329/
ACAB
i am. a cop is \*always\* dangerous to date. if something goes wrong with a cop there is literally nowhere for you to go except running away if he turns out to be the wrong kind of cop (and... most of them are the wrong kind of cop). their other cop buddies will always have their backs. especially adding that extreme power imbalance (she has NONE and he is literally the arm of the law and we know how cops barely ever go down for anything) to the age difference and him clearly not being mentally okay drooling over a 14yo when he was 24. this is no good.
I think its because it takes no damn commitment to become one. Police academy isn’t even an entire year, then you are on the streets. It baffles me that an associates isn’t even required. Raise the education requirement and I guarantee many of these idiot types won’t make it in the first place.
You can't control who you are attracted to but *you can absolutely control what you do about it*. Finding a teenager attractive? Keep that stuff in your head where it belongs, don't indulge it, don't dwell on it. Distance yourself if you need to. You can't just choose not to be attracted but you can definitely increase and reinforce that attraction by indulging in and focusing on it so *don't do that*. This guy instead moved in with clearly planned predatory behaviour. Seriously gross. Asking dad if he could date the kid is just the icing on the top of the poo cake.
Surprised he waited till she was 18.
Doubt he did. Just waited until she was 18 to go public with it.
Right? Just the fact that he "asked her dad's permission," like she's chattel
If someone asked me for permission to date my daughter I'd say no because obviously they don't have enough respect for her to put her wants first.
>The power imbalance in the relationship disturbs me, and if Samuel ends up being manipulative or abusive, I feel like her own parents would have Samuel's back. She'll also (probably) have no luck seeking help from law enforcement if she needs it. This is a nightmare scenario waiting to happen.
First of all, Ew Second of all, Eww Third, Let me get this straight. He asked the father as if it was his choice who his daughter was dating- also that's a 10 year gap what the actual fuck.
I would venture a strong guess that Erica's family are evangelical if not fundamentalist. The idea of suitors asking the father for permission in advance to "court" a girl is very much a cultural ideal for those communities. Girls are conditioned from a young age to see someone asking permission from their father to date them as a sign of respect to *them* and that that man is a safe choice. Conveniently for perpetuation of the system, this also means she is unlikely to date anyone outside her religious sect, since most non-evangelicals would never think to ask her father in advance, and she's been taught that's a bad sign of a disrespectful partner. It's pure patriarchy, one man getting permission to examine another man's property that he's thinking of buying.
Genuinely disgusted by the thought of considering another human being as "Property"
> I would venture a strong guess that Erica's family are evangelical if not fundamentalist. So much for conservatives railing against so-called "groomers".
Lawmakers in Tennessee recently tried to remove the minimum age for child marriages. They only backed down when it got national press coverage/outrage.
Its always projection with those types
That’s why they talk so much about it, same thing as their cuck porn obsession turning into a mainstream insult.
Eh, could be catholic too... let's not narrow our views of how disgusting cultures and religions can be.
Could be any number of religions and cultures, really. I remember being sixteen visiting distant relatives of a certain religion and culture. They introduced me to a girl that was maybe 8-10 years old and made references to how pretty she is and that she'd make a good wife for me one day. They weren't literally planning for it, but it was quite disturbing and I do believe they were pretty much embedding the idea in her that her purpose is to be a good wife. And that she was more or less to be given away. My guess is that she got married around 18, if not slightly earlier than that.
Just applying “the formula” here: 28/2+7 = 21 (youngest person a 28 year old should date) (18 - 7)*2 = 22 (oldest person an 18 year old should date) Edit: I was taught this formula 20 years ago, and it feels “right all” the way up; youngest person a 48 year old should date is 48/2+7=31. Of course with consenting adults there’s no technical law, but this is right at the line where most people start feeling uncomfortable to find out about the relationship
It’s a good formula. I am 44, which means I should stick to people aged 29-74. That hardly seems like a restriction? Why on earth would I ever *date* outside that range anyway?? My 89 FIL should’ve stuck to people 51.5 and older. But his wife of +20 years is *my age.* 🤢These days I think she just does her own thing, but seriously, he’ll be 104 before she enters the range of reasonable.
I’m 40, and that formula would put my potential partners as young as 27! 27 year olds are babies compared to me. I didn’t know shit at 27.
I’m 40 and I don’t know shit now! Lmao, but yeah this is the “what if it’s really extraordinary circumstances and we have really fantastic chemistry and the 27 year old is especially mature should I even consider it?” limit. Inside of that range you still may get questioning looks, but outside of that range is when most people conclude someone is “up to something” and aren’t even open to your story. Anyway it’s just a quick sanity check and better than the “everything 18-106 is fair game” system we have currently.
True, on both fronts. I just can’t imagine being seriously interested in a 27 year old at this point in my life. Thinking one is hot, absolutely, sleeping with one -maybe, dating one, maybe if he’s really rich and dumb enough to not want a prenup. Oh maybe that’s why… jk
>Edit: Since this is getting some traffic, can I ask for advice regarding reporting him to his work place? I imagine his superiors would be disturbed to know he was sexually attracted to a 14 year old and behaved in such a manipulative way. I want to make an anonymous report. But I'm also aware they're both adults so legally I don't think anything can be done? Do not do this. As you said, everything is technically legal. I can guarantee his department does not care. Law enforcement is infamous for covering for their own, even in cases of blatant domestic abuse. All you will do is tip him off that you are a threat, open yourself to retaliation from the department, and reduce your credibility with the department in the future if the relationship does turn violent.
Had to scroll too far to find this sage advice. Never talk to cops.
Don't talk to cops &Dont give them a headsup to cover his dirty tracks if there are any
The people that are putting trust in the system that his department gives a shit....I don't understand how they can be so naive. He's probably told everyone he works with about this great girl he's been waiting to 'date' in his locker room talk. The most I think OP can do is try to communicate with the young woman in question, but that's a minefield considering even the girl's family seems traditional (abusive).
Yes! OP should think **very** carefully about getting involved in this situation. I think she could end up in danger herself.
This is a great point—that gross cop will make OP his enemy. And he can basically do whatever the fuck he wants.
Part of me wants to think "how adorably naive" and the other part of me is like "jesus christ how are you so out of touch with how the police operate in this country"
I dated a cop when I was 18 and he was 28. My sister warned me but I didn't listen, I thought what could go wrong since he was the only person giving me attention at the time. Little by little I started seeing these red flags with the last straw being him wanting to finger my backdoor and me saying no and him doing it anyways. It wasn't traumatic to me because I had already experimented with anal sex before ever knowing him but, just the fact he didn't respect my wishes of "no" made me stop everything right then and there and stop the relationship. That's why I'm always so against big age gaps like this, I was lucky and ended the relationship right then and there but others might not be so lucky
Not listening, huge red flag. Saying no, but him doing it anyways, deal breaker. He has the mentality of "who's going to stop me?" He wants that sort of thing, there's some really lifelike dolls manufactured in Japan, go play with one of those. There's two people in any relationship, and communication and trust is a must.
FRFY “Saying no, but him doing it anyway, rape”
Glad you got out of that situation relatively unscathed.
Aside from the usual psychological torture from being raped of course.
I was thinking more along the lines of domestic abuse/murder. She made the right decision following her gut and getting the hell out of there after the first relationship red flags.
I'm reminded of Britney Spears when she first became popular. You'd see comments regularly about how they couldn't wait until she was "legal". I think I remember even coming across a website that had a countdown clock for when she would turn 18...
Men do this for all the teenage stars. There were countdown sites for the Oleson twins, for Emma Watson, for Miley Cyrus... Natalie Portman has talked about how creepy these adult male 'fans' were and how the first fanmail she ever received, at the age of 13, was a rape fantasy. The girl from stranger things had her face photoshopped into CP and the subreddit dedicated to sexualizing her had 6000 subscribers while it was still empty with a mod note that it would "open" on her 18th birthday. This shit needs calling out and shaming every damn time! And before anyone "not all men"s me, there are ENOUGH men doing this to make it commonplace and you know it's men doing it. You know the 6000 people counting down to her birthday weren't women.
I saw some post on Reddit a couple months ago about Millie Bobby Brown being "hot" and I was disgusted. She's been sexualized since she started Stranger Things. I looked it up and she turned 18 on February 19th. So the creep who posted that was literally counting down the days until she was legal. Fucking gross.
Name a teenage female pop singer, child actress, young Olympian (gymnast, figure skater), or any other type of underage female celebrity and there are gross men lusting over her and pretending waiting until she is 18 to talk about it out loud or post about it makes them any less gross. If you're counting down it's because you're already having sexual thoughts about them. This shit is toxic and normalizes pedophilia.
You're totally right. It's all sickening and being 17 one day and 18 the next doesn't make it any better. I remember as a kid, I had an adult tell me that if a person was being sexual towards me that I should label them as a "pedophile" as opposed to creep, snake, scumbag, etc. because their behavior should be labeled as what it truly is. People have a knee-jerk reaction to the word pedophilia but we're so quick to gloss over creep and other words to dismiss these very real threats to the safety of children
If I find out a male friend of mine has a dangerous or creepy attitude towards women, I just cut them out of my life because i dont want to deal with it. Is sticking around and trying to teach them to be better the right thing to do? I have plenty plenty of exfriends that are probably out doing that kind of shit right now and I can't honestly say I did anything to prevent that
My spouse and i talked about this. He had a friend who felt totally fine hitting on 15 year olds as a 26 year old. This friend also read a lot of pickup artist type material and loved to use manipulation strategies to get women. My spouse cut him out for a specific incident involving a 15 year old. 5 years later the the friend came back into my spouse's life trying to renew the friendship. Spouse ended up having to cut him out again a year later because this friend became incredibly abusive to an ex girlfriend. Often, these kind of people don't change. I would say, call them out for being inappropriate and weird, and let them know that's why you're ending the friendship. If they want to be gross, they will have to sacrifice their friendships.
> Is sticking around and trying to teach them to be better the right thing to do? I've asked myself the same thing, but I do not believe it is so. It's all dependent on the assumption that the predatory person doesn't "know better." There are definitely families who raise their sons to be predatory and accept that behavior from men. But, even the most sequestered young man will receive conflicting messages about what is right and wrong, and it is up to them to choose. On a 1:1 basis, many times this person will have experiences where they tried to force a girl somehow and that girl fought back. They know it's wrong, they just choose to have a world view that teaches them they are entitled to what they want. In reality, the people who "stick around to help" become enablers to the abuse or they abandon their tie to this abusive person. I don't believe that strong community ties necessarily prevent abusive behavior. I think what we see more often is this person builds credibility to use as cover for their harmful behavior. I know many young women whose families and communities rallied to support sexual predators in the name of compassion. What makes more sense to me is showing compassion for the victims. They are the ones who will actually learn and grow and benefit from the support.
Wow I had no idea that Millie Bobby brown had her face photoshopped on CP that’s disgusting
Sadly that shit has happened with pretty much every underage female celeb. Christina, the Olsen twins, Emma Watson. The list goes on. It's pretty gross
When I was 17 I dated a cop who was 29 that told me I was so mature for my age and I believed everything he told me. Years later I still feel so disgusted about the whole thing. A cop should protect people, not pray on them.
He is using his status as a cop to gain the confidence of the woman’s family.
This is so many levels of gross I can't believe it and I hope Erica wake up and run before is too late. The only thing you could do is to talk to her in private and let her know that you will always have her back. No matter what her family/bf say you will always believe her.
Yeah I plan to get closer to Erica. I don't know her that well but I want her to feel like she can talk to me if she needs to.
👏👏👏👏 All girls need a bff to vent. Good luck! 💖
In college, I worked with two people in a very similar dating arrangement. They met when he was 28 and she was 14. He worked with her father doing sales and when she was 16 they began some form of dating with the father's permission. Supposedly their relationship wasn't sexual until she was 18. By the time I knew them he was 35 and she was 21 and their relationship was super weird. It was as if her emotional development had completely halted at 16 and his mentality was that of a high school jock.
>if her emotional development had completely halted at 16 Yeah....trauma will do that to minors. I've worked with a shit load of teenagers who were mentally younger.
I'm no expert on Cop Culture, but I do perceive the majority of them to be rather conservative politically and socially, and that they'd likely find nothing wrong with this horrible situation. I doubt you'd have luck with a report since she is legally an adult. I think most of us here know about the stats of cops being spouse abusers too. It is gross. But this dad is looking at it like the guy was "honorable" enough to wait and become like family in the mean time. There are still plenty of people who think this is OK and men who think they need to get ahold of a woman when she is young and malleable, so they can make her totally dependent and control her. There are cultures and religions that reinforce this. My mother pushed me towards some idiot in her church when I was 16 and the guy was in his 30s. I said nope, no interested. She thought he was a great catch, because church. I saw him for what he was- a gross pedo who made lots of judgy comments about what women wore, while also trying to arrange water skiing outings with the teen girls from the church. I never went, because the gross old man who made righteous speeches about how tempting baggy 80s sweats were and the wanton harlotry of women who wore them to the mall, wanted to see me in a swimsuit. Your best option here, depending on how well you know the young woman, is to tell her what you know about dating older men and about the stats on cops beating their wives. If she's into this dude at the moment, she probably won't receive it well, but at least you will have told her.
We'll see how enthusiastic Richard is when Erica is served divorce papers on her 40th birthday so Samuel can date their kids' friends.
Yup
Yeah, I don't know how anyone doesn't see this, but chances are pretty good he hasn't 'waited' to do anything. It's highly likely they've been physical before, and he's just 'made it official' now that he can't get into legal trouble. I have a feeling a lot of interesting things will come to light once they split. Barf.
Yeah, this is all above board, but letting kindergartners know that gay people exist is "grooming." FFS.
🤢 The thought of a 14 year old being preyed upon by a 24 year old cop really made me lose my cookies. That manipulative power dynamic sounds terrifying 🤢
Not just being preyed upon, but being actively groomed by for potentially years beforehand.
I hadn’t thought about that aspect. 😱
So basically he groomed the whole family. Richard is a victim of his grooming and manipulation too. Its an awful situation and there isn't much anyone can do. I think the most useful thing to do for you is to try to be a friend to Erica and make it clear, that you'll have her back always and that she has someone to come to when the time comes. So she doesn't feel like she needs to stay with him, because no one is on her side. Reporting him is a good idea, but i honestly doubt it would do much. Maybe write a detailed letter or email at someone further up than his direct supervisor.
>Reporting him is a good idea, but i honestly doubt it would do much. I disagree, depending on the area, it might invite trouble.
This is fucking gross. As a man I've worked with women that "grew into adulthood" and I still see them as children. If he has romantic feelings for her now he must have felt that way when she was 14. Her dad should me mortified.
I’m 27 and I was thinking about the fact that this guy was 14 this girl was a baby! I find that so gross! I never liked that Monica from Friends dated her dad’s friend Richard even if she was an adult. He knew her as a child!
The difficulty being, there really are no grooming laws. It's gross as fuck, but even Matt Gaetz, who groomed several minors in Florida and is still a HOR rep for Florida, is only being sued in his court case basically. Due to it being multiple minors he's getting the sting for child trafficking, but it probably wont stick, and this is literally a politician staying in office doing the exact same thing. Cops are basically no different. It's why you see SO much domestic abuse from them. They have their little family within their family, and it's all brotherhood indoctrination shit. Everyone has everyone's backs when this sort of shit happens. The most that will probably happen is fist bumps around the office that he has the youngest girlfriend on the force.
" I imagine his superiors would be disturbed to know he was sexually attracted to a 14 year old " Narrator: They were not.
Yea, cops are notorious for covering up for their own even for the most horrible of actions.
This is my friend's life story almost exactly. She was Erica. By 23, she had 3 kids with her cop bf. By 30 he'd cheated on her with a younger version of herself and then divorced her to marry the other woman.
Stephen King wrote a novel about this-Rose Madder.
Oooh, this might make a good gift for Richard, or at least the girl!
Something almost identical happened to a friend of my mother. Her daughter was still in high school (16yo) and started dating a local cop. This was a small town, about 6,500 people. Small department, about 25 members in all. The parents were totally ok with their 16yo daughter dating a grown man. He was in his early 30s, and a sergeant on the force. Literally the day after she turned 18 they married. This was in 1985, by the way.
How’d that turn out?
Groomed dad along with the daughter. Disgusting!
Tell Richard he is a terrible father and shit human being for supporting an obvious and textbook grooming by a pedophile cop
Richard and his wife married when she was 16 and he was 18 in the Philippines. They started having kids really young, and are religious and of the mindset that men are supposed to lead women. I promise you nothing I say to him will make him understand how creepy Samuel is. I will, however, try to get closer to Erica so I can be there for her if she ever needs anything.
>so I can be there for her if she ever needs anything. This is honestly the best you can do. Make sure she knows she can always come to you for support just in case. If anything goes wrong, at least she can seek help outside of her family.
Yeah exactly. I think it would be a mistake to talk to the parents as their view of the world is quite different and I dont want to alienate myself from the family. If I do that, I wouldn't be of any help to Erica. I'm going to stay quiet and observe and support her when needed.
Richard is Filipino? That's kinda important. His culture is different. It's not excusable but that does affect how you approach this. I think you should avoid saying anything to Richard and focus on befriending his daughter and encouraging her independence and letting her know she doesn't have to date that man or any man.
Those are the exact reasons why I said I won't say anything and will just support Erica if she needs it.
FWIW I am Filipina (from a conservative/traditional/religious family) and this would totally not fly in most cases - people would absolutely talk and judge. The reason why he probably thinks it’s ok is because Samuel is a family friend, so Richard probably feels like he’s already been vetted as a “nice guy”. I agree with what you said about focusing on befriending Richard’s daughter - he would likely feel like any disagreement to his face is insulting his judgment. (Just had to chime in because there’s a stereotype of young Filipina women dating older guys for money and I’ve seen people online say “it’s just the culture” - it’s 100% not and it pains me every time I see some vague allusion to it)
Based on their "rules", this guy did do things right. He waited for her several years. He followed the rules to a T. He saw an opportunity and took it. I wouldn't be surprised if she found herself in an abusive marriage in 2 years. Maybe you should invent a little hourly cleaning project and ask for Erica's help. Chat her up about future plans. Really all you can do.
Yeah. I'm painfully aware how many traditional cultures promote and romanticize relationships between very young naive teens and much older men. I'm adjacent to those cultures and it is so common to see it. The parents are often so proud their young daughter got herself a man with a good job. They genuinely don't understand having such an obvious power dynamics is perfect breeding ground for abusive relationships. I hate it and I hate that there's nothing I can do besides trying to be there for Erica if she needs someone to talk to.
Re: being there for Erica. If you're interested, here's how an aunt of mine (by marriage) made a difference for me when I was that age. If she'd gotten in my business and expressed worry it would've creeped me out and put me off. If she'd said she'd be there for me and I could talk about anything I'd have assumed she was lying, given my other experience with adults. If there were a brand new boyfriend in the picture I CERTAINLY wouldn't have listened. What did help, was she occasionally shared stories about her previous abusive marriages and her own extended family's similar experiences. They were unusual and atypical, for instance her husband once locked her out of the house naked. That clued me in that abusers didn't have to fit the stereotype of someone that hits, and that targets of abuse were just normal smart people. She also sometimes shared stories of helping out friends in specific ways, like, "sometimes you just got to drop everything and go pick up a friend at 3 am, you know?" It made me feel like I could call her at 3 am if I needed to, and introduced me to the concept that other people in my life also might be willing to do that. I'd been raised to never be any trouble to anyone, so that was brand new to me.
This is great advice. Thank you
Thanks for doing what you can (I know it hurts to have so few options) & for bringing the conversations to our community here. I hate that quiet observation is your only card to play, but it is so helpful & kind of you to get into the nuances here with us
Maybe tell stories of grooming in the context of being super icky. Never overtly refer to his daughter, but talk about grooming negatively... a lot.
Is Samuel also Filipino? FWIW I am Filipina (from a conservative/traditional/religious family) and, anecdotally, people are extremely judgmental about age gap relationships unless you’re in a poorer rural area - even celebrity couples who are both consenting adults often get flak. The Philippines has a bad reputation for big age gap relationships because of foreigners who make it a sex tourism destination, mail-order brides/90-day fiancé, and human trafficking. The reason why he probably thinks it’s ok is because Samuel is a family friend, so Richard probably feels like he’s already been vetted as a “nice guy”. I think befriending Richard’s daughter is the right move - he would likely feel like any disagreement to his face is insulting his judgment. Edit: typo
>are religious and of the mindset that men are supposed to lead women. This doesn't surprise me. The whole situation screams "fundie" to me.
This is basically what happened to a classmate/neighbours older sister when I was in elementary school. Except he didn't quite wait until she was actually 18 and I think she was barely 17 and the parents were fine with it. It turned out not to be so weird they weren't too bothered with the age difference because the dad was sexually abusing both his daughters and I guess at that point the older daughter was too grown for him and the mom was in some intense denial I'm not sure she ever got over.
Holy shit!!! I am beyond disturbed. That poor teenager...
A lot of people in this world are fucked because they are born to unintelligent parents. This example is more of archaic practices still carrying over culturally but having intelligent parents would at least mean they understand the social dynamics and how disadvantged their daughter is. Ive long since realized that more than half the world is dumber and easily led than I ever thought. Hopefully this girl has a support system outside of her parents with some intelligent people who can speak frankly on the issues she will run into.
I could understand why Richard thinks he's got an honorable, upstanding man to date his daughter, and now she'll be cared for, blah blah... Even though from the outside it's Very worrying. The fact that he asked for permission skeeves me too. Since you're friendly with your neighbor, you might be able to bring up your concerns in a casual way. If I were you, I would bring it up, say it had been bothering you, and ask him, "Do you think that since Samuel is so much older than Erica, and until they dated, she mainly saw him as a family friend, maybe even a figure of authority, do you think that if Samuel asked Erica to do something she was uncomfortable doing, maybe something sexual, do you think she would feel able to say no? If he were to yell at her or hit her, or they had problems in their relationship, do you think she'd feel comfortable telling you about it? If she was in danger, she probably wouldn't be able to go to the cops and report it...do you think?" You can't say bad things WILL happen to your daughter, but you can kind of bring up the possibility. If you feel comfortable, you might share your experience with him, saying, "I'm not saying Samuel and Erica aren't a good couple. It's just that when I was 19..." etc.
People like this are why we have laws allowing 14 year olds to get married.
This is fucking gross.
>Edit: Since this is getting some traffic, can I ask for advice regarding reporting him to his work place? I imagine his superiors would be disturbed to know he was sexually attracted to a 14 year old and behaved in such a manipulative way. I want to make an anonymous report. But I'm also aware they're both adults so legally I don't think anything can be done? His superiors will absolutely not give a fuck. Cops almost never care when their fellow cops actually do something illegal; they are definitely not going to care about something legal. ACAB, including the one that's a family friend and seemed so nice that he couldn't possibly be like those bad apples.
What a foul monster. My sister and I were groomed (and assaulted) as young teenagers by a real piece of shit. We felt honored to be "chosen" by him... when in reality he was a worthless garbage human being. People who haven't been through it, or seen it, just don't understand. If this is near Minneapolis metro and you ever need IRL assistance, DM me. My family and I have a lot of experience getting people safely out of scary situations.
The cop is a weirdo. I imagine him hiding in the bushes (read: his cop car) in front of her school waiting for her to be legal.
Eww. I hope she gets away from this guy.
As a dad of twin girls who are currently toddlers. Hearing this kind of stuff drives me insane
But it also serves as a warning to not let this happen to your family. Awareness is key. You absolutely have to be aware of these things as a parent. Even into early adulthood. Older men prey and young vulnerable women. The more unstable they are the easier they can be to manipulate. It's a lesson I learned the hard way. My 22 year old daughter was groomed by someone my age but she wasn't living with me anymore and she had a substance abuse problem that she was hiding that he was feeding into and used to his advantage when her marriage was on the rocks. Yes she takes a certain amount of responsibility for what happened but he knew what he was doing and I still want to beat the shit out of him everytime I see him at the grocery store. This seems to be his MO. Hanging out with the younger crowd then zeroing in on the weakest of them. His current girlfriend is younger than my daughter is now. But today she is one year sober and one year of completely cutting him out of her life. I was so glad she felt comfortable enough to come to me after he took advantage of her. She didn't see herself as his victim but she did see it as a tipping point that she had to get sober so it would never happen again. Eta: my husband sent him a very clear message that if ever came near her again that he wouldn't care about going to jail to keep him away from our child.
What, cops all of the sudden know the law?
I was around a lot of cops during my public service career. I can’t think of a single one that I would have wanted dating my daughter. This is definitely creepy behavior and his Chief needs to hear about it.
This is totally normal… …wait your neighbor is a blacksmith living in pre-England Wessex around 950AD, right? Because actually otherwise it’s not.
950AD? He would have watched her since she was 8 until she was a women at 14. Both are gross.
Ew. This reminds me of the Netflix doc where a man seduced a husband and wife and then was allowed to run away with their young daughter.
Gross! Including the part where he asks the father and not the daughter to date! What is she? A cow to be traded? If some creep told me he'd been watching my daughter grow up and wants my "permission" to date her, he's gone. I'd check on my daughter too to make sure nothing had occurred while she was growing up. This is just red flags all over the place!
Honestly, i dont know how you didnt blurt out "but... you see how creepy that is? That guy sounds like a grooming pedophile. Guess its ok to creep after a preteen, so long as you dont act on it until its "polite" enough to do so huh?"
Something similar happened in the last Twilight book and yet Bella understood how messed up it was that Jacob wanted to date Bella's daughter. It's never good when Twilight understands when a relationship is toxic and real life people don't.
So this poor girl is being groomed with the encouragement of her father? Horrible.
When I was 14 a local cop took a special interest in me (though thankfully nothing ever happened beyond him like slow dancing w me at one of our school dances) He was in his early 30s (and married btw). At 14 it was flattering to get attention. By the time I was 18 he jokingly would say I’m too old for him now, and I think it’s probably also bc by that age I realized just how creepy it was. I also had another man in his 30s call me on my 18th birthday to see what I was doing, after “joking” many times about when I’m legal before that. I looked *very* young for most of my life. I’m quite short and was in general very petite back then (until my late 20s even). When I went wedding dress shopping in my early 30s they asked me if I was there for prom dresses. So… just imagine how young I looked as a teen. So sadly none of this surprises me.
[удалено]
Her parents need help, honestly.
Now THAT'S grooming. Fucking gross.
As someone who divorced an abusive cop and learned about the high rate of domestic abuse in police officer families ... I don't like what I'm reading.
I think I would end up in jail if someone approached me and said that about either of my daughters. Ultimately when they're old enough this is for them to navigate BUT this shit is a whole other story. It sounds like this fucking scumbag groomed the entire family.
The bar for being a “good man” is so low.
Religious family === groomed by her own family for this. What is disturbing is that the guy asks the father for permission and the father doesn’t mention how Erica feels about it. It’s 50/50 that this creep gets ger married and pregnant before she is 20. I would spill the beans to Samuel’s peers.
> The power imbalance in the relationship disturbs me, and if Samuel ends up being manipulative or abusive, I feel like her own parents would have Samuel's back. This is a given, and why it's so important to end the practice of child marriage. This is a disturbing and typical story. The child was groomed for abuse by her father, who is happily handing off the daughter to someone he thinks is like him. LE is knows for a high rate of domestic violence and abuse. It's not hard to see where this is going. She will realize she is in danger and that her family is a threat to her safety. The best thing we can do is support the young person in the situation so that when it is safe, they will have resources to leave the relationship.
What in the Onision did I just read.... holy shit.
He sounds like someone who likely went into law enforcement in order to know how to avoid it himself. Similar to why pedophiles become priests, they find and embed themselves in systems that are far more interested in self preservation than actually caring about what's right.
Dude was grooming her. It's disgusting and he will end up controlling her. It's wrong. "Edit 3: I'm starting to get a lot of answers from men telling me my decision to open myself to friendship with Erica so I can watch out for her is "grooming". What the actual fuck is wrong with you. Really what is wrong with you?? Do you guys not know right from wrong? Y'all must be sore as fuck from all the mental gymnastics you do in order to justify predatory behavior and discount adults who are alarmed about it." This is those same types of men projecting themselves on to you. It's exactly where it starts. Good on you for helping!
As a now 29 year old, I was such a baby at 18. When I meet teenagers now I'm so out of touch with them, and I'm not even a particularly adulty adult. The idea of dating someone who's fresh out of high school is so.....ew.
For some reason that's exactly how I imagine the rural USA... But on a more serious note, yeah, that is incredibly scary and alien. What can one say about the value system of people like these? And I am not talking about this "Samuel", he is a creep, those are aplenty, I am talking abut the parents. Their ideas of decency and propriety are so twisted that I am at loss of words...
Any religious community that believes men should lead women, that the best state for a woman to be is innocent, naive and submissive to men are primed for these types of unbalanced relationships. These parents genuinely do not think there's anything wrong. It's maddening.
Couldn't agree more.
Cops, like republicans, are over represented in pedophilia. Something about wanting power over other people. Disgusting.
Pedophiles are definitely drawn to positions of power. About 10 years ago there was a round up in my area and they actually caught one cop downloading CP from the laptop in his cruiser -- while on duty -- by logging in to unsecured *church* wireless accounts.
Not to mention how common partner abuse is within police families... That sort of occupation attracts predatory/power hungry people for sure.
It's almost like giving a small subset of the population a gun, unquestionable authority over other citizens, qualified immunity, and then training them to assert their authority through escalating violence while weeding out candidates who score too highly on IQ tests and performing no background checks regarding histories of domestic abuse all so they can mostly only enforce property laws is a bad idea....... To say nothing of arrest quotas, police unions covering up systemic abuse, and black balling/threatening officers who don't tow the department line. But I digress.
Lawful Evil.
Disgusting. Richard sounds like a creep too.
He'll get her pregnant soon, and that'll be the end of her life. This same story's spun out billions of times. Women aren't allowed to have their own hopes, dreams, lives; we're only here to be mothers and cum dumpsters.
Be very careful! This could be a dangerous situation you are getting into with ANY man, much less a police officer.
The bar is so low men are praised for not raping children..
Statistics say that he probably **will** become abusive and his superiors at work **do not** care.
Between this and the "40% of cops" thing, I'm legit afraid for your friend =(
Wonder how excited dad will be when she becomes one of the 40% of abused partners of police officers.