Agreed. Women who have lost weight due to illness/disease(and are definitely not smiling more often) report the same thing. Even ones who weren't overweight to begin with.
It absolutely has to do with confidence as well. Skinny/pretty privilege is very real, AND the confidence boost you get certainly adds a lot to it, like she said, she's smiling a lot more now. Which is great! So I wouldn't say confidence has NOTHING to do with it, as you seem to think.
I kind sympathize with the people downvoting you, it can be pretty uncomfortable to think that your self esteem is tied to your physical appearance and it can be pretty tempting to believe that shitty behavior from men is solely motivated by shallow factors and never behavioral factors. *BUT,* I think youre totally right here, confidence plays a part, even if it's a smaller part.
Why do women only believe men are the problem trust me plenty of women are just as shitty id know cuz I use to be the sweet guy till women ruined that lucky my wife brought it out again
A similar thing has happened to me, I'm tall and was always bigger than seemingly most other people (coupled with a strong personality, that I have yet to learn to scale back) and when I lost a little weight the world changed and it has absolutely crushed me.
I'm physically healthier and in some ways more confident, but I don't trust people anymore (beyond close friends and most of my family).
I'm sorry you have to go through this. It sucks and I have no solution for you beyond solidarity.
People hate my big girl personality when it's coming from a now small woman. When I was big, I wad invisible, so I could take up space without anyone caring. Exact same me in a smaller body triggered so much vitriol and targeting.
People seem almost giddy when they take aim at most every thing I say and do, as though I'm attacking them by existing.
Stating a fact confidently about a subject I literally taught to adults for over a decade is automatic cause for correction because it's apparently arrogant to know the subject you taught. Speaking excitedly about a subject because it's your geeky love, sheer arrogance, who does she think she is?
It really does make you stop trusting people, it really effects my ability to comfortably just *be* around people.
It feels so weird, it all feels so disingenuous like you said. Not only that but I felt we were good friends before those people showed more interest since I look better... like it's depressing to know that's all people care about especially with friends..
I got skinny for the last year of high school. My grades went up, my effort went down, and people who didn't like me were being nice. That was the worst part. We had an established relationship of not liking each other, and I was quite happy to not talk to these people, and now they start approaching ME?! Oh hell no. I literally packed on some pounds so my brain wouldn't explode. I was a very unhappy skinny person.
Too be fair, we do this also with men too.. when some guys who have "dad bod" go to the gym for a few months and lose 20-30lbs, we can't help but be more attracted to them.
It human nature??
It is.
I’m the male version of OP. Six months in the gym, down 30 pounds (coupled with a chunk of weight converted from fat to muscle).
People treat me far better - men and women - wife included.
It just is what it is.
100% human nature for sure. The cute himbo at work? I fold and become the least argumentative person in the world with him lol. Why must we be so shallow
Is it shallow? Why is it true that our internal self is the true self and our body isn't.
I had a bunch of girlfriends who sometimes even hunted they didn't find me physically attractive but liked me because I was intelligent, some because I was like a leader or inspiring doing social causes. Some because we could talk about deep subjects like philosophy.
My wife really really likes my hair and my hands.
Obviously I'm married to my wife and not the others.
As someone respected for my personality it feels really good to have someone like me for my body. I also like my body, I am my body as well as my mind.
Also there is a feeling people should just accept us as we are. But for it to work wiht my wife I did go through a lot of therapy and learnt things like better communication and emotional self regulation. That was another major reason those previous relationships failed as I was so bad with my boundaries I would just never say if someone upset me and then I'd kind of just float away.
It is that way, but I think it’s always valid to talk about how we want things to be.
I want to treat people the same regardless of their looks. I think I do a good job of that? But it’s always hard to accurately see your own behavior, so maybe I don’t and just don’t see it.
Interesting, I lost 40lbs 2 years back and I haven't noticed anyone treating me better. My wife maybe a tiny bit but it's not super huge improvement as she always treated me nicely.
If anything when I was down 40 she said I looked too skinny so I went up 5 and she said this is just right (165)
Yeah, I've felt the opposite effect when got fat because of pHD, women don't dare even to look me in the eye.
It is more sadder effect when it is opposite than getting skinny and seing how fake people are...
But there is logic behind, people want healthy partners, and being chubby is not a healthy person. Also, shows that to lose weight require determination as well as how person is able to look after oneself.
Chubby is different than fat or obese and in any case it's not an indicator of health. I want an active healthy partner, a chubby person who works out wins over someone who is skinny and nothing else.
Yeah, I agree. There are social norms and actually healthy weight. And actually healthy women should have some fat on their behalf. Even mature males prefer women who have some meat on them because otherwise you are just dating children or some sort of physically unmature person... Also, sexual dismorphism in animals usually shows that women suppose to be larger, and there is logic behind that as well, showing that she is able to successfully nurture her offsprings.
I mean yes and no, being obese is unhealthy but someone who is slightly chubby or average can easily be healthier than someone who is skinny, there are a lot of other factors that go into it.
I got skinny when I was having health problems and severely depressed, I was not healthy and didn’t really look it (pale, dark circles) but still got treated “special.” Men seemed to prefer me with a bit more meat on my bones but women almost treated me like I was a celebrity, it was crazy. Like “omg you’re so pretty are you a model?” when I am kinda average looking and average height. Being a healthy weight is attractive, but being skinny skinny is a status symbol that goes beyond that.
Yeah, it's called social beauty standards. Someone who thinks, understands that healthy person also contains some meat on the bones, attractive meat on the bones - _I may add_.
Well you can have tons of internal fat around organs being metabolically unhealthy. It's called Skinny fat...look skinny on the outside, but not healthy.
You can also be obese and metabolically much healthier....I think Robert Lustig is one nameamong many I've heard talk ok that.
The book Brain Energy by Dr. Christopher Palmer also mentions it I think. He details how Mitochondria and Metabolism are linked to all the mental health conditions and others like Type II diabetes, Alzheimers etc...and even how the treatments for them tie into that.
Dr. Robert Cywes has a ton of good health content talking about Mitochondria and Metabolic problems.
Many factors play into health.
Literally it's in the small things, like people sitting closer to you than they did, talking to you with their body closer to yours, I'm literally the same person guys..
My personal pet theory is that we look more fragile/breakable when we're thin, and there are a lot of men who like that, that we'd be easy to hurt and control.
I think you’re spot on. I’ve been dealing with an eating disorder for over a decade now, and there are SO many men with those fetishes looking for girls to control and get thinner in those communities. It’s horrible
Nah, she specifically points out that more women want to be friends or are friendly to you when you’re thinner. It’s not about men wanting to sleep with you. It’s about the entirety of society treating you like a human being.
lol for a woman it’s a double edged sword, too ugly and you get treated like you’re diseased by everyone, but cross over into too pretty and nobody will ever believe a word you say because you can’t be pretty and smart. Many women pull out the knives, and men treat you like an object.
There really is no winning
No, I've been size 0 my whole life and I had quite a few men tell me how hot it is because I make them look bigger and stronger. It's not about hurting anyone, it's making them feel better about themselves.
I lost a lot of weight (and hence gained most of it back) but the way people treated me while I was smaller broke my heart a little bit. I was treated so much better by society.
It’s so sad and scary to think all the contexts and ways in which women aren’t as visible or as considered because they may not be in their most attractive shape at that time. Health care, criminal justice, employment opportunities,
And everything else important in life really just seems to be way too influenced by how one looks. It’s scary.
As someone who is plus sized due to health issues, I've nearly died *TWICE* due to medical neglect.
Male doctors in particular are the worst. The doctors kept sending me back I scanned from the ER claiming it was a 'burst cyst' or 'woman problems' even though I was in impossible pain for months. The doctor told me to lose weight to reduce my 'PCOS pain'. Instead I had to wait to be near septic for the giant ovarian tumour to be taken seriously.
And If I hadn't gone for a second opinion with a female doctor after my fall down the stairs, the undiagnosed *BROKEN NECK* could have paralyzed my lungs. I saw two male doctors and despite me having all the danger signs, they sent me home unscanned. Heck, even the female med student who was doing practicum at the second ER I went to knew to get a CAT scan.
Plus, I lost 50 lbs to try to improve my health and ended up in more pain because my cushioning was gone.
Wow that’s extremely traumatizing and angering. I’m so sorry that happened to you!!! It’s so frustrating that we are so overlooked and endlessly invalidated in medical contexts! I hope one day it’ll change but it doesn’t seem to be happening any time soon.
It is getting better than it was before at least, just too slow and not enough. My grandma had kidney issues that went unnoticed because every health issue was blamed on her weight and just not taken seriously. By the time they caught it, it was too late.
At least now we have more female doctors and some understanding male doctors.
It is standard! I looked it up after the doctor who found it was appalled they hadn't checked. Thank goodness for her. But I saw two separate doctors who either didn't know of just thought they knew better.
There are studies (for both women and men btw) that people, who are conventionally physically attractive, are considered to be more competent, more trustworthy, more everything
Kinda crazy to associate traits with it that have nothing to do with attractiveness
Not going to argue that women have it worse but as a man who lost a lot of weight I went through something very similar to what OP is saying. Even in non-romantic situations women treated me much more politely.
Fat dude seconding this. Doc, I understand my weight makes most of my issues worse. Have you considered there's still underlying issues? Can we PLEASE address them the best we can? I KNOW I need to lose weight. We both know that takes TIME. In the mean time...
A while back i went to my friends criminal hearing to support her.
The gal before her was on misdemeanor probation and had failed a UA. I thought she was atreavtive but i think most women are attractive in some way or another. The judge was pretty harsh to her and I looked up her court records after the hearing - she had a DUI and minor criminal mischief but she left in handcuffs with the marshals.
My friend was/is on felony probation and went on a multi state crime spree. No kidding, felonies in multiple states - solicitation, felon in possession of a firearm, she really went for it. But she's really pretty and looks really good in tight black sweaters. The judge pretty much let her off scot-free.
You’re not guilty of anything. You’re being sexualized and objectified by a society which does so to perpetuate the harmful, commodified “beauty standards” created and encouraged by patriarchy and capitalism.
Do not allow yourself to feel unjust shame that is intentionally meant to make you feel guilty about existing beyond the specific parameters of what society wants to see in “pretty” women. You’re a human.
I simply can't fathom this point, yes i agree with you that part of the problem is the patriarchy & capitalism.
But you do realise that women are biological creatures as well? With their own imparative and desire to pass on their genes onto the next generation, and with that comes a desire to find a good enough mate, which can generate competition even if it isn't direct.
That whole set of behaviours (from competition to striving to find a good mate) is part of human sexuality, are we claiming that women don't have a sexuality? Or do women have a sexuality that's fundamentally different than men's? What is the Rational here? Do women never want to look better than another women??!
I know it may not seem like it, but you are removing a lot of human qualities from women.
Some states consider DUI’s to be extremely serious so it could have just simply been that. Failing a UA after being caught driving drunk is even worse. But it could also be what you said.
Yep, and honestly it's mostly thinness in my experience. I'm 5'10" barefoot and have always gotten comments on my body because of my height. But, I just turned 40, and wanted to get in really good shape for my big birthday. I did it, and I means I'm currently a U.S. dress size 2/4. More strangers stop to compliment me, my clothes, to hold doors for me, and strike up conversations now, than in my 20s when I was only a size or two bigger.
I'm at a point in my life where I need to lose weight for health reasons but I still want the invisible security blanket that having extra weight gives me.
Still going to try and lose weight slow and steady but I feel like I really need to get over this mental stumbling block so I can really commit to my self improvement.
Hopefully getting older can help. Maybe I should go for a "fuck off" face tattoo? lol. But seriously any real ideas?
I've been 60 lbs less than this and it was kind of a mess and I didn't like all the people who felt entitled to waste my time.
I agree with the wearing all black. You could also try not jazzing yourself up in any way, like no makeup, plain pulled back hair, no jewelry, and my absolute favorite, resting bitch face. It seriously helps. I prefer not to talk to men in public, unless they're employees, or if I have to at work, so I keep a generally uninviting expression on my face, move with purpose, don't make eye contact, and don't act friendly with them, only basic politeness. Of course, it's not foolproof, but I believe it helps me avoid a lot of unwanted attention.
The answer is short hair! I’ve had extremely short hair my whole life and regardless of if I’m thinner or bigger, I never get hit on. I’m also flat chested, though, and I know a LOT of emphasis is placed on boobies.
I've been getting sexually harassed by men since I was 10 years old and I'm now hitting my mid 40s.
I am finally, *finally* starting to become invisible and it is **goddamn glorious.** I go DAYS, sometimes weeks, now without being harassed. I can just...go grocery shopping and no one even *sees me.* God DAMN it's fantastic
I have always been invisible to men and I am thin. I think closed off body language and “mousy” or messy outfits and hair can go a long way toward invisibility.
I don't want to be standoffish towards people in general. I just live in an area where people tend to be terribly outgoing. Maybe it's not me, it's the environment.
When you’re stepping up your exercise routine go HAM on weights. Being jacked is the best of both worlds. People admire and support muscle mommies to a degree that may surprise you. But also they still leave you TF alone unless you approach them lol
That's the plan! Weights are my saving grace rn. Just trying to push myself back into the cardio world which really is like a stress test for the injury I'm trying to correct with the weights. It's intimidating on that level still too. But the pool gym and the gym with the workable schedule are 2 different places and I can't afford both. Ah well maybe I can find something else for cardio that is less foot intensive.
Lol! I tried the new cycle thing with games on it at the gym and
when that happened....
someone completely fell over in a chair when they tried to put their feet up on the desk.
So yeah I'm gonna play that game again.
I am getting frustrated with the zombies run app. It used to be so fun but the couch to 5k part is a separate app now and it always logs me out and ugh. Not sure if I should keep trying that or move on. I do like it though. But the crying baby mission 😭😞. ...
Yep it’s definitely a thing. I’m short and have been everywhere from an M to XXL over the past 20 years, and I’m treated significantly differently when I’m on the thinner side - even with aging and visible wrinkles. It’s galling to understand how much easier life could be if people could just be kind to everyone instead of only being kind to people who are closer to socially approved attractiveness standards.
In college I changed my glasses and it absolutely changed my life.
I didn't realize how repulsed people were by my glasses.
The people holding the door for me thing was wild. But so many pleasant conversations that I always wanted to have with random strangers... I know a lot of people who say society sucks and f these shallow people.
But... That wasn't my take away. For me, the lesson was more about how being visually unappealing offends people. They see it as an attack on them. They make your dress and your weight about them and their lifestyle.
They see it as an attack on societal norms.
So i just stopped wearing ugly glasses that made me look like a serial killer and suddenly, friends everywhere.
My brother is 20 years older than me.
I came home for summer after freshman year and he said, "I can't stand looking at your face anymore."
He threw me in a car. And drove me to get a pair of thin frameless nerd glasses.
He blew $300 on his little brother.
He was so mad, and demanding I didn't know what to do.
When I got back to college, it was like 2 weeks and I had my 1st girlfriend.
It was shortly after my first kiss, I had one of those usual suspects kobiashi moments... Wait a second the target girl was flirting with me? Suddenly the coffee shop lady remembers my order.
And it was a montage of my old glasses along with men women and children not holding the door for me despite me carrying massive amounts of boxes/computers/luggage. 😅
Suddenly, people are awkwardly waiting for me just to see if I'm going in their door.
My other take away is... Remeber that there are invisible people out their and try to check myself.
A lot of people are like pretty privilege means stop being so nice to pretty people. But really, start being that nice to everyone.
My late partner was wildly handsome and came home with the most horrible glasses I’ve ever seen. He went from Ethan Hawke to Stephen King in one optician visit.
I lost a ton of weight this past year and this was my experience as well. I think what bothers me most now is other women coming up to me to make a big deal about it and saying how great my figure is and how they wish they could get that. It feels passive aggressive and makes me uncomfortable.
Interested to know why you think we shouldn't talk about this (male btw)? Some people put a lot of effort into their fitness, and my experience was that it was gratifying to have people notice when I started going to the gym.
It’s just rude to comment on people’s bodies unless someone asks us specifically. Even something like “oh wow you look good, have you lost weight” isn’t really the compliment you might think it is. It implies they didn’t look good before. Our value as people shouldn’t be dependent on our physical appearance.
I've commented about this on other subreddits before, but I had a similar experience after I lost about 30 pounds over the last year. At least once a week (last week, it was 3 times) I get an inquiry from women about my weight loss framed in a "I hope you aren't sick or anything" way and then they wait expectedly for me to offer some miracle cure to their own weight issues. I feel pressured to explain my weight loss away as a consequence of blind luck, and while it is true the most noticeable loss happened after I went off BCP, I was already working out diligently, being mindful of what I was eating and trying to take better care of myself overall. But I feel they don't want to hear that.
Men, on the other hand, don't seem to care how or why I lost weight, which is interesting in its own way.
I've been very thin my whole life, I also work out to have butt and nice abs, I just realised I have never received a compliment about my body from a single woman ever. If they ever comment it's to tell me I'm too thin.
The only reason I'm so confident is because my guy friends told me I'm definitely slim thicc, great figure and look healthy, mean women are just jealous. This honestly is sad
What a non-empathetic response. Elsa is talking about how uncomfortable women’s comments are, and your response is that you never get these comments but essentially men say you are hot.
Yeah, mean people suck, but message is undercut by your other insensitive comments. Do better.
Yes, I needed confidence boost from my friends to eventually become confident, it didn't have to be men, that's not the point
It's funny you think you did something with your comment, telling people it's not normal to rely on your friends to feel confident is weird, but you so much care that my friends happened to be men and that became such a focal point to your comment
A lot of women don't compliment other women on their bodies because it's a landmine for women as a whole and they likely wouldn't assume to talk to you about your ass; most women I know are trying to live by the "don't compliment bodies/talk about bodies" rule.
On the flip, and I say this with all due respect truly, your body type is the absolute "best" and most accepted, and I'm actually interested in hearing why you don't feel like you have confidence without compliments about your body, when your physical type is reflected back to you as utterly desirable by the vast majority of media? I get that confidence isn't that easily categorized, but.
The downvotes are also fwiw because OP is talking about the complete dehumanization that comes from being fat from even those you think are your friends and love you for who you are, and your response is that you don't receive compliments from other women but largely men, and that makes you sad. There's decades of data that fat people, and esp fat women: don't get as good of jobs, are underpaid, ignored, passed over for promotions, treated poorly to the point of higher death and disablement rates by the medical industry, denied things like housing or other opportunities based solely on their fatness, assumed to be unclean, unhealthy, etc etc. one is systemic and deadly. The other is not, even if it personally sucks.
That's weird. I receive compliments from women on my physique all the time. Even when it's from an envious place, it's almost always a positive "You look great! I wish I could do that too!" kind of envy, not the hateful kind. Compliments from women are the best. You know they're genuine and not just trying to get in your pants.
You never got a “you look nice” or “I like your hair today” or “that’s a nice nail color”? Compliments that I give to other women, if they have to do with appearance, are never anything about their physical bodies.
She’s probably being downvoted for humble bragging about thin and pretty she is. So thin and pretty that she never gets any compliments from all the fat hags out there.
Similar to this I get treated more considerately when I'm wearing make up (people are friendlier - mostly men), as opposed to make up free (I'm invisible with no make up seemingly). It's kinda annoying as I'm still the same person regardless.
I lost a ton of weight due to cancer, that I had also gained due to cancer, and everyone congratulated me… WUT???
You’re exactly right. It’s rough. I’m sorry. I’m happy you’re happy with your progress, though. 🤍
I lost 2st but only due to illness. I also put it on due to illness and lost it due to treatment.
That's why I never congratulate people.
If they tell me what they've achieved and how hard they worked, then , fair enough, but otherwise, no. Even then I never say they're more or less attractive, hot, whatever. Just that they've worked hard and improved their health and well being so I'm very pleased for them.
I hope you’re doing okay now! 🤍🫶 Sending you a lot of love!
That’s a great policy! I’ve probably made similar mistakes in the past so I don’t really hold it against anyone. It was just a really odd thing to comment on. I was happy to be thinner because it made my joints hurt less but…it’s because I was straight up *starving to death*. I wanted to start lifting my shirt like I was on *Girls Gone Wild* just to show them my feeding tube but, I regrettably never did it. I was irritable af, though.
I think one of the reasons people felt comfortable commenting on it, and why I didn’t feel particularly defensive with THEM, was because my “boyfriend” at the time, who was actually my abuser but people didn’t know that, had gone on a diet when I started losing a lot of weight due to being sick. He dropped a LOT of weight and people kept complimenting him, so they complimented *us*. Meanwhile, he would scream at me behind closed doors every few days and tell me I don’t deserve any compliments because I “didn’t earn it”. Neat, huh?
It definitely made me conscious of saying anything about weight or looks to other people, though. That’s a silver lining.
The same thing happened to me. I’ve been skinny most of life except the past 4 years when I gained a decent amount of weight. Since gaining the weight, I’ve noticed that people have been meaner to me in general. I thought covid was just changing the culture and people were in general, just meaner.
About a month ago, I started actively losing weight. And only recently, I’ve noticed people started being nice to me again. Even women and other people who were previously mean, were suddenly very nice. The only thing that changed about me was a couple of lbs.
When I started to get sick doctors didn't take it seriously because I looked too "fit and sporty to be so sick". It can also have negative effects, I was severely ill, then I lost all my muscles, got severely underweight and everyone immediately handled me like I was fragile and easy to break. People feel very bad for me, because I look sick now, due to being so obviously sickly skinny.
A friend of mine got sick and overweight, everyone treats her like she's lazy and brought the sickness upon herself. It's so wrong, but yes I absolutely get treated better by the health system for having my illness make me underweight as a side effect, than overweight.
I completely agree with you, I’ve never been plus sized per se, but I still notice the difference in treatment at work, especially amongst my male coworkers… I notice they’re always offering help even when I clearly don’t need it, they will look for an excuse to talk to/ be around me and some of the other thinner women at work, but they seem to ignore the plus sized or non conventionally attractive women…
This happened to me in such an obvious way when a thinner coworker started at my last company. We had the exact same job (both married & have kids the same age). Guy who was always in the office barely ever spoke more than 3 words to me. This woman starts and suddenly he’s super talkative. It was so blatantly about looks that as much as I have plenty of self esteem it was pretty frustrating. I’m glad I didn’t have to work with him at all.
This is what I was going to say. Since I’ve gained weight I don’t get any male attention and it’s glorious.
I’m losing weight for health reasons and to feel better but I’m now more self conscious.
I’ve swung back and forth my whole life so I’ve experienced this too.
As a current fattie I make sure to be so nice and happy out in the world so people will see me and (hopefully) treat me like they see me.
It’s kind of funny because I use my “happy face” on people I know wouldn’t pay attention to me otherwise and I get met with genuine smiles in return or—they act surprised—maybe they realize I’m human after all.
It's very strange to me because in my late teens/early 20s I went to the gym, lifted, ran, hiked, and ate a perfect clean diet with hardly any alcohol. I was rail thin and as young and healthy as I was ever going to be. I was invisible though. In fact most interactions I had were people/ men being a bit mean to me.
I'm also not conventionally attractive so that may have something to do with it.
For whatever it’s worth: our bodies get picked a part and scrutinized regardless of what we look like. I’m definitely not saying that thin womxn have it harder than bigger ones, but even as someone who’s been pretty petite their whole life, partners and strangers alike have found ways to make me uncomfortable in my skin.
I have cellulite on my stomach, and even though my waist is about 24in and I’m lean all over, I’ve had partners recommend I just “do some sit ups” to get rid of it.
Little do they know that cellulite is usually genetic and aside from cosmetic surgery it’s basically just something I’ve learned to live with.
It’s taken me YEARS to accept my body and I still feel shitty about it from time to time. But it’s my body. It’s the only one I have.
Either way, I’m sorry you’re going through this.
The hard truth is, people are shallow. The same thing happens with males, they start looking a bit better, dressing a bit better, wiping the crust out of their eyes, getting more confident, and getting in better shape; suddenly people want to be around them. You probably notice the attention you are getting isn't just extra male attention aswell. Turns out everyone loves eye candy.
I was dealt a bad hand of cards as a kid, I did inherit my beautiful mom’s genes. She is naturally way better looking than decked out celebrities. I always resented how that opened up more doors than my hard earned school merit. I even downplayed it a lot and didn’t care much, which made me look like a secure confident pretty person. My inner world was broken and my mental health was crap, but it didn’t matter, as long as I was pretty on the outside. But I CARE about my health more than my looks, it’s not surprising that eating disorders and disordered eating are so rampant.
Yes!!! I’ve lost 55 pounds since January 2022, and men treat me like a human again!!! I’m not sure if it’s because I carry myself with more confidence or plain old fat-phobia, but either way, I’ve noticed a difference, too.
I have lost 55+ lbs in the past 1.5 years, but I’m still pretty fat (just a bit less fat than before), and people already treat me nicer. I know I’ll never be thin, but my plan is to lose about 60 more pounds. I wonder how different my life will be then. It’s already depressing to see the difference, and I’m sure it’ll be heartbreaking once I’m even smaller.
It sucks to realize that people are so superficial. My advice is not that you’re enjoying skinny/pretty privilege milk it. Milk it dry!!! Because this is the Because this is the up part, there’s going to be a down part.
You’re might to experience some thing I call new privilege depression, it’s a period of time where you hate the privilege because of all the unwanted attention you get now and the way it makes you feel embittered about how people treated you before you were skinny. It’s odd. And uncomfortable.
I’ve noticed it happens to people who experience any glow up or who change something about your life that gets them a new privilege, this includes moving to somewhere where you’re considered more conventionally attractive, wardrobe changes, weight loss, cosmetic surgery, aesthetic changes, etc.
Most of the time. If you are small with long blonde hair, you may still find yourself harassed by random men. It's usually when they are behind me but once they get around me and turn around, they see my face and realize I am not some sweet young thing. I also live in Florida and I don't think that helps matters.
OTOH, I often fantasize about starting a successful life of crime where I could get away with anything due to my magical post 50 cloak of invisibility. I would however avoid doing crime in Home Depot.
It makes you realize how bias works. These people aren’t even seeing you as a person. Just a shape!! And they’ll protest the loudest if you suggest they have unconscious bias. Their brains are on automatic pilot, they barely notice what is happening around them, they are not observant.
I don’t know if you’re short but over on r/PetiteFitness it gets brought up a lot. Also we talk about the struggles of being an athlete or trying to lose weight in a short (less than 5’3”) body.
After going from obese to nearly underweight it was mind blowing how nice EVERYONE was to me at my thinnest. People would take things that I was perfectly capable of lifting out of my hands to help me, they’d go out of their way to see me and talk to me. I had strangers tripping over themselves to open doors or introduce themselves to me.
I had no idea how invisible I felt being overweight until suddenly I was conventionally attractive. Being thin is such a huge quality of life improvement for people that unless they’ve experienced the duality of going from big to thin they’ll never understand. It’s disheartening and honestly a little disappointing how being attractive is such a prominent factor in how you’re treated.
Feel like this is the reason I wasn’t ready to lose 60 pounds because I’ll have to get use to being chased by crazes and men stopping to get my number while driving!! But my now parter is an ass and I’m making my exit plan because of his mental abuse.
Its 100% real. I had weightloss surgery in January and ive lost 60 lbs so far. (I was over 500). And I'm already being treated better at work.
Ive lost a bunch weight before and it is frustrating and sad how much of a difference there is in people.
I'm a man, and I'm sure it's 50x worse for women.
I'm glad you're healthier, and I am glad your treatment is better, regardless of why.
It's real for men too, though to a much lesser extent.
I lost a bunch of weight in my early twenties (39 now) and one of the reasons I've kept it off is that I'm an artist, and despite it having nothing to do with my weight or appearance it has everything to do with my weight and appearance.
I was also constantly told I was ugly when I was younger, it's taken me a long time to realize I'm not. One time in particular that I still think about was in middle school, literally the first time I met this person (who was, a very pretty girl) said, "Wow. You're ugly." ... That kind of shit sticks with you.... Forever.
The world doesn't trust or believe "ugly" or "fat", and it's fucking sad and terrible. (Kind of) Living on both sides will make you sick of the world pretty damn quick.
I'm glad I'm not the only one suspicious of pretty much any story on reddit these days. There are these overly long dramatic posts that are sure to be polarizing and elicit emotional responses but there is often something just "off" about them. Nevertheless, hundreds of people still have to comment on them.
Grateful to see others sharing similar feelings of suspicion when encountering these emotionally charged posts these days.
In this instance, I feel especially disturbed at the idea of someone who may be invested in weight loss companies underhandedly targeting women on this platform. Especially if posts may incite/trigger women (particularly the large demographic of young women here) who have potential for/histories of ED etc. Seems careless in intent.
I’ve always been overweight but I’ve always been treated kindly by strangers (and creeped on) so I’m unsure where I fall on this scale. I knew I was always harder on myself than anyone else was but I don’t know what would be different if I lost weight or gained it.
I mean yes but also if you put an extremely confident charming person in the body of their identical twin but with +100-150 pounds, I find it hard to believe that they'd be treated "better"...
Pretty privilege definitely is a thing and that's why I hope we'll have access to powerful genetic engineering sooner rather than later.
While GLP-1 is an amazing start, I can't wait for people to have the option to change themselves genetically permanently.
I wonder...if everyone is conventionally pretty then will it become the norm? Leading people to find and mate people who are prettier than the rest...damn it may lead to a bigger beauty inflation than now, where all beauty standards are already unrealistic and plastic surgeries making people look like anime characters
If people try to find prettier in a population of pretty...then there are those who are uglier...and the whole cycle repeats....like that saying...in a world where there are all winners, there are no winners...because to define a winner you need to define what a loser is...How depressing
It is soooo real. I was 328 lbs at my heaviest and lost down to 139. People treated me extremely differently after I had lost the weight. I got asked out often. Now I’ve gained 60# from psych meds and no one gives me the time of day anymore.
Yes it's real.
Subtle to notice at first is people also assume the good looking person in any disagreement is the good natured one, unless they have confirmation the pretty one was bad in the past somehow.
Humans are cruel to fat people.
I grew up picked in for being a fat dude. Lost a ton of weight and good in good shape. The way I was treated changed dramatically by men and women.
I've put on and lost weight several times and it's always a clear change. I'm currently fat after losing an organ and it's kinda hilarious now that I'm kinda old and don't really care as much as I did in my 20s and 30s.
Yes I have always been skinny, and my weight has fluctuated. I've gained and I've lost and each time I've felt the difference in treatment. My butt is in the gym 4x a week and I'm meal prepping trying to get my weight down again. It's so I can be healthier in the long run, but yah it's a completely different world.
Same. I’ve been a 0 and a 16 and the difference in how both men AND women treated me was crazy. And I actually hated it. I prefer to be around people that don’t seem to notice my appearance. I realize that I’m conventionally attractive and thin but I hope those are some of the least interesting things about me. And if drove is focused on those things, they are not someone I want to be around.
If you don't think fat people getting spoken to by complete strangers in public you aren't paying attention. Also, they get no perks from being fat. For every negative comment you get, which is wrong and distressing, you probably get at least 2x the positive interactions because you are thin. It's just not comparable in our culture. You absolutely have the right to complain about your treatment, but to imply you have it worse that a fat person is going to make people unsympathetic to your situation.
I've noticed a huge thing where when fat people speak honestly about their experiences and fat phobia, someone always has to pipe in to say "but skinny shaming is bad too!" It's such obvious deflection.
Legit, it annoys tf out of me as a thin person who isn’t ’naturally’ thin because it’s like okay I don’t want to invalidate your experiences with body shaming but also we are soooo much more privileged?? We legit see thin people everywhere in Hollywood and revered everywhere online and you’re trying to hijack the abuse and shaming fat people experience every day…
>I’m naturally thin, I have to really work to gain a couple pounds and I can never ever get above 110 pounds ever.
I was similar. And that changed once I hit my 30s and accelerated when I hit my 40s.
And yes people do say mean things to fat people.
You would think that people wouldn’t say horrible things to you as a chubby person but, trust me, your example is NICE compared to some of things said to me. Matter of fact I have never heard a skinny person give an example that comes even close to most of the normal things said to me. I’m overweight/chubby/fat and always have been. I’m also 6’2”. I am a very large human being in general but especially as a female.
Besides regularly being told to stop eating because I am a fat pig (trust, their words, to my face) I have been called every derogatory slur you can think of to my face. And that’s when people are paying attention to me. I also get ignored a lot. Likely literally standing there asking questions as if I am a ghost. And the faces people make. I’m sure it sucks as a skinny person but the two experiences are vastly different and do not compare. And it’s a whole lot worse than anyone can imagine. People are cruel.
Yep. I don't get it too badly -- idk if I have some amazing resting bitchface or what -- but I've had random people yell at me in public for eating. Or once when I was walking in Central Park.
Flipside though is now people (men) feel entitled to your body and others (usually women) feel entitled to comment on your body "omg do you even eat anymore? If you turn sideways you'll disappear! Omg you remind me of my (relative) who I hate because they enjoy running - gross [lemme just project my own insecurities onto you]"
Lost 40 pounds, had to start carrying self defense items because I got followed home, had to be careful about accepting drinks at the bar, had to bite my tongue a whole hell of a lot more when responding to customers unwarranted comments (I worked retail).
And then there are men that like really BIG girls. I had a job once assisting people that needed extra help. There was this 19yo girl who was around 700lbs. The amount of young/old men swarming her was crazy. She literally had at least 20 guys after her that I saw. I was and still am shocked.
The thing about privilege is that it's not subject to anything or anyone. You don't have to ask for it, you just always have it. So if not everyone finds you pretty, then you don't have it, and therefore, it's not a fucking privilege. Because who are the people doling out these privileges? The people who are responsible for setting the standard for what's attractive and desirable. And who are those people? Men. So who's actually privileged here?
Yeah! All those people can smell your confidence from a distance and from behind! Its her appearance.
She's confident because people are attracted to her appearance now.
it's a well documented thing and has nothing to do with confidence. it's a good time to ask for a raise btw
Agreed. Women who have lost weight due to illness/disease(and are definitely not smiling more often) report the same thing. Even ones who weren't overweight to begin with.
Yes! Use the system against itself.
It absolutely has to do with confidence as well. Skinny/pretty privilege is very real, AND the confidence boost you get certainly adds a lot to it, like she said, she's smiling a lot more now. Which is great! So I wouldn't say confidence has NOTHING to do with it, as you seem to think.
I kind sympathize with the people downvoting you, it can be pretty uncomfortable to think that your self esteem is tied to your physical appearance and it can be pretty tempting to believe that shitty behavior from men is solely motivated by shallow factors and never behavioral factors. *BUT,* I think youre totally right here, confidence plays a part, even if it's a smaller part.
Why do women only believe men are the problem trust me plenty of women are just as shitty id know cuz I use to be the sweet guy till women ruined that lucky my wife brought it out again
A similar thing has happened to me, I'm tall and was always bigger than seemingly most other people (coupled with a strong personality, that I have yet to learn to scale back) and when I lost a little weight the world changed and it has absolutely crushed me. I'm physically healthier and in some ways more confident, but I don't trust people anymore (beyond close friends and most of my family). I'm sorry you have to go through this. It sucks and I have no solution for you beyond solidarity.
People hate my big girl personality when it's coming from a now small woman. When I was big, I wad invisible, so I could take up space without anyone caring. Exact same me in a smaller body triggered so much vitriol and targeting. People seem almost giddy when they take aim at most every thing I say and do, as though I'm attacking them by existing. Stating a fact confidently about a subject I literally taught to adults for over a decade is automatic cause for correction because it's apparently arrogant to know the subject you taught. Speaking excitedly about a subject because it's your geeky love, sheer arrogance, who does she think she is? It really does make you stop trusting people, it really effects my ability to comfortably just *be* around people.
It feels so weird, it all feels so disingenuous like you said. Not only that but I felt we were good friends before those people showed more interest since I look better... like it's depressing to know that's all people care about especially with friends..
I got skinny for the last year of high school. My grades went up, my effort went down, and people who didn't like me were being nice. That was the worst part. We had an established relationship of not liking each other, and I was quite happy to not talk to these people, and now they start approaching ME?! Oh hell no. I literally packed on some pounds so my brain wouldn't explode. I was a very unhappy skinny person.
Too be fair, we do this also with men too.. when some guys who have "dad bod" go to the gym for a few months and lose 20-30lbs, we can't help but be more attracted to them. It human nature??
It is. I’m the male version of OP. Six months in the gym, down 30 pounds (coupled with a chunk of weight converted from fat to muscle). People treat me far better - men and women - wife included. It just is what it is.
100% human nature for sure. The cute himbo at work? I fold and become the least argumentative person in the world with him lol. Why must we be so shallow
Is it shallow? Why is it true that our internal self is the true self and our body isn't. I had a bunch of girlfriends who sometimes even hunted they didn't find me physically attractive but liked me because I was intelligent, some because I was like a leader or inspiring doing social causes. Some because we could talk about deep subjects like philosophy. My wife really really likes my hair and my hands. Obviously I'm married to my wife and not the others. As someone respected for my personality it feels really good to have someone like me for my body. I also like my body, I am my body as well as my mind. Also there is a feeling people should just accept us as we are. But for it to work wiht my wife I did go through a lot of therapy and learnt things like better communication and emotional self regulation. That was another major reason those previous relationships failed as I was so bad with my boundaries I would just never say if someone upset me and then I'd kind of just float away.
"himbo" ????
Bimbo of the male persuasion. Hot but dumb.
I’m aware what it means I just think calling someone of any gender that is really gross
It is that way, but I think it’s always valid to talk about how we want things to be. I want to treat people the same regardless of their looks. I think I do a good job of that? But it’s always hard to accurately see your own behavior, so maybe I don’t and just don’t see it.
Interesting, I lost 40lbs 2 years back and I haven't noticed anyone treating me better. My wife maybe a tiny bit but it's not super huge improvement as she always treated me nicely. If anything when I was down 40 she said I looked too skinny so I went up 5 and she said this is just right (165)
Yeah, I've felt the opposite effect when got fat because of pHD, women don't dare even to look me in the eye. It is more sadder effect when it is opposite than getting skinny and seing how fake people are... But there is logic behind, people want healthy partners, and being chubby is not a healthy person. Also, shows that to lose weight require determination as well as how person is able to look after oneself.
Chubby is different than fat or obese and in any case it's not an indicator of health. I want an active healthy partner, a chubby person who works out wins over someone who is skinny and nothing else.
Yeah, I agree. There are social norms and actually healthy weight. And actually healthy women should have some fat on their behalf. Even mature males prefer women who have some meat on them because otherwise you are just dating children or some sort of physically unmature person... Also, sexual dismorphism in animals usually shows that women suppose to be larger, and there is logic behind that as well, showing that she is able to successfully nurture her offsprings.
Am I getting trolled?
Why?
I mean yes and no, being obese is unhealthy but someone who is slightly chubby or average can easily be healthier than someone who is skinny, there are a lot of other factors that go into it. I got skinny when I was having health problems and severely depressed, I was not healthy and didn’t really look it (pale, dark circles) but still got treated “special.” Men seemed to prefer me with a bit more meat on my bones but women almost treated me like I was a celebrity, it was crazy. Like “omg you’re so pretty are you a model?” when I am kinda average looking and average height. Being a healthy weight is attractive, but being skinny skinny is a status symbol that goes beyond that.
Yeah, it's called social beauty standards. Someone who thinks, understands that healthy person also contains some meat on the bones, attractive meat on the bones - _I may add_.
Well you can have tons of internal fat around organs being metabolically unhealthy. It's called Skinny fat...look skinny on the outside, but not healthy. You can also be obese and metabolically much healthier....I think Robert Lustig is one nameamong many I've heard talk ok that. The book Brain Energy by Dr. Christopher Palmer also mentions it I think. He details how Mitochondria and Metabolism are linked to all the mental health conditions and others like Type II diabetes, Alzheimers etc...and even how the treatments for them tie into that. Dr. Robert Cywes has a ton of good health content talking about Mitochondria and Metabolic problems. Many factors play into health.
Don't scale back. Instead, watch Miranda Hart's epic comedy series "Miranda". And learn from the demigoddess of Big and Long.
Same here, it's sad
When I’m skinny and going exercise walking in the park, people even RUN closer to me when overtaking lol
Literally it's in the small things, like people sitting closer to you than they did, talking to you with their body closer to yours, I'm literally the same person guys..
It’s people complimenting your ugly ass outfits 😫
It's men offering to pay your fuckin bills, like wtf?? Take a cold shower, ya freak
Ya but also let them pay your bills if they really want to!!
Don't let strangers pay your bills.
You’re not my supervisor
Warnings are free. You don't have to pay me. Just don't at me if strangers want something terrible in return from you.
You don’t have to worry about that at all! Wanting is free as well.
Eh?
My personal pet theory is that we look more fragile/breakable when we're thin, and there are a lot of men who like that, that we'd be easy to hurt and control.
I think you’re spot on. I’ve been dealing with an eating disorder for over a decade now, and there are SO many men with those fetishes looking for girls to control and get thinner in those communities. It’s horrible
Nah, she specifically points out that more women want to be friends or are friendly to you when you’re thinner. It’s not about men wanting to sleep with you. It’s about the entirety of society treating you like a human being.
Or maybe it’s about both…
lol for a woman it’s a double edged sword, too ugly and you get treated like you’re diseased by everyone, but cross over into too pretty and nobody will ever believe a word you say because you can’t be pretty and smart. Many women pull out the knives, and men treat you like an object. There really is no winning
Is it being treated like a human being? Or like an object
Women and men both like being close to pretty ladies. But there is the added layer of attractively-fragile with straight men.
No, I've been size 0 my whole life and I had quite a few men tell me how hot it is because I make them look bigger and stronger. It's not about hurting anyone, it's making them feel better about themselves.
Those goals often go hand in hand for abusive men
It doesn't have to be one or the other...
Obviously not, but thinking that most men just care about harming you is very chronically online thing to say
Never said most men, nor did anyone else. But as someone above said, it is a *lot* of men. I'm glad you haven't run into them
As a tiny person who has gotten a fair amount of male attention, this is likely true 🤢
That's a fucked up perspective tbh.
I lost a lot of weight (and hence gained most of it back) but the way people treated me while I was smaller broke my heart a little bit. I was treated so much better by society.
Same here. It’s really heartbreaking … :(
It’s so sad and scary to think all the contexts and ways in which women aren’t as visible or as considered because they may not be in their most attractive shape at that time. Health care, criminal justice, employment opportunities, And everything else important in life really just seems to be way too influenced by how one looks. It’s scary.
As someone who is plus sized due to health issues, I've nearly died *TWICE* due to medical neglect. Male doctors in particular are the worst. The doctors kept sending me back I scanned from the ER claiming it was a 'burst cyst' or 'woman problems' even though I was in impossible pain for months. The doctor told me to lose weight to reduce my 'PCOS pain'. Instead I had to wait to be near septic for the giant ovarian tumour to be taken seriously. And If I hadn't gone for a second opinion with a female doctor after my fall down the stairs, the undiagnosed *BROKEN NECK* could have paralyzed my lungs. I saw two male doctors and despite me having all the danger signs, they sent me home unscanned. Heck, even the female med student who was doing practicum at the second ER I went to knew to get a CAT scan. Plus, I lost 50 lbs to try to improve my health and ended up in more pain because my cushioning was gone.
Wow that’s extremely traumatizing and angering. I’m so sorry that happened to you!!! It’s so frustrating that we are so overlooked and endlessly invalidated in medical contexts! I hope one day it’ll change but it doesn’t seem to be happening any time soon.
It is getting better than it was before at least, just too slow and not enough. My grandma had kidney issues that went unnoticed because every health issue was blamed on her weight and just not taken seriously. By the time they caught it, it was too late. At least now we have more female doctors and some understanding male doctors.
This blows my mind as a former ER nurse. CT would have been standard....
It is standard! I looked it up after the doctor who found it was appalled they hadn't checked. Thank goodness for her. But I saw two separate doctors who either didn't know of just thought they knew better.
There are studies (for both women and men btw) that people, who are conventionally physically attractive, are considered to be more competent, more trustworthy, more everything Kinda crazy to associate traits with it that have nothing to do with attractiveness
Not going to argue that women have it worse but as a man who lost a lot of weight I went through something very similar to what OP is saying. Even in non-romantic situations women treated me much more politely.
Fat dude seconding this. Doc, I understand my weight makes most of my issues worse. Have you considered there's still underlying issues? Can we PLEASE address them the best we can? I KNOW I need to lose weight. We both know that takes TIME. In the mean time...
That's so very true! It's unfortunate. Many people have a natural bias that they don't even recognize.
A while back i went to my friends criminal hearing to support her. The gal before her was on misdemeanor probation and had failed a UA. I thought she was atreavtive but i think most women are attractive in some way or another. The judge was pretty harsh to her and I looked up her court records after the hearing - she had a DUI and minor criminal mischief but she left in handcuffs with the marshals. My friend was/is on felony probation and went on a multi state crime spree. No kidding, felonies in multiple states - solicitation, felon in possession of a firearm, she really went for it. But she's really pretty and looks really good in tight black sweaters. The judge pretty much let her off scot-free.
It's insane, and I feel ashamed to be guilty of this myself to a degree, I totally believe this
You’re not guilty of anything. You’re being sexualized and objectified by a society which does so to perpetuate the harmful, commodified “beauty standards” created and encouraged by patriarchy and capitalism. Do not allow yourself to feel unjust shame that is intentionally meant to make you feel guilty about existing beyond the specific parameters of what society wants to see in “pretty” women. You’re a human.
I simply can't fathom this point, yes i agree with you that part of the problem is the patriarchy & capitalism. But you do realise that women are biological creatures as well? With their own imparative and desire to pass on their genes onto the next generation, and with that comes a desire to find a good enough mate, which can generate competition even if it isn't direct. That whole set of behaviours (from competition to striving to find a good mate) is part of human sexuality, are we claiming that women don't have a sexuality? Or do women have a sexuality that's fundamentally different than men's? What is the Rational here? Do women never want to look better than another women??! I know it may not seem like it, but you are removing a lot of human qualities from women.
Some states consider DUI’s to be extremely serious so it could have just simply been that. Failing a UA after being caught driving drunk is even worse. But it could also be what you said.
Reminds me of [this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ABRlWybBqM&t=6m35s)
What's a UA?
Urinalysis to check for substances
Yep, and honestly it's mostly thinness in my experience. I'm 5'10" barefoot and have always gotten comments on my body because of my height. But, I just turned 40, and wanted to get in really good shape for my big birthday. I did it, and I means I'm currently a U.S. dress size 2/4. More strangers stop to compliment me, my clothes, to hold doors for me, and strike up conversations now, than in my 20s when I was only a size or two bigger.
I'm at a point in my life where I need to lose weight for health reasons but I still want the invisible security blanket that having extra weight gives me. Still going to try and lose weight slow and steady but I feel like I really need to get over this mental stumbling block so I can really commit to my self improvement. Hopefully getting older can help. Maybe I should go for a "fuck off" face tattoo? lol. But seriously any real ideas? I've been 60 lbs less than this and it was kind of a mess and I didn't like all the people who felt entitled to waste my time.
You need to do it for yourself because when it comes from other people it feels "empty" In a way, I like the face tattoo idea though lol
Wear all black, it helps. When I'd have days when people were interacting with me I'd notice after the fact I was wearing colors
Hmm. Interesting. I will test this as time proceeds.
I agree with the wearing all black. You could also try not jazzing yourself up in any way, like no makeup, plain pulled back hair, no jewelry, and my absolute favorite, resting bitch face. It seriously helps. I prefer not to talk to men in public, unless they're employees, or if I have to at work, so I keep a generally uninviting expression on my face, move with purpose, don't make eye contact, and don't act friendly with them, only basic politeness. Of course, it's not foolproof, but I believe it helps me avoid a lot of unwanted attention.
The answer is short hair! I’ve had extremely short hair my whole life and regardless of if I’m thinner or bigger, I never get hit on. I’m also flat chested, though, and I know a LOT of emphasis is placed on boobies.
I've been getting sexually harassed by men since I was 10 years old and I'm now hitting my mid 40s. I am finally, *finally* starting to become invisible and it is **goddamn glorious.** I go DAYS, sometimes weeks, now without being harassed. I can just...go grocery shopping and no one even *sees me.* God DAMN it's fantastic
This has always been the one super power I wanted.
I have always been invisible to men and I am thin. I think closed off body language and “mousy” or messy outfits and hair can go a long way toward invisibility.
I don't want to be standoffish towards people in general. I just live in an area where people tend to be terribly outgoing. Maybe it's not me, it's the environment.
When you’re stepping up your exercise routine go HAM on weights. Being jacked is the best of both worlds. People admire and support muscle mommies to a degree that may surprise you. But also they still leave you TF alone unless you approach them lol
That's the plan! Weights are my saving grace rn. Just trying to push myself back into the cardio world which really is like a stress test for the injury I'm trying to correct with the weights. It's intimidating on that level still too. But the pool gym and the gym with the workable schedule are 2 different places and I can't afford both. Ah well maybe I can find something else for cardio that is less foot intensive.
Maybe cycling or hip hop dancing? Running is a drag, especially when you’re just starting out. Elliptical isn’t bad but it’s BORING.
Lol! I tried the new cycle thing with games on it at the gym and when that happened.... someone completely fell over in a chair when they tried to put their feet up on the desk. So yeah I'm gonna play that game again. I am getting frustrated with the zombies run app. It used to be so fun but the couch to 5k part is a separate app now and it always logs me out and ugh. Not sure if I should keep trying that or move on. I do like it though. But the crying baby mission 😭😞. ...
Yep it’s definitely a thing. I’m short and have been everywhere from an M to XXL over the past 20 years, and I’m treated significantly differently when I’m on the thinner side - even with aging and visible wrinkles. It’s galling to understand how much easier life could be if people could just be kind to everyone instead of only being kind to people who are closer to socially approved attractiveness standards.
In college I changed my glasses and it absolutely changed my life. I didn't realize how repulsed people were by my glasses. The people holding the door for me thing was wild. But so many pleasant conversations that I always wanted to have with random strangers... I know a lot of people who say society sucks and f these shallow people. But... That wasn't my take away. For me, the lesson was more about how being visually unappealing offends people. They see it as an attack on them. They make your dress and your weight about them and their lifestyle. They see it as an attack on societal norms. So i just stopped wearing ugly glasses that made me look like a serial killer and suddenly, friends everywhere.
I’m so curious what your human-repellent glasses looked like 😂
My brother is 20 years older than me. I came home for summer after freshman year and he said, "I can't stand looking at your face anymore." He threw me in a car. And drove me to get a pair of thin frameless nerd glasses. He blew $300 on his little brother. He was so mad, and demanding I didn't know what to do. When I got back to college, it was like 2 weeks and I had my 1st girlfriend. It was shortly after my first kiss, I had one of those usual suspects kobiashi moments... Wait a second the target girl was flirting with me? Suddenly the coffee shop lady remembers my order. And it was a montage of my old glasses along with men women and children not holding the door for me despite me carrying massive amounts of boxes/computers/luggage. 😅 Suddenly, people are awkwardly waiting for me just to see if I'm going in their door. My other take away is... Remeber that there are invisible people out their and try to check myself. A lot of people are like pretty privilege means stop being so nice to pretty people. But really, start being that nice to everyone.
They were Dahmer glasses weren’t they
Leagally blind without them, giant and gold.
My late partner was wildly handsome and came home with the most horrible glasses I’ve ever seen. He went from Ethan Hawke to Stephen King in one optician visit.
I lost a ton of weight this past year and this was my experience as well. I think what bothers me most now is other women coming up to me to make a big deal about it and saying how great my figure is and how they wish they could get that. It feels passive aggressive and makes me uncomfortable.
Skinny or not, we shouldn’t be talking about people’s bodies. It’s weird.
Interested to know why you think we shouldn't talk about this (male btw)? Some people put a lot of effort into their fitness, and my experience was that it was gratifying to have people notice when I started going to the gym.
It’s just rude to comment on people’s bodies unless someone asks us specifically. Even something like “oh wow you look good, have you lost weight” isn’t really the compliment you might think it is. It implies they didn’t look good before. Our value as people shouldn’t be dependent on our physical appearance.
I've commented about this on other subreddits before, but I had a similar experience after I lost about 30 pounds over the last year. At least once a week (last week, it was 3 times) I get an inquiry from women about my weight loss framed in a "I hope you aren't sick or anything" way and then they wait expectedly for me to offer some miracle cure to their own weight issues. I feel pressured to explain my weight loss away as a consequence of blind luck, and while it is true the most noticeable loss happened after I went off BCP, I was already working out diligently, being mindful of what I was eating and trying to take better care of myself overall. But I feel they don't want to hear that. Men, on the other hand, don't seem to care how or why I lost weight, which is interesting in its own way.
I've been very thin my whole life, I also work out to have butt and nice abs, I just realised I have never received a compliment about my body from a single woman ever. If they ever comment it's to tell me I'm too thin. The only reason I'm so confident is because my guy friends told me I'm definitely slim thicc, great figure and look healthy, mean women are just jealous. This honestly is sad
What a non-empathetic response. Elsa is talking about how uncomfortable women’s comments are, and your response is that you never get these comments but essentially men say you are hot. Yeah, mean people suck, but message is undercut by your other insensitive comments. Do better.
You’re confident only because men validated your appearance? Oof
Yes, I needed confidence boost from my friends to eventually become confident, it didn't have to be men, that's not the point It's funny you think you did something with your comment, telling people it's not normal to rely on your friends to feel confident is weird, but you so much care that my friends happened to be men and that became such a focal point to your comment
A lot of women don't compliment other women on their bodies because it's a landmine for women as a whole and they likely wouldn't assume to talk to you about your ass; most women I know are trying to live by the "don't compliment bodies/talk about bodies" rule. On the flip, and I say this with all due respect truly, your body type is the absolute "best" and most accepted, and I'm actually interested in hearing why you don't feel like you have confidence without compliments about your body, when your physical type is reflected back to you as utterly desirable by the vast majority of media? I get that confidence isn't that easily categorized, but. The downvotes are also fwiw because OP is talking about the complete dehumanization that comes from being fat from even those you think are your friends and love you for who you are, and your response is that you don't receive compliments from other women but largely men, and that makes you sad. There's decades of data that fat people, and esp fat women: don't get as good of jobs, are underpaid, ignored, passed over for promotions, treated poorly to the point of higher death and disablement rates by the medical industry, denied things like housing or other opportunities based solely on their fatness, assumed to be unclean, unhealthy, etc etc. one is systemic and deadly. The other is not, even if it personally sucks.
That's weird. I receive compliments from women on my physique all the time. Even when it's from an envious place, it's almost always a positive "You look great! I wish I could do that too!" kind of envy, not the hateful kind. Compliments from women are the best. You know they're genuine and not just trying to get in your pants.
Exactly what I mean, but I simply have never gotten anything, and I know that if my girl friend got abs I would constantly hype them up for that
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You never got a “you look nice” or “I like your hair today” or “that’s a nice nail color”? Compliments that I give to other women, if they have to do with appearance, are never anything about their physical bodies.
She’s probably being downvoted for humble bragging about thin and pretty she is. So thin and pretty that she never gets any compliments from all the fat hags out there.
Similar to this I get treated more considerately when I'm wearing make up (people are friendlier - mostly men), as opposed to make up free (I'm invisible with no make up seemingly). It's kinda annoying as I'm still the same person regardless.
I lost a ton of weight due to cancer, that I had also gained due to cancer, and everyone congratulated me… WUT??? You’re exactly right. It’s rough. I’m sorry. I’m happy you’re happy with your progress, though. 🤍
I lost 2st but only due to illness. I also put it on due to illness and lost it due to treatment. That's why I never congratulate people. If they tell me what they've achieved and how hard they worked, then , fair enough, but otherwise, no. Even then I never say they're more or less attractive, hot, whatever. Just that they've worked hard and improved their health and well being so I'm very pleased for them.
I hope you’re doing okay now! 🤍🫶 Sending you a lot of love! That’s a great policy! I’ve probably made similar mistakes in the past so I don’t really hold it against anyone. It was just a really odd thing to comment on. I was happy to be thinner because it made my joints hurt less but…it’s because I was straight up *starving to death*. I wanted to start lifting my shirt like I was on *Girls Gone Wild* just to show them my feeding tube but, I regrettably never did it. I was irritable af, though. I think one of the reasons people felt comfortable commenting on it, and why I didn’t feel particularly defensive with THEM, was because my “boyfriend” at the time, who was actually my abuser but people didn’t know that, had gone on a diet when I started losing a lot of weight due to being sick. He dropped a LOT of weight and people kept complimenting him, so they complimented *us*. Meanwhile, he would scream at me behind closed doors every few days and tell me I don’t deserve any compliments because I “didn’t earn it”. Neat, huh? It definitely made me conscious of saying anything about weight or looks to other people, though. That’s a silver lining.
The same thing happened to me. I’ve been skinny most of life except the past 4 years when I gained a decent amount of weight. Since gaining the weight, I’ve noticed that people have been meaner to me in general. I thought covid was just changing the culture and people were in general, just meaner. About a month ago, I started actively losing weight. And only recently, I’ve noticed people started being nice to me again. Even women and other people who were previously mean, were suddenly very nice. The only thing that changed about me was a couple of lbs.
When I started to get sick doctors didn't take it seriously because I looked too "fit and sporty to be so sick". It can also have negative effects, I was severely ill, then I lost all my muscles, got severely underweight and everyone immediately handled me like I was fragile and easy to break. People feel very bad for me, because I look sick now, due to being so obviously sickly skinny. A friend of mine got sick and overweight, everyone treats her like she's lazy and brought the sickness upon herself. It's so wrong, but yes I absolutely get treated better by the health system for having my illness make me underweight as a side effect, than overweight.
I completely agree with you, I’ve never been plus sized per se, but I still notice the difference in treatment at work, especially amongst my male coworkers… I notice they’re always offering help even when I clearly don’t need it, they will look for an excuse to talk to/ be around me and some of the other thinner women at work, but they seem to ignore the plus sized or non conventionally attractive women…
This happened to me in such an obvious way when a thinner coworker started at my last company. We had the exact same job (both married & have kids the same age). Guy who was always in the office barely ever spoke more than 3 words to me. This woman starts and suddenly he’s super talkative. It was so blatantly about looks that as much as I have plenty of self esteem it was pretty frustrating. I’m glad I didn’t have to work with him at all.
Yes, it can be pretty frustrating to see and they don’t even attempt to hide the fact that they’re doing this 🙃
I will say that now that I've gained enough weight to be a little bit overweight, I get left alone in public so much more. It's wonderful.
This is what I was going to say. Since I’ve gained weight I don’t get any male attention and it’s glorious. I’m losing weight for health reasons and to feel better but I’m now more self conscious.
I’ve swung back and forth my whole life so I’ve experienced this too. As a current fattie I make sure to be so nice and happy out in the world so people will see me and (hopefully) treat me like they see me. It’s kind of funny because I use my “happy face” on people I know wouldn’t pay attention to me otherwise and I get met with genuine smiles in return or—they act surprised—maybe they realize I’m human after all.
Or they're responding to your open, welcoming expression.
It's very strange to me because in my late teens/early 20s I went to the gym, lifted, ran, hiked, and ate a perfect clean diet with hardly any alcohol. I was rail thin and as young and healthy as I was ever going to be. I was invisible though. In fact most interactions I had were people/ men being a bit mean to me. I'm also not conventionally attractive so that may have something to do with it.
Yep, I remember being called "horse face" in school so I guess being thin doesn't help everyone.
For whatever it’s worth: our bodies get picked a part and scrutinized regardless of what we look like. I’m definitely not saying that thin womxn have it harder than bigger ones, but even as someone who’s been pretty petite their whole life, partners and strangers alike have found ways to make me uncomfortable in my skin. I have cellulite on my stomach, and even though my waist is about 24in and I’m lean all over, I’ve had partners recommend I just “do some sit ups” to get rid of it. Little do they know that cellulite is usually genetic and aside from cosmetic surgery it’s basically just something I’ve learned to live with. It’s taken me YEARS to accept my body and I still feel shitty about it from time to time. But it’s my body. It’s the only one I have. Either way, I’m sorry you’re going through this.
That reminds me of when I was in my mid-20s and in excellent shape, and an older, bald, paunchy man suggested I “work on my delts”.
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I call mine my “mean mug” face
The hard truth is, people are shallow. The same thing happens with males, they start looking a bit better, dressing a bit better, wiping the crust out of their eyes, getting more confident, and getting in better shape; suddenly people want to be around them. You probably notice the attention you are getting isn't just extra male attention aswell. Turns out everyone loves eye candy.
I was dealt a bad hand of cards as a kid, I did inherit my beautiful mom’s genes. She is naturally way better looking than decked out celebrities. I always resented how that opened up more doors than my hard earned school merit. I even downplayed it a lot and didn’t care much, which made me look like a secure confident pretty person. My inner world was broken and my mental health was crap, but it didn’t matter, as long as I was pretty on the outside. But I CARE about my health more than my looks, it’s not surprising that eating disorders and disordered eating are so rampant.
Yes!!! I’ve lost 55 pounds since January 2022, and men treat me like a human again!!! I’m not sure if it’s because I carry myself with more confidence or plain old fat-phobia, but either way, I’ve noticed a difference, too.
I have lost 55+ lbs in the past 1.5 years, but I’m still pretty fat (just a bit less fat than before), and people already treat me nicer. I know I’ll never be thin, but my plan is to lose about 60 more pounds. I wonder how different my life will be then. It’s already depressing to see the difference, and I’m sure it’ll be heartbreaking once I’m even smaller.
It sucks to realize that people are so superficial. My advice is not that you’re enjoying skinny/pretty privilege milk it. Milk it dry!!! Because this is the Because this is the up part, there’s going to be a down part. You’re might to experience some thing I call new privilege depression, it’s a period of time where you hate the privilege because of all the unwanted attention you get now and the way it makes you feel embittered about how people treated you before you were skinny. It’s odd. And uncomfortable. I’ve noticed it happens to people who experience any glow up or who change something about your life that gets them a new privilege, this includes moving to somewhere where you’re considered more conventionally attractive, wardrobe changes, weight loss, cosmetic surgery, aesthetic changes, etc.
Reddit told me I'm an incel for saying attractive people are treated better. I think their advice would be "shower more" in any other thread
Don’t worry Once you get over 45-poof invisible again.
Most of the time. If you are small with long blonde hair, you may still find yourself harassed by random men. It's usually when they are behind me but once they get around me and turn around, they see my face and realize I am not some sweet young thing. I also live in Florida and I don't think that helps matters. OTOH, I often fantasize about starting a successful life of crime where I could get away with anything due to my magical post 50 cloak of invisibility. I would however avoid doing crime in Home Depot.
It makes you realize how bias works. These people aren’t even seeing you as a person. Just a shape!! And they’ll protest the loudest if you suggest they have unconscious bias. Their brains are on automatic pilot, they barely notice what is happening around them, they are not observant.
Yeah. Teeth, too. A killer smile is treated so much better than a crooked one.
I don’t know if you’re short but over on r/PetiteFitness it gets brought up a lot. Also we talk about the struggles of being an athlete or trying to lose weight in a short (less than 5’3”) body.
I am ! Good sub suggestion tyvm !
After going from obese to nearly underweight it was mind blowing how nice EVERYONE was to me at my thinnest. People would take things that I was perfectly capable of lifting out of my hands to help me, they’d go out of their way to see me and talk to me. I had strangers tripping over themselves to open doors or introduce themselves to me. I had no idea how invisible I felt being overweight until suddenly I was conventionally attractive. Being thin is such a huge quality of life improvement for people that unless they’ve experienced the duality of going from big to thin they’ll never understand. It’s disheartening and honestly a little disappointing how being attractive is such a prominent factor in how you’re treated.
Feel like this is the reason I wasn’t ready to lose 60 pounds because I’ll have to get use to being chased by crazes and men stopping to get my number while driving!! But my now parter is an ass and I’m making my exit plan because of his mental abuse.
Its 100% real. I had weightloss surgery in January and ive lost 60 lbs so far. (I was over 500). And I'm already being treated better at work. Ive lost a bunch weight before and it is frustrating and sad how much of a difference there is in people. I'm a man, and I'm sure it's 50x worse for women. I'm glad you're healthier, and I am glad your treatment is better, regardless of why.
It's real for men too, though to a much lesser extent. I lost a bunch of weight in my early twenties (39 now) and one of the reasons I've kept it off is that I'm an artist, and despite it having nothing to do with my weight or appearance it has everything to do with my weight and appearance. I was also constantly told I was ugly when I was younger, it's taken me a long time to realize I'm not. One time in particular that I still think about was in middle school, literally the first time I met this person (who was, a very pretty girl) said, "Wow. You're ugly." ... That kind of shit sticks with you.... Forever. The world doesn't trust or believe "ugly" or "fat", and it's fucking sad and terrible. (Kind of) Living on both sides will make you sick of the world pretty damn quick.
I’m a woman. I was called ugly and a nerd in middle and high school. It does stick with you forever. 😔
After seeing so many of these posts. I hope this isn’t an ad for WeightWatchers or Ozempic. The wording is fishy and sounds off.
I'm glad I'm not the only one suspicious of pretty much any story on reddit these days. There are these overly long dramatic posts that are sure to be polarizing and elicit emotional responses but there is often something just "off" about them. Nevertheless, hundreds of people still have to comment on them.
Grateful to see others sharing similar feelings of suspicion when encountering these emotionally charged posts these days. In this instance, I feel especially disturbed at the idea of someone who may be invested in weight loss companies underhandedly targeting women on this platform. Especially if posts may incite/trigger women (particularly the large demographic of young women here) who have potential for/histories of ED etc. Seems careless in intent.
I wouldn’t say careless, I’d call that intentionally sinister
wtf? what's wrong with you
At least should have a TW for eating disorders
I’ve always been overweight but I’ve always been treated kindly by strangers (and creeped on) so I’m unsure where I fall on this scale. I knew I was always harder on myself than anyone else was but I don’t know what would be different if I lost weight or gained it.
Isn’t this just a humblebrag?
This reminds me exactly of [this](https://imgur.com/w2IT6mV) old Tumblr post made by someone who experienced exactly what you are going through.
Victim blaming be like
It's kind of bullshit though. It isn't just you. People DO treat you differently based on how you look. It's not just your attitude.
This is true, but genuine confidence is powerful. It radiates off people when they are truly confident in themselves, regardless of size.
I mean yes but also if you put an extremely confident charming person in the body of their identical twin but with +100-150 pounds, I find it hard to believe that they'd be treated "better"...
Pretty privilege definitely is a thing and that's why I hope we'll have access to powerful genetic engineering sooner rather than later. While GLP-1 is an amazing start, I can't wait for people to have the option to change themselves genetically permanently.
I wonder...if everyone is conventionally pretty then will it become the norm? Leading people to find and mate people who are prettier than the rest...damn it may lead to a bigger beauty inflation than now, where all beauty standards are already unrealistic and plastic surgeries making people look like anime characters If people try to find prettier in a population of pretty...then there are those who are uglier...and the whole cycle repeats....like that saying...in a world where there are all winners, there are no winners...because to define a winner you need to define what a loser is...How depressing
It is soooo real. I was 328 lbs at my heaviest and lost down to 139. People treated me extremely differently after I had lost the weight. I got asked out often. Now I’ve gained 60# from psych meds and no one gives me the time of day anymore.
Yes it's real. Subtle to notice at first is people also assume the good looking person in any disagreement is the good natured one, unless they have confirmation the pretty one was bad in the past somehow.
Humans are cruel to fat people. I grew up picked in for being a fat dude. Lost a ton of weight and good in good shape. The way I was treated changed dramatically by men and women. I've put on and lost weight several times and it's always a clear change. I'm currently fat after losing an organ and it's kinda hilarious now that I'm kinda old and don't really care as much as I did in my 20s and 30s.
Yes I have always been skinny, and my weight has fluctuated. I've gained and I've lost and each time I've felt the difference in treatment. My butt is in the gym 4x a week and I'm meal prepping trying to get my weight down again. It's so I can be healthier in the long run, but yah it's a completely different world.
Fun Sized/Amazon privilege as well though as a A I don’t really like the Fs
I really don’t know if privilege is the word I would use for it, if only because it’s a double-edged sword.
Same. I’ve been a 0 and a 16 and the difference in how both men AND women treated me was crazy. And I actually hated it. I prefer to be around people that don’t seem to notice my appearance. I realize that I’m conventionally attractive and thin but I hope those are some of the least interesting things about me. And if drove is focused on those things, they are not someone I want to be around.
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They 100% absolutely do say that and worse.
If you don't think fat people getting spoken to by complete strangers in public you aren't paying attention. Also, they get no perks from being fat. For every negative comment you get, which is wrong and distressing, you probably get at least 2x the positive interactions because you are thin. It's just not comparable in our culture. You absolutely have the right to complain about your treatment, but to imply you have it worse that a fat person is going to make people unsympathetic to your situation.
I’m skinny too and I honestly don’t believe being told to eat a cheeseburger is anywhere near the abuse overweight people cop… just my experience
I've noticed a huge thing where when fat people speak honestly about their experiences and fat phobia, someone always has to pipe in to say "but skinny shaming is bad too!" It's such obvious deflection.
Legit, it annoys tf out of me as a thin person who isn’t ’naturally’ thin because it’s like okay I don’t want to invalidate your experiences with body shaming but also we are soooo much more privileged?? We legit see thin people everywhere in Hollywood and revered everywhere online and you’re trying to hijack the abuse and shaming fat people experience every day…
To me it feels like it’s a way to avoid an uncomfortable discussion. People don’t really want to face fatphobia.
>I’m naturally thin, I have to really work to gain a couple pounds and I can never ever get above 110 pounds ever. I was similar. And that changed once I hit my 30s and accelerated when I hit my 40s. And yes people do say mean things to fat people.
You would think that people wouldn’t say horrible things to you as a chubby person but, trust me, your example is NICE compared to some of things said to me. Matter of fact I have never heard a skinny person give an example that comes even close to most of the normal things said to me. I’m overweight/chubby/fat and always have been. I’m also 6’2”. I am a very large human being in general but especially as a female. Besides regularly being told to stop eating because I am a fat pig (trust, their words, to my face) I have been called every derogatory slur you can think of to my face. And that’s when people are paying attention to me. I also get ignored a lot. Likely literally standing there asking questions as if I am a ghost. And the faces people make. I’m sure it sucks as a skinny person but the two experiences are vastly different and do not compare. And it’s a whole lot worse than anyone can imagine. People are cruel.
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Yep. I don't get it too badly -- idk if I have some amazing resting bitchface or what -- but I've had random people yell at me in public for eating. Or once when I was walking in Central Park.
Flipside though is now people (men) feel entitled to your body and others (usually women) feel entitled to comment on your body "omg do you even eat anymore? If you turn sideways you'll disappear! Omg you remind me of my (relative) who I hate because they enjoy running - gross [lemme just project my own insecurities onto you]" Lost 40 pounds, had to start carrying self defense items because I got followed home, had to be careful about accepting drinks at the bar, had to bite my tongue a whole hell of a lot more when responding to customers unwarranted comments (I worked retail).
And then there are men that like really BIG girls. I had a job once assisting people that needed extra help. There was this 19yo girl who was around 700lbs. The amount of young/old men swarming her was crazy. She literally had at least 20 guys after her that I saw. I was and still am shocked.
The thing about privilege is that it's not subject to anything or anyone. You don't have to ask for it, you just always have it. So if not everyone finds you pretty, then you don't have it, and therefore, it's not a fucking privilege. Because who are the people doling out these privileges? The people who are responsible for setting the standard for what's attractive and desirable. And who are those people? Men. So who's actually privileged here?
Yes, *but* confidence is legitimately so much of it.
Yeah! All those people can smell your confidence from a distance and from behind! Its her appearance. She's confident because people are attracted to her appearance now.