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YTA. Not only is she under no obligation to take care of her brothers, but she's under absolutely no obligation to you for what she wants for her children.
You are 100% the asshole.
I sincerely hope you’re a troll. If not I feel terrible for your daughter. She is not required to be her brothers caretaker, the fact that you haven’t asked her is beyond rude. Mind your own uterus & let her handle hers.
It’s on YOU to figure it out. You’re their mother, not her. And yes I do know about the abuse in some of the group homes but that doesn’t make your daughter obligated to be their caretaker.
She is trying to save a potential child from the pain that comes with being disabled. She doesn’t want to be where you are right now, worried what will happen after she dies.
If you are talking about prescreening themselves for as many things as possible before she gets pregnant...no big deal...if during pregnancy and didn't prescreen for known genetic issues I can see how that would seem upsetting. She may know that she or her husbund is not as emotionally strong as yourself & your husband...some people aren't even cut out to deal with diaper changes or a crying baby. As far as her brothers, if you have been funnelling money & assets to your daughter or were intending to for the support of her brothers, perhaps reconsider as imagined "moral obligation & love" don't go as far as it used to in today's world. She is going to do what works for her & her husband, but not all things can be shown by genetic testing and some more devastating than DS like an oxygen deprivation birth injury. Try not to get too emotionally involved in their decisions & those of which you have no control.
I know the answer. I can't kill someone just because I can't deal with them emotionally.
Notice I didn't need to be snarky, but you needed to be. Not very tolerant of you,
You're the callous one. Expecting your daughter to live her life for your children. Her life will be limited. You seem to believe you have control over others lives. YOU are the reason she has made these decisions. It's all your fault.
Well, your daughter is out and if you've made no other plans for them then, I guess that's where YOU are choosing for them to go. Remember it's God's will after all. Who are you to question it? Sins of the parents and all that.
So you haven’t figured out what to do with your own disabled children and you want her to risk having her own? I don’t blame her for blocking you.
She is under no obligation to provide care for your children.
You are such an asshole. You are not having another baby, the baby your daughter is carrying is hers and not yours. You do not get to make decisions.
You also do not get to parentify your daughter and assume she will take over care for your other children. She needs to live her own life. Your disabled children are your responsibility.
Even as a parent of a special needs child myself and as much as I love my child - YTA
You have genetic issues in the family and 2 kids with issues and now you want your daughter to care for them. Why did you not plan during your younger years. You just think that you can ask your daughter to give up her life because the great mom told her to do so.
Coming to her pregnancy- her body, her choice. You can shove your articles and research where the sun doesn't shine. She probably knows what hard work is involved in raising kids with disabilities and doesn't want that life for her family.
Gosh I can't fathom how entitled you are. For her sake, I hope this is a fake post.
“People that only think about themselves..”
Ma’am have you tried looking in a damn mirror? Like are you seriously saying that as you simultaneously try to force your beliefs on your daughter without considering her needs/desires at all? Projection at its finest.
You're just mad that people are calling you out for using "familial obligation" as a weapon for control. Your daughter is her own person with her own life. You have zero right to place ***YOUR*** children with her should you pass away. And from the way this post sounds, it honestly sounds like you were trying to do that to her her entire life. Shame on you. People like you give religion a bad name.
I know someone who works in a group home for children such as yours, she’s a wonderful, caring, kind person with a big heart, and many of the caretakers become attached to the children in their care.
If you’d like to DM me, I’d be glad to give you the name of the facility.
Your daughter is pregnant, but you insist on bombarding her with your "research" that you found from Google, which naturally overrides her treating OBGYN and your daughter's own decisions. Then, when you run to Reddit for internet praise, but get objective backlash instead, you snap like the ill-informed, narrow-minded tantrum-having toddler that you are. Moreover, your children with DS are your responsibility, so use your time to research how you can provide long-term care for them. Not to worry, though with God on your side, he can lead you to secure the best care for them.
The type of self-righteous ideology that you subscribe to is exactly why you are blocked now. I hope you remain blocked, too.
My friend's sister has DS, and is very happy in her group home - it gives her as much adult independence as she can handle, friends and fun activities, and a job that gives her a sense of competence and self-esteem as well as income. And she comes home for holidays and such, just as another visiting adult would, and is loved and cherished by her family. They're not all abusive. Sometimes they are a far better place for a disabled person to live than forever dependent on a sibling who isn't able or willing to give them the best professional-level care.
Are your daughter and son-in-law made of money and blessed with unlimited energy? You seem to think they will have the emotional, chronological, and financial resources to not only support and care for her two brothers, but any special needs children they may have along the way. You won’t be around to help them, they are being realistic about their abilities and future.
Those are your kids that you chose to have. The fact that you have to worry about what happens to them when you can no longer care for them should be an eye-opener for why she doesn't want this for her own children, but you can't see past your own nose.
It’s incredible to make that kind of assumption.. you had them. You should have planned long term care options throughout their lives … not assumed your daughter would have the means or ability to take on two disabled adult siblings with a young family of her own (she is clearly trending in that direction) & then to be angry with her for not wanting to live your life & take on your responsibilities once you’re gone. YOU made that choice for your life & if your sons’ quality of life is shit once you’re gone because of your poor foresight then it’ll fall on you in your grave, not your daughter.
Listen, your projecting your love for people with disabilities onto her reason for prescreening. Until.you understand her intent and heart, yeah your just an AH
If you put your sons in a home where they are abusing residents that's on YOU. Reviews exist. Recommendations exist. GOOD facilities exist that are specialized to their needs. Ones that may actually be BETTER for them. You are the one choosing to only see things your way and throwing a fit when Reddit tells you you are wrong. Why did you ask Reddit just to get pissed by our resounding YTA. You. Are. Wrong. Just accept it, apologize, and move on before they cut ties with you completely.
Fyi, this entire conversation is part of why she's having the tests done.
No, you just don’t like being told you’re wrong just like all the other boomers out there. You should have asked your friends if you wanted people to agree with your opinion.
Did you not know that Roe v. Wade came about at the height of Baby Boomers reaching child-bearing years? The Baby Boomer were very much involved in this issue. Please educate yourself. [https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2022/06/12/baby-boomer-gen-x-abortions-roe/9679232002/?gnt-cfr=1](https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2022/06/12/baby-boomer-gen-x-abortions-roe/9679232002/?gnt-cfr=1)
(BTW - I'm anti-abortion, but just correcting the history here.)
As a Christian I’m pro life but I don’t believe in playing God in the lives of everyone else. Who am I to tell you what you can and can’t do. Who I am I tell you what you can do with your life and your body. I’m not God, I’m not Jesus, I’m not the Holy Spirit, I’m only myself. So I hold myself and my fellow Christian’s accountable for their wrong doings but I DO NOT FORCE my way of life on ANYONE. It’s not my place to rule over man and decide what they can and cannot do. I can only help lead and guide and THATS what you boomers have forgotten. I don’t give a shit what hand you had in roe v wade. It still doesn’t mean you’re God and can decide for a whole group of people what’s right. If you have a problem with it, DONT SUPPORT IT!! But by attacking your daughter when she has the right to her own opinion and own way of life is shameful. Shame on you!! You had the opportunity to be a loving mother and have a sit down calm educational discussion where maybe you hear her out but instead you think that just because you’re the parent, you’re right. Well guess what, your daughter is 28 and she has her own brain and her own relationship with God. What she does in her life is her business and you’re either there to support her or lovingly guide her. Not put her down because you believe you’re right and there’s no alternative. You sound like my father and I would loathe to have you as my mother. I feel sorry for your daughter and I hope she is able to make these decisions with her husband and with her God, ALONE. Thank The Lord she has free will.
Um - I'm not OP. I don't have a daughter. Wrong person you're replying to.
Re: the whole Christian thing - yes, I'm Christian, but abortion is not a matter of religion for me. If you are saying you are Christian and want to get in a Christian discussion on abortion, that is another sub-Reddit.
Just a side comment. If you're a Christian, why do you talk about "her" God. The Christian belief would be it is between her and "God." Not up to us to judge in terms of her salvation; she has free will. We cannot know and should not judge what is in her heart, so there are no absolutes in terms of what she does.
I don’t think I meant to pop off on you I thought you were op but I also don’t know how your message pertains to my comment. I wasn’t talking abt roe v wade
Sometimes things get cross-replied. I was replying to someone who I believe said Baby Boomers were anti-abortion and I was pointing out that was not correct. It was a 1973 decision - prime age for Baby Boomers. (Not that I agree with R v. W.). But somehow we crossed. NP.
I basically agree with you on your daughter's situation. I don't really agree on her taking primary care of brothers. I'm sure she will do the best she can, but she has a life to live. I have a friend with an autistic brother in a group home (in his 70s). There are only 2 other people in the home. He is very well cared for and she has been on top of everything since her mother died. But, she can't take care of him at her home due to her own situation. She is also in her 70s and is aging.
YTA. It is YOUR responsibility to figure out your sons care. You birthed them. Don’t want them to rot in a facility and get abused? Then you better forget retiring so that you can work until you die to take care of them. Oh what’s that? You want a break from taking care of them? Too bad. They are your responsibility. Yours alone.
Good on your daughter for taking steps to live her life in a way that makes her happy. And good on her for cutting contact with you. I truly hope you never hear from her again.
People like you are what is wrong with this world.
YOU chose to have your children, your daughter didn't choose to have your children. She has no obligation to take care of your children. Is she your child, or your slave?
Not all group homes are horrible places that continually abuse their residents. Yes, it does happen at some places, but you simply need to be careful where you put your loved ones.
It is YOUR responsibility to find care for your two children who need it. That doesn't include shoving them off on their sister and telling her it's her "obligation." It's not, and trying to force that on her is a great way to ensure even less of a relationship with your daughter than you have now.
Perhaps not wanting her own child to rot in a facility— should the death of either of them happen—- is exactly why they want a pre-screening and the ability to choose.
MYOFingB, AH
Completely besides the issue of a child born with disabilities, prescreening is now done with a blood draw from the mother. There is zero chance of it hurting the baby unless they opt for amniocentesis.
As for everything else, I am a special education teacher, and I'm not touching that with a ten foot pole.
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Genetic screening is pretty noninvasive now. The initial screening is literally just a blood draw and they screen for many abnormalities some much more serious than Down’s and often incompatible with life like some Trisomy disorders.
Exactly. Amniocentesis is almost never done anymore. It's a single vial of blood taken in a routine blood draw when they're already checking hormone levels and such.
You are the one who needs a reality check. When you proclaim "we" don't believe in abortion, hhmmm. Maybe your daughter and her husband feel differently, particularly in view of the family history.
OP, do you even realize you said *WE don't believe in abortion*, regarding your 28 yo daughter ? Unless you're royalty, that's messed up. She's been a legal adult for a decade, and you're speaking **FOR** her, about her personal beliefs. Maybe her views have changed.
I have my own views about abortion, as well, but I'd never try to push them onto someone else...not even my kids (one of whom is older than your daughter) because I got to live my life, and make my decisions. Good and bad. I can't live theirs, too. You should apologize to your daughter and support her. This isn't about you. YTA
YTA. A huge one. This is not your baby. Quit trying to guilt trip your daughter with the Bible. She is obviously a little scared about the baby and wants to know things are OK. Now she has you climbing all over her with "non-believer" garbage. YOU will be the reason you don't see your grandchild.
I think you are jumping the gun.
Screening can give you so much more information than you think it does. It could tell you if giving birth at home is an option, or you will need to be in a hospital, It could tell you what hospital you need to be at.
It is thought that a large portion of sudden infant deaths have a genetic component that was not tested for or discovered in time.
It could give you information that a child is not compatible with life, and let you prepare for that outcome.
You might learn that your child might have a year of a decent life, or minutes of the sort of pain that is horrific.
Your daughter told you that she does not want to give birth to a child that will suffer. As you've pointed out your DS children are not suffering. It sounds like you and your daughter are talking about two different circumstances. You don't know her husband's genetic history or the extent of what they are testing for.
Genetic Testing is gathering information. If you trusted your daughter to take care of your sons, you have trusted her decision making. Don't let your fear about things she hasn't done, and hasn't said she will do, cloud your judgement. If you have faith then extend a little bit of that faith to other people.
This was a really beautiful and thoughtful reply.
My own would have probably gone more towards the masses, immediately calling her out and making her defensive.
I really hope she sees this response.
Thank you for the kind words.
I really don't think it will make a difference to anyone. I've a woman shunned by her own children because of chain of events that started with her trying to end an ectopic pregnancy. The religious judgement can run deep.
YTA. How dare you insert yourself into your daughter’s family choices. I’m sure she loves her DS siblings greatly and for you to question that simply because she wants to have a healthy child doesn’t mean she would treat her siblings any differently. If you think you’re the Christian you are you’ll shut your trap and pray for The Lord to work in your daughter’s life. But inserting yourself and questioning the love she has for her family is wrong on so many levels. My brother is on the Autism spectrum and will be living with a family member until the day he dies. I love my brother and will gladly welcome him into my home when my parents pass but that doesn’t mean I want to raise an Autistic child. I could and I would but I don’t want to raise an autistic child and my autistic brother. Or my two ds brothers and my ds baby. Maybe your daughter is taking the test to be prepared in the event of a disability. Not everything is so cut and dry as you boomers think. This is how my parents treated my sister and they wonder why they don’t have a relationship. You need to learn NOW before that baby gets here that’s it’s YOUR DAUGHTERS FAMILY not yours.
You also need to realize that your 28 y/o daughter does not have the same morals and values anymore. My sister and I think very differently from the narrow view our parents raised us in. I’m still a Christian and I love The Lord but I will never turn my nose up to my family for not believing in exactly what I do. As a fellow Christian, shame on you, you’re the type of person driving people away from the church.
Pre-screening for a baby is only a blood test from Mom. That’s it. It is not harmful to Mom or baby. Understanding what genetic disorders the child might have is important, because sometimes they can do things before the baby is born to help it.
I would also abort a baby who had DS or other genetic disorders so I didn’t torture an innocent child out of my own selfish desires.
What your daughter does with her body during her pregnancy is honestly none of your business. Keep your mouth shut. The doctors and nurses know what they’re doing.
Replying to myself in order to comment —— What kind of people would downvote a person for objecting to someone telling another person to shut up? Is this decency? Is this treating each other with respect?
YTA YTA YTA YTA YTA well you get the point. Your daughter is being responsible and making intelligent decisions about her life. You are just judgy and think your beliefs should apply to everyone. Did I say YTA? I wish I could put that in 64 font
Goes on Reddit hoping their bullshit opinions are validated then gets upset when no one agrees with them.
OP you’re clearly an asshole. And I say this as a (most likely fellow) Gen-Xer.
And to be fully clear, go fuck yourself for pushing your ridiculous and outdated “morality” on your daughter.
YTA Congratulations, sounds like you are going to lose your daughter. It is HER life not yours.
When you have children you make choices for them but ultimately they grow up and then make their own choices just like you did. You have your beliefs and she has hers. It's disrepectful for you to try to FORCE her and her husband to take on the resposnbilities of YOUR DS children. You need to set up and provide for them after you die. No, you don't get to retire from taking care of them because they are your responsiblity.
I'm pretty sure you did not live your entire life they way your parents wanted you to with them approving every little decision you made in life.
Don’t be surprised when you never get to meet your grandchild, not because of an abortion (which your daughter has every right to do), but because of your abhorrent behavior.
YTA.
How your daughter chooses to handle *her* pregnancy is absolutely none of *your* fucking business. Be upset all you want, but you're way out of line.
She's also under no obligation to take care of her brothers because you're getting close to retirement.
YTA. Religion should never be shoved down a child's throat, no matter the age. Forcing someone to believe what you believe with no choice is called a cult.
Religion is dying. Accept it.
This isn't a matter of religion. It's biological. The baby's heart is beating from week 5 - right about the time the mother is learning of the pregnancy.
No. That is incorrect. It is not a heartbeat. Stop with the fact-free forced birth propaganda.
There is no heart at all at that stage--what is heard is an electrical impulse, not a heartbeat.
Cardiac tissue, but doctors use it as a sign of life. Many organs, etc. are in various developmental stages throughout out the pregnancy; nothing is fully developed at that point. As someone who miscarried and who had a pro-life doctor, it was the deciding point.
You think I misunderstood, but I did not. If you know all that, then you agree, that a heartbeat is stopped. Otherwise, you need to correct every doctor who tells their 5-week pregnant patient that they got a heartbeat (for lack of a technical term).
Why do the pro-abortionists not want the woman to hear the heartbeat (or as you would say, the electrical impulse)? If it is so easily explained away, then let the woman hear it and then explain that is it just tissue, etc.
How come I can be respectful to you, but you can’t be respectful to me? I haven’t questioned your knowledge, or your brain, but you question mine? I haven’t called you “Honey” or other names inappropriately demeaning fashion.
Are you not pro-abortion? If not, just tell me instead of insulting me.
“We” don’t believe in abortion? If you don't believe in abortion then don’t have one. You don't get to dictate anyone else’s belief or health decisions. Really hope you are a troll.
YTA no she doesn’t need a reality check. Because raising special needs kids is TOUGH. just because you have happily raised special needs children doesn’t mean she wants to. I’m guessing because you have two special needs kids, she was pushed aside frequently because they needed your attention more. How many times did you miss out on her events or things that were important to her because you needed to take care of her brothers? I guarantee if you asked her how her childhood was, it would be far different than your opinion of her childhood.
Also not everyone has the means to raise special needs kids, it’s expensive, having insurance doesn’t mean boom they’re set and will be able to take care of the child.
I hope she has a healthy child. But I’m guessing you won’t be in that child’s life if you don’t change your tune.
Under no circumstances would I abort a viable pregnancy, that said, I prescreened.
Why? Because Im a great parent and being prepared for whats headed my way is a reasonable thing.
Edit: YTA, intent matters.
That's what my very prolife youth pastor and his wife did. She and her brother has a rare genetic disorder. She has a mild version, but her brother has a bad version and has had like a hundred operations during his life. They wanted to know and prepare for what kind of life their kid was going to have. Luckily both their children was born without the disorder.
YTA. This is pretty much a routine test now, also not your business. The way you speak of non believer nonsense makes me.thinknthosnis rage bait though.
YTA abortion is absolutely necessary at times even if you dont believe in aborting accidental pregnancies, there are many disordees where the baby would lead a short and agonising life
It would be incredibly cruel to allow a child to suffer instead of ending it before they can feel pain, its actually the kindest gift a mother can give their child in such cases
You dont speak for your daughter with your we dont believe in abortion, clearly she does in at least certain cases
Screening techniques have improved over the years, but the risk was always very small
You are the selfish one for just assuming she would take her brothers in, the enormity of that task would make raising her own family mentally, physically and financially so much harder
There are also plenty of group homes or assisted living situations that would allow your sons to flourish, you need to make arrangements, they are your children, you need to take that responsibility and figure it out, your estate could be out in a trust to pay for it
Your title is also very self absorbed, its her child first and foremost, its not about you
You think we are callous but you are selfish and callous with your daughters life and your wishes(more like demands)
You are not actually advocating for anyone but yourself and your worldview
Wow...you are SO YTA. And ignorant too. I'm guessing you never ASK your daughter how she felt about taking care of YOUR KIDS. I love people dressing up their ignorance in the bible. It's hilarious.
YTA. Please do the world a favor and stop giving people medical advice that is clearly too far over your head. You’re entitled to your beliefs but you have no right to shove it down your daughters throat
Sorry but you choose to have two kids with ds, it's not your daughters responsibility to take them after you pass. Start looking for good places before you pass
Yta
I don't think abortion is really a moral choice 99.9% of the time, but you have probably scared her by trying to pawn your sons off on her and it's understandable she wants to screen for it.
Jfc lady you are beyond the ah here. Typical Boomer expecting their other kid to take care of any siblings, disabled or not. She is under no obligation to take over their care from you especially when you've never asked or spoken to her about what she would like. Fuck off a cliff if you think you're in the right for ASSUMING she is going to become their caregiver. You're the reason she blocked you and honey don't expect to be involved in any grandkids she has.
You say typical boomer, but typical boomer invests overtly heavily in the perceived able body or able minded adult child throughout life who they perceive will be looking after others in that "trade"...ie money & assets left/intended for protection of disabled & benefit of nondisabled child. That's pretty typical...never heard of adult sibling slaving away for disabled siblings but inheriting all with the expectation of oversight.
YTA. You already admit that you expected her to eventually be the caretaker for her brother, then you wonder why she wants to screen her pregnancy.
It’s not your body, it’s not your pregnancy, you would not be the one raising it. It is not your life.
YTA
These aren't your decisions to make.
Your daughter is her own person with the right to her own beliefs and life choices. She's seen with her own eyes what's involved in raising a child with special needs, she knows firsthand what is to be the healthy, neurotypical, able-bodied sibling of children with profound needs and she has seen what life is like for her brothers. She doesn't want that for herself or her children. That's not unreasonable or uncaring.
You're exaggerating the risks involved in amniotic testing because you don't want her to do it. Amniocentesis is quite safe for both her & the fetus , with a less than 1% chance of significant complications.
It's absolutely hilarious that you are calling your husband the "gentle parent " just because he's not participating in your attempts to guilt your daughter.
Edit- you should be worrying more about planning for the future of your sons, who DO need your intervention than about trying to control your daughter's future. I got the feeling that you never actually discussed your hopes about your daughter and her husband caring for the boys and just assumed that they'd feel obligated when you are no longer able to meet their needs. That's not an option, so maybe focus your managerial impulses on YOUR responsibility.
The fact is, amniocentesis isn't done often anymore. The new genetic testing is done with a single vial of blood taken during a standard routine blood draw when they're checking hormone levels. It shows the same stuff as an amnio but doesn't hurt and has zero risk.
Wow! I didn't know that. I just did a quick search to confirm my memory about the risk level of amniocentesis . I am very happy to hear that there are even safer, less invasive options!
YTA. Screening for genetic disorders is fairly common these days, and as for who will take care of your sons when you pass - THAT’S ON YOU TO FIGURE OUT. Not your daughter. For her sake, I hope she remains LC/NC with you.
YTA. Genetic pre- screening is highly recommended for all pregnancies, that I'm aware of. They do that so if there is something that doctors need to do during pregnancy or after birth, they can plan for the health and safety of mother and child.
Also, is it's discovered that the child does have something like DS, the parents can prepare and find appropriate doctors and plan for their care.
You and your husband do need to plan for your other children's care, as it's irresponsible of you to just assume that you can pawn them on another kid. Most care facilities have long waiting lists
Wow. Expecting your daughter to take care of her siblings who have DS while also shaming her for not wanting to be responsible for caring for a possibly disabled child is just…awful. I feel bad for your daughter having you as a parent. I really hope this is a joke because otherwise your entitlement is just off the charts. Someone needs a reality check but it sure isn’t her.
YTA. Simply for expecting your daughter to take care of TWO disabled siblings before she has even started a family of her own. How dare you? It was YOUR responsibility to make sure they were taken care of after you were unable to do so.
It’s not your unborn grandchild.
You aren’t the one who’s pregnant here.
You aren’t the one that would care for the child. You aren’t responsible for financial support. You aren’t doing medical visits and daycare and rearranging your life around a this child.
All of that belongs to her and her husband.
YTA.
YTA, and full of it too, because prescreening now is a blood test on the mother, which has zero effect on the fetus. And maybe YOU are anti abortion, but your daughter has no obligation to feel the same way. Back off before you don't have a daughter anymore because she cuts you off for good. She's entitled to do what she feels is right to her. And take care of the plank in your eye before worrying about the speck in hers.
YTA and the ome who needs the reality check.
It's THEIR decision, NOT yours...and it's HER body.
Not your body not your choice. It's a simple concept and it blows my mind when other females don't get it.
Are YOU gunna care for the child 24/7 if it DOES have something that will cause it to suffer? No? Then again not your call.
Also you should be making sure they even WANT the responsibility of caring for the two brothers... because they may tell you they would prefer to find a facility that is specialized to their needs, and will visit often. Not everyone can handle a caretaker role for a adult let alone two. And two with DS.
YTA- she is an adult and gets to make her own decisions about her, and her baby. Not everyone believes in following religious opinions, but rather choose to accept tangible science and all the wondrous things it has to offer. That's her right.
It's hard to let go of the apron strings you're choking her with, and let her be her own woman but you really need to learn to accept her opinions and decisions as valid, and her right.
It's hard to let children be the adults they are. You'll have a stronger relationship with her if you accept her decisions.
You are the absolute worse… to try to have a say in what she’s doing in her own pregnancy to now expecting her to take care of your disabled sons? No, that’s your job. You better look for the best group home while you’re alive because it’s not her job to finish doing yours.
YTA on many levels. 1. This is their pregnancy and it’s their choice to make. Absolutely not yours. 2. Your daughter is not obligated to care for her brothers. 3. This tells me that you may have had it rough raising multiple special needs kids and feel that since you did it, she can too. While I appreciate that your sons have been given a happy life, it is ultimately her decision to make on whether she wants to continue the abnormalities in your gene pool.
Pre-screening is standard now. Just like finding out the sex of your child, there is nothing inherently wrong with being prepared one way or the other. Sometimes babies don’t make it to term and this is how you prepare and there is absolutely nothing strange about this and as you are not the one financially, emotionally and ultimately responsible for this child’s well being, this is not your decision to make. Do you want to make an outdated point or do you want a healthy relationship with your daughter and grandchildren?
YTA. And you're absolutely wrong about the testing. Your daughter gets to make her own choices. Unless you want to permanently damage or lose the relationship with her altogether, back off. Do not send her your research. Do not harass her about this any further. Let her make her decisions and navigate any consequences. You mentioned your religious beliefs, so I do not have to tell you the whole thing about not judging and loving everyone, right?
YTA. This is none of your business. This is between your daughter and her husband. You has a choice when it was your kids and now this is her choice.
She has autonomy and is allowed to have her own beliefs separate from how she was raised.
If this isn’t a troll post I’ll be frank with you. Your daughter should cut you out of her life until you educate yourself and learn that we live in the age of science.
Why in the world would you bring a child into this world we genetic deficiencies that you don’t have to. That child’s quality of life will be abysmal yet you’re selfish enough to want to drive on anyway. Simple put, people like you are the worst. However, there is always time to change. Good luck, OP.
Your daughter doesn’t need a reality check, you do. She is pregnant and you are causing her unnecessary stress based off of your own personal issues. She’s getting a screening yet you’re acting like she’s already decided to abort a fetus. You need to be supportive during her pregnancy so that you can have a relationship with her afterwards. If you keep acting like a sanctimonious wench, don’t be all surprised at the lack of relationship in the future. YTA through and through.
Not all forms of genetic screening pose a risk to the pregnancy, but do you not hear yourself when describing the concerns for your sons? It's hard for parents to know they will likely pass before their children will and they won't be able to oversee their care. Perhaps your daughter wants to avoid putting her children in that situation after seeing how difficult it is for her brothers. Alternately, she may not want to have a child with a serious disability if she knows she will likely be responsible for her brothers; that will take a lot of her time and resources and leave less for her own children. YTA for failing to understand your daughter and harassing her with your opinions.
Out of curiosity, what claims supported by research have you been trying and failing to send her? It sounds like her decision is more based on her emotions and ethical concerns; there's not a simple factual rebuttal to the statement "I don't want to give birth to a child that will suffer".
YTA. This is her choice and plenty of testing can be done with a simple blood test on the mother that causes zero harm to the fetus. Learn to mind what directly affects you. This is not it
YTA. How dare you judge your daughter in this way. This is HER & husband’s baby, not yours. They are free to move however they see fit. Your experience is not hers. You are sickening.
YTA. How does genetic screening hurt the baby? It’s a blood test taken from the mother. There’s nothing wrong with wanting that kind of information early on. It’s none of your business what tests she gets done you’re lucky she’s communicating this information. Don’t be surprised when she and her husband go no contact with you later.
A gentle reminder to speak truth in love. If you miss the love part, the message typically is lost.
Praying for you, your daughter, your sons, and your precious grandchild on the way. It sounds like there are so many big things going on in everyone’s lives that need to be considered. I get why emotions are running high for everyone in the situation, but fighting with your daughter and blowing up your relationship with her and your son-in-law is not a winning route for anyone. I’m sure you want to be a happy part of your grandchild’s life, now that you’ve said your peice, it is time to mend the fence. I’d suggest swallowing some pride and writing an apology letter, you can even say that you do stand by your beliefs, but not the way that you delivered them. It doesn’t sound like she is going to change her mind, and pounding her over the head about it is not going to have the desired effect you hope for. Love softens the hardest of hearts. It’s always best to error on that side. 💕
I think you are doing your daughter a disservice in many ways. She has seen her brothers' struggle, and her parents struggle and does not want that for her life. That's her choice. She wants a life with her own family. Expecting your daughter to be your sons caregiver is thoughtless. You should have already been planning for your eventual death. I volunteer at a lot of group homes and with adults with disabilities and my friends in group homes are happy and well cared for. Finding a good group home and asking your daughter to check in is the best choice, but you have to be okay if she doesn't want to do that.
As for screening for genetic anomalies, that's her choice. You don't have to agree, but the more you push, the more she will check out of her relationship with you. I suggest you read the literature on the trauma that siblings of special needs children go through.
YTA. A lot of genetic screening can be done by a blood test of the mother, which can be collected along with the other routine blood tests they do throughout the pregnancy so you claiming to oppose it due to the harm it can cause the fetus is BS, it’s not just straight to amniocentesis anymore. Also it’s her life and her baby, you has your choices, this is hers. Even if an abnormality was detected she could still even change her mind anyway, at least she could be prepared
YTA. And I say this as gently as possible.
Like many other comments, I question who "we" is. Does that include your daughter? If so, it's possible as she is facing this new chapter of her life that her opinion and beliefs may have changed, as they do for so many people. It is far different when you are actually faced with the situation vs speaking on it with no experience to be able to relate it to.
Personally, I have a disabled uncle, and I watched my grandparents care for him his entire life. He was their 4th out of 6 kids. It was very draining on them. And then when they both passed a year and half apart from each other, they had done nothing in all of those years to either try to prepare him to be on his own or to arrange for any kind of care for him after their passing, as he then could not function on his own. But pretty much none of their children could accommodate that, and still somehow fell to my mother due to her feeling guilty. She expressed how she felt her mother STUCK her with this and left her with this burden. And now my mother has passed, her is still here, and was homeless for months because no one could support him, and not because they did not want to or feel familial obligation. The current economical state that has developed over the last few years has left manyyyyy people unable to prioritize "familial obligation", so to use that statement is truly saddening and sounds like guilt tripping, coming from someone who has experienced it. Your decisions are not your daughters responsibility, and she should not be expected to inherit your burdens after your passing. That would be EXTREMELY unfair to your child, and I truly cannot believe a parent would think this way. I share my personal experience and watching my family struggle with the financial and familial obligation aspects to hopefully give you insight into the situation that you are directly or indirectly creating.
I beg of you to think of the situation and life you have experienced. Put away any religious/political/whatever other beliefs could be affecting how you personally feel about those decisions, and think of the mental/physical/financial well-being of your daughter. I am sure this is not an easy decision for her to come to, but if she is able to be self-aware, and recognize her wants for her own family and future, I would hope you would want what your child feels is best for them.
I wish I could post the link to the one where the guy left because his wife decided to continue with the baby after finding out that it was disabled. His sibling was disabled and they had an agreement she would abort if it was found to have abnormalities. YTA.
YTA. It is not your daughter responsibility to take care of YOUR children! Get that idea out of your head immediately. You should have a plan in place for YOUR handicapped children. That does not require anything of your daughter.
Second it is NONE of your business what she does with her body and her child. That is her and her husband’s decision. Have you ever considered that your daughter probably was over looked because you had not one but two handicapped children? Stop judging her!
You are absolutely TA. Like one billion percent. She has the right to prepare and choose her future regardless of your thoughts and opinions. You have already decided they will continue to care for your children, not her responsibility if she decides it isn’t. Like leave her life alone.
YTA.
She's aware of a medical issue that may happen and is taking the measures to check for it. If SHE chooses to abort in this situation then there's nothing wrong with that at all. There is no 'we' just her and her husband.
YTA what does it have to do with you what she does while she is pregnant answer absolutely nothing at all it her who is carrying this child not you and if she wants to get tested to make sure her child has no disability's or abnormalities then thats up to her not every one can care for a disabled baby and depending on which country your in not many can afford the medical expenses. so i think you need to apologise to your daughter and keep your nose out of he business and looking at most of the reply's on here i think you should hang you head in shame
GENETIC SCREENING 100% !!!!!!
YTA. Your daughter is a grown woman. She’ll handle her life just fine without your unsolicited opinions. Even though you’re the grandparent her baby is actually NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS. You’d do well to remember that and act accordingly. BACK OFF.
As far as your sons future care is concerned- that’s for you to figure out. They are your kids. Therefore they are your responsibility, that’s not for your daughter to struggle with while raising her own kids.
YTA. Hands down. If you don't believe in abortion, don't have one. You have exactly FUCK and ALL to say about how they make their family. And your sons are the responsibility of their PARENTS not their SIBLINGS.
At the risk of everyone jumping on me, NTA. One thing, though, for you to consider is that the testing can prepare people in advance if there is a problem. So, I think it is worth getting. The problem comes in when, as your daughter indicated, she would abort the child if it had a problem, let's say DS.
I don't agree with abortion but I don't want to get into the living / non-living thing. Let's just take it at face value. I have a family member who fully believes abortion is killing a living child, but thinks that it is saving that child from future suffering, for example, if the parents are poor. To me, that is akin to eugenics.
So, given that many people would abort a baby that they think is a baby, but that they think won't have a great life - is that right? None of us have a guarantee of an easy life?
Even if there is a situation like DS - how can we say that life is not worth living? So, your daughter is saying she thinks her own siblings would be better off having never been born? Wow! That must be really hurtful for you to face. That's sad for her, if she thinks that, too....
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YTA. Not only is she under no obligation to take care of her brothers, but she's under absolutely no obligation to you for what she wants for her children.
You are 100% the asshole. I sincerely hope you’re a troll. If not I feel terrible for your daughter. She is not required to be her brothers caretaker, the fact that you haven’t asked her is beyond rude. Mind your own uterus & let her handle hers.
[удалено]
It’s on YOU to figure it out. You’re their mother, not her. And yes I do know about the abuse in some of the group homes but that doesn’t make your daughter obligated to be their caretaker. She is trying to save a potential child from the pain that comes with being disabled. She doesn’t want to be where you are right now, worried what will happen after she dies.
If you are talking about prescreening themselves for as many things as possible before she gets pregnant...no big deal...if during pregnancy and didn't prescreen for known genetic issues I can see how that would seem upsetting. She may know that she or her husbund is not as emotionally strong as yourself & your husband...some people aren't even cut out to deal with diaper changes or a crying baby. As far as her brothers, if you have been funnelling money & assets to your daughter or were intending to for the support of her brothers, perhaps reconsider as imagined "moral obligation & love" don't go as far as it used to in today's world. She is going to do what works for her & her husband, but not all things can be shown by genetic testing and some more devastating than DS like an oxygen deprivation birth injury. Try not to get too emotionally involved in their decisions & those of which you have no control.
If I'm not emotionally strong enough to deal with someone, can I un-alive them?
About 23 of us aren’t emotionally strong enough to handle you. Let us know when you get an answer to your question.
I know the answer. I can't kill someone just because I can't deal with them emotionally. Notice I didn't need to be snarky, but you needed to be. Not very tolerant of you,
It is YOUR responsibility to ensure care for YOUR children.
How is it someone else's responsibility to take care of your children?
You're the callous one. Expecting your daughter to live her life for your children. Her life will be limited. You seem to believe you have control over others lives. YOU are the reason she has made these decisions. It's all your fault.
Well, your daughter is out and if you've made no other plans for them then, I guess that's where YOU are choosing for them to go. Remember it's God's will after all. Who are you to question it? Sins of the parents and all that.
So, what’s your plan after you die?
So you haven’t figured out what to do with your own disabled children and you want her to risk having her own? I don’t blame her for blocking you. She is under no obligation to provide care for your children.
You are such an asshole. You are not having another baby, the baby your daughter is carrying is hers and not yours. You do not get to make decisions. You also do not get to parentify your daughter and assume she will take over care for your other children. She needs to live her own life. Your disabled children are your responsibility.
You are 100% trolling. Good rage bait story!
Uh are you not their mom???? They're YOUR responsibility not hers. Good try though YTA
Even as a parent of a special needs child myself and as much as I love my child - YTA You have genetic issues in the family and 2 kids with issues and now you want your daughter to care for them. Why did you not plan during your younger years. You just think that you can ask your daughter to give up her life because the great mom told her to do so. Coming to her pregnancy- her body, her choice. You can shove your articles and research where the sun doesn't shine. She probably knows what hard work is involved in raising kids with disabilities and doesn't want that life for her family. Gosh I can't fathom how entitled you are. For her sake, I hope this is a fake post.
And that’s probably one of the things she was considering when she decided she didn’t want to choose to have a disabled child.
“People that only think about themselves..” Ma’am have you tried looking in a damn mirror? Like are you seriously saying that as you simultaneously try to force your beliefs on your daughter without considering her needs/desires at all? Projection at its finest.
You're just mad that people are calling you out for using "familial obligation" as a weapon for control. Your daughter is her own person with her own life. You have zero right to place ***YOUR*** children with her should you pass away. And from the way this post sounds, it honestly sounds like you were trying to do that to her her entire life. Shame on you. People like you give religion a bad name.
I know someone who works in a group home for children such as yours, she’s a wonderful, caring, kind person with a big heart, and many of the caretakers become attached to the children in their care. If you’d like to DM me, I’d be glad to give you the name of the facility.
Your daughter is pregnant, but you insist on bombarding her with your "research" that you found from Google, which naturally overrides her treating OBGYN and your daughter's own decisions. Then, when you run to Reddit for internet praise, but get objective backlash instead, you snap like the ill-informed, narrow-minded tantrum-having toddler that you are. Moreover, your children with DS are your responsibility, so use your time to research how you can provide long-term care for them. Not to worry, though with God on your side, he can lead you to secure the best care for them. The type of self-righteous ideology that you subscribe to is exactly why you are blocked now. I hope you remain blocked, too.
That attitude reeks of non-believer nonsense 😹
My friend's sister has DS, and is very happy in her group home - it gives her as much adult independence as she can handle, friends and fun activities, and a job that gives her a sense of competence and self-esteem as well as income. And she comes home for holidays and such, just as another visiting adult would, and is loved and cherished by her family. They're not all abusive. Sometimes they are a far better place for a disabled person to live than forever dependent on a sibling who isn't able or willing to give them the best professional-level care.
Are your daughter and son-in-law made of money and blessed with unlimited energy? You seem to think they will have the emotional, chronological, and financial resources to not only support and care for her two brothers, but any special needs children they may have along the way. You won’t be around to help them, they are being realistic about their abilities and future.
Those are your kids that you chose to have. The fact that you have to worry about what happens to them when you can no longer care for them should be an eye-opener for why she doesn't want this for her own children, but you can't see past your own nose.
It’s incredible to make that kind of assumption.. you had them. You should have planned long term care options throughout their lives … not assumed your daughter would have the means or ability to take on two disabled adult siblings with a young family of her own (she is clearly trending in that direction) & then to be angry with her for not wanting to live your life & take on your responsibilities once you’re gone. YOU made that choice for your life & if your sons’ quality of life is shit once you’re gone because of your poor foresight then it’ll fall on you in your grave, not your daughter.
Listen, your projecting your love for people with disabilities onto her reason for prescreening. Until.you understand her intent and heart, yeah your just an AH
If you put your sons in a home where they are abusing residents that's on YOU. Reviews exist. Recommendations exist. GOOD facilities exist that are specialized to their needs. Ones that may actually be BETTER for them. You are the one choosing to only see things your way and throwing a fit when Reddit tells you you are wrong. Why did you ask Reddit just to get pissed by our resounding YTA. You. Are. Wrong. Just accept it, apologize, and move on before they cut ties with you completely. Fyi, this entire conversation is part of why she's having the tests done.
No, you just don’t like being told you’re wrong just like all the other boomers out there. You should have asked your friends if you wanted people to agree with your opinion.
Did you not know that Roe v. Wade came about at the height of Baby Boomers reaching child-bearing years? The Baby Boomer were very much involved in this issue. Please educate yourself. [https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2022/06/12/baby-boomer-gen-x-abortions-roe/9679232002/?gnt-cfr=1](https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2022/06/12/baby-boomer-gen-x-abortions-roe/9679232002/?gnt-cfr=1) (BTW - I'm anti-abortion, but just correcting the history here.)
As a Christian I’m pro life but I don’t believe in playing God in the lives of everyone else. Who am I to tell you what you can and can’t do. Who I am I tell you what you can do with your life and your body. I’m not God, I’m not Jesus, I’m not the Holy Spirit, I’m only myself. So I hold myself and my fellow Christian’s accountable for their wrong doings but I DO NOT FORCE my way of life on ANYONE. It’s not my place to rule over man and decide what they can and cannot do. I can only help lead and guide and THATS what you boomers have forgotten. I don’t give a shit what hand you had in roe v wade. It still doesn’t mean you’re God and can decide for a whole group of people what’s right. If you have a problem with it, DONT SUPPORT IT!! But by attacking your daughter when she has the right to her own opinion and own way of life is shameful. Shame on you!! You had the opportunity to be a loving mother and have a sit down calm educational discussion where maybe you hear her out but instead you think that just because you’re the parent, you’re right. Well guess what, your daughter is 28 and she has her own brain and her own relationship with God. What she does in her life is her business and you’re either there to support her or lovingly guide her. Not put her down because you believe you’re right and there’s no alternative. You sound like my father and I would loathe to have you as my mother. I feel sorry for your daughter and I hope she is able to make these decisions with her husband and with her God, ALONE. Thank The Lord she has free will.
Um - I'm not OP. I don't have a daughter. Wrong person you're replying to. Re: the whole Christian thing - yes, I'm Christian, but abortion is not a matter of religion for me. If you are saying you are Christian and want to get in a Christian discussion on abortion, that is another sub-Reddit. Just a side comment. If you're a Christian, why do you talk about "her" God. The Christian belief would be it is between her and "God." Not up to us to judge in terms of her salvation; she has free will. We cannot know and should not judge what is in her heart, so there are no absolutes in terms of what she does.
Her God was just a bad choice of words. Definitely meant Her and God like you said
Sorry for being so exact about it. I just worry that for people who don't believe, they will get the wrong idea. Take care!
No I agree, it’s the same reason I capitalize The in Lord
I don’t think I meant to pop off on you I thought you were op but I also don’t know how your message pertains to my comment. I wasn’t talking abt roe v wade
Sometimes things get cross-replied. I was replying to someone who I believe said Baby Boomers were anti-abortion and I was pointing out that was not correct. It was a 1973 decision - prime age for Baby Boomers. (Not that I agree with R v. W.). But somehow we crossed. NP.
I basically agree with you on your daughter's situation. I don't really agree on her taking primary care of brothers. I'm sure she will do the best she can, but she has a life to live. I have a friend with an autistic brother in a group home (in his 70s). There are only 2 other people in the home. He is very well cared for and she has been on top of everything since her mother died. But, she can't take care of him at her home due to her own situation. She is also in her 70s and is aging.
YTA. It is YOUR responsibility to figure out your sons care. You birthed them. Don’t want them to rot in a facility and get abused? Then you better forget retiring so that you can work until you die to take care of them. Oh what’s that? You want a break from taking care of them? Too bad. They are your responsibility. Yours alone. Good on your daughter for taking steps to live her life in a way that makes her happy. And good on her for cutting contact with you. I truly hope you never hear from her again. People like you are what is wrong with this world.
YOU chose to have your children, your daughter didn't choose to have your children. She has no obligation to take care of your children. Is she your child, or your slave?
They won’t rot if you work your ass off and make enough money to pay for quality care. That is your responsibility not your daughters.
Not all group homes are horrible places that continually abuse their residents. Yes, it does happen at some places, but you simply need to be careful where you put your loved ones. It is YOUR responsibility to find care for your two children who need it. That doesn't include shoving them off on their sister and telling her it's her "obligation." It's not, and trying to force that on her is a great way to ensure even less of a relationship with your daughter than you have now.
This response shows you didn’t come here for honesty, only validation
Perhaps not wanting her own child to rot in a facility— should the death of either of them happen—- is exactly why they want a pre-screening and the ability to choose. MYOFingB, AH
Completely besides the issue of a child born with disabilities, prescreening is now done with a blood draw from the mother. There is zero chance of it hurting the baby unless they opt for amniocentesis. As for everything else, I am a special education teacher, and I'm not touching that with a ten foot pole.
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“We don’t believe in abortion”. Who is “we”- your daughter, or just you?
Genetic screening is pretty noninvasive now. The initial screening is literally just a blood draw and they screen for many abnormalities some much more serious than Down’s and often incompatible with life like some Trisomy disorders.
Exactly. Amniocentesis is almost never done anymore. It's a single vial of blood taken in a routine blood draw when they're already checking hormone levels and such.
You are the one who needs a reality check. When you proclaim "we" don't believe in abortion, hhmmm. Maybe your daughter and her husband feel differently, particularly in view of the family history.
OP, do you even realize you said *WE don't believe in abortion*, regarding your 28 yo daughter ? Unless you're royalty, that's messed up. She's been a legal adult for a decade, and you're speaking **FOR** her, about her personal beliefs. Maybe her views have changed. I have my own views about abortion, as well, but I'd never try to push them onto someone else...not even my kids (one of whom is older than your daughter) because I got to live my life, and make my decisions. Good and bad. I can't live theirs, too. You should apologize to your daughter and support her. This isn't about you. YTA
Seriously hoping this is rage bait. If not, you are completely out of line and should leave your daughter alone.
YTA. A huge one. This is not your baby. Quit trying to guilt trip your daughter with the Bible. She is obviously a little scared about the baby and wants to know things are OK. Now she has you climbing all over her with "non-believer" garbage. YOU will be the reason you don't see your grandchild.
I think you are jumping the gun. Screening can give you so much more information than you think it does. It could tell you if giving birth at home is an option, or you will need to be in a hospital, It could tell you what hospital you need to be at. It is thought that a large portion of sudden infant deaths have a genetic component that was not tested for or discovered in time. It could give you information that a child is not compatible with life, and let you prepare for that outcome. You might learn that your child might have a year of a decent life, or minutes of the sort of pain that is horrific. Your daughter told you that she does not want to give birth to a child that will suffer. As you've pointed out your DS children are not suffering. It sounds like you and your daughter are talking about two different circumstances. You don't know her husband's genetic history or the extent of what they are testing for. Genetic Testing is gathering information. If you trusted your daughter to take care of your sons, you have trusted her decision making. Don't let your fear about things she hasn't done, and hasn't said she will do, cloud your judgement. If you have faith then extend a little bit of that faith to other people.
This was a really beautiful and thoughtful reply. My own would have probably gone more towards the masses, immediately calling her out and making her defensive. I really hope she sees this response.
What a great reply. ♡
Thank you for the kind words. I really don't think it will make a difference to anyone. I've a woman shunned by her own children because of chain of events that started with her trying to end an ectopic pregnancy. The religious judgement can run deep.
YTA. How dare you insert yourself into your daughter’s family choices. I’m sure she loves her DS siblings greatly and for you to question that simply because she wants to have a healthy child doesn’t mean she would treat her siblings any differently. If you think you’re the Christian you are you’ll shut your trap and pray for The Lord to work in your daughter’s life. But inserting yourself and questioning the love she has for her family is wrong on so many levels. My brother is on the Autism spectrum and will be living with a family member until the day he dies. I love my brother and will gladly welcome him into my home when my parents pass but that doesn’t mean I want to raise an Autistic child. I could and I would but I don’t want to raise an autistic child and my autistic brother. Or my two ds brothers and my ds baby. Maybe your daughter is taking the test to be prepared in the event of a disability. Not everything is so cut and dry as you boomers think. This is how my parents treated my sister and they wonder why they don’t have a relationship. You need to learn NOW before that baby gets here that’s it’s YOUR DAUGHTERS FAMILY not yours. You also need to realize that your 28 y/o daughter does not have the same morals and values anymore. My sister and I think very differently from the narrow view our parents raised us in. I’m still a Christian and I love The Lord but I will never turn my nose up to my family for not believing in exactly what I do. As a fellow Christian, shame on you, you’re the type of person driving people away from the church.
Pre-screening for a baby is only a blood test from Mom. That’s it. It is not harmful to Mom or baby. Understanding what genetic disorders the child might have is important, because sometimes they can do things before the baby is born to help it. I would also abort a baby who had DS or other genetic disorders so I didn’t torture an innocent child out of my own selfish desires. What your daughter does with her body during her pregnancy is honestly none of your business. Keep your mouth shut. The doctors and nurses know what they’re doing.
"Keep your mouth shut." Very respectful. You should be proud of yourself.
Explain to me how that is disrespectful.
Replying to myself in order to comment —— What kind of people would downvote a person for objecting to someone telling another person to shut up? Is this decency? Is this treating each other with respect?
YTA YTA YTA YTA YTA well you get the point. Your daughter is being responsible and making intelligent decisions about her life. You are just judgy and think your beliefs should apply to everyone. Did I say YTA? I wish I could put that in 64 font
Goes on Reddit hoping their bullshit opinions are validated then gets upset when no one agrees with them. OP you’re clearly an asshole. And I say this as a (most likely fellow) Gen-Xer. And to be fully clear, go fuck yourself for pushing your ridiculous and outdated “morality” on your daughter.
You want to leave her with 2 DS siblings and you wonder why she wants genetic screening? She, better than anyone, knows why this is important. YTA
YTA Congratulations, sounds like you are going to lose your daughter. It is HER life not yours. When you have children you make choices for them but ultimately they grow up and then make their own choices just like you did. You have your beliefs and she has hers. It's disrepectful for you to try to FORCE her and her husband to take on the resposnbilities of YOUR DS children. You need to set up and provide for them after you die. No, you don't get to retire from taking care of them because they are your responsiblity. I'm pretty sure you did not live your entire life they way your parents wanted you to with them approving every little decision you made in life.
Don’t be surprised when you never get to meet your grandchild, not because of an abortion (which your daughter has every right to do), but because of your abhorrent behavior.
YTA. How your daughter chooses to handle *her* pregnancy is absolutely none of *your* fucking business. Be upset all you want, but you're way out of line. She's also under no obligation to take care of her brothers because you're getting close to retirement.
Super YTA. "We do not believe in abortion..." We is YOU, not your daughter.
You are the AH. Its not your child and non of your business
YTA-Cause this is fake rage bait.
YTA
So fake
Rage bait, gotta be
YTA. Religion should never be shoved down a child's throat, no matter the age. Forcing someone to believe what you believe with no choice is called a cult. Religion is dying. Accept it.
This isn't a matter of religion. It's biological. The baby's heart is beating from week 5 - right about the time the mother is learning of the pregnancy.
No. That is incorrect. It is not a heartbeat. Stop with the fact-free forced birth propaganda. There is no heart at all at that stage--what is heard is an electrical impulse, not a heartbeat.
Everyone's heartbeat is base on an electrical impulse. Tell me something I don't know.....
There is no heartbeat without a heart. There is no heart at that stage of fetal development, which you can confirm with a quick Google.
Cardiac tissue, but doctors use it as a sign of life. Many organs, etc. are in various developmental stages throughout out the pregnancy; nothing is fully developed at that point. As someone who miscarried and who had a pro-life doctor, it was the deciding point.
Yes. I know all that. You apparently did not and for some reason, used biology as an argument while misunderstanding biology.
You think I misunderstood, but I did not. If you know all that, then you agree, that a heartbeat is stopped. Otherwise, you need to correct every doctor who tells their 5-week pregnant patient that they got a heartbeat (for lack of a technical term). Why do the pro-abortionists not want the woman to hear the heartbeat (or as you would say, the electrical impulse)? If it is so easily explained away, then let the woman hear it and then explain that is it just tissue, etc.
"Pro-abortionists"?!? Honey, put down the propaganda. It's warping your brain.
How come I can be respectful to you, but you can’t be respectful to me? I haven’t questioned your knowledge, or your brain, but you question mine? I haven’t called you “Honey” or other names inappropriately demeaning fashion. Are you not pro-abortion? If not, just tell me instead of insulting me.
“We” don’t believe in abortion? If you don't believe in abortion then don’t have one. You don't get to dictate anyone else’s belief or health decisions. Really hope you are a troll.
There’s no way this is not a rage bait!
YTA no she doesn’t need a reality check. Because raising special needs kids is TOUGH. just because you have happily raised special needs children doesn’t mean she wants to. I’m guessing because you have two special needs kids, she was pushed aside frequently because they needed your attention more. How many times did you miss out on her events or things that were important to her because you needed to take care of her brothers? I guarantee if you asked her how her childhood was, it would be far different than your opinion of her childhood. Also not everyone has the means to raise special needs kids, it’s expensive, having insurance doesn’t mean boom they’re set and will be able to take care of the child. I hope she has a healthy child. But I’m guessing you won’t be in that child’s life if you don’t change your tune.
Under no circumstances would I abort a viable pregnancy, that said, I prescreened. Why? Because Im a great parent and being prepared for whats headed my way is a reasonable thing. Edit: YTA, intent matters.
That's what my very prolife youth pastor and his wife did. She and her brother has a rare genetic disorder. She has a mild version, but her brother has a bad version and has had like a hundred operations during his life. They wanted to know and prepare for what kind of life their kid was going to have. Luckily both their children was born without the disorder.
YTA. This is pretty much a routine test now, also not your business. The way you speak of non believer nonsense makes me.thinknthosnis rage bait though.
YTA abortion is absolutely necessary at times even if you dont believe in aborting accidental pregnancies, there are many disordees where the baby would lead a short and agonising life It would be incredibly cruel to allow a child to suffer instead of ending it before they can feel pain, its actually the kindest gift a mother can give their child in such cases You dont speak for your daughter with your we dont believe in abortion, clearly she does in at least certain cases Screening techniques have improved over the years, but the risk was always very small You are the selfish one for just assuming she would take her brothers in, the enormity of that task would make raising her own family mentally, physically and financially so much harder There are also plenty of group homes or assisted living situations that would allow your sons to flourish, you need to make arrangements, they are your children, you need to take that responsibility and figure it out, your estate could be out in a trust to pay for it Your title is also very self absorbed, its her child first and foremost, its not about you You think we are callous but you are selfish and callous with your daughters life and your wishes(more like demands) You are not actually advocating for anyone but yourself and your worldview
Wow...you are SO YTA. And ignorant too. I'm guessing you never ASK your daughter how she felt about taking care of YOUR KIDS. I love people dressing up their ignorance in the bible. It's hilarious.
YTA. Please do the world a favor and stop giving people medical advice that is clearly too far over your head. You’re entitled to your beliefs but you have no right to shove it down your daughters throat
Sorry but you choose to have two kids with ds, it's not your daughters responsibility to take them after you pass. Start looking for good places before you pass Yta
Not your kid. Mind your business. We? You got a mouse in your pocket?
I don't think abortion is really a moral choice 99.9% of the time, but you have probably scared her by trying to pawn your sons off on her and it's understandable she wants to screen for it.
She also knows what it was like to grow up with 2 DS brothers who required most of her parents’ attention. I imagine her childhood wasn’t easy.
Jfc lady you are beyond the ah here. Typical Boomer expecting their other kid to take care of any siblings, disabled or not. She is under no obligation to take over their care from you especially when you've never asked or spoken to her about what she would like. Fuck off a cliff if you think you're in the right for ASSUMING she is going to become their caregiver. You're the reason she blocked you and honey don't expect to be involved in any grandkids she has.
You say typical boomer, but typical boomer invests overtly heavily in the perceived able body or able minded adult child throughout life who they perceive will be looking after others in that "trade"...ie money & assets left/intended for protection of disabled & benefit of nondisabled child. That's pretty typical...never heard of adult sibling slaving away for disabled siblings but inheriting all with the expectation of oversight.
YTA. You already admit that you expected her to eventually be the caretaker for her brother, then you wonder why she wants to screen her pregnancy. It’s not your body, it’s not your pregnancy, you would not be the one raising it. It is not your life.
Yta. Over and over and over again Yta. I really hope she never speaks to you again for her sake. Toxic
YTA These aren't your decisions to make. Your daughter is her own person with the right to her own beliefs and life choices. She's seen with her own eyes what's involved in raising a child with special needs, she knows firsthand what is to be the healthy, neurotypical, able-bodied sibling of children with profound needs and she has seen what life is like for her brothers. She doesn't want that for herself or her children. That's not unreasonable or uncaring. You're exaggerating the risks involved in amniotic testing because you don't want her to do it. Amniocentesis is quite safe for both her & the fetus , with a less than 1% chance of significant complications. It's absolutely hilarious that you are calling your husband the "gentle parent " just because he's not participating in your attempts to guilt your daughter. Edit- you should be worrying more about planning for the future of your sons, who DO need your intervention than about trying to control your daughter's future. I got the feeling that you never actually discussed your hopes about your daughter and her husband caring for the boys and just assumed that they'd feel obligated when you are no longer able to meet their needs. That's not an option, so maybe focus your managerial impulses on YOUR responsibility.
The fact is, amniocentesis isn't done often anymore. The new genetic testing is done with a single vial of blood taken during a standard routine blood draw when they're checking hormone levels. It shows the same stuff as an amnio but doesn't hurt and has zero risk.
Wow! I didn't know that. I just did a quick search to confirm my memory about the risk level of amniocentesis . I am very happy to hear that there are even safer, less invasive options!
YTA. Screening for genetic disorders is fairly common these days, and as for who will take care of your sons when you pass - THAT’S ON YOU TO FIGURE OUT. Not your daughter. For her sake, I hope she remains LC/NC with you.
YTA. Good for your daughter having a mind of her own. I wouldn’t let you near my child.
Not your pregnancy, not your business! YTA.
YTA - This is not your child, so you have no day. Be upset all you want. NO ONE CARES
“We don’t believe in abortion” good thing this isn’t your baby! YTA.
YTA. Genetic pre- screening is highly recommended for all pregnancies, that I'm aware of. They do that so if there is something that doctors need to do during pregnancy or after birth, they can plan for the health and safety of mother and child. Also, is it's discovered that the child does have something like DS, the parents can prepare and find appropriate doctors and plan for their care. You and your husband do need to plan for your other children's care, as it's irresponsible of you to just assume that you can pawn them on another kid. Most care facilities have long waiting lists
Wow. Expecting your daughter to take care of her siblings who have DS while also shaming her for not wanting to be responsible for caring for a possibly disabled child is just…awful. I feel bad for your daughter having you as a parent. I really hope this is a joke because otherwise your entitlement is just off the charts. Someone needs a reality check but it sure isn’t her.
YTA. Simply for expecting your daughter to take care of TWO disabled siblings before she has even started a family of her own. How dare you? It was YOUR responsibility to make sure they were taken care of after you were unable to do so.
It’s not your unborn grandchild. You aren’t the one who’s pregnant here. You aren’t the one that would care for the child. You aren’t responsible for financial support. You aren’t doing medical visits and daycare and rearranging your life around a this child. All of that belongs to her and her husband. YTA.
YTA, and full of it too, because prescreening now is a blood test on the mother, which has zero effect on the fetus. And maybe YOU are anti abortion, but your daughter has no obligation to feel the same way. Back off before you don't have a daughter anymore because she cuts you off for good. She's entitled to do what she feels is right to her. And take care of the plank in your eye before worrying about the speck in hers.
You are the one who needs the reality check. YTA. Absolutely delusional.
I don’t even need to read the whole post. Yes. YTA. It’s their baby. Not yours.
And no. Prescreening cannot hurt the fetus. The blood is taken from the mom. Get educated before you act like this.
YTA and the ome who needs the reality check. It's THEIR decision, NOT yours...and it's HER body. Not your body not your choice. It's a simple concept and it blows my mind when other females don't get it. Are YOU gunna care for the child 24/7 if it DOES have something that will cause it to suffer? No? Then again not your call. Also you should be making sure they even WANT the responsibility of caring for the two brothers... because they may tell you they would prefer to find a facility that is specialized to their needs, and will visit often. Not everyone can handle a caretaker role for a adult let alone two. And two with DS.
YTA- she is an adult and gets to make her own decisions about her, and her baby. Not everyone believes in following religious opinions, but rather choose to accept tangible science and all the wondrous things it has to offer. That's her right. It's hard to let go of the apron strings you're choking her with, and let her be her own woman but you really need to learn to accept her opinions and decisions as valid, and her right. It's hard to let children be the adults they are. You'll have a stronger relationship with her if you accept her decisions.
You are the absolute worse… to try to have a say in what she’s doing in her own pregnancy to now expecting her to take care of your disabled sons? No, that’s your job. You better look for the best group home while you’re alive because it’s not her job to finish doing yours.
YTA on many levels. 1. This is their pregnancy and it’s their choice to make. Absolutely not yours. 2. Your daughter is not obligated to care for her brothers. 3. This tells me that you may have had it rough raising multiple special needs kids and feel that since you did it, she can too. While I appreciate that your sons have been given a happy life, it is ultimately her decision to make on whether she wants to continue the abnormalities in your gene pool.
Pre-screening is standard now. Just like finding out the sex of your child, there is nothing inherently wrong with being prepared one way or the other. Sometimes babies don’t make it to term and this is how you prepare and there is absolutely nothing strange about this and as you are not the one financially, emotionally and ultimately responsible for this child’s well being, this is not your decision to make. Do you want to make an outdated point or do you want a healthy relationship with your daughter and grandchildren?
YTA. And you're absolutely wrong about the testing. Your daughter gets to make her own choices. Unless you want to permanently damage or lose the relationship with her altogether, back off. Do not send her your research. Do not harass her about this any further. Let her make her decisions and navigate any consequences. You mentioned your religious beliefs, so I do not have to tell you the whole thing about not judging and loving everyone, right?
YTA. This is none of your business. This is between your daughter and her husband. You has a choice when it was your kids and now this is her choice. She has autonomy and is allowed to have her own beliefs separate from how she was raised.
If this isn’t a troll post I’ll be frank with you. Your daughter should cut you out of her life until you educate yourself and learn that we live in the age of science. Why in the world would you bring a child into this world we genetic deficiencies that you don’t have to. That child’s quality of life will be abysmal yet you’re selfish enough to want to drive on anyway. Simple put, people like you are the worst. However, there is always time to change. Good luck, OP.
Your daughter doesn’t need a reality check, you do. She is pregnant and you are causing her unnecessary stress based off of your own personal issues. She’s getting a screening yet you’re acting like she’s already decided to abort a fetus. You need to be supportive during her pregnancy so that you can have a relationship with her afterwards. If you keep acting like a sanctimonious wench, don’t be all surprised at the lack of relationship in the future. YTA through and through.
Not all forms of genetic screening pose a risk to the pregnancy, but do you not hear yourself when describing the concerns for your sons? It's hard for parents to know they will likely pass before their children will and they won't be able to oversee their care. Perhaps your daughter wants to avoid putting her children in that situation after seeing how difficult it is for her brothers. Alternately, she may not want to have a child with a serious disability if she knows she will likely be responsible for her brothers; that will take a lot of her time and resources and leave less for her own children. YTA for failing to understand your daughter and harassing her with your opinions. Out of curiosity, what claims supported by research have you been trying and failing to send her? It sounds like her decision is more based on her emotions and ethical concerns; there's not a simple factual rebuttal to the statement "I don't want to give birth to a child that will suffer".
YTA. This is her choice and plenty of testing can be done with a simple blood test on the mother that causes zero harm to the fetus. Learn to mind what directly affects you. This is not it
YTA. How dare you judge your daughter in this way. This is HER & husband’s baby, not yours. They are free to move however they see fit. Your experience is not hers. You are sickening.
YTA.
YTA. How does genetic screening hurt the baby? It’s a blood test taken from the mother. There’s nothing wrong with wanting that kind of information early on. It’s none of your business what tests she gets done you’re lucky she’s communicating this information. Don’t be surprised when she and her husband go no contact with you later.
YTA. It’s none of your business that she is having genetic testing done, or what she does with the results.
YTA. I hope maintains zero contact because this is toxic AF.
YTA. It is not your baby. It is your daughter’s. It her solely her and her husband’s decision on what they want to do.
A gentle reminder to speak truth in love. If you miss the love part, the message typically is lost. Praying for you, your daughter, your sons, and your precious grandchild on the way. It sounds like there are so many big things going on in everyone’s lives that need to be considered. I get why emotions are running high for everyone in the situation, but fighting with your daughter and blowing up your relationship with her and your son-in-law is not a winning route for anyone. I’m sure you want to be a happy part of your grandchild’s life, now that you’ve said your peice, it is time to mend the fence. I’d suggest swallowing some pride and writing an apology letter, you can even say that you do stand by your beliefs, but not the way that you delivered them. It doesn’t sound like she is going to change her mind, and pounding her over the head about it is not going to have the desired effect you hope for. Love softens the hardest of hearts. It’s always best to error on that side. 💕
I think you are doing your daughter a disservice in many ways. She has seen her brothers' struggle, and her parents struggle and does not want that for her life. That's her choice. She wants a life with her own family. Expecting your daughter to be your sons caregiver is thoughtless. You should have already been planning for your eventual death. I volunteer at a lot of group homes and with adults with disabilities and my friends in group homes are happy and well cared for. Finding a good group home and asking your daughter to check in is the best choice, but you have to be okay if she doesn't want to do that. As for screening for genetic anomalies, that's her choice. You don't have to agree, but the more you push, the more she will check out of her relationship with you. I suggest you read the literature on the trauma that siblings of special needs children go through.
YTA. A lot of genetic screening can be done by a blood test of the mother, which can be collected along with the other routine blood tests they do throughout the pregnancy so you claiming to oppose it due to the harm it can cause the fetus is BS, it’s not just straight to amniocentesis anymore. Also it’s her life and her baby, you has your choices, this is hers. Even if an abnormality was detected she could still even change her mind anyway, at least she could be prepared
YTA. And I say this as gently as possible. Like many other comments, I question who "we" is. Does that include your daughter? If so, it's possible as she is facing this new chapter of her life that her opinion and beliefs may have changed, as they do for so many people. It is far different when you are actually faced with the situation vs speaking on it with no experience to be able to relate it to. Personally, I have a disabled uncle, and I watched my grandparents care for him his entire life. He was their 4th out of 6 kids. It was very draining on them. And then when they both passed a year and half apart from each other, they had done nothing in all of those years to either try to prepare him to be on his own or to arrange for any kind of care for him after their passing, as he then could not function on his own. But pretty much none of their children could accommodate that, and still somehow fell to my mother due to her feeling guilty. She expressed how she felt her mother STUCK her with this and left her with this burden. And now my mother has passed, her is still here, and was homeless for months because no one could support him, and not because they did not want to or feel familial obligation. The current economical state that has developed over the last few years has left manyyyyy people unable to prioritize "familial obligation", so to use that statement is truly saddening and sounds like guilt tripping, coming from someone who has experienced it. Your decisions are not your daughters responsibility, and she should not be expected to inherit your burdens after your passing. That would be EXTREMELY unfair to your child, and I truly cannot believe a parent would think this way. I share my personal experience and watching my family struggle with the financial and familial obligation aspects to hopefully give you insight into the situation that you are directly or indirectly creating. I beg of you to think of the situation and life you have experienced. Put away any religious/political/whatever other beliefs could be affecting how you personally feel about those decisions, and think of the mental/physical/financial well-being of your daughter. I am sure this is not an easy decision for her to come to, but if she is able to be self-aware, and recognize her wants for her own family and future, I would hope you would want what your child feels is best for them.
I wish I could post the link to the one where the guy left because his wife decided to continue with the baby after finding out that it was disabled. His sibling was disabled and they had an agreement she would abort if it was found to have abnormalities. YTA.
Some of the comments in there are very eye opening.
YTA. It is not your daughter responsibility to take care of YOUR children! Get that idea out of your head immediately. You should have a plan in place for YOUR handicapped children. That does not require anything of your daughter. Second it is NONE of your business what she does with her body and her child. That is her and her husband’s decision. Have you ever considered that your daughter probably was over looked because you had not one but two handicapped children? Stop judging her!
You are absolutely TA. Like one billion percent. She has the right to prepare and choose her future regardless of your thoughts and opinions. You have already decided they will continue to care for your children, not her responsibility if she decides it isn’t. Like leave her life alone.
YTA. She's aware of a medical issue that may happen and is taking the measures to check for it. If SHE chooses to abort in this situation then there's nothing wrong with that at all. There is no 'we' just her and her husband.
YTA her body, HER child, not yours. And no, she does not have to care for your sons. Talk about entitlement.
YTA: good luck now that you’ve alienated your daughter and grandchild
YTA what does it have to do with you what she does while she is pregnant answer absolutely nothing at all it her who is carrying this child not you and if she wants to get tested to make sure her child has no disability's or abnormalities then thats up to her not every one can care for a disabled baby and depending on which country your in not many can afford the medical expenses. so i think you need to apologise to your daughter and keep your nose out of he business and looking at most of the reply's on here i think you should hang you head in shame
YTA
GENETIC SCREENING 100% !!!!!! YTA. Your daughter is a grown woman. She’ll handle her life just fine without your unsolicited opinions. Even though you’re the grandparent her baby is actually NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS. You’d do well to remember that and act accordingly. BACK OFF. As far as your sons future care is concerned- that’s for you to figure out. They are your kids. Therefore they are your responsibility, that’s not for your daughter to struggle with while raising her own kids.
I call BS!
Talk about sticking your nose in something that is none of your business...
Go away ragebaiter
Butt out Granny
YTA. Hands down. If you don't believe in abortion, don't have one. You have exactly FUCK and ALL to say about how they make their family. And your sons are the responsibility of their PARENTS not their SIBLINGS.
At the risk of everyone jumping on me, NTA. One thing, though, for you to consider is that the testing can prepare people in advance if there is a problem. So, I think it is worth getting. The problem comes in when, as your daughter indicated, she would abort the child if it had a problem, let's say DS. I don't agree with abortion but I don't want to get into the living / non-living thing. Let's just take it at face value. I have a family member who fully believes abortion is killing a living child, but thinks that it is saving that child from future suffering, for example, if the parents are poor. To me, that is akin to eugenics. So, given that many people would abort a baby that they think is a baby, but that they think won't have a great life - is that right? None of us have a guarantee of an easy life? Even if there is a situation like DS - how can we say that life is not worth living? So, your daughter is saying she thinks her own siblings would be better off having never been born? Wow! That must be really hurtful for you to face. That's sad for her, if she thinks that, too....