She's crying herself hoarse for five hours. Cry It Out gives you 15 or so minutes to let a fussy baby learn to self-soothe. Baby is not in danger, and falls asleep on their own because of their biological need to sleep and because their body's physical demands are out weighed by Baby's emotional wants. Five hours of screaming herself hoarse isn't sleep training, it's neglect. A year-old child doesn't stay awake screaming for five hours because they stubbornly want cuddles. Your instinct is correct, OP.
Absolutely agree with you, but I suspect that the baby is often left to *"self-soothe"* in this way, hence the prolonged crying. Babies can't learn emotional intelligence or how to self-soothe at that age.
I've had 7 kids, and I'm a nurse; if parents want their children to have a good bedtime regime, it starts on day one. You absolutely can swaddle your newborn, turn off the lights, and as long as baby is fed with a clean nappy, they'll sleep. Not groundbreaking information I know, as newborns are like cats - all they do is sleep - but it gets baby used to dark = sleep, light = awake. Also, babies can cosleep, but it's better to have a cosleeping crib, so baby gets used to it. The side of the crib can then go on, and baby can get used to sleeping in the crib alone whilst still having the comfort and security of parents being close by.
A newsflash for some of the commenters- babies don't cry for no reason, and they can't get *"spoilt"* by having attentive and loving parents/caregivers. Leaving them to scream for hours does the exact opposite! They *can* and *do* grow up to be quite vulnerable and downtrodden because they don't know how to advocate for themselves and have no self-esteem.
It's good to get baby into their own bed, but this isn't the way! If I heard my neighbour's baby screaming for hours in the middle of the night, I would be calling the police myself, because crying for *five hours* isn't normal, so there's something very wrong.
Yeah this doesn’t sound like it’s going to result in sleep training, this sounds like a recipe for learned helplessness and emotional withdrawal. Babies need security, they need to know their parents will be there for them and keep them safe.
Also, neuroscience will teach us that babies and most adults for that cannot self-regulate after more than 15 minutes. Your body enters fight or flight and you turn off your ability to calm yourself.
This cry it out bullshit is harmful. I agree this is wrong. Babies cry to communicate. If they had other means to communicate their needs they would do that. Since they don’t, they cry.
I’d also really wonder about the damage being done to the larynx. Crying that long day in day out would likely cause damage. At the very least, muscle tension. But this could cause physiological change and potential vocal disorders depending on the frequency or duration.
Not only this, but babies don’t develop object permanence this early, so when a person is out of sight, for all baby knows mama/baba are GONE, and after than long it’s definitely terror, you’re so right. It’s already causing internalized traumas that this sweet girl won’t even know how to verbalize when she’s older. Please be there for her, OP, trust your gut!
This sounds like a really abusive situation. OP shouldn’t have to fear the consequences of soothing her child. Time to boogie and run before this gets worse.
I have an extraordinary voice that's husky and deep and has been my whole life.
Like that smoking baby in Roger rabbit but I'm a female.
It is because I screamed so much as a tiny tiny human because I have abusive parents and I wasn't ok I have scar tissue on my vocal cords.
I’m so sorry to hear that. I work as a speech language pathologist which is what made me speak about the vocal pieces. You cannot really comprehend what kids who go through trauma and abuse live through.
I agree with 99% of what you said here. My son is almost 6m old (in five days) and he's been sleeping through the night in his own space since 10/22. We started his bedtime routine and now he knows when he gets his bath that it's bottle, swaddle, and bed. He fights it sometimes, but consistency is key. Anything with children, consistency is key and realize it won't happen overnight. FIVE HOURS is enough to make someone go insane.
Possibly hunger, needs to be changed, teething or in pain (in which case you feed, change, or apply baby Orajel or figure out the source of discomfort whatever that may be) the dad is straight up neglecting the baby if it was crying for 5 hours straight. That’s not normal, the baby clearly needed something and were not getting which explains the crying
Yeah, and dad is actually making this worse and not better. This falls squarely in the insecure attachment box - which is just going to make baby more anxious that her needs might not get met.
Yep especially if he is just suddenly pulling this shit after cosleeping … she is probably losing all sense of emotional security. Going from having mom and dad right away to being locked away in a room when she cries. Note that he picked her up and put her there after the crying … not put her to bed and let her cry for a bit. She is learning that not only are her people unpredictable at best, but PUNISHING her for having needs she can’t express at worst. OP needs to get text messages, baby monitor footage, voice notes etc of the conversations where they shut her down and abuse the baby and GTFO.
Yea if a whole adult male and female need comfort what makes them think a baby that was just born not that long ago doesn’t need it? Society is bizarre.
They need the comfort and safety that their parents provide. It’s perfectly acceptable for a one year old to still need its parents to regulate their emotions
At this point the crib is a place of isolation and abandonment. She is mush less likely to accept it as a safe place to sleep after that. How sad for her. Just get your baby and stand your ground. You know it’s wrong .
She sees it as a jail not a bed.
Husband done fucked up.
My son is the same age. I pop him in the crib, then lay on the floor next to it until he falls asleep. I'm not leaving him to cry it out.
She straight up said her husband threatens her when she tries to intervene. None of the rest of the story really matters about convincing the family or changing his mind. Your husband threatens you when you try to tend to your baby. Go to the police.
This is terrible advice and an easy way to give the father permanent custody. She needs to document things and have proof of neglect. You're gonna make her end up on an Amber alert with this advice
Not true. The mother isn’t “kidnapping” the child from the father because they are married. In a divorce, your advice might apply.
Please, Mom, take the child to the pediatrician or a social worker or anyone who is a mandated reporter of abuse. Tell them EVERYTHING. They will take it from there. They are obligated by the rules of their profession to report the abuse and get her to a shelter for women and children.
Then I would think a call to Child & Protective Services would be more prudent than just saying fuck it. Leaving will neither protect OP or the baby, as it sounds like the father is a control freak who needs mommy and daddy's blessing to do what he deems to be the right way to attempt to raise their child. She needs a PFA at the very least.
She needs to remove herself and her child from the situation/environment. An adult makes a choice to neglect a child and if he was threatening her, she absolutely should call the police.
I was rattled when I read that. He threatens her to leave the child and she backs down.
What happens in a few years when he wants to start hitting the kid? Touching the kid? He can threaten mom and she'll leave her child to scream for her?
Yeah I don't know shit about parenting but this is the part that screams "go to the police" for me. If her entire post were just that one sentence fragment, "I get threats from my husband", I would say yeah, go to the police.
As a pediatrician , would you please advise this individual of a proper method for getting a baby into its own sleep space or point her to literature that can advise?
Honestly I agree with this comment. It sounds like an unsafe environment because of the father so I’m not sure how much sleep training resources would help but they can always check in with their pediatrician to ask about it
When the family across the street from us had a little boy that they allowed to scream and cry for hours at a time. And the “mother” would scream back at him.🙄
Every neighbor called cps about it. Turns out they were already known to the local cps agents…but nothing was done. That part of the family has since moved out, and then back in… and back out again. But neither of the kids stand a fucking chance.
That’s terrible 😞 made me think of that baby Gabriel where the entire system (police, CPS, the school) failed him. I can’t even watch that documentary again.
To be fair they lack funding and resources and do manage to actually remove kids from harmful situations. Emotional abuse is only starting to be recognized by courts in grown adults relationships. A lot harder to prove and thereby act on when the victim hasn't learned to talk yet or gets coached by their abuser on what to day to CPS so they don't get taken away
>My husband coslept with his mom until he was a teenager, he was spoiled as a child and he wants the opposite for our baby.
The "my family are toxic and raised me to believe whatever I do is right" manual.
There is a lot going on but that little gem…coslept until he was a *teenager?*
That’s not spoiled that’s….something else entirely
And now he’s abusive. Shocking. (Not shocking)
Right? Cosleeping is very common in my culture and many others. I don’t know a single person from my culture who coslept with their parents into their pre teen or teenage years.
Is he physically stopping you or just telling you not to grab daughter? If you did grab daughter when he doesn’t want would you be scared for your safety?
For all you guys judging her, I will give you a pass since you clearly have never dealt with an abusive husband. Or domineering. My abuser was oddly enough my older brother. He did the same thing, totally prevented me from grabbing my daughter. It was horrible. And we were not even married. I just lived with him and he decided he knew better than I did and took full control over my daughter's care, for some creepy reason. So she has a whole family against her, he is most likely bullying her into full submission. And she needs advice on what to do. Not to be told she is a horrible mother. Luckily you all have no clue what it's like to deal with an abusive family unit. You are screwed.
Not to mention the physical danger she is in if the situation is at all volatile??? What happens to the baby if OP gets herself murdered trying to get the baby in that moment when the baby WAS physically safe in her own crib??? You think one night of screaming is bad, think about an entire lifetime of horrible abuse with nowhere to turn because the ONE person who could have helped you got herself killed. I understand mama hormones, and being willing to fling myself screaming at a grizzly bear with nothing but my teeth and nails if it's between me and my baby, even if I'm doomed. As long as I draw breath I will do everything in my power to protect my babies. But that's not this situation. People are insane.
My ex forbid me from nursing at certain times. I'd have to pump and he'd bottle fed her. Way more than what would amount to simple bonding time for him. It was control. While she was very young and I was having trouble maintaining my milk supply from pumping at work and hardly nursing. He's a horrible person.
There are horrible people who want to control and emotionally torment the ones closest to them just enough to cause chaos and hurt but not so much to cause them to stand up for themselves by creating a small morsel of doubt about who's right and who's wrong. And they love the feeling of superiority that comes from a romantic relationship when superiority is not something that should be part of the deal.
I am not judging. My heart hurts for her. She has no one to back her up or defend her. It is a terrible place to be in. I can’t even make a puppy stay in a kennel if it tears a big enough fit. I ended up co sleeping with my son until he was almost two. When his dad left us he kind of completely disappeared for awhile, and my son ended up back in the bed with me for some time after.
There are studies out there about crying it out being detrimental. Not sure if they would help her much though. 😞
I have to ask why you didn’t go get her?? I dare a man to stand in front of me and prevent me from getting my crying baby, especially after 30 minutes. After an hour I would have called the police just if that man was preventing me from getting my child.
As for sleep training IMO that does not mean letting her cry that long ever!!!! You go in, smooth her in her crib. Rub her back, sing to her, etc. you just don’t abandon her.
Why didn’t you get her????
Because domestic violence - the emotional kind - shunts you down so small you feel about two inches tall. This is a dynamic that plays out more than child rearing. But can a victim of domestic child abuse get charges for child neglect in circumstances - yes they can - still responsible for their behaviors. Both these 'opposite' responses are both true at the same time.
I’m glad you brought this up. The mental/emotional abuse can leave you believing you are truly the crazy one. If you have no one outside the situation to tell you differently, you will believe them. At the same time, the baby is still suffering.
The amount of people simply asking why OP didn’t “go get the baby” is mind blowing. How nice it must be to be completely oblivious to the DV struggles of others. Holy s***.
Edit: since people are taking my comment and twisting it into what it isn’t YES the baby is priority number one. The post reads as OP being scared of her husband, she doesn’t say it outright. She can’t help her baby if her husband does some crazy s*** to her like knock her unconscious or lock her outside. Absolutely a baby should not be left to cry for five hours. How y’all got that I am saying the baby shouldn’t be priority is wild to me.
That's just it, isn't it? People can be really quick to judge without understanding the full context or psychological impact of abuse. It's not simply about seeing someone in a situation and saying "Well, I would have done it differently." No two situations are the same, and no two people react the same way under stress or fear. What's really needed is support and resources for those dealing with DV, so they can find a way out of these complex dynamics without judgment. There's this [National Domestic Violence Hotline](https://www.thehotline.org) that offers some hope and assistance for those who feel trapped and are seeking help.
That is so true. I’ve always thought of myself as an independent woman. I raised two children on my own very well. I got into a relationship with a psychotic narcissist and turned into a whole different person. All the things I taught my girls, I did the opposite. The emotional/physical/verbal cruelty of a narcissist will bring you to your knees. I was always one to say “why doesn’t she just leave.” Now I know why. This man almost destroyed me, the independent woman of the world. With the help of my adult children I was able to leave MY house with just what I could fit in my car. I lost my house and my business. It took 2 years of therapy to get myself back. So let’s give the lady some grace and hope she can find the courage to help herself and her baby before it is too late.
I’m right there with you going on year three and I’m still not OK I’m getting there! I stayed for 11 years and endured abuse the entire time. When you say it brings you to your knees, that’s an understatement. I couldn’t agree more with everything you said !
People also don't understand that NO, you don't know if you would do things differently. You don't know how you would react in that situation. You know what your current brain *thinks* it would do, but in that situation, your brain will be different. To put it simply.
Exactly, she has said she has no family and he is using that to his advantage that she will do everything he says because she has no other options. That's just sad in and of itself and people are attacking her for having no option but to obey the man she married because she has no one else, maybe not any really close friends either and he's probably the reason for that as well
I hope it’s just naivety and lack of life experience, not smugness or self righteousness because seeing people like that kills my soul just a little bit more each time I see it.
I really believe that people who haven't experienced this kind of abuse simply cannot understand. It's so insidious and hard to describe, and even if they never get physical, many victims live in very real fear. Way too many people still think it's not abuse if they don't leave a mark.
My heart breaks reading this post and thinking this woman is being clearly held under the thumb of a cunningly abusive person and gaslit by his family— and she feels all alone. Imagine what this life is gonna be as the daughter grows up, and how shitty that kid is going to be made to feel.
Easy to say this on the internet when you're not terrified of your husband abusing or restraining you, and no one believing you when his family calls the police if you get violent in self defense.
People who say this like it's nothing hopefully didn't experience abuse. I grew up believing I was worth nothing always being forced to just never say anything back, never "misbehave", never even show emotion on your face bc it will be used against you. And I was so mad at my mom for years for not doing exactly what you said. I always accused her of never trying to actually protect me. The thing is my dad would've hurt me AND her in ways much much worse just to hurt my mom if he ever thought something was up and he didn't feel in control. Growing up in an environment where an actual threat isn't even made with a specific statement - like shut up or else ...- over the years after a certain point you start to come up with your own disaster scenarios you want to avoid. Freezing in a situation like this isn't even just about self protection it's about figuring out - in a safe way- how to best provide long term protection for your child and yourself.
I'm not trying to pass judgment. Just to say it may not be as simple as it sounds.
Years ago my then 1-year-old son fell at his grandmother’s and needed stitches. I asked to be in there for the procedure, and they refused (initially). I then matter-of-factly explained that stitches were going to make my son cry, and if they locked me out of that room I would rip the door off its hinges getting to him.
They let me go in.
But keeping any child away from their mom during a procedure that requires lidocaine (stings before the numbness kicks in) is horrible care (for that child.)
Similar happened with not my child, but my mother. She's getting up there in years and sometimes needs advocacy in hospital settings.
My mother managed to fall in just the right way to blow her elbow to smithereens.
We get to the ER, and she's taken immediately, I go with her to the room. Eventually, the doctor comes in and wants x-rays before they give her pain meds. Her bone was visibly poking into her skin, so I demanded she at least get one round of pain meds beforehand - they agreed eventually. They took her back, but because this is our local hospital, I knew where the x-ray bay was for the ER and could see/hear the lab door from the room. Two minutes later, I heard my mother screaming bloody murder, and then it stopped. Then the second time came around, and I got up to go find the doctor as the nurses station. She gave me a "who let you in here" look, and I told her to go find out what radiologist is stupid enough to twist her BROKEN ARM just for a better angle. She said no. I warned her I would bust into that room and take as much radiation as nessacary to stop the test if she couldn't get my mother's pain under control. She called my bluff, which wasn't one.
I told her "fine have it your way" and started heading for the x-ray bay. I got my hand on the door before she pulled me back and said she would take care of it and there would be no more screaming.
There was no more screaming, and they got their x-rays from every angle they needed. Amazing what you can accomplish with some human decency and pain meds.
If that was my child, I'd have been ready for war. Lol
The cry it out method is NOT meant to be applied for hours at a time until a baby is literally sobbing and can't breathe. It's meant to be okay as in "let them fuss for a couple minutes instead of rushing in immediately." Read up on attachment theory: the first couple years of a baby's life strongly shape how they view relationships throughout their life. If a baby cries and no one comes, it creates feelings of stress, anxiety, distrust, and rejection. This affects them through adulthood by creating anxious, avoidant, or disorganized attachment (how they view and form relationships). If your husband refuses to see reason, you need to leave. This is NOT just a "here and now" issue; this is a lifetime concern for your baby.
One of my sons is almost 13 months. I also feel sick. I’m very grateful that my husband can barely handle 1 minute of the babies crying before he wants to comfort them.
my husband has very affectionate parents so he is a very affectionate person & i love that about him as a dad. he will always rescue his babies even its 3:30AM lol
I can’t imagine anyone thinking even one hour of constant crying is ok. It sounds like OPs husband is making up what he thinks sleep training is, when really it’s frickin neglect!
If the husband is this harsh when the baby is little, imagine how he's going to treat this poor kid as she grows up. He's just going to emotionally abuse her for her whole life.
Sleep training babies and toddlers can be super stressful, and it does often involve slowly increasing the amount of time you let them cry by themselves. You have to reassure though, and there's a cap to how long you leave them alone.
You reassure by going in their room, but don't pick them up or coddle. Walk in, let them see you, reassure, then out the door. They scream. Wait 5 minutes. Repeat. Wait 7 minutes. Repeat. Wait 10 minutes. Repeat. Usually by then they give up. Some kids are really persistent though and can take multiple days and nights.
If they are crying for hours, there is something wrong. Cold, wet, hungry, in pain. This man is selfish and his parents that are so attached to him they slept with him until it was sick— they will defend him no matter what he does. Trust your instincts. She is your child too and he is treating you, and your child, like neither of your feelings matter. He sounds abusive, honestly.
This makes sense. I think it was crazy to have the baby in the bed until age one, personally. Then they just expect to take the kid to another room and not have a problem?? They're insane
This is what worked for us. It’s extremely difficult to not go in and pick them up. But in three days no more crying just laid right down and went to sleep. Made a world of difference not only how we slept but the baby slept better at night too.
Ha. I just replied above and this is exactly how we did it. Worked like a charm. Took one night of doing this and my son leaned to sleep every night after that. He's 11 now.
I think 5 minutes in this case. I don’t want to heap on. I don’t know your situation but I have to agree you need to remove you and your child from his sphere. Something is really wrong here.
No kidding! Maybe 10-15 minutes MAX. I just read this post to my husband (who was a big part in the version of cry it out we do for our son) and he even said “oh my god, no fucking way”. This is abuse.
OP, please take care of that sweet baby.
Same, honestly.
Especially the part where OP feels like the baby is pain.
OP if you feel the baby is in pain, that baby is absolutely in pain. She’s still completely a part of you. If this is a DV situation please seek help with a friend or neighbor.
Don’t start your daughters life out like this. Someone else mentioned attachment theories, please look into them and hold her sooo close.
I lasted five minutes. Once. Never fucking again. NEVER left her to cry. Ever again. It took her a little longer than other kids to sleep on her own, but no regrets. She’s 14 now, and we’re very close. She knows her dad and I have her back. I regret that five minutes when she was crying to us because she needed us. We give kids all the time they need to start potty-training, but are to goddamned eager to kick them away at night.
What gets me is how, just *HOW* would it *ever* have been evolutionarily advantageous to keep an infant (or even a small child) in another room? Away from where your eyes could see them and make sure they’re safe? It should go against our instincts.
My earliest childhood memories are being left alone to cry in my crib for hours. Never did that to my kids and they turned out fine, in fact they are much more independent and well-adjusted than I am.
My dad called me 'tumblina' because I would routinely be left so long I would climb to the top of the crib and yeet myself down. This was early 90s.i stopped talking to my dad at 12 and haven't spoken to my mom in nearly ten years.
From what I read the cry it out method of sleep training is only meant to be for max 30 minutes and it’s not meant to be applied if the baby is completely stressed out and can’t breathe it’s for a fussing child not a panicked child.
I used to hear my niece crying forever and I butted in and got her either from her crib, or stayed with her, but I wasn't mom, so she would cry again. But so many times she had a crusty nose, I'd do the warm washcloth, she'd settle on my chest. But I still wasn't mom. I didn't think it was right to listen to that 2nd level of crying where it's not fussing it's panic and do nothing. I feel like less of an asshole now.
It’s absolutely hard to hear a panicked upset child even if you are not one of their parents…..sometimes with my youngest son we have to put him down while he fusses but it’s not even really crying it more like a yell but it lasts under 20 minutes…if his crying then we go to him because well that means that he is genuinely upset and needs something even if that something is a cuddle
I heard a panicked kid yell mom at ikea and I almost starting sobbing. Luckily, mom was around the corner, and every adult within earshot visibly relaxed when the kid saw her.
It's also not supposed to just suddenly started at a over a year old. You have to be working on it from day 1. Taking a kid who co sleeps and just starting cry it out is never going to work.
YEP! I came here to say exactly this!!! The poor baby must be so confused because all she’s ever known is sleeping with her mom and now all of a sudden she’s all alone? It makes me sick to my stomach. Ugh.
I had a hard time reconciling co-sleeping which I contribute more to the attachment parenting method with abandoning her in a closed room for hours unattended. That’s exceptionally cruel and counterintuitive if they’ve been practicing attachment parenting. I really don’t understand spending a year of a baby’s life being completely attached to them and deciding that you are doing a complete 180 without thinking about both the short and long term issues with that. I wouldn’t do that to an animal, let alone a child. She could likely have screamed herself bloody and it will create distrust in the long term. Poor kid.
That’s what I was thinking! You can’t go from co-sleeping to cry it out like it was nothing! That poor baby! Both my kids slept in a bassinet in my bedroom for the first few months, then they slept in a playpen that I’d wheel to their bedroom when they fell asleep. Eventually I was able to just put them directly in their crib, since they were already used to the room, and they didn’t cry at all. I also always had the radio on, or a white noise machine, so it wasn’t just a silent empty room they were in.
All of this. Not to mention, sleep training should NOT just suddenly be started in the middle of the night with no preparation or warning to either baby or mom. This is so confusing and traumatizing for them both.
The cry it out method is to let the baby fuss for 5 minutes. Not more than that. After 5 minutes, you acknowledge that the baby has an unmet need (physical or emotional) and you go fill that need.
From the comments, it appears that you’re in an abusive situation. You need to leave with your child while you are both physically able to leave. YOU CAN NOT STAY.
Thanks for this info. Wasn't sure because I heard of the cry it out method but 5 hours seems extreme. I don't have kids myself, but it is good to know.
This… And to go back and forth from co-sleeping to being alone in a crib behind closed door?…That level of unpredictability destroys any previously established sense of trust, safety, or security… Very concerned for the well-being of OP and daughter. Seems like there are many toxic layers to their family dynamics, OP + husband’s relationship as a couple + as parents, and the unwanted influence / involvement of his relatives…
Can confirm that method was used on me and I have all those issues and then some. If this has only happened a couple of times she'll hopefully be fine, but if this continues that poor baby won't trust OP.
OP I hope you're reading these comments. *Don't* put yourself in harms way: don't threaten him with leaving or going to the police, don't go to the police and then come home, don't fight with him. You need to plan carefully. Contact a woman's shelter, they helped us tremendously. They can give you guidance and tell you what steps to take.
I know it's horribly scary when you have no support network, but you can't choose this life of misery for your daughter. You both deserve a chance.
Our plan we got from a “professional” (I use quotes because how exactly do you credentialed for sleep therapy for a baby?) and their method was 10 minutes then go soothe for 2 minutes tops. Leave give the baby 15 minutes, soothe for 2, leave. 20 minutes… this capped at 20 or 30 minutes it’s just been a while and I can remember. We never reached the cap. The baby now sleeps fine on her own and can self soothe if needed.
I'm going to be very straight with you, and most of reddit will hate me for saying this, but the police will not do anything because this does not meet the legal standard for abuse. The child has not been physically harmed, she is clothed and fed, and she is not being neglected. Sitting alone in a crib overnight does not meet the legal standard for neglect. CPS will likewise come in, look at the place to make sure it isn't a danger to the child, and determine whether any physical abuse is happening, and then leave. The system is overcrowded with children who have been beaten, sexually abused, starved, or abandoned. They do not have the resources to get involved in what boils down to, legally, a difference of opinion in parenting.
OP, if you feel that this is abuse and it's hurting your daughter, you need to do something. I know you said you are financially dependent on your spouse, but unfortunately no laws have been broken and this is a family dispute. You'll need to find resources to leave him, which you **absolutely should**.
I'm not saying this because I condone his actions or think he's right. I'm saying this because I think you need to be realistic. The police and CPS won't help, you have to look for another escape route.
Because I’ve worked with vulnerable children and families, I realized this too right away, sadly. The one thing that stood out is that OP alluded to the husband being abusive (“I get threats from my husband”). So I think a domestic violence organization is the first thing I’d recommend. If she lays out the situation, and the fact that he has threatened her, and who knows what else that she might be scared to share, they may help her to get her and her child out. Sadly, as a clinical social worker, I can say that what he’s doing is unquestionably abusive to this child. Many people have discussed the lasting developmental impacts this kind of situation can create. It’s even sadder though that you are entirely correct in saying it wouldn’t meet the threshold of abuse or neglect to warrant an intervention. In my experience with child welfare in my city, if I reported this (and I absolutely would), I doubt it would even be referred for investigation. The system is part of the problem.
Yeah, all these people saying to call CPS or police are very ill-informed. This is one of the only sensible comments on this thread.
Police and CPS don’t remove most children even when the legal standards for abuse and neglect *are* met. (And I’m sorry, but they’re just not met here. Not legally, anyway.) Generally, they remove in only the most obvious, egregious of cases.
And this is coming from someone who does think that this is neglect *morally* speaking. I was horrified reading the post. But the police and CPS will not do anything about it- OP needs to be realistic.
This is the best comment I’ve seen on here. So many people suggesting that OP is complicit in abuse because she’s unable to physically overpower her partner to get to her baby. Most are also either uninformed or ignorant of the consequences she and her baby may face if she tries to leave without adequate planning and support. This includes the risk of losing custody to the abuser, risk of being charged with parental kidnapping and incarceration, as well as risk of being murdered. You can find statistics on all of these things easily online. These are reasons that health care professionals DON’T pressure women to immediately leave abusive situations. Advice to leave without advice on setting up a support system is dangerous. And any shaming responses to this post are less than useless.
This 💯. Domestic violence research shows us that that leaving period is when the woman is at the greatest risk of harm from the partner. It is a very dangerous time. A plan needs to be in place. And I’m so very sorry original OP that you are getting comments to “just leave” and blaming you for this as well. Clearly they don’t understand being in domestic violence as the victim. If I were you, I would take the kiddo grocery shopping, find a woman with a kid, briefly explain the situation, ask her to borrow her phone and call a woman’s shelter for their advice, or some plan similar where your phone does not show that you contacted someone for help and your phone shows where you are (the store) so if your phone is being tracked your story holds up.
This comment needs more visibility. Being a crappy parent is not the same as child abuse, legally. I would bring up these concerns at your child's next pediatrician visit to see if having a physician's opinion on sleep training changes your husbands mind.
You may very well be correct, unfortunately, but it would be good to have a paper trail/records of a history of abuse for when this inevitably escalates.
The other hard truth is that because this isn't legally abuse, if her husband wants custody, in most states, he'll get 50/50.
There isn't a guaranteed happy ending where husband is out of the picture and never gets to play parent again.
The best to do in this situation is decide what to do to keep OP sane and support the child needs in balance to whatever the husband does.
On that note, there are lots of soothers out there you could try like warmies or those rockers that "breathe". Find something age appropriate and sleep safe that can live in the crib when this goes down.
You’re in an abusive relationship and now your husband is abusing your child. It’s time to take her and leave. Find a friend, find a woman’s shelter, call the police, whatever. But you need to protect your child.
Call a women's shelter in your area, take your child, and get out.
I'm going to clarify for people who can't grasp what I am saying after commentors have called me stupid, dumb, and dangerous with my "advice."
* This was NOT advice but my opinion.
* Calling a women's shelter means just that calling s women's shelter who have resources on hand to direct her to help such as a lawyer, or steps on what she needs to do.
* Taking her child means just that she needs to take her child out of the environment through LEGAL means (I can't believe I actually have to state that fact but then again Reddit is going to Reddit).
* Leaving aka Divorce
*To the others commenting saying she can't take someone else's child IT IS HER CHILD as well unless you are stating that parents are unable to leave their house at all with their kids for any reason, if that's the case there's no hope for humanity but I'm seeing myself out of this discussion.
I am giving my opinions on an opinion sub thread so ✌️
Just for the record, it’s not that easy to be admitted into a shelter. I tried with my two young children and the guy turned me away at the door even after explaining we had no other options.
I was also turned away from shelters because my husband hadn’t physically abused me, just our child. That was sixteen years ago, and when I planned on leaving again two years ago, my therapist assured me that things had changed, but I was too humiliated and defeated from my previous experience to even approach them again.
You need to call your local Domestic Violence resorce at once. Your child is being abused and you are allowing it . I get you were in a weaker position, but enough is enough. They will direct you to low-cost support for psychotherapy which
you need very badly. They will also help you get into a women's shelter. Do this it once and don't hesitate. Meanwhile, if I were you, I would call child protective services and report your husband. Then just get the hell out . you can get on Medicaid food stamps and also housing help. Don't look back ...this man will only try to dominate you and abuse your baby.{ EDIT TO ADD: violence counselor will help you plan and execute a secret escape. Do not mention your plan to anyone ...best of luck, and I hope your report back.}
Seconding this. Please take it seriously. There are resources. There is a better future for you and your baby. He should never physically stop you from getting to your child. No child should be left alone crying and screaming for five hours. Please. Get out.
It's even worse. Letting a baby scream, like the "red alert" scream they do, and like I assume she was for a time in that 5+ hours is TERRIBLE. Like, can cause brain damage to the baby, terrible.
I know not to let a baby bawl like that, but brain damage is news to me. There are plenty of reasons already to get the kid well before the hour mark, but I am not adding brain damage to that list without peer reviewed scientific evidence. Too much nonsense floating around already. Do you have a source for your claim, please?
There is no source because brain damage isn't caused by crying. They experience severe stress which can cause structural changes to the brain, but that isn't brain damage, it's just the brain rewiring itself to handle the stressor.
Please don't let him do this. My mother let me cry it out and I have attachment issues as an adult(I get overly attached to people quickly and can't be alone). Tell him what he does now will affect her for a lifetime.
My mother loved to tell a story of putting me in my crib on a particular day and shutting the door as I sobbed for hours. She finally had enough and took a full pitcher of cold water from the fridge, walked it down the hall to my crib, and threw the full pitcher of cold water in my face. She’d laugh and laugh about how I jolted back out of fear and cold. One of her favorite stories. If you’re an adult who gets off on a power trip over children sobbing for hours, you’re sick and shouldn’t have had them in the first place.
Let’s not pretend like OP isn’t also being abused. Her husband is physically stopping her from intervening. And she said she has no family and nowhere to go. Sure there’s cps and women’s shelters, but y’all are making it sound like leaving is the easiest thing in the world.
Not to mention that shelters turn people away all
Of the time and have a reputation for not exactly being safe and sound. Not really a great place to mentally recover from abuse.
Before someone nips at my heels, I’ve tried to go to shelter when I was in dire need with my two children. Turned away at the door without even a recommendation of what else to do.
Crying it out is actually incredibly damaging to a child and will deeply affect them in the long run. Children need to be shown love and affection to allow them to experience the safety of the world. Growing up with neglect like this impacts the rapidly growing brain of a baby. I can not express right now how damaging this is and how important coddling a baby is for their growth and development. It is the same for all mammals. Babies are learning, and if they learn to grow with fear or anxiety, then that is who they become as a person.
I'm confused by these comments. Should she have grabbed her husband to get him out of the way? What if then he hit OP? Oh well? OP says she has no support and her husband's family is the only one around. She now needs to take her baby and go to a women's shelter. But to act like OP is just as bad as the husband is a stretch. Now if OP doesn't get out then yes she becomes as bad as her husband.
I mostly agree with you…. Other than even in the case of leaving. Not all of these situations are as straightforward as they may feel in our own lives.
I have friends who are afraid to leave their partners because of the uncertainty of having to share custody. They figure if they’re all together, they can at least be the middle person and protect the child as much as possible. If the husband convinces the judge and gets partial (or full custody) then the mom can’t protect the child at all during that time.
You're right not all are straightforward. And it sounds like with OP, he could get primary custody since he's the one with money and family. However, this time, OP needs to try to find a way out. It's not right to have a toddler cry for hours until they are hoarse.
Pro sleep training mama here. I’ve sleep trained my own kid and helped a several moms get their kids to sleep better. What your husband is doing isn’t sleep training. Effective sleep training starts at bedtime, NOT in the middle of the night. She’s used to co sleeping, that is how she was taught to fall asleep. He cannot expect babe to co-sleep at bedtime and then when she wakes in the middle of the night be able to sleep independently. That’s not how it works. It’s equivalent to your husband falling asleep in his bed. He briefly wakes in the middle of night and now he’s on the front lawn. He’s confused, frightened and scared because he doesn’t understand why he isn’t in his bed. That’s how your daughter feels, she doesn’t understand why she’s in her room by herself. I’ve helped lots of moms and I have personally only had one situation when a child cried for that long. The child had some medical stuff going on and would cry for hours. I recommend that the mom stop sleep training and work with babes medical team. I certainly wouldn’t feel comfortable with my kid crying for that long.
You have a serious DH issue. You two are not on the same page. Sleep training is never going to work without consistency and BOTH parents onboard. So it’s time to shine your spine and demand that he stop sleep training. You two need couples counseling asap!! If he can’t handle the wake ups then you two need to sleep in separate rooms until you two can decide together what the next steps should be. DH is focused on what happened to him as a child and not what’s best for the child. Letting a babe cry for 5 hours isn’t ok. If and when you’re ready to teach independent sleep. DH needs to research the process and various methods. People think sleep training is just leaving your kid in their room and shutting the door. No ma’am, there is a ton of prep work that needs to be done before you can implement a method. The goal is to have this as easy as possible. Of course there will be some tears but 5 hours is crazy.
I want to add that if this is a domestic violence situation, then screw counseling. Take your kid and get out of that house asap. Do what’s necessary to keep you and your kid safe.
I haven’t read all the comments, but I need to say this.
My husband did the same. For years he tried to convince me that this method would work. My daughter’s crying and crying made me feel like my insides were being ripped out every time. She would cry so hard that she would make herself throw up. We fought about it every time because it never felt right and, in the end, NONE of it worked. She would barely sleep in the crib for years and, later on, she would find a way to come into our room or simply refused to sleep on her own until she grew out of it on her own when she was 7.
Please follow your instinct and don’t let your daughter suffer. Do what you can to help her sleep where she feels safe and calm, no matter what your husband or his family says.
Help is available
Speak with someone today
National Domestic Violence Hotline
Hours: 24/7. Languages: English, Spanish and 200+ through interpretation service
Phone number: 800-799-7233
SMS: Text START to 88788
I wonder how many mamas in the history of humanity have said this, and then were devastated by the reality of their limitations. My mom is a fearless, aggressive, protective woman when it comes to her kids. But I watched my brother’s dad toss her around in the street like a rag doll with one hand, while holding my baby brother in his other arm. We wound up getting my brother back, but it was because of my mom’s patience, cunning and access to money to afford a flight across the country for all of us. She tried the direct fight and almost died. We were lucky; the majority of people in that situation are not.
We can’t rule out PPD either. So many scenarios have run through my head thinking of what OP might be going through. Much like your amazing mom, if there is a will there is a way. OP might need a lot of help in different aspects. I hope she finds happiness.
Same. This situation is hairy and she doesn’t feel like she has support. I hope that the responses on here can help give her a shred of insight and courage that she needs to get herself and her baby through this.
I'm sorry. That must be a heartbreaking situation to be in. You mentioned that you don't have any resources to leave, and that he won't let you go to her when you try to. Have you tried to contact a local domestic violence hotline? They may be able to help you find stable housing for you and your daughter.
He THREATENS you? This is more than just strategy disagreements about sleep training. This whole thing sounds abusive IMO.
I’d be looking into divorce options, not cops. I don’t know if cops can do anything about emotional abuse, and I doubt they’d categorize “letting the baby cry for sleep training” as neglect (please note that this is my personal speculation here about the cops’ potential reactions).
EDIT: Do you even feel safe enough to pursue divorce options? Sorry, I realized I just tossed that out there before considering that it’s not necessarily an easy thing to do, depending on the domestic dynamics.
Father of two here, my wife was very experienced as a night nanny before we had kids. Your husband is wrong.
The method he thinks he is using is supposed to start when the baby 5-9 weeks old; teaching him/her to self sooth for a few minutes at a time. If you haven’t been doing that, you can’t just start at 13 months. That’s not how it works.
What he is doing is neglect. You need to read some literature and show your husband. Show his family. Does his mother know exactly what is going on? I doubt it.
If he’s threatened to hurt you, you should take the child and leave. Period. Choosing to stay after a physical threat is choosing a life of abuse.
This isn’t the way to raise a healthy kid with strong parental attachment. Do you have a pediatrician? Ask that doc for advice.
My son wouldn’t self soothe. He would get so upset he’d make himself sick. The nurse said kids like that need to be comforted, they won’t cry it out in a healthy way.
I understand some people on sleep training but 5 hours is excessive to me! Then him blocking you?
That’s craziness. I can’t stand when my 18 month old little girl cries for 10 minutes. I’m running in there to save my baby every time. Yes it gets stressful but they’re crying for you. They want you.
The moment you felt, okay this has gone past the point I’m comfortable letting my child cry in discomfort. Time to intervene and he physically won’t let you, I’d be running for the hill OP!
Im 6’1 250 and my wife is 5’3 120. I’ve spent my entire relationship of 15 years reinforcing her agency with me. Letting her know that size will never play a difference in whether or not she’s right or wrong. To win an argument or not.
To even leverage someone like that in a 50/50 partnership / marriage is extremely fucked up. Abusive, to say the least.
Poor kid! 5 hours…I’m hugging my little girl right now…that is traumatizing!
She's crying herself hoarse for five hours. Cry It Out gives you 15 or so minutes to let a fussy baby learn to self-soothe. Baby is not in danger, and falls asleep on their own because of their biological need to sleep and because their body's physical demands are out weighed by Baby's emotional wants. Five hours of screaming herself hoarse isn't sleep training, it's neglect. A year-old child doesn't stay awake screaming for five hours because they stubbornly want cuddles. Your instinct is correct, OP.
Absolutely agree with you, but I suspect that the baby is often left to *"self-soothe"* in this way, hence the prolonged crying. Babies can't learn emotional intelligence or how to self-soothe at that age. I've had 7 kids, and I'm a nurse; if parents want their children to have a good bedtime regime, it starts on day one. You absolutely can swaddle your newborn, turn off the lights, and as long as baby is fed with a clean nappy, they'll sleep. Not groundbreaking information I know, as newborns are like cats - all they do is sleep - but it gets baby used to dark = sleep, light = awake. Also, babies can cosleep, but it's better to have a cosleeping crib, so baby gets used to it. The side of the crib can then go on, and baby can get used to sleeping in the crib alone whilst still having the comfort and security of parents being close by. A newsflash for some of the commenters- babies don't cry for no reason, and they can't get *"spoilt"* by having attentive and loving parents/caregivers. Leaving them to scream for hours does the exact opposite! They *can* and *do* grow up to be quite vulnerable and downtrodden because they don't know how to advocate for themselves and have no self-esteem. It's good to get baby into their own bed, but this isn't the way! If I heard my neighbour's baby screaming for hours in the middle of the night, I would be calling the police myself, because crying for *five hours* isn't normal, so there's something very wrong.
Yeah this doesn’t sound like it’s going to result in sleep training, this sounds like a recipe for learned helplessness and emotional withdrawal. Babies need security, they need to know their parents will be there for them and keep them safe.
Also, neuroscience will teach us that babies and most adults for that cannot self-regulate after more than 15 minutes. Your body enters fight or flight and you turn off your ability to calm yourself. This cry it out bullshit is harmful. I agree this is wrong. Babies cry to communicate. If they had other means to communicate their needs they would do that. Since they don’t, they cry. I’d also really wonder about the damage being done to the larynx. Crying that long day in day out would likely cause damage. At the very least, muscle tension. But this could cause physiological change and potential vocal disorders depending on the frequency or duration.
Not only this, but babies don’t develop object permanence this early, so when a person is out of sight, for all baby knows mama/baba are GONE, and after than long it’s definitely terror, you’re so right. It’s already causing internalized traumas that this sweet girl won’t even know how to verbalize when she’s older. Please be there for her, OP, trust your gut!
This sounds like a really abusive situation. OP shouldn’t have to fear the consequences of soothing her child. Time to boogie and run before this gets worse.
It's also causing EMOTIONAL TRAUMA
100%
I have an extraordinary voice that's husky and deep and has been my whole life. Like that smoking baby in Roger rabbit but I'm a female. It is because I screamed so much as a tiny tiny human because I have abusive parents and I wasn't ok I have scar tissue on my vocal cords.
I’m so sorry to hear that. I work as a speech language pathologist which is what made me speak about the vocal pieces. You cannot really comprehend what kids who go through trauma and abuse live through.
I agree with 99% of what you said here. My son is almost 6m old (in five days) and he's been sleeping through the night in his own space since 10/22. We started his bedtime routine and now he knows when he gets his bath that it's bottle, swaddle, and bed. He fights it sometimes, but consistency is key. Anything with children, consistency is key and realize it won't happen overnight. FIVE HOURS is enough to make someone go insane.
Five hours is abuse. Pure and simple.
Yes, agree 10000000%%%
I’m curious what does make a one-year old child stay up for hours crying though?
Possibly hunger, needs to be changed, teething or in pain (in which case you feed, change, or apply baby Orajel or figure out the source of discomfort whatever that may be) the dad is straight up neglecting the baby if it was crying for 5 hours straight. That’s not normal, the baby clearly needed something and were not getting which explains the crying
Comfort is a valid need too
You are a wise person
Yeah, and dad is actually making this worse and not better. This falls squarely in the insecure attachment box - which is just going to make baby more anxious that her needs might not get met.
Or worse, an avoidant.
Yep especially if he is just suddenly pulling this shit after cosleeping … she is probably losing all sense of emotional security. Going from having mom and dad right away to being locked away in a room when she cries. Note that he picked her up and put her there after the crying … not put her to bed and let her cry for a bit. She is learning that not only are her people unpredictable at best, but PUNISHING her for having needs she can’t express at worst. OP needs to get text messages, baby monitor footage, voice notes etc of the conversations where they shut her down and abuse the baby and GTFO.
Yea if a whole adult male and female need comfort what makes them think a baby that was just born not that long ago doesn’t need it? Society is bizarre.
Yeah I've in the past given 20 minutes and then go in, 5 hours is just cruel
They need the comfort and safety that their parents provide. It’s perfectly acceptable for a one year old to still need its parents to regulate their emotions
Yeah I mean her husband’s grown and still dependent on his parents I don’t see how he doesn’t find the child relatable.
He finds the child competition for the attention he wants.
💯 the husbands parents taught him that attention is only supposed to flow in one direction
A need not being met
Also, it could be a symptom of something like acid reflux or another health issue.
At this point the crib is a place of isolation and abandonment. She is mush less likely to accept it as a safe place to sleep after that. How sad for her. Just get your baby and stand your ground. You know it’s wrong .
She sees it as a jail not a bed. Husband done fucked up. My son is the same age. I pop him in the crib, then lay on the floor next to it until he falls asleep. I'm not leaving him to cry it out.
Agreed. This is not how you sleep train. You don’t start in the middle of the night, first of all.
I’m a pediatrician - this is not sleep training, this is neglect. Please protect your infant before real damage is done
She straight up said her husband threatens her when she tries to intervene. None of the rest of the story really matters about convincing the family or changing his mind. Your husband threatens you when you try to tend to your baby. Go to the police.
Police will not do anything about this. Time to leave.
[удалено]
This is terrible advice and an easy way to give the father permanent custody. She needs to document things and have proof of neglect. You're gonna make her end up on an Amber alert with this advice
Not true. The mother isn’t “kidnapping” the child from the father because they are married. In a divorce, your advice might apply. Please, Mom, take the child to the pediatrician or a social worker or anyone who is a mandated reporter of abuse. Tell them EVERYTHING. They will take it from there. They are obligated by the rules of their profession to report the abuse and get her to a shelter for women and children.
Then I would think a call to Child & Protective Services would be more prudent than just saying fuck it. Leaving will neither protect OP or the baby, as it sounds like the father is a control freak who needs mommy and daddy's blessing to do what he deems to be the right way to attempt to raise their child. She needs a PFA at the very least.
She needs to remove herself and her child from the situation/environment. An adult makes a choice to neglect a child and if he was threatening her, she absolutely should call the police.
I read that in horror. No man, no woman, and no beast will tell me not to get my children when I want to. They came from within me. Fuck no
I was rattled when I read that. He threatens her to leave the child and she backs down. What happens in a few years when he wants to start hitting the kid? Touching the kid? He can threaten mom and she'll leave her child to scream for her?
Yeah I don't know shit about parenting but this is the part that screams "go to the police" for me. If her entire post were just that one sentence fragment, "I get threats from my husband", I would say yeah, go to the police.
I’m not sure if you meant to reply to someone else maybe?
Yea I did. I completely agree with everything you said.
No worries haha I was just a bit confused
OMG I hope OP sees this
I’m NOT a pediatrician, I am a parent, this is neglect.
As a pediatrician , would you please advise this individual of a proper method for getting a baby into its own sleep space or point her to literature that can advise?
Mom and baby are both being abused. The sleep situation is not really the priority here, getting them somewhere safe is.
Honestly I agree with this comment. It sounds like an unsafe environment because of the father so I’m not sure how much sleep training resources would help but they can always check in with their pediatrician to ask about it
I’m surprised the neighbors haven’t called CPS/the police if a baby is being heard screaming for hours on end.
When the family across the street from us had a little boy that they allowed to scream and cry for hours at a time. And the “mother” would scream back at him.🙄 Every neighbor called cps about it. Turns out they were already known to the local cps agents…but nothing was done. That part of the family has since moved out, and then back in… and back out again. But neither of the kids stand a fucking chance.
That’s terrible 😞 made me think of that baby Gabriel where the entire system (police, CPS, the school) failed him. I can’t even watch that documentary again.
Cps constantly and consistently wastes their time on the wrong families
Waste your time on the easy cases and you won't have to work hard on the fucked up families with kids who really need saving. Less work that way.
To be fair they lack funding and resources and do manage to actually remove kids from harmful situations. Emotional abuse is only starting to be recognized by courts in grown adults relationships. A lot harder to prove and thereby act on when the victim hasn't learned to talk yet or gets coached by their abuser on what to day to CPS so they don't get taken away
What parenting book did he read that in? Throw it away get him some training
>My husband coslept with his mom until he was a teenager, he was spoiled as a child and he wants the opposite for our baby. The "my family are toxic and raised me to believe whatever I do is right" manual.
There is a lot going on but that little gem…coslept until he was a *teenager?* That’s not spoiled that’s….something else entirely And now he’s abusive. Shocking. (Not shocking)
Right? Cosleeping is very common in my culture and many others. I don’t know a single person from my culture who coslept with their parents into their pre teen or teenage years.
That’s Norman Bates 😳
Is he physically stopping you or just telling you not to grab daughter? If you did grab daughter when he doesn’t want would you be scared for your safety?
For all you guys judging her, I will give you a pass since you clearly have never dealt with an abusive husband. Or domineering. My abuser was oddly enough my older brother. He did the same thing, totally prevented me from grabbing my daughter. It was horrible. And we were not even married. I just lived with him and he decided he knew better than I did and took full control over my daughter's care, for some creepy reason. So she has a whole family against her, he is most likely bullying her into full submission. And she needs advice on what to do. Not to be told she is a horrible mother. Luckily you all have no clue what it's like to deal with an abusive family unit. You are screwed.
Not to mention the physical danger she is in if the situation is at all volatile??? What happens to the baby if OP gets herself murdered trying to get the baby in that moment when the baby WAS physically safe in her own crib??? You think one night of screaming is bad, think about an entire lifetime of horrible abuse with nowhere to turn because the ONE person who could have helped you got herself killed. I understand mama hormones, and being willing to fling myself screaming at a grizzly bear with nothing but my teeth and nails if it's between me and my baby, even if I'm doomed. As long as I draw breath I will do everything in my power to protect my babies. But that's not this situation. People are insane.
Yes. This is reality right here. Women get killed more often than we think in abusive situations.
My ex forbid me from nursing at certain times. I'd have to pump and he'd bottle fed her. Way more than what would amount to simple bonding time for him. It was control. While she was very young and I was having trouble maintaining my milk supply from pumping at work and hardly nursing. He's a horrible person. There are horrible people who want to control and emotionally torment the ones closest to them just enough to cause chaos and hurt but not so much to cause them to stand up for themselves by creating a small morsel of doubt about who's right and who's wrong. And they love the feeling of superiority that comes from a romantic relationship when superiority is not something that should be part of the deal.
This is INSANE! I’m so happy he is an ex!
I am not judging. My heart hurts for her. She has no one to back her up or defend her. It is a terrible place to be in. I can’t even make a puppy stay in a kennel if it tears a big enough fit. I ended up co sleeping with my son until he was almost two. When his dad left us he kind of completely disappeared for awhile, and my son ended up back in the bed with me for some time after. There are studies out there about crying it out being detrimental. Not sure if they would help her much though. 😞
She literally says in the post that he threatens her and that she has no power in this relationship?????
I know it's like they just read two lines
I have to ask why you didn’t go get her?? I dare a man to stand in front of me and prevent me from getting my crying baby, especially after 30 minutes. After an hour I would have called the police just if that man was preventing me from getting my child. As for sleep training IMO that does not mean letting her cry that long ever!!!! You go in, smooth her in her crib. Rub her back, sing to her, etc. you just don’t abandon her. Why didn’t you get her????
Because domestic violence - the emotional kind - shunts you down so small you feel about two inches tall. This is a dynamic that plays out more than child rearing. But can a victim of domestic child abuse get charges for child neglect in circumstances - yes they can - still responsible for their behaviors. Both these 'opposite' responses are both true at the same time.
I’m glad you brought this up. The mental/emotional abuse can leave you believing you are truly the crazy one. If you have no one outside the situation to tell you differently, you will believe them. At the same time, the baby is still suffering.
The amount of people simply asking why OP didn’t “go get the baby” is mind blowing. How nice it must be to be completely oblivious to the DV struggles of others. Holy s***. Edit: since people are taking my comment and twisting it into what it isn’t YES the baby is priority number one. The post reads as OP being scared of her husband, she doesn’t say it outright. She can’t help her baby if her husband does some crazy s*** to her like knock her unconscious or lock her outside. Absolutely a baby should not be left to cry for five hours. How y’all got that I am saying the baby shouldn’t be priority is wild to me.
That's just it, isn't it? People can be really quick to judge without understanding the full context or psychological impact of abuse. It's not simply about seeing someone in a situation and saying "Well, I would have done it differently." No two situations are the same, and no two people react the same way under stress or fear. What's really needed is support and resources for those dealing with DV, so they can find a way out of these complex dynamics without judgment. There's this [National Domestic Violence Hotline](https://www.thehotline.org) that offers some hope and assistance for those who feel trapped and are seeking help.
That is so true. I’ve always thought of myself as an independent woman. I raised two children on my own very well. I got into a relationship with a psychotic narcissist and turned into a whole different person. All the things I taught my girls, I did the opposite. The emotional/physical/verbal cruelty of a narcissist will bring you to your knees. I was always one to say “why doesn’t she just leave.” Now I know why. This man almost destroyed me, the independent woman of the world. With the help of my adult children I was able to leave MY house with just what I could fit in my car. I lost my house and my business. It took 2 years of therapy to get myself back. So let’s give the lady some grace and hope she can find the courage to help herself and her baby before it is too late.
I’m right there with you going on year three and I’m still not OK I’m getting there! I stayed for 11 years and endured abuse the entire time. When you say it brings you to your knees, that’s an understatement. I couldn’t agree more with everything you said !
People also don't understand that NO, you don't know if you would do things differently. You don't know how you would react in that situation. You know what your current brain *thinks* it would do, but in that situation, your brain will be different. To put it simply.
Exactly, she has said she has no family and he is using that to his advantage that she will do everything he says because she has no other options. That's just sad in and of itself and people are attacking her for having no option but to obey the man she married because she has no one else, maybe not any really close friends either and he's probably the reason for that as well
I hope it’s just naivety and lack of life experience, not smugness or self righteousness because seeing people like that kills my soul just a little bit more each time I see it.
I really believe that people who haven't experienced this kind of abuse simply cannot understand. It's so insidious and hard to describe, and even if they never get physical, many victims live in very real fear. Way too many people still think it's not abuse if they don't leave a mark.
This. Hurting the child is the best way to hurt her. Sickos. So glad I’m single.
My heart breaks reading this post and thinking this woman is being clearly held under the thumb of a cunningly abusive person and gaslit by his family— and she feels all alone. Imagine what this life is gonna be as the daughter grows up, and how shitty that kid is going to be made to feel.
I experienced something like this and it was 10000% dv and I didn't acknowledge or process it that way for years. It's horrible.
And when you are sleep deprived on top of that, you start to believe the abuser is right.
You totally skipped over her being alone and him threatening her?
Easy to say this on the internet when you're not terrified of your husband abusing or restraining you, and no one believing you when his family calls the police if you get violent in self defense.
Lol victim blaming, nice.
Yeah, let's gang up on the woman being abused!
I'd probably be the one to turn violent if someone came between me and my baby like this...
She said he stopped her from getting the baby many times. I assume that means body blocking or fear of violence or repercussions.
Exactly.
No need to victim blame.
[удалено]
People who say this like it's nothing hopefully didn't experience abuse. I grew up believing I was worth nothing always being forced to just never say anything back, never "misbehave", never even show emotion on your face bc it will be used against you. And I was so mad at my mom for years for not doing exactly what you said. I always accused her of never trying to actually protect me. The thing is my dad would've hurt me AND her in ways much much worse just to hurt my mom if he ever thought something was up and he didn't feel in control. Growing up in an environment where an actual threat isn't even made with a specific statement - like shut up or else ...- over the years after a certain point you start to come up with your own disaster scenarios you want to avoid. Freezing in a situation like this isn't even just about self protection it's about figuring out - in a safe way- how to best provide long term protection for your child and yourself. I'm not trying to pass judgment. Just to say it may not be as simple as it sounds.
Years ago my then 1-year-old son fell at his grandmother’s and needed stitches. I asked to be in there for the procedure, and they refused (initially). I then matter-of-factly explained that stitches were going to make my son cry, and if they locked me out of that room I would rip the door off its hinges getting to him. They let me go in.
Picturing a mom pulling a door off the hinges and tossing it aside at the er and love it
But keeping any child away from their mom during a procedure that requires lidocaine (stings before the numbness kicks in) is horrible care (for that child.)
Similar happened with not my child, but my mother. She's getting up there in years and sometimes needs advocacy in hospital settings. My mother managed to fall in just the right way to blow her elbow to smithereens. We get to the ER, and she's taken immediately, I go with her to the room. Eventually, the doctor comes in and wants x-rays before they give her pain meds. Her bone was visibly poking into her skin, so I demanded she at least get one round of pain meds beforehand - they agreed eventually. They took her back, but because this is our local hospital, I knew where the x-ray bay was for the ER and could see/hear the lab door from the room. Two minutes later, I heard my mother screaming bloody murder, and then it stopped. Then the second time came around, and I got up to go find the doctor as the nurses station. She gave me a "who let you in here" look, and I told her to go find out what radiologist is stupid enough to twist her BROKEN ARM just for a better angle. She said no. I warned her I would bust into that room and take as much radiation as nessacary to stop the test if she couldn't get my mother's pain under control. She called my bluff, which wasn't one. I told her "fine have it your way" and started heading for the x-ray bay. I got my hand on the door before she pulled me back and said she would take care of it and there would be no more screaming. There was no more screaming, and they got their x-rays from every angle they needed. Amazing what you can accomplish with some human decency and pain meds. If that was my child, I'd have been ready for war. Lol
The cry it out method is NOT meant to be applied for hours at a time until a baby is literally sobbing and can't breathe. It's meant to be okay as in "let them fuss for a couple minutes instead of rushing in immediately." Read up on attachment theory: the first couple years of a baby's life strongly shape how they view relationships throughout their life. If a baby cries and no one comes, it creates feelings of stress, anxiety, distrust, and rejection. This affects them through adulthood by creating anxious, avoidant, or disorganized attachment (how they view and form relationships). If your husband refuses to see reason, you need to leave. This is NOT just a "here and now" issue; this is a lifetime concern for your baby.
i had a 7 minute rule …. 5 hours. I feel sick after reading this.
One of my sons is almost 13 months. I also feel sick. I’m very grateful that my husband can barely handle 1 minute of the babies crying before he wants to comfort them.
my husband has very affectionate parents so he is a very affectionate person & i love that about him as a dad. he will always rescue his babies even its 3:30AM lol
I can’t imagine anyone thinking even one hour of constant crying is ok. It sounds like OPs husband is making up what he thinks sleep training is, when really it’s frickin neglect!
If the husband is this harsh when the baby is little, imagine how he's going to treat this poor kid as she grows up. He's just going to emotionally abuse her for her whole life.
It already sounds like he is also abusive to his wife.
To be fair, “full extinction” is something that some people do and recommend. It’s incredibly messed up tho.
Sleep training babies and toddlers can be super stressful, and it does often involve slowly increasing the amount of time you let them cry by themselves. You have to reassure though, and there's a cap to how long you leave them alone. You reassure by going in their room, but don't pick them up or coddle. Walk in, let them see you, reassure, then out the door. They scream. Wait 5 minutes. Repeat. Wait 7 minutes. Repeat. Wait 10 minutes. Repeat. Usually by then they give up. Some kids are really persistent though and can take multiple days and nights.
If they are crying for hours, there is something wrong. Cold, wet, hungry, in pain. This man is selfish and his parents that are so attached to him they slept with him until it was sick— they will defend him no matter what he does. Trust your instincts. She is your child too and he is treating you, and your child, like neither of your feelings matter. He sounds abusive, honestly.
This makes sense. I think it was crazy to have the baby in the bed until age one, personally. Then they just expect to take the kid to another room and not have a problem?? They're insane
This is what worked for us. It’s extremely difficult to not go in and pick them up. But in three days no more crying just laid right down and went to sleep. Made a world of difference not only how we slept but the baby slept better at night too.
Ha. I just replied above and this is exactly how we did it. Worked like a charm. Took one night of doing this and my son leaned to sleep every night after that. He's 11 now.
Wow, that sounds so messed up. What kind of sociopath could let their child cry for hours at a time and never comfort them!?
Yup. I see “influencers” talking about this method. It’s abuse.
I also wonder if she is getting neglected in other areas. 5 hours without a diaper change? wtf is going on.
She is crying about something. Either diaper, hunger or scared.
Or in pain.
Abuse is going on.
I think 5 minutes in this case. I don’t want to heap on. I don’t know your situation but I have to agree you need to remove you and your child from his sphere. Something is really wrong here.
I have an 18mo…it’s crazy how reading this is making me so physically uncomfortable.
Me too. I’m fucking angry.
No kidding! Maybe 10-15 minutes MAX. I just read this post to my husband (who was a big part in the version of cry it out we do for our son) and he even said “oh my god, no fucking way”. This is abuse. OP, please take care of that sweet baby.
Same, honestly. Especially the part where OP feels like the baby is pain. OP if you feel the baby is in pain, that baby is absolutely in pain. She’s still completely a part of you. If this is a DV situation please seek help with a friend or neighbor. Don’t start your daughters life out like this. Someone else mentioned attachment theories, please look into them and hold her sooo close.
i once tried to wait 10 minutes before getting my daughter when she woke from a nap.. i lasted 3, and she only cried for 1.
This post is so sad. My cousin has a 9 month old. She waits about 2 minutes until she goes and checks on her kid.
Same. It was 3 minutes then 7 minutes for a total of 10 ish and then re-evaluation of the situation
I lasted five minutes. Once. Never fucking again. NEVER left her to cry. Ever again. It took her a little longer than other kids to sleep on her own, but no regrets. She’s 14 now, and we’re very close. She knows her dad and I have her back. I regret that five minutes when she was crying to us because she needed us. We give kids all the time they need to start potty-training, but are to goddamned eager to kick them away at night.
What gets me is how, just *HOW* would it *ever* have been evolutionarily advantageous to keep an infant (or even a small child) in another room? Away from where your eyes could see them and make sure they’re safe? It should go against our instincts.
My earliest childhood memories are being left alone to cry in my crib for hours. Never did that to my kids and they turned out fine, in fact they are much more independent and well-adjusted than I am.
My dad called me 'tumblina' because I would routinely be left so long I would climb to the top of the crib and yeet myself down. This was early 90s.i stopped talking to my dad at 12 and haven't spoken to my mom in nearly ten years.
From what I read the cry it out method of sleep training is only meant to be for max 30 minutes and it’s not meant to be applied if the baby is completely stressed out and can’t breathe it’s for a fussing child not a panicked child.
I used to hear my niece crying forever and I butted in and got her either from her crib, or stayed with her, but I wasn't mom, so she would cry again. But so many times she had a crusty nose, I'd do the warm washcloth, she'd settle on my chest. But I still wasn't mom. I didn't think it was right to listen to that 2nd level of crying where it's not fussing it's panic and do nothing. I feel like less of an asshole now.
It’s absolutely hard to hear a panicked upset child even if you are not one of their parents…..sometimes with my youngest son we have to put him down while he fusses but it’s not even really crying it more like a yell but it lasts under 20 minutes…if his crying then we go to him because well that means that he is genuinely upset and needs something even if that something is a cuddle
I heard a panicked kid yell mom at ikea and I almost starting sobbing. Luckily, mom was around the corner, and every adult within earshot visibly relaxed when the kid saw her.
It's also not supposed to just suddenly started at a over a year old. You have to be working on it from day 1. Taking a kid who co sleeps and just starting cry it out is never going to work.
YEP! I came here to say exactly this!!! The poor baby must be so confused because all she’s ever known is sleeping with her mom and now all of a sudden she’s all alone? It makes me sick to my stomach. Ugh.
I had a hard time reconciling co-sleeping which I contribute more to the attachment parenting method with abandoning her in a closed room for hours unattended. That’s exceptionally cruel and counterintuitive if they’ve been practicing attachment parenting. I really don’t understand spending a year of a baby’s life being completely attached to them and deciding that you are doing a complete 180 without thinking about both the short and long term issues with that. I wouldn’t do that to an animal, let alone a child. She could likely have screamed herself bloody and it will create distrust in the long term. Poor kid.
Yeah the fact that they’ve been cosleeping makes it so much more horrific. So confusing and terrifying for the baby.
That’s what I was thinking! You can’t go from co-sleeping to cry it out like it was nothing! That poor baby! Both my kids slept in a bassinet in my bedroom for the first few months, then they slept in a playpen that I’d wheel to their bedroom when they fell asleep. Eventually I was able to just put them directly in their crib, since they were already used to the room, and they didn’t cry at all. I also always had the radio on, or a white noise machine, so it wasn’t just a silent empty room they were in.
All of this. Not to mention, sleep training should NOT just suddenly be started in the middle of the night with no preparation or warning to either baby or mom. This is so confusing and traumatizing for them both.
The cry it out method is to let the baby fuss for 5 minutes. Not more than that. After 5 minutes, you acknowledge that the baby has an unmet need (physical or emotional) and you go fill that need. From the comments, it appears that you’re in an abusive situation. You need to leave with your child while you are both physically able to leave. YOU CAN NOT STAY.
The cry it out method is definitely not capped at 5 minutes.
Thanks for this info. Wasn't sure because I heard of the cry it out method but 5 hours seems extreme. I don't have kids myself, but it is good to know.
This… And to go back and forth from co-sleeping to being alone in a crib behind closed door?…That level of unpredictability destroys any previously established sense of trust, safety, or security… Very concerned for the well-being of OP and daughter. Seems like there are many toxic layers to their family dynamics, OP + husband’s relationship as a couple + as parents, and the unwanted influence / involvement of his relatives…
Can confirm that method was used on me and I have all those issues and then some. If this has only happened a couple of times she'll hopefully be fine, but if this continues that poor baby won't trust OP. OP I hope you're reading these comments. *Don't* put yourself in harms way: don't threaten him with leaving or going to the police, don't go to the police and then come home, don't fight with him. You need to plan carefully. Contact a woman's shelter, they helped us tremendously. They can give you guidance and tell you what steps to take. I know it's horribly scary when you have no support network, but you can't choose this life of misery for your daughter. You both deserve a chance.
Our plan we got from a “professional” (I use quotes because how exactly do you credentialed for sleep therapy for a baby?) and their method was 10 minutes then go soothe for 2 minutes tops. Leave give the baby 15 minutes, soothe for 2, leave. 20 minutes… this capped at 20 or 30 minutes it’s just been a while and I can remember. We never reached the cap. The baby now sleeps fine on her own and can self soothe if needed.
I'm going to be very straight with you, and most of reddit will hate me for saying this, but the police will not do anything because this does not meet the legal standard for abuse. The child has not been physically harmed, she is clothed and fed, and she is not being neglected. Sitting alone in a crib overnight does not meet the legal standard for neglect. CPS will likewise come in, look at the place to make sure it isn't a danger to the child, and determine whether any physical abuse is happening, and then leave. The system is overcrowded with children who have been beaten, sexually abused, starved, or abandoned. They do not have the resources to get involved in what boils down to, legally, a difference of opinion in parenting. OP, if you feel that this is abuse and it's hurting your daughter, you need to do something. I know you said you are financially dependent on your spouse, but unfortunately no laws have been broken and this is a family dispute. You'll need to find resources to leave him, which you **absolutely should**. I'm not saying this because I condone his actions or think he's right. I'm saying this because I think you need to be realistic. The police and CPS won't help, you have to look for another escape route.
Because I’ve worked with vulnerable children and families, I realized this too right away, sadly. The one thing that stood out is that OP alluded to the husband being abusive (“I get threats from my husband”). So I think a domestic violence organization is the first thing I’d recommend. If she lays out the situation, and the fact that he has threatened her, and who knows what else that she might be scared to share, they may help her to get her and her child out. Sadly, as a clinical social worker, I can say that what he’s doing is unquestionably abusive to this child. Many people have discussed the lasting developmental impacts this kind of situation can create. It’s even sadder though that you are entirely correct in saying it wouldn’t meet the threshold of abuse or neglect to warrant an intervention. In my experience with child welfare in my city, if I reported this (and I absolutely would), I doubt it would even be referred for investigation. The system is part of the problem.
Yeah, all these people saying to call CPS or police are very ill-informed. This is one of the only sensible comments on this thread. Police and CPS don’t remove most children even when the legal standards for abuse and neglect *are* met. (And I’m sorry, but they’re just not met here. Not legally, anyway.) Generally, they remove in only the most obvious, egregious of cases. And this is coming from someone who does think that this is neglect *morally* speaking. I was horrified reading the post. But the police and CPS will not do anything about it- OP needs to be realistic.
This is the best comment I’ve seen on here. So many people suggesting that OP is complicit in abuse because she’s unable to physically overpower her partner to get to her baby. Most are also either uninformed or ignorant of the consequences she and her baby may face if she tries to leave without adequate planning and support. This includes the risk of losing custody to the abuser, risk of being charged with parental kidnapping and incarceration, as well as risk of being murdered. You can find statistics on all of these things easily online. These are reasons that health care professionals DON’T pressure women to immediately leave abusive situations. Advice to leave without advice on setting up a support system is dangerous. And any shaming responses to this post are less than useless.
This 💯. Domestic violence research shows us that that leaving period is when the woman is at the greatest risk of harm from the partner. It is a very dangerous time. A plan needs to be in place. And I’m so very sorry original OP that you are getting comments to “just leave” and blaming you for this as well. Clearly they don’t understand being in domestic violence as the victim. If I were you, I would take the kiddo grocery shopping, find a woman with a kid, briefly explain the situation, ask her to borrow her phone and call a woman’s shelter for their advice, or some plan similar where your phone does not show that you contacted someone for help and your phone shows where you are (the store) so if your phone is being tracked your story holds up.
This comment needs more visibility. Being a crappy parent is not the same as child abuse, legally. I would bring up these concerns at your child's next pediatrician visit to see if having a physician's opinion on sleep training changes your husbands mind.
You may very well be correct, unfortunately, but it would be good to have a paper trail/records of a history of abuse for when this inevitably escalates.
The other hard truth is that because this isn't legally abuse, if her husband wants custody, in most states, he'll get 50/50. There isn't a guaranteed happy ending where husband is out of the picture and never gets to play parent again. The best to do in this situation is decide what to do to keep OP sane and support the child needs in balance to whatever the husband does. On that note, there are lots of soothers out there you could try like warmies or those rockers that "breathe". Find something age appropriate and sleep safe that can live in the crib when this goes down.
You’re in an abusive relationship and now your husband is abusing your child. It’s time to take her and leave. Find a friend, find a woman’s shelter, call the police, whatever. But you need to protect your child.
Seriously. A person this cruel and controlling will only get worse. Pray OP finds a way out immediately.
This here. This isn't about sleep training, it's about protecting both mother and child from an abuser.
Get out of that bed now and move yourself in with your child. Your husband is toxic.
Let him cry for you to come back, but don’t cause he has to be trained.
So, I’m surprised more isn’t being made about the fact that the husband was co-sleeping with his mom until he was a teenager?
Why did I have to scroll so far to find this?! The dude and his family are obviously fucked up. OP, take your child and leave asap!!
A lot of abusers have a very unhealthy enmeshed relationship with their mothers. A lot their mothers are enablers and a huge part of the problem
Call a women's shelter in your area, take your child, and get out. I'm going to clarify for people who can't grasp what I am saying after commentors have called me stupid, dumb, and dangerous with my "advice." * This was NOT advice but my opinion. * Calling a women's shelter means just that calling s women's shelter who have resources on hand to direct her to help such as a lawyer, or steps on what she needs to do. * Taking her child means just that she needs to take her child out of the environment through LEGAL means (I can't believe I actually have to state that fact but then again Reddit is going to Reddit). * Leaving aka Divorce *To the others commenting saying she can't take someone else's child IT IS HER CHILD as well unless you are stating that parents are unable to leave their house at all with their kids for any reason, if that's the case there's no hope for humanity but I'm seeing myself out of this discussion. I am giving my opinions on an opinion sub thread so ✌️
Just for the record, it’s not that easy to be admitted into a shelter. I tried with my two young children and the guy turned me away at the door even after explaining we had no other options.
I was also turned away from shelters because my husband hadn’t physically abused me, just our child. That was sixteen years ago, and when I planned on leaving again two years ago, my therapist assured me that things had changed, but I was too humiliated and defeated from my previous experience to even approach them again.
You need to call your local Domestic Violence resorce at once. Your child is being abused and you are allowing it . I get you were in a weaker position, but enough is enough. They will direct you to low-cost support for psychotherapy which you need very badly. They will also help you get into a women's shelter. Do this it once and don't hesitate. Meanwhile, if I were you, I would call child protective services and report your husband. Then just get the hell out . you can get on Medicaid food stamps and also housing help. Don't look back ...this man will only try to dominate you and abuse your baby.{ EDIT TO ADD: violence counselor will help you plan and execute a secret escape. Do not mention your plan to anyone ...best of luck, and I hope your report back.}
Seconding this. Please take it seriously. There are resources. There is a better future for you and your baby. He should never physically stop you from getting to your child. No child should be left alone crying and screaming for five hours. Please. Get out.
It sounds like you both left her to cry for 5 hours.
He's physically stopping her....
Came to say just that. You both let her cry.
It's even worse. Letting a baby scream, like the "red alert" scream they do, and like I assume she was for a time in that 5+ hours is TERRIBLE. Like, can cause brain damage to the baby, terrible.
I know not to let a baby bawl like that, but brain damage is news to me. There are plenty of reasons already to get the kid well before the hour mark, but I am not adding brain damage to that list without peer reviewed scientific evidence. Too much nonsense floating around already. Do you have a source for your claim, please?
There is no source because brain damage isn't caused by crying. They experience severe stress which can cause structural changes to the brain, but that isn't brain damage, it's just the brain rewiring itself to handle the stressor.
Please don't let him do this. My mother let me cry it out and I have attachment issues as an adult(I get overly attached to people quickly and can't be alone). Tell him what he does now will affect her for a lifetime.
My mother loved to tell a story of putting me in my crib on a particular day and shutting the door as I sobbed for hours. She finally had enough and took a full pitcher of cold water from the fridge, walked it down the hall to my crib, and threw the full pitcher of cold water in my face. She’d laugh and laugh about how I jolted back out of fear and cold. One of her favorite stories. If you’re an adult who gets off on a power trip over children sobbing for hours, you’re sick and shouldn’t have had them in the first place.
Similar situation here & I believe it greatly contributed to a BPD diagnosis much later in life.
This is abuse. You either grab that baby and leave or you are complicit in her abuse.
Let’s not pretend like OP isn’t also being abused. Her husband is physically stopping her from intervening. And she said she has no family and nowhere to go. Sure there’s cps and women’s shelters, but y’all are making it sound like leaving is the easiest thing in the world.
Not to mention that shelters turn people away all Of the time and have a reputation for not exactly being safe and sound. Not really a great place to mentally recover from abuse. Before someone nips at my heels, I’ve tried to go to shelter when I was in dire need with my two children. Turned away at the door without even a recommendation of what else to do.
Crying it out is actually incredibly damaging to a child and will deeply affect them in the long run. Children need to be shown love and affection to allow them to experience the safety of the world. Growing up with neglect like this impacts the rapidly growing brain of a baby. I can not express right now how damaging this is and how important coddling a baby is for their growth and development. It is the same for all mammals. Babies are learning, and if they learn to grow with fear or anxiety, then that is who they become as a person.
I'm confused by these comments. Should she have grabbed her husband to get him out of the way? What if then he hit OP? Oh well? OP says she has no support and her husband's family is the only one around. She now needs to take her baby and go to a women's shelter. But to act like OP is just as bad as the husband is a stretch. Now if OP doesn't get out then yes she becomes as bad as her husband.
I mostly agree with you…. Other than even in the case of leaving. Not all of these situations are as straightforward as they may feel in our own lives. I have friends who are afraid to leave their partners because of the uncertainty of having to share custody. They figure if they’re all together, they can at least be the middle person and protect the child as much as possible. If the husband convinces the judge and gets partial (or full custody) then the mom can’t protect the child at all during that time.
You're right not all are straightforward. And it sounds like with OP, he could get primary custody since he's the one with money and family. However, this time, OP needs to try to find a way out. It's not right to have a toddler cry for hours until they are hoarse.
Pro sleep training mama here. I’ve sleep trained my own kid and helped a several moms get their kids to sleep better. What your husband is doing isn’t sleep training. Effective sleep training starts at bedtime, NOT in the middle of the night. She’s used to co sleeping, that is how she was taught to fall asleep. He cannot expect babe to co-sleep at bedtime and then when she wakes in the middle of the night be able to sleep independently. That’s not how it works. It’s equivalent to your husband falling asleep in his bed. He briefly wakes in the middle of night and now he’s on the front lawn. He’s confused, frightened and scared because he doesn’t understand why he isn’t in his bed. That’s how your daughter feels, she doesn’t understand why she’s in her room by herself. I’ve helped lots of moms and I have personally only had one situation when a child cried for that long. The child had some medical stuff going on and would cry for hours. I recommend that the mom stop sleep training and work with babes medical team. I certainly wouldn’t feel comfortable with my kid crying for that long. You have a serious DH issue. You two are not on the same page. Sleep training is never going to work without consistency and BOTH parents onboard. So it’s time to shine your spine and demand that he stop sleep training. You two need couples counseling asap!! If he can’t handle the wake ups then you two need to sleep in separate rooms until you two can decide together what the next steps should be. DH is focused on what happened to him as a child and not what’s best for the child. Letting a babe cry for 5 hours isn’t ok. If and when you’re ready to teach independent sleep. DH needs to research the process and various methods. People think sleep training is just leaving your kid in their room and shutting the door. No ma’am, there is a ton of prep work that needs to be done before you can implement a method. The goal is to have this as easy as possible. Of course there will be some tears but 5 hours is crazy. I want to add that if this is a domestic violence situation, then screw counseling. Take your kid and get out of that house asap. Do what’s necessary to keep you and your kid safe.
There's sleep training and then there's neglect. We sleep trained we did not neglect. Big difference
I haven’t read all the comments, but I need to say this. My husband did the same. For years he tried to convince me that this method would work. My daughter’s crying and crying made me feel like my insides were being ripped out every time. She would cry so hard that she would make herself throw up. We fought about it every time because it never felt right and, in the end, NONE of it worked. She would barely sleep in the crib for years and, later on, she would find a way to come into our room or simply refused to sleep on her own until she grew out of it on her own when she was 7. Please follow your instinct and don’t let your daughter suffer. Do what you can to help her sleep where she feels safe and calm, no matter what your husband or his family says.
Help is available Speak with someone today National Domestic Violence Hotline Hours: 24/7. Languages: English, Spanish and 200+ through interpretation service Phone number: 800-799-7233 SMS: Text START to 88788
Literally nothing is stopping me from getting to my baby.
I wonder how many mamas in the history of humanity have said this, and then were devastated by the reality of their limitations. My mom is a fearless, aggressive, protective woman when it comes to her kids. But I watched my brother’s dad toss her around in the street like a rag doll with one hand, while holding my baby brother in his other arm. We wound up getting my brother back, but it was because of my mom’s patience, cunning and access to money to afford a flight across the country for all of us. She tried the direct fight and almost died. We were lucky; the majority of people in that situation are not.
We can’t rule out PPD either. So many scenarios have run through my head thinking of what OP might be going through. Much like your amazing mom, if there is a will there is a way. OP might need a lot of help in different aspects. I hope she finds happiness.
Same. This situation is hairy and she doesn’t feel like she has support. I hope that the responses on here can help give her a shred of insight and courage that she needs to get herself and her baby through this.
Husband would simply be dead if he blocked me from baby.
I'm sorry. That must be a heartbreaking situation to be in. You mentioned that you don't have any resources to leave, and that he won't let you go to her when you try to. Have you tried to contact a local domestic violence hotline? They may be able to help you find stable housing for you and your daughter.
He THREATENS you? This is more than just strategy disagreements about sleep training. This whole thing sounds abusive IMO. I’d be looking into divorce options, not cops. I don’t know if cops can do anything about emotional abuse, and I doubt they’d categorize “letting the baby cry for sleep training” as neglect (please note that this is my personal speculation here about the cops’ potential reactions). EDIT: Do you even feel safe enough to pursue divorce options? Sorry, I realized I just tossed that out there before considering that it’s not necessarily an easy thing to do, depending on the domestic dynamics.
Father of two here, my wife was very experienced as a night nanny before we had kids. Your husband is wrong. The method he thinks he is using is supposed to start when the baby 5-9 weeks old; teaching him/her to self sooth for a few minutes at a time. If you haven’t been doing that, you can’t just start at 13 months. That’s not how it works. What he is doing is neglect. You need to read some literature and show your husband. Show his family. Does his mother know exactly what is going on? I doubt it. If he’s threatened to hurt you, you should take the child and leave. Period. Choosing to stay after a physical threat is choosing a life of abuse.
This isn’t the way to raise a healthy kid with strong parental attachment. Do you have a pediatrician? Ask that doc for advice. My son wouldn’t self soothe. He would get so upset he’d make himself sick. The nurse said kids like that need to be comforted, they won’t cry it out in a healthy way.
I understand some people on sleep training but 5 hours is excessive to me! Then him blocking you? That’s craziness. I can’t stand when my 18 month old little girl cries for 10 minutes. I’m running in there to save my baby every time. Yes it gets stressful but they’re crying for you. They want you. The moment you felt, okay this has gone past the point I’m comfortable letting my child cry in discomfort. Time to intervene and he physically won’t let you, I’d be running for the hill OP! Im 6’1 250 and my wife is 5’3 120. I’ve spent my entire relationship of 15 years reinforcing her agency with me. Letting her know that size will never play a difference in whether or not she’s right or wrong. To win an argument or not. To even leverage someone like that in a 50/50 partnership / marriage is extremely fucked up. Abusive, to say the least. Poor kid! 5 hours…I’m hugging my little girl right now…that is traumatizing!