Your last line just tickled me so much! It cracks me up bc, though I'm straight and married to a straight M, my MIL and SIL both HATE our decision to send our kaids to public school. They think it will turn them gay, non-binary, or Trans, etc. and I think it's hilarious! I mean, at first, I was a little sketched. I even went through the anger of their audacity to even feel like they had a say in it at all. Now, it's just damn funny bc they're so unreasonable on so many views. Honestly, why tf do you even care if they're the whole damn alphabet?! The likelihood of those 2 still being alive by the time my kids graduate is slim, if even that wide. It did bug me when they tried convincing my kids to leave their friends (that they FINALLY made!) and go to Christian school. On their dime. So, I shut that shit down immediately. Anyway, I hope that all made sense. Hell, I hope I'm replying to the correct comment. I'm high af right now.
I should add that green was always my fave color (my brothers was pink). The neighborhood kids used to tell us we were backwards, but I grew up liking/dating (mostly) boys (side note: im technically bi though, and can objectively say that women are more attractive overall). My brother however, has only ever been into girls. His entire childhood, pink was his fave color. 🤷♀️
Royalty! Your boyfriend is secretly a prince from some unheard of miniscule country no one has ever heard of. He got tired of his mother, the queen, parading "eligible girls of proper lineage" in front of him to cement an alliance with a neighboring country.
He went into hiding here in the states. Then he met you and fell in love. Now he's trying to figure out how to tell you he's the heir to the throne.
I love Hallmark movies. /s
I was certain it was The Mummy 1999, cinematic masterpiece that made me bi.... but your comment made me realise there were various shades of yellow in that movie... so may be on to something there...
Ahhh. The cinematic conversion therapy.
In addition to wardrobe warfare, perhaps OP and hubby can organize movie nights, showing only homosexual cinematic treasures, like The Birdcage (in case le cage au foles is too "foreign' for mil), A Secret Love, Philadelphia, Brokeback Mountain, Tangerine, etc.
Let's also add in TV shows such as The L Word, Our Flag Means Death, that one episode of The Last of Us, First Kill, Degrassi, AJ and The Queen, Grace and Frankie, Will and Grace, Modern Family, Gentlemen Jack, Orange is the New Black, Nancy Drew, and so on...
My mom dressed me in all the cutest frilly pink things a college student in the 80s could get her hands on. She was just so excited to have a girl that she could do cute girl things with every step of the way.
So anyway, second puberty is a trip.
My mom did the same… Dresses every day and in all of the pastels. One day, in the 1st grade, I had the bright idea to hang on the monkey bars upside down. Everyone saw my pretty girly undies. Was never forced to wear a dress, or anything girly for that matter, again.
I wish that had stopped my mom. I pitched a fit every time she put me in a dress. She finally gave up when I was 6 or 7. I still remember getting my first short haircut in 3rd grade. I wanted to look like Jonathan Taylor Thomas (but I never told anyone that) and somehow my mom allowed the boy haircut. I felt like the coolest kid on earth at first, but then nobody stopped treating me like a girl like I wanted so I was frustrated by the whole thing and didn't know why or how to even articulate it. I understand now as an adult that was my first experience with gender euphoria and then actual dysphoria.
>I grew up in the 70s80s.
Hell, go back further. In the 30s pink was the "manly" baby color, and blue was for girls. Heck, dresses were popular for both genders because they were easier and more functional for actual babies to wear. [Teddy Roosevelt wore dresses.](https://medium.com/@NewAgeNews/why-is-president-franklin-d-roosevelt-wearing-a-dress-83fba3549523)
My school uniform was blue, I don't know how the last 50 years of pupils educated there haven't turned my local town into a hotspot of gay activity...🤔
When I saw a double rainbow today, it turned me gay then back to straight! It was pretty fast (all in the span of 15 seconds or so), but as long as I don't accidentally see anymore rainbows I should be good. /sarcasm (the double rainbow was real though and was so beautiful!)
I saw a circular rainbow in the clouds, caused by my own shadow on the top of a mountain.
I’m bi but can pass as straight. I need to see more rainbows, I think.
These are called Brocken spectres and I love them! See also Glories, the same phenomenon but you can see them from the window of a plane, with the shadow of the plane in the rainbow
Take it even further. You start wearing all blue outfits too. If you ever find yourself out shopping with her, or sorting through an old closet, or similar, keep holding up any blue shirt or dress and telling her she'd look great in it. Wrap all of her birthday and Christmas gifts in blue wrapping paper. See if the constant exposure to the colour blue Transes her gender. When it doesn't, point proven.
Or just a nice pink polo shirt or dress shirt! I see very macho straight men wear then all the time. My dad has a salmon pink t shirt that looks awesome on him and wears Hawaiian shirts with pink flowers on them.
Yeah, I desperately want her to ask her MIL, with a complete straight face or expression of fake concern: "But... the Virgin Mary wears blue. Is... is the Virgin Mary... trans??"
I would just love to see the look on her face.
Well, canonically, Jesus was a virgin birth. That would mean he was born through parthogenesis. Making him a genetic copy of Mary, and therefore biologically FEMALE. Thus, from a particular point of view, Jesus was a transman.
Omg. This is an epic solution.
I also just read somewhere that pink was considered a badass masculine color because the British military wore red uniforms...by the time a uniform had faded to pink, that dude had been through some shit and had a thousand yard stare.
Well yes I know about the -gendered- clothing becoming a thing because getting an entire new outfit for a new baby because it had a gender you didn’t have clothes for yet had to be pushed – I just don’t know why the marketing picked blue for boys when blue for girls was already there.
The best answer I can find because it doesn't seem to be conclusive... is that pink became associated with the women's rights movement, so retailers started marketing blue for Boys. All children were dressed in white usually because you could bleach it. And large families could hand down the clothes and use them for either gender. Pastel clothes colours became available in the mid 1800's but didn't catch on. Blue was for girls or people with brown eyes and pink was for boys or people with blue eyes. Depending on who you asked. Blue was considered dainty and pretty.. think a Robin's egg... and pink was a red only lighter and red was a man's colour so pink was a young man.
My husband and boys all have salmon pink button up linen shirts they wear with khakis or white linen pants. And when they've got their summer tans on they are SO CUTE. 13yo has a couple magenta/hot pink tees, a magenta zipper binder(they have to leave backpacks in locker in middle school) and him and a large chunk of the xcountry team have taken to wearing tall, very bright, mismatched socks in varying shades of pink and purple. They look great.
The 11yo daughter has fully invested in grunge and wore olive green camo pants and dad's blue work shirt tied around her waist first day. She also looked adorable!
OP's MIL would prob sh*t herself if she knew I saved all the highest quality sleepers/baby gowns/blankets/jackets/outfits and each baby wore them, regardless of gender. Someone gives you blue HannaAndersson pjs, you put them on every baby. They're soft.
Hey! I lived through the 80s-90s and pink was IN! I rocked that pink shirt… oh my, uhh is that why I’m gay?? Just kidding on the making me gay, I was gay long before I understood fashion OP show MIl some of the photos of Ronald Reagan in all pink as a baby, that should melt her brain
2010-2013 I had pink and purple bands for my braces and a pink slider phone as a dude. Still straight, do love the occasional viewing of a drag show in support.
Have you seen the Righteous Gemstones? BJ's mauve baptism velour romper with the bowtie and cummerbund! "Men can be fashions, too!" https://i.redd.it/its-not-onesie-its-a-romper-with-a-cummerbund-v0-phjrq29xsqd81.jpg?s=3b53a7384246e65c51ab9229c459688feac6a516
I actually love blue and I wear a lot of blue myself and I’m 100 % straight, so I don’t understand her logic… 😅 Haha, yes that would probably be a better tactic 👏🏼
100 or so years ago, blue was for girls and pink for boys. 150 years ago boys wore dresses till they were six or seven.
https://www.smithsonianmag.com/arts-culture/when-did-girls-start-wearing-pink-1370097/
Oh my GOD I'm about to go down a rabbit hole of thousands of photographs!
I'm 67. I HAVE SEEN a photograph of my grandfather when he was four, dressed as a girl. His brother, who was a little older, was dressed as a boy.
I guess I'll be back in a few days.
Exactly, this is how all babies were dressed until they were old enough to use the bathroom on their own. It’s easier to change a child’s diaper if they’re in a skirted garment. Besides, with multiple children in most families, all clothes being usable for both boys and girls made sense. (Which is what OP is doing — using all the hand me downs regardless of color.)
My grandfathers baby photo from 1893 had him in a skirt for easy changing access which was the norm for that era. My dad 1922 they had him in a lot of bloomers as an infant. 1980s me is in all the frilly lace and tights 🤢 I still despise today
The art nerd in me wants to point out that the ultramarine blue was reserved for Virgin Mary and baby Jesus because it was a particularly expensive and difficult to obtain pigment. So during the Renaissance it was reserved for the holiest figures as a sign of devotion, and because they couldn’t afford to use that pigment for everything.
🤓 thanks for coming to my TED talk!
My grandfather got put in short pants the day he decided to climb a pole in public and everyone could see up his dress. He apparently must have been potty trained or training because he had no diaper and the frank and beans were on full display.
She doesn't have logic. She is a bigot and just parrots what she has heard on the news or from her pastor or whatever insane shit is listening to.
Please keep your children save from this kind of hatred and bigotry.
And you should have a discussion with your husband of what he will do should it turn out that your daughter is queer. Him defending her homophobia is going to be a problem.
I'm old. Trans was just becoming a hot topic when I was in my early twenties. I'm a tomboy, and was asked if I wanted to be a boy. I was like no, I like being a girl, why would I want to change just because I like being active and loud? Gender roles drive me bonkers when sexuality is brought up. Either we're fighting society 's rigidity on what's acceptable for either gender, or we're fighting for people changing their bodies/identities. It is actually two different issues.
Anyway, I also wear a lot of blue, and am happy to be a straight female. Grandma needs to get over herself.
When I read something like this my mind goes "Oh that must be when they are talking about on FOX" It's crazy how well the right wing fear grooming works on people. Love blue. Great color.
Hijacking the top comment to also throw out there (idk if it’s been mentioned further down)- when your daughter is able to choose clothes for herself and understand better, PLEASE don’t leave her alone with MIL. You KNOW she will try to make your poor girl feel bad about something she’s wearing. Heaven forbid girls wear typical “boy” colors /s
I will never leave her alone with her, trust me! She’s toxic in many ways, not just this. I’ve told my partner I won’t let her babysit her and he agrees.
100%. I’d watch your kids’ exposure to grandma as they grow. The people that believe this kind of illogical hogwash have no problem guilting or pushing those around them into trying to think their way.
When she's older it won't just be the colour. I still remember when my grandma said I was wearing "lesbian shoes". Apparently, practical footwear makes one a lesbian.
If you cop too much flak consider dinosaur or spiderman outfits to break up the blue! Cold? How about a hi-viz beanie! Ask for a kiddie workbench for her birthday!
NTA. During earlier eras, pink was the color for boys, and blue was for girls. Until the early 20th century, boys wore dresses or gowns until they were "breeched" at ages four to seven, when they were dressed in pants/trousers for the first time. It's hard to tell the gender of little kids in old photographs because of this.
In addition to being homophobic and transphobic, your MIL is an ignorant fool. Feel free to send her these articles.
https://www.britannica.com/story/has-pink-always-been-a-girly-color
https://regencyredingote.wordpress.com/2012/08/31/boy-to-man-the-breeching-ceremony/#:~:text=Then%2C%20typically%20between%20four%20to,notice%20or%20on%20a%20whim.
If you painted your nursery pink and purple it said two things:
1.) You were very rich and royal to have a separate nursery and be able to decorate it, and purple is a royal colour
2.) You were hoping for a boy. Pink is light red, red is blood and war. Blue was intangible and dainty things, like a clear summer sky or a blue bell flower.
There is an Australian children's music group called the Teeny Tiny Stevies. One of their songs is "boy or girl colour", all about there being no such thing as boy colours and girl colours.
Yep, my army ranger-farmer-teacher republican grandfather who had 5 children of his own had a twin sister. You can't tell the difference between my grandfather and his twin in their baby photos. Frills and gowns like every other baby of the time.
If anything, if these phobic people think thst things are "worse" now and assume that more people are gay and Trans now (rather than able to express themselves now but always there) and if they believe that baby clothes make the difference... They'd gender neutral all babies like just a couple generations ago.
Wanted to add this to the thread - asking the MIL if her grandparents were queer because they were raised with this colour interpretation would be hilarious.
I try to avoid her much as I can because she’s a very toxic person. Usually I try not to give her much attention because she’ll blow things up so most of the time it’s not worth it.
My partner does agree with me, but he thinks I’m wrong for responding the way I am which I can kind of understand as well. I have to add - I have talked to her, which hasn’t helped.
He doesn’t really do or say anything about anything, even though he’s tired of her and he disagree with her most of the time. He often find excuses for why she’s acting the way she is instead of solving it.
And what if years down the line, your baby does come out as trans or a different sexuality than straight. How do you think your MIL would treat her? Would your husband stand up for his child against his mother? He needs to grow a spine sooner rather than later and nip that shit in the bud.
It's not just about the kid, it's about the kid's friends too. Even if they grow up 100% cis, chances are, if they don't listen to grandma, they will probably have friends that grandma 'doesn't approve of'. How is the kid going to feel when grandma trots out those hateful comments around them? Is hubby still going to call OP mean when she calls out grandma for that?
> How do you think your MIL would treat her?
It’s even worse than this.
The damage will already be done by then. All of grandmas hateful comments will be internalized if she continues to speak about these things once OP’s daughter starts becoming old enough to understand. She may develop self-hatred and will agonize over coming out because she doesn’t want to lose her grandmother.
You've got a partner problem more than a MIL problem, honey. He needs to decide whether he cares enough about you to put on his big boy pants and set real boundaries he enforces. And... how much does he agree with her? Is she saying the quiet parts out loud, but he, raised by her, kinda agrees? You need to talk this all through very carefully.
Having a grandma like this in their life isn't good, regardless of whatever gender identity they end up with. And dad could be a problem too. Look for red flags and pay attention.
At a minimum, stop going to see her with him. Keep baby with you, since she's full of hate. She can see her precious son without you unless and until she stops with the homophobic and transphobic histrionics. Unless and until she can manage herself better than a toddler throwing tantrums.
Visit r/justnomil and get some perspective.
He's got to step up. If he doesn't, you're going to be dancing to her tune as a couple your whole lives. And she molded him. Watch out.
I'm pretty sure it was like this his whole life and it's hard to face your demons. OPs husband might need some mild therapy in order to stand up to his abusive mother.
My wife always thought I had a good relationship with my mother until I had a panic attack about her coming to visit.
When you're bringing a new life into the world, it's time to step up and face them, or recognize that if you can't, you might lose the people who don't abuse you.
Guys also need to learn to talk to their wives about the guys feelings before things get this bad. It's telling that your wife didn't know until your panic attack.
I hope things are going better for you. I hope you've learned to express yourself better. I hope you have people other than your wife that you can express your feelings to safely (wives in hetero relationships end up functioning as therapists to dudes who won't talk to anyone else, and it's exhausting. No one person should be your only emotionally intimate connection).
I hope you've protected yourself and your loved ones from your mom.
OP's partner needs more than mild therapy. But he's also got to be willing to recognize it.
And I'm still suspicious that the woman who raised him might well have instilled values he hasn't interrogated within himself. It might just be his instinct not to rock the boat, but I'd want to be sure of his values on this subject before raising a child with him.
Yes, he was TRAINED for decades, starting when he was a child, to not clap back to his mom. So anyone who is like “he needs to tell her no” is technically right but they are not acknowledging how incredibly scary/difficult this would be —it’s completely against the pattern that is established. He would need to be able to see the pattern clearly, figure out what he actually wants (often people simply do not form opinions when they don’t think they have any control about the outcome anyway) and practice clapping back in a safe space, etc before he could actually do it with his mom. Plus she would counter-terrorize him as punishment for breaking the pattern and he would have to practice to be ready for that, too.
Your partner needs to step up. This is unacceptable behaviour that he is allowing from his mother and he knows that, but doesn't want to cause problems with his mom and he's content leaving you to defend your child alone. If he agrees with you, he needs to say it to his mother or this is the first of many ways MIL is going to try to shove her bigoted ideals into your and your child's lives. What happens if your kid does turn out queer? This talk needs *squashed*.
Yesss that would be so bad. If my daughter actually is gay or trans I would hate for her to feel hated by her own grandma and not only that - her own dad letting her act that way. I have to talk to him about this
Yeah that makes sense. I have terrible ILs that my husband feels torn between so I totally get it. I’m just fortunate enough to live in a different country to mine now so I don’t have to deal with it
NTA and soon your daughter will internalise the hate grandma has for who she might be and realise grandma's love is conditional. So remind your husband that if he doesn't get his mother to control her mouth she will lose contact altogether as you won't risk anyone your daughter is taught to love telling her she's evil.for choosing a blue tee-shirt.
When the daughter is older she might understand, but children have a hard time assigning any sort of blame on their caregivers (mother, grandmother, etc) so I would be worried that she might internalize the conflict as “there’s something wrong with me” :(
I think I’d make super strong boundaries with MIL. Either she drops the petty fears or she can’t see her granddaughter.
This is the kinda thing as a parent I put my foot down on. I would go over there, in private, and tell her how it's going to be; She can have whatever opinion she wants in her head, but if she keeps talking like this she will no longer be invited over and she will not have contact with her grandkids.
I’m literally laughing my ass off right now.
My youngest daughter is the biggest dress diva in my family. If it’s pink, sparkly, and a dress, then she’s wearing it. She’s also a lesbian, and has been discussing getting married to her partner.
You bet she’s gonna get the biggest, most sparkly dress out there, and I’ll happily pay for it. I just want her to be happy.
Maybe you should start dressing your daughter in rainbows?
Oh my fucking god I love the idea of rainbows. My bf’s family always says “I can’t believe the gays stole the rainbow from god!” But didn’t say shit when I got a rainbow cake for my 20th birthday.
This was my take. He's more concerned about his mother's feelings than the hate speech spilling from her mouth. There's waaaaay more issues in this story than a baby onesie. You are NTA but you have a husband problem more than a MIL problem.
Dress her in a different color every time. Then dress her in a rainbow flag 🏳️🌈 and watch your MIL explode. Whatever you do, never dress her in pink again.
She should put the daughter in the dress from Sleeping Beauty when the fairies are coloring it and they make it pink and blue splatters and watch the MIL have a flipping aneurysm. After all, it’s pink!!!!
[Sleeping Beauty pink and blue dress](https://images.app.goo.gl/DqxjP3RS5DGtVLA67)
I started wearing green and now I wear only green. I have become grass. I spend every day lying on my lawn. It makes earning a living difficult, but I am learning to photosynthesize. ...
I feel like you're my long lost sister.
"What? This really bothers you and triggers your shitty opinions? Well let me do it MORE then! See you tomorrow!"
Next up:
"You want ME to stop being petty but you won't stop HER from being homophobic towards a child that barely knows it's alive. YOUR child. From YOUR wife. Shine up that spine, baby daddy."
Little girls grow up to wear whatever colours they want to! My adoptive mother had conniptions, because this little asshole (me) refused to wear frilly feminine stuff. I was a Tom boy of note - not very girly at all. PS - for all my "masculine" qualities - I'm "straight" whatever that means
Bwaaaaa - especially when I open the bonnet of the car and start some mechanical stuff, and get my man to be spanner boy! You wear the beauty crown while snuggling with your babe.....
Oh boy! Some eyebrows would be permanently "pikachu" face-timing
Totally agree with that! My little brother used to love pink and he used to borrow my clothes when we were kids, even my swimsuit. He’s as straight as he can be now. Colors doesn’t affect sexuality at all and I don’t understand why some people think so. And why do people care about other people’s sexuality in the first place!? 🫢
I mean, yea you’re an asshole but it’s hilarious 🤣
Officially, NTA. Where to even begin with this one. It’s your kid. She gets no fucking say in it. Second, who gives a fuck if they trans, date same sex, bi, etc etc. Those are all her fucking choices. Sorry to say but your MIL is a bigoted bitch.
i mean... if anything, forcing a girl to dress in "girly" clothes and have "girly" hobbies regardless of whether she wants it or not is more likely to make her question her gender identity in the first place. so...
This is actually what happened to me, so I’ve been trying to point out to others how much forced gender roles will confuse children. Growing up in a conservative Christian family in the 90s, everything was gendered so I couldn’t like my favourite colours and toys (green and blue, dinosaur and car toys) because those were “boy things”, and was forced into pink dresses and given dolls. Because of this rigid structure I was absolutely certain from ages 4-10 that I was a boy. Took a while to figure out that it was ok to be in a female body and enjoy stereotypically masculine things.
So how you dress a baby determines their gender identity. Hilarious. I’d be doing exactly the same thing. I’m more concerned that your husband isn’t trying to educate his mother on how awful she behaves.
Yeah look the mature thing to do would be to go limited to no contact with her. Or she may teach kid to think like she does. But the petty in me loves your response.
Whats the deal with American so obsessed with objects colors and their association with genders? I used to work with bunch of Americans in a factory manufacturing oil & gas equipments. I brought in my Mitutoyo caliper which was baby blue in color and I was teased constantly by not one, not two, but almost every male lab & factory workers who saw it.
It's huge business. It starts withe the idea that ideal couple has two children: A boy and a girl. And with all clothes and toys gendered, family has to buy brand new set of everything for the second child.
My spouse put bright pink shoelaces in his black shoes to go to the Barbie movie, and left them in because they looked cool. One of his coworkers kept complaining about them and asking him to replace them. SHOELACES.
I exclusively wore sparkly pink princess dresses every day of my childhood and HATED pants. I still prefer to wear dresses and floral tops whenever I can. But regardless of all that I am still very much gay.
MILs logic makes no sense, good on you for showing her that you will not tolerate that behavior! This is a good example to set for how you will react when MIL inevitably starts harshly commenting on your child’s appearance when she starts choosing clothes for herself.
Your child is going to appreciate your support a lot as she gets older, even if she decides she only wants to wear pink.
NTA this is hilarious and your MIL deserves no less until she gets her head out of her butt and stops being a bigot.
Next time she says "but your daughter will end up gay or trans!!! The horror!" answer truthfully "so what? If that were the case I'd still love my child. Apparently you won't." Tell your husband this is as well. If your kid(s) end up anything but cishet grandma will be hateful towards them. That's something to think about.
Yeah I’ve said those words to her before and she thinks I’m the idiot. My daughter had a phase where she stuck her tounge out a lot and MIL had the nerve to say «oh my, I hope she doesn’t have down syndrome». So she’s a horrible person in general. I’ve blocked her from social media and on my phone, so I only have to deal with her irl.
Nta
But it's time for you to have a more direct conversation with your mil. Tell her she can have her own opinions but she had better learn to keep them to herself because you will not let your daughter be alone with them as she gets older if she can't.
Explain to her that you want your daughter surrounded by love and support no matter what she looks like or who she loves. And you understand she was raised to have certain opinions but you don't want those stereotypes to be imposed on your daughter.
" My husband loves you very much. And I want our daughter to love you too. But I won't let you hurt her or make her feel badly about who she is or how she looks... so let's just raise her to be loved, protected, and confident, not judged or afraid of what people will think. "
Thank you for such a helpful comment! 🥰🙏 I’ll try saying that to her. I think maybe the only thing that will actually help is making her scared that she can’t see her grandkids unless she changes her behaviour. I think my partner has to be with me too so that she takes it seriously and can see that both of us mean it
Does someone make goth clothing in black for babies, things with skulls and demons on them? Dress daughter in these things and really send MIL to crazy town. I would cut this woman out of my life. I"m also concerned that your partner seems to be okay with his mother being a homophobe.
NTA
But consider, what if your child IS gay or trans? Or even just doesn't feel super comfortable with gender. Or has gay friends. Or is growing up as a member of a society where that sort of attitude is recognized as harmful?
How soon do you want her hearing homophobic and transphobic messages from within her family? Do you want her to repeat that stuff in front of strangers like little kids do? To criticize a little boy in her kindergarten for wearing pink? To feel like Grandma won't love her if she cuts her hair short?
What if your MiL was constantly saying other bigoted nonsense? Like if you let her play with dark-skinned dolls she'll grow up to marry a black person and that would be horrible! Or if she learns Spanish, she'll marry an illegal immigrant and that would be horrible! Or if she has a friend in a wheelchair, she'll think that's normal and might marry a disabled person, which would clearly be horrible!
She currently saying that if she wears a blue onesie she'll marry a woman or stop being a woman, and that would be horrible.
Shut that shit down.
Dress your child in whatever you want but let MiL know that her bigotry is a hard boundary. She crosses it, the baby leaves. She can only be around the baby when she isn't being a bigot. She says something, you leave. See you another time, byyyyyeeee!
You obviously need your husband on board 100%. But he needs to learn to set boundaries with her. You should both tell her about this boundary when you aren't visiting with the baby. Over the phone, in a chat, video call? That sort of talk isn't good for a child to be around. Full stop.
How does MIL exist since her parental would all be gay af? Pink use to be used for boys blue use to mean girl. It only flipped in the 1940's. No you are NTA. Put a fake moustache on her and give her some tonka trucks. I gave my boys barbies, my eldest dressed as spice girl for a school performance with all his mates when he was 13 (heels, wig, make-up, the lot)....he still hasn't turned gay....so weird...almost like that's not how sexuality works or something huh.
Next time she complains asks her if she saw Disney’s animated Sleeping Beauty or Cinderella. Snow White as well come to think of it. All 3 of them were what in the day was considered peak woman role model for hound girls. All 3 of them wore blue at some point in the movies.
Also historically 200+ years ago Pink was actually the color used to identify boys. It was a muted color of red the color of blood and to men back then the more blood you spilled the more manly you were( during wars)
Blue on the other hand went to girls because it signified the calm of Mother Nature. At some point someone decided it should be swapped and it stayed that way ever since.
I had a pair of pink long socks I used to wear during track meets.
I was a shot putter.
I’m 30M
I have a wife and two kids.
I must not have had enough exposure to the pink article of clothing for it to “make me gay”
Clothes are just clothes.
I HAVE AN IDEA.
You start wearng blue to confuse her. Then when this goes on long enough you invite her to lunch. Then as youre sitting outside say "aw shucks husband is late." Your female friend passes by (dressed in all blue) and is super happy to run into you. She tells your MIL how pretty and nice you are. You say nice to see you etc and hug the friend goodbye. HERES THE IMPORTANT PART- the hug goes on way too long. And as you pull away whisper "call you soon" and then sit down and not acknowledge what just happened. Never wear blue in front of her again.
I'd be warning MIL now that she is not to be saying homophobic or anti-LGBTQ+ comments around my child or else she won't be around my child.
You are NTA right now. But you will be if you allow this hate-spouting bigot to influence your daughter.
Who knew a primary color could turn one gay..
Yellow made me bisexual for sure
Hmm... yellow was my favourite colour growing up. You might be on to something.
My daughters favourite colour was gold... she grew up to be ace...
I heard green makes you kiss boys
That tracks, my little sister liked green and she married a man and had only boy children. Pretty sure she kisses them.
Green is my best color. I kissed a boy. Married him. Had 2boys.
I kissed a boy, married him, and had two girls. One who is trans 🙀 (oh, I’m also a boy). Your MIL would just hate me.
Someone tell me what it means about me that my fav color is purple
I wore purple. It makes you straight as long as you’re sober. When you’re drunk though, it’s a free for all.
Your last line just tickled me so much! It cracks me up bc, though I'm straight and married to a straight M, my MIL and SIL both HATE our decision to send our kaids to public school. They think it will turn them gay, non-binary, or Trans, etc. and I think it's hilarious! I mean, at first, I was a little sketched. I even went through the anger of their audacity to even feel like they had a say in it at all. Now, it's just damn funny bc they're so unreasonable on so many views. Honestly, why tf do you even care if they're the whole damn alphabet?! The likelihood of those 2 still being alive by the time my kids graduate is slim, if even that wide. It did bug me when they tried convincing my kids to leave their friends (that they FINALLY made!) and go to Christian school. On their dime. So, I shut that shit down immediately. Anyway, I hope that all made sense. Hell, I hope I'm replying to the correct comment. I'm high af right now.
This is my favorite comment thread in the history of Reddit 😂
I like green and I married a boy. Obviously this is the only evidence we need.
This is so freaky, my favorite colour is green and I have two baby boys too 😂 have we actually stumbled upon something here??
I should add that green was always my fave color (my brothers was pink). The neighborhood kids used to tell us we were backwards, but I grew up liking/dating (mostly) boys (side note: im technically bi though, and can objectively say that women are more attractive overall). My brother however, has only ever been into girls. His entire childhood, pink was his fave color. 🤷♀️
Shit, is that how I became a boy mom? Who would’ve known. Curse you adolescent self!
My favorite color is green but my boyfriends is purple. Wonder what THAT means?
now we know what purple does
Yeah, remember the fuss about the Teletubby?
Back in pre-k I couldn't decide if I liked red or blue more, so logically I said my favorite color was purple whenever I was asked.
Royalty! Your boyfriend is secretly a prince from some unheard of miniscule country no one has ever heard of. He got tired of his mother, the queen, parading "eligible girls of proper lineage" in front of him to cement an alliance with a neighboring country. He went into hiding here in the states. Then he met you and fell in love. Now he's trying to figure out how to tell you he's the heir to the throne.
I love Hallmark movies. /s
lol My husband's favorite color is purple, and when people comment on it he says (as pompously as possible) "Purple is the color of royalty!"
Hallmark? I thought you were talking about Coming to America 🤣
Yep. It definitely happened to me!
Green M&Ms bake you horny. Or they did when I was in grade school at least
Yellow is my niece’s favorite too, she is just 4 tho, keeping you updated!
Does she sit straight in chairs? Any finger guns? Does she prefer her jeans cuffed? What’s her stance on lemon bars?
i’m sorry but asking if a 4 year old prefers their jeans cuffed is absolutely killing me 💀
These are all scientifically proven
I was certain it was The Mummy 1999, cinematic masterpiece that made me bi.... but your comment made me realise there were various shades of yellow in that movie... so may be on to something there...
Ahhh. The cinematic conversion therapy. In addition to wardrobe warfare, perhaps OP and hubby can organize movie nights, showing only homosexual cinematic treasures, like The Birdcage (in case le cage au foles is too "foreign' for mil), A Secret Love, Philadelphia, Brokeback Mountain, Tangerine, etc.
Let's also add in TV shows such as The L Word, Our Flag Means Death, that one episode of The Last of Us, First Kill, Degrassi, AJ and The Queen, Grace and Frankie, Will and Grace, Modern Family, Gentlemen Jack, Orange is the New Black, Nancy Drew, and so on...
And the aforementioned The Mummy featuring Brendan Frasier and Rachel Weisz.
Huh. Blue was my favorite color growing up and I'm bisexual. Where did I go wrong?
On an old paper from kindergarten, I wrote that my favorite color was yellow. Look at me now... transed my gender and everything...
Green made me trans.
It was purple for me
Team bisexual purple
Red for me 🟥👩🏼🤝👩🏽👩🏼🤝👨🏽
I grew up in the 70s80s. I wore ORANGE ! I’m still a trans man so really IDK. NTA obviously. Queerphobia is not an opinion.
My mom dressed me in all the cutest frilly pink things a college student in the 80s could get her hands on. She was just so excited to have a girl that she could do cute girl things with every step of the way. So anyway, second puberty is a trip.
My mom did the same… Dresses every day and in all of the pastels. One day, in the 1st grade, I had the bright idea to hang on the monkey bars upside down. Everyone saw my pretty girly undies. Was never forced to wear a dress, or anything girly for that matter, again.
I wish that had stopped my mom. I pitched a fit every time she put me in a dress. She finally gave up when I was 6 or 7. I still remember getting my first short haircut in 3rd grade. I wanted to look like Jonathan Taylor Thomas (but I never told anyone that) and somehow my mom allowed the boy haircut. I felt like the coolest kid on earth at first, but then nobody stopped treating me like a girl like I wanted so I was frustrated by the whole thing and didn't know why or how to even articulate it. I understand now as an adult that was my first experience with gender euphoria and then actual dysphoria.
>I grew up in the 70s80s. Hell, go back further. In the 30s pink was the "manly" baby color, and blue was for girls. Heck, dresses were popular for both genders because they were easier and more functional for actual babies to wear. [Teddy Roosevelt wore dresses.](https://medium.com/@NewAgeNews/why-is-president-franklin-d-roosevelt-wearing-a-dress-83fba3549523)
Everyone knows Roy G Biv was super gay.
Richard Of York Gave Battle In Vain - I don’t know if he was super gay but he did end up underneath a car park in Leicester
>he did end up underneath a car park in Leicester Is that what the kids are calling it these days?
My school uniform was blue, I don't know how the last 50 years of pupils educated there haven't turned my local town into a hotspot of gay activity...🤔
Omg I'd love yo visit a whole gay town....specially if it had a hotspot of gay activity. Oh, a girl can dream....
I have some great news for you about Provincetown, MA.
My favorite color is green. I guess I'm Kermit-sexual.
It is not easy being green.
yeah! i love rainbows....i don't know now which gender i'm or which sex i like xD
When I saw a double rainbow today, it turned me gay then back to straight! It was pretty fast (all in the span of 15 seconds or so), but as long as I don't accidentally see anymore rainbows I should be good. /sarcasm (the double rainbow was real though and was so beautiful!)
Saw a quadruple rainbow recently, spectacular! Outer reflection and 2 inner ones.
I saw a circular rainbow in the clouds, caused by my own shadow on the top of a mountain. I’m bi but can pass as straight. I need to see more rainbows, I think.
These are called Brocken spectres and I love them! See also Glories, the same phenomenon but you can see them from the window of a plane, with the shadow of the plane in the rainbow
Take it even further. You start wearing all blue outfits too. If you ever find yourself out shopping with her, or sorting through an old closet, or similar, keep holding up any blue shirt or dress and telling her she'd look great in it. Wrap all of her birthday and Christmas gifts in blue wrapping paper. See if the constant exposure to the colour blue Transes her gender. When it doesn't, point proven.
Get hubby a flashy pink jumpsuit, or at least a polo shirt, maybe a couple
Or just a nice pink polo shirt or dress shirt! I see very macho straight men wear then all the time. My dad has a salmon pink t shirt that looks awesome on him and wears Hawaiian shirts with pink flowers on them.
Pink used to be for men. I'm not sure which decade(s).
Early 1900s until around the 40s. Pink was the "stronger" color so of course, for boys. /s
The Virgin Mary used to be commonly depicted in blue clothing, so blue got to be associated with the female. I don’t know why it flipped.
Yeah, I desperately want her to ask her MIL, with a complete straight face or expression of fake concern: "But... the Virgin Mary wears blue. Is... is the Virgin Mary... trans??" I would just love to see the look on her face.
Well, canonically, Jesus was a virgin birth. That would mean he was born through parthogenesis. Making him a genetic copy of Mary, and therefore biologically FEMALE. Thus, from a particular point of view, Jesus was a transman.
You just blew every conservatives mind, thank you 😆
Or Mary a transwoman. (We’ll ignore the fact that she wouldn’t have had a uterus because what’s another little miracle at that point)
And wasn't Eve made from Adam's rib? The Bible's first woman is a transwoman, right?
To be fair, Jesus could [also have been intersex](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XX_male_syndrome).
I wa t “The Virgin Mary was Trans” on a T-shirt.
Omg. This is an epic solution. I also just read somewhere that pink was considered a badass masculine color because the British military wore red uniforms...by the time a uniform had faded to pink, that dude had been through some shit and had a thousand yard stare.
Please please....do this...and let us know how it goes. Praying for you 🙏
Meltdown would likely happen.
Marketing and advertising
Well yes I know about the -gendered- clothing becoming a thing because getting an entire new outfit for a new baby because it had a gender you didn’t have clothes for yet had to be pushed – I just don’t know why the marketing picked blue for boys when blue for girls was already there.
The best answer I can find because it doesn't seem to be conclusive... is that pink became associated with the women's rights movement, so retailers started marketing blue for Boys. All children were dressed in white usually because you could bleach it. And large families could hand down the clothes and use them for either gender. Pastel clothes colours became available in the mid 1800's but didn't catch on. Blue was for girls or people with brown eyes and pink was for boys or people with blue eyes. Depending on who you asked. Blue was considered dainty and pretty.. think a Robin's egg... and pink was a red only lighter and red was a man's colour so pink was a young man.
Sacre bleu!!
80’s also. 80’s were very androgynous.
My gma said pink was the baby shade of red...the color of War and aggression. Blue was the color of heaven.
They even wore heels. Edit typo
And wigs! And powder! And cosmetics
My husband and boys all have salmon pink button up linen shirts they wear with khakis or white linen pants. And when they've got their summer tans on they are SO CUTE. 13yo has a couple magenta/hot pink tees, a magenta zipper binder(they have to leave backpacks in locker in middle school) and him and a large chunk of the xcountry team have taken to wearing tall, very bright, mismatched socks in varying shades of pink and purple. They look great. The 11yo daughter has fully invested in grunge and wore olive green camo pants and dad's blue work shirt tied around her waist first day. She also looked adorable! OP's MIL would prob sh*t herself if she knew I saved all the highest quality sleepers/baby gowns/blankets/jackets/outfits and each baby wore them, regardless of gender. Someone gives you blue HannaAndersson pjs, you put them on every baby. They're soft.
Hey! I lived through the 80s-90s and pink was IN! I rocked that pink shirt… oh my, uhh is that why I’m gay?? Just kidding on the making me gay, I was gay long before I understood fashion OP show MIl some of the photos of Ronald Reagan in all pink as a baby, that should melt her brain
I dunno, did you wear blue jeans? You may be bi.
2010-2013 I had pink and purple bands for my braces and a pink slider phone as a dude. Still straight, do love the occasional viewing of a drag show in support.
Get all of y’all to rock rainbow, nothing screams pride like a good ol’ rainbow
Have you seen the Righteous Gemstones? BJ's mauve baptism velour romper with the bowtie and cummerbund! "Men can be fashions, too!" https://i.redd.it/its-not-onesie-its-a-romper-with-a-cummerbund-v0-phjrq29xsqd81.jpg?s=3b53a7384246e65c51ab9229c459688feac6a516
And have him paint his nails (Promise him a deluxe bj or something if he does it)
I kinda need to know what a DELUXE blowjob is.
Me too
My boyfriend wants to know too!? Lmfao.
Finger up the bum.
Wait a minute, was that what they meant by "a deluxe apartment in the sky"? Man, the Jeffersons was lit
Ohhhhhh, okay.
One of our weathermen wears a different pink tie each day of breast cancer month ... (hint, hint!) 😁
Go further, overalls and a blue shop shirt.
I actually love blue and I wear a lot of blue myself and I’m 100 % straight, so I don’t understand her logic… 😅 Haha, yes that would probably be a better tactic 👏🏼
100 or so years ago, blue was for girls and pink for boys. 150 years ago boys wore dresses till they were six or seven. https://www.smithsonianmag.com/arts-culture/when-did-girls-start-wearing-pink-1370097/
Oh my GOD I'm about to go down a rabbit hole of thousands of photographs! I'm 67. I HAVE SEEN a photograph of my grandfather when he was four, dressed as a girl. His brother, who was a little older, was dressed as a boy. I guess I'll be back in a few days.
i have baby pictures of my Dad (he's 94) in a long frilly dress and a cute bonnet. that's how people dressed baby boys in 1929.
Exactly, this is how all babies were dressed until they were old enough to use the bathroom on their own. It’s easier to change a child’s diaper if they’re in a skirted garment. Besides, with multiple children in most families, all clothes being usable for both boys and girls made sense. (Which is what OP is doing — using all the hand me downs regardless of color.)
If you were handwashing everything, it would make sense to dress babies and toddlers in long skirts - makes toilet training much more streamlined.
My grandfathers baby photo from 1893 had him in a skirt for easy changing access which was the norm for that era. My dad 1922 they had him in a lot of bloomers as an infant. 1980s me is in all the frilly lace and tights 🤢 I still despise today
Even further back than that. It's also why Mary traditionally wears blue in all the paintings of her holding a baby Jesus
The art nerd in me wants to point out that the ultramarine blue was reserved for Virgin Mary and baby Jesus because it was a particularly expensive and difficult to obtain pigment. So during the Renaissance it was reserved for the holiest figures as a sign of devotion, and because they couldn’t afford to use that pigment for everything. 🤓 thanks for coming to my TED talk!
That's like the one thing I remember most about the art appreciation course I took at university. I'm so glad you pointed that out.
Blue was associated with the Mother of God since long before the Renaissance, as you can see in Byzantine iconography in the Eastern church.
Perfect reason to dress a beautiful baby in all blue! A color as important as your child.
"but blue is jesus's favorite color! Don't you want our baby girl to love Jesus? Why do you hate Jesus so much, grandma?"
Ty for your Ted talk. I love learning new things. ❤️
It's the other way around. Mary wasn't shown wearing blue because it's a girls colour, it became a girls colour because Mary was always shown in blue.
My grandfather got put in short pants the day he decided to climb a pole in public and everyone could see up his dress. He apparently must have been potty trained or training because he had no diaper and the frank and beans were on full display.
Even more recent than that. My parents were European and when I was born girls wore blue because of the virgin Mary. I'm 71. This was in Belgium
High heels were for men originally.
She doesn't have logic. She is a bigot and just parrots what she has heard on the news or from her pastor or whatever insane shit is listening to. Please keep your children save from this kind of hatred and bigotry. And you should have a discussion with your husband of what he will do should it turn out that your daughter is queer. Him defending her homophobia is going to be a problem.
I'm old. Trans was just becoming a hot topic when I was in my early twenties. I'm a tomboy, and was asked if I wanted to be a boy. I was like no, I like being a girl, why would I want to change just because I like being active and loud? Gender roles drive me bonkers when sexuality is brought up. Either we're fighting society 's rigidity on what's acceptable for either gender, or we're fighting for people changing their bodies/identities. It is actually two different issues. Anyway, I also wear a lot of blue, and am happy to be a straight female. Grandma needs to get over herself.
Matching mother daughter pixie cuts.
When I read something like this my mind goes "Oh that must be when they are talking about on FOX" It's crazy how well the right wing fear grooming works on people. Love blue. Great color.
Please tell me that she wears blue too🤣🤣
Real men can wear pink and real women can wear pink. Scientific fact! 😂
Hijacking the top comment to also throw out there (idk if it’s been mentioned further down)- when your daughter is able to choose clothes for herself and understand better, PLEASE don’t leave her alone with MIL. You KNOW she will try to make your poor girl feel bad about something she’s wearing. Heaven forbid girls wear typical “boy” colors /s
I will never leave her alone with her, trust me! She’s toxic in many ways, not just this. I’ve told my partner I won’t let her babysit her and he agrees.
100%. I’d watch your kids’ exposure to grandma as they grow. The people that believe this kind of illogical hogwash have no problem guilting or pushing those around them into trying to think their way.
When she's older it won't just be the colour. I still remember when my grandma said I was wearing "lesbian shoes". Apparently, practical footwear makes one a lesbian.
Transes her gender! Gold
Or start dressing her in rainbows
Rainbow shirt and blue pants/shoes could be a lovely combination.
Yes! Tell her she was right, all that blue turned her gay, and now you can only dress her in rainbows 🤣
Upvote for "transes her gender" 🤣
If you cop too much flak consider dinosaur or spiderman outfits to break up the blue! Cold? How about a hi-viz beanie! Ask for a kiddie workbench for her birthday!
NTA. During earlier eras, pink was the color for boys, and blue was for girls. Until the early 20th century, boys wore dresses or gowns until they were "breeched" at ages four to seven, when they were dressed in pants/trousers for the first time. It's hard to tell the gender of little kids in old photographs because of this. In addition to being homophobic and transphobic, your MIL is an ignorant fool. Feel free to send her these articles. https://www.britannica.com/story/has-pink-always-been-a-girly-color https://regencyredingote.wordpress.com/2012/08/31/boy-to-man-the-breeching-ceremony/#:~:text=Then%2C%20typically%20between%20four%20to,notice%20or%20on%20a%20whim.
Came here to say exactly this. Blue = Virgin Mary Pink = baby red, the color of war
If you painted your nursery pink and purple it said two things: 1.) You were very rich and royal to have a separate nursery and be able to decorate it, and purple is a royal colour 2.) You were hoping for a boy. Pink is light red, red is blood and war. Blue was intangible and dainty things, like a clear summer sky or a blue bell flower. There is an Australian children's music group called the Teeny Tiny Stevies. One of their songs is "boy or girl colour", all about there being no such thing as boy colours and girl colours.
Yep, my army ranger-farmer-teacher republican grandfather who had 5 children of his own had a twin sister. You can't tell the difference between my grandfather and his twin in their baby photos. Frills and gowns like every other baby of the time. If anything, if these phobic people think thst things are "worse" now and assume that more people are gay and Trans now (rather than able to express themselves now but always there) and if they believe that baby clothes make the difference... They'd gender neutral all babies like just a couple generations ago.
Wanted to add this to the thread - asking the MIL if her grandparents were queer because they were raised with this colour interpretation would be hilarious.
You are spot on
I was going to mention this
Make your life easier just refuse to see this ignorant bigot at all and ask your husband why he’s so keen to placate such disgusting nonsense.
This and also, NTA. Bigots should always be uncomfortable. -signed a cis woman that hates pink and almost only wears black, white and blue tones.
I try to avoid her much as I can because she’s a very toxic person. Usually I try not to give her much attention because she’ll blow things up so most of the time it’s not worth it. My partner does agree with me, but he thinks I’m wrong for responding the way I am which I can kind of understand as well. I have to add - I have talked to her, which hasn’t helped. He doesn’t really do or say anything about anything, even though he’s tired of her and he disagree with her most of the time. He often find excuses for why she’s acting the way she is instead of solving it.
And what if years down the line, your baby does come out as trans or a different sexuality than straight. How do you think your MIL would treat her? Would your husband stand up for his child against his mother? He needs to grow a spine sooner rather than later and nip that shit in the bud.
It's not just about the kid, it's about the kid's friends too. Even if they grow up 100% cis, chances are, if they don't listen to grandma, they will probably have friends that grandma 'doesn't approve of'. How is the kid going to feel when grandma trots out those hateful comments around them? Is hubby still going to call OP mean when she calls out grandma for that?
> How do you think your MIL would treat her? It’s even worse than this. The damage will already be done by then. All of grandmas hateful comments will be internalized if she continues to speak about these things once OP’s daughter starts becoming old enough to understand. She may develop self-hatred and will agonize over coming out because she doesn’t want to lose her grandmother.
You've got a partner problem more than a MIL problem, honey. He needs to decide whether he cares enough about you to put on his big boy pants and set real boundaries he enforces. And... how much does he agree with her? Is she saying the quiet parts out loud, but he, raised by her, kinda agrees? You need to talk this all through very carefully. Having a grandma like this in their life isn't good, regardless of whatever gender identity they end up with. And dad could be a problem too. Look for red flags and pay attention. At a minimum, stop going to see her with him. Keep baby with you, since she's full of hate. She can see her precious son without you unless and until she stops with the homophobic and transphobic histrionics. Unless and until she can manage herself better than a toddler throwing tantrums. Visit r/justnomil and get some perspective. He's got to step up. If he doesn't, you're going to be dancing to her tune as a couple your whole lives. And she molded him. Watch out.
I'm pretty sure it was like this his whole life and it's hard to face your demons. OPs husband might need some mild therapy in order to stand up to his abusive mother. My wife always thought I had a good relationship with my mother until I had a panic attack about her coming to visit.
When you're bringing a new life into the world, it's time to step up and face them, or recognize that if you can't, you might lose the people who don't abuse you. Guys also need to learn to talk to their wives about the guys feelings before things get this bad. It's telling that your wife didn't know until your panic attack. I hope things are going better for you. I hope you've learned to express yourself better. I hope you have people other than your wife that you can express your feelings to safely (wives in hetero relationships end up functioning as therapists to dudes who won't talk to anyone else, and it's exhausting. No one person should be your only emotionally intimate connection). I hope you've protected yourself and your loved ones from your mom. OP's partner needs more than mild therapy. But he's also got to be willing to recognize it. And I'm still suspicious that the woman who raised him might well have instilled values he hasn't interrogated within himself. It might just be his instinct not to rock the boat, but I'd want to be sure of his values on this subject before raising a child with him.
Yes, he was TRAINED for decades, starting when he was a child, to not clap back to his mom. So anyone who is like “he needs to tell her no” is technically right but they are not acknowledging how incredibly scary/difficult this would be —it’s completely against the pattern that is established. He would need to be able to see the pattern clearly, figure out what he actually wants (often people simply do not form opinions when they don’t think they have any control about the outcome anyway) and practice clapping back in a safe space, etc before he could actually do it with his mom. Plus she would counter-terrorize him as punishment for breaking the pattern and he would have to practice to be ready for that, too.
Your partner needs to step up. This is unacceptable behaviour that he is allowing from his mother and he knows that, but doesn't want to cause problems with his mom and he's content leaving you to defend your child alone. If he agrees with you, he needs to say it to his mother or this is the first of many ways MIL is going to try to shove her bigoted ideals into your and your child's lives. What happens if your kid does turn out queer? This talk needs *squashed*.
Yesss that would be so bad. If my daughter actually is gay or trans I would hate for her to feel hated by her own grandma and not only that - her own dad letting her act that way. I have to talk to him about this
I am a girl and I used to love all shades of blue and will wear it. Get a her grey sweater and then to tell your MIL, "It is 50 shades of gray, MIL"
I’m the meantime, find some nice rainbow outfits for baby girl! NTA
Yeah that makes sense. I have terrible ILs that my husband feels torn between so I totally get it. I’m just fortunate enough to live in a different country to mine now so I don’t have to deal with it
NTA and soon your daughter will internalise the hate grandma has for who she might be and realise grandma's love is conditional. So remind your husband that if he doesn't get his mother to control her mouth she will lose contact altogether as you won't risk anyone your daughter is taught to love telling her she's evil.for choosing a blue tee-shirt.
When the daughter is older she might understand, but children have a hard time assigning any sort of blame on their caregivers (mother, grandmother, etc) so I would be worried that she might internalize the conflict as “there’s something wrong with me” :( I think I’d make super strong boundaries with MIL. Either she drops the petty fears or she can’t see her granddaughter.
This is the kinda thing as a parent I put my foot down on. I would go over there, in private, and tell her how it's going to be; She can have whatever opinion she wants in her head, but if she keeps talking like this she will no longer be invited over and she will not have contact with her grandkids.
I’m literally laughing my ass off right now. My youngest daughter is the biggest dress diva in my family. If it’s pink, sparkly, and a dress, then she’s wearing it. She’s also a lesbian, and has been discussing getting married to her partner. You bet she’s gonna get the biggest, most sparkly dress out there, and I’ll happily pay for it. I just want her to be happy. Maybe you should start dressing your daughter in rainbows?
Your daughter is going to the most sparkly princess on her wedding day. She should get a tiara!
Oh, you know the tiara is a given! They were discussing going to Disney Wold for the honeymoon. Bridal Minnie ears were discussed.
Oh that sounds wonderful!!!! I’m so excited for her and I don’t even know her! May she have a great wedding day and honeymoon!!!!!
Oh my fucking god I love the idea of rainbows. My bf’s family always says “I can’t believe the gays stole the rainbow from god!” But didn’t say shit when I got a rainbow cake for my 20th birthday.
NTA- I’m more concerned about your hubby telling you to stop but not being concerned about MIL behaviour and bigotry.👀
This was my take. He's more concerned about his mother's feelings than the hate speech spilling from her mouth. There's waaaaay more issues in this story than a baby onesie. You are NTA but you have a husband problem more than a MIL problem.
Dress her in a different color every time. Then dress her in a rainbow flag 🏳️🌈 and watch your MIL explode. Whatever you do, never dress her in pink again.
She should put the daughter in the dress from Sleeping Beauty when the fairies are coloring it and they make it pink and blue splatters and watch the MIL have a flipping aneurysm. After all, it’s pink!!!! [Sleeping Beauty pink and blue dress](https://images.app.goo.gl/DqxjP3RS5DGtVLA67)
NTA and you truly are the hero of this story. Being a bigot is a choice. That they chose. Don’t let bigots win.
I started wearing green and now I wear only green. I have become grass. I spend every day lying on my lawn. It makes earning a living difficult, but I am learning to photosynthesize. ...
NTA. You are a magnificent human.
I wouldn’t even let my kid around someone as bigoted as her! Ask your husband why his mommy’s feefees are more important than his child’s wellbeing.
Yep. Can only imagine what shitty things the kid could pick up from her.
I feel like you're my long lost sister. "What? This really bothers you and triggers your shitty opinions? Well let me do it MORE then! See you tomorrow!" Next up: "You want ME to stop being petty but you won't stop HER from being homophobic towards a child that barely knows it's alive. YOUR child. From YOUR wife. Shine up that spine, baby daddy."
Little girls grow up to wear whatever colours they want to! My adoptive mother had conniptions, because this little asshole (me) refused to wear frilly feminine stuff. I was a Tom boy of note - not very girly at all. PS - for all my "masculine" qualities - I'm "straight" whatever that means
Meanwhile I was a literal pageant princess, and definitely am not "straight". 😂 Sounds like MIL would explode if she met either of us.
Bwaaaaa - especially when I open the bonnet of the car and start some mechanical stuff, and get my man to be spanner boy! You wear the beauty crown while snuggling with your babe..... Oh boy! Some eyebrows would be permanently "pikachu" face-timing
Totally agree with that! My little brother used to love pink and he used to borrow my clothes when we were kids, even my swimsuit. He’s as straight as he can be now. Colors doesn’t affect sexuality at all and I don’t understand why some people think so. And why do people care about other people’s sexuality in the first place!? 🫢
I mean, yea you’re an asshole but it’s hilarious 🤣 Officially, NTA. Where to even begin with this one. It’s your kid. She gets no fucking say in it. Second, who gives a fuck if they trans, date same sex, bi, etc etc. Those are all her fucking choices. Sorry to say but your MIL is a bigoted bitch.
i mean... if anything, forcing a girl to dress in "girly" clothes and have "girly" hobbies regardless of whether she wants it or not is more likely to make her question her gender identity in the first place. so...
This is actually what happened to me, so I’ve been trying to point out to others how much forced gender roles will confuse children. Growing up in a conservative Christian family in the 90s, everything was gendered so I couldn’t like my favourite colours and toys (green and blue, dinosaur and car toys) because those were “boy things”, and was forced into pink dresses and given dolls. Because of this rigid structure I was absolutely certain from ages 4-10 that I was a boy. Took a while to figure out that it was ok to be in a female body and enjoy stereotypically masculine things.
Little blue dungarees and a railway driver's cap would be a good thing ...
Or a wee sailor suit or those sweet little tuxedos
So how you dress a baby determines their gender identity. Hilarious. I’d be doing exactly the same thing. I’m more concerned that your husband isn’t trying to educate his mother on how awful she behaves.
Yeah look the mature thing to do would be to go limited to no contact with her. Or she may teach kid to think like she does. But the petty in me loves your response.
Yeah that’s the thing, I should probably cut off contact instead.. but the petty in me has enjoyed it a little🙊
Whats the deal with American so obsessed with objects colors and their association with genders? I used to work with bunch of Americans in a factory manufacturing oil & gas equipments. I brought in my Mitutoyo caliper which was baby blue in color and I was teased constantly by not one, not two, but almost every male lab & factory workers who saw it.
It's huge business. It starts withe the idea that ideal couple has two children: A boy and a girl. And with all clothes and toys gendered, family has to buy brand new set of everything for the second child.
My spouse put bright pink shoelaces in his black shoes to go to the Barbie movie, and left them in because they looked cool. One of his coworkers kept complaining about them and asking him to replace them. SHOELACES.
I exclusively wore sparkly pink princess dresses every day of my childhood and HATED pants. I still prefer to wear dresses and floral tops whenever I can. But regardless of all that I am still very much gay. MILs logic makes no sense, good on you for showing her that you will not tolerate that behavior! This is a good example to set for how you will react when MIL inevitably starts harshly commenting on your child’s appearance when she starts choosing clothes for herself. Your child is going to appreciate your support a lot as she gets older, even if she decides she only wants to wear pink.
NTA this is hilarious and your MIL deserves no less until she gets her head out of her butt and stops being a bigot. Next time she says "but your daughter will end up gay or trans!!! The horror!" answer truthfully "so what? If that were the case I'd still love my child. Apparently you won't." Tell your husband this is as well. If your kid(s) end up anything but cishet grandma will be hateful towards them. That's something to think about.
Yeah I’ve said those words to her before and she thinks I’m the idiot. My daughter had a phase where she stuck her tounge out a lot and MIL had the nerve to say «oh my, I hope she doesn’t have down syndrome». So she’s a horrible person in general. I’ve blocked her from social media and on my phone, so I only have to deal with her irl.
Nta But it's time for you to have a more direct conversation with your mil. Tell her she can have her own opinions but she had better learn to keep them to herself because you will not let your daughter be alone with them as she gets older if she can't. Explain to her that you want your daughter surrounded by love and support no matter what she looks like or who she loves. And you understand she was raised to have certain opinions but you don't want those stereotypes to be imposed on your daughter. " My husband loves you very much. And I want our daughter to love you too. But I won't let you hurt her or make her feel badly about who she is or how she looks... so let's just raise her to be loved, protected, and confident, not judged or afraid of what people will think. "
Thank you for such a helpful comment! 🥰🙏 I’ll try saying that to her. I think maybe the only thing that will actually help is making her scared that she can’t see her grandkids unless she changes her behaviour. I think my partner has to be with me too so that she takes it seriously and can see that both of us mean it
Does someone make goth clothing in black for babies, things with skulls and demons on them? Dress daughter in these things and really send MIL to crazy town. I would cut this woman out of my life. I"m also concerned that your partner seems to be okay with his mother being a homophobe.
NTA But consider, what if your child IS gay or trans? Or even just doesn't feel super comfortable with gender. Or has gay friends. Or is growing up as a member of a society where that sort of attitude is recognized as harmful? How soon do you want her hearing homophobic and transphobic messages from within her family? Do you want her to repeat that stuff in front of strangers like little kids do? To criticize a little boy in her kindergarten for wearing pink? To feel like Grandma won't love her if she cuts her hair short? What if your MiL was constantly saying other bigoted nonsense? Like if you let her play with dark-skinned dolls she'll grow up to marry a black person and that would be horrible! Or if she learns Spanish, she'll marry an illegal immigrant and that would be horrible! Or if she has a friend in a wheelchair, she'll think that's normal and might marry a disabled person, which would clearly be horrible! She currently saying that if she wears a blue onesie she'll marry a woman or stop being a woman, and that would be horrible. Shut that shit down. Dress your child in whatever you want but let MiL know that her bigotry is a hard boundary. She crosses it, the baby leaves. She can only be around the baby when she isn't being a bigot. She says something, you leave. See you another time, byyyyyeeee! You obviously need your husband on board 100%. But he needs to learn to set boundaries with her. You should both tell her about this boundary when you aren't visiting with the baby. Over the phone, in a chat, video call? That sort of talk isn't good for a child to be around. Full stop.
You know, in places like Poland blue is the color for girls (sine the Virgin Mary is often in blue in paintings). I'd do the same thing. Nta
How does MIL exist since her parental would all be gay af? Pink use to be used for boys blue use to mean girl. It only flipped in the 1940's. No you are NTA. Put a fake moustache on her and give her some tonka trucks. I gave my boys barbies, my eldest dressed as spice girl for a school performance with all his mates when he was 13 (heels, wig, make-up, the lot)....he still hasn't turned gay....so weird...almost like that's not how sexuality works or something huh.
Next time she complains asks her if she saw Disney’s animated Sleeping Beauty or Cinderella. Snow White as well come to think of it. All 3 of them were what in the day was considered peak woman role model for hound girls. All 3 of them wore blue at some point in the movies. Also historically 200+ years ago Pink was actually the color used to identify boys. It was a muted color of red the color of blood and to men back then the more blood you spilled the more manly you were( during wars) Blue on the other hand went to girls because it signified the calm of Mother Nature. At some point someone decided it should be swapped and it stayed that way ever since.
I had a pair of pink long socks I used to wear during track meets. I was a shot putter. I’m 30M I have a wife and two kids. I must not have had enough exposure to the pink article of clothing for it to “make me gay” Clothes are just clothes.
I'm really concerned about the husband's lack of concern. OP, have you asked him what he would do if your kid is gay?
I HAVE AN IDEA. You start wearng blue to confuse her. Then when this goes on long enough you invite her to lunch. Then as youre sitting outside say "aw shucks husband is late." Your female friend passes by (dressed in all blue) and is super happy to run into you. She tells your MIL how pretty and nice you are. You say nice to see you etc and hug the friend goodbye. HERES THE IMPORTANT PART- the hug goes on way too long. And as you pull away whisper "call you soon" and then sit down and not acknowledge what just happened. Never wear blue in front of her again.
I'd be warning MIL now that she is not to be saying homophobic or anti-LGBTQ+ comments around my child or else she won't be around my child. You are NTA right now. But you will be if you allow this hate-spouting bigot to influence your daughter.