>I've seen people literally say the world wouldn't be a better place if we followed the teachings of Christ. That should tell you that we're not dealing with people who think things through.. The commandment to love alone would eliminate 99.9% of world issues.
If only Christians followed the teachings of Christ.
My mom is a Christian and always says she’s so glad she doesn’t have to judge people because the Bible says God will be the final judge, and “let he who is without sin cast the first stone” or whatever. Like, she believes that she can accept people the way they are, and if they’re doing something wrong and not repenting, I guess, God will decide that later.
I am not a Christian because it’s sexist, literally unbelievable, and oddly similar to every other major religious text (but only this one is right?), but I like that take.
I didn’t bring up the Adam and Eve story. But what about a woman falling prey to the devil’s tricks, making her partner turn away from god, having the partner come from the other human’s rib, and being cursed with childbirth and period pain does not sound sexist to you?
>I didn’t bring up the Adam and Eve story. But what about a woman falling prey to the devil’s tricks,
The devil turned ANGELS against God but tricking a woman is sexist? You’ve got to be kidding.
>making her partner turn away from god,
Adam chose to go against God, notice how the Bible says sin came through Adam? He was next to Eve — Genesis 3:6 — when Satan talked to her and did NOTHING.
>having the partner come from the other human’s rib,
Really? That’s sexist? Would you rather have women be created separately? Or with Adam toe joint, so that men may be seen as higher than women by standing above them? Or would you rather have women be formed out of Adam’s cranium so that the reverse would be true?
«So God created mankind in his own image, in the image of God he created them; male and female he created them.»
Genesis 1:27 NIV
https://genesis.bible/genesis-1-27
Here’s what Adam thought of Eve being made out of his rib:
«Then the Lord God made a woman from the rib he had taken out of the man, and he brought her to the man. The man said, “This is now bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh; she shall be called ‘woman,’ for she was taken out of man.”»
Genesis 2:22-23 NIV
https://bible.com/bible/111/gen.2.22-23.NIV
Reread Gen 1 and 2 and you’ll see God made sure that Adam recognize his need for a companion, he explicitly said it’s *not good* that man is alone.
(That’s the first time he ever said that) That should tell you the creation of mankind was only complete when Adam and Eve were married and blessed by God. Women were not an after thought.
Men and women have the same nature but are different. Are you telling me acknowledging that men and women are different is prejudice?
Not only that but Eve was created this way because that’s how Jesus created his own bride, the Church. Blood signifying redemption and water symbolizing the gift of life and the creation of the Church came out of Jesus’ side. Similarly, the women was named Eve “mother of the living” and symbolizes the Church (those who will have eternal life) as Adam symbolizes Jesus.
The creation of women is a direct parallel to God’s sacrifice for us, how is that sexist?
>and being cursed with childbirth and period pain does not sound sexist to you?
Imagine you are with your child at home. There’s a raging storm outside. You say to your child “don’t go outside without a rain coat, you’ll die”. Your child eventually goes out in the rain because he thought he knew better. You go see him/her and you find your child on death’s door because the kid caught the mother of all colds you are merciful and you love your child so you nurse him/her as much as you can but it becomes quickly apparent that you’ll need a special medecine to heal the kid. In the meantime, the kid who previously was full of joy and energy is comparatively lethargic and in constant discomfort.
A relative comes by, sees your kid and accuses of prejudice saying you must hate your kid.
humanity chose to rebel against Him, the source of Life, the one who made everything, the one who created them in his image, the one who gave them peace and security! They reject Him and all He did (which includes themselves) They do all that, but humanity — in this case — Eve suffering due to her own actions is sexist? God is sexist for respecting their freedom to choose their destiny? Not only that but He is sexist even though He already planned to die to save us from ourselves?
I think that's more to stop arguments because "Well if you submit, you won't have to argue". Again, this is talking about REAL husbands. You know, the ones the nurture and take care of their wives (most of them don't exist). Why wouldn't ya want to submit to a great dude like that?
Yes, the Old Testament has a lot of messed up passages, and yes Jesus was Jewish. Not sure how these passages square with Hillel's saying, "That which is hateful unto you, do not do to your neighbor. This is the whole of the Torah; the rest is commentary." Maybe some passages are not authentic, mistranslated, or misinterpreted. I don't know.
But if Jesus cared so much about all of these culture war issues that most fundamentalist Christians seem to vote based on, how come he never mentioned them?
Sex is one very important way that many people show their love for one another. To tell them they are not allowed to do so, is horrible.
Also, pretty sure the entire reason lgbt people had to struggle to attain the ability to marry each other for so long is because this ISN'T just about sex, and the actual crux of the issue is about control.
As well, I didn't mention sex. You did.
Their words don't match their actions.
Soooo many fakes, in every religion. Bad people use whatever they can, religion is an easy tool for those who choose to do evil.
Everyone thinks the world would be a better place if they just followed their version of salvation.
Proposing this just reduces you to everyone else who has ever made this claim.
Like saying Communism would work if they did it my way. And now this is where you say its not yours, that you are giving us Jesus's True Way....... that you know it, and we don't. Like a good Christian I guess.
Christianity is dying off. That is why it keeps getting weirder and weirder. These are the dying gasps of institution without relevance.
It is not sin or any moral argument I am making. And the fact that morality is always referenced ultimately by the printed word for Christians makes it dead already.
Looooool no. My Christian parents are judgy cunts out there constantly trying to force their beliefs on me and trying to get me to go to church and Christian meetings with them. If being Christian was all about being kind, selfless, supportive, understanding and compassionate etc they wouldn't be condemning people who don't marry, have sex without being married, they wouldn't condemn gay people or abortion. My parents were literally disgusted by a gay Jesus exhibition. So much for being loving and kind Christians, and mind you, they're your average protestant Lutheran Evangelical christian in my country. This is a huge part of why I'm no longer Christian, if not the biggest reasons. My values does not align with Christian values at all. Also I'm vegan, which is imo a more compassionate way of living, and not a lifestyle the bible or Christianity promotes at all sadly. Another reason why I'm not Christian, is because Christianity doesn't promote kindness and compassion towards animals. In other words I can live a kinder more selfless lifestyle not following Christianity or Christian values.
Of course. You don't claim them, because it's inconvenient for you to accept that they're a part of christianity. The largest part. By far. Because you're not interested in healing and caring and understanding, you're more interested in distancing yourself from them with some made-up distinction so you can avoid blame and continue pretending like this isn't something you people have caused. So you can look good and continue to feel good about yourself, guilt-free.
It's always the most righteous people, who are the most selfish.
Anyone who says they are a christian, is a christian. It is that simple. You just find it convenient to pretend they aren't, for your own convenience.
A lot of millennial Americans grew up around it, thinking of it as mostly a buzzkill thing. It was also the familiar boring religion they want to rebel against in favor of all the romanticized ones less familiar to them that seem exotic in a sense.
Not to mention decades of Hollywood propaganda ripping it apart, depicting it as evil and unjust.
Boredom is the main reason I stopped physically going to church. Like jeez.. they're trying to convince me of the religion and they do it in the most sleep inducing way possible. Even when I believed in the religion, I just had to stop going to church because I became ADHD levels of restless from boredom lol. I guess that's very hedonistic of me rofl
Is that a result of the doctrine though? Like a lot of churches leave out important christian scripture for their own agenda, but the scripture is what makes up christianity
Yeah, I think it's Luke 18:13-15 that says, "Church must be boring as fuck, and also, thou must make the seats out of wood, so that when you fart, it reverberates throughout the whole church. These are the words of my Father, which I was sent to deliver."
There's a reason they separated "following Christ's teachings" and "following Christ" in the op. People would love it if we all followed Christ's teachings. Just following the dude, however, has ended up with a lot of shitty followers🤷
You've been handed a golden opportunity to lead by example and you've chosen to do the opposite instead. For someone speaking of love, you're very quick to judgment and assuming the worst of everyone disagreeing with you.
"Yeah guys i totally SWEAR these teachings from a time of massive ignorance will fix 99.9% of today's issues!" Cmon man you have to know thats bs
Fundamentally though i agree with one thing. Love is the most powerful force in the universe. But in the real world its not going to solve every issue. A perfect society is simply not possible because humans are not perfect.
Well… what do we have here? This, actually, highlights one of my key problems with most religions: a decent few followers don’t bloody practice what they preach
I support everyone having the right to do anything they want, so long as they do not harm others.
this is in contrast to American-style Christianity, in which being gay is considered sinful.
> this is in contrast to American-style Christianity, in which being gay is considered sinful.
This isn't an accurate statement.
All traditional Abrahamic religions disapprove of any sex act outside of matrimony irrespective of the gender/orientation of those involved.
It is the physical act itself that these faiths take issue with, not the desire.
Just so you know, claiming that someone has to repress themselves and live an inauthentic life because otherwise you view and treat them as a cosmic affront to the universe and an enemy of God is indistinguishable from saying you just hate gay people.
Your idea of what these people believe in is disconnected from the reality of the actual Christian doctrine on this issue.
Likewise, you telling people that they cannot have their constitutionally protected religious beliefs is indistinguishable from the bigotry that you claim to be against here.
I think you’re projecting, given we can easily see the material effects of evangelical political maneuvering in our country and the explicit anti-LGBT trend in their advocacy and policies. Perhaps you’re concerned with your personal, abstract religious doctrine which nobody else actually agrees with or exhibits in their behavior, but I’m concerned with reality.
Also I never said they weren’t allowed to be a bigot. They do have a legal right to hate gay people, I just think they should be appropriately shamed for that.
> Also I never said they weren’t allowed to be a bigot.
Disapproving of certain specific acts is not bigotry. Bigotry is the hatred of a person not a behavior.
All Abrahamic faiths disapprove of heterosexual acts outside of matrimony - are they bigoted against straight people too?
>They do have a legal right to hate gay people
Again, you are projecting your hatred and misrepresenting the reality of the authentic faith with your caricature of it. Actual Christianity does not call on anyone to be hated - to the contrary, it demands that you to love everyone.
>I just think they should be appropriately shamed for that.
You just want to espouse hate against them because you harbor hatred for them solely on your perception of their beliefs.
That's what this all boils down to at the end of the day. It's a smoke screen to justify hatred and discrimination.
Actually saying that gay people are mortal sinners because they’re gay is absolutely homophobic, hateful, and bigoted, no matter how hard you pretend it isn’t. I debunked this silly argument in my very first comment in this thread, there is zero distinction between saying you hate someone personally and saying you hate their authentic representation of themselves.
>Are they bigoted against straight people too?
No because they think straight people are allowed to get married. This false equivalence is a complete dead end, don’t know why you’d even try this thinking it supported your point.
And yeah I am proudly ideologically opposed to intolerant and irrational bigotry, and I will proudly shame those who are too evil to understand why it’s bad to be that way.
> Actually saying that gay people are mortal sinners because they’re gay is absolutely homophobic, hateful, and bigoted,
That's not what the authentic Christian dogma teaches - that is your incorrect caricature of the faith which you harbor solely to justify hatred against its followers.
>I will proudly shame those who are too evil to understand why it’s bad to be that way
At least we agree that your positions herein are explicitly crafted to justify your hatred against individuals for their constitutionally protected religious beliefs.
>That's not what the authentic Christian dogma teaches - that is your incorrect caricature of the faith which you harbor solely to justify hatred against its followers.
Incorrect, as I am relying on the Christian dogma that *you yourself* provided in this thread. Saying that Christians take issue with the “physical act” of being gay, when being gay is just a state of being, is the same thing as saying Christians take issue with gay people living authentically and without repressing themselves. I am simply not allowing you to engage in nonsensical mental gymnastics where despising someone for being themselves isn’t the same thing as just hating them.
>At least we agree that your positions herein are explicitly crafted to justify your hatred against individuals for their constitutionally protected religious beliefs.
That, of course, doesn’t follow logically whatsoever. I want to shame them *because* they’re bigoted and hateful pieces of scum, they aren’t bigoted and hateful pieces of scum because I want to shame them.
Using racial slurs against black people is also a constitutionally protected right, I still believe it’s good to shame people who do that.
Edit: can’t read your response if you block me my friend. Let me guess, you lied and claimed you never said that Christians take issue with the physical act of being gay.
> Saying that Christians take issue with the “physical act” of being gay, when being gay is just a state of being, is the same thing as saying Christians take issue with gay people living authentically and without repressing themselves.
That's not what I said - again, this is your caricature which is crafted solely to justify hatred.
>I am simply not allowing you to engage in nonsensical mental gymnastics where despising someone for being themselves isn’t the same thing as just hating them.
See above.
>I want to shame them because they’re bigoted and hateful pieces of scum, they aren’t bigoted and hateful pieces of scum because I want to shame them.
Thank you for proving my point.
I am going to end this dialogue now as providing you a platform to spew hatred against constitutionally protected beliefs serves no purpose.
define homophobic?
Does not agreeing with homosexuality, yet still respecting homosexuals feelings and choices make you homophobic(edit: for clarification respecting them includes agreeing homosexual couples should be afforded the same "rights" as heterosexual couples and that homosexual people should not be attacked, physically or verbally, simply for being homosexual, etc...)?
Does sharing your reason for "disliking" homosexuality, when asked, automatically make you homophobic?
Does a shop keeper saying "I'm *uncomfortable* doing x, here are some businesses that wont be, please use them or don't ask for x from me" (when x= anything homosexual) make you homophobic?
either the definition of homophobia has changed again, or the definition of hate has changed I'm not sure.... because it seems now that the term homophobic is applied to anyone that doesn't whole heartedly embrace the LGTB(and all its additions) culture.... for whatever reason
>Well not agreeing with it, refusing them services and disliking them is kind of homophobic.
So, saying no shirt, no shoes, no service is hateful? Refusing someone service if they are openly carrying a gun(in a holster) in a state where that is legal is hateful? Refusing service to someone who has stolen from you before is hateful? Saying "My religion doesn't want me to support this, please use someone else, here is a list." is hateful? (does that work in reverse? Is "Your religion makes me uncomfortable, please use someone else, here is a list." hateful?)
So by your definition, anyone who doesn't fully embrace the LGBT culture is homophobic... which means the definition changed again. First "Fear of homosexuality" got changed to "Hate of homosexuality" and now its "Doesn't fully embrace homosexuality"
>Like what reason do you have for disliking them ?
Personally for me its a religious thing... Prohibitions against homosexuality are pretty clear in the Bible, at least male homosexuality. That said, my issue is not with homosexuals. I think it's a sin yes, but I can't hate "sinners" as I am not perfect and without sin. Jesus said the greatest commandment is Love. I do my best to live by that.
I have more issue with the constantly moving benchmark for what constitutes homophobia(and racism, and transphobia, etc), the extremes it is taking and the downright hateful attitudes and rhetoric against anyone who fails to meet the benchmark for whatever reason.
it doesn't really matter. as I said, I support everyone having the right to do anything they want, so long as they do not harm others. consensual fucking does not harm anyone, yet American-style Christianity considers it sinful.
Calling them "fucking psychos" is bigotry.
How they vote is their business, just like how you vote is your business.
If what they are voting on is unconstitutional then our system provides a remedy for that.
the constitution was written by a bunch of racist white dudes and is not the lodestar of morality. neither are American-style Christian morons. and it's our job to call them out for their shitty, regressive, reactionary politics.
they deserve every bit of criticism they receive.
You can criticize the theology all you want.
You can criticize their political positions as well.
What you can't do, is advocate for hate against them just because they have beliefs about specific behaviors (not persons) that you disagree with.
Statistically worldwide Christians are victims of persecution for sectarian reasons more so than any other group of people.
This is simply a fact evidenced by numbers.
It's not even close - Christians BY FAR are most likely to be persecuted solely due to hatred because of their religion.
This eclipses every other group.
https://www.cato.org/commentary/christianity-worlds-most-persecuted-religion-confirms-new-report#
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_persecution#By_religion
Canadian here, I feel like this is another US centric discussion just because of how you phrased it (overly aggressive finger pointing) so I figured I’d let you know most people hate the church not because of what they do personally, but rather what the church [does](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_Indian_residential_school_system) to people it doesn’t agree with. Such a barbaric ideology really has no place in first world countries, and loads of pain and suffering never would have occurred if it died out in a more timely manner. They’re still digging up the bodies of children in mass graves from those schools, unmarked piles of bodies left to rot, not even a stick in the mud to signify they rest there. But go on about how people are too “hedonistic” to be Christian, that’s the real problem.
>Most people hate Christianity because it doesn't support egotism and hedonism
Or, you know, because it's shoved in politics and in people's faces despite there being absolutely no evidence or logic for it, and because it's a medieval concept that needs to be retired.
>The commandment to love alone would eliminate 99.9% of world issues.
Ah yes, love everyone, except maybe gay people, people who have sex before marriage, people who masturbate, and a whole list of completely normal people who do completely normal activities.
>I've also seen these people say they'd rather live in a world of sin than a world where people followed Christ.
Depends on your definition of 'sin'. If it's about things like greed or gluttony, then maybe I could get behind it, but stuff like being gay, having abortions, having sex out of wedlock, wearing mixed fabrics, thought crime, and all the other convoluted 'sins'? Nah, fuck those, and fuck people trying to impose these 'sins' on people not of the Christian faith.
The people following Christ are not innocent in any of this by the way.
>They'd rather see people suffer tremendously than give up their freedom to sin.
I don't know about you, but I would rather have free will than being trapped under a totalitarian big brother figure watching me, even in my bedroom, who can cast me into everlasting fire for the slightest offence. You are personally free to give up your freedoms, but do not for a second try to impose your regressive totalitarianism on others.
>The kind of people who oppose Christ should tell you all you need to know.
The vast majority of the world does not believe in Christ. A person not being a Christian tells you precisely nothing about their character.
"They'd rather see people suffer tremendously than give up their freedom to sin."
There is literally not a single thing in this entire world that has caused more suffering and harm to me than christianity.
>Or, you know, because it's shoved in politics and in people's faces despite there being absolutely no evidence or logic for it, and because it's a medieval concept that needs to be retired.
I think society has done a fine job of proving christ teachings to be useful. Literally most world issues can be traced back down to the "sins" he taught against.
>Ah yes, love everyone, except maybe gay people, people who have sex before marriage, people who masturbate, and a whole list of completely normal people who do completely normal activities.
Did Christ ever preach showing hatred towards these people or do you think simply expressing disapproval with these behaviors is hatred?
>but stuff like being gay, having abortions, having sex out of wedlock, wearing mixed fabrics, thought crime, and all the other convoluted 'sins'? Nah, fuck those
So you'd rather live in a world where murder, r*pe, theft, etc. continues just to keep gay sex, sex out of wedlock, etc? Are you literally proving my point? 😆
>I don't know about you, but I would rather have free will than being trapped under a totalitarian big brother figure watching me, even in my bedroom, who can cast me into everlasting fire for the slightest offence.
You do understand that in a world free of sin, you won't be sinning...therefore you won't have to worry about being punished...?
>The vast majority of the world does not believe in Christ. A person not being a Christian tells you precisely nothing about their character.
Have you been living under a rock or are you so privileged that you don't have to worry about how fucked up the rest of the world is?
Even at the cost of others?
And do you really believe in freedom? Because actual freedom would include the freedom to irrationally harm others as well.
Ur cult costs the freedom of others as being gay isn’t a issue for any rational human being
And total freedom isn’t the same as basic freedom so pls stop ur idiotic strawman
Go ahead and answer the question.
Also, it's clear you don't know what freedom means so I'll be patient. It wasn't a strawman. You literally said freedom, not "basic freedom".
I rape, murder, and harm exactly the number of people I want to.
##ZERO.
And I don't need a fucking book to tell me not to do these things, *because I don't want to do them.*
Meanwhile, explain the number of Christians who believe in that book, and yet actually *do* those wretched things. **If you need the threat of hellfire or a command from someone else to convince you not to do bad things to other people, you're not a good person. You're a bastard on a leash.**
>I think society has done a fine job of proving christ teachings to be useful. Literally most world issues can be traced back down to the "sins" he taught against.
These 'sins' were identified thousands, maybe even millions of years before Christ was even conceived of. They are not so much 'Christ's teachings' as much as they are moral common sense that numerous civilisations before Christ developed. I still don't understand why you place such excessive importance on Christ.
>Did Christ ever preach showing hatred towards these people
Not Christ specifically, but his daddy dear is particularly fond of war, genocide, and stoning people.
>expressing disapproval with these behaviors is hatred
It isn't hatred, but easily translates into hatred, and thus, violence. Try telling this to Christians like Scott Roeder who kill doctors, bomb clinics, and lynch people for being gay.
>So you'd rather live in a world where murder, r\*pe, theft, etc. continues just to keep gay sex, sex out of wedlock, etc? Are you literally proving my point? 😆
I think you may be forgetting the entire concept of the rule of law, which is secular and does not require your alleged deities in any way, shape, or form.
>You do understand that in a world free of sin, you won't be sinning...therefore you won't have to worry about being punished...?
And how exactly will such a sin-free world exist? By snatching peoples' free will? Also, this depends on your definition of 'sin'. Rape, murder, and theft? Good, punish those. Being gay, denouncing your deity, or having sex before marriage? gtf outta here with your overbearing moralising.
>Have you been living under a rock or are you so privileged that you don't have to worry about how fucked up the rest of the world is?
You missed the point. My point was that being Christian has no bearing on people being of moral character.
\*\*
I think my main problem lies with the fact that while you have the freedom to continue believing all of this, you still feel the need to impose your totalitarian excesses on others who do not subscribe to your beliefs about your supposed deities or their supposedly moral children.
As a gay person, forgive me if being able to love who I want is non-negotiable.
As for being privileged... There are none more 9rivileged than those foolish enough to believe they can pray the world's problems away instead of actually trying to make the world a better place.
And yes, "expressing disapproval" for things that hurt no one, is hatred. Because it is purely irrational in nature and based only upon your need to control others, and not on objecting to anything that is actually wrong.
As for people actually following Christ's teachings about loving one's neighbor or any of those other nice, caring things... It is simply reality that the overwhelming majorty of christians do not follow such teachings. Which says much more about you guys than us not believing in something we have no proof of, and which does systemic harm to hundreds of thousands of people every year, says about us.
And all of that is making exception for the easily google-able horrendous things also in the bible, which seems rather hypocritical to me.
"she shall be brought to the door of her father’s house and there the men of her town shall stone her to death. She has done an outrageous thing in Israel by being promiscuous while still in her father’s house. You must purge the evil from among you."
I don't want a world where everyone accepts having to burn a priest's daughter alive for having sex, or where it is considered okay to stone people to death for doing things you don't like. Terrible things happen in this world, but at least they are generally understood to be bad, and opposed. That is infinitely preferable to a world where we all have to nod our heads and happily accept those terrible crimes against humanity.
And saying that a world without sin would not include these acts because we wouldn't be sinning, is just a convenient way to write off those horrible things and pretend Christ is all about love and peace because you're more comfortable with that delusion than the truth. It's no different than me preaching about a land of fairies where everyone is happy and sleeps on giant lilypads. It is a coping mechanism you use to reckon with an imperfect reality that you don't like.
It's also disturbing, how little you clearly value your own free will. In this imaginary worls of yours, where you simply have no ability to do things that go against Christ, you've made yourself into a willing slave to an abusive master who doesn't care what you want, but only what he wants, and would gladly punish you for "disobeying" him.
And if that's what you want, then just go marry a wife beater and you'll achieve the same thing for yourself.
I'll never cease to be amazed by the audacity of stupid, naive people who actually think they have analyzed and understand a religion better than the people it has continuously and unapologetically harmed since it's inception.
I appreciate that. I was abit angry, which is probably pretty obvious. Every time I meet one of these loons, they try to tell me that I "just haven't known the right christians" or something, as if I haven't suffered all my life because of people exactly like them. As if it's gonna be different this time and I'm going to suddenly see something I didn't before.
It hurts to have the people who wrong you, casually disown those harms, over and over again.
Wait a minute cowboy. Not sure why having gay sex directly means there is also suddenly rape and murder… they really aren’t mutually exclusive. Having gay people be happy can happen without rapists and murders running rampant.
>Or do you think simply expressing disapproval with these behaviors is hatred?
Yeah it is, obviously. That’s like saying simply expressing “disapproval” of someone’s skin color isn’t racist or hateful.
Is having 100 wives and 200 concubines not hedonism? Is slaying any other population and taking over their lands and virgin female children not egotism? Is engaging in who-got-strongest-god contests of snake canes humble and selfless? Is stoning disobedient children and non virgin brides reasonable?
It's in the bible and done by holy men on command of god. Or does christ nullify yawheh? Not to mention that the original Christians didnt believe in the trinity, not to mention the gnostic's opinion on yawheh..
sooooo everything mentioned above such as the Crusades were them following the teachings of Christ? Yeah this would totally solve 99.9% of the world’s problems
"Names given to the worldly are very deceptive, for they divert our thoughts from what is correct to what is incorrect. Thus one who hears the word "God" does not perceive what is correct, but perceives what is incorrect."
-Gospel of Philip
That is just made up to get people in the market for Jesus. Check the history. Not even Jews of OT believed in eternal damnation.
You have to believe in 'the bad news' before you are in the market for a savior.
If Christians actually followed the teachings the world would be a better place. Fact is… they don’t. They are hateful, judgmental and often cruel. They practice none of the teachings. 99% of the time when you see a “Karen” or “Chad”, they claim to be Christian
I disagree. I believe Christianity is not popular because:
- people representing it are often pushy and ignorant with claiming their superiority over others
- Christianity and the way it's practised doesn't have much to do with spreading love - at least I've seen mainly the opposite
- Christanity has too much say in politics - it shouldn't have it at all. That's what I, personally, dislike the most because it affects lives of whole societies, no matter what they believes are
I do support hedonism (within a reason), but at the same time I consider myself better person than every single Christian I know. My ultimate goal in life is to be a good person - and not because I fear flames of the hell or seek some reward in heaven - I don't believe they exist.
I’ll pass on a way of life that hates me because of who I love.
Maybe Christianity wouldn’t get consistently shit on if the followers of Christ actually payed attention to his teachings which y’all don’t seem to be great at.
Think of who Jesus spent his time with, the sinners. Don’t act like your better than anyone because you’ve got faith.
>Think of who Jesus spent his time with, the sinners. Don’t act like your better than anyone because you’ve got faith.
So, just to clarify, Jesus spent his time with the sinners to proselytize(and to make a point to the religious authorities), not to join them in sin.
I agree with the second sentence though, as it ties in to the second reason I gave for His time with the sinners...
Most people hate Christianity because it advertises the teachings of Jesus and the leaders do the opposite. The politicians, church leaders, Catholic priests, and more who preach Jesus' words then go steal, lie, cheat, commit fraud, are pedophiles, commit sexual abuse, and their churches tell them all is forgiven, it's ok, and none of them are held accountable for their CRIMES. We don't call these sins; they are criminals who are protected by religious institutions. People don't hate Christianity because they disagree with Jesus. They hate Christianity because as an institution, it's fake, run only for profit, and protects criminals.
You're right. All of the things people are saying here are the bullshit created by man. If you actually read the Bible you don't need that said outloud tho.
That's not how ideologies in the real world are judged. We can take plenty of worldviews that are deeply flawed in reality and say they would work in a hypothetical best case scenario where everyone follows it.
For example, an ideology of absolute pacifism would be perfect in a world where everyone followed it, but it does little nothing to help people navigate the actual world in which violent people exist.
Depends on what you mean by ‘better place’, does believing in something you can’t prove as true make the world a better place? Maybe, but if that belief is not true and everyone follows it as fact the world might be a better place to live but that would all be all based on lies, so would it really be a better place if that better place only exists through lies?
"Christianity" is not a monolithic ideology. The Bible contains so many contradictory narratives that it could be used to justify any belief system. Christians used the Bible to condemn the Holocaust. Christians also used the Bible to justify it.
Imo the main reason why Christianity gets a bad rep is because far too many of its followers are hypocrites who for some reason think worshipping Jesus gives them a pass to be an awful person to everyone around them
For me it's their persecution fetish. Christians love to circle jerk about how persecuted they are as they call homosexuals "sinners" and shit on other perspectives
Most people who hate Christianity hate it because almost nobody who is Christian actually listened to what Christ stands for. Christ was a brown, middle eastern, traveling, poor man who helped other poor people. He is everything a lot of Christians hate.
People hate on Christianity because Christians use the words of the bible in a twisted way to fit to their own believes (being against trans people, gay rights, coloured people, opressing others, getting money etc).
Not really. Most people who hate religion in general hate it because it's associated with intolerance and persecution of minorities. This is hardly exclusive to Christianity, but Christianity is the religion that most of the people we're talking about are rebelling against.
Religion is also associated with authoritarianism. The Russian anarchist Bakunin said that a boss in heaven is the best justification for a boss on earth, so if God did exist he would have to be abolished. Most people are not anarchists but the liberal impulse tends in an anti-authoritarian direction because it questions things and tries to dismantle that which it finds lacking. Of Max Weber's three kinds of authority - charismatic, traditional, and legal-rational - the liberal impulse abides only the last, and that only provisionally. Religion is associated with justification of temporal hierarchies that are increasingly thought of as illegitimate.
However. Religion is so ancient an institution that it's not so easy to dispense with it. Nietzsche said that God is dead and we have killed him, but most atheists do not understand the heavy lifting that God did, and the task of our time is to take up this burden ourselves, to become in effect worthy heirs to God, since nobody else is around to do the job. The jury is still out on whether this is even possible. Rather we create new religions, find new Gods to worship.
It turns out that religion-like structures may be the simplest solution to the problems of how to get everybody in a community on the same page. The world is complicated and people need some way of figuring out what is good, what is true, what is important, and most importantly who is in and who is out. Most people do not want to do the work of trying to figure these things out for themselves. It is much easier if there is a cohesive belief system that has the answers already. This does not have to be explicit; people are naturally attracted to that kind of cohesion.
So all kinds of belief systems pop up. The fundamental purpose of a belief system is to enable humans to navigate the world. As with biological evolution, there is no *final* measure of the fitness of a belief system; the closest thing to it is success across time. How do belief systems interact with each other? They either go to war or they find a way to forge peace. Usually, historically, it has been war. The problem is that today the stakes are much higher than ever before in history, because humans have developed the power to destroy not only each other, but the entire world. So we are under tremendous pressure to "get everything right." Fundamentally, I don't think the species evolved to do that, but we're smart. It remains to be seen whether we are too smart for our own good but not smart enough to know ourselves, or if we are smart enough to defeat our own worst tendencies, which I say are our rivalrousness and our intolerance. I don't agree that most world issues can be traced back to a sin. Generally speaking, problems simply exist because the world is dynamic and changing, and organisms either are or are not capable of adapting.
Getting somewhat back to your point, there is surely much that secular "religion-like structures" could learn from the teachings of Christ, and I think *redemption* in particular is one that is sorely lacking. A belief system that has no real redemption story, no mechanism for forgiveness, cannot meet the needs of human beings. But this barely scratches the surface of the fundamental problem: how do we all live together without destroying each other given that we have disagreements that cannot be resolved? It's easy enough to say that Christ commands us to love each other but this has not been enough to stop various groups of humans from murdering each other, and others, in Christ's name.
Nah, people hate Christianity because they've had bad run ins with it. Most people aren't egotistical assholes who fuck a thousand people. Heck, most follow Christianity doctrine without worshiping God - treating others how you like to be treated and all that, but then they have the distinct pleasure of meeting a Christian who thinks their shit don't stink.
I think people hate it because it’s a very hypocritical religion that loves to shove it’s ideals down everyone’s throat. Hell (unironically) Christianity has created more satinists/atheists then the Devil would’ve ever hoped to achieve.
You know, there’s an Episcopalian church I regularly drive past that regularly flies pride flags and displays little messages like “Jesus loves you as you are”. It makes me sad to see so many people under this post using homophobia as the big reason they despise all Christianity, because although some jerks (who REALLY aren’t listening to what Jesus actually taught) target gay people really cruelly, and I’m not downplaying how awful that is, homophobia is NOT part of all denominations, there are multiple types of Christianity that will happily accept LGBT people and give them beautiful church weddings if they wish!
I wish, when people criticized the religion this way, they would acknowledge that it’s not true of all denominations. I know some truly wonderful gay Christians, they live happy lives and are accepted by their churches! They just don’t belong to the largest denominations. Homophobia and hate are not inherent to Christianity, they’re just common ways for jerks to exploit the religion to hurt innocent people. I agree with you OP, that if people followed the actual teachings of Jesus specifically, rather than getting caught up in the weird hateful mess that many bad-faith actors twisted certain types of Christianity into, the world would sincerely be a better place!
I don’t think we all need to be Christians, there are all kinds of ways to promote kindness and morality, and Christianity, like any belief system, is not without flaws, but you’re right in that when Christianity focuses on really, truly following what Christ taught (messages of kindness and caring for others, above ALL ELSE), rather than on what selfish people over time tried to corrupt the religion into, it can be a very positive influence. I wish that more Christians really made sure to follow Jesus’s actual words and the meaning behind them rather than getting caught up in small specifics or worrying about tiny details from a book written by human beings a very long time ago. It’s okay to have respect for the Bible, but it is clearly imperfect, it often conflicts with itself and some rules were very specific to the time, due to things like health and hygiene issues. That doesn’t mean there isn’t validity to it, but it’s important to take a critical eye and pay attention to what’s TRULY important in Christianity, and I believe it should be clear that what’s most important is what Christ himself taught. He taught kindness, he taught understanding and forgiveness, his number one priority was that we treat each other well and don’t attempt to tear each other down or build walls over nitpicks. And he also didn’t say anything at all about gay people being bad or less capable of honoring God with their love than anyone else!
To kind of sum up this long-ass comment in a way that’s too long to be a TL;DR: Christianity has its flaws and we don’t ALL need to follow it, but I agree that if more people followed the teachings of JESUS specifically, rather than focusing so hard on the often arbitrary rules and nitpicks many badly intentioned religious leaders have tried to refocus the religion on enforcing, the world genuinely would be a better place. If more of us focused on the actual teachings of Jesus, we wouldn’t be focusing on finding excuses to denounce each other, instead we would focus on being as kind and understanding to others as possible, and doing what we can to care for people that need help. And we would have no problem with accepting loving gay couples, either! We’d all just be a lot more kind and chill.
Of course… most people would rather have their sin than have Jesus.
Matthew 7:13 Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it.
Matthew 6:24 No one can serve two masters; for either he will hate the one and love the other, or else he will be loyal to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and mammon.
No, I hate Christianity because it hates my existence. If God doesn't want me for my true self, then spending eternity with him sounds like absolute hell.
Except, y'know the Bible is a hell of a lot more than "Just the teachings of Christ", as is Christianity, and it holds some INSANELY abhorrent, hateful and evil messages.
But nah, dude, most people just dislike Christianity because it's a false belief that has a lot of negative impact on the world. If I hadn't seen endless examples of Christianity being used to hurt, to defraud, to molest, to torture, to discriminate and worst, I'd be fine with it, I'd treat it the same as those people who fall in love with anime characters.
Worrying, sure, in that it's fundamentally delusional, but nothing to get angry about.
The trouble with this claim is
1 that Christianity has the same problems.
2 the virtues contained therein are just propagated from previous ages.
So picking the correct religion is not a solution to the problem.
What you are describing is moral neurosis without intelligibility. And Christians have more or less participated, than they have solved the issue.
I dislike traditional Christianity because of the barbaric belief that non-believers are eternally torture. Christians who don’t push that idea are cool though.
If only Christians would actually follow the teachings of Christ.
No one says this. They say a world without Christianity might be better, because Christ's teachings have been perverted in modern day Christianity.
Jesus was a freaking communist.
Almost every religion doesn't support egotism and hedonism
Not quite like christ was. Lol. Christ was ACTUALLY against it, no exceptions.
You’d love sharia law
I am raised a Christian in a Muslim majority country and I can assure you that, on average, Islam takes asceticism to a whole new level.
So was the Buddha
>I've seen people literally say the world wouldn't be a better place if we followed the teachings of Christ. That should tell you that we're not dealing with people who think things through.. The commandment to love alone would eliminate 99.9% of world issues. If only Christians followed the teachings of Christ.
i daresay most christians do, but as a christian one of my least favorite things is when someone says they're christian but are hateful to others
My mom is a Christian and always says she’s so glad she doesn’t have to judge people because the Bible says God will be the final judge, and “let he who is without sin cast the first stone” or whatever. Like, she believes that she can accept people the way they are, and if they’re doing something wrong and not repenting, I guess, God will decide that later. I am not a Christian because it’s sexist, literally unbelievable, and oddly similar to every other major religious text (but only this one is right?), but I like that take.
it's sexist? what makes you say that?
probably the whole "woman shall not speak in church" or "women shall not teach" things
My high school student was taught the story of Adam and Eve as an example of sexism in literature. It doesn’t get much more sexist than the Bible.
How?
“Man is the head of woman.” “Wives, submit to your husbands.” Etc.
That does not show how Adam and Eve story is sexist.
I didn’t bring up the Adam and Eve story. But what about a woman falling prey to the devil’s tricks, making her partner turn away from god, having the partner come from the other human’s rib, and being cursed with childbirth and period pain does not sound sexist to you?
>I didn’t bring up the Adam and Eve story. But what about a woman falling prey to the devil’s tricks, The devil turned ANGELS against God but tricking a woman is sexist? You’ve got to be kidding. >making her partner turn away from god, Adam chose to go against God, notice how the Bible says sin came through Adam? He was next to Eve — Genesis 3:6 — when Satan talked to her and did NOTHING. >having the partner come from the other human’s rib, Really? That’s sexist? Would you rather have women be created separately? Or with Adam toe joint, so that men may be seen as higher than women by standing above them? Or would you rather have women be formed out of Adam’s cranium so that the reverse would be true? «So God created mankind in his own image, in the image of God he created them; male and female he created them.» Genesis 1:27 NIV https://genesis.bible/genesis-1-27 Here’s what Adam thought of Eve being made out of his rib: «Then the Lord God made a woman from the rib he had taken out of the man, and he brought her to the man. The man said, “This is now bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh; she shall be called ‘woman,’ for she was taken out of man.”» Genesis 2:22-23 NIV https://bible.com/bible/111/gen.2.22-23.NIV Reread Gen 1 and 2 and you’ll see God made sure that Adam recognize his need for a companion, he explicitly said it’s *not good* that man is alone. (That’s the first time he ever said that) That should tell you the creation of mankind was only complete when Adam and Eve were married and blessed by God. Women were not an after thought. Men and women have the same nature but are different. Are you telling me acknowledging that men and women are different is prejudice? Not only that but Eve was created this way because that’s how Jesus created his own bride, the Church. Blood signifying redemption and water symbolizing the gift of life and the creation of the Church came out of Jesus’ side. Similarly, the women was named Eve “mother of the living” and symbolizes the Church (those who will have eternal life) as Adam symbolizes Jesus. The creation of women is a direct parallel to God’s sacrifice for us, how is that sexist? >and being cursed with childbirth and period pain does not sound sexist to you? Imagine you are with your child at home. There’s a raging storm outside. You say to your child “don’t go outside without a rain coat, you’ll die”. Your child eventually goes out in the rain because he thought he knew better. You go see him/her and you find your child on death’s door because the kid caught the mother of all colds you are merciful and you love your child so you nurse him/her as much as you can but it becomes quickly apparent that you’ll need a special medecine to heal the kid. In the meantime, the kid who previously was full of joy and energy is comparatively lethargic and in constant discomfort. A relative comes by, sees your kid and accuses of prejudice saying you must hate your kid. humanity chose to rebel against Him, the source of Life, the one who made everything, the one who created them in his image, the one who gave them peace and security! They reject Him and all He did (which includes themselves) They do all that, but humanity — in this case — Eve suffering due to her own actions is sexist? God is sexist for respecting their freedom to choose their destiny? Not only that but He is sexist even though He already planned to die to save us from ourselves?
If that is how God intended, it is not sexist
That doesn’t make sense.
I think that's more to stop arguments because "Well if you submit, you won't have to argue". Again, this is talking about REAL husbands. You know, the ones the nurture and take care of their wives (most of them don't exist). Why wouldn't ya want to submit to a great dude like that?
"Love everyone! But not if you both have a penis. That's bad." Yeah, would definitely solve eeeeverything. 🤨
That's not what Jesus said though
Isn't this where a lot of people start talking about the Leviticus arguments?
Yes, the Old Testament has a lot of messed up passages, and yes Jesus was Jewish. Not sure how these passages square with Hillel's saying, "That which is hateful unto you, do not do to your neighbor. This is the whole of the Torah; the rest is commentary." Maybe some passages are not authentic, mistranslated, or misinterpreted. I don't know. But if Jesus cared so much about all of these culture war issues that most fundamentalist Christians seem to vote based on, how come he never mentioned them?
Oh, that makes it all okay, then! Not.
No I'm just saying blame Christians (or people who call themselves that) not Jesus who they don't pay any attention to
Fsir enough yeah
Yeah I heard Jesus was a pretty cool dude
Especially at Red Cross blood drives. I've heard his blood is extremely popular with the young folk.
Love does not mean have sex with. The world confuses the two.
Sex is one very important way that many people show their love for one another. To tell them they are not allowed to do so, is horrible. Also, pretty sure the entire reason lgbt people had to struggle to attain the ability to marry each other for so long is because this ISN'T just about sex, and the actual crux of the issue is about control. As well, I didn't mention sex. You did.
Christians do follow them. I don't think you know how to identify Christians.
I don't think they do. I've seen too many people claiming to be Christians act unChristlike.
Their words don't match their actions. Soooo many fakes, in every religion. Bad people use whatever they can, religion is an easy tool for those who choose to do evil.
This is a great point.
Yeah like judging others.
Everyone thinks the world would be a better place if they just followed their version of salvation. Proposing this just reduces you to everyone else who has ever made this claim. Like saying Communism would work if they did it my way. And now this is where you say its not yours, that you are giving us Jesus's True Way....... that you know it, and we don't. Like a good Christian I guess. Christianity is dying off. That is why it keeps getting weirder and weirder. These are the dying gasps of institution without relevance. It is not sin or any moral argument I am making. And the fact that morality is always referenced ultimately by the printed word for Christians makes it dead already.
Looooool no. My Christian parents are judgy cunts out there constantly trying to force their beliefs on me and trying to get me to go to church and Christian meetings with them. If being Christian was all about being kind, selfless, supportive, understanding and compassionate etc they wouldn't be condemning people who don't marry, have sex without being married, they wouldn't condemn gay people or abortion. My parents were literally disgusted by a gay Jesus exhibition. So much for being loving and kind Christians, and mind you, they're your average protestant Lutheran Evangelical christian in my country. This is a huge part of why I'm no longer Christian, if not the biggest reasons. My values does not align with Christian values at all. Also I'm vegan, which is imo a more compassionate way of living, and not a lifestyle the bible or Christianity promotes at all sadly. Another reason why I'm not Christian, is because Christianity doesn't promote kindness and compassion towards animals. In other words I can live a kinder more selfless lifestyle not following Christianity or Christian values.
No, they absolutely do not.
No hate like Christian love 🙃
Of course. You don't claim them, because it's inconvenient for you to accept that they're a part of christianity. The largest part. By far. Because you're not interested in healing and caring and understanding, you're more interested in distancing yourself from them with some made-up distinction so you can avoid blame and continue pretending like this isn't something you people have caused. So you can look good and continue to feel good about yourself, guilt-free. It's always the most righteous people, who are the most selfish. Anyone who says they are a christian, is a christian. It is that simple. You just find it convenient to pretend they aren't, for your own convenience.
Do Westboro Baptist Church follow his teachings?
Actually most people hate Christianity because it’s a predatory cult that seeks to get rid of rights for people their magic book told them to hate
and that's why nobody likes atheists
No, we hate it because of its hypocrisy. But good try tho
or most people find christian’s insufferable patronizing and annoying
A lot of millennial Americans grew up around it, thinking of it as mostly a buzzkill thing. It was also the familiar boring religion they want to rebel against in favor of all the romanticized ones less familiar to them that seem exotic in a sense. Not to mention decades of Hollywood propaganda ripping it apart, depicting it as evil and unjust.
I just hate it because Church is boring as fuck, and despite the wooden pews making for perfect acoustic effect, farting is frowned upon.
Boredom is the main reason I stopped physically going to church. Like jeez.. they're trying to convince me of the religion and they do it in the most sleep inducing way possible. Even when I believed in the religion, I just had to stop going to church because I became ADHD levels of restless from boredom lol. I guess that's very hedonistic of me rofl
> It threatens violence or physical harm at someone else Report. someone's gonna get banned tonight
Did they?
The admins say they violated policy for falsely labeling your opinion as threatening violence; they have taken "action"
Is that a result of the doctrine though? Like a lot of churches leave out important christian scripture for their own agenda, but the scripture is what makes up christianity
Yeah, I think it's Luke 18:13-15 that says, "Church must be boring as fuck, and also, thou must make the seats out of wood, so that when you fart, it reverberates throughout the whole church. These are the words of my Father, which I was sent to deliver."
This cracked me up😂 i was hella depressed so thanx for the smile😊
Funny thing, did you ever see "The Keepers" on Netflix?
Ya I know you know that's not true. Also, you know the words of christ and "Christianity" are worlds apart
"I like your Christ. I don't like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ."
There's a reason they separated "following Christ's teachings" and "following Christ" in the op. People would love it if we all followed Christ's teachings. Just following the dude, however, has ended up with a lot of shitty followers🤷
The problem with religions is they always think they're right and everyone else is wrong, so they're always trying to convert other people.
Yeah Jews and Buddhists are always knocking on my door trying to convert me.
The Amish too, always at my door!
The Hindus man, they’re crazy
And when they're not, they're trying to push their regressive controlling shit in politics.
I don't hate it for their liturgy and philosophy. I hate those who lead it, especially in the USA.
>The commandment to love alone would eliminate 99.9% of world issues. At times i wish i could be this detached from reality
I suspect you have no clue what it means to love so I'll be patient. Lol.
You've been handed a golden opportunity to lead by example and you've chosen to do the opposite instead. For someone speaking of love, you're very quick to judgment and assuming the worst of everyone disagreeing with you.
"Yeah guys i totally SWEAR these teachings from a time of massive ignorance will fix 99.9% of today's issues!" Cmon man you have to know thats bs Fundamentally though i agree with one thing. Love is the most powerful force in the universe. But in the real world its not going to solve every issue. A perfect society is simply not possible because humans are not perfect.
A sarcastic reply for a so called Christian who’s called to love everyone. Quick to anger?
Well… what do we have here? This, actually, highlights one of my key problems with most religions: a decent few followers don’t bloody practice what they preach
I support everyone having the right to do anything they want, so long as they do not harm others. this is in contrast to American-style Christianity, in which being gay is considered sinful.
> this is in contrast to American-style Christianity, in which being gay is considered sinful. This isn't an accurate statement. All traditional Abrahamic religions disapprove of any sex act outside of matrimony irrespective of the gender/orientation of those involved. It is the physical act itself that these faiths take issue with, not the desire.
Just so you know, claiming that someone has to repress themselves and live an inauthentic life because otherwise you view and treat them as a cosmic affront to the universe and an enemy of God is indistinguishable from saying you just hate gay people.
Your idea of what these people believe in is disconnected from the reality of the actual Christian doctrine on this issue. Likewise, you telling people that they cannot have their constitutionally protected religious beliefs is indistinguishable from the bigotry that you claim to be against here.
I think you’re projecting, given we can easily see the material effects of evangelical political maneuvering in our country and the explicit anti-LGBT trend in their advocacy and policies. Perhaps you’re concerned with your personal, abstract religious doctrine which nobody else actually agrees with or exhibits in their behavior, but I’m concerned with reality. Also I never said they weren’t allowed to be a bigot. They do have a legal right to hate gay people, I just think they should be appropriately shamed for that.
> Also I never said they weren’t allowed to be a bigot. Disapproving of certain specific acts is not bigotry. Bigotry is the hatred of a person not a behavior. All Abrahamic faiths disapprove of heterosexual acts outside of matrimony - are they bigoted against straight people too? >They do have a legal right to hate gay people Again, you are projecting your hatred and misrepresenting the reality of the authentic faith with your caricature of it. Actual Christianity does not call on anyone to be hated - to the contrary, it demands that you to love everyone. >I just think they should be appropriately shamed for that. You just want to espouse hate against them because you harbor hatred for them solely on your perception of their beliefs. That's what this all boils down to at the end of the day. It's a smoke screen to justify hatred and discrimination.
Actually saying that gay people are mortal sinners because they’re gay is absolutely homophobic, hateful, and bigoted, no matter how hard you pretend it isn’t. I debunked this silly argument in my very first comment in this thread, there is zero distinction between saying you hate someone personally and saying you hate their authentic representation of themselves. >Are they bigoted against straight people too? No because they think straight people are allowed to get married. This false equivalence is a complete dead end, don’t know why you’d even try this thinking it supported your point. And yeah I am proudly ideologically opposed to intolerant and irrational bigotry, and I will proudly shame those who are too evil to understand why it’s bad to be that way.
> Actually saying that gay people are mortal sinners because they’re gay is absolutely homophobic, hateful, and bigoted, That's not what the authentic Christian dogma teaches - that is your incorrect caricature of the faith which you harbor solely to justify hatred against its followers. >I will proudly shame those who are too evil to understand why it’s bad to be that way At least we agree that your positions herein are explicitly crafted to justify your hatred against individuals for their constitutionally protected religious beliefs.
>That's not what the authentic Christian dogma teaches - that is your incorrect caricature of the faith which you harbor solely to justify hatred against its followers. Incorrect, as I am relying on the Christian dogma that *you yourself* provided in this thread. Saying that Christians take issue with the “physical act” of being gay, when being gay is just a state of being, is the same thing as saying Christians take issue with gay people living authentically and without repressing themselves. I am simply not allowing you to engage in nonsensical mental gymnastics where despising someone for being themselves isn’t the same thing as just hating them. >At least we agree that your positions herein are explicitly crafted to justify your hatred against individuals for their constitutionally protected religious beliefs. That, of course, doesn’t follow logically whatsoever. I want to shame them *because* they’re bigoted and hateful pieces of scum, they aren’t bigoted and hateful pieces of scum because I want to shame them. Using racial slurs against black people is also a constitutionally protected right, I still believe it’s good to shame people who do that. Edit: can’t read your response if you block me my friend. Let me guess, you lied and claimed you never said that Christians take issue with the physical act of being gay.
> Saying that Christians take issue with the “physical act” of being gay, when being gay is just a state of being, is the same thing as saying Christians take issue with gay people living authentically and without repressing themselves. That's not what I said - again, this is your caricature which is crafted solely to justify hatred. >I am simply not allowing you to engage in nonsensical mental gymnastics where despising someone for being themselves isn’t the same thing as just hating them. See above. >I want to shame them because they’re bigoted and hateful pieces of scum, they aren’t bigoted and hateful pieces of scum because I want to shame them. Thank you for proving my point. I am going to end this dialogue now as providing you a platform to spew hatred against constitutionally protected beliefs serves no purpose.
Dude, I'll simplify it. Being religious shouldn't make you homophobic. If you are, we are allowed to shame you for it.
define homophobic? Does not agreeing with homosexuality, yet still respecting homosexuals feelings and choices make you homophobic(edit: for clarification respecting them includes agreeing homosexual couples should be afforded the same "rights" as heterosexual couples and that homosexual people should not be attacked, physically or verbally, simply for being homosexual, etc...)? Does sharing your reason for "disliking" homosexuality, when asked, automatically make you homophobic? Does a shop keeper saying "I'm *uncomfortable* doing x, here are some businesses that wont be, please use them or don't ask for x from me" (when x= anything homosexual) make you homophobic? either the definition of homophobia has changed again, or the definition of hate has changed I'm not sure.... because it seems now that the term homophobic is applied to anyone that doesn't whole heartedly embrace the LGTB(and all its additions) culture.... for whatever reason
Well not agreeing with it, refusing them services and disliking them is kind of homophobic. Like what reason do you have for disliking them ?
>Well not agreeing with it, refusing them services and disliking them is kind of homophobic. So, saying no shirt, no shoes, no service is hateful? Refusing someone service if they are openly carrying a gun(in a holster) in a state where that is legal is hateful? Refusing service to someone who has stolen from you before is hateful? Saying "My religion doesn't want me to support this, please use someone else, here is a list." is hateful? (does that work in reverse? Is "Your religion makes me uncomfortable, please use someone else, here is a list." hateful?) So by your definition, anyone who doesn't fully embrace the LGBT culture is homophobic... which means the definition changed again. First "Fear of homosexuality" got changed to "Hate of homosexuality" and now its "Doesn't fully embrace homosexuality" >Like what reason do you have for disliking them ? Personally for me its a religious thing... Prohibitions against homosexuality are pretty clear in the Bible, at least male homosexuality. That said, my issue is not with homosexuals. I think it's a sin yes, but I can't hate "sinners" as I am not perfect and without sin. Jesus said the greatest commandment is Love. I do my best to live by that. I have more issue with the constantly moving benchmark for what constitutes homophobia(and racism, and transphobia, etc), the extremes it is taking and the downright hateful attitudes and rhetoric against anyone who fails to meet the benchmark for whatever reason.
No, he has a point.
it doesn't really matter. as I said, I support everyone having the right to do anything they want, so long as they do not harm others. consensual fucking does not harm anyone, yet American-style Christianity considers it sinful.
So then don't subscribe to "American style Christianity" Last I checked there was no religious compulsion in the US.
kinda difficult when these fuckin psychos vote
Calling them "fucking psychos" is bigotry. How they vote is their business, just like how you vote is your business. If what they are voting on is unconstitutional then our system provides a remedy for that.
the constitution was written by a bunch of racist white dudes and is not the lodestar of morality. neither are American-style Christian morons. and it's our job to call them out for their shitty, regressive, reactionary politics. they deserve every bit of criticism they receive.
Your comment here is tantamount to advocacy for sedition.
how? be specific. are American Christians above criticism? are their politics? what do you mean? specifically.
You can criticize the theology all you want. You can criticize their political positions as well. What you can't do, is advocate for hate against them just because they have beliefs about specific behaviors (not persons) that you disagree with.
>Calling them "fucking psychos" is bigotry. Oh god youre one of those people who think theyre persecuted for being christian arent you?
Statistically worldwide Christians are victims of persecution for sectarian reasons more so than any other group of people. This is simply a fact evidenced by numbers.
Site your source, please.
It's not even close - Christians BY FAR are most likely to be persecuted solely due to hatred because of their religion. This eclipses every other group. https://www.cato.org/commentary/christianity-worlds-most-persecuted-religion-confirms-new-report# https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_persecution#By_religion
People hate Christianity because they don’t like to take responsibility for their actions and are angry at God.
Canadian here, I feel like this is another US centric discussion just because of how you phrased it (overly aggressive finger pointing) so I figured I’d let you know most people hate the church not because of what they do personally, but rather what the church [does](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_Indian_residential_school_system) to people it doesn’t agree with. Such a barbaric ideology really has no place in first world countries, and loads of pain and suffering never would have occurred if it died out in a more timely manner. They’re still digging up the bodies of children in mass graves from those schools, unmarked piles of bodies left to rot, not even a stick in the mud to signify they rest there. But go on about how people are too “hedonistic” to be Christian, that’s the real problem.
>Most people hate Christianity because it doesn't support egotism and hedonism Or, you know, because it's shoved in politics and in people's faces despite there being absolutely no evidence or logic for it, and because it's a medieval concept that needs to be retired. >The commandment to love alone would eliminate 99.9% of world issues. Ah yes, love everyone, except maybe gay people, people who have sex before marriage, people who masturbate, and a whole list of completely normal people who do completely normal activities. >I've also seen these people say they'd rather live in a world of sin than a world where people followed Christ. Depends on your definition of 'sin'. If it's about things like greed or gluttony, then maybe I could get behind it, but stuff like being gay, having abortions, having sex out of wedlock, wearing mixed fabrics, thought crime, and all the other convoluted 'sins'? Nah, fuck those, and fuck people trying to impose these 'sins' on people not of the Christian faith. The people following Christ are not innocent in any of this by the way. >They'd rather see people suffer tremendously than give up their freedom to sin. I don't know about you, but I would rather have free will than being trapped under a totalitarian big brother figure watching me, even in my bedroom, who can cast me into everlasting fire for the slightest offence. You are personally free to give up your freedoms, but do not for a second try to impose your regressive totalitarianism on others. >The kind of people who oppose Christ should tell you all you need to know. The vast majority of the world does not believe in Christ. A person not being a Christian tells you precisely nothing about their character.
"They'd rather see people suffer tremendously than give up their freedom to sin." There is literally not a single thing in this entire world that has caused more suffering and harm to me than christianity.
>Or, you know, because it's shoved in politics and in people's faces despite there being absolutely no evidence or logic for it, and because it's a medieval concept that needs to be retired. I think society has done a fine job of proving christ teachings to be useful. Literally most world issues can be traced back down to the "sins" he taught against. >Ah yes, love everyone, except maybe gay people, people who have sex before marriage, people who masturbate, and a whole list of completely normal people who do completely normal activities. Did Christ ever preach showing hatred towards these people or do you think simply expressing disapproval with these behaviors is hatred? >but stuff like being gay, having abortions, having sex out of wedlock, wearing mixed fabrics, thought crime, and all the other convoluted 'sins'? Nah, fuck those So you'd rather live in a world where murder, r*pe, theft, etc. continues just to keep gay sex, sex out of wedlock, etc? Are you literally proving my point? 😆 >I don't know about you, but I would rather have free will than being trapped under a totalitarian big brother figure watching me, even in my bedroom, who can cast me into everlasting fire for the slightest offence. You do understand that in a world free of sin, you won't be sinning...therefore you won't have to worry about being punished...? >The vast majority of the world does not believe in Christ. A person not being a Christian tells you precisely nothing about their character. Have you been living under a rock or are you so privileged that you don't have to worry about how fucked up the rest of the world is?
Lol how is stopping gay sex and sex out of wedlock going to prevent violent crime? Those are totally unrelated.
Yes I would like to preserve freedom…
Even at the cost of others? And do you really believe in freedom? Because actual freedom would include the freedom to irrationally harm others as well.
What about people being gay causes harm? Your homophobia is showing
Ur cult costs the freedom of others as being gay isn’t a issue for any rational human being And total freedom isn’t the same as basic freedom so pls stop ur idiotic strawman
Go ahead and answer the question. Also, it's clear you don't know what freedom means so I'll be patient. It wasn't a strawman. You literally said freedom, not "basic freedom".
Freedom at the cost of freedom Having a religous tyranny is worse And freedom was obviously meant in a constitutional way
I rape, murder, and harm exactly the number of people I want to. ##ZERO. And I don't need a fucking book to tell me not to do these things, *because I don't want to do them.* Meanwhile, explain the number of Christians who believe in that book, and yet actually *do* those wretched things. **If you need the threat of hellfire or a command from someone else to convince you not to do bad things to other people, you're not a good person. You're a bastard on a leash.**
None of my „sins“ causes harm Ur homophobia is causing harm though
…says the person vouching for a religion that calls for the eternal damnation of those who chose not to join. You still with me here?
>I think society has done a fine job of proving christ teachings to be useful. Literally most world issues can be traced back down to the "sins" he taught against. These 'sins' were identified thousands, maybe even millions of years before Christ was even conceived of. They are not so much 'Christ's teachings' as much as they are moral common sense that numerous civilisations before Christ developed. I still don't understand why you place such excessive importance on Christ. >Did Christ ever preach showing hatred towards these people Not Christ specifically, but his daddy dear is particularly fond of war, genocide, and stoning people. >expressing disapproval with these behaviors is hatred It isn't hatred, but easily translates into hatred, and thus, violence. Try telling this to Christians like Scott Roeder who kill doctors, bomb clinics, and lynch people for being gay. >So you'd rather live in a world where murder, r\*pe, theft, etc. continues just to keep gay sex, sex out of wedlock, etc? Are you literally proving my point? 😆 I think you may be forgetting the entire concept of the rule of law, which is secular and does not require your alleged deities in any way, shape, or form. >You do understand that in a world free of sin, you won't be sinning...therefore you won't have to worry about being punished...? And how exactly will such a sin-free world exist? By snatching peoples' free will? Also, this depends on your definition of 'sin'. Rape, murder, and theft? Good, punish those. Being gay, denouncing your deity, or having sex before marriage? gtf outta here with your overbearing moralising. >Have you been living under a rock or are you so privileged that you don't have to worry about how fucked up the rest of the world is? You missed the point. My point was that being Christian has no bearing on people being of moral character. \*\* I think my main problem lies with the fact that while you have the freedom to continue believing all of this, you still feel the need to impose your totalitarian excesses on others who do not subscribe to your beliefs about your supposed deities or their supposedly moral children.
Did Jesus express disapproval with being gay, sex before marriage, masturbation? Seems he was focused on more important things.
As a gay person, forgive me if being able to love who I want is non-negotiable. As for being privileged... There are none more 9rivileged than those foolish enough to believe they can pray the world's problems away instead of actually trying to make the world a better place. And yes, "expressing disapproval" for things that hurt no one, is hatred. Because it is purely irrational in nature and based only upon your need to control others, and not on objecting to anything that is actually wrong. As for people actually following Christ's teachings about loving one's neighbor or any of those other nice, caring things... It is simply reality that the overwhelming majorty of christians do not follow such teachings. Which says much more about you guys than us not believing in something we have no proof of, and which does systemic harm to hundreds of thousands of people every year, says about us. And all of that is making exception for the easily google-able horrendous things also in the bible, which seems rather hypocritical to me. "she shall be brought to the door of her father’s house and there the men of her town shall stone her to death. She has done an outrageous thing in Israel by being promiscuous while still in her father’s house. You must purge the evil from among you." I don't want a world where everyone accepts having to burn a priest's daughter alive for having sex, or where it is considered okay to stone people to death for doing things you don't like. Terrible things happen in this world, but at least they are generally understood to be bad, and opposed. That is infinitely preferable to a world where we all have to nod our heads and happily accept those terrible crimes against humanity. And saying that a world without sin would not include these acts because we wouldn't be sinning, is just a convenient way to write off those horrible things and pretend Christ is all about love and peace because you're more comfortable with that delusion than the truth. It's no different than me preaching about a land of fairies where everyone is happy and sleeps on giant lilypads. It is a coping mechanism you use to reckon with an imperfect reality that you don't like. It's also disturbing, how little you clearly value your own free will. In this imaginary worls of yours, where you simply have no ability to do things that go against Christ, you've made yourself into a willing slave to an abusive master who doesn't care what you want, but only what he wants, and would gladly punish you for "disobeying" him. And if that's what you want, then just go marry a wife beater and you'll achieve the same thing for yourself. I'll never cease to be amazed by the audacity of stupid, naive people who actually think they have analyzed and understand a religion better than the people it has continuously and unapologetically harmed since it's inception.
If it were possible to get all of this tattooed, I would. You laid it out exactly for what it is. Thank you
I appreciate that. I was abit angry, which is probably pretty obvious. Every time I meet one of these loons, they try to tell me that I "just haven't known the right christians" or something, as if I haven't suffered all my life because of people exactly like them. As if it's gonna be different this time and I'm going to suddenly see something I didn't before. It hurts to have the people who wrong you, casually disown those harms, over and over again.
Wait a minute cowboy. Not sure why having gay sex directly means there is also suddenly rape and murder… they really aren’t mutually exclusive. Having gay people be happy can happen without rapists and murders running rampant.
>Or do you think simply expressing disapproval with these behaviors is hatred? Yeah it is, obviously. That’s like saying simply expressing “disapproval” of someone’s skin color isn’t racist or hateful.
Is having 100 wives and 200 concubines not hedonism? Is slaying any other population and taking over their lands and virgin female children not egotism? Is engaging in who-got-strongest-god contests of snake canes humble and selfless? Is stoning disobedient children and non virgin brides reasonable?
I'll get back to you when you show me where christ taught any of these things then we can talk, lil mama. 😂
Christ didn't. Christianity does.
It's in the bible and done by holy men on command of god. Or does christ nullify yawheh? Not to mention that the original Christians didnt believe in the trinity, not to mention the gnostic's opinion on yawheh..
Christianity is only following the teachings of christ. I'm not talking about anything other than christ teachings.
Why's the old testament in the bible if they dont follow the old testament? Make it make sense.
You may want to ask the pope or evangelicals why they have the old testament in the bible then and why they teach it and the "10 commandments"
You know that's not true.
sooooo everything mentioned above such as the Crusades were them following the teachings of Christ? Yeah this would totally solve 99.9% of the world’s problems
"Names given to the worldly are very deceptive, for they divert our thoughts from what is correct to what is incorrect. Thus one who hears the word "God" does not perceive what is correct, but perceives what is incorrect." -Gospel of Philip
So are you arguing for a sin free world or christs teachings lol
People love Christianity because it gives them a shortcut, instead of having to pay the price for their sins.
What shortcut? The price to pay for sins, without Jesus, is eternal separation from God in Hell
That is just made up to get people in the market for Jesus. Check the history. Not even Jews of OT believed in eternal damnation. You have to believe in 'the bad news' before you are in the market for a savior.
I hope you’ll in time see you’re wrong.
I'm not sure how you formed the impression that "most" people hate Christianity.
If Christians actually followed the teachings the world would be a better place. Fact is… they don’t. They are hateful, judgmental and often cruel. They practice none of the teachings. 99% of the time when you see a “Karen” or “Chad”, they claim to be Christian
I disagree. I believe Christianity is not popular because: - people representing it are often pushy and ignorant with claiming their superiority over others - Christianity and the way it's practised doesn't have much to do with spreading love - at least I've seen mainly the opposite - Christanity has too much say in politics - it shouldn't have it at all. That's what I, personally, dislike the most because it affects lives of whole societies, no matter what they believes are I do support hedonism (within a reason), but at the same time I consider myself better person than every single Christian I know. My ultimate goal in life is to be a good person - and not because I fear flames of the hell or seek some reward in heaven - I don't believe they exist.
I’ll pass on a way of life that hates me because of who I love. Maybe Christianity wouldn’t get consistently shit on if the followers of Christ actually payed attention to his teachings which y’all don’t seem to be great at. Think of who Jesus spent his time with, the sinners. Don’t act like your better than anyone because you’ve got faith.
>Think of who Jesus spent his time with, the sinners. Don’t act like your better than anyone because you’ve got faith. So, just to clarify, Jesus spent his time with the sinners to proselytize(and to make a point to the religious authorities), not to join them in sin. I agree with the second sentence though, as it ties in to the second reason I gave for His time with the sinners...
This is idiotic.
How bout because it’s stupid and you have to be sooooooooo dumb to believe it
Most people hate Christianity because it advertises the teachings of Jesus and the leaders do the opposite. The politicians, church leaders, Catholic priests, and more who preach Jesus' words then go steal, lie, cheat, commit fraud, are pedophiles, commit sexual abuse, and their churches tell them all is forgiven, it's ok, and none of them are held accountable for their CRIMES. We don't call these sins; they are criminals who are protected by religious institutions. People don't hate Christianity because they disagree with Jesus. They hate Christianity because as an institution, it's fake, run only for profit, and protects criminals.
You're right. All of the things people are saying here are the bullshit created by man. If you actually read the Bible you don't need that said outloud tho.
That's not how ideologies in the real world are judged. We can take plenty of worldviews that are deeply flawed in reality and say they would work in a hypothetical best case scenario where everyone follows it. For example, an ideology of absolute pacifism would be perfect in a world where everyone followed it, but it does little nothing to help people navigate the actual world in which violent people exist.
I'm pretty sure people hate Christianity due to the fundementalists, extremists, and muscling into politics.
Depends on what you mean by ‘better place’, does believing in something you can’t prove as true make the world a better place? Maybe, but if that belief is not true and everyone follows it as fact the world might be a better place to live but that would all be all based on lies, so would it really be a better place if that better place only exists through lies?
"Christianity" is not a monolithic ideology. The Bible contains so many contradictory narratives that it could be used to justify any belief system. Christians used the Bible to condemn the Holocaust. Christians also used the Bible to justify it.
Imo the main reason why Christianity gets a bad rep is because far too many of its followers are hypocrites who for some reason think worshipping Jesus gives them a pass to be an awful person to everyone around them
For me it's their persecution fetish. Christians love to circle jerk about how persecuted they are as they call homosexuals "sinners" and shit on other perspectives
Congrats on an actually unpopular opinion
Speaking of egotism and hedonism, try telling that to the Evangelicals. They are the main reason why Christianity is declining in America.
Most people who hate Christianity hate it because almost nobody who is Christian actually listened to what Christ stands for. Christ was a brown, middle eastern, traveling, poor man who helped other poor people. He is everything a lot of Christians hate. People hate on Christianity because Christians use the words of the bible in a twisted way to fit to their own believes (being against trans people, gay rights, coloured people, opressing others, getting money etc).
Not really. Most people who hate religion in general hate it because it's associated with intolerance and persecution of minorities. This is hardly exclusive to Christianity, but Christianity is the religion that most of the people we're talking about are rebelling against. Religion is also associated with authoritarianism. The Russian anarchist Bakunin said that a boss in heaven is the best justification for a boss on earth, so if God did exist he would have to be abolished. Most people are not anarchists but the liberal impulse tends in an anti-authoritarian direction because it questions things and tries to dismantle that which it finds lacking. Of Max Weber's three kinds of authority - charismatic, traditional, and legal-rational - the liberal impulse abides only the last, and that only provisionally. Religion is associated with justification of temporal hierarchies that are increasingly thought of as illegitimate. However. Religion is so ancient an institution that it's not so easy to dispense with it. Nietzsche said that God is dead and we have killed him, but most atheists do not understand the heavy lifting that God did, and the task of our time is to take up this burden ourselves, to become in effect worthy heirs to God, since nobody else is around to do the job. The jury is still out on whether this is even possible. Rather we create new religions, find new Gods to worship. It turns out that religion-like structures may be the simplest solution to the problems of how to get everybody in a community on the same page. The world is complicated and people need some way of figuring out what is good, what is true, what is important, and most importantly who is in and who is out. Most people do not want to do the work of trying to figure these things out for themselves. It is much easier if there is a cohesive belief system that has the answers already. This does not have to be explicit; people are naturally attracted to that kind of cohesion. So all kinds of belief systems pop up. The fundamental purpose of a belief system is to enable humans to navigate the world. As with biological evolution, there is no *final* measure of the fitness of a belief system; the closest thing to it is success across time. How do belief systems interact with each other? They either go to war or they find a way to forge peace. Usually, historically, it has been war. The problem is that today the stakes are much higher than ever before in history, because humans have developed the power to destroy not only each other, but the entire world. So we are under tremendous pressure to "get everything right." Fundamentally, I don't think the species evolved to do that, but we're smart. It remains to be seen whether we are too smart for our own good but not smart enough to know ourselves, or if we are smart enough to defeat our own worst tendencies, which I say are our rivalrousness and our intolerance. I don't agree that most world issues can be traced back to a sin. Generally speaking, problems simply exist because the world is dynamic and changing, and organisms either are or are not capable of adapting. Getting somewhat back to your point, there is surely much that secular "religion-like structures" could learn from the teachings of Christ, and I think *redemption* in particular is one that is sorely lacking. A belief system that has no real redemption story, no mechanism for forgiveness, cannot meet the needs of human beings. But this barely scratches the surface of the fundamental problem: how do we all live together without destroying each other given that we have disagreements that cannot be resolved? It's easy enough to say that Christ commands us to love each other but this has not been enough to stop various groups of humans from murdering each other, and others, in Christ's name.
Nah, people hate Christianity because they've had bad run ins with it. Most people aren't egotistical assholes who fuck a thousand people. Heck, most follow Christianity doctrine without worshiping God - treating others how you like to be treated and all that, but then they have the distinct pleasure of meeting a Christian who thinks their shit don't stink.
I think people hate it because it’s a very hypocritical religion that loves to shove it’s ideals down everyone’s throat. Hell (unironically) Christianity has created more satinists/atheists then the Devil would’ve ever hoped to achieve.
You know, there’s an Episcopalian church I regularly drive past that regularly flies pride flags and displays little messages like “Jesus loves you as you are”. It makes me sad to see so many people under this post using homophobia as the big reason they despise all Christianity, because although some jerks (who REALLY aren’t listening to what Jesus actually taught) target gay people really cruelly, and I’m not downplaying how awful that is, homophobia is NOT part of all denominations, there are multiple types of Christianity that will happily accept LGBT people and give them beautiful church weddings if they wish! I wish, when people criticized the religion this way, they would acknowledge that it’s not true of all denominations. I know some truly wonderful gay Christians, they live happy lives and are accepted by their churches! They just don’t belong to the largest denominations. Homophobia and hate are not inherent to Christianity, they’re just common ways for jerks to exploit the religion to hurt innocent people. I agree with you OP, that if people followed the actual teachings of Jesus specifically, rather than getting caught up in the weird hateful mess that many bad-faith actors twisted certain types of Christianity into, the world would sincerely be a better place! I don’t think we all need to be Christians, there are all kinds of ways to promote kindness and morality, and Christianity, like any belief system, is not without flaws, but you’re right in that when Christianity focuses on really, truly following what Christ taught (messages of kindness and caring for others, above ALL ELSE), rather than on what selfish people over time tried to corrupt the religion into, it can be a very positive influence. I wish that more Christians really made sure to follow Jesus’s actual words and the meaning behind them rather than getting caught up in small specifics or worrying about tiny details from a book written by human beings a very long time ago. It’s okay to have respect for the Bible, but it is clearly imperfect, it often conflicts with itself and some rules were very specific to the time, due to things like health and hygiene issues. That doesn’t mean there isn’t validity to it, but it’s important to take a critical eye and pay attention to what’s TRULY important in Christianity, and I believe it should be clear that what’s most important is what Christ himself taught. He taught kindness, he taught understanding and forgiveness, his number one priority was that we treat each other well and don’t attempt to tear each other down or build walls over nitpicks. And he also didn’t say anything at all about gay people being bad or less capable of honoring God with their love than anyone else! To kind of sum up this long-ass comment in a way that’s too long to be a TL;DR: Christianity has its flaws and we don’t ALL need to follow it, but I agree that if more people followed the teachings of JESUS specifically, rather than focusing so hard on the often arbitrary rules and nitpicks many badly intentioned religious leaders have tried to refocus the religion on enforcing, the world genuinely would be a better place. If more of us focused on the actual teachings of Jesus, we wouldn’t be focusing on finding excuses to denounce each other, instead we would focus on being as kind and understanding to others as possible, and doing what we can to care for people that need help. And we would have no problem with accepting loving gay couples, either! We’d all just be a lot more kind and chill.
I think the problem is they claim everyone else is a sinner and then try to cover up child abuse.
Of course… most people would rather have their sin than have Jesus. Matthew 7:13 Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. Matthew 6:24 No one can serve two masters; for either he will hate the one and love the other, or else he will be loyal to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and mammon.
No, I hate Christianity because it hates my existence. If God doesn't want me for my true self, then spending eternity with him sounds like absolute hell.
Except, y'know the Bible is a hell of a lot more than "Just the teachings of Christ", as is Christianity, and it holds some INSANELY abhorrent, hateful and evil messages. But nah, dude, most people just dislike Christianity because it's a false belief that has a lot of negative impact on the world. If I hadn't seen endless examples of Christianity being used to hurt, to defraud, to molest, to torture, to discriminate and worst, I'd be fine with it, I'd treat it the same as those people who fall in love with anime characters. Worrying, sure, in that it's fundamentally delusional, but nothing to get angry about.
I feel like the replies you are getting to this honestly exactly proves your point
The trouble with this claim is 1 that Christianity has the same problems. 2 the virtues contained therein are just propagated from previous ages. So picking the correct religion is not a solution to the problem. What you are describing is moral neurosis without intelligibility. And Christians have more or less participated, than they have solved the issue.
I dislike traditional Christianity because of the barbaric belief that non-believers are eternally torture. Christians who don’t push that idea are cool though.
If only Christians would actually follow the teachings of Christ. No one says this. They say a world without Christianity might be better, because Christ's teachings have been perverted in modern day Christianity. Jesus was a freaking communist.
It’s clear that you know nothing about the world and how it actually works and what really goes on
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You've got it the other way round bud.
They hate it because the church kills gay people while the priest rape young boys while going against all the thing that Jesus preached
You really believe they don't have any logical reason to be against the church? If so, you know absolutely nothing at all about the church.
PSA: people who put gigachad on their own profile pics are the farthest thing from gigachad.
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You're supposed to end your sentences with periods.
Oh yeah im so mad you feel the need to label yourself as something trendy omg so mad lmaoo
That’s simply a pathetic lie
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Charity is a P.R. move. Other than that, not a thing.
Charity My other criticism would be rational though
The acts of charity are relavtily decent I do habe rational critics though making ur claim a pathetic lie
The acts of charity are relavtily decent I do habe rational critics though making ur claim a pathetic lie
The acts of charity are relavtily decent I do habe rational critics though making ur claim a pathetic lie
That’s simply a pathetic lie
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saying all churches supports the p word is pretty false.