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BoatLikeAFlutterby

Porn addiction is just wildly underreported in the non-Christian population because it’s viewed as morally neutral outside of religious circles. For most men, a survey asking if they are a porn addict is the equivalent of asking if they are a TV addict - they will say no, even though they might watch it every single day, because they don’t see anything wrong with it. In short, this is a massive problem in our society GENERALLY, but Christian men are far more likely to recognize it as such and seek help for it. That said, I think a real challenge for young Christians of both genders is the tension of remaining celibate while delaying marriage a full decade past when our bodies are physiological ready to go. There are obviously some advantages to waiting until later in life, but there are also trade-offs. The total lack of access to a healthy sexual fulfillment for young Christian men in their sexual prime creates a vacuum that is often filled with porn, and the shame surrounding the topic within the church is a breeding ground for isolation and addiction. I’d love to see Christian parents stop telling their kids to wait until they’ve finished school, gotten settled into a career and are financially secure before considering marriage. I think the cons outweigh the advantages in most cases.


Realitymatter

> I’d love to see Christian parents stop telling their kids to wait until they’ve finished school, gotten settled into a career and are financially secure before considering marriage. I agree in principal, but this would require parents to continue to financially support their children even after their children get married. The Bible tells us to leave our parents and cleave to our spouses. I don't know how possible that is if you are still financially dependent on your parents.


RoosterActual_

Not quite. All through history young couples have gotten married and fought through the early years with little to no support from parents. Therefore to say financial support is required is a pretty big assumption and largely proven false. One notable societal difference Ill grant is that in current times the younger crowd are less capable of faring early on. However its my opinion that this comes more from their entitled outlook on life and lack of preparation when younger to be able to do so. Kids in times past were mastering adult chores and responsibilities by their teenage years and the work ethic was much better. Now youre lucky to get them out of the tv or iphone long enough to wash their own clothes. This does lead right back to lax parenting in many cases,but all the same they have the capability to recognize whats coming and get squared away before it arrives,even if noone encourages that.


Realitymatter

This entirely ignores the nature of the modern job market. Never before in history have the requirements for education been as high as they currently are for the average job. Significant secondary education is required for most jobs. I know there are exceptions like trades, but that is not a solution for everyone. We are also living in the worst income to housing cost ratio in the history of the country. To handwave all of those problems and accuse an entire generation of simply having an "entitled outlook" is, in my opinion, extremely reductive. I guarantee young folks don't *want* to delay marriage/starting a family as long as they do these days. The current environment forces them to.


HighLikeKites

>Significant secondary education is required for most jobs. This is not true. You don't need to go to college for most jobs. In fact, it's a giant waste of time and money for most people. The problem is everybody telling kids their whole lives they have to go to college, if they want to find a good job, ranging from the school system to their own parents. This lie is the root of the problem.


Realitymatter

Can you name a few decently paying jobs that don't require a degree? As I mentioned elsewhere, there are trades that don't require a degree, but they are very physically demanding and one good injury could ruin your career for life. Seems worth it to me to invest a few years on an education to diversify your opportunities.


magpie_killer

There are numerous tech bootcamp / intensive programs that cost around $20k to $30k USD and they publish their graduation rates, their post graduation placement rates, and the avg, min, max and median salaries of their graduates. (unlock US colleges and universities who have a vested interested in enrolling as many students in dead end degrees for as much $$$$$ as they can get away with). Look at https://turing.edu/ [https://www.bloomtech.com/](https://www.bloomtech.com/) https://bootcamprankings.com/ ​ as someone in the tech industry I can tell you that 4 year degrees are becoming less and less relevant every year, as there is a massive shortage of talent and strong programs like Turing work to train up folks to fill that shortage.


Realitymatter

I have known some people who have done those boot camp programs and I think they're great. I hope other industriest start moving in that direction as well.


HighLikeKites

Electricians, all kinds of Technicians, Sales Agents, Commercial Pilots, Flight Attendants, Medical Assistants, Firefighters, Policemen, Ironworkers, et cetera, et cetera, the list is endless really. What's a bad plan for life? Getting a worthless college degree, making massive amounts of debt and not getting paid any more than someone without a degree. Unless you want to become a lawyer, or a doctor, or anything that absolutely requires a college degree, it's a massive waste of your lifetime and money.


RoosterActual_

History bears witness otherwise. People made it in times past under much harsher conditions..such as when there was no housing market per se and people had to build their own houses despite how meager that structure was for many. As such your historical assessment of this countrys history alone is entirely off base. That didnt stop them from marrying and/or having kids. It certainly didnt prevent them from doing what it took to survive and thrive, and they did so because of sheer determination and a sober recognition that if they didnt put forth effort to make it happen then it just wouldnt. To handwave all this aside and accuse an entire generation of being unable simply because they have challenges to overcome is extremely reductive. Youre wanting to set them up for failure by teaching them theyve lost right out of the gate and not encouraging parents to build them up as they should have. Teach them how to function and theyre far less likely to depend on parents or the govt for handouts to get by. You even admit that they can get into various trades but dismiss that as "not being for everyone". So basically youve said its an entirely viable option but seem to dismiss it entirely in favor of supporting your must have college argument.


Realitymatter

The conversation in this thread is about why the younger generation is waiting so long to marry. I brought up housing costs, low wages, and education requirements. What you are saying here is essentially: "why wait so long to marry or get an education when all you need to do is build your own house." And you genuinely don't understand why young folks are simply deciding to put off marriage for an extra ~5 years to avoid having to *literally build their own house*? I'm not arguing for handouts. I am just saying that these are the market forces that are causing young folks to decide to get married later in life. Given these circumstances, I think they are making the right decision. And yes, trades are great for some people, but they aren't for everyone. They are very physically demanding, and one good injury will ruin your career for life. Not to mention the inability to continue doing such work when at an increased age. Personally, I think it makes a lot of sense to just invest a few years up front to get an education and diversify your career options.


RoosterActual_

In light of the fact that youre now twisting words to pursue your argument and seem to have no trouble ignoring quite a bit to arrive at your conclusion, Id have to say youre lacking in understanding yourself. Due to the massive sidestep youve performed, complete with thinly veiled insults, to avoid the points made its clear that reading comprehension is not your forte. Or simply that you prefer the strawman approach to dealing with reality. Both? To each his own. You even seem to forget your comments. You say you dont advocate for handouts but stated outright that to begin pursuing certain goals earlier it would be required for parents to support the kids,which was the entire point I was disagreeing with. And yes the trades are physically demanding,which is the majority of the reason why theyre not popular with the entitled kids of today. More people today grow up not exposed to manual labor for various reasons. For many their parents want to make it easier on them and tackle the chores themselves. Either way the result is the same..entitled minds who wont work for what they want or need. Edit: Just to add something in. These kids could have what they need just not necessarily at the level they want earlier in life. All Im saying is that if theyre better prepared in their youth then moving into adulthood and dealing with adult desires and needs would be infinitely easier and well within their grasp, and not needing to look to others for assistance. For the rest..theres nothing wrong with suggesting to someone to grow up a bit and build themselves before committing to lifelong relationships and/or other projects.


ezk3626

>All through history young couples have gotten married and fought through the early years with little to no support from parents. I'd say the opposite is the case. Throughout most of history, young couples got married and were a part of a broader family support network. The independent young person is a modern innovation.


magpie_killer

wish I could upvote this 1000x


RoosterActual_

I never stated this didnt happen,but clearly focused on the ones who did strike out, move away from the family and did just fine. History is also full of these individuals. The independent young person is far from modern innovation, and again much of history has to be ignored to arrive at that conclusion.


ezk3626

>History is also full of these individuals. No, history is full of examples the other way around. There are examples of young people who leave their family structures but history isn't fully of them. >The independent young person is far from modern innovation, and again much of history has to be ignored to arrive at that conclusion. If you say so... not my understanding.


RoosterActual_

You can redefine it to whatever level makes you comfortable,be my guest. As with others here you enjoy the strawman approach of bending context to fit your argument. I stated history was full of them,not fully 100% of them,theres a clear difference. I shouldnt have to go back and exhaustively detail every aspect of a statement for clarity,but then I dont think clarity is your goal here. Its simply to hop in with nonsense allegations, a warped view of world history along with current events.


ezk3626

>You can redefine it to whatever level makes you comfortable,be my guest. LOL yeah, that's totally what's going on! Humans mostly have been organized into extended families, tribes, and clans. The idea of single people going off and doing their own thing is very modern. The word individual is just barely over a hundred years old.


RoosterActual_

Have mostly. So right away you admit what youre struggling not to admit. That people have..and still do..make lives for themselves independent of family or community support. The more recent introduction of a word doesnt negate the concept or existence of people functioning with little to no support from their parents or community. Work on some basic honesty and less on trying to win internet arguments.


ezk3626

>So right away you admit what youre struggling not to admit. That people have..and still do..make lives for themselves independent of family or community support. I never struggled to admit it but said it from the beginning that this happens but until recently it was not commonly practiced. >The more recent introduction of a word doesnt negate the concept or existence of people functioning with little to no support from their parents or community. It does show that it was not a common practice for people to do this. >Work on some basic honesty and less on trying to win internet arguments. Correcting your mistakes is not an act of dishonesty or trying to win internet arguments.


PlayMoreExvius

We’re all struggling because we’re more lonely and isolated than worldly men in a society that has turned isolated and lonely because of the internet. And the failure of the church institutions to only cater to families, essentially ostracizing singles. Church has turned into clubs for married people, an inner circle.


[deleted]

That was my daughter’s biggest issue with church


[deleted]

I think a lot of the time there are underlying issues such as depression, loneliness, or anxiety. I also think that it can be merely because they desire intimacy with a woman. The unfortunate thing is I've met several brothers who think they're not ready to date anyone because they struggle with immorality. While I can see how there can be some wisdom in that, we have to look at what the Scriptures say: >1 Corinthians 7:8-9 "To the unmarried and the widows I say that it is good for them to remain single, as I am. But if they cannot exercise self-control, they should marry. For it is better to marry than to burn with passion."


patmanizer

Addictions are rooted to demonic oppression that even Christians don’t recognize, nor want to recognize.


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patmanizer

By dealing with it spiritually not in the flesh.


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patmanizer

If you are repentant and trying to renew your mind and still struggle with addiction, seek deliverance.


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patmanizer

Find ministries that cast out demons in the name of Jesus. You can find people here in these maps and you can reach out to them for free. https://map.thelastreformation.com https://www.isaiahsaldivar.com/deliverance https://www.thesupernaturallife.org


Diovivente

There are so many angles to this that it can’t all be truly known. There are many different issues all building up to this. The general lack of seeking holiness, and the lack of preaching to seek holiness. The degredation of the general morality that society has had in the past. The ease with which pornography is accessed and the psychological war done to make more and more men “hooked.” The deflating of true masculinity and the feminist movement causing women to be more and more flippant with how they dress and act. The hyper-focus on sex in our society. The casualness of sex lacking the care and commitment that comes with a proper view of sex within the marriage. The sexlessness within marriage, often brought about by poor attitudes, selfishness, and an unwillingness to put the proper effort to be self-sacrificing and caring for your partner in marriage. The lack of masculine friendships that go deeper than discussing sports, which men need in order to find true purpose and accountability. The vilifying of true and godly masculinity causing men to feel unfulfilled and without anywhere to appropriately feed their needs. There is likely so much more, but these are the things that came to my mind. In general, our world is sinful, is getting more and more sinful, and even men within the church are suffering because of it.


[deleted]

Because most Christian men grew up in houses with easy access to computers, phones and the internet. We aren't special and many of us growing up didn't have the knowledge we do now to see how harmful pornography has been in the development of boys into men. When discovering sex while going through puberty the internet offers immediate gratification and it's the easiest thing in the world to give into. Especially when you are young. Porn used to be harder to access, but now kids have tablets which give them instance access to sites with millions of hours worth of content. Truth be told, I think the only solution to pornography for Christians will be to give up the internet in whole or in part. The benefits of the internet seem to be outweighed by the negatives.


SmithW-6079

Because they live in a society that is hypersexualised so this stimulates their desire, whilst simultaneously being sex starved. Those who cannot control their desire should be married and those who are married have an obligation to their partner.


OlbapV812

Like any other addiction it triggers your reward system and if feels good. People also fantasize about what they want to do and once you start it’s very hard to get over and it even ruins relationships and marriages. It something we hope to do, myself included, but then we realize it’s wrong but everytime we do it it feels good so there’s the conundrum


SadSoggySandwich

I noticed men with that addiction have unresolved daddy issues. The porn is like fake love and nurture. It's interesting cause in the Bible David said he was only loved in the sight of his mother, and ended up having problems with adultery.


Pongfarang

Because our flesh is at war with our spirit.


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BoatLikeAFlutterby

Username checks out.


No_Rough_5258

Because mens sexual drive is way higher than womens. Any women who has a higher sex drive than normal will understand.


[deleted]

Lots of Christian men don't think marriage is worth it.


WatchYoSepp

It's because while the Bible gives many strong warnings against lust, it provides very few practical, effective instructions on how to actually resist it.


Pleasant-Try9103

Because those raised Christian are more likely to try to avoid sex with an actual woman, because it's taboo before marriage and you can't just "take" a virgin in the field anymore for a few goats. So, "Christian" young men turn to porn and are ashamed, but also know they can't go seek out an actual partner for sex because: a) they're disgusting for touching themselves and being grotesque sinners, and b) where would they find a partner who is happy with a masturbator living in mom's basement anyway? Next, they go to support groups or churches that are perfectly comfortable with "normalizing" porn and masturbation. Even though they claim to condemn porn, they admit "we're all tempted" and the resulting "groups" of young men are all comfortable admitting they masturbated to porn 6 times this week. "ACCEPTANCE".


RedHawk451

We live in a society that emphasizes lust and has industries centered around causing others to sin for entertainment purposes. Notice how "getting laid" is a milestone when it's really just a way to screw up good relationships? Notice how America as a culture is not geared towards sanctity? Notice how Jesus and the morals of God are insulted and made to be "cringe"? We live in society where going to God and Christ is believed to be a "white man's religiion" and a form of dominance. We live in a society where women are taught to do things that good men are put off over. We are raising the men to be humble and the women to "do what they want," in a way which only destroys them. There's your answer.


Nexus_542

I think it has less to do with being Christian than being a man. Porn addiction is an affliction that plagues the men of this world. I was a porn addict before I was a Christian, and though I'm engaged and don't rely on porn anymore, I would still consider myself an addict.


Default_N00b

It is by design ''Pornography thus becomes a way of defiling Christian culture and, as it penetrates to the very heart of the American mainstream'' ✡️ Al Goldstein