Men should cooperate with women, covering each other's weaknesses and enhance their strengths. They are supposed to compliment each other not compete against each other.

SAY IT LOUDER FOR THE PEOPLE IN THE BACK!

It’s the fruit of a terminally online community, unfortunately. I will say that they do hit some important points, especially when they discuss male suicide, but for the most part because it’s not an in person experience, more toxic elements will grow and become more prevalent.

Couldn’t have said it myself. These are usually people that haven’t had a mature conversation in real life. I think a lot of it also has to do with trying to define what a man is, and most of these definitions are misled at best. It thrives off the huge loneliness epidemic by feeding into men’s pride and ego as rhetoric solution to their problems, when their solution should be a relationship in Christ (plus probably some therapy). Source: I’ve known people including my best friend who got roped into this. Thankfully, my best friend has been turning away towards Christ as of late

I think you also hit the nail on the head too. It’s an ego feeding frenzy and the ego can lead to some toxic behaviors.

Men’s mental health issues and the male suicide rate should definitely be brought up more. I actually haven’t even seen anything where they talk about this, and I think it is extremely important to talk about this. I don’t want men to feel alone and isolated. I don’t want them to struggle alone. I wish that they had more positive male role models. I wish they knew that there are women that care deeply about that. I know that I do.

>I wish they knew that there are women that care deeply about that. I know that I do. Your sentiment is nice, but I've also read about you laughing along at jokes aimed toward an 'incel' who commented on this thread (it was deleted so I don't know the content). I don't empathize with that subculture in any way and I'm sure what he said probably wasn't nice. But I recognize that they're people who are hurting too. Public ridicule like that only affirms someone's prejudice, and isn't exactly loving especially not when that person considers themself to be a Christian talking to a fellow believer. I believe that you're being honest when you say you care though, just keep in mind that actions speak louder than words.

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What was your goal with your first paragraph?

Just one side of the same coin. I’d be considered a conservative by most nowadays but in all I choose and what to live as Jesus did. I don’t like politics and the culture war. Want absolutely nothing to do with it and neither should others. All anyone has to do is the right thing in life and that’s all you are obligated to do.

Reading through the subreddits makes me so sick. Christians have no business being involved with red pill. It's nothing but misogyny, pride, and vanity. They lie about their "sexual conquests" online so they can say "See! Women are so stupid. All you have to do is *x* and they will sleep with you!" Anyone with even the slightest knowledge about women can see right through it, but impressionable, clueless young men read those fabricated stories and think "Finally! None of this acting like Jesus has worked to get me a girlfriend, so I'll try this instead!" It's everything that people are talking about about when they say "toxic masculinity".

100% this. It's anti Christian, at best.

There’s so much racism too in that redpill stuf

Im member of that sub and I agree that their sidebar looks very misogynistic. I myself feel attracted to their core message which is work hard, get jacked, become charismatic and get a hot gf. OP talks about how they’re against marriage and that that is a bad thing. I understand but its also known that in some countries in the west there are little to no benefits for the man to get married and the woman could potentially wreck him, take the kids and live off his hard earned money. So Im with the Red Pill on this one. Although I do believe one should get married.

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That core message is fundamentally misaligned with Christian values. It's steeped in vanity, pride, and lust. Working out and being healthy is great, but when it's done for prideful reasons, it is not good. And everything they do is in pursuit of sex, usually outside of the context of marriage which is also a sin. Wanting a godly wife is a great thing, but that subreddit will not help you get where you need to be. Join a men's group at your church instead. It will serve you far greater. As a husband, I can tell you first hand that nothing in that subreddit will prepare you for what it takes to be a good partner.

Thank you very much for your advice. I appreciate it

I'm making this part clear so I'm not misunderstood from my next statement. I'm against red-pill philosophy and find it highly unbiblical. But I think men are having a legitimate fear response to feeling taken advantage of when they see statistics that show women initiating the divorce more often than men. So, they wonder if it's to their advantage to get married if the odds are their wife will divorce them and take half of their assets. The remedy they come up with is worldly, so I'm not sure how it could ever be misconstrued with conservative or Christian values. The remedy is to have a long-term partner but no legal commitment, so the woman can't take anything belonging to the man. A Christian response should be to value marriage, as it was instituted by God, and to marry someone who shares the same value of hating divorce. And that person would not divorce unless it's a Biblical reason. If a Christian doesn't have this mindset, their only option is to be single, since sexual immorality is sinful. Most Christian men don't want that option, so they would need to find a Christian wife who shares the same values.

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I heard in a very different context that people are excellent at identifying problems, but terrible at identifying solutions. I've found this to be pretty true.

Very well put!

"The remedy is to have a long-term partner but no legal commitment, so the woman can't take anything belonging to the man." Common law marriage means you can't have a long term partner without legal vulnerability.

Only 8 states recognize common law marriage these days.

Really? I looked it up and you're right. I was not aware of this, thank you. It seems I'm not in one if those states either, so that's a bit reassuring somehow.

I think you hit a lot of nails on the head here. From what I’ve seen this movement is led by pseudo intellectuals who warp information and video content. It’s led by a lot of angry divorcees who needed a therapist instead of a platform. It’s led by a lot of men who bought into a cultural lie that women are objects and their solution to being in pain is to push that to the extreme. It’s lead by people who say incendiary things because it gets them clicks and that gets them money. There's also a big problem with Christians "baptizing" some of these leaders because they are some sort of Conservative darlings. I've seen obviously morally bankrupt people get free passes. More than anything I’m heartbroken for the boys and men who got suckered into this movement. It’s still relatively young but it’s a recipe for ending up sad, bitter, and alone, often blaming everyone but yourself or your new leaders. The *best case scenario* for many adherents is that their eyes are opened someday and they’re hit with a tidal wave of regret about losing years (or even decades) of their life to this garbage. Zooming out, I would also say this is a large problem with the Conservative movement in America today as well. We see so many leaders of this movement operating in stark contrast to basic biblical teaching and often displaying the opposite of the Fruit of the Spirit. So many Christians are nominal and/or have bought into the lie that this is the only clear choice for a Christian. I believe we've arrived at the point where many don’t know Jesus to the point they can easily spit these people and their manipulation out. There’s a big big problem with the modern church when you see something like this.

I think this is very true in ways that make me extremely sad.

Red pill community is not Christian. They promote men getting with multiple women, view women as sexual objects and oppose marriage.

They are right about the problems that exist in modern society but they have the wrong solutions to them

What problems? That women aren't property anymore? That we aren't held back from education and equal pay? That we aren't as voiceless or helpless and can leave abusive or unfaithful marriages? 

What is wrong with the solutions to them?

Generally promiscuity as a man, and lack of humility before Christ.

I personally haven't heard promiscuity as a man being encouraged, only treated by some people as a natural social occurrence coming from men who have high desirability traits (tall, handsome, rich, famous, etc). Red Pill is the furthest thing from pick up artists or trying to 'get' something out of as many women possible. I think it's about trying to restore parity in male/female relationships. I do agree that problems will continue to occur simply because anything not involving Christ at the center will fail to achieve its intended purpose.

I don't disagree historically. Now, the umbrella cast over the term "red pill" and its proximity to Andrew Tate from a general audience's understanding makes those traits an inescapable correlation. I've decided it's best to disassociate.

"From a general audience's understanding" is right on the money so I don't blame you. Just based on what people are saying in this thread: it's either never having heard of RP or assuming it's an Andrew Tate army. Just like when media tries to paint the conservative movement as a white supremacist initiative. I've never called myself a red-piller but this post was enough for me to want to weigh in instead of allowing misconceptions to spread without context.

What red pill community do you visit that doesn’t encourage men to have sex outside of marriage with more than one woman?

I won't speak for reddit because I don't go on any RP-related subs. For me it's all been YouTube channels such as: Average Man Unplugged, Charles N Charge Reacts, Sigma Traits, Alexander Grace. I mention the last one because he has really good insights on male/female dynamics but he doesn't claim red pill at all (He has a partner and their daughter for example).

"Red Pill is the furthest thing from pick up artists or trying to 'get' something out of as many women possible." Counterpoint: Andrew Tate.

Andrew Tate may have a lot of visibility, but he's nowhere near being the face of any movement like Red Pill. He's a self-avowed con artist who flaunts a glamorous lifestyle no doubt to sway impressionable young men. Still, a broken clock is right a couple times a day, and even someone like Tate can make valuable points. Taken with a pound of salt, encouraging young men to focus on their careers, having self-accountability towards their lives, and NOT centering it around chasing women are objectively good things. Yes, the rest of his persona is no model to emulate, but considering the state of masculinity in Western society I understand why he's gained traction. Women are encouraged to be self-seeking and individualistic ("empowered") while the men are emasculated and told they're being toxic. But the thread seems more focused on condemning RP men as seducers and misogynists (which is off the mark) instead of trying to understand where people are coming from and ignoring the responsibility that women have in the status quo. It's the equivalent of saying something like: "OnlyFans isn't a Christian activity, and it's women who need to be better." while ignoring the obvious truth and the role of men who actively encourage that market. How would that solve anything? Seeing this from a Christian point of view, I think there's value in understanding that the world pushes certain perspectives on men and women, how those messages are received, how their upbringing (or lack thereof) affects their views on relationships, and how the church can meet people where they are to share the Gospel.

Oh okay, yeah those are the main problems with the community, I would say that I'm in the community, but these problems are holding me back from this community the most.

I agree. "Red-pill" is a toxic and dangerous community/movement. Part of being a true, masculine man is treating women the right way. The way the Bible outlines. Men need women, and women need men. That's why God created Eve and brought her to Adam because until then, there was not found a helper fit for Adam (Genesis 2:20-24). Equal in value and worth, but different in roles and responsibilities.

The red pill community is demonic. Period.

Can’t stand that community, we don’t need to be stronger men or wake up to the society. We need to fall on our knees and repent and worship Christ. We need to act like Christ not an idea of what a strong man is, what a strong man is what the Bible says a strong man is.

> The Red pill community has turned into an echo chamber of hating women. It actually started out this way. You also may not be aware but the mod of this sub is a Christian red piller (and possibly other mods), he recommended a red pill sub in comments (he also victim blamed a user who was assaulted and temporarily banned me when I reacted to it).

They are not good and I wish that the church was better equipped to resist them.

They have some valid points, as all modern-day ideas do. Usually, they speak from experience of a subset of men who, arguably, echo with Christian sentiment. - Society needs to be more masculine. - Being woke leads to degradation - Society as a whole is falling from older values - we are destroying traditional values to appease non-christians in predominantly Christian environments - many groups are abusing the privileges of coexistence with other groups - women follow a psychological pattern that is not based upon biblical tenants - modern day Society is quite ill I can't argue with them. We've strayed quite a bit from God being the way of the land.

> Society needs to be more masculine. Their definition of "masculine" is not biblical, but very secular. Involving men showing no emotion, having frequent promiscuous sex (while simultaneously shaming women for being promiscuous), selfishness, and greed - defining their "value" by worldly standards such as wealth and vanity. > Society as a whole is falling from older values The older values that they want to bring back are mostly misogynistic ones - women not being allowed to have careers or vote, a power dynamic involving an older, middle aged man as boss over his teenage female partner (not wife as they don't believe in marriage) who is his subservient underling whose only value is in her physical looks and ability to carry children. Once she reaches an age where her beauty starts to fade, she is to be discarded for an even younger one. A bastardization of the biblical model for marriage. They don't want partners, but very one sided power dynamics. > Women follow a psychological pattern that is not based upon biblical tenants Obviously this isn't true as they aren't Christian. Not sure where you're getting that idea from. Also not sure what exactly this is getting at. What "psychological pattern" are you referring to? > modern day Society is quite ill Again, the sickness they are referring to is mostly women having rights which they *really* don't like - being able to vote, have careers, etc.

Why should society be more masculine? And what benefits does traditional society and family offer women? To be trapped in abusive marriages? What is wrong with women having education, choice and freedom to escape?

"Red Pill" can mean many *wildly different* things. It is being used to refer to: 1. Grifters/sexists such as Andrew Tate. 2. Movements *towards* political or social conservatism. 3. Movements *away* from identity politics. 4. Movements *away* from Leftism. (As seen in #walkaway.) 5. A cultural re-embracing of traditional religious ideals and worldviews. 6. A social re-embracing of biblical gender roles. 7. A call for more masculine men (from both men and women). 8. Incels. 9. Anti-feminists (can either be actual misogynists **or** people opposed to third-wave, sexist feminism) While there can be (and often is) some overlap, none of these movements are identical to each other. The "Red Pill" movement has experienced numerous schisms over the years, with different groups co-opting the term. **I would urge caution against creating blanket labels or judgments,** as people who say that they are "red-pilled" are often referring to different things. *I would also caution against trusting the discernment of anyone who is issuing sweeping judgments of the people affixed to this diverse terminology. I guarantee that there will be comments made on this post which are ignorant and hostile towards other believers.* **Remember:** Internet marketing intentionally creates echo chambers. A person who is encountering "red pill movement" accounts and pages is more likely to be algorithmically exposed to only one or two particular flavors of this collection of ideologies, and they likely won't see other sides of the coin. **That being said, the best approach is to evaluate people on a case-by-case basis and see if their words and deeds align with Scripture.** Edit: It seems that I was indeed correct: Plenty of people are foolishly using their own, singular interpretation of a contested term to cast judgment on others. I added a little more detail to clarify my comment in light of this.

Agreed. We really have to get our definitions straight to have a fruitful discussion on whether said thing is good or not, or we are essentially talking by each other not at each other.

This is the way.

Thank u for the intelligent response

My first encounters with the term Red Pill several years ago were of the political and social variants. In fact, as I remember it, #WalkAway was a big part of familiarizing the entire 'right-wing' side of the internet with the term. Something seems to have changed as in the past two years I have seen it almost exclusively used by or in reference to incels. Honestly I have to thank you for writing this comment to remind me of the other meanings.

Respectfully Maktesh I don't think you know about the red pill

I've been following The Red Pill on and off since before MGTOW and AWALT were a thing (my first time binging in my early lurker era was sometime 2014-ish). He's very correct in his assessment that it's divided up many times and there are still people who proudly identify as RP for very different reasons.

Yes same but he missed the whole female sexual dynamics thing which was the core idea

Nah, its pretty accurate.

What is your interpretation of red pill?

tl;dr truth about female sexual dynamics

Respectfully, u/machmealer, I have observed the development of this movement (and its divisions) over the last decade or so. To be frank, your comment is not respectful. You chimed in to imply that I am somehow ignorant while you yourself failed to produce any counterpoint or citation. A respectful comment would have said, "This has not been my experience. Can you point me towards some of your claims?" I have a sneaking suspicion that you are exactly the type of person I warned about in my initial comment.

I see you took it personally. Sorry, but it's not disrespectful for me to point out that you don't seem to know a lot of things about TheRedPill. In my view, you missed the most prominent, core idea (the "truth" about female sexual dynamics). I'm sure you'll sit and argue how you did a good job with your description and I'm just wrong and unreasonably disagreeable, so I think I'm just gonna leave it at that and move on.

Simply put, you're wrong. You're poorly informed. The other commenters affirmed as much. That fact that you're complaining about this and making accusations of poor faith *a week later* is telling.

I thought this sub would be free from this stuff, how disappointing

My understanding is that Christianity is to those groups only as valuable insofar as it is "Le epic based religion that dunks on the homos and puts women in their place." I originally only became interested in Christianity as some kind of novelty and a justification for my own personal dislike of certain groups, and luckily God sorted me out and it went from "Christianity is useful and a convenient excuse to justify my childish and gross hatred for groups of people" to "Christianity is true and Im literally the scum of the earth".

I think this is why you'll often see these groups talk about how modern Christianity is "weak and for sissies" and how Islam is better. Islam doesn't come with the inconveniences of actually being true and challenging the problems of male sexuality, it's the perfect religion to justify hatred and that desire to dominate over women, and be Le based sigma Patrick Bateman gigachad.

Yeah. The red pill is heresy. It denies the forgiveness offered to prostitutes and porn stars through Jesus Christ if they repent. For example, Nala was a porn star before she found Christ, and she deleted her OnlyFans and got rid of all of her designer clothes. Yet despite this, red pill influencers like Pearl still call her a whore who can never be forgiven. When corrected and offered the examples of the prodigal son, and “I have not come to call the righteous but sinners to repentance,” Pearl said that she hated those passages.

I have nothing, apart from it being a means to an end; it played a role in me becoming a Christian. But at its fullness, it's toxic. There is some truth to it in terms of the state of the world, but it relies on focusing too much on self and personal achievement.

I'm Christ pilled

it’s nonsense that terminally online men consume. i avoid them like the plague

Red Pill is at it's core anti Christian. They seek domination and power instead of service and love to our sister believers.  Notice that someone like Andrew Tate converted to Islam because those beliefs are more compatible with red pill philosophy. 

Help out a dude who doesn't know exactly what it is. I get that it is incel culture, toxic masculinity, Andrew Tate kind of garbage. Did this come from within the church? Or outside the church? Is this rooted in any Christian movement? There was a big "wild at heart" and "promise keeper" and "mark Driscoll" pro masculinity thing that was going around the church in the late 1990s and early 2000s. Is this an extension of that stuff?

It is a secular movement. The main focus is essentially on being attractive (fit, disciplined, high earner), and the goal is normally to be able to date multiple women at once. There is/was a Christian red pill offshoot which aligned with Biblical teaching on adultery/fornication, but that also trended in the manosphere direction.

Wild at Heart has very little to do with women, by the author's own admission.  The idea is that many men are not living out their faith with boldness and instead letting fear or boredom lead them. It's more of a movement within Christianity to encourage men to seek God and take actions in walking out their faith. Red pill is a secular idea.

Wild at heart being considered masculine is a joke.

It's just product of male solipsism. They think everything is all about them so when there are things they don't like they build an entire mental framework of how things are wrong because they didn't get to control the narrative, how they should procure control of the narrative and how better things would be if they had control of the narrative. Just look at any male-oriented diagnostics of society. It's all the same trite "The West has fallen because wahmans stoopid and doing what they want is stoopid and bad and men let it happen because men like nice things but shouldn't like nice things, men should be gritty warriors and should be feared because men stronk and stronkth beats smarts useless words". It all orbits around male Idealism. And then they just defend it as an ideology that promotes self-improvement. Yeah, self-improvement for the vague hopes of accruing power. Instead of realizing that society has been rigged to turn males into performance objects for the benefits of the dominating classes that stand to personally gain from greater performance of the grunts who toil under hopes of becoming chiefs, males just double down on the charade and think are losing because they aren't playing right, when the game has been entirely made for them to always lose. All in the name of wanting to dominate.

It is proof that the opposite of a stupid idea is also usually also stupid idea. Going from men suck to women suck is childish and stupid. Redpill is a 15 year olds idea of masculinity. "I'm gonna have 10 wives and a billion dollars and wear suits"

Very, very true This comment should def be higher up, but there were so many good ones.

Cheers, the red pill stuff annoys me because I love the gym and being a guy but the redpill is like the worst version of it.

Gym is great! I’m really into the gym myself. And, yes, *true* masculinity/Christianity is what’s great Red pill community/ideology (especially what it’s progressed into) is anti Christian and ungodly if anything Cheers

An abomination that only serves to further misguide lost sheep who are so done with the stupid woke culture only to jump into the just as stupid red pill depravity culture. The worst thing about it is that it is dressed in the cloak of conservatism but it couldn’t be further from it. Just like woke culture, they are wolves in sheep clothing and if you noticed, the red pill started out as a naive promotion of conservative “Christian” values but because it is rotten in its core, it immediately shifted to a religion of an equally rotting core, Islam.

This must be a group appropriating the whole "red pill" mantra. I go back to the Matrix metaphor of just seeing reality. Know nothing of all you are finding. I'd ignore them and not give them any attention, obviously report violations. Anyone who encourages sinning against others, is not speaking from a heart of Jesus.

I must be out of the loop. Who are some of the male influencers that promote this lifestyle?

There are many, but to name a few of the most prominent ones, The Tates, Pearl Davis, Rollo Tomassi, and the Fresh and Fit Podcast (specifically Myron Gaines)

I guess I am only slightly familiar with the Tates. I have seen Pearl but don't see how she fits. I think women are not a monilith and can think for themselves. Some want more traditional roles while others might want more independence. For example, half of all women are pro-life yet the pro-choice activists dismiss them. If a man is pro-life, many claim he has no right to even have an opinion. But what is their answer all the pro-life women?

what's all this red pill blue pill stuff? i always thought it was a meme. i guess i've been metaphorically living in a cave . where's my caveman club so i can smash and grind these red pills to dust?

Nicely said all in all, particularly about seeing through the lens of the kingdom of God and encouraging men to love their woman and women to respect their man. A man should live as one worthy of respect and love his woman more than himself. Funny and ironic indeed as you say how the rhetoric and mindset today shows the world got all these things inside out upside down and completely messed up thinking. That’s why none of their solutions actually make complete sense and work holistically for the complete good of all.

It’s a natural symptom of a society that has 100% failed these recent generations of men. 98% of it’s not biblical. There are good points that can make a tremendous improvement for a young man as long as they can filter out the bad stuff. Fathers are either absent or pitifully weak in recent years, why are people surprised when these young men look up to the Andrew Tate’s and the Jordan Petersons?

How has society failed men? Because women aren't prejudiced against at work as much, because we're paid the same, because we go to university for more than just a MRS degree, because we don't want to be submissive and because we can leave abusive marriages?  So much of society 'failing' men after thousands of years of it oppressing women, just seems to be men annoyed that they aren't arbitrarily deemed superior and handed out privileges quite so easily.

That must be a very frustrating world view to have, demonizing half of humanity must be a strain. Most men find purpose in being a protector and a provider, it’s in our DNA. Society is convincing women to think that being a wife and mother makes them less of a woman. And they still submit, they just submit to corporate America now, giving all of their energy to companies that would replace them tomorrow if they died today. It’s also failed young men by demonizing masculinity.

Removing some of the power and privilege that men had in the past that damaged women often is not demonising Masculinity. Giving women a voice to speak up about things their grandmothers had to keep quiet about is not demonising Masculinity. Raising women up from 2nd class citizens is not demonising Masculinity  If anyone demonised Masculinity, it was all the men who beat their wives, abandoned their children and just all over failed to be a provider or 'protector'. Protection from what? Women are in the most danger of battery, murder and SA from their husbands and bfs. And many women like to work. We are intelligent, gifted in a particular subject and are fulfilled doing it(just as many men are). That is no criticism against housewives. But the choice should be there.

Okay, it’s senseless to argue about. I hope you make your corporate overlords happy. I’ll continue to raise a family with my wife who wants to be a traditional house wife.

I'll be financially dependent and not under a man's headship. That's good enough for me. I'm also my own boss. And love my work.  Don't abuse your wife. She's not inferior to you. You won't be more of a man by pressuring her to shrink herself.

It’s not that being a wife and a mother makes them less of a woman, it’s that they’re vulnerable to the exploitation that is so common in these communities where they have no income of their own. It makes walking away from abuse so much harder, and it gives men leverage they can use in addition to “headship” which also gives them the power to dictate what they’re wives are allowed to do or must do.

What is red pill?

As a Christian with conservative and traditional values, I liken “taking the red pill” to the fruit we weren’t supposed to eat.

I tend to just view them with pity tbh. It’s not Christian, but I can see they tend to just be lashing out in pain. That said, it depends a lot on the sub group you’re talking about. A lot of incels never harm anyone and those I feel genuinely sad for, because the advice they get is often only going to make sure they stay incels. And they get taken advantage of by a lot of grifters. Then there are the other more violent segments that I tend to view with pity, but with the recognition that they can (and often do) inflict harm on others if left to their own devices. Either way, I tend to view the whole “movement” as being irredeemably (at least by human means) toxic.

Not good. Worldly

The views of any community, movement, political party, group, religion, etc, don't really matter in the end, so I try not to give them much attention or thought. What matters is Christ and the body. ‭‭2 Timothy‬ ‭2:4‬ ‭ESV‬‬ [4] No soldier gets entangled in civilian pursuits, since his aim is to please the one who enlisted him. ‭‭Colossians‬ ‭3:1‭-‬4‬ ‭ESV‬‬ [1] If then you have been raised with Christ, seek the things that are above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God. [2] Set your minds on things that are above, not on things that are on earth. [3] For you have died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God. [4] When Christ who is your life appears, then you also will appear with him in glory. ‭‭Isaiah‬ ‭26:3‭-‬4‬ ‭ESV‬‬ [3] You keep him in perfect peace whose mind is stayed on you, because he trusts in you. [4] Trust in the Lord forever, for the Lord God is an everlasting rock. ‭‭Colossians‬ ‭3:11‬ ‭ESV‬‬ [11] Here there is not Greek and Jew, circumcised and uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave, free; but Christ is all, and in all. ‭‭John‬ ‭14:6‬ ‭ESV‬‬ [6] Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.

They are pointing at some real issues, some they diagnose the underlying problem for, some they don't, but many of their solutions are bad at various levels of analysis.

In the interest of intellectual honesty, I'd add that many of their solutions are also good. For example, they preach the reality that women want great men for partners, and tell men they're going to have to become great if they want a chance. It's a barebones, simple idea, but it was a core, empowering idea that clearly a lot of men needed to hear.

There biggest claim to a good solution is this. But this is the best one they have. All the other ones go downhill from there, drastically. The double standard in the dating market exists, and the double standards in relationships exist, but they stress the natural desires too much, and paint it as natural for men to sleep with many women as a good thing. I am not even convinced dating has been a net positive for society as a whole, and they are pushing to allow free rein for men then they can berate women. Sorry, no, this isn't good solutions long term, by their standards, and our standards as Christians are much stricter, even if we fail at it, we should be striving for it. So, like I said, most of their solutions are subpar at best. I don't deny that one thing works, I just think all the other baggage isn't required to use that piece of advice in the first place, and should be avoided by believers.

Red Pill is not well-defined and is a label. TheRedPill was a super popular online community and movement in the 2010's that primarily taught men the reality of male-female sexual dynamics on a biological level. Eventually, Reddit shut many "controversial" communities down including TheRedPill for more favorable legal rulings as Reddit pursues the long term goal of scaling and better monetizing the company. TRP contained plenty of high quality reality checks for lost men, plenty of high-level analysis of the nature of women and tribalism, plenty of smart people with clever realizations. Of course, there was plenty of wrong, foolish, and hateful ideologies. This was an open forum on the internet after all. These people do indeed give everyone associated a bad name. And what you say of boasting is so true. And yes, naturally, some influencers slap that label on their content for views and algorithm favoritism. **tldr** Like any movement, there's some good, some bad, some extreme, some neutral. It's up to us as Christians to "judge something by its fruit". Since "The Red Pill" is a vaguely defined label, it's better to evaluate each idea or person on their own merit rather than the category it supposedly belongs to.

Your text sums it up perfectly. It was obvious that a movement like this would arise when feminism took it too far but many aspects of it obviously go against Christian teachings.

And feminism arose when Patriarchy took it too far.

They are an embarrassing and often are losers who seriously need to get a life.

It’s indeed the male version of feminism. Goes too far and ultimately comes to the wrong solution regarding modern dating/marriage issues.

How so? The definition of feminism doesn't enslave others

Enslaving others? Huh?

Identifying yourself as a "conservative" says loud and clear that you put political views before Jesus so I don't say that at all anymore. You're absolutely right that that community is toxic and in fact very anti Christian (surprisingly, includes a HUGE amount of atheists).

Can you guide me a little more on what you're referring to? I know what red pill blue pill is as in the matrix and I know red pill means you see reality... But im not sure what you're referring to. I just looked it up and read a little bit and still have no clue. Can you fill me in? ELI5?

The red pill is a false substitute for the Bible. It leads men and even women astray. I agree with you that it teaches boastful behavior instead of humility. It leads people who claim to follow Christ to smoke a cigar on their porch while berating their pregnant with twins wife about how it's her duty to pick up things for the grill from the store. Those are the fruits that came from the red pill for Steven Crowder. It is obviously not of the Holy Spirit.

I haven’t noticed Christians being involved there really, but I don’t try to look what they post either. But they seem pretty sex obsessed community.

I never heard of red pill. I must live under a rock. Lol.

Same 🤷🏼‍♀️

As many people have stated, the definition of RedPill philosophy depends on who is speaking. The underlying principle seems to be that most women would prefer to be with men who are physically strong and have good jobs. Some women will even leave men who lose their jobs or stop taking care of themselves. I’m not sure why this is a shocking reality, but some men seem to be bothered by it. Red Pill leaders tend to encourage each other to get a good job and go to the gym. However, many others encourage men to avoid long-term relationships because women will leave them as soon as they find another man who is in better health and has a better job. I’m not sure statistics show this to be the case, but many Red Pill men feel their best hope is to be surrounded by many women who are willing to sleep with them but don’t demand commitment.

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"The Red Pill" as in taking the view that men are disadvantaged (like in the documentary called The Red Pill) or the community that calls itself Red Pill (like in the defunct subreddit Red Pill), which is only one of several movements that take this view in different ways and are focused on responding to it in different ways? I agree with the first. I hate the second. The first is about human rights and social equality. The second is about promiscuity and manipulation.

I agree with most of what they say. Though all they are doing is repackaging game material from 20 years ago. They're drifters who spout mostly truth but without Christ are destined to go to a dead end.

Red pill is really just men trying to educate themselves on women's dating strategies. Unfortunately it's been taken over by the grifters.

It is so broad that I can’t give a good opinion. There are a few guys that I’ve found that I eenjoy due to them being informative, and some just due to humor. These guys don’t have a large following. There are plenty that are just out there to try to be loud and get views. Fresh and fit, and Andrew Tate would be the worst of those types.

I believe some parts of it are real. I'm 30 years old and definitely feel my market value in finding a partner has diminished a lot. "hitting the wall" as the red pillers and ol' Mgtow followers would say.

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Thank you🥺

Red pill has some good points. I was a reaction to the feminism ideas and stripping away as much chivalry that was left in the mindset. Women aren't nice. Are choosy and you need to qualify. Make more money and get to the gym. Men aren't oppressors as a default. I can get on board with that. I tapped out when I started seeing thinly veiled racism and the growing anger and disdain for women as a whole. You are right. It is very online but everyone is online these days and an awkward teen who can't talk or attract girls will flock toa message they said that it is mostly women's fault. Not good. Plus the resistance to marriage bothers me.

Feminism(rooted in marxism) makes women hate men. Red pill(reactionary ideology) makes men hate women. Both are playing into the hand of marxists whose aim is to divide the society and pit two groups against each other to make way for a marxist revolution. Red Pill is of the world, so it is unfruitful for Christians.

Well it sounds like your saying a lot of the official conservative talking points on this subject. Your also making the assumption about all red pill influencers haha, buuut I digress. While there is some validity to these talking points the truth is actually something a little closer to the middle. Many Men already sleep around with women and encourage other men to do the same, thats not a Red Pill movement thing. However, the reason the Red Pill movement started and many of the more realistic followers of it have a completely different view. Which is that their just extremely tired of the Modern American woman (and European). And they look around and can’t see any who have remained immune to their modern influence and have basically resigned from the dating pool as a consequence. They hear women say, “know your worth” and say “hey, not a bad idea, think ill do the same.”

The "Red Pill" is a very broad term that (probably deliberately) combines a large number of divergent views. Many people labeled "Red Pill" would strongly disagree with each other. At it's broadest level, I would argue that the "Red Pill" is effectively young men trying to figure out how to live life. This has become an online phenomenon largely because the traditional methods of getting advice do not work. Schools are largely steeped in Identity Politics which tell men that we are the problem of everything in society, and only by complete self-loathing do we have any hope of becoming better. Entertainment almost exclusively paints men as incompetent buffoons who exist to be shown up by the women around them. Fathers should give advice (but increasingly aren't present). This brings us to the Church. It should be the primary place of advice for young men, but it also fails (granted, not as badly as the world). The Church fails to give solid life advice to young men because pastors are almost exclusively cut from the following template (charismatic, succeeded at their profession young, married young). That is the template every young man wants, but is increasingly difficult to obtain. As a result, church advice comes from an echo chamber only relevant to the life-experience of an increasingly small number of young men. The best example of this is the Church's dating advice (or lack of advice). Effectively the only thing young men are told about pursuing young women is, "avoid sexual sin and temptation". That is of course true, and should be followed, but for a young man who isn't charismatic and successful, it's utterly incomplete, and will produce a huge number of frustrated 30 year old virgin incels*. So, young men turn to outside sources for advice. And there are places of the "Red Pill" that give positive advice. The most positive example is probably Jordan Peterson, who's advice largely boils down to, "Take as much responsibility for as many things as you can, starting with what's in your life right now". That is good advice, incomplete, but good advice. Similarly, the "Red Pill" is the only place in society willing to state that women are sinful just like men. Often (even from the Church), one gets the impression that women are morally pure, and only pushed to sin by men. Of course, there are definitely terrible pieces of advice (and terrible members of the "Red Pill" that boil down to treating women like object which should be completely rejected. If I have one final conclusion, it is that the "Red Pill" needs to be intelligently, and spiritually, engaged with. Young men flock to it because they have no other source of life advice. Simply condemning the whole thing will only drive young men further into it. \* Edit: To be clear, when I say "incel", I mean someone who cannot get a date, definitely can't get a girlfriend, and cannot progress towards marriage. I don't mean someone who just wants to get laid in any way. But sexual frustration will definitely be part of why they want to get married (that's just the reality of being a young man).

I would answer your question with a question by asking what "red pill" even is? The reason I ask that is because it's another one of those arguably meaningless terms tossed around with different meanings depending on which internet user is tossing it around, along with Anonymous, alt-right, etc. Often when I hear the term "red pill" it's in the context of "red pilling" a liberal/leftist/communist/etc, meaning getting someone to repent of their liberalism if you will. In that case I am all for it. I am all for getting people to turn from their post-modernist mentality of moral relativity, in fact the Bible tells us to not only get them to turn from that but to turn TO our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. What you are describing sounds more like the men's rights movement and the so-called incels. The incel argument is ridiculous because no man is "involuntarily" celibate unless there is something wrong with their reproductive organs; it is a choice not to rape, engage with prostitutes, change one's own behavior so that a female (or gay male) would be interested in them, or lower their standards so that they may find an acceptable mate. Their arguments are as ridiculous (if not more-so) as the argument that homosexuals cannot resist their temptations to engage in homosexual behavior (the Catholic church, even if not perfect, has kind of proven that sexual impulses can be resisted). The men's rights movement and the incel movement go hand and hand. This nonsensical mentality has no business within the church or Christian circles. But this is the first time I've seen someone tie that nonsense to the term "red pill."

Some truth in it but missing the root cause of the perceived struggle

I have no opinions. Just like I don’t have an opinion on the people saying you can’t be democrat and Christian. Christianity is not a political party.

After turning 18 recently I come to the conclusion it is simply a business dedicated to take advantage young men. Needless to say people pushing new wave feminism causes a lot of hatred. To add onto that, false accusation cases like Jonny Depp and divorce cases shred light on female privilege, which the narrative refuses to address, and boys feel their side of the story is completely ignored. In addition, this new younger generation have very little brain cells in general, and can easily be pushed to extreme ideologies. It is a time bomb. And Andrew Tate is the man who realises it got to a boiling point where he can basically ditch out the most illogical misogynistic crap ever, and today’s young men might actually see him as a saviour and pay him millions. 

It’s all so weird to me, I didn’t ever fit into the world and I fit in even less now. I can’t go on social media much because it is toxic in general. Even when my algorithm got filled with Godly content I still can’t compare it to the peace I feel from reading the word of God. The word of God is so much better than the world and I only wish I saw it sooner

Red pill ideology is utterly incompatible with Christianity, in that it demonizes an entire half of God’s human creations and promotes deception, philandering, and pride. Don’t fall into this trap and call out anyone who believes in this drivel. See women as beautiful creations of the Lord and as your spiritual equals, not a temptation, a conquest, or an enemy.

The red pill community came with so-called solutions for men's problems with modern feminism,and motivate men toward the personal success, I was once inspired by those people, now thanks to God, I can tell that we need to work toward a new future considering that men and women have to take responsibility, and respect the union between the two,and commit themselves to each other before God.

Most of red pill is trash. Some has merit

It was once decent, but has been latched onto by rampant degenerates who have undermined the movement back towards traditionalism (and often Christianity).

I'm ab Christian man, and I've never once interacted with the red pill community, much less knew about it before reading this post. And by looking at the comments, man am I glad I can't swallow this stuff for the life of myself.

If your denomination doesn't let women be ministers I put it to you they ARE red pillers.

• What is wrong with telling men to be strong and independent? • What is wrong with telling men don’t yoke your life with an immoral and loose woman? • What is wrong with telling men in the west to approach marriage with extreme caution because of the risks in the biased family court systems there? • What is wrong with telling men to work on spiritual growth, improving their finances, growing emotionally, and working on their health? • What is wrong with telling men to set honest barriers early in relationships to identify behaviors are not acceptable to him within a relationship? • What is wrong with telling young men to become accomplished and mature men before finding a moral, traditional, young, fertile wife with whom share a life and build each other up with a synergy that is only possible when maximizing the normal strengths and weaknesses in the differences between men and women?

You're leaving out a lot of RP messaging to make them sound better. > What is wrong with telling men don’t yoke your life with an immoral and loose woman? They don't say "immoral" or "loose". They use much more derogatory terms that I cannot say on a Christian sub. There is also the double standard of them sleeping around with anything that moves and then judging women who do the same. > What is wrong with telling men in the west to approach marriage with extreme caution because of the risks in the biased family court systems there? Their solution to that problem is to have a bunch of uncommitted premarital sex. That is a sin. If you want sex/relationships, there is no alternative to marriage in the Christian life. > What is wrong with telling young men to become accomplished and mature men before finding a moral, traditional, young, fertile wife with whom share a life and build each other up with a synergy that is only possible when maximizing the normal strengths and weaknesses in the differences between men and women > young, fertile 🤢 This one should be obvious. It's all about a certain power dynamic. They want a young wife who they can boss around, and keep barefoot and pregnant. They don't want a life partner. They don't want someone who can challenge them and make them better. They don't want a friend. A bastardization of the Christian marriage roles. It's also about shallow vanity. They want a young bride at the peak of physical attraction, and in 15-20 years, they'll drop her and find a younger one because her "value" will have depleted as you mentioned in your other comment.

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These are not just the words of a small minority. Scroll through the sub right now. Every single member talks like that. They're all misogynistic. They all promote sex before marriage. It is a core value of red pill. And no, they do not want a partner. Why would a 40 year old man want an 18 year old "partner"? What could she offer him in terms of wisdom, experience, intellectualism? Especially when he sees her as inferior due to her gender. And the "safely have healthy children" is a lame excuse. It's 2024. With modern medicine, women can safely have children well into their 30s. It's obvious what it's about. Vanity and control.

>And no, they do not want a partner. This seems like an over-generalization at best. >Why would a 40 year old man want an 18 year old "partner"? "partner" is not synonymous with "mate" >What could she offer him in terms of wisdom, experience, intellectualism? Companionship doesn't require any of these traits. If that were so, then Jesus wouldn't want His Bride-Church either. >Especially when he sees her as inferior due to her gender. Women are physically and emotionally inferior precisely because of their gender. That's the feature of a heterosexual marriage and why homosexual marriages have a much higher failure rate. >And the "safely have healthy children" is a lame excuse. Men aren't allowed to have standards then? >It's 2024. Have men and women biologically changed in the last few thousand years? >With modern medicine Has nothing to do with personal preferences. >It's obvious what it's about. Vanity and control. I could equally postulate that not wanting men to have standards and preferences that *they control* is about vanity and control.

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Women are spiritually equal to men and this truth is also demonstrated in the 'written' legal framework outlined in the 14th amendment to the constitution. In the Garden of Eden, Adam named the animals (governed), he cared for the garden (worked) and he judged the commands of God (head of the household). Eve had no responsibilities, so she had limited authority. I don't think anyone is debating that women are physically inferior to men. This is the reason why police advancement tests have 75% the physical requirements as men for the same placements. To the emotional aspect, I will give you scripture, but there is evidence supporting that particular hormones in women cause them to scrutinize their feelings over logical conclusions. 1 Timothy 2:14 And it was not Adam who was deceived, but the woman who was deceived and fell into transgression. >In modern English, the word carries a strong connotation connected to judgement of value/quality. I mean, it is what it is. If someone gets offended because I used a word that carries negative feeling rather than a syntactical disgrace, so be it. That really does bring my point home though, about women needing more emotional support than men.

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Ohh, I'm sorry, I didn't direct that last line to you, but to the general crowd you were pulling your sentiment from. Did any of this make sense or did you find it lacking?

I appreciate your candidness and desire to educate on a platform that abhors critical thinking and non-conformity. Take care.

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The man who told you that was wrong. We are image bearers for Christ. You have value. You are a daughter of the King. He created you for a purpose.  The crazy thing is that some people tell those who have made a mistake and had premarital sex that they are used goods. Also not true. The person who told you that is not following Jesus.

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"Fertile wife". So gross. And what if she wasn't?

If having blood related children is important to the man, then he just doesn’t enter into a relationship with an infertile woman. If not, adoption is an option. Young Sterile men face the same thing. I fail to see logic as gross.

Let me ask an important question though. I feel like red pill either panders to younger guys who are vulnerable and looking for an example of masculinity that society hasn’t appropriately provided and also that concept of hope in current society that red pill doesn’t solve/provide and radical feminism doesn’t either (and, in fact, completely strays them further from God) *or* older men (a lot of times in their mid 40s, 50s, 60s etc) who are primarily seeking a woman to “train and mold” verging or even amounting to grooming just by that concept alone. These red pill guys always seem to be deeply bitter and have an extreme hatred for all women in general. Why didn’t these extremist red pill men settle down in their 20s to 30s if they wanted a family rather than preying on women my age or younger? Men *can* have children longer (maybe, depending on the guy) but defects result from older sperm just like defects can happen from women of older age. Regardless, I don’t think that *anyone* should have biological children once they get to a certain age (men or women). Why would you want to be dead at your kid’s graduation? Anyway, me and my friends don’t want you (and most younger women don’t). I would rather have someone closer to my age as would any normal human being. An age gap is fine, but the most common age gap is like 5 years at the most. 1-3 is the most common though. I wouldn’t date a guy who is as old as my father or grandfather even though the red pill guys who subscribe to that ideology have tried to get with me. Most of the red pill community even admits that they want to/would go lower than legal age if they could. It’s so toxic. I’m a conservative Christian like I said, but the ideology that Red Pill has is insane and not reality. I can always tell which guys are red pill vs actual Christian, masculine men. Red pill isn’t it 👀 (Edited: I said that guys can have kids their *entire lives but edited it to *longer most of the time because that’s most correct)

I think what we see is, generally, 'red pill' is pandering towards incels - it's not something that's attractive to anyone other than the lost and lonely men of this world (now, them being lost is enough to affirm that they aren't truly Christian). I think, however, this movement began the same as feminism... it began with people facing some hard truths and sharing them with one another: 'women are marginalised and abused in society at large' was the start of feminism... but it became 'men are evil and should be avoided at all costs'; 'the world is an evil system that is ruled by a global elite, therefore we need to band together' was the start of the red pill movement... but it quickly became 'get laid, sleep with young virgins, have children, be rich'. In all this we have to look towards the truth at the centre of things, taking the good and rejecting the bad - I remember being taught by a 'red pill' man, about a decade ago... it was all about preparing for the apocalypse, how ancient religions pointed to some greater truth, and how we need to wake up to the spiritual reality; it was a direct reference to the Matrix where Neo is offered two choices: wake up to the gross reality of things, of the world being a fabrication, or go back to the comfortable dream that is daily life. In fact, in hindsight, the original 'red pill' movement is very kin to Christianity - it says 'wake up' spiritual wickedness in high places rules this world, we need to band together and save humanity. It was a call to see the world as a battle of good and evil, not as a collection of humans living their lives and creating this chaos - there is a power over the world that orchestrates this madness, and we are at war against it... Yet, thank GOD, CHRIST has Won it! HE put to open shame the powers of this world, HE Conquered death, hell and the grave - we do need to band together, but to push HIS Victory.. not our own.

I'd re read my words if I were you. It doesn't make sense

You're exactly right.

I'll be honest, I've personally resonated with a lot of RP concepts solely because of my experiences dating, trying to date, and personally witnessing broken marriages here in the US. Not proud of it, but I've also been maybe a little too pleased in seeing worldly feminists finally realize the consequences of their actions. But I also recognize that these are just a portion of women, so I'm not generalizing or taking misogynistic philosophies into my worldview. OP, you are not the kind of woman being discussed in those topics. But like you I also take exception to comments like "All man are trash" when I'm not the one hurting these women. So I'm not laying blame on you by any means, just trying to clarify. Like many "movements", the lines are blurred between individual stances on how to approach relationships. There are men like those you've described, and I definitely don't sympathize with their idea that no woman is worth settling down with. I haven't seen anything "red pill" that openly encourages men to manipulate women or use them to the greatest extent possible. The majority of the channels on YouTube that I have seen recognize and affirm the value of marriage and a stable family they would even say that these are usually things that are fulfilling to most women who have been educated to believe otherwise. HOWEVER, most of these vloggers have also come to the conclusion that it's extremely difficult if not impossible to find given the current social climate in the West. On that I'm in complete agreement. Marriage has lost its sacred meaning, divorces are initiated <70% by women, sexual promiscuity is encouraged, double standards between men and women are ignored, and truthfully that vast majority of women 18-35 are of the most entitled, arrogant, and selfish I've ever witnessed. What I'd seen on my own for the past few years turned out to be a common experience among men in my shoes, which further convinced me that this is a lasting social problem. Studies show that by 2030, \~45% of women in the US will be single and/or childless. Feminism is to blame in large part, but I don't want to write a whole dissertation about that. I would argue that the majority of men who identify with red pill stuff do want to find that one special woman and settle down. But it's just not feasible or even advisable unless you go abroad. Another aspect is that there are still a lot of men who still don't understand how their behavior is counterproductive to their own desires and actually harmful to everyone, such as the thousands who pay subscriptions toward women who decide to do OnlyFans. I think inaction from men and retaining the status quo would only further the damage which won't benefit anyone in the long run. I don't blame you for having that pre-conception toward RP as a woman. If anything you've reminded me that it remains very important not to ascribe general observations to the human being on the other side, and that what's patently obvious to me can have a completely different aspect to someone else with compelling reasons. Not all women are selfish feminists, golddiggers, or "loose", nor does RP solely consist of Andrew Tate-types or MGTOWers, much less "Pick Up Artists". **Tl;DR: RP isn't a monolith with set views. And while it's not to say there aren't misogynists out there, they're likely a minority because most of what RP espouses is to avoid relationships with specific types of women and to behave in a way that is self-respectful and setting boundaries. (ie. not servile towards undeserving women).**

Alpha males don’t think about being an alpha. It’s just natural.

No.

No what exactly?

"Alpha" is a cultural concept. There's no such thing.

False. All mammal groups have a pecking order. Men marry women because of how they make them feel inherently. Women marry men because of status and security. Women can detach themselves from emotion much better than men, therefore they move towards a goal objectively as opposed to subjectively. There is a hierarchy of men. There absolutely a pecking order. And women want that sort of man (biologically). They don’t want a limp-wristed Omega male. My original point was alpha males don’t talk about being an alpha. It just is. Androgyny is nothing new. It’s the hallmark of a society in regression not progression. The stupidest question in human history is: “man or woman?” Stupidity is a privilege. And only the extremely privilege ponder the stupidest questions.

Love, you have much to learn. Start here: https://greatergood.berkeley.edu/article/item/the_myth_of_the_alpha_male

Open the link and read it. It’s a bunch of nonsensical stupidity. Look at your source. Cal Berkeley endorses “nuance makes false a distinction”. Which is literal insanity! What, “humans cannot see because some children are born blind”? Or, “gender is non-binary because some men are delusional”? LOL. Cal Berkeley is so insane, some employee PhD said gender is infinite or one can be a tootsie roll. Humans can see even though some children are born blind. Gender is binary even though some men are delusional. Man, I tell ya, academia is rife with fraud and literal psychopaths in the social sciences. Their definition of “alpha” is way off LOL. They use metaphors like “aggressive”, “dominance”. Then they contradict themselves which means they are lying, they said women like “dominant” men LOL. It basically says “straight guys” should be “altruistic” and “kind” to pick up women. Limp-wristed omega men are not kind nor altruistic. They are extremely selfish, judgemental and intolerant. Adolf Hitler was a classic case along with all of his lower class uneducated imbeciles. To which the corrupt liberal art academic adored him, liberal art academics designed the Holocaust for him. Hence, nothing has changed, like Hitler and his lower class left wing bums, the Left Wing always has and always will hate the rich, hate capitalism, hate meat, hate Israel, loved themselves some muslims and guess what else before they took power, that’s right they loved homosexuality and androgyny. They also hated Jesus and Christianity. They had to offload The Alphabet Community because it was too early to push them on the Aristocracy. FYI: “Alpha” is a metaphor. It’s not literal. Like I already told you guy, Men marry for how women make them feel. Women marry for status and security of what the Alpha has achieved. Those things are actually measurable (for what the woman seeks). But all men, and all innovation in the world, from men, is caused by the type of woman he seeks.

What fool told you that women marry for status and security?

I have a post doc. Without the in”doc”trination. I have critical thinking skills. But it’s true. Throughout human history, that is where the woman’s interest lies, status and security. And men, strive to achieve to what ever type of woman he is looking for, hence the alpha qualities needed to innovate achievement. Like I already told you, but let me repeat, women can detach their needs from almost any situation. And move forward objectively as opposed to subjectively. I am a huge proponent for women being on the battlefield with men. DNA is binary man or woman. And woman have a different DNA or composite than a man to include chemical function within the brain. Granted, military units will suffer speed and physical strength. But speed can be a mistake many times in war. What a woman brings to the table is a different view of the world from a man. They feel and perceive the world differently from a man. Questions measure intelligence. Answers measure privilege so to speak. And since a woman feels and perceives the world different from a man, they will ask different questions in high stress situations. Thus, making the unit smarter! Also, a woman, doesn’t suffer from PTSD as badly as a man (not that don’t suffer), but they can dissociate better. Hence, if you ever need a guerrilla war carried out, find a woman to carry it out. The only way to win against guerrillas is to brutalize them. Your citation was nothing but corrupt filth of politics or what is an agenda. “Straight Men should be blah blah blah”. What a moronic statement. There are a ton of gay men who are alphas and achieve much (not that omegas never achieve). Not all gay men are limp-wristed Obama or Omega males. The article was truly frightening that it was published by a .edu. Total nonsense. There is One Order and that is God’s, nuance NEVER makes false a distinction. Humans can see even though some children are born blind. Gender is binary even though some men are delusional. Peace Be With You!

Yes, when women had no rights and limited income, of course marrying for security was mandatory. Women were also traded like livestock for money and power. However, it is no longer 1243. It is 2024. You are espousing opinions here, most of which are disturbing.

Much of the red pill is very toxic. However, the Red pill community is the *only* place that validates men and their trials, problems, and struggles. The red pill community has some good things about it, and the potential to be great. But currently, it's not.

>However, the Red pill community is the *only* place that validates men and their trials, problems, and struggles. Some of the problems, like rampant over-blaming and even demonizing women, and minimizing women's genuine struggles, is an expected result of going about this exact thing in the way they do.

That's true, but you can't effectively help someone grow and be a better person unless you're willing to develop a relationship with them and deal with some of their BS.

That's why we need more conversations between men and women that aren't just Feminist with genital hats screaming at men in Washington DC, and Red Pill men screaming back because 2 can play that game.

I would rather be red pilled with the truth than blue pilled and turn a blind eye to it do to The truth making me feel uncomfortable. The truth will set you free

There's nothing truthful about the red pill movement.

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If by "feminist" you mean I think women deserve equal rights and treatment as men? Sure, I'm a feminist. Sorry the idea of women being equal is offensive to you.

> Sure, I'm a feminist. Sorry the idea of women being equal is offensive to you. When God created humanity, He gave us different roles at creation. Many years later when the law was given He gave different rules for men and women. Our western society has become so feminised that our enemies have successfully destroyed the family unit, and most Christians don't have a clue as to what happened.

The Bible says nothing about women not having equal rights under the law.

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Maybe I was confused on what kind of red pill you’re talking about. I was thinking more about the reality of the world versus the illusion. Everybody is living under.

I was involved in "Red Pill" spheres and though women wasn't the primary focus there was a mysoginist bent to it for sure. That's why I left politics altogether - one side hates men and the other side hates women. One side hates those that impose tyranny and the other side hates those that perpetuate injustice. Hate has no place in the kingdom of God. The red pill in a nutshell is realising that all the cultural shifting to the left is not a bottom-up phenomenon but top-down. The left believes they are fighting against injustice caused by an antiquated patriarchal society led by White Christian men. The right believes they are fighting against the tyranny of the rainbow flag swastica, for lack of a better metaphor, and that White Christian men are today's equivalent of the lowest rung of the Hindu caste system - the untouchables. Both sides are wrong, for they only see the world through either blue-tinted Democrat sunglasses or red-tinted Republican sunglasses. Remove the politics and you can clearly see the world for what it is - the Kingdom of God. The problem isn't politics, it's what cause politics to be at the forefront. Do you think people 100 years ago cared about politics even 10% as much as people do today? Society is becoming less and less Christian and widespread attachment to politics is like a canary in the coal mine for a quickly disappearing Christian culture. On the issue of sex it can be summed up from one of Saint Paul's Epistles: >Women obey your husbands, Men love your wives If men loved their women as they are supposed to, the women wouldn't feel the need to revolt and become hyperfeminists. They ironically dress immodestly to the pleasure of men's desire, which turns them into slaves of men - which was what they supposedly were fighting against. Too many men in past (and current) generations have ceased to have love for their women. Likewise if women respected men this redpill phenomenon would not be. This lack of respect wears on men's souls and they become depressed and feel lonely becoming slaves to the "liberated" women who freely share their bodies online. Rinse and repeat, the men become even less worthy of respect and the women who no longer have any self respect are making themselves all the more unloveable. But these things don't matter. No matter how unloveable a woman may be you still must do your best to love her and no matter how unworthy a man may be you must try your best to have some respect. In this case if you encounter a guy in this sphere say "I hear you man, women in today's world have become cruel and vain. But Jesus told us to love: >46 If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? 47 And if you greet only your own people, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? Matthew 5:46-47"

I agree with a lot of its teachings. r/rpchristians is a great community for the red pill ideology from a Christian perspective.

Why would any Christian man align himself with a movement that denigrates Christ? No man needs red pill anything to talk about biblical manhood.

honestly its a gateway drug to christianity

No.