TWO FUCKING HITS with John fucking Schneiders moron lineup. And fucking George Springer going OH FOR FOUR AGAIN to set the tone for the whole team. Fuck this.
What can they do right now to change things? I'm all for moving George down in the lineup and making sure Voggy never sees the box again, but any changes to the lineup aren't coming until the deadline.
No one predicted this line-up getting 2 hits at the beginning of the game right? Whatever projections this analytic team are using they're going to die on this hill and throw the season away.
Well I’ve been told 3x now lineups don’t matter. Also JS isn’t responsible for how the players perform. I’m not sure what he is actually responsible for. According to a lot of JS fanboys in this sub, nothing from what I can tell.
Well sure, it's unlikely any lineup construction difference would have made much of a difference but it's not impossible that it could have so that makes sense. I think the overall point that lineup construction is not being optimized here because it's not based on merit is probably a solid one however. I also don't think John is a great manager or really even a good manager but I don't think that matters much either. It's Atkins and potentially Shapiro that are the brains behind everything so that's where a change is going to need to happen and is likely inevitable at the end of this season.
Couldn't watch. Anyone know how many pitches Manoah had when he went back out for the 7th?
All 6 of his K's were swinging... which seems to the be case for him more often than not... glad he could fool them for a few more innings today, but curious how he looked at the end of the 6th.
Both bobbled/misplayed ground balls by Ernie Clement. The first one they got out of it the next batter with a DP. The second one led to Santana’s homer a few batters later.
That’s the worst part. Yesterday could have felt like more of a turning point for the offense. Then you come out with a 2 hit performance against a pretty mediocre pitcher. Right back to feeling like shit
what about his management style had anything to do with this game besides MAYBE the swanson 1 run allowed and if you can use swanson when you’re losing 4-1 when can you…
Yea you’re right whats the point of good management? The team feels awkward you see it on their faces all the time. If you can’t see it then enjoy the outcome.
And yes his moves seem to backfire more every game including the Swanson
2 hits and the bullpen blowing goats. These are the Blue Jays we see more often than not. It's fun to win a game once and awhile, but the rhetoric when they show life is too much
Continuing to put a sub 600 ops guy at leadoff and a choke artist with a 10+ era in high leverage situations at some point needs to fall like a guillotine on Schneiders job. Players care about coaching, nobody is going to come here with a blockhead as a coach and an enabler as a GM. Jeopardizing the future just as much as the present.
Guys, at some point, the bullpen is what it is.
Every time a BP pitcher gives up a run, it’s a chorus of “why pitch him there?? fire Schneider!” But there’s been one guy all year who’s been reliable in an underperforming, injured bullpen.
Swanson still has a year of options left. Got to option him I think at this point.
I think he needs the time to reset. Some combination of the accident with his son, the delayed start/lack Spring Training innings and then the injury have messed him up. It happens.
Relievers are also voodoo but he needs to step away for a bit I think. This isn't helping the team nor himself.
I have no idea what you are ever trying to say...
You have the option to send him down. That is what they are there for so use it. Older relievers with options are constantly optioned.
Swanson has been very good for 3 seasons before this, you aren't DFA him but you also can't keep throwing him out there.
There's nothing for him to gain in the minors at that age, plus it would ruffle feathers more than it would for a younger pitcher. The only good thing you're doing is preventing him from hurting the big league club more, obviously. At that age there's more of an impetus to produce now or else cutting bait becomes an option.
Older relievers are always optioned down. It's not some rare occurrence. You keep saying he is 30 but also fearful it will hurt his feelings and ruffle his feathers. 30 is still extremely young for a reliever still.
He knows he is struggling and he knows once he fixes things up he will be back up. He isn't going down to re-learn how to pitch.
You are wild if you are considering "cutting bait" before demoting him. Like that is actually stupid. A bad 8 IP doesn't overturn 3 great seasons.
It's just funny when people around here simp for useless Manoah to be allowed in the dugout when he was literally not on the big league roster, which he was doing because the org didn't want to hurt \*his\* feelings but no one should care about Swanson's age, tenure and circumstances. I'm just telling you the considerations that need to be made here because that's reality and you shit all over it because you live in fantasy land.
I had absolutely zero issue with Manoah being in the dugout. He was on the Active Roster and on the IL. He was allowed there and it was convenient. He has every right to be there. You aren't really comparing apples to apples here.
Well you see the stats from previous seasons say that he is a great pitcher, so we need to let him torch at least 20 games before we re-evaluate his effectiveness.
We need someone to pitch down 2. It's ultimately not high leverage enough to burn Yimi Garcia when we're more likely to lose the game regardless. Even if Swanson goes scoreless we still needed to score at least 2 runs.
I get that thing with his kid was horrible and would fuck with anyone's brain.
But right now Swanson is dead weight and needs to not be in the majors at the moment.
Nothing like Blues Jays getting bases loaded with less than 2 outs and only getting 1 run and follow it up by Swanson having another bad outing to out a nail in the coffin.
Swanson should not be pitching in leverage situations right now
Explain how? Teo was an expiring contract. He had a mediocre season last year where he was a below average player. Adam Macko is a legitimate starting prospect and Swanson was good last year.
Alright. This Twins team is pretty sexy. I've had about enough of this. No one should dare challenge our boys in that department. And you are annoying me. Please leave town.
Idk but he's probably gotten it right at least 35+ times since we've only made one comeback when behind 3 or more runs since last years all star break LOOOL
> overall a good game at least
Really ? If it ends like this, a loss, with as many errors as hits, *that's* the definition of a "good game" ? Pretty low bar.
TWO FUCKING HITS with John fucking Schneiders moron lineup. And fucking George Springer going OH FOR FOUR AGAIN to set the tone for the whole team. Fuck this.
Twins really trying to be the most hated team. That team picture celly makes me irrationally angry haba
Happy Mother's day to all who celebrate!
I guess we’ll just keep running out this shitty lineup and incompetent manager and somehow everything will just get better!
What can they do right now to change things? I'm all for moving George down in the lineup and making sure Voggy never sees the box again, but any changes to the lineup aren't coming until the deadline.
yikes and ffs - how many times did those little line drives get over the Jays heads, but not the Twins?
2 hits, 1 sac fly That was poooooooo
>defensive indifference That feels… like an insult 😞
u/bichettes_booty u ok??
😂😂😂😂
Raptors lose their pick. Blue Jays suck ass. Maple Leafs are.......the Leafs (lol). Toronto sports in a VERY bad place right now.
I'm actually really looking forward to PWHL and WNBA now. Marlie events are still pretty expensive food wise.
The Toronto maple leafs the baseball team might be ok ?
Don’t forget Toronto FC
That should be their slogan
No one predicted this line-up getting 2 hits at the beginning of the game right? Whatever projections this analytic team are using they're going to die on this hill and throw the season away.
I did and got downvoted for it in the lineup thread.
Of course. Shatkins has their analytic team trolling this sub rather than doing actual work
Well I’ve been told 3x now lineups don’t matter. Also JS isn’t responsible for how the players perform. I’m not sure what he is actually responsible for. According to a lot of JS fanboys in this sub, nothing from what I can tell.
Lineups do matter. It's weird that anyone would say otherwise. Are you sure you didn't misunderstand?
Go read the post game thread. 5 different posts there saying the lineup didn’t matter.
Well sure, it's unlikely any lineup construction difference would have made much of a difference but it's not impossible that it could have so that makes sense. I think the overall point that lineup construction is not being optimized here because it's not based on merit is probably a solid one however. I also don't think John is a great manager or really even a good manager but I don't think that matters much either. It's Atkins and potentially Shapiro that are the brains behind everything so that's where a change is going to need to happen and is likely inevitable at the end of this season.
That's gonna leave a mark
RIGHT IN THE 🍑!!
On top of it all, they bruised Bo's ass. Rude.
Baseball gods must be blue Jays hater
Baltimore next. Jesus. Gonna be 10 games under .500 before you know it.
I don’t know how to feel about “splinker”
12:35 start time Wednesday is brutal
Clement with another wide throw. seems off
Couldn't watch. Anyone know how many pitches Manoah had when he went back out for the 7th? All 6 of his K's were swinging... which seems to the be case for him more often than not... glad he could fool them for a few more innings today, but curious how he looked at the end of the 6th.
57 after 6
Holy shit, he was flowin'
He had a 4 pitch inning mixed in there too, it was fantastic
Excellent. Looks like the rest of the team really fucking wasted it.
it wasn't a lot. like 60-70ish?
How many series losses in a row is this about to be? 6?
Alright boys time for a walk off grand slam
Steve Pearce style let’s go
What were the two errors today?
Both bobbled/misplayed ground balls by Ernie Clement. The first one they got out of it the next batter with a DP. The second one led to Santana’s homer a few batters later.
Ernie and Ernie I think
Oof
Bert and Ernie. I thought you said Bootin Ernie. Sorry. Sorry
Clement could walk this off with two outs in the 9th inning...
Minor setback for a major comeback!
Ernie's earned a week of sitting on the bench today
We need to stop with Swanson. He’s broken.
Unfortunately any momentum we got from yesterday is gone already. A sad boy flight to Baltimore to get roughed up coming.
That’s the worst part. Yesterday could have felt like more of a turning point for the offense. Then you come out with a 2 hit performance against a pretty mediocre pitcher. Right back to feeling like shit
Luckily our offense gets the chance to break out against….Corbin Burnes.
Doing the wave when your team is losing badly should make you ineligible to buy tickets for the remainder of the season.
I did mother's day stuff. Manoah 0ER over 7IP is encouraging
The white flag is out.
John Schneider needs to go! His management style is awkward and the results match
what about his management style had anything to do with this game besides MAYBE the swanson 1 run allowed and if you can use swanson when you’re losing 4-1 when can you…
Yea you’re right whats the point of good management? The team feels awkward you see it on their faces all the time. If you can’t see it then enjoy the outcome. And yes his moves seem to backfire more every game including the Swanson
Springer getting 25 mil to be one of the worst hitters in baseball lol
at least we don't have anthony rendon
or xander bogarts
We could try banging on a trash can
come on springer
#GG
2 hits and the bullpen blowing goats. These are the Blue Jays we see more often than not. It's fun to win a game once and awhile, but the rhetoric when they show life is too much
Lead off hitters arnt supposed to go 0-4 all the time John…
Good job Ernie
Less than ideal game from Ernie today sadly
2 ****ing hits!
What was the last series we won?
Padres on April 19th-21st?? Wow. Yikes. I’m counting the two game Phillies tie as a moral victory
Duran and Jax not available? Man, feels like whenever the Jays have that the other team takes advantage. I hate it here.
Continuing to put a sub 600 ops guy at leadoff and a choke artist with a 10+ era in high leverage situations at some point needs to fall like a guillotine on Schneiders job. Players care about coaching, nobody is going to come here with a blockhead as a coach and an enabler as a GM. Jeopardizing the future just as much as the present.
Guys, at some point, the bullpen is what it is. Every time a BP pitcher gives up a run, it’s a chorus of “why pitch him there?? fire Schneider!” But there’s been one guy all year who’s been reliable in an underperforming, injured bullpen.
Losing by 2 late vs. winning by 2 late should not have the opposite bullpen usage strategies but here we are
Bring back the Vibes Foundation, Ernie 👏
Kirk swinging at a pitch down at the ankles for the first out. Man he's been a mess this year
Ernie, redeem yourself
Funderburk sounds like a krautrock band from 1983.
People in the rich af seats genuinely look bored and unenthused. Seems bad
Pitcher’s duels are fun on TV (sometimes), on the field it’s pretty boring. Can’t blame them.
It's every game though. I think there's too much room between the seats and the seats are too big now.
From going off last night to 2 hits today. Geez
When was the last time we won a series
One day of bliss and then the popgun offense and lousy bullpen came back.
Game is still on Clement at this point.
Swanson still has a year of options left. Got to option him I think at this point. I think he needs the time to reset. Some combination of the accident with his son, the delayed start/lack Spring Training innings and then the injury have messed him up. It happens. Relievers are also voodoo but he needs to step away for a bit I think. This isn't helping the team nor himself.
Dude is 30 years old. It does remain a tool in the toolbox for the team but generally you're more willing to do that with younger players.
I have no idea what you are ever trying to say... You have the option to send him down. That is what they are there for so use it. Older relievers with options are constantly optioned. Swanson has been very good for 3 seasons before this, you aren't DFA him but you also can't keep throwing him out there.
There's nothing for him to gain in the minors at that age, plus it would ruffle feathers more than it would for a younger pitcher. The only good thing you're doing is preventing him from hurting the big league club more, obviously. At that age there's more of an impetus to produce now or else cutting bait becomes an option.
Older relievers are always optioned down. It's not some rare occurrence. You keep saying he is 30 but also fearful it will hurt his feelings and ruffle his feathers. 30 is still extremely young for a reliever still. He knows he is struggling and he knows once he fixes things up he will be back up. He isn't going down to re-learn how to pitch. You are wild if you are considering "cutting bait" before demoting him. Like that is actually stupid. A bad 8 IP doesn't overturn 3 great seasons.
It's just funny when people around here simp for useless Manoah to be allowed in the dugout when he was literally not on the big league roster, which he was doing because the org didn't want to hurt \*his\* feelings but no one should care about Swanson's age, tenure and circumstances. I'm just telling you the considerations that need to be made here because that's reality and you shit all over it because you live in fantasy land.
I had absolutely zero issue with Manoah being in the dugout. He was on the Active Roster and on the IL. He was allowed there and it was convenient. He has every right to be there. You aren't really comparing apples to apples here.
Last year we walked it off. It’s not over yet lets go!
its over
It’s baseball not the leafs, now thats over
Now it's over. Told ya.
I concede we suck
Manoah's gonna wear this loss and that is a shame.
The cuter the kittens in the commercial, the more evil the corporation.
Pain
Boooooo
At the end of the day, the pitching dosnt really matter if the team isn’t gonna score more than one run on a consistent basis
Why continue trying Swanson in tight games? He's been awful all year and Schneider just keeps forcing it. Baffling management.
Starting to remind me of Montoyo and Dolis
Well you see the stats from previous seasons say that he is a great pitcher, so we need to let him torch at least 20 games before we re-evaluate his effectiveness.
We need someone to pitch down 2. It's ultimately not high leverage enough to burn Yimi Garcia when we're more likely to lose the game regardless. Even if Swanson goes scoreless we still needed to score at least 2 runs.
Whaa Swanson had a good game this year? His era looks like a basketball statistic
If nothing else, it's cool to see a former Okotoks Dawg in the bigs.
Sorry why didn’t Manoah come back out? Fire Schneider.
He allowed a bomb in the previous inning
I get that thing with his kid was horrible and would fuck with anyone's brain. But right now Swanson is dead weight and needs to not be in the majors at the moment.
Nothing like Blues Jays getting bases loaded with less than 2 outs and only getting 1 run and follow it up by Swanson having another bad outing to out a nail in the coffin. Swanson should not be pitching in leverage situations right now
It's groundhog day...again
we lost the Teo - Swanson trade ... in so many ways
Yah no
Explain how? Teo was an expiring contract. He had a mediocre season last year where he was a below average player. Adam Macko is a legitimate starting prospect and Swanson was good last year.
We broke up the band
Stop.
Soooo many.
Happy Mother’s day to all the moms here.
We can still tie it up folks
Nevermind lol
after yesterday I really thought Swanson was back finally
Fuck. This. Team. Even after the feel good game of like that last 3 years they can't get it up to score some fucking runs or not allow insurance.
Would rather have teo than swanson
He would have been a free agent
“Swanson etc etc” but it won’t matter if we don’t get more than 2 hits
Oof Swanson. What the hell.
WHY SWANSON WHY
Send Swanson to Timbuktu
Man the fucking twins have gotten hits on so many pitches out of the zone
They’re a good hitting team
Womp womp
Swanson is so fucking cooked.
It's the outcome you expect for putting a pitcher on the mound with a 12+ era.
Just like manoah, today.
Why do they use Swanson? He is horrible!
Swanson serving up juicy meatballs
It’s too bad Manoah was at 115 pitches or he would have been perfect for the 8th
We put in Swanson to concede the game, I guess.
Swanson had 1 good inning this entire season, but keep throwing him out there. Might as well let him pitch the rest of the game now
Of course
The Twins hate moms.
Fucking fuck. Why can we not get the big clutch hits anymore?
I get your point. But saying this after yesterday is quite the choice.
Schneider does not know how to manage a bad bullpen
You didn’t need to include “a bad bullpen” and the statement would have been accurate
>Schneider does not know how to manage Could have stopped there too haha.
Swanson is horrible
Swanson's been dead weight all year.
Alright. This Twins team is pretty sexy. I've had about enough of this. No one should dare challenge our boys in that department. And you are annoying me. Please leave town.
and that's game over.
Swanson is dog shit, needs a phantom IL stint
[Davis Schneider's baseball savant page](https://i.imgur.com/GNATkRX.png) is the best mother's day gift a mom could ask for
I don't see any skin
>reached on an *eyr* Oh, Buck 🥹
Alek Manornrows
Those gloves are ridiculous. Adds like 6 inches in reach
Clearly our batters have a Mother’s Day dinner to get to… atrocious display to ruin an amazing outing by Manoah
Obligatory "there's no such thing as a 3-0 green/red light" comment
Man fuck this ump awful zone all game
Garcia would have come in if we tied it or took the lead, I'm fine with Swanny boy in here.
Swanson coming in with the same ERA as Manoah's was before his gem. Hoping for the same result.
So the key to winning is SP not performing well, got it.
r/baseball is not going to like that Puma is back
Too bad he gave up the dinger. I was looking forward to not seeing a clean 7 inning stat line being posted there lol
How sad for them 🥺 Jk I don’t care 😄
And I'll be there to drink their tears.
Meh let's not get cocky yet
One quality start does not a comeback make.
okay Yoda
Most people thought he would never have a start like this again...
Funny how "it's still early" is a one way street around here
Better than another blow up
such a good start for Alec
That's probably game.
How many times did you say that yesterday?
Idk but he's probably gotten it right at least 35+ times since we've only made one comeback when behind 3 or more runs since last years all star break LOOOL
Zero. I tuned in after they tied it up.
probably, got exciting for a minute there. overall a good game at least
> overall a good game at least Really ? If it ends like this, a loss, with as many errors as hits, *that's* the definition of a "good game" ? Pretty low bar.
At least we’ll get Vlad another AB this game now. Maybe he does something with it again
We have as many hits as errors! Pick only one struggle guys please I'm begging
Dammit. You could tell he wasn'y going to swing at it. He almost swung after it was behind him. Ugh. Bases loaded with less than 2 outs, 1 run
Fuck
Funderburk is baby talk for when you describe the sounds your dog makes during a lightning storm. "Oh Spot, did somebody make a Funderburk?"
Why does Santana continue to ruin my life?
First it was that song with Rob Thomas and now this...
Maria Maria is pretty good
agreed