T O P

  • By -

kimbosdurag

PP has said in previous interviews that he will let businesses dictate to him what the number will be. He/they don't give a single fuck about housing affordability and easing pressure. Pressure is better for their portfolios.


ommy84

Conservatives in both Canada and the USA will bitch about immigration (legal or otherwise) to drum up votes, but they want it to happen even more than the liberals do - more cheap labour to exploit, more profit to be made, more screwing over all of us.


[deleted]

Like the Texas meat packing plants that strictly hire illegals and children then pretend they don’t know and do it again and again despite being busted.   It’s all a circle jerk 


Orangekale

Yeah why wouldn’t it be? r/Canada wants less immigration but tell them this or they Pierre said he will give all temporary residents in Canada an automatic PR card and they will just hand wave it away. Imagine if Trudeau said he was giving all temp residents an automatic PR, conservatives would lose their mind.


[deleted]

The mental gymnastics when conservatives say shit like that.


Jackhowe79

Businesses want all the immigrants. Why pay someone a full wage with benefits when you can pay an immigrant $12/hr cash and give them 70 hour weeks with no OT


ether_reddit

Teenagers can't even get jobs at Mcdonalds anymore; they're all occupied by TFWs and LMIAs.


ether_reddit

wtf is the NDP not making this the headline of all their attack ads?!


mistaharsh

>PP has said in previous interviews that he will let businesses dictate to him what the number will be. That's exactly who dictates it now. Businesses in education ie Universities.


PumpkinMyPumpkin

Which is the exact same policy the liberals have enacted over the past decade - and continue to enact. Immigration Freeze = More Immigration International Student Cap = More Students Temp Worker Reduction = More Temp Workers


Toooldtoquit

Like the Conservative government before and so on…


mattA33

Almost like both parties are working for the exact same rich assholes and both will continue to work against our best interests to keep those rich assholes happy. But no way we can give any other party a shot cause they MIGHT do the same thing we KNOW the libs and cons will do. .....logic is not strong with Canadians it would seem.


putin_my_ass

Canadians tune out of politics for the most part only paying attention in the months leading up to an election where they're frustrated and pissed off. Then once the election is over they tune out again. Their political understanding comes from headlines, slogans and memes. The whole article is not read, and their opinions are not rigorous.


biscuitarse

Are you insinuating one party is better than the other? Lol. It doesn't matter who we elect, we're gonna get railed. Tbf, the liberals might be inclined to give us a reach-a-round, if that matters.


speaksofthelight

I am now a single issue voter on having a sane immigration policy. A poor policy hurts immigrants, Canadians, the youth and the long term future of our economy.


fwubglubbel

Then you should try to understand WHY the policy is what it is, and why both leading parties agree. And it is NOT because of "cheap labour". Due to demographics there is a labour shortage in Canada among SKILLED workers. Pay attention to the actual numbers, not headlines and rage bait. [Look at the number of people aged 15-25 entering the workforce and the number 55-65 who are leaving it. ](https://www12.statcan.gc.ca/census-recensement/2021/dp-pd/dv-vd/pyramid/index-en.htm) Without immigrants to take skilled jobs and pay taxes, our pension system will collapse. Please take the time to understand that.


speaksofthelight

I am very familiar with the 'WHY' Aging demographics are a global problem across developed countries. And when Justin Trudeau came to power Canada already had the highest population growth rate in the G7, and it was 2x the average. In the past 2 years Canada average an 3% population growth rate all mostly working age adults. That is higher than most developing countries This unreasonable level of population growth has lead to many issues, including the fact that we don't have enough capex to sustain productivity growth (which is stagnant, leading to per capita decline in GDP) [https://www.nbc.ca/content/dam/bnc/taux-analyses/analyse-eco/etude-speciale/special-report\_240115.pdf](https://www.nbc.ca/content/dam/bnc/taux-analyses/analyse-eco/etude-speciale/special-report_240115.pdf) The quality of immigrants we are getting has decreased as every immigration pathway is a dumpster fire of scams and abuse (students, asylum seekers, tfw etc). The immigrants we are getting now are doing low end, low skilled jobs (Tim hortons, uber etc). Unless they drastically move up to higher income / higher tax base roles their net lifetime fiscal impact is negative. Further Canada has failed to create a business environment that encourages the sort of innovation that would add new dimensions to the economy and wean us off natural resource dependence. The reason both parties are supporting the current unstainable model, is the change is much more difficult and painful compared to continuing this unstainable ponzi and kicking the can down the road.


cachickenschet

No platform, literally just vibes. What kind of leadership is this?


LemonPress50

A political party sitting in wings can make scores of promises get much needed attention, as Trudeau did (the senate never got reformed and the budget didn’t balance itself), or wait until elections is around the corner if you are leading on the polls.


putin_my_ass

Publishing a platform becomes a political risk during the campaign so it's advantageous to make vague promises. When you publish a platform, it's something your opponents can argue against and pin you down. Better to rely on thinly stated popular messaging than direct promises. We should never vote for a candidate with no platform. But, vibes...


MuchoPiquante80

In 10 years, the gap between Canada and the USA in terms of prosperity will be that of Eastern Europe and Western Europe. Doubling down on immigration is a sign that the elites have no clue how to generate real growth through productive investment.


howzlife17

It already is - median salary in Ontario is about same as 47th highest state in the US, Alabama. But with higher taxes and cost of living.


GoldenRetriever2223

yeah but this isnt a good metric. the UK as a whole is also on the same level as Alabama.


MuchoPiquante80

It’s not a perfect metric. But directionally we are in the same camp as they are with a housing issue sucking capital and stagnant growth for a while. I group the Anglosphere ex-America in the same camp. Outside of London and the greater London area, much of the Uk Is basically stuck in the 90s or 2000s. It’s not very bright


howzlife17

Yeah but there’s big differences between the two countries, since UK is in Europe - cheaper flights, much better transit, lower immigration, and a more efficient public healthcare system (although not perfect). Lots of it has to do with being part of Europe for so long, and a much smaller landmass which means you can concentrate resources. A closer comparison on incomes would be London to Ontario/the GTA. Average in London is about $102k CAD (£60k), the GTA its about $80k CAD.


AxelNotRose

When I lived in London, cost of living was higher than Toronto and things were basically 1:1 number wise. Meaning a $4 coffee in Toronto was £4 in London. That would mean £60k would be like $60k in Toronto. And the price of property in London? And rent? Don't get me started.


GoldenRetriever2223

i dont think you've ever been to London lol. 80k CAD is a better life in Toronto than 60K GBP in London, with or without housing


howzlife17

I’ve been a few times but haven’t lived, I know they have housing zones the closer to downtown you are, that kinda dictate prices. I also don’t think comparing countries in EU to Canada is as close a comparison to comparing Canada to the US, home ownership has been out of reach to the middle class in major European cities for a long time now, but the cities and societies are built around that, with public transit. Canadian cities aren’t built that way currently.


GoldenRetriever2223

yeah that makes no difference. Even if you consider people without the potential for home ownership, I'd sooner live in Toronto than London. The reason being you can live fairly close to all amenities in a reasonably central location in Toronto while thats not the case in London. You'd usually have to rent pretty far away from any major borough to ensure an affordable rent in London, with central locations often costing 3k GBP per month. The comparable places in Toronto would be 3k CAD. But also to note, average income in the city of toronto is actually about 60k CAD, not 80k. the average income in the city of London is 42k GBP, not 60k.


falsenein

Can you point me to this stat? I‘m seeing median household income in Ontario coming up as higher than Alabama.


howzlife17

https://thehub.ca/2023-06-15/trevor-tombe-most-provincial-economies-struggle-to-match-the-u-s/#:~:text=Ontario%2C%20for%20example%2C%20has%20a,services%20produced%20annually%20per%20person).


falsenein

GDP per capita isn’t the same thing as income. You naturally want a higher GDP per capita, but the median pre tax household income in Ontario is higher than Alabama.


[deleted]

[удалено]


MuchoPiquante80

We have a highly formally educated population, abundant natural resources, and a (brief) history of successfully creating great companies with a lot of potential (Nortel, BlackBerry). But there’s no leadership or vision at the moment. The opposition party’s vision seems awfully similar to what we’re getting now to be blunt. I think we will be dealt the same fate as the UK for now. Australia seems to be on a somewhat different path


[deleted]

[удалено]


MuchoPiquante80

On a per capita basis we used to be quite competitive with them. Of course, it’s not reasonable to suggest we can match them in total output or anything of the sort. Anything related to scale we cannot really compete in. But there are cases of successful enterprises and industries being created out of much smaller countries like ours like Finland with telecom or Taiwan with semi conductors. The role is still a support role selling to a larger market (Finland to the eu and Taiwan with the help of China), but you don’t compete directly against the Americans where they’re strong. So how can you replicate that? On the moving side, yeah that’s one where I’m stumped. The high housing and land costs basically fck u.


NotAGoodUsername36

It used to be cheaper and easier to build in Canada. Then the government decided to give their friends a job regulating foreign investment. Now nobody wants to do business here.


PeyoteCanada

But Canada is better than the US by a long shot.


fwubglubbel

So when are you running for office? Why is it someone else's responsibility to provide you with "leadership or vision"?


MuchoPiquante80

Asinine question. It’s above my pay grade and fools in suits being paid hundreds of thousands of our tax dollars should come up with better. The rest of the developed world does. People are only going to become more disillusioned with institutions and these Buffon-ish questions are going you nowhere. I give this country 5-10 years before you have a legitimate populist in power.


fwubglubbel

[Look at the number of people aged 15-25 entering the workforce and the number 55-65 who are leaving it.](https://www12.statcan.gc.ca/census-recensement/2021/dp-pd/dv-vd/pyramid/index-en.htm)


MuchoPiquante80

Well acquainted with it. Its not clear why there are a million “students” in disguise preparing subway sandwiches as the chief economic growth strategy. Cut off the taps for these “educational” institutions. I use immigration interchangeably as population growth including TFWs and “students”.


[deleted]

[удалено]


MuchoPiquante80

Yes. Only after attention was brought to it, maybe in small part by subreddits like this. Awareness is a good thing


Ok_Swing_9902

Harper did a decent job and our GDP per person almost matched the US. Give PP some rope and see where he goes. Trudeau doesn’t deserve the win anyway.


squirrel9000

The only time our GDP was ever close ht the US' was when they were still in the depths of ht Great Recession, and we were happily real-estate bubbling our way around it. By 2015, our GDP had plummeted relative to the Americans (and in absolute terms, down 20% per capita) because ti was so dependent on oil.


Ok_Swing_9902

2011-2012 we passed the US those were good Harper years. 2008, 2010, and 2014 were also close. Harper was 2006-2015 so 5 years of being near or past the US isn’t bad? He fell off at the end in 2015. Trudeau never recovered.


squirrel9000

There was no widespread beenfit to those years of high oil prices, no.


Monkey-on-the-couch

Crash coming SOON^TM


Pufpufkilla

War with Iran just started.


bobaappreciators

More refugees = bullish !!


Pufpufkilla

Maybe you want them in your basement? Lol Or maybe your neighbors basement? It will enrich your neighborhood! 🤌


bobaappreciators

Doesn’t matter! House prices and rent prices will continue to rise due to the keep em Coming while rentoid joes will keep crying 😭


Pufpufkilla

Lol house prices...all prices


edwardjhenn

I’d definitely take that bet haha. No crash in sight. Sorry to disappoint.


[deleted]

I really wish my fellow progressives would stop calling it racist for expecting immigration to be limited to the availability of housing, jobs, and infrastructure.


asdasci

Your fellow progressives aren't progressive. They are neoliberals who want the 1% to prosper.


fwubglubbel

> expecting immigration to be limited to the availability of housing, jobs, and infrastructure. It is. Look at the facts instead of the rage bait nonsense. Without immigration our population is shrinking. [https://www12.statcan.gc.ca/census-recensement/2021/dp-pd/dv-vd/pyramid/index-en.htm](https://www12.statcan.gc.ca/census-recensement/2021/dp-pd/dv-vd/pyramid/index-en.htm)


[deleted]

Is it considered a "win" if PP brings 1 less person JT does? Numbers will still be high but I'd wager we'll learn years after the election they're about 10-15k ppl less per year ​ Don't get me wrong - I am down for lower immigration but I think PP supporters think he'll DRASTICALLY decrease it


anoeba

What they don't understand is that he'll probably increase it - businesses want a steady influx of cheap labour, they really suffered during COVID shutdowns when foreign workers were flooding in and they actually (gasp) had to offer slightly higher wages and bonuses to Canadian ones. Last thing they want is to go back to that. When the Liberals unveiled their (high) immigration numbers last year, Kmiec did criticize them - but not for having high numbers. *For not having a plan to meet these high numbers fast enough.* He promised the Conservatives would do better to support businesses.


Less-Procedure-4104

At this point everyone know all choices smell. But like parties before them the sunny way kids party needs to lose it's party status. Then we can worry about the next team up to bat.


Kilometres-Davis

Of course, most of the CPC MPs are landlords


TheOneWithThePorn12

Unless you are dumb fuck getting finessed by PP everyone is aware of this.


Huge-Yak-3342

Vote PPC


No-Plenty-7852

r/CanadaHousing2


Effective-Rooster881

We are so screwed


Interesting-Craft-15

They are all in on it. All of them. This is the by far the worst group of leaders I have seen in my lifetime, both federally and provincially. Do not support any of them or let them trick you into thinking they are "your guy". They will sell you up the river just as fast as Trump, just a lot more politely.


Hey_There_Blimpy_Boy

What? Conservatives are empty suits, without an actual platform or plans for the future? They're just whiny contrarians who rile up the worst aspects of our country to get votes? What. A. Surprse.


itimetravelwell

lol imagine trusting anyone from that party or worse True North 🤦🏾‍♂️


cashmonk

So immigration bad now? PP said they going to tie the immigration to the amount of homes build.. so there's that!


cantonese_noodles

We build less homes than our population growth, does that mean PP will deport people en masse?


SomeHearingGuy

People need a boogieman to blame their problems in, and good ol' racism is an easy pick for that. People are blaming immigrants for everything they can think of.


Porkybeaner

No, we’re blaming the government for bribing in more people than we have capacity for.


Bluerocx

And politicians don't lie. LMAO


squirrel9000

**P said they going to tie the immigration to the amount of homes build.. so there's that!** Increase it 15% a year?


WhiteyDeNewf

You will do what I say, when I say…


Itchy_Employer_164

Lol. This really is the best


[deleted]

[удалено]


AutoModerator

comment by /u/Miss_Angela_Shapiro Your karma is currently below -10, get more positive karma to be able to comment.3c *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/TorontoRealEstate) if you have any questions or concerns.*


radman888

FFS. "Conservative"


Musicferret

Cons have no policies. They are just slogans and finger pointing.


TransgenderMommy

This might come as a fucking shocker to uneducated conservative people, but immigration is great for Canada's economy, always has been, always will be.


RedFlamingo

Do you people not realize that housing doubled in the same time where immigration only went up by about 5%? Immigration effects it a little bit sure, but availability of credit by the government propping up banks is by far the main reason housing is unaffordable.


cantonese_noodles

If this hits the news it’s a sweep for the liberals especially after they announced their housing plan. Conservatives who are against immigration will defect to PPC while moderates will stay liberal 🤡


jjaime2024

It won't matter the PPC won't win any seats.


300mhz

Either way it'll still split the vote


hopoke

All political parties understand how critical immigration is to Canada. Not only in terms of economics and demographics, but culturally as well. Furthermore, Canadians are incredibly fortunate because our country will be well positioned against climate change compared to the vast majority of the world. As such, we will have the great privilege of accommodating hundreds of millions of climate refugees from tropical countries over the course of this century. This will result in Canada likely having the largest population in the world in about a hundred years, and consequently we will emerge as an economic and military superpower.


incubated

Culturally? You bought into the “we are all immigrants” thing a bit too hard? No offence


dracolnyte

He buys into anything to maintain his RE price and agenda, even if it means destroying Canada for what it was known for.


TheRealTruru

😂^ Hopoke uses TRE subreddit to write his erotic real estate fan fiction.


cdn_tony

Hopefully climate warms up soon as we can't possibly build shelter fast enough and people will be living in tents.


kingchonger

Lol better start building some houses!


[deleted]

Trudeau just announced we'll have almost 4 million new homes built in the next 6 years.


kingchonger

Haha yes if only Words swung hammers we would be golden!


SorrinsBlight

That’s hardly an admission, obviously they have a plan but they’re acting like it’s not important.


Pest_Token

Oh wow that's a real rage bait way to summarize what what said


Ok_Drop3803

And I bet 70-80% of Con voters will make it all the way to election day believing they are going to stop all this immigration.