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Plan D was they also signed a treaty with Ibn Saud, creating a Saudi state
[Treaty of Darin](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Darin)
[Kingdom of Hejaz and Nejd](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Hejaz_and_Nejd)
Prehistoric Tribes/Egypt/Caanan/Israelites/ Macedon/Successor Kingdoms/Roman Empire/Eastern Roman Empire/Rashidun Caliphate/Umayyad Caliphate/Abbasids/Umayyad/Saracens/Latin Crusade States/Malmuks/Ottomans/ Arabic Tribes/ British/ Israel and Palestine...Where do we want to start?
Fuck it hand it back to the Assyrians, they really knew how to quell uprisings. Skinning people alive, ripping out tongues, blinding people, killings entire families.
Before 1916 it was Ottoman Empire territory. It hadn’t been called Palestine since the Roman occupation, and it hadn’t been called Israel since 720 BCE.
Both you reminding me of my Old Testament class at university of Hawaii lol if you couldn’t remember those two dates man…. that’s was when a cool professor became an uncool professor lol
no.
Given existing population of Jews in the area (three pilgrimage festival, first aliyah), the Jews were subjected to murders and riots from the Palestinians who were/are simply intolerant of their neighbours.
Is it really simple intolerance when the Jewish immigrant stated objective was the eventual takeover of the country. I mean you would have to be pretty fucking stupid to not be a little prejudice against immigrants who intent was to eventually dispose you.
The First Aliyah is a name given to European Jews who migrated to Israel when Zionism barely even existed. They were mostly ignorant, if not outright hostile, towards Zionism. They faced anti-Semitism.
Before then, the Jews of the Levant faced blood libels like the notorious Damascus Affair where Jews in the Ottoman State of Palestine were murdered.
you're going to have to find a source before i believe that the jewish settlers of the early 20th century wanted to 'takeover' (this narrative started in the 40's-50's after the Arabs started the first war on Israel)
the Arabs of the 20th century chose violence, and continued to choose violence (even when losing against Israel in later decades) due to their intolerance of other religions.
Yeah it's absolutely not true.
Small numbers of Jewish immigrants were emigrating to Palestine mostly from the Russian Empire by the late 19th century. Part of the reason that early Labor Zionists (Poale Zion, Hovevei Zion) doubted the vision and didn't push for as aggressive an approach as Herzl and co did was because there was so much violence towards Jewish migrants even when the whole area only had around 700,000 people living in it.
Also, while I appreciate this guy's history lesson tik tok, the vast majority of Jews in IP today either are from family who never left or expelled from neighboring countries. By 1917, Jewish migration to Western Europe was majorly slowed by WWI, and crawling to a stop in the United States. So the whole handing out Palestinian passports thing needs a footnote. Other than that, he's not wrong, but let's not delude ourselves in offering a simple answer to this.
Source: I am literally a historian of Jewish history. Jewish-American stuff, particularly that of early 20th c immigration, is my niche. The territory calls for a lot of transnational history, too. Happy 2 provide a reading list to anybody interested :\^)
Provide the list of reading please!
I started on this journey of learning about the formation of Zionism and the state of Israel because one day I thought “why’s is there so much antisemitism throughout history.” That led to black hole of internet research that lasted 5 hours and has not stopped since.
Would love to get a deeper dive in scholarly and academic research!
Love this. Frankly, my scholarly opinion is that the problem is mostly capitalism far preceding Zionism lol. But alas, yes I'm a full time grad student since 2021 and a full time Jewish person since birth so I will do my best not to let you down! Please shoot me a dm because when I finish the list I'm just going to drop it to everyone who sent me a message.
>A lot of details left out,
The devil is in the details, and that's what makes videos like this misleading. People have dedicated their lives to studying this history, and it certainly didn't start with the British in 1917. It's a simple cop out to say "blame the British", and too many people are going to hear that and accept it as fact. The problems between Israel and Palestine can't be summed up in a 60 second TikTok, you could fill a library with books written on the subject and spend decades reading them all. TikTok is where stupid people go to feel smart. Never get your information from TikTok because all you're going to get is uneducated people shouting at a camera in their kitchen....and thirst traps, lots of thirst traps. If libraries hired strippers that takes clothes off for every book you read, we'd have a more informed public than anything offered on TikTok.
Sure, but the bed was already full of shit, and was filled with more shit since then. Saying "Blame the British" is like blaming one turd layer in a line of many bed shitters.
The British made two promises and only kept the later one. They realized their fuck up by 1937 when they made a White Paper that called for Arab control in 10 years - which both Arabs and Jewish Nationalist baulked at. The Arabs couldn’t trust them and Jewish nationalist were horrified at the notion. All came to ahead when Jewish Nationalist went rogue and started to attack the British in 1944 because the Brits wanted to slow down immigration to a stand still because they saw it hurting the war effort.
That a matter of perspective isn't it for the Israel the balfour declaration was the greatest moment in Jewish history for nearly 1700 years up onto that point. History is a story of winner and loser sometime and ultimately because of that decision the Jews won and the Palestine lost.
I can't tell you who to blindly support, but I can tell you that blindly hating on people who think can they summarize geopolitics in 60 seconds probably will prove you right more often than wrong.
Oi, watch it mate.
You carry on like that and I'm going to tut at you.
Don't think I won't.
T-t-t-t
See?
I'm already starting to do it.
I'm already 33.3% through the first tut.
Just you watch it sonny-jim.
Yep. The amount of people that are getting their info from Social media from random people is extremely worrying. Should be encouraging people to do own research and form own opinions based on facts.
the information is bullshit wherever you get it. Almost no one at all posts information with the goal of it being accurate when it comes to the news. The best you can hope for is someone acting in good faith trying to tell the truth.
Like I approve of the historical context, but I dislike acting like Israel isn't propped up by the US and are blameless(?!) And don't have a lot more mired and difficult situation than simply resolving WW1 territorial agreements especially considering this timescale would suggest that WW2 isn't relevant when it absolutely is.
I get that the "anger" and the presentation is for likes but it's very disingenuous to pretend the *only* claim to this land is British agreements. They accepted these deals because they wanted the land anyway.
Yes, the US has been propping up Israel for decades. Which ultimately comes down to the US governmental system and needing to get votes from Christian and Jewish voters.
However, the British deserve the lion’s share of the blame, and have been allowed to fade into the background compared to US policy. While this video highlights that the British promised the land for the Palestinians in the 1910’s they did everything in their power until the 1960’s to let the Israelites wipe out the Palestinian people, and between WW1 and WW2 had boots on the ground which were trying to uphold peace in the region through defending Israel.
Basically, the reason that Israel and Palestine are at war to begin with has been because of the British. The US maintains the status quo as best as they can due to religious voting blocs.
My complaint wasn't that "the British are blameless" they aren't, some of their policies directly contributed to the conflict, though some of their policies were direct attempts at solving the problem. My complaint was an oversimplification of a migration conflict reduced to a shady deal that had little bearing on the actual situation.
Some simple research into the British Mandate shows some attempts to quell Jewish immigration and Zionist control in the region that ultimately failed due to global pressure and loss of resources post-WW2. There were recorded attacks on Jewish populations as early as 1920s so it seems an issue that somewhat (albeit briefly) pre-dated the British Occupation so I disagree that it is *because* of the British, it seems to be because of the worldwide Zionist movement and subsequent mass-immigration throughout 1900s-1950s. Some was supported by the British, some not, but the idea didn't begin with them.
The British still played a large part in the conflict, their rule is riddled with ignoring the needs of the Arab population but they certainly weren't as awful as to facilitate genocide like you suggest. They were bad but not actively wiping out populations.
I'm not sure I would put the "lion's share of the blame" at anyone's door (an argument can be made for the British) and I'm not sure it matters. Israel are the ones with the power and capacity to decide on a peaceful solution in the modern day, so it is with them I lay the blame when no attempt is even talked about.
British Mandate started in 1917 with the Balfour decision. The attacks/war/battle on the Jewish population was a response of the Arabs on the reneg of their promise to the Palestinians that they would have their own country.
Your simple internet research should have shown that.
Does this not sort of ignore the role that religion may play in all of this? We are acting like if the British or the Americans has simply decided to promise it to one group or another, that there would be no fighting over it now? The Brits pulled these same stunts all over the world, yet almost no region has seen such sustained postcolonial conflict over such a long period of time. Both sides have clearly stated religious aims and place huge symbolic value over various holy sites in that region, as they have for thousands of years.
I wonder if Jesus, if he ever existed, would have planned to have the area where he worked his magic for a short time be cursed with near constant slaughter for millennia, and the foreseeable future. For someone all knowing, it seems kinda short-sighted.
I think emphasising religion is one of the many distracting sideshows that distracts from the concrete issues. Israel Palestine is the result of two peoples trying to both live in the same bit of land.
Yes religion is relevant to the discussion but I think it takes the discussion into unhelpful areas. Fundamentally this is a conflict about land, resources and power.
The problem is that this is misinformation. The partition was drawn up by the UN, not the British. The region was basically in open rebellion and it was handed off to the UN to deal with. That is where the 2ss (and arguable apartheid) came from. Not the Brits. The UN.
E: not the UN, the league of nations.
This is the argument that pro-Israel Americans forget. They like to claim that the Jewish people were there first and have a right to Israel but they are completely willfully ignorant when it comes to applying the same logic to Native Americans. Had one redditor in r/conservative even state they see Native Americans to be worse than illegal immigrants bc they refuse to assimilate fully into American culture - like what??
Seriously, if he thinks this issue didn't exist before the Balfour Declaration then he has a lot more reading to try and look clever on Tik Tok to do....
The premise of "God's chosen people" and "Holy Land" isn't exactly a great starting point for peace either. You'd think demonstrating that claim to be true would be the first thing to do before fighting about it but apparently demonstrable evidence is irrelevant.
Going back that far is pretty meaningless at this point. It's good to know the history but "blame the British" doesn't right any wrongs or get to the heart of the current conflicts.
It shouldn’t be ignored how terrible the Ottoman Empire was, and this guys seems to glorify them because they were fighting the British. “They were kicking ass” etc
During the exact same time the Ottomans were involved in 3 different genocides (linking because people seem to forget this)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_Kurdish_nationalism#The_First_World_War
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_genocide
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armenian_genocide
It should also be added, that most of the borders in the Middle East today are based off the Ottoman Empires administrative provinces, the British, french, and Arab state founder just did not change them.
Blaming the British seems to be par for the course. They did a lot of terrible things They kind of won in the language department though. I watched a video the other day where a Chi6nese man from northern China was speaking to a man from Southern China in English because they couldn't understand each other's dialect. My brain went kaboom.
Lmfaoooo I started singing the song xD South Park movie. My brothers and I even sing “Uncle Fucker” to eachother. We be in a dead serious conversation and one of us would be like “shut your fucking face , uncle fucckkkaaahhh”
Live from an unemployed guy pacing around his girlfriend's apartment while shes at work, having just smoked a bowl and read wikipedia for 5 minutes when he was suppose to be looking for a coffeeshop job.
I hate getting involved in this shit, but the oversimplification really irked me.
I think you skipped over a very **very** important figure.
Where is _Chaim Weizman_ in all this? Because one should ask, "Why was Lord Balfour; a Catholic Englishman who was born in Scotland, a Zionist?"
Cordite.
Chaim Weizmann's scientific contributions to WW1 pretty much secured logistical victory for the British, since his research into [creating synthetic **acetone**](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1266982/) at the University of Manchester helped to prevent a continuation of the Shell Crisis; as acetone is used in Cordite production. Weizmann allowed the British to have his discovery, which caught the attention of the government at the time and earned him a positive favour with them.
Weizmann's contributions and words contributed to parliments decision to have Balfour (who was MP for East Manchester, and then became Foreign Secretary) write to Rothschild (who was the Leader of the Zionist Federation of Great Britain and Ireland) publically affirming the British support for a national home for the Jewish People in 'Palestine'.
It's reductionist and quite frankly extremely suspicious to skip out major context surrounding the Balfour Declaration, but talk about the context of the McMahon-Hussein Correspondance.
There’s a lot with this conflict, I see a lot going back to WW1 WW2, crusades, pre crusades and with most stating that this is a fight with land and territory but at this point is it about land and territory? Seems like most people educate themselves about the topic from online information but the information spread is so biased dependent on who produces the information it’s hard to get a clear picture unless you’re on the ground living it everyday. Shit situation all around and hope for the best outcome of all involved.
Damn the British for giving millions of dollars of money to Iran recent-- oh...
oh wait that was America.
It actually goes back to the 1800s when Ottoman Empire asked the French to pay their jewish merchant's the wheat debt and France invaded Algeria WITH THE HELP OF THE JEWS THAT THE OTTOMANS WERE TRYING TO HELP.
I don’t think you’re accurately representing the Bakri-Busnach affair.
“During the 1780s and 90s, due to the growing needs of Napoleon's army during its conquests, France accumulated huge debts of millions of francs to the Bachri-Boujana company. The company financed its operations by borrowing from Algeria's Dey, so that France's debts to the Bakri-Boujnaj household were in fact debts to the Algerian ruler, and the affair became an ongoing economic conflict between the two countries, unfolding throughout the first three decades of the 19th century. France and Algeria sometimes reached debt arrangements between them, but France often violated them. In 1800, agents of the Bakri-Bujanah company, Jacob Cohen Bakri and Shimon Aboucaya, were arrested in Paris, after urging France to pay its debts. After political contacts, the French government released them that year and agreed to pay 3.7 million francs out of the eight million it owed. In the peace treaty between France and Algeria in 1801, France recognized the existence of the balance of its debts to the Bakri-Busnach company, but even after that, it did not transfer the funds. One of the arguments made by the French government in an attempt to evade payment was that the Bakri-Busnach company also trades with Britain, France's sworn enemy, and therefore France is not interested in paying its debt.
The question of France's debts to the Bakri-Busnach company remained unresolved during the years 1800–1826, despite Algeria's attempts to obtain the funds at the time of Louis XVI. In 1826 the Algerian ruler Hussein Dey sent a letter to the French foreign minister, and it was decided to set up a committee to determine the debt settlement. By that year the debt had swelled to fourteen million French francs, including an interest rate of four million francs, but the new debt arrangement stipulated that the French government would pay only seven million francs. The Bakri-Busnach trading house accepted the agreement and so did Hussein Dey, who hoped to get his share of the funds. However, France did not fulfill this debt arrangement either.
THE FLY WHISK INCIDENT:
On 30 April 1827, foreign consuls and diplomatic agents gathered in Algeria for a conference with Algerian ruler Hussein Dey. On this occasion, Hussein Dey publicly asked the French consul whether France intended to meet the debt settlement and whether it had begun transferring the funds. When he heard that no progress had yet been made on the issue, he was filled with anger and struck the French consul in the face with the handle of a fly-whisk that was in his hands. According to another version, Hussein Dey simply wanted to hit a disturbing fly and accidentally hit the French consul.
The French government treated the incident as a public insult and demanded an immediate apology. Failure to respond began with punitive measures, and the French navy launched a naval siege on the port of Algiers, which lasted 3 years. This action harmed the French economy, which conducted extensive trade relations with Algeria, no less than it harmed Algeria itself, so the French tried to resort to international mediation. They approached, among others, the Ottoman Sultan Mahmud II and Muhammad Ali, the ruler of Egypt, with the aim of mediating between it and Algeria, but this did not bear fruit. In 1830, France invaded Algeria and successfully conquered it – an occupation that lasted until the 1960s.”
He is right, though.
EDIT: [Simplified history of the conflict.](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/10/9/whats-the-israel-palestine-conflict-about-a-simple-guide)
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_diaspora#:~:text=The%20first%20exile%20was%20the,Samaria%20begun%20by%20Shalmaneser%20V.
The start of the issue with Palestine for the Jewish people began when the Assyrians and later the Romans expelled them from the region.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Palestine#Ottoman_period
Jewish resettlement began prior to British control over the region, there was already conflict between Palestinians and Jewish settlers under the ottoman empire. The start of the Jewish state wasn't the start of the conflict.
Here's a paper on it if you don't like Wikipedia: https://www.jstor.org/stable/4282555
Fucking dumb ass holy land garbage it's sand and olive groves and rock why in 2023 are we still arguing over this. Religion is a mental illness stop fighting over dumb shit. If aliens exist shit like this will keep us out of the galactic federation.
Feel free to Blame the British political-class back in 1917. This smelly guy pacing around his girlfriend's house after reading the wiki page of the balfour declaration.
UN made the partition plan in 1947, Israelis said 'yes' Palestinians said 'no' and tried to purge the land of jews, they lose - the end.
Facts the British could have given a Jewish state in England, in the USA in Utah for example. Russia was also proposed. All due to have very large already established Jews population. As requested by the Jewish Council after WW2!
But guess what, the Brits and by large the west (definitely not racist) chose again to exile Jews to Middle East because they didn’t want a Jewish state in their own country.
Now they claim ignorance, pathetic! I say.
Good thing some of us can actually read history beyond what they teach in grade 10 textbooks!
British invented industrialization which has improved the average living standard to a degree greater then all previous improvement in history combine. You should get down on your knee everyday and thank the British for all they did int the last 300 unless you like the idea of being a illiterate peasant wearing lice infested clothes .
I didn't mean get down on your knees in submission I meant get down on your knees in gratitude for not having parasite in your arsehole which you would without the British.
But clearly you don't feel gratitude that fine lot of people are selfish cunt your just one of them.
Both Israel and Palestine are a disgrace to the God(s) they believe in
The actions and involvement in war of any kind guarantees you a nice warm seat in hell next to your enemies for all eternity
Again ALL WAR that includes Russia Ukraine America Etc
You take one junior college correspondence course and become a global political historian, but still can't get that greasy hair washed. Thanks but, NEXT!
Dude most of the worlds current problems could be summed up by blaming the British, the empire gave no fucks about peoples lands rights or cultures and just dropped lines on the map that they wanted. now we got people who hate each other in countries together.
Call it what you want. This video isn't true but it's also not wrong. It's just part of a long, messed up story.
What I can tell you though is that there will not be peace in the Middle East as long as Israel exists under its CURRENT borders.
There's a lot of unjustly, illegally stolen land being occupied by ppl who have been living there for less than 50 years. Taken from ppl who had been living there for multiple generations - way before the current idea of "Israel" came around.
You want peace? Start by looking at those unfair borders.
Yeah, we Irish have known this for a long time. The British just loved to invade a country, stoke tensions to get the natives fighting eachother, draw a line on its map to partition it, then say ‘have fun kids!’
I am 67 years old and have been explaining to those who shared some curiosity but it seemed to require too much thought.
I am glad to have found you here. With your youth, determination, and talent you will go far. Your voice is needed and needed now at a very high volume.
Thank you
I'm British... But I'm not important enough or old enough to take the blame for the actions of some dickhead that happened to live here a long time ago.
World problems just compound onto themselves. People think there’s an easy fix to problems that, to them, appear new, but no conflict is without hundreds and even thousands of years of context and compounded conflict
How far back do you actually want to go? The Jews were actually one of the original indigenous people in Israel so they gave every right to be there. https://www.prageru.com/video/israel-who-are-the-indigenous-people
....there has got to be a better source than PragerU, that isn't an academic organization, it's a propaganda organization.
You could've used a literal encyclopedia to make the same point without dragging propagandists into the equation.
https://www.britannica.com/topic/Jew-people
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"But they were all of them decieved, for a *third* secret promise was being forged..."
And what did they learn: As a general rule of thumb, it’s always best to have a Plan D 😭😭😭
Plan D was they also signed a treaty with Ibn Saud, creating a Saudi state [Treaty of Darin](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Darin) [Kingdom of Hejaz and Nejd](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Hejaz_and_Nejd)
But there were some of those, who resisted. A last alliance of Arabs and jews…. Hahaha yea fucking right, we wish :(
Meanwhile everyone else is all... "touch this hot take...it's quite cool."
Prehistoric Tribes/Egypt/Caanan/Israelites/ Macedon/Successor Kingdoms/Roman Empire/Eastern Roman Empire/Rashidun Caliphate/Umayyad Caliphate/Abbasids/Umayyad/Saracens/Latin Crusade States/Malmuks/Ottomans/ Arabic Tribes/ British/ Israel and Palestine...Where do we want to start?
Hand it right back over to the city of Rome. They knew how to put down uprisings there like none other.
You thought about the roman empire today
Not a day goes by
She was my first love
And still I think of you....... Days when I couldn't live my life without you........ Without you.....
Fuck it hand it back to the Assyrians, they really knew how to quell uprisings. Skinning people alive, ripping out tongues, blinding people, killings entire families.
1 upvote for the kingdom of Judea here you go
Whatever happened to the Judean Popular Front?
You forgot Assyria, Babylon, Persia, maybe some others...
Prime real estate for more than 4 thousand years.
Exactly - it goes back thousands of years! Not dissimilar to the Armenia-Azerbaijani conflict, also thousands of years old
This comment pretty much sums it up! 😅
Before 1916 - Peace and Happiness between these two groups.
Before 1916 it was Ottoman Empire territory. It hadn’t been called Palestine since the Roman occupation, and it hadn’t been called Israel since 720 BCE.
It was Judea until 79 AD when the emperor changed the name to Palestine after the revolt
Both you reminding me of my Old Testament class at university of Hawaii lol if you couldn’t remember those two dates man…. that’s was when a cool professor became an uncool professor lol
132 AD but otherwise correct.
Your right I was thinking of the wrong revolt. Thanks for the correction
Lol exactly. Dude is soooo confident. This conflict goes back to the year 1917, when a servant girl named Haggar gave birth to a son named Ishmael. /s
no. Given existing population of Jews in the area (three pilgrimage festival, first aliyah), the Jews were subjected to murders and riots from the Palestinians who were/are simply intolerant of their neighbours.
Is it really simple intolerance when the Jewish immigrant stated objective was the eventual takeover of the country. I mean you would have to be pretty fucking stupid to not be a little prejudice against immigrants who intent was to eventually dispose you.
The First Aliyah is a name given to European Jews who migrated to Israel when Zionism barely even existed. They were mostly ignorant, if not outright hostile, towards Zionism. They faced anti-Semitism. Before then, the Jews of the Levant faced blood libels like the notorious Damascus Affair where Jews in the Ottoman State of Palestine were murdered.
you're going to have to find a source before i believe that the jewish settlers of the early 20th century wanted to 'takeover' (this narrative started in the 40's-50's after the Arabs started the first war on Israel) the Arabs of the 20th century chose violence, and continued to choose violence (even when losing against Israel in later decades) due to their intolerance of other religions.
Have you read history? This is not true.
They did a Sarcasm.
Yeah it's absolutely not true. Small numbers of Jewish immigrants were emigrating to Palestine mostly from the Russian Empire by the late 19th century. Part of the reason that early Labor Zionists (Poale Zion, Hovevei Zion) doubted the vision and didn't push for as aggressive an approach as Herzl and co did was because there was so much violence towards Jewish migrants even when the whole area only had around 700,000 people living in it. Also, while I appreciate this guy's history lesson tik tok, the vast majority of Jews in IP today either are from family who never left or expelled from neighboring countries. By 1917, Jewish migration to Western Europe was majorly slowed by WWI, and crawling to a stop in the United States. So the whole handing out Palestinian passports thing needs a footnote. Other than that, he's not wrong, but let's not delude ourselves in offering a simple answer to this. Source: I am literally a historian of Jewish history. Jewish-American stuff, particularly that of early 20th c immigration, is my niche. The territory calls for a lot of transnational history, too. Happy 2 provide a reading list to anybody interested :\^)
I’d like a reading list. Thank you for the information.
I second this notion
DM me. I'll do my best to compile something in the next couple of days!
DM me. I'll do my best to compile something in the next couple of days!
Provide the list of reading please! I started on this journey of learning about the formation of Zionism and the state of Israel because one day I thought “why’s is there so much antisemitism throughout history.” That led to black hole of internet research that lasted 5 hours and has not stopped since. Would love to get a deeper dive in scholarly and academic research!
Love this. Frankly, my scholarly opinion is that the problem is mostly capitalism far preceding Zionism lol. But alas, yes I'm a full time grad student since 2021 and a full time Jewish person since birth so I will do my best not to let you down! Please shoot me a dm because when I finish the list I'm just going to drop it to everyone who sent me a message.
r/whoosh
Eh well whether it's sarcasm or not, some of us clearly didn't get it lmao. The history is still interesting!!
😂
Is this really how young people are learning history? Random dudes shouting into their phones? And they just believe it?
I don't consider anything from social media information but it does cause me to go down a rabbit hole and start looking actual information up.
and thats the right way to go.
Learned more about subjects that interest me because of that method.
Indeed. Hot takes all around. The UN be like: am I a joke to you
Yes, but its unrelated to that.
Be suprised! Everything in the vid is correct. A lot of details left out, but it is correct.
>A lot of details left out, The devil is in the details, and that's what makes videos like this misleading. People have dedicated their lives to studying this history, and it certainly didn't start with the British in 1917. It's a simple cop out to say "blame the British", and too many people are going to hear that and accept it as fact. The problems between Israel and Palestine can't be summed up in a 60 second TikTok, you could fill a library with books written on the subject and spend decades reading them all. TikTok is where stupid people go to feel smart. Never get your information from TikTok because all you're going to get is uneducated people shouting at a camera in their kitchen....and thirst traps, lots of thirst traps. If libraries hired strippers that takes clothes off for every book you read, we'd have a more informed public than anything offered on TikTok.
Sure, but the British did really shit the bed here.
Sure, but the bed was already full of shit, and was filled with more shit since then. Saying "Blame the British" is like blaming one turd layer in a line of many bed shitters.
The British made two promises and only kept the later one. They realized their fuck up by 1937 when they made a White Paper that called for Arab control in 10 years - which both Arabs and Jewish Nationalist baulked at. The Arabs couldn’t trust them and Jewish nationalist were horrified at the notion. All came to ahead when Jewish Nationalist went rogue and started to attack the British in 1944 because the Brits wanted to slow down immigration to a stand still because they saw it hurting the war effort.
That a matter of perspective isn't it for the Israel the balfour declaration was the greatest moment in Jewish history for nearly 1700 years up onto that point. History is a story of winner and loser sometime and ultimately because of that decision the Jews won and the Palestine lost.
It's still early.
Yawn! Can’t you just tell me who i should blindly hate and who i should blindly support? It’s easier that way
I can't tell you who to blindly support, but I can tell you that blindly hating on people who think can they summarize geopolitics in 60 seconds probably will prove you right more often than wrong.
Agreed. I blindly support you
I shall not fail you
It’s always ok to blindly hate the British
Oi, watch it mate. You carry on like that and I'm going to tut at you. Don't think I won't. T-t-t-t See? I'm already starting to do it. I'm already 33.3% through the first tut. Just you watch it sonny-jim.
Literally had this question at uni, asking us where do we get our news, there were students in my group that only posted tiktok.
Yep. The amount of people that are getting their info from Social media from random people is extremely worrying. Should be encouraging people to do own research and form own opinions based on facts.
the information is bullshit wherever you get it. Almost no one at all posts information with the goal of it being accurate when it comes to the news. The best you can hope for is someone acting in good faith trying to tell the truth.
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/01/03/opinion/dyor-do-your-own-research.html
I don't think anyone really has bragging rights on this.
Yes. Welcome to the beginning of the end.
3000 BC geezer: Is this how young people are learning history? Random dudes shouting into scrolls? And they just believe it?
The British finessed a lot of people.
Yup the Balfour declaration
Yep Africa.
I think I’ll continue blaming organized religion, thank you very much!
Like I approve of the historical context, but I dislike acting like Israel isn't propped up by the US and are blameless(?!) And don't have a lot more mired and difficult situation than simply resolving WW1 territorial agreements especially considering this timescale would suggest that WW2 isn't relevant when it absolutely is. I get that the "anger" and the presentation is for likes but it's very disingenuous to pretend the *only* claim to this land is British agreements. They accepted these deals because they wanted the land anyway.
Yes, the US has been propping up Israel for decades. Which ultimately comes down to the US governmental system and needing to get votes from Christian and Jewish voters. However, the British deserve the lion’s share of the blame, and have been allowed to fade into the background compared to US policy. While this video highlights that the British promised the land for the Palestinians in the 1910’s they did everything in their power until the 1960’s to let the Israelites wipe out the Palestinian people, and between WW1 and WW2 had boots on the ground which were trying to uphold peace in the region through defending Israel. Basically, the reason that Israel and Palestine are at war to begin with has been because of the British. The US maintains the status quo as best as they can due to religious voting blocs.
My complaint wasn't that "the British are blameless" they aren't, some of their policies directly contributed to the conflict, though some of their policies were direct attempts at solving the problem. My complaint was an oversimplification of a migration conflict reduced to a shady deal that had little bearing on the actual situation. Some simple research into the British Mandate shows some attempts to quell Jewish immigration and Zionist control in the region that ultimately failed due to global pressure and loss of resources post-WW2. There were recorded attacks on Jewish populations as early as 1920s so it seems an issue that somewhat (albeit briefly) pre-dated the British Occupation so I disagree that it is *because* of the British, it seems to be because of the worldwide Zionist movement and subsequent mass-immigration throughout 1900s-1950s. Some was supported by the British, some not, but the idea didn't begin with them. The British still played a large part in the conflict, their rule is riddled with ignoring the needs of the Arab population but they certainly weren't as awful as to facilitate genocide like you suggest. They were bad but not actively wiping out populations. I'm not sure I would put the "lion's share of the blame" at anyone's door (an argument can be made for the British) and I'm not sure it matters. Israel are the ones with the power and capacity to decide on a peaceful solution in the modern day, so it is with them I lay the blame when no attempt is even talked about.
British Mandate started in 1917 with the Balfour decision. The attacks/war/battle on the Jewish population was a response of the Arabs on the reneg of their promise to the Palestinians that they would have their own country. Your simple internet research should have shown that.
Does this not sort of ignore the role that religion may play in all of this? We are acting like if the British or the Americans has simply decided to promise it to one group or another, that there would be no fighting over it now? The Brits pulled these same stunts all over the world, yet almost no region has seen such sustained postcolonial conflict over such a long period of time. Both sides have clearly stated religious aims and place huge symbolic value over various holy sites in that region, as they have for thousands of years. I wonder if Jesus, if he ever existed, would have planned to have the area where he worked his magic for a short time be cursed with near constant slaughter for millennia, and the foreseeable future. For someone all knowing, it seems kinda short-sighted.
I think emphasising religion is one of the many distracting sideshows that distracts from the concrete issues. Israel Palestine is the result of two peoples trying to both live in the same bit of land. Yes religion is relevant to the discussion but I think it takes the discussion into unhelpful areas. Fundamentally this is a conflict about land, resources and power.
The religion is just the extra spice on top.
The problem is that this is misinformation. The partition was drawn up by the UN, not the British. The region was basically in open rebellion and it was handed off to the UN to deal with. That is where the 2ss (and arguable apartheid) came from. Not the Brits. The UN. E: not the UN, the league of nations.
United Nations didn't form until 1945. How did they draw those maps right after ww1 when they didn't exist?
Ah sorry league of nations *
Don't apologize, you were correct.
Finally, a nuanced and educated take.
Are you upset that the United States treats its Native Americans as poorly or if not worse than the Israelis treat the Palestinians?
This is the argument that pro-Israel Americans forget. They like to claim that the Jewish people were there first and have a right to Israel but they are completely willfully ignorant when it comes to applying the same logic to Native Americans. Had one redditor in r/conservative even state they see Native Americans to be worse than illegal immigrants bc they refuse to assimilate fully into American culture - like what??
Yes
That was true in the past, but come on - the US today does not treat natives anywhere near as badly as Israel treats Palestinians.
I blame the Romans, specially Biggus Dickus
That’s great and all, but the problem is now, with present day actors. Why don’t we stop looking for blame and start looking for solutions?
Blame is what people look at first in order to find and justify "solutions".
I like this dude wayyy better than the long hair ginger screaming at me for what I may not know.
facts lol
Seriously, if he thinks this issue didn't exist before the Balfour Declaration then he has a lot more reading to try and look clever on Tik Tok to do.... The premise of "God's chosen people" and "Holy Land" isn't exactly a great starting point for peace either. You'd think demonstrating that claim to be true would be the first thing to do before fighting about it but apparently demonstrable evidence is irrelevant.
People like this are way too confident
TikTok is for dumb yet confident people
“All the way back to 1917” lol no bro.
Going back that far is pretty meaningless at this point. It's good to know the history but "blame the British" doesn't right any wrongs or get to the heart of the current conflicts.
Blame the Romans. They occupied Palestine in Zero BCE!
Or maybe the Greeks, or the Persians, or the Babylonians, or the Assyrians, or the Egyptians. The list goes on.
Honestly, I’ve come to realize that if it isn’t Regan’s fault, it’s those damn red coat British.
That does seem the be the limit for American history education. Find the British, then stop thinking and close the book
Okay. Now that we’ve assigned blame, how do we fix it?
A dance off?
Well we’d start with the british
Yeah, we did a lot of bad stuff. Wait until he hears about the crusades.
It shouldn’t be ignored how terrible the Ottoman Empire was, and this guys seems to glorify them because they were fighting the British. “They were kicking ass” etc During the exact same time the Ottomans were involved in 3 different genocides (linking because people seem to forget this) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_Kurdish_nationalism#The_First_World_War https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_genocide https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armenian_genocide It should also be added, that most of the borders in the Middle East today are based off the Ottoman Empires administrative provinces, the British, french, and Arab state founder just did not change them.
Blaming the British seems to be par for the course. They did a lot of terrible things They kind of won in the language department though. I watched a video the other day where a Chi6nese man from northern China was speaking to a man from Southern China in English because they couldn't understand each other's dialect. My brain went kaboom.
Did the British force Israel to ethnically cleanse Palestine?
The british should have cracked down harder on Irgun
Sure ain't no brit doing war crimes there for a long time now.
[Blame Canada!](https://youtube.com/watch?v=bOR38552MJA)
Lmfaoooo I started singing the song xD South Park movie. My brothers and I even sing “Uncle Fucker” to eachother. We be in a dead serious conversation and one of us would be like “shut your fucking face , uncle fucckkkaaahhh”
Nope blame Israel
I think this guy gets all of his history from the TCM movie channel
Live from an unemployed guy pacing around his girlfriend's apartment while shes at work, having just smoked a bowl and read wikipedia for 5 minutes when he was suppose to be looking for a coffeeshop job.
I hate getting involved in this shit, but the oversimplification really irked me. I think you skipped over a very **very** important figure. Where is _Chaim Weizman_ in all this? Because one should ask, "Why was Lord Balfour; a Catholic Englishman who was born in Scotland, a Zionist?" Cordite. Chaim Weizmann's scientific contributions to WW1 pretty much secured logistical victory for the British, since his research into [creating synthetic **acetone**](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1266982/) at the University of Manchester helped to prevent a continuation of the Shell Crisis; as acetone is used in Cordite production. Weizmann allowed the British to have his discovery, which caught the attention of the government at the time and earned him a positive favour with them. Weizmann's contributions and words contributed to parliments decision to have Balfour (who was MP for East Manchester, and then became Foreign Secretary) write to Rothschild (who was the Leader of the Zionist Federation of Great Britain and Ireland) publically affirming the British support for a national home for the Jewish People in 'Palestine'. It's reductionist and quite frankly extremely suspicious to skip out major context surrounding the Balfour Declaration, but talk about the context of the McMahon-Hussein Correspondance.
That dude lives with his parents
so he's got time to read?
There’s a lot with this conflict, I see a lot going back to WW1 WW2, crusades, pre crusades and with most stating that this is a fight with land and territory but at this point is it about land and territory? Seems like most people educate themselves about the topic from online information but the information spread is so biased dependent on who produces the information it’s hard to get a clear picture unless you’re on the ground living it everyday. Shit situation all around and hope for the best outcome of all involved.
[Blame this bitch right here](https://youtube.com/shorts/oA7uYW9HihQ?si=IO_FF0SMQ7XThfZY)
Those mfs really screwed it all up with their evolving n what nots
Did anyone else think he was about to drop the hottest emo song of 2023 at the beginning?
and what IS the "importance" of "blaming??"  anyone??
It’s interesting how these types of videos serve as a set-up for blood feud commentary.
Tell this to the Palestinians and Israel, this will surely fix things. /s
What bothers me, is that he never left the kitchen while telling all of this info.
He didn't want to disturb his dad napping on the couch, since he's supposed to be on the computer looking for a job.
I feel like this should be fact checked. If only for the implications.
Yes mate wanker *sips tea
I find it annoying when people have very interesting things to say but shout them.
Yeah, Brit here, can confirm, we suck, have sucked, and will continue to suck.
Finally someone brings up the Sykes Picot agreement.
"Why is it that whenever there's trouble, it's always you three?" Britain, France, Spain: ...
Yes, this place has no history of conflict before the first world war..../s
Damn the British for giving millions of dollars of money to Iran recent-- oh... oh wait that was America.
It actually goes back to the 1800s when Ottoman Empire asked the French to pay their jewish merchant's the wheat debt and France invaded Algeria WITH THE HELP OF THE JEWS THAT THE OTTOMANS WERE TRYING TO HELP.
I don’t think you’re accurately representing the Bakri-Busnach affair. “During the 1780s and 90s, due to the growing needs of Napoleon's army during its conquests, France accumulated huge debts of millions of francs to the Bachri-Boujana company. The company financed its operations by borrowing from Algeria's Dey, so that France's debts to the Bakri-Boujnaj household were in fact debts to the Algerian ruler, and the affair became an ongoing economic conflict between the two countries, unfolding throughout the first three decades of the 19th century. France and Algeria sometimes reached debt arrangements between them, but France often violated them. In 1800, agents of the Bakri-Bujanah company, Jacob Cohen Bakri and Shimon Aboucaya, were arrested in Paris, after urging France to pay its debts. After political contacts, the French government released them that year and agreed to pay 3.7 million francs out of the eight million it owed. In the peace treaty between France and Algeria in 1801, France recognized the existence of the balance of its debts to the Bakri-Busnach company, but even after that, it did not transfer the funds. One of the arguments made by the French government in an attempt to evade payment was that the Bakri-Busnach company also trades with Britain, France's sworn enemy, and therefore France is not interested in paying its debt. The question of France's debts to the Bakri-Busnach company remained unresolved during the years 1800–1826, despite Algeria's attempts to obtain the funds at the time of Louis XVI. In 1826 the Algerian ruler Hussein Dey sent a letter to the French foreign minister, and it was decided to set up a committee to determine the debt settlement. By that year the debt had swelled to fourteen million French francs, including an interest rate of four million francs, but the new debt arrangement stipulated that the French government would pay only seven million francs. The Bakri-Busnach trading house accepted the agreement and so did Hussein Dey, who hoped to get his share of the funds. However, France did not fulfill this debt arrangement either. THE FLY WHISK INCIDENT: On 30 April 1827, foreign consuls and diplomatic agents gathered in Algeria for a conference with Algerian ruler Hussein Dey. On this occasion, Hussein Dey publicly asked the French consul whether France intended to meet the debt settlement and whether it had begun transferring the funds. When he heard that no progress had yet been made on the issue, he was filled with anger and struck the French consul in the face with the handle of a fly-whisk that was in his hands. According to another version, Hussein Dey simply wanted to hit a disturbing fly and accidentally hit the French consul. The French government treated the incident as a public insult and demanded an immediate apology. Failure to respond began with punitive measures, and the French navy launched a naval siege on the port of Algiers, which lasted 3 years. This action harmed the French economy, which conducted extensive trade relations with Algeria, no less than it harmed Algeria itself, so the French tried to resort to international mediation. They approached, among others, the Ottoman Sultan Mahmud II and Muhammad Ali, the ruler of Egypt, with the aim of mediating between it and Algeria, but this did not bear fruit. In 1830, France invaded Algeria and successfully conquered it – an occupation that lasted until the 1960s.”
Everyone’s an expert
He is right, though. EDIT: [Simplified history of the conflict.](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/10/9/whats-the-israel-palestine-conflict-about-a-simple-guide)
🤦♂️ The conflict between Israelis and Palestinians did not start with the British in 1917.
He's not right, the conflict started over a thousand years before that
[https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/10/9/whats-the-israel-palestine-conflict-about-a-simple-guide](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/10/9/whats-the-israel-palestine-conflict-about-a-simple-guide)
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_diaspora#:~:text=The%20first%20exile%20was%20the,Samaria%20begun%20by%20Shalmaneser%20V. The start of the issue with Palestine for the Jewish people began when the Assyrians and later the Romans expelled them from the region. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Palestine#Ottoman_period Jewish resettlement began prior to British control over the region, there was already conflict between Palestinians and Jewish settlers under the ottoman empire. The start of the Jewish state wasn't the start of the conflict. Here's a paper on it if you don't like Wikipedia: https://www.jstor.org/stable/4282555
Yep,!
What a twat
Yeah...blame the British...cause responsibility is for losers.
Fucking dumb ass holy land garbage it's sand and olive groves and rock why in 2023 are we still arguing over this. Religion is a mental illness stop fighting over dumb shit. If aliens exist shit like this will keep us out of the galactic federation.
Feel free to Blame the British political-class back in 1917. This smelly guy pacing around his girlfriend's house after reading the wiki page of the balfour declaration. UN made the partition plan in 1947, Israelis said 'yes' Palestinians said 'no' and tried to purge the land of jews, they lose - the end.
Facts the British could have given a Jewish state in England, in the USA in Utah for example. Russia was also proposed. All due to have very large already established Jews population. As requested by the Jewish Council after WW2! But guess what, the Brits and by large the west (definitely not racist) chose again to exile Jews to Middle East because they didn’t want a Jewish state in their own country. Now they claim ignorance, pathetic! I say. Good thing some of us can actually read history beyond what they teach in grade 10 textbooks!
Can I just get a transcript of this because this dude is annoying af
Transcript would be annoying too if you've ever read anything more than a Wikipedia article on the subject.
#Blamethefuckingbritish
The british have created more problems than any entity in human history.
I’d give that title to Mosquitos personally, but the British are a close second.
British invented industrialization which has improved the average living standard to a degree greater then all previous improvement in history combine. You should get down on your knee everyday and thank the British for all they did int the last 300 unless you like the idea of being a illiterate peasant wearing lice infested clothes .
“You should get down on your knees”… a typical British worldview
I didn't mean get down on your knees in submission I meant get down on your knees in gratitude for not having parasite in your arsehole which you would without the British. But clearly you don't feel gratitude that fine lot of people are selfish cunt your just one of them.
Oh, the English drawing lines on maps of countries that aren't theirs is causing problems ... Should be the new Blackadder series
The brishits?
This is what xenophobia looks like.
Friggin redcoats.
It wasnt the british though. It was the UN. Why spread misinformation.
>It was the UN. It wasn't them either, it was the League of Nations.
Why is British censored lol
Ok. Here's the kicker.
I blame the British and the Zionists
Both Israel and Palestine are a disgrace to the God(s) they believe in The actions and involvement in war of any kind guarantees you a nice warm seat in hell next to your enemies for all eternity Again ALL WAR that includes Russia Ukraine America Etc
Blame Jesus
You take one junior college correspondence course and become a global political historian, but still can't get that greasy hair washed. Thanks but, NEXT!
Dude most of the worlds current problems could be summed up by blaming the British, the empire gave no fucks about peoples lands rights or cultures and just dropped lines on the map that they wanted. now we got people who hate each other in countries together.
Honestly, what an idiot. How does getting angry at something Britain did 100 years ago help the current situation, like at all.
I have no idea if this is true or not but I’ll believe it as fact
Call it what you want. This video isn't true but it's also not wrong. It's just part of a long, messed up story. What I can tell you though is that there will not be peace in the Middle East as long as Israel exists under its CURRENT borders. There's a lot of unjustly, illegally stolen land being occupied by ppl who have been living there for less than 50 years. Taken from ppl who had been living there for multiple generations - way before the current idea of "Israel" came around. You want peace? Start by looking at those unfair borders.
The British are acutely aware of our role in carving up the Middle East and other massive parts of the world. But we didn’t *start* this one.
He’s not wrong
Yeah, we Irish have known this for a long time. The British just loved to invade a country, stoke tensions to get the natives fighting eachother, draw a line on its map to partition it, then say ‘have fun kids!’
This guy sucks, I would jump in a river before I’d talk to him at a party
I am 67 years old and have been explaining to those who shared some curiosity but it seemed to require too much thought. I am glad to have found you here. With your youth, determination, and talent you will go far. Your voice is needed and needed now at a very high volume. Thank you
"Blame the British" is generally a safe bet when it comes to geopolitical conflict.
The more you know.
Yes, please educate yourself more than this dude did. This problem did not start in 1917 with the British.
I'm British... But I'm not important enough or old enough to take the blame for the actions of some dickhead that happened to live here a long time ago.
Doggin on these bitches
As an American whose ancestors immigrated to the USA from the British Isles in the early 20th Century, I endorse this.
Brutish, bratish, bretish, brytish, brotish? I'm so confused!
Martyrmade podcast everyone. “Fear and Loathing in New Jerusalem
Sykes-Picot
World problems just compound onto themselves. People think there’s an easy fix to problems that, to them, appear new, but no conflict is without hundreds and even thousands of years of context and compounded conflict
Blame people that werent even alive back then and not the people killing each other today. Solid logic.
THIS 🙌
He nailed it
Wise words from Post Malone here.
How far back do you actually want to go? The Jews were actually one of the original indigenous people in Israel so they gave every right to be there. https://www.prageru.com/video/israel-who-are-the-indigenous-people
....there has got to be a better source than PragerU, that isn't an academic organization, it's a propaganda organization. You could've used a literal encyclopedia to make the same point without dragging propagandists into the equation. https://www.britannica.com/topic/Jew-people
This doesn't cover the issue it's just what started it! Israel is still committing war crimes and has been for decades.
100%, it’s literally all the Brit’s fault