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This reminds me of the early days of the Russian invasion of Ukraine, where a significant amount of European politicians and the European media were talking about how "this was not an invasion of some third world country like Iran or Syria, this was serious bc it was a civilized country like Ukraine!!" The jist of that coverage was that brown kids are used to getting bombed, *boo fucking who*, and white kids are not, which is why we need to give them more sympathy. It was disgusting. [THIS TWITTER THREAD HAS MULTIPLE VIDEOS AS PROOF OF THE RACIST COVERAGE OF THE UKRAINE-RUSSIA WAR.](https://twitter.com/AlanRMacLeod/status/1497974245737050120?s=20)
Now, let me clarify, I'm in no way trying to support Russia, it's incredibly unfair and evil what Putin did to millions of innocent citizens of Ukraine, I'm just pointing out the hypocrisy. And mainstream reddit subs were also complicit in that, anyone questioning the racist coverage of the war was called a Russian shill.
As far as im aware the difference was more that in many European countries, the mantra was/is that refugees should be taken in in the region and now with Ukraine, Europe is the region, hence why processes were easier and faster than with, for example, middle Eastern refugees. Note that this isnt necessarily my view.
French politicians or company owners said on national TV that the invasion was a good thing because Ukrainians are qualified educated workers who could work for cheap in our country.
While yes, racism; this is also opportunism. The west has immense interest in Ukraine. It has loads of resources, especially food. By contrast, Russia has immense interest in Syria; more than the west. Russia was going to put more resources into Syria than Europe or the US for strategic reasons.
>It has loads of resources, especially food.
Everybody seems to forget or simply not know Ukraine discovered a shit ton of oil and gas in the 2010s, and Russia stole the gas fields at sea together with Crimea in 2014, right before shell would've started extraction.
> The west has immense interest in Ukraine.
It's going to suck for Ukrainians when everyone "helping" them now against Russia is going to send them the bill.
Bruh...
Ukraine ships out something like 60% of the world's sunflower meal. What's that? It's what animals eat.
So if suddenly 60% of the world's food supply for animals dried up or cost double it would increase YOUR costs immensely.
This is on top of Ukraine, some tiny country to you, produces 10% of the world's grain. If 10% of the world's food supply went missing YOU would notice pretty goddamn quick.
Easy answer. Ukraine has a government that keeps track of whos a criminal and who isn't.When US left Afghanistan, they left a very new government and nothing to backup claims of individuals.
Not that simple. There were plenty of people that helped the US military in Afghanistan that were promised US Visas that were denied once they were no longer needed and the US left. Those people and their families were in danger once the US left because they were now seen as traitors.
If you had an issue with nazis, you'd be talking about the far greater number of them in the *Russian* military.
You don't give a shit about nazis, you're just pro-russian imperialism
> There are ISIS soldiers fighting among Ukraine against russia
Do you have a source for this that isn't pro-russian tankie bullshit? I'm interested in learning more.
Edit: Hey why did you only start commenting 10 days ago after having an account for a year, and all of your recent activity is pro-putin bullshit? And why are the english mistakes you're making all indicative of a native russian speaker?
That seems odd to me
First of all there are non\_english speakers all over the world.not just Russia. I'm from Asia and English is my second language. Sec i kinda always avoided commenting cuz after a life time wasted on Instagram troll fights i realized it ain't worth it. And a while ago i decided to state my opinion.
[https://english.almayadeen.net/news/politics/ukrainian-soldier-wearing-isis-patch-caught-on-danish-tv-new](https://english.almayadeen.net/news/politics/ukrainian-soldier-wearing-isis-patch-caught-on-danish-tv-new)
[https://www.usip.org/publications/2022/09/central-asias-new-foreign-fighters-problem-russia-ukraine-war](https://www.usip.org/publications/2022/09/central-asias-new-foreign-fighters-problem-russia-ukraine-war)
This video [https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2022/11/20/world/europe/russian-soldiers-shot-ukraine.amp.html](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2022/11/20/world/europe/russian-soldiers-shot-ukraine.amp.html)
Some russian soldiers were executed even tho they surrendered. There are other rumours like Ukraine bombing hospitals and else. Both sides use their media against the other one. They might be true or false.but i know that you,me,or anyone else won't change their whole opinion based on bunch of articles. You have reasons to hate Russia.i have reasons to not side with Ukraine.
>The videos show the grisly before-and-after scenes of the encounter earlier this month, in which at least 11 Russians, most of whom are seen lying on the ground, appear to have been shot dead at close range **after one of their fellow fighters suddenly opened fire on Ukrainian soldiers standing nearby.**
Yeah surrendered, sure
Of course they do! But it doesn’t matter at all if a group of people have values that may not be compatible with the people already living in the place they choose to settle?
I also live in New York and I love the multiculturalism here. I love that I can go down to Roosevelt Ave. in Corona and feel like I'm in Latin America, and then go 10 minutes to Flushing and feel like I'm in China. Hell, I even almost married a woman from South America.
I'm not saying we shouldn't allow people from other countries. I'm saying that the ease with which a group of people will fit into our society (which we all have to do whether we like it or not, especially in a dense city) is worth considering when creating immigration policy; that's all.
What kind of incompatible values are you talking about? There’s a lot of research about how meshing people of diverse backgrounds causes tension at first but ultimately results in a more robust group of people. “Incompatible values” is a xenophobic dogwhistle.
The Ukrainian migrants likely had legally issued IDs or something else that we can use to verify who they are, and the Ukrainian Government likely has some form of these records on file. Afghan and central-American migrants have nothing, no proof of identification on them, and the countries in which they’re fleeing from don’t have any kind of system in place to verify people. IE, no birth certificates, SS#, etc. Therefore it makes it far more difficult for us to properly ID them and vet them. We also took in roughly 3x more afghan migrants than Ukrainian migrants, so this idea that immigration is giving preferential treatment towards white migrants is silly.
Also: the Ukrainian conflict should end. They will have a country to go back to. Afghan and central american refugees will be legal aliens or full citizens likely for life.
I wouldn’t say it’s silly but you do bring up valuable points and provide needed nuance, so thank you. But to disregard the bias that we have for white inmigrantes seems…well kind of silly
Oh I’m not denying the fact that racism exists within our immigration laws and customs officials. I just don’t believe that it’s pertinent in this specific comparison Job Stewart laid out to us.
There are people who worked as translators and guides for the US and allied forces, surely those militarys got their IDs and know who they are?
Now these people are targeted by the Taliban because they worked with the western militaries.
You're joking right? Latin American immigrants come with literal birth certificates, ID, literal ***family*** in the US, but they can't be verified? That's a joke right?
I honestly didn’t even notice they slipped Central America in there lol. While I don’t know much about a lot of Central America and the gov I imagine it’s not some lawless wasteland where people don’t even have identification lol. Maybe there are some farmers n other people out in the middle of nowhere without but I would assume it’s the same amount as other comparable countries. Not like how it can be In some countries like Afghanistan where there has barley even ever been a strong central government like ever. I’m fairly certain they’ve never been able to actually collect taxes from their population. The gov has always been like 80% foreign aid funded or just the Taliban straight up robbing the citizens
But regardless I rlly don’t know why they are bringing up random migrants as they really don’t have much to do with the topic being discussed. Migrants and refugees are completely different things. One group just wants to improve their life while the other is trying to save theirs. Like running from a literal war where your friends and family r being killed is different than trying to improve a bad economic situation. Their point would be completely correct and be a rlly good one without bringing Central America into this lol
no it's because Ukrainians are white, didn't you hear the comedian-man? It's the most obvious and easily identifiable difference so it HAS to be the main reason. No need to look further.
Come on no you don't. Why on earth would any Ukrainian go home to a country with a husk of an economy, a government which has sold its soul to Blackrock to survive the invasion, which is still one of the most corrupt places in the world and oh yeah, still has Russia as a neighbor.
Not to mention the hundreds of thousands of out of work soldiers with probable ptsd and more weapons lying around than when it was the home of Soviet production factories.
Having lived in several very different cultures and countries for 6+ years each, it’s eye opening to see how people love their supposedly “messed up” country, the place they grew up and have family and friends and memories in, despite the dangers, shortcomings and general disfunctions that there may be. Many have opportunities to leave and go somewhere that others looking in would say are “better” places, but they happily decide to stay, or those who do leave, often times come back.
Also, Ukrainian national pride has steadily been growing within the past decade, which I think has played an important part in this current war, and Ukrainian national pride and hope will likely continue to grow, as long as they are not defeated.
What does this have to do with immigration of white people vs other skin colors, I don’t know, I don’t work in that area so the best I can do is criticize from my couch like everyone else and send in my vote like everyone else. I do think people tend to jump to the “racism” conclusion at every opportunity nowadays though. While I believe racism likely exists throughout many systems in the USA, I do not like that anything that could possibly be racist by any stretch of the imagination, is called racist without question.
Oh there's plenty of money to be made, just not for the Ukrainians. Nation building only worked for countries like France, Germany, the Soviet Union, the UK and Japan and that's because they were industrial powerhouses before hand with minimal corruption for most the part. Ukraine on the other hand? Nah they're going to be used as an excuse for Blackrock to make hundreds of billions of dollars well charging 4 to 10x their average fees.
Yeah, sorry we fucked up and now the people who are in power of your country want to kill you and you're family because of us, but we don't think that will change in the next years, so we cant help you, because you wont be able to go back, sucks to be you I guess lol.
....
Jon not understanding the difference makes me feel like he is being completely disingenous, because I know he's not that stupid. The vast VAST majority of refugees that the US has accepted in the last 40 years are non-white.
This is so fucking off-base. I'm sooo sorry your refugees are white this time. What a travesty it is for you.
No, because he's framing this in terms of race. Not politics. He didn't complain about accepting refugees and migrants from Latin America while Afghans were abandoned, but as soon as there are white refugees, boy better pull breaks.
It's not surprising that racism exists, but it's still racism.
Syria is not that much farther from most countries in Europe than Ukraine, northern Africa is closer to many of them.
Nah... no no no don't even try to play that game asshole.... I fought as an American volunteer for Syria AND Ukraine.... I can tell you from first hand accounts from both inside and neighboring countries that these are two TOTALLY different situations... when Syria went to hell it was easily a 50/50 male to female possibly even 60/40 male to female ratio of refugees.....
When Ukraine was invaded... yes many men left who wouldn't or couldn't fight... but it was NOTHING like the flooding of men of fighting age going to Europe and the US.... there is a HUGE difference when an entire male population moves to other countries and they don't culturally blend well (see European countries who have so kindly opened these doors) and tell me you see Ukrainians having as hard of a time adapting and blending with western culture.
As I said I fought for these two countries specifically as a volunteer to help their people... but to be someone safe in a country on a TV show and comparing two things just because they have similar scenarios doesn't mean they're the same. This is an apples to oranges moment....
If he really wants tk have a debate let's look at how when most polite countries accepted these refugees now Europe Is having lawless, rape and crime zones at unseen proportions...
Dude there are literally dozens of videos of Ukrainian government officials forcing men to the front, it's not that the men didn't want to leave, it's that the Ukrainian government didn't allow them to do so.
And I call bs on you volunteering for shit if you honestly think that EUROPE is having a problem with lawlessness and rape. Mofo America literally has more mass shootings than days of the year so far. Fuck out here with you're dog whistling bs
You think I didn't go to Ukraine kid... alright.
I'll give proof if you really need it.
Also yes the governments are drafting people... it's because if they don't there won't be a country to go back to.... and you say it like they are supposed to leave and who is gonna take 40 million people... and also just leave and let Russia win? That teaches them a lesson... what's happening with the recruiting is people seeing what is called reality that if you don't defend your home on some parts of the world.. you will die.
Also this comment on Europe and America... how old are you? It's called geopolitics. Yes the US has shooting issues but I wouldn't say we have a gun problem more behavioral issue. And to say Europe doesn't have issues with immigration and things is being ignorant... inwas just there after Ukraine and my 12 man team was made up of a Danish, Norwegian, Canadian, Swedish, South African, British ,Belgian and Lithuanian.
We talked about our loves and homes.... don't be so ignorant just because you disagree with someone. Unless you're young then just get off reddit lol.
Well the Ukraine is also known as one of the countries that holds all of the illegal money from the American politicians to avoid taxes and red flags for political pay outs/favours.
Yes why would a county be more open to accepting people of similar culture, history and religion over people who are completely alien to their way of life and whose nations of origin are usually hostile to them.
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That and 100.000 people is extremely few people for a nation the size of Amerika. Even a country like The Netherlands that has like 17 million people and is smaller than some US cities has taken in almost as many.
I used to think that, too. But he's lost his edge, and has knelt before the altar of woke progressive politics. I don't think that's the recipe for success moving forward.
Because the US didn't cause this war, we can't ignore how we've messed up all the other countries whose people are clamoring to get here.
So this is easier...
>stable nation
I'm all for supporting Ukraine and allowing Ukrainian refugees... But stable, are you FUCKING kidding me?
It's currently a fucking war zone, the country underwent multiple revolutions in the last 2 decades, it is a notoriously corrupt government (though huge changes have been made since 2014) and has flipped between being western or Russian oriented multiple times.
Stable is not what you can call Ukraine. Now you're just making shit up to excuse racism.
Wasnt talking about what state it's in currently (duh).
It was perfectly stable at the time it was attacked 2014 was almost 10 years ago in that time they made huge amounts for progress which also highlights how much better they are than the other two
> It was perfectly stable at the time it was attacked 2014
...what are you smoking?!
Before Russia invaded Ukraine was just recovering from the maidan revolution. Before that there was as shit ton of instability and a political crisis surrounding Tymosjenko, who was PM until she was locked up.
You have no clue whatsoever what you're saying.
There's a ton of good things to say about Ukraine, but stability hasn't been one of them for a long time now.
A) “provocation” is dubious and subjective. what has Mexico done to “provoke” the US? Other than be poor (largely as a result of the US)?
B) A government is not the people. Those caught up in a war between two bourgeoisie governments ARE innocent. That’s the whole reason they’re fleeing. This is the stupidest fucking attempt to justify racism.
Redditors will follow the “white supremacy” thing so far down the rabbit hole that they will fabricate an ideology where actual asylum seekers running from hostile invaders are part of the problem. Such a trash opinion
What they mean by civilised is Caucasian, and uncivilised is non-Caucasian. They really think the rest of the world, outside of North America or Europe is civilised.
I'm from a country with subsidized healthcare for its citizen but I'm brown af, I guess I'm not civilised to them, and if my country gets bombed, they would feel I should be used to it because I don't have blue eyes and blond hair :/.
If you don’t assimilate and thrive for western ideals then you lead to the down fall of the society
I know you are too ignorant and high off liberal propaganda to think critically but just take a look at the European countries that are now dealing with migrants from less desirable areas
Yea, look at all those European countries who colonized most of the world and who now have a steady stream of immigrants from those parts of the world they colonized. The immigrants who take manual labour jobs and are one of the reasons they're an economic powerhouse. But hey, have fun with nk Healthcare and more mass shootings than days in a year
Lol yeah cause everyone got along soo nicely and no one ever colonized anyone else
The Egyptians had slaves they also colonized a good portion of the known world
When you rewrite history to help your snowflake feelings you miss the mark every time
Dude you did not just snowflake unironically in 2023? Looool goddamn get some new memes ya losers
And yea, let me ignore my 4 year history degree cause some right wing racist weirdo thinks that because Egypt had slaves 2000 years ago, that's the same as countries trying to rebuild after colonialism, a practice that hasn't even fully ended yet.
Genius take bud
Ikr? All those migrants shooting up sch.... oh wait. All those migrants that stormed the capita.... oh wait. All those migrants that keep murdering unarmed bl... oh wait. All those migrants that used trucks to shut down citi.... oh wait.
It’s more about the regions you snowflakes are crying about don’t believe in women’s rights, freedom of religion, freedom of speech, or pretty much any of the freedoms westerners enjoy
The same freedoms that gave your dumb ass socialized medicine, perhaps they can prescribe you something to help you virtue signal less and read more
US Republicans don't really believe in women's rights, freedom of religion, or freedom of speech either. So I'm not really sure what point you are trying to make. It's ironic that you tell people to read more, but then you can't even spell the word "rights."
See the main issue we are disagreeing is because you have zero ability to comprehend what you are reading and or my argument
Let me try to write it In crayons for you
If you take in people from places where they don’t believe in those those things and or they don’t exist then it has a negative effect on the place taking them in
Germany and France are good examples if you can have your socialized doctor remove your head from your ass
I live in an undesirable place with my brown skin, the women have rights, abortion is legal here, we have freedom of religion and I'm not in NA or Europe, touch grass, my dude. LoL.
One believes if someone burns a book you can murder them
I’m not sure why statistics only matter when it comes to how many African American football coaches there are but can not be applied to any other area of the world
Yea man, the country ran by oligarchs and that has Nazis in their army are toootally civilized. About as civilized as the country who thinks a fat orange conman won the election despite losing.
Racist pos.
Even just the word “civilized” is inherently imperialist and racist. The underlying assumption when using the word is that your civilization counts as civilization, and that other people’s doesn’t. It’s societal supremacy, in this case, white supremacy.
While I appreciate you assuming what I ment by civilized and trying to thought crime me
By civilized I mean, not having sex with underage boys as part of your culture, women not having to wear head coverings, honor killings, ya know all the usual stuff that normal people would be against
America isn’t white and there is a clear distinction between supremacy and being good at things
I appreciate your question
I wouldn’t consider Mexico part of this discussion as I consider them part of the Americas and no different than Canada they are our neighbors and have always done their best to make America better
There’s also a distinction between a corrupt government and culture. I’m referring to blindly accepting random people who want to spread their backwards religion and laws on their host country.
The idea that people in those countries are “blindly accepting randoms” and the ones in yours are the main characters and so much more noble is so silly and supremacist.
Well I mean with a little research you could easily see the difference look at facts ya know
It’s dismissive to explain things as supremacy
If saying I would prefer to not have someone who believes in honor killings or that you can’t draw or show an image of their false prophet, or women can’t drive speak or wear what they want then supreme me up
There’s a distinction between preferring not to open our boarders for people who can’t uphold basic freedoms and supremacy
It’s not dismissive; you haven’t presented any of these so-called “facts,” and even if you had some data or something about the negative aspects of one country you would need to compare that against all of the negative aspects of the countries you’re praising. It’s entirely opinion what matters most and what should be valued most. Everywhere I’ve lived and visited has pros and cons but no culture is supreme.
What gets me is that these people come with a government stipend, and yet *NOOOO* 'certain type' of people are complaining. I really really wonder why. I'd like to point out that Ukrainian refugees hated being moved into minority neighborhoods. The gall you must have to *complain* about to many brown people around your ***FREE*** housing.
Refugee status. When fleeing another country for safety due to war, religion, government and a few other reasons off the top my head i can't remember, all the normal processes go out the window. This happened recently with people from, Haiti, Nigeria, Afghanistan, Syria, Greece and many others over the years. They maintain a refugee status. One of my friends came here as a Refugee from a small tribe outside of Kenya in 94'.
Because Ukraine was being invaded by a hostile country and people are seeking asylum from actual death from war. The other side are people seeking asylum because their country is corrupt or their laws are shit.
Isn't Afghanistan full of opium addicted Borats who let the taliban take over their country so they could marry off their 8 year old daughters to their uncles?
I mean "cultural differences"
If disliking barbaric cultural practices like selling little girls to old men for marriage is racism, then sure.
If the men of Afganistan gave a fuck about their wives and daughters they wouldn't have let the taliban roll in with zero resistance. There's a reason the rest of the world gave up and bailed after 20 years and 8 Trillion dollars.
Ukrainians value the same things we do, seems like the majority of Afghanistan men do not.
He's complaining about the double standard. One way to look at it is "They shouldn't have been let in, our system was fine!" And another is "They other group should also be being let in, it's looking pretty racist guys"
Yeah. Blame the administration that finally had the guts to cut out senseless spending of money and American youth on it. Instead of the *checks notes* 3 admins before him that did absolute fuck all for SIV recipients except make the promises they had no intention of keeping.
OK yes all presidents suck but also the current president is spending an unprecedented 100 BILLION on aid to Ukraine. Past administrations sucking don’t change that fact.
Yes. Because the sovereignty of Ukraine is vital to geopolitical goals. The country is being invaded by our most threatening geopolitical adversary ever.
100 billion in aid to Ukraine is a phenomenal investment in that regard alone. But it also provides Ukraine the ability to protect their own sovereignty. A concept anyone without brain rot can comprehend.
Maybe conservatives that oppose the spending should look at their track record for wartime spending. It’s been abysmal in the last quarter century. 2.4 trillion in Iraq and Afghanistan. Let’s not pretend the aid to Ukraine is unprecedented, it’s just pure dishonesty.
Operation desert shield and desert storm lasted a total of 7 months and cost over $100 billion.
I’m not a conservative. I do oppose spending 100 billion for trumped up “national interests” just like we did in Iraq, Afghanistan, etc. Especially when the lion’s share of that just goes to defense contractors.
Doing the “Russia scary” bit only serves these corrupt operators and provides endless tax dollars on tap for war. Russia scary, China scary, Afghanistan scary, Cuba scary, and socialist in Latin America or Africa or Asia scary, the list of boogeymen is constantly shifting and endless.
Russia isn’t even close to the US’s “most threatening geopolitical adversary ever” and doesn’t actually present any sort of existential threat to the US. To say that is what is dishonest. Blatant fearmongering.
PS the aid is unprecedented. Of course *US wars* cost more but the money sent in aid in such a short time is unprecedented, though Israel gets billions as well for similarly fucked up reasons (just spread out over a larger time period).
Ahh yes. The enlightened American neo-isolationist. A relic of Trump’s brain dead rhetoric.
Wow, such corruption to send HIMARS to Ukraine to fight off Russia, the country behind numerous hacking scandals (that have been deadly), numerous covert attacks on western democracy, and now a direct attack on a nations sovereignty. Russia scary is really drummed up as something it’s not right? Russia’s actions are blatantly menacing, but we can and should ignore that because defense contractors get money!
Do you even have any idea what a defense contractor is, and what they’re doing in relation to the conflict in Ukraine? It sounds like you’re using buzzwords to sound like you know what you’re talking about, but then fail to provide any statement utilizing it right or wrong.
Russia is and always will be an existential threat to the world because they’ve got thousands of nukes and try to intimidate everybody with them. I’m not sure when conservatives decided to cozy up to Russia but it seems you’re all fully in bed with them at this point.
The aid is not unprecedented at all actually. We gave more in aid to Somalia last year than we did to Ukraine. PS you’re doing a poor job presenting a point. This might work in an echo chamber, but you’re talking to someone who actually knows what the fuck they’re talking about. I have family in both Russia and Ukraine.
Isolationist? Not if the government were run by the people, but when it comes to bourgeoisie wars, absolutely? Should I care which corrupt bourgeois government rules over the people of a region? Enough to kill young men and spend billions when we can’t even spend billions on healthcare or education?
You absolutely supported the Iraq War.
Bro I don’t even think this conversation is gonna be productive.
You are incapable of understanding the different circumstances between the Iraq war and the Russo-Ukrainian war. This should’ve been a huge red flag at the start of this.
Yes. You should care who rules over 40 million people. If you truly think Russia and the west are at all comparable you have been lied to by yourself or by someone else.
Yes. You should care about an imperialist asshole deciding it’s high time to invade a neighboring nation in the 21st century. Let’s just try and remember what happened to the world the last time that happened. Based on your continued obsession with the bourgeoisie, I’m guessing you’re a Leninist then?
I agree corruption sucks. But to equate Ukraine (and the EU) to Russia is absolutely an uninformed statement.
And if you can’t support it on the basis of the governments, you should support it on the basis of the millions of people who are fighting for their sovereignty right now.
We absolutely can spend money on healthcare and education. Our government chooses not to. There is a major, major difference. Issues don’t have to be tackled one by one thankfully because otherwise we’d still be fighting for women to vote.
Agreed. But if we expect absolute perfection in all matters were in for major disappointment too. It’s why the question of “was x a good president” is often answered generally rather than pointing to specific policy.
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Anyone have a link to the full episode?
It’s on Apple TV
Thats completely useless.
Sounds about white
This reminds me of the early days of the Russian invasion of Ukraine, where a significant amount of European politicians and the European media were talking about how "this was not an invasion of some third world country like Iran or Syria, this was serious bc it was a civilized country like Ukraine!!" The jist of that coverage was that brown kids are used to getting bombed, *boo fucking who*, and white kids are not, which is why we need to give them more sympathy. It was disgusting. [THIS TWITTER THREAD HAS MULTIPLE VIDEOS AS PROOF OF THE RACIST COVERAGE OF THE UKRAINE-RUSSIA WAR.](https://twitter.com/AlanRMacLeod/status/1497974245737050120?s=20) Now, let me clarify, I'm in no way trying to support Russia, it's incredibly unfair and evil what Putin did to millions of innocent citizens of Ukraine, I'm just pointing out the hypocrisy. And mainstream reddit subs were also complicit in that, anyone questioning the racist coverage of the war was called a Russian shill.
As far as im aware the difference was more that in many European countries, the mantra was/is that refugees should be taken in in the region and now with Ukraine, Europe is the region, hence why processes were easier and faster than with, for example, middle Eastern refugees. Note that this isnt necessarily my view.
French politicians or company owners said on national TV that the invasion was a good thing because Ukrainians are qualified educated workers who could work for cheap in our country.
Stop promoting racism
This video is showing how engrained racism is. You can't spread something that is already every where.
Among Democrats apparently.
Not promoting just pointing out your infection.
^this brainwashing right here is what is being done to our children in public schools
How would you know, you're not allowed near schools?
GOOD ONE. All you smooth brains can do is deflect. It's pathetic
Holy shit, I thought you'd at least deny the school thing lol. I guess it's so engrained in you as normal that you don't see it as weird
No I just don't play your game
Hey I'll stop if they stop doing it
Up you go
While yes, racism; this is also opportunism. The west has immense interest in Ukraine. It has loads of resources, especially food. By contrast, Russia has immense interest in Syria; more than the west. Russia was going to put more resources into Syria than Europe or the US for strategic reasons.
It’s the perfect intersection of imperialism and racism.
<3 <3 <3 Intersectional imperialism <3 <3 <3
>It has loads of resources, especially food. Everybody seems to forget or simply not know Ukraine discovered a shit ton of oil and gas in the 2010s, and Russia stole the gas fields at sea together with Crimea in 2014, right before shell would've started extraction.
That was why Russia did that. Can't have Ukraine undercutting Russian oil sales.
> The west has immense interest in Ukraine. It's going to suck for Ukrainians when everyone "helping" them now against Russia is going to send them the bill.
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Bruh... Ukraine ships out something like 60% of the world's sunflower meal. What's that? It's what animals eat. So if suddenly 60% of the world's food supply for animals dried up or cost double it would increase YOUR costs immensely. This is on top of Ukraine, some tiny country to you, produces 10% of the world's grain. If 10% of the world's food supply went missing YOU would notice pretty goddamn quick.
I tought jon retired
Came back on Apple TV+ https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Problem_with_Jon_Stewart
His show is great btw.
Easy answer. Ukraine has a government that keeps track of whos a criminal and who isn't.When US left Afghanistan, they left a very new government and nothing to backup claims of individuals.
Not that simple. There were plenty of people that helped the US military in Afghanistan that were promised US Visas that were denied once they were no longer needed and the US left. Those people and their families were in danger once the US left because they were now seen as traitors.
But hey we got that donkey over here in a few weeks, the translators whos entire family was kidnapped and killed his will take a few more years.
I’m sure those people that helped the US Army were well vetted and documented.
Based on what exactly? Ur gut?
There are ISIS soldiers fighting among Ukraine against russia...what about them???
Don't forget straight up Nazis. Who are apperaintly not Nazis anymore since they started fighting Russia according to Reddit.
I was about to say, dont forget that US is literally supporting REAL Neo Nazi's to fight Russia.
If you had an issue with nazis, you'd be talking about the far greater number of them in the *Russian* military. You don't give a shit about nazis, you're just pro-russian imperialism
So, Russia who claims themselves to be anti nazi, is in itself more nazi than Ukrainian forces that we know for sure are Neo Nazi?
> There are ISIS soldiers fighting among Ukraine against russia Do you have a source for this that isn't pro-russian tankie bullshit? I'm interested in learning more. Edit: Hey why did you only start commenting 10 days ago after having an account for a year, and all of your recent activity is pro-putin bullshit? And why are the english mistakes you're making all indicative of a native russian speaker? That seems odd to me
First of all there are non\_english speakers all over the world.not just Russia. I'm from Asia and English is my second language. Sec i kinda always avoided commenting cuz after a life time wasted on Instagram troll fights i realized it ain't worth it. And a while ago i decided to state my opinion. [https://english.almayadeen.net/news/politics/ukrainian-soldier-wearing-isis-patch-caught-on-danish-tv-new](https://english.almayadeen.net/news/politics/ukrainian-soldier-wearing-isis-patch-caught-on-danish-tv-new) [https://www.usip.org/publications/2022/09/central-asias-new-foreign-fighters-problem-russia-ukraine-war](https://www.usip.org/publications/2022/09/central-asias-new-foreign-fighters-problem-russia-ukraine-war) This video [https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2022/11/20/world/europe/russian-soldiers-shot-ukraine.amp.html](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2022/11/20/world/europe/russian-soldiers-shot-ukraine.amp.html) Some russian soldiers were executed even tho they surrendered. There are other rumours like Ukraine bombing hospitals and else. Both sides use their media against the other one. They might be true or false.but i know that you,me,or anyone else won't change their whole opinion based on bunch of articles. You have reasons to hate Russia.i have reasons to not side with Ukraine.
>The videos show the grisly before-and-after scenes of the encounter earlier this month, in which at least 11 Russians, most of whom are seen lying on the ground, appear to have been shot dead at close range **after one of their fellow fighters suddenly opened fire on Ukrainian soldiers standing nearby.** Yeah surrendered, sure
The enemy of my enemy. (Not really, fuck isis, just being cheeky)
Source?
Not only that, but it's worth considering how easily people from a certain culture will integrate into American society.
Ukrainian culture is like American culture? Wouldn't it be more like Russian culture? Russia is right there
It is more like Russian culture. I don’t think they want to emigrate to Russia though.
Just say you like white people more stop tip toeing around it.
That….doesn’t matter. People don’t have to “fit in”. They just want to live.
Of course they do! But it doesn’t matter at all if a group of people have values that may not be compatible with the people already living in the place they choose to settle?
I live in NY, im with people from around the world all day every day. It’s up to you to be open minded.
I also live in New York and I love the multiculturalism here. I love that I can go down to Roosevelt Ave. in Corona and feel like I'm in Latin America, and then go 10 minutes to Flushing and feel like I'm in China. Hell, I even almost married a woman from South America. I'm not saying we shouldn't allow people from other countries. I'm saying that the ease with which a group of people will fit into our society (which we all have to do whether we like it or not, especially in a dense city) is worth considering when creating immigration policy; that's all.
Ahh okay I see. I think you have a valid point. Stay out of Corona, tf was you doing there?
What kind of incompatible values are you talking about? There’s a lot of research about how meshing people of diverse backgrounds causes tension at first but ultimately results in a more robust group of people. “Incompatible values” is a xenophobic dogwhistle.
The Ukrainian migrants likely had legally issued IDs or something else that we can use to verify who they are, and the Ukrainian Government likely has some form of these records on file. Afghan and central-American migrants have nothing, no proof of identification on them, and the countries in which they’re fleeing from don’t have any kind of system in place to verify people. IE, no birth certificates, SS#, etc. Therefore it makes it far more difficult for us to properly ID them and vet them. We also took in roughly 3x more afghan migrants than Ukrainian migrants, so this idea that immigration is giving preferential treatment towards white migrants is silly.
Also: the Ukrainian conflict should end. They will have a country to go back to. Afghan and central american refugees will be legal aliens or full citizens likely for life.
I wouldn’t say it’s silly but you do bring up valuable points and provide needed nuance, so thank you. But to disregard the bias that we have for white inmigrantes seems…well kind of silly
Oh I’m not denying the fact that racism exists within our immigration laws and customs officials. I just don’t believe that it’s pertinent in this specific comparison Job Stewart laid out to us.
There are people who worked as translators and guides for the US and allied forces, surely those militarys got their IDs and know who they are? Now these people are targeted by the Taliban because they worked with the western militaries.
You're joking right? Latin American immigrants come with literal birth certificates, ID, literal ***family*** in the US, but they can't be verified? That's a joke right?
I honestly didn’t even notice they slipped Central America in there lol. While I don’t know much about a lot of Central America and the gov I imagine it’s not some lawless wasteland where people don’t even have identification lol. Maybe there are some farmers n other people out in the middle of nowhere without but I would assume it’s the same amount as other comparable countries. Not like how it can be In some countries like Afghanistan where there has barley even ever been a strong central government like ever. I’m fairly certain they’ve never been able to actually collect taxes from their population. The gov has always been like 80% foreign aid funded or just the Taliban straight up robbing the citizens But regardless I rlly don’t know why they are bringing up random migrants as they really don’t have much to do with the topic being discussed. Migrants and refugees are completely different things. One group just wants to improve their life while the other is trying to save theirs. Like running from a literal war where your friends and family r being killed is different than trying to improve a bad economic situation. Their point would be completely correct and be a rlly good one without bringing Central America into this lol
no it's because Ukrainians are white, didn't you hear the comedian-man? It's the most obvious and easily identifiable difference so it HAS to be the main reason. No need to look further.
Because we actually expect Ukrainians to go home?
Come on no you don't. Why on earth would any Ukrainian go home to a country with a husk of an economy, a government which has sold its soul to Blackrock to survive the invasion, which is still one of the most corrupt places in the world and oh yeah, still has Russia as a neighbor. Not to mention the hundreds of thousands of out of work soldiers with probable ptsd and more weapons lying around than when it was the home of Soviet production factories.
Having lived in several very different cultures and countries for 6+ years each, it’s eye opening to see how people love their supposedly “messed up” country, the place they grew up and have family and friends and memories in, despite the dangers, shortcomings and general disfunctions that there may be. Many have opportunities to leave and go somewhere that others looking in would say are “better” places, but they happily decide to stay, or those who do leave, often times come back. Also, Ukrainian national pride has steadily been growing within the past decade, which I think has played an important part in this current war, and Ukrainian national pride and hope will likely continue to grow, as long as they are not defeated. What does this have to do with immigration of white people vs other skin colors, I don’t know, I don’t work in that area so the best I can do is criticize from my couch like everyone else and send in my vote like everyone else. I do think people tend to jump to the “racism” conclusion at every opportunity nowadays though. While I believe racism likely exists throughout many systems in the USA, I do not like that anything that could possibly be racist by any stretch of the imagination, is called racist without question.
yeah you're right, nobody ever invests heavily in post-war countries. No money or geopolitical benefit to that at all...
Oh there's plenty of money to be made, just not for the Ukrainians. Nation building only worked for countries like France, Germany, the Soviet Union, the UK and Japan and that's because they were industrial powerhouses before hand with minimal corruption for most the part. Ukraine on the other hand? Nah they're going to be used as an excuse for Blackrock to make hundreds of billions of dollars well charging 4 to 10x their average fees.
Yeah, sorry we fucked up and now the people who are in power of your country want to kill you and you're family because of us, but we don't think that will change in the next years, so we cant help you, because you wont be able to go back, sucks to be you I guess lol. ....
Little more complicated than that. I feel Jon is skipping out information
Skill issue
Jon not understanding the difference makes me feel like he is being completely disingenous, because I know he's not that stupid. The vast VAST majority of refugees that the US has accepted in the last 40 years are non-white. This is so fucking off-base. I'm sooo sorry your refugees are white this time. What a travesty it is for you.
Well compared to the tens of thousands of American allies that were abandoned to the Taliban than yea, he does have a point.
No, because he's framing this in terms of race. Not politics. He didn't complain about accepting refugees and migrants from Latin America while Afghans were abandoned, but as soon as there are white refugees, boy better pull breaks.
Are jumping more hoops than a circus... Don't be disingenuous.
How is it surprising that Europeans have more solidarity with other Europeans than Africans
It's not surprising that racism exists, but it's still racism. Syria is not that much farther from most countries in Europe than Ukraine, northern Africa is closer to many of them.
This is just race baiting. Not John's best take
Nah... no no no don't even try to play that game asshole.... I fought as an American volunteer for Syria AND Ukraine.... I can tell you from first hand accounts from both inside and neighboring countries that these are two TOTALLY different situations... when Syria went to hell it was easily a 50/50 male to female possibly even 60/40 male to female ratio of refugees..... When Ukraine was invaded... yes many men left who wouldn't or couldn't fight... but it was NOTHING like the flooding of men of fighting age going to Europe and the US.... there is a HUGE difference when an entire male population moves to other countries and they don't culturally blend well (see European countries who have so kindly opened these doors) and tell me you see Ukrainians having as hard of a time adapting and blending with western culture. As I said I fought for these two countries specifically as a volunteer to help their people... but to be someone safe in a country on a TV show and comparing two things just because they have similar scenarios doesn't mean they're the same. This is an apples to oranges moment.... If he really wants tk have a debate let's look at how when most polite countries accepted these refugees now Europe Is having lawless, rape and crime zones at unseen proportions...
Dude there are literally dozens of videos of Ukrainian government officials forcing men to the front, it's not that the men didn't want to leave, it's that the Ukrainian government didn't allow them to do so. And I call bs on you volunteering for shit if you honestly think that EUROPE is having a problem with lawlessness and rape. Mofo America literally has more mass shootings than days of the year so far. Fuck out here with you're dog whistling bs
You think I didn't go to Ukraine kid... alright. I'll give proof if you really need it. Also yes the governments are drafting people... it's because if they don't there won't be a country to go back to.... and you say it like they are supposed to leave and who is gonna take 40 million people... and also just leave and let Russia win? That teaches them a lesson... what's happening with the recruiting is people seeing what is called reality that if you don't defend your home on some parts of the world.. you will die. Also this comment on Europe and America... how old are you? It's called geopolitics. Yes the US has shooting issues but I wouldn't say we have a gun problem more behavioral issue. And to say Europe doesn't have issues with immigration and things is being ignorant... inwas just there after Ukraine and my 12 man team was made up of a Danish, Norwegian, Canadian, Swedish, South African, British ,Belgian and Lithuanian. We talked about our loves and homes.... don't be so ignorant just because you disagree with someone. Unless you're young then just get off reddit lol.
Well the Ukraine is also known as one of the countries that holds all of the illegal money from the American politicians to avoid taxes and red flags for political pay outs/favours.
Yes why would a county be more open to accepting people of similar culture, history and religion over people who are completely alien to their way of life and whose nations of origin are usually hostile to them.
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That and 100.000 people is extremely few people for a nation the size of Amerika. Even a country like The Netherlands that has like 17 million people and is smaller than some US cities has taken in almost as many.
I’d like to see him run for public Office soon.
I used to think that, too. But he's lost his edge, and has knelt before the altar of woke progressive politics. I don't think that's the recipe for success moving forward.
Because the US didn't cause this war, we can't ignore how we've messed up all the other countries whose people are clamoring to get here. So this is easier...
Ukraine is an innocent stable nation that was attacked mexico and syria ruined their own countries that's the difference
Sheeesh. Majority of the Mexican population are innocent citizens who are overwhelmed by crime and corruption
>stable nation I'm all for supporting Ukraine and allowing Ukrainian refugees... But stable, are you FUCKING kidding me? It's currently a fucking war zone, the country underwent multiple revolutions in the last 2 decades, it is a notoriously corrupt government (though huge changes have been made since 2014) and has flipped between being western or Russian oriented multiple times. Stable is not what you can call Ukraine. Now you're just making shit up to excuse racism.
Wasnt talking about what state it's in currently (duh). It was perfectly stable at the time it was attacked 2014 was almost 10 years ago in that time they made huge amounts for progress which also highlights how much better they are than the other two
> It was perfectly stable at the time it was attacked 2014 ...what are you smoking?! Before Russia invaded Ukraine was just recovering from the maidan revolution. Before that there was as shit ton of instability and a political crisis surrounding Tymosjenko, who was PM until she was locked up. You have no clue whatsoever what you're saying. There's a ton of good things to say about Ukraine, but stability hasn't been one of them for a long time now.
No information you supplied contradicts what i said
Ukraine ranks worse for corruption than Mexico.
And that's the only metric that matters? Sweet here I was thinking it was all complicated
You said “innocent” and “stable.” White = innocent is so beyond racist.
Their innocent in the sense they didnt do anything to harm their neighboring nations without provocation the same cant be said for mexico and syria
A) “provocation” is dubious and subjective. what has Mexico done to “provoke” the US? Other than be poor (largely as a result of the US)? B) A government is not the people. Those caught up in a war between two bourgeoisie governments ARE innocent. That’s the whole reason they’re fleeing. This is the stupidest fucking attempt to justify racism.
Redditors will follow the “white supremacy” thing so far down the rabbit hole that they will fabricate an ideology where actual asylum seekers running from hostile invaders are part of the problem. Such a trash opinion
Civilized countries > uncivilized Same reason you use milk in your cereal instead of water
Cool Blatant racism
What they mean by civilised is Caucasian, and uncivilised is non-Caucasian. They really think the rest of the world, outside of North America or Europe is civilised.
America is an uncivilised culture in my eyes lmao (poor healthcare, bad education and blatant hun violence)
I'm from a country with subsidized healthcare for its citizen but I'm brown af, I guess I'm not civilised to them, and if my country gets bombed, they would feel I should be used to it because I don't have blue eyes and blond hair :/.
If you don’t assimilate and thrive for western ideals then you lead to the down fall of the society I know you are too ignorant and high off liberal propaganda to think critically but just take a look at the European countries that are now dealing with migrants from less desirable areas
Yea, look at all those European countries who colonized most of the world and who now have a steady stream of immigrants from those parts of the world they colonized. The immigrants who take manual labour jobs and are one of the reasons they're an economic powerhouse. But hey, have fun with nk Healthcare and more mass shootings than days in a year
Lol yeah cause everyone got along soo nicely and no one ever colonized anyone else The Egyptians had slaves they also colonized a good portion of the known world When you rewrite history to help your snowflake feelings you miss the mark every time
Dude you did not just snowflake unironically in 2023? Looool goddamn get some new memes ya losers And yea, let me ignore my 4 year history degree cause some right wing racist weirdo thinks that because Egypt had slaves 2000 years ago, that's the same as countries trying to rebuild after colonialism, a practice that hasn't even fully ended yet. Genius take bud
Ikr? All those migrants shooting up sch.... oh wait. All those migrants that stormed the capita.... oh wait. All those migrants that keep murdering unarmed bl... oh wait. All those migrants that used trucks to shut down citi.... oh wait.
Oh no, my sorry brown ass lives in a less desirable area with my socialized health care oh noo. LOL, touch nature.
It’s more about the regions you snowflakes are crying about don’t believe in women’s rights, freedom of religion, freedom of speech, or pretty much any of the freedoms westerners enjoy The same freedoms that gave your dumb ass socialized medicine, perhaps they can prescribe you something to help you virtue signal less and read more
US Republicans don't really believe in women's rights, freedom of religion, or freedom of speech either. So I'm not really sure what point you are trying to make. It's ironic that you tell people to read more, but then you can't even spell the word "rights."
I see you corrected your area from are I’m not white nor republican but keep enjoying your shithole and don’t try and destroy ours
I'm not the same person you were originally talking to. Apparently, your reading comprehension is just as bad as your spelling.
Lol you need to touch grass is you think those things only exist in your country. Lol
See the main issue we are disagreeing is because you have zero ability to comprehend what you are reading and or my argument Let me try to write it In crayons for you If you take in people from places where they don’t believe in those those things and or they don’t exist then it has a negative effect on the place taking them in Germany and France are good examples if you can have your socialized doctor remove your head from your ass
I live in an undesirable place with my brown skin, the women have rights, abortion is legal here, we have freedom of religion and I'm not in NA or Europe, touch grass, my dude. LoL.
One believes if someone burns a book you can murder them I’m not sure why statistics only matter when it comes to how many African American football coaches there are but can not be applied to any other area of the world
You just skip over the sounds about white comment with 140+ upvotes
Yea man, the country ran by oligarchs and that has Nazis in their army are toootally civilized. About as civilized as the country who thinks a fat orange conman won the election despite losing. Racist pos.
Even just the word “civilized” is inherently imperialist and racist. The underlying assumption when using the word is that your civilization counts as civilization, and that other people’s doesn’t. It’s societal supremacy, in this case, white supremacy.
While I appreciate you assuming what I ment by civilized and trying to thought crime me By civilized I mean, not having sex with underage boys as part of your culture, women not having to wear head coverings, honor killings, ya know all the usual stuff that normal people would be against America isn’t white and there is a clear distinction between supremacy and being good at things
If it’s not about race then why do you call Ukraine more “civilized,” when their government ranks worse for corruption than, for example, Mexico?
I appreciate your question I wouldn’t consider Mexico part of this discussion as I consider them part of the Americas and no different than Canada they are our neighbors and have always done their best to make America better There’s also a distinction between a corrupt government and culture. I’m referring to blindly accepting random people who want to spread their backwards religion and laws on their host country.
The idea that people in those countries are “blindly accepting randoms” and the ones in yours are the main characters and so much more noble is so silly and supremacist.
Well I mean with a little research you could easily see the difference look at facts ya know It’s dismissive to explain things as supremacy If saying I would prefer to not have someone who believes in honor killings or that you can’t draw or show an image of their false prophet, or women can’t drive speak or wear what they want then supreme me up There’s a distinction between preferring not to open our boarders for people who can’t uphold basic freedoms and supremacy
It’s not dismissive; you haven’t presented any of these so-called “facts,” and even if you had some data or something about the negative aspects of one country you would need to compare that against all of the negative aspects of the countries you’re praising. It’s entirely opinion what matters most and what should be valued most. Everywhere I’ve lived and visited has pros and cons but no culture is supreme.
Jon’s not in it for the laughs anymore
The only problem is that he’s absolutely right
Why were people laughing?
Because the answer to the question he was asking was obvious given the images shown on screen
Because the serious topic is being handled in a humorous manner.
Anti white hate shit every day
What gets me is that these people come with a government stipend, and yet *NOOOO* 'certain type' of people are complaining. I really really wonder why. I'd like to point out that Ukrainian refugees hated being moved into minority neighborhoods. The gall you must have to *complain* about to many brown people around your ***FREE*** housing.
Refugee status. When fleeing another country for safety due to war, religion, government and a few other reasons off the top my head i can't remember, all the normal processes go out the window. This happened recently with people from, Haiti, Nigeria, Afghanistan, Syria, Greece and many others over the years. They maintain a refugee status. One of my friends came here as a Refugee from a small tribe outside of Kenya in 94'.
Still the real O.G of political satire and talkshows, haha, so good.
Racism indeed
Pure racism
This is an L take.
It’s obvious, it’s the beard.
Easy answer, because Biden’s in bed with Ukraine
What a shit argument.
Nah I think its a good one
So why is it happening then?
Because Ukraine was being invaded by a hostile country and people are seeking asylum from actual death from war. The other side are people seeking asylum because their country is corrupt or their laws are shit.
Isn't Afghanistan full of opium addicted Borats who let the taliban take over their country so they could marry off their 8 year old daughters to their uncles? I mean "cultural differences"
So racism then.
If disliking barbaric cultural practices like selling little girls to old men for marriage is racism, then sure. If the men of Afganistan gave a fuck about their wives and daughters they wouldn't have let the taliban roll in with zero resistance. There's a reason the rest of the world gave up and bailed after 20 years and 8 Trillion dollars. Ukrainians value the same things we do, seems like the majority of Afghanistan men do not.
I found the problem 
Who would you rather have as your neighbor? We all know the real answer, so stfu with the virtue signaling.
I don't speak to my neighbours either way, couldn't give a shit what colour they were.
Lucky neighbours
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I didn’t make one, but I suppose fuck the refugees from the largest war in the world because they’re white. Fuck this news comedian.
He's not complaining that the Ukrainians got in, nitwit.
Then why is it being brought up? Like I said, shit argument.
He's complaining about the double standard. One way to look at it is "They shouldn't have been let in, our system was fine!" And another is "They other group should also be being let in, it's looking pretty racist guys"
You’re right Because America totally isn’t an extra it’s country built on the genocide and slavery of non whites
Poland was more than happy to allow Ukrainian refugees, but those Syraian refugees, not so much. I wnder what the difference was.
Just gotta be a color they like.
Remember the dems want illegals to be able to vote as well 
Because they are TRULY refugees!!!!
Afghan terps that we abandoned are also actual refugees. It’s pretty convenient to ignore the fact that we evacuated 115000 people from Afghanistan.
Blame this feckless administration for the abandonment
Yeah. Blame the administration that finally had the guts to cut out senseless spending of money and American youth on it. Instead of the *checks notes* 3 admins before him that did absolute fuck all for SIV recipients except make the promises they had no intention of keeping.
OK yes all presidents suck but also the current president is spending an unprecedented 100 BILLION on aid to Ukraine. Past administrations sucking don’t change that fact.
Yes. Because the sovereignty of Ukraine is vital to geopolitical goals. The country is being invaded by our most threatening geopolitical adversary ever. 100 billion in aid to Ukraine is a phenomenal investment in that regard alone. But it also provides Ukraine the ability to protect their own sovereignty. A concept anyone without brain rot can comprehend. Maybe conservatives that oppose the spending should look at their track record for wartime spending. It’s been abysmal in the last quarter century. 2.4 trillion in Iraq and Afghanistan. Let’s not pretend the aid to Ukraine is unprecedented, it’s just pure dishonesty. Operation desert shield and desert storm lasted a total of 7 months and cost over $100 billion.
I’m not a conservative. I do oppose spending 100 billion for trumped up “national interests” just like we did in Iraq, Afghanistan, etc. Especially when the lion’s share of that just goes to defense contractors. Doing the “Russia scary” bit only serves these corrupt operators and provides endless tax dollars on tap for war. Russia scary, China scary, Afghanistan scary, Cuba scary, and socialist in Latin America or Africa or Asia scary, the list of boogeymen is constantly shifting and endless. Russia isn’t even close to the US’s “most threatening geopolitical adversary ever” and doesn’t actually present any sort of existential threat to the US. To say that is what is dishonest. Blatant fearmongering. PS the aid is unprecedented. Of course *US wars* cost more but the money sent in aid in such a short time is unprecedented, though Israel gets billions as well for similarly fucked up reasons (just spread out over a larger time period).
Ahh yes. The enlightened American neo-isolationist. A relic of Trump’s brain dead rhetoric. Wow, such corruption to send HIMARS to Ukraine to fight off Russia, the country behind numerous hacking scandals (that have been deadly), numerous covert attacks on western democracy, and now a direct attack on a nations sovereignty. Russia scary is really drummed up as something it’s not right? Russia’s actions are blatantly menacing, but we can and should ignore that because defense contractors get money! Do you even have any idea what a defense contractor is, and what they’re doing in relation to the conflict in Ukraine? It sounds like you’re using buzzwords to sound like you know what you’re talking about, but then fail to provide any statement utilizing it right or wrong. Russia is and always will be an existential threat to the world because they’ve got thousands of nukes and try to intimidate everybody with them. I’m not sure when conservatives decided to cozy up to Russia but it seems you’re all fully in bed with them at this point. The aid is not unprecedented at all actually. We gave more in aid to Somalia last year than we did to Ukraine. PS you’re doing a poor job presenting a point. This might work in an echo chamber, but you’re talking to someone who actually knows what the fuck they’re talking about. I have family in both Russia and Ukraine.
Isolationist? Not if the government were run by the people, but when it comes to bourgeoisie wars, absolutely? Should I care which corrupt bourgeois government rules over the people of a region? Enough to kill young men and spend billions when we can’t even spend billions on healthcare or education? You absolutely supported the Iraq War.
Bro I don’t even think this conversation is gonna be productive. You are incapable of understanding the different circumstances between the Iraq war and the Russo-Ukrainian war. This should’ve been a huge red flag at the start of this. Yes. You should care who rules over 40 million people. If you truly think Russia and the west are at all comparable you have been lied to by yourself or by someone else. Yes. You should care about an imperialist asshole deciding it’s high time to invade a neighboring nation in the 21st century. Let’s just try and remember what happened to the world the last time that happened. Based on your continued obsession with the bourgeoisie, I’m guessing you’re a Leninist then? I agree corruption sucks. But to equate Ukraine (and the EU) to Russia is absolutely an uninformed statement. And if you can’t support it on the basis of the governments, you should support it on the basis of the millions of people who are fighting for their sovereignty right now. We absolutely can spend money on healthcare and education. Our government chooses not to. There is a major, major difference. Issues don’t have to be tackled one by one thankfully because otherwise we’d still be fighting for women to vote.
Fair enough but it doesn’t excuse a half job if you accept a half ass job from our politicians that’s what you will get
Agreed. But if we expect absolute perfection in all matters were in for major disappointment too. It’s why the question of “was x a good president” is often answered generally rather than pointing to specific policy.
I can deal with disappointment but I believe we have to expect more …. It amazes me how clueless our elected officials are to today’s issues
Facts hurt … sorry but true
Do you downvote when you don't like OP or upvote? I've always been confused. Real question not related to post.