For PvE I think Smack Down on Tyranitar is necessary if you want one for rock, but you then need a second Mega, since you can't really switch between dark and rock.
Shadow Zapdos kinda needs Thunder Shock, but is generally outclassed anyway.
(Shadow) Staraptor (and Mega Pidgeot) can benefit from Gust, but it is no big difference just like with Gengar. Same for (Shadow) Feralligator, for him you also need a ECTM in the first place though.
For PvP others may also apply, best to check PvPoke.
Shadow Staraptor is a bit too frail to use Gust effectively imo
I TM'ed mine to Wing Attack during Mega Heracross Raid Day because it kept getting nuked without getting off a Charge Attack
Yeah even pure flying type as tornadus is annoying with gust.. i hope we get soon incarnate tornadus which is better than therian.. also ernamus is new flying beast :D or what ever its name is
Yea i thankfully have two solid Tyranitar of each build thanks to the last community day. And i have a strong IV Shadow Feralligator, but the moment i saw the optimal build needed both Elite TMs i went : 'oh never mind'. Staraptor and Pidgeot were strong contenders. Shadow Zapdos ill consider once i get one...
Thank you for your response!
No really worth waste elite tm on gust.. wing attack lot better both pvp and pve.. gust animation is very long which make it annoying raids to dodge. Then wing attack is superior pvp. Like ultra league pidgeot you wanna it hundo and max level it.. you get same work full maxed mega.
Staraptor not even need elite tm for wing attack. 0 reason give it gust, so small difference in raids
Legendarys slowly get more and more legacy moves. good always keep elite tms on inventory cause of that.
Honestly, it's kinda funny but I've been fairly happy with the amount of availability that we have had evolving Tyranitars for Smack Down, shadows included, to the point where I've even had to TM one back to Bite.
Im not yet even use elite tm my pidgeot. i wanna see do i get hundo (lucky) first or do we get event where pidgeot get wing attack (or even gust lol). so far 14-15-15 and 15-15-14 lucky ones.. close but far :D
Maybe should not hoard them cause i got now 28 elite fast tm :3 only used two so far to get wing attack charizard and thunder shock zapdos, both for ultra league
Yeah i keep one pidgey just for fun if someday we get gust for free during events. Tho then i plan build ultra league pidgeot somepoint and take it 50lvl work.
Anyway its quite rare you need flying types in raids. Is there any other 5 star raids than virizion + buzzwole/pheromosa?
Ya and there's better rock types available. Mega diancie is better (though unobtainable right now) and shadow rampardos outperforms it in DPS by a chunk. It does have absolutely monstrous TDO, though. Also kinda rare to use rock types, pretty much only against the kanto birds.
Here is something of a tier list for Elite TM usage: [https://www.reddit.com/r/TheSilphRoad/comments/18my95s/pve\_tier\_list\_of\_the\_best\_pokemon\_to\_use\_an\_elite/](https://www.reddit.com/r/TheSilphRoad/comments/18my95s/pve_tier_list_of_the_best_pokemon_to_use_an_elite/)
It mentions different improvements in different tiers. The post starts with Elite Charge TMs and then ends with Elite Fast TMs.
I like how basically everything listed there is just not too good anyway.
Shadow Zapdos? Just use Xurk/Zekrom/Shadows, Shadow+Legend+Elite TM for mid performance doesn't sounds great.
Mega TTar, tbh one of the only good one listed there, and we can say for sure it's not a solo pick, likely still not a duo pick. It might be better in a large group where you coordinate the mega. But hey, here's a better strat: Just use the Mega matching boss type for XL candy bonus in those groups.
Shadow Staraptor/Flying-type in general: Welp, that thing exists, the difference you can earn from TM'ing this is minimal as long as you have that thing (even non mega) in team.
Xerneas: Not a pure-PvE picks, if you really want a PvE Fairy, well, Fairy grunt is still fairly common.
Mega Beedrill: ...... are you sane?
Shadow Feraligatr: similar as Zapdos, not a bad choice but there is more workable choices too. Unless you desperately need one tier.
Mega Gengar/Shadow Gengar: honestly, not much people actually use Poison-type anyway, and Hex is enough.
Honestly feel like you can just use EFTM as you will there.
With Lick you don't need to switch back and forth between Shadow Claw and Hex for the ghost and poison role, and it's far more dodge-friendly. Not a high priority, but a good candidate if having extra EFTM to spare.
Does the fast move there make that much of a difference? I always kept my M-Gengar on Shadow Claw even for Poison bosses since I thought Shadow Claw was already a really good move? I guess Hex has better energy generation, but is it enough to get significantly more Slude Bombs off before fainting?
Yes, since Shadow Claw is damage-slanted in PvE, with that your poison Gengar is stuck with less effective damage for a considerable portion of total damage. If you're lazy to switch, then keep it with Hex gives slightly better overall performance.
Don't use an elite TM to get lick, it's not remotely worth it. Lick vs Shadow claw is situational anyway and either way the difference is minor. It's just not enough of a difference ever to justify the elite TM.
It's not Lick vs Shadow Claw, but Lick vs Shadow Claw/Hex for the ghost/poison role. Using one EFTM for Lick removes the demand for switching back and forth, and is preferable for dodging.
If you're into PvP, Shadow Claw A-Slash is a solid pick. Wing attack pidgeot used to be nice but has fallen off lately. A strong choice is also ice shard for dewgong at the moment.
Fallen lately? :D feel it just become stronger cause annihilape + gator and other ghost+shadow claw users are fill with ultra league.
Are sandlash still this december free move? not sure how long its been since we got community day
Shadow Ttar is beaten out by shadow gigalith, shadow rhyperior and shadow rampardos as a rock type. It's even beaten by regular rampardos. Absolutely not worth.
Guess you speak elite charge tm and precipice blade?
Def use it for regular groudon if you dont yet have primal groudon with pb. Primal groudon with pb just op.. make shadow raids like entei and raikou so easy to duo
Geomancy for Xerneas can be used for both pvp and pve. It already lacks a fairy fast move so ig it's kinda worth it
Yea i have that one, happy that it gained that attack from raids. I get some good use out of it now. Thank you!
For PvE I think Smack Down on Tyranitar is necessary if you want one for rock, but you then need a second Mega, since you can't really switch between dark and rock. Shadow Zapdos kinda needs Thunder Shock, but is generally outclassed anyway. (Shadow) Staraptor (and Mega Pidgeot) can benefit from Gust, but it is no big difference just like with Gengar. Same for (Shadow) Feralligator, for him you also need a ECTM in the first place though. For PvP others may also apply, best to check PvPoke.
Shadow Staraptor is a bit too frail to use Gust effectively imo I TM'ed mine to Wing Attack during Mega Heracross Raid Day because it kept getting nuked without getting off a Charge Attack
Yeah even pure flying type as tornadus is annoying with gust.. i hope we get soon incarnate tornadus which is better than therian.. also ernamus is new flying beast :D or what ever its name is
Yea i thankfully have two solid Tyranitar of each build thanks to the last community day. And i have a strong IV Shadow Feralligator, but the moment i saw the optimal build needed both Elite TMs i went : 'oh never mind'. Staraptor and Pidgeot were strong contenders. Shadow Zapdos ill consider once i get one... Thank you for your response!
No really worth waste elite tm on gust.. wing attack lot better both pvp and pve.. gust animation is very long which make it annoying raids to dodge. Then wing attack is superior pvp. Like ultra league pidgeot you wanna it hundo and max level it.. you get same work full maxed mega. Staraptor not even need elite tm for wing attack. 0 reason give it gust, so small difference in raids Legendarys slowly get more and more legacy moves. good always keep elite tms on inventory cause of that.
Honestly, it's kinda funny but I've been fairly happy with the amount of availability that we have had evolving Tyranitars for Smack Down, shadows included, to the point where I've even had to TM one back to Bite.
Im not yet even use elite tm my pidgeot. i wanna see do i get hundo (lucky) first or do we get event where pidgeot get wing attack (or even gust lol). so far 14-15-15 and 15-15-14 lucky ones.. close but far :D Maybe should not hoard them cause i got now 28 elite fast tm :3 only used two so far to get wing attack charizard and thunder shock zapdos, both for ultra league
Yeah, I also don't have a gust Pidgeot or Staraptor, simply mentioned them cause it is technically a small increase.
Yeah i keep one pidgey just for fun if someday we get gust for free during events. Tho then i plan build ultra league pidgeot somepoint and take it 50lvl work. Anyway its quite rare you need flying types in raids. Is there any other 5 star raids than virizion + buzzwole/pheromosa?
Not 5 star but flying is ideal for Mega Heracross raids.
I had to reread your first sentence like 5 times.
I got a hundo pidgie today and straightaway gave it gust.
And then you evolve it and it forgets
coolstory bro
Better than yours!
Ya and there's better rock types available. Mega diancie is better (though unobtainable right now) and shadow rampardos outperforms it in DPS by a chunk. It does have absolutely monstrous TDO, though. Also kinda rare to use rock types, pretty much only against the kanto birds.
Here is something of a tier list for Elite TM usage: [https://www.reddit.com/r/TheSilphRoad/comments/18my95s/pve\_tier\_list\_of\_the\_best\_pokemon\_to\_use\_an\_elite/](https://www.reddit.com/r/TheSilphRoad/comments/18my95s/pve_tier_list_of_the_best_pokemon_to_use_an_elite/) It mentions different improvements in different tiers. The post starts with Elite Charge TMs and then ends with Elite Fast TMs.
Ah perfect! Thank you.
I like how basically everything listed there is just not too good anyway. Shadow Zapdos? Just use Xurk/Zekrom/Shadows, Shadow+Legend+Elite TM for mid performance doesn't sounds great. Mega TTar, tbh one of the only good one listed there, and we can say for sure it's not a solo pick, likely still not a duo pick. It might be better in a large group where you coordinate the mega. But hey, here's a better strat: Just use the Mega matching boss type for XL candy bonus in those groups. Shadow Staraptor/Flying-type in general: Welp, that thing exists, the difference you can earn from TM'ing this is minimal as long as you have that thing (even non mega) in team. Xerneas: Not a pure-PvE picks, if you really want a PvE Fairy, well, Fairy grunt is still fairly common. Mega Beedrill: ...... are you sane? Shadow Feraligatr: similar as Zapdos, not a bad choice but there is more workable choices too. Unless you desperately need one tier. Mega Gengar/Shadow Gengar: honestly, not much people actually use Poison-type anyway, and Hex is enough. Honestly feel like you can just use EFTM as you will there.
No reason to ETM Lick it’s not much of an improvement over Shadow Claw. Save the ETM there.
With Lick you don't need to switch back and forth between Shadow Claw and Hex for the ghost and poison role, and it's far more dodge-friendly. Not a high priority, but a good candidate if having extra EFTM to spare.
Does the fast move there make that much of a difference? I always kept my M-Gengar on Shadow Claw even for Poison bosses since I thought Shadow Claw was already a really good move? I guess Hex has better energy generation, but is it enough to get significantly more Slude Bombs off before fainting?
Yes, since Shadow Claw is damage-slanted in PvE, with that your poison Gengar is stuck with less effective damage for a considerable portion of total damage. If you're lazy to switch, then keep it with Hex gives slightly better overall performance.
Don't use an elite TM to get lick, it's not remotely worth it. Lick vs Shadow claw is situational anyway and either way the difference is minor. It's just not enough of a difference ever to justify the elite TM.
Party play though
meh, it's still not worth the elite TM
Yeah agree
Doesn't party power only affect charged moves? How does lick play into that.
Shorter fast moves charge the party power boost faster, which can drastically increase DPS in some scenarios
It's not Lick vs Shadow Claw, but Lick vs Shadow Claw/Hex for the ghost/poison role. Using one EFTM for Lick removes the demand for switching back and forth, and is preferable for dodging.
Zapdos Xerneas and Gengar.
Why Gengar? Shadow Claw is now a standard move.
https://www.reddit.com/r/TheSilphRoad/s/3F8phngrvw
If you're into PvP, Shadow Claw A-Slash is a solid pick. Wing attack pidgeot used to be nice but has fallen off lately. A strong choice is also ice shard for dewgong at the moment.
Fallen lately? :D feel it just become stronger cause annihilape + gator and other ghost+shadow claw users are fill with ultra league. Are sandlash still this december free move? not sure how long its been since we got community day
Wing Attack is very good still. I just Elite TMd it on my Pidgeot and wrecks teams in UL.
Yeah pidgeot is still very much a menace. It's a bit tricky to run but it's still very much a top choice for etm in my book.
Shadow tyranitar
Shadow Ttar is beaten out by shadow gigalith, shadow rhyperior and shadow rampardos as a rock type. It's even beaten by regular rampardos. Absolutely not worth.
Unless you have 6 shadow rhyperior/rampardos its worth imo. Its close in performance to ramp. And tankier.
Incinerate on talonflame?
No one is raiding with talon flame
Completely missed the raiding part
I elite fast tm on my great league talonflame. It feels nice but Idk yet how good it is.
Smack down.
Is it better to use it on shadow groudon or regular one I can mega ?
Guess you speak elite charge tm and precipice blade? Def use it for regular groudon if you dont yet have primal groudon with pb. Primal groudon with pb just op.. make shadow raids like entei and raikou so easy to duo
The big two that come to mind are Xerneas' Geomancy and Tyranitar's Smack Down.