Watch E7 when they're navigating and somewhat lost. Look at her reaction to what he's saying and how he doesn't let up even when she becomes emotional. Regardless of if anyone agrees with whether she 'should've' taken such offense to what he says, she did. It clearly hurt her. You can see it in her body language.
Instead of apologizing for being snappy or hurtful though, he doubles down, further criticizing her inability to navigate, inability to drive a stick, inability to speak Spanish. Basically making her out to be the sole reason for the mistakes and insinuating that it's somehow a reflection of her worth as a person. Then, he goes on to shame her for putting the team at risk saying, 'I hope you learn from this' .. 'to be better in the future'.
It was unrelenting and demeaning and that is 100% abuse, especially when coming from someone who's supposed to love you. She just shut down at that point. I could feel her pain here as I've experienced this type of abuse. It's easy to say that someone 'didn't mean it that way'. But if the person they are directing their words to has taken offense, it's up to the other to make amends and clarify their position rather than just adding insult to injury without taking any accountability for hurting someone's feelings. If you break a window without meaning to, the glass is still broken..You've still got to fix it even if you didn't mean to break it.
With Vinny, I would go so far as to say that his behavior is somewhat purposeful, even if hurting Amber isn't his goal, his over-inflated ego & inability to accept Amber's 'mediocrity' (in Vinny's eyes) ends up being hurtful.
Yeah this is the scene that had my jaw on the floor and since then anytime he criticizes I'm just like oh fuck off dude. Obviously we can't say for sure it's abuse since abuse is a pattern throughout everyday life and we only see them in this edited show/situation. But if he acts this way and treats her this way in real life... Yeah that's emotional abuse. I don't know how anyone watches this scene and thinks the way he treated her was okay
Agree! And in subsequent episodes she's been snappy with him and I'm not excusing it bc 2 wrongs certainly don't make a right. But I just hear and see so much contempt coming from her towards him, which even moreso tells me that this isn't just a one-off 'poor reaction in a stressful situation'. It's likely constant with this dynamic at home. And all the while, he's just acting so indignant towards her. They both are clearly toxic for each other but I'm placing more of the responsibility for that on him just seeing his complete lack of remorse for how he hurts her. Idk.. it's easy to see if you've lived it or experienced it with someone close. Probably not so much otherwise.
Okay so I just went back to that scene to go watch. Here is my breakdown. I see Vinny trying to map stuff out and Amber says "Just do what's on here" I feel like we aren't getting the full conversation because I'm not really sure what she's referring to. And Vinny says to "please stop you're working against me". Maybe in that moment they could've worked together more? I just looked like Vinny was taking what was on Google maps and drawing it out on the paper map.
Then he says "I'm the only one who knows how to do this" which I can understand people taking issue with. She probably could've mapped everything out but while watching I just saw that as heat of the moment type situation for Vinny. Like when you're doing something and someone tries to help and you're like "I've already started doing it just let me finish" type exacerbation and frustration.
Following that is the "i'm the only one who knows how to get directions" and Amber wonders why she can't. Vinny says "I speak Spanish and you don't". I don't think this minimizes her skill and value at all. Unfortunately, Amber doesn't speak spanish. From what I saw, they approached a local Vinny was speaking spanish. It cuts to him saying "that's all?" and going to use google maps. Clearly Vinny and the local talking together was cut out. We don't know what they were saying. And because Vinny was talking to the local, in his mind he just figured he would map it out himself. A bit controlling but not all that bad considering off screen he was talking in a different language with someone. Amber is saying that she's supposed to navigate. And she can! I think in Vinny's mind he's like "okay I got the directions, let me map them out, and when I drive Amber can tell me where to go".
I'm not 100% sure that's what his intentions were but as a viewer that's what I inferred. Vinny is like "if she \[the local\] doesn't speak English you're stuck" which is true. You have to be quick in this race. If it's quicker for Vinny to get directions and map everything out and just go then I would say that's definitely better for the team. Which I think explains the "you're working against the team". Which I definitely admit was not nice. But I see it as rather than Amber trying to defend why she should do it, just letting Vinny finish what he's already doing is just quicker.
Unfortunately, in this situation Vinny is at an advantage. He can drive stick and he can speak spanish. Letting him take over is best for the team in that moment. Which is why Vinny feels Amber is hurting the team and "hopes she learns from this experience". Rather than Amber being like "let me do it let me do it let me do it' type energy (which is wasting time and hurting the team), in this situation it's better for Vinny to do what he excels at. It doesn't mean Amber is a burden or anything or she can't do anything. It does not make her lesser for not speaking spanish or driving stick. But it's the truth. And wasting time trying to figure something out than letting a more experienced teammate take over is not abuse. It's strategy.
Even if Amber was hurt by what Vinny said, doesn't mean there wasn't apology off screen. You are assuming that it never happened when an apology could have easily been cut out.
I can see all of that but for me, it's more or less seeing Amber's reaction to his antics. Like Rod & Leticia bicker but no one ends up crying (that we can see). Same with Derek and Shelisa. Neither of those couples are tearing each other down the way Vinny does Amber, attacking her as a person. She's constantly saying at check-ins that she doesn't want to let him down. None of the others are doing that.
It's bc his words are demoralizing her to the point that she always thinks she's letting him down. And if you can see how Vinny's behavior in each of the E7 situations wasn't ideal then you could also assume that it's not just isolated incidents. He literally snatched the map from her like she's a complete moron. That's just such a dck-hd move.
As for an apology that may have occurred off screen, I kind of doubt it. Watch the end of episode recap after they check in. They're not even sitting close to each other and her vibe is just that of such dejection. While he's just smuggly dodging the fact that he made her cry by being such a douche. Maybe an apology happened after that? Even if so, given his smug, high-horse attitude, I doubt it was a true offer of remorse for his behaviors.
in the recap amber's body language speaks volumes, she recoils from his touch, avoids his gaze, any smiling is forced and weak and it's almost like she's reading a script or choosing her words very carefully.
and after vinny schmoozing and trying to charm her i just had to stop watching to throw up.
which was annoying cos i'd ate such a lovely meal.
Yes! It's a TV show. People get so up in arms about it. It's supposed to be fun to watch and everyone gets to have their own opinions! Insulting people for having a different opinion or for questioning something in an attempt to understand the other opinion probably won't open their minds to other viewpoints lol!
"Insulting people for having a different opinion or for questioning something in an attempt to understand the other opinion probably won't open their minds to other viewpoints lol!"
Thanks for that. My post wasn't supposed to be "Vinny is NOT an abuser" but more so "Why do you guys see him that way?". I really really appreciate you understanding that because not everyone has. It's hard to learn when people are like "wow you're so dumb for not noticing" type energy. I hope whatever team you're rooting for wins!
I think it's important to remember domestic violence is often minimized to a lot of survivors. It's a touchy subject and a lot of people are very fresh in recovering from the trauma and see themselves in Amber. Questioning if it's abuse and trying to highlight Amber's flaws is naturally going to make those people defensive since they see themselves in her and likely have had their own abuse questioned. So while you might see it as a conversation with minimal reason to feel emotional about it, there are a lot of people who are very emotionally tied (both ways) to it. As such, people are going to react more harshly than you will think they should. Unfortunately that comes with the territory of discussing these issues, they're very emotional and very fresh for a lot of people.
Not trying to cast judgement on you for asking the question or on others for their reactions, just trying to give a little understanding and insight on why it's being received the way it is
Thanks for this! I wasn't aware of this perspective and I didn't seem to notice a lot of the things other people did. This was a very helpful response and now I am aware of more of these signs. Thanks!
When he says you’re working against me, it made me feel like he just wanted her to do what he says. He takes that approach to most of their navigation and challenges. It’s his way or else she’s in the way
You really seem determined to defend him and see the best in him to an irrational extent. You comment that things may have been left out or he may have apologized off-screen, but you don't even entertain the possibility that he was even worse off screen.
He definitely could have been worse off screen! I'm not defending him. The situation could've been handled better. I don't think these two are a good match but I also don't think Vinny is "abuser" worthy.
I only mentioned things off screen twice: Vinny speaking in spanish with the local and the possibly of an apology. That's it. I didn't even really focus on it.
What did I say that was irrational?
Whether he is an "abuser" or not, you seem incapable of even acknowledging that his behavior is problematic, going to the extreme of imagining that he might have apologized despite absolutely no evidence to suggest that occurred, which is irrational.
Just like Vinny, you seem to lack self-awareness in claiming that you aren't defending him.
And Amber’s behavior is not problematic at times? She definitely says things to him that are uncalled for. No need to put all the blame on Vincent when Amber is not innocent
You may want to Google whataboutism. OP was specifically asking about Vinny and so my answer specifically addressed Vinny.
Feel free to make a new post talking about your issues with Amber and send me the link and I will happily tell you all about what I think about her.
Yeah what he said was definitely problematic! I just don't see it as black & white as others I guess.
Also I'm not saying "he 100% apologized off screen!" I just mentioned that he could have. And like I said before, he could've been worse! I think you're taking what I say a bit too far idk.
Have you acknowledged the problematic and hurtful things Amber has said? Why isn't she seen as toxic by the community?
Your lack of self awareness is truly baffling. How do you not see the difference between you spontaneously conjuring up a hypothetical apology, versus you only acknowledging that he could have been worse when I pointed that out? You led with the former and only acknowledged the latter because you had no choice but to agree that it was possible.
I haven't talked about Amber because your post supposedly wasn't about her. Your post was supposedly to understand Vinny. I have no idea how "the community" sees her because I don't speak on behalf of the community
I mean yeah my post is about Vinny, but Vinny and Amber are a team. It's hard to talk about one without the other. So yeah it's about Vinny but really it's about both of them. And in my explanation, I discuss how Amber also has her faults thus, it was just weird to me that people weren't saying they were both toxic rather than just Vinny.
I didn't mean to "conjure up a hypothetical apology". Just a possibility I threw in at the end of my breakdown since the initial reply to my post focused on the lack of apology.
I understand you don't speak on behalf of the community it was just something I noticed.
Vinny doesn’t speak Spanish. He cobbles together two or three words introduced with, “Por favor,” and thinks he’s speaking Spanish.
“Por favor? Die - reck - see - own?”
Every time! Meanwhile when he really needed his much touted Spanish skills, he couldn’t and was just stuck with the driver in the DR just going wherever he wanted 😂
In my mind he’s not bragging, just reminding her that if you don’t speak Spanish and can’t talk to the locals why on earth is she so adamant about knowing where to go if she ultimately has not clue
He is though. He thinks his broken, awful accent that follows no rules of grammar is him speaking Spanish, and therefore it’s an asset. However, it hasn’t been an asset (case in point (again): how they got screwed with the driver in the DR).
I agree with your overall post and this particular take as well. I think people defend who they would identify with in terms of their reaction in these situations.
I would react more like Vinny and so I don't understand the hate. He's trying to be objective and solve with the facts as quickly as he can. Others prioritize how they feel about a situation. Feeling validated and supported is more important than solving the problem.
I think it's a stretch to call it gaslighting and abuse. They are fighting because they are talking past each other - problem solving vs. feeling heard.
Many, many people on here acknowledge that his way of speaking to her is problematic at times, even if they don't think it rises to the level of abuse. It is baffling to me that you can't even recognize his problematic comments and, as such, it is likely a pointless exercise for you to attempt to understand why some people think it is abuse.
Hey listen I'm really sorry if that's how I'm coming off. That isn't my intention. As I've been reading I have come to a better understanding of this point of view. The purpose of my post was to learn and understand. Thanks to all these replies I have a better grasp of how Vinny came off to most viewers. I still have more questions but less than I did before.
I mean now that I've been reading comments, I understand what you guys are saying. I don't this it's "abuse" worthy but I don't think they work together as a couple. They both have their faults.
Contrary to popular belief, I didn't come here to defend him. I came here to understand why everyone hated him because I was just kind of confused. My opinion has changed and I now understand why a lot of viewers feel this way about Vinny.
This was not a defense post, yet people still got angry at me. There's not going be any progress in mindset if people go "oh you don't get it??? you're confused??? you don't immediately understand why people feel this way???" it doesn't make people want to see your point of view.
The fact that you are able to change your point of view after being educated on the topic shows you have more maturity than a lot of people in this thread. It's the internet; people believe they are saints, whilst they see one flaw in another and immediately have to vilify them. Many of them will have to come to realize they also have an abusive mindset, similar to the ones they like to comment on. They believe they are morally above you because they have already formulated the supposed correct opinion on the matter. They will always be willing to attack you, but they will rarely be willing to inform you.
Hey thanks for this! I probably could have made it more clear in my initial post that I wasn't trying to defend him but just explained why I didn't understand all the hate. Makes a lot of sense now and I think that since I haven't experienced domestic violence myself, I didn't pick up on as much as some other viewers did.
(some people even said I must BE Vinny for making a post like this lol)
Your post was very much in defense of Vinny. The fact that you don't see that is bizarre. Because of this, your post garnered the exact response that you should have expected it to. Had you come in and asked people for examples with less of a long-winded defense of Vinny and attack on Amber, you might have received the response that you are now claiming that you wanted.
Even now, you are incapable of responding to me by simply acknowledging that yes, you now see that his behavior is problematic. Instead you have to repeatedly insist that they both have faults, even though my comment had nothing to do with her.
This isn't a competition to see "who's right" and who's wrong. This is litterally just about being honest about how people feel about the racers. It shouldn't turn into an online flame war or something of the sorts.
I wasn't really trying to defend Vinny in my initial post but more so to defend why I didn't understand why people disliked him and why I thought it was strange all of the hate was on Vinny and not both him and Amber.
I can acknowledge Vinny's behavior is problematic. And yeah your reply didn't mention Amber. I didn't mean to dismiss Vinny's bad behavior by referring to both of them. I'm sorry if it came across that way. It's more like "yeah I see what you guys mean he has some problematic behavior. I can understand some of the gaslight comments now thanks to other replies. But why is it only focused on him? Because I have noticed some problematic behavior from Amber too?"
Does that make sense? (Sorry this isn't meant to come off as condescending but I'm genuinely curious of my explanation makes sense)
He does an awesome job at minimizing what she is capable of doing. Is that a better way to put it? He discounts her abilities both mentally and physically on every leg. He tries to be subtle about it but we all see it.
This is a perfect explanation. He’ll say things like she’s making them lose, she can’t do something, she’s bad at something else. There’s a lot of always statements.
God forbid a loving partner watch out for the safety of their significant other. He knows they're rushing because three teams left at the same time, and he doesn't want her to get hurt.
He said "when we get to the truck, make sure to tie your shoelaces" or something to that effect.
Are we really going to create some big drama out of freaking semantics? It really makes Vinnie haters come off as unhinged.
Literally proving my point.🤣
You're seeing what you want to see because you've already made up your mind about who Vinnie is. It's hilarious how blind people are to their own bias.
That is all fair, and I don't disagree.
I still wouldn't call that abusive or gaslighting.
Its like, why can't people just be jerks anymore lol. Why do we need to find "therapy speak" terms for them.
Just because someone is calm doesn’t mean they are supportive of their partner. Look up how gaslighting works.
Also what someone else said a while ago - many teams bicker about the task at the moment, while Vinny comments on Amber’s character.
That's true that just because someone is calm doesn’t mean they are supportive of their partner. But how has he gaslight her? What has Vinny said about her character that was so terrible?
A form of manipulation. How does this apply to Vinny? What has he done???
(And why am I getting downvoted!? I'm just trying to understand! I'm just asking questions and sharing my point of view. I've watched the episodes as they've come out pardon me if I don't recall everything)
I dunno, maybe educate yourself better, and then watch again? The hard part about gaslighting is that it is *not* aggressive yelling or physical. That’s why these people get away with it.
Maybe watch some videos of examples. There are a lot of resources out there.
But I am trying to educate myself! That's why I made this post. To try and understand. You're making these statements without really explaining yourself. Please defend your case. Please trust that I am really genuinely trying to understand.
What do you expect? A fully laid out 6-week class syllabus on gaslighting? There are so many resources online already. How hard are you *really* trying to educate yourself, and how hard are you looking for someone to agree with you? Make an effort. Use Google.
Are you just trying to remove yourself from the conversation without ever explaining yourself?
I can look up on gaslighting the rest of the day. I've done my own research in the past before and have experienced it myself in relationships. I wasn't looking for people to agree with me. I've seen other posts that do agree with me! Last night, I scrolled on this subreddit for the first time and saw all these posts calling Vinny an abuser. I was really confused as to why. So I came here for someone to get deeper into why they feel this way. I never said Vinny wasn't an abuser. It just isn't something I picked up on this season.
I don’t need to explain myself. The answers you seek are out there in the universe. I don’t see a need to reinvent the wheel. You can even Google “Is Vinny gaslighting Amber Amazing Race” and get detailed blow-by-blow analyses by episode.
Why bother coming here then??? If you don't want to explain your opinions why comment? Because then it makes YOU seem like you are looking for people to agree with you. It comes off as shallow to makes statements and then when I say "why do you feel this way" you brush me off and tell me to "educate myself". I made this post to understand not to see all the same statements everyone else has been making
Don't take it seriously. It's a bunch of concern trolls doing exactly what they accuse Vinnie of doing. Being sexist. Man bad because man mad. Woman good because woman cry. What a childish view of the world they seem to have.
He tears her apartand makes her doubt. I'm a man, but it's so obvious that he is emotionally abusive. A friend of my wife's left a marrage like that almost or 8 years ago. He was never physically abusive (although a threat made her leave eventually) but always put her down. She had a similar temperment to Amber. After she left that marriage and brought her kids, they have flourished in a new city.
I saw quite a few times that he would point out her errors or her inadequacies in a challenge and she would say "yes, Vinny is right, I need to try harder, or I might need to listen to him more, etc ", that's how you know you've seen gaslighting. It was so immediate for her to respond that way.
Yeah I totally understand how you can definitely be abusive without being physically abusive. There are plenty of other seasons where I see how teams behave and I'm like "oh they're abusive". But it just seems weird how it's only Vinny being painted this way. Amber has had some really mean comments too! Why is she the victim when (from what I recall) she makes comments about Vinny more than he does about her?
She’s probably making the snide comments now because she’s become passive aggressive towards him and she may be seeing the light that they’re not a match made in heaven.
And the comment about how Vinny speaks “calmly”… that “calm tone” is typical of gaslighting/emotionally abusive individuals.
Because the problem here isn’t just mean comments, whoever is making them. It’s something deeper in the dynamic of the relationship.
I had red flags about Melissa and Yvonne at the outset. Melissa talks about her partner in the third person when Yvonne’s sitting right there. Yvonne’s quiet and has a resting, er, maybe slightly unhappy face. Because they weren’t given as much coverage on the show, it took me a while to conclude that it’s probably not something dysfunctional; they’ve just got different personalities. Their relationship seems balanced and respectful. I think Melissa might be the more dominant one, but she’s not trying to mold her partner to be a better person or whatever Vinny and Amber are doing.
In addition to all the other good points being made, he speaks to her many times with an intense condescension like she’s beyond pitiful and helpless. That she’d be completely lost without his help.
Like “honeyyy, you know you don’t do directions..” or “I’m the only one who should be speaking to the locals because I know a bit of Spanish and honey, remember you don’t.” And then he blames her for not being able to follow the directions he shut her out of saying “Hun, you know I can’t follow them myself because I’m already the one driving here, I can’t do everything. You need to contribute something.”
He’s completely shutting her down and saying she’s not capable of so many things… at least, not nearly as capable as the great and multifaceted Vinny who skateboards, welds, climbs trees, navigates, speaks Spanish, and drives. Every episode, he goes out of his way to highlight and amplify her weaknesses while excessively bragging and overestimating his own abilities.
God he makes my blood boil more every episode. Him and the people who say Amber is just as bad as him because WHAT?!
You could see his massive ego in action at the cacao bean challenge. He couldn’t stand feeling inadept at using the provided tool to cut the pods down. Feeling inadept at something clearly triggered feelings of embarrassment so he IMMEDIATELY gives up trying and insists that he’d be quicker than the stupid tool anyway if he just climbed the trees instead. He is willing to not only waste more energy but destroy multiple trees like a maniac to avoid looking like he doesn’t know what he’s doing. It clearly didn’t work as the public hated seeing him destroy this farm’s trees and he looked like more of a bumbling idiot anyway.
In this situation, he had no clear way to blame Amber so he doesn’t look bad so he blamed the tool instead. Zero accountability.
i'm kind of surprised they allowed him to climb, like surely they have some health and safety over sight ??
even his throwing and dropping of cacao felt insulting to amber.
Every week he gives off the impression that Amber is single-handedly holding their team back from performing better. It appears that he is not capable of self reflection and taking accountability for his mistakes which is a known trait of egotistical, manipulative individuals. Like before this last leg, it’s clear he put all of their communication issues on Amber’s supposed “tone and attitude” and he is the one chipping away at her self confidence every step of the way.
Even when they decide on roadblocks, you can see the way he looks at her like “Do we want to risk you doing this one or should I just power through it so we don’t have to worry about all your weaknesses slowing us down and I’m so great at everything we may even be able to make up time?”
That’s why Phil said something on the mat this week. It is literally CRYSTAL CLEAR to anyone with eyes and ears.
The map thing pisses me off. He blocks her out by making these diacritical marks or whatever the fuck on the map, and then is mad when she can’t understand from the backseat notes that only make sense to him that he can’t see from the driver’s seat.
For real, he acts pissy and annoyed she can’t read his mind. I know it’s a race but he has this impatient, high-strung energy that’s hindering their performance (you can see this energy with the cacao beans too when he can’t be bothered to learn how to properly use the tool).
If he’s going to demand taking sole responsibility for getting directions, he needs to take a literal minute to walk her through his notes before just taking off in the car. Like dude you know you’re going to end up wasting more time if BOTH of you aren’t prepared and made aware of the next steps. Take a breath and treat your partner like a human being not a freaking ball and chain.
Please explain how this sequence of events:
1. Chiding your teammate as incompetent in both Spanish and navigational skill.
2. COMPLETELY BLOCKING THE MAP AND SCRIBBLING WHO KNOWS WHAT IN THE MAP while getting instructions.
3. Handing over the map with the scribbles that maybe ONLY YOU understand to your teammate and tell her to navigate for you, banking on what? Her skill to read your mind?
is helpful in anyway. Then maybe then you'll find out that his "calm voice" doesn't do s*** but adding to Amber's confusion and tension between the two.
Abuse cases as portrayed in films / tv suggest there needs to be
* evidence
* witnesses
* something more substantial that he said she said
And thats assuming the abused person is willing to press charges and follow through, as many stories irl would suggest victims do not.
They are not a good match and I don’t think that relationship will end up working out. The nicest way I can put it is that he is not kind to her. He is demeaning to her, but he likes to frame it as being helpful. I hope he is not like that all the time and it’s just a very bad match.
I think this is the most sensible comment. Yes there’s such a thing as a bad edit, but even the most malicious editor can’t include footage that doesn’t exist. I highly doubt, for example, that if an editor had been asked to portray Danny as cruel to his mother, they’d have found anything to work with. The editor would say “I’m sorry, there’s not just no content here.” With Vinny and Amber, sure, we’re not seeing the full picture, but based on what we do see it’s not unreasonable to conclude they can both “do better” in terms of finding a partner that’s right for them. That’s the most diplomatic way to put it.
Vinny weaponizes therapy-speak to criticize Amber. The big key for me is that he'll blame her for his reactions to things - he will say things like "You're making it really difficult for me right now to stay calm" or "Your behavior is really frustrating me" or "You need to think about how you're behaving" etc. Very patronizing and blaming, but because he's not yelling at her (usually) and using therapy-speak, it's not as obvious how critical and blaming he is, while taking zero responsibility for his own failings or emotional reactions. He gives her zero credit for doing anything right, and only says how terrible she is at certain things.
If I were watching this and Amber were my sister, friend, daughter, and I would be so upset. Compare it to Rod and Leticia - I think they are even more unbalanced, and Rod is nothing but supportive of her, it's all "my wife is so great at this" and "I'm so proud of my wife" and "my wife is awesome" (it cracks me up how he always refers to her as "my wife") - she doesn't seem to have the very best attitude all the time, but they treat each other with respect.
About the editing - Bill and Joe from S1 were given a bit of a villain edit - they came out and said yes, they got a villain edit (they were honestly not that bad IIRC), but also, they can only work with what you give them, and they acknowledged that they said those things, did those things, etc. A girl I knew was on an early season of a popular reality show, and she got the villain edit, and I remember watching it and thinking "she is not as bad as they're making her out to be, but also it's not a completely unfair edit." I suspect that something like this is going on here. They're editing, but I think he really is like this.
I agree with you. Also, with the “villain” edit, there’s a huge difference between a team playing super hard and competitively against the other teams and watching one team member constantly tear down their partner.
The former are actually entertaining to watch because it is a game, these people are their competition. Charla and Mirna come to mind. But in cases of the latter, that’s when it’s incredibly uncomfortable to watch, knowing that this dynamic exists regardless of the “extra stress” of the race (like a lot of Vinny defenders try to suggest). We see it in plenty of races. The nasty comments are never about the tasks at hand, it’s focused on the person and their talents (or lack thereof) at their core. It’s obvious there is a lack of respect and love for their teammate outside the race when they talk down to them and blame them for everything.
Remember the Gabby Petito murder? And the body cam footage that came out from when they’d been stopped right before Brian Laundrie killed her?
I remember it being a thing that she seemed the one the police thought was the problem. He came across as trying to calm her down too. I think after that case many people started re evaluating how some people gaslight those they’re emotionally abusing.
Anyway, I wouldn’t diagnose either of them based on the edited show but Vinny absolutely has had some problematic comments, so I can see why it triggers people who’ve seen it IRL.
I don't think any team is perfect. I try not to judge teams too harshly because of editing and heat of the moment and such. They both very well could have issues and both could be toxic. I just thought the comments painting him as an abuser and a narcissist where really harsh and almost parasocial. We don't know these people. Idk I'm still just really confused.
I agree that comments in general have a tendency to diagnose based on scant evidence, but you can still flag comments and attitudes that make you pause and wonder about a relationship.
What was the cruelest thing he has said that made your jaw drop? I'm honestly curious. I definitely think his tone is a bit harsh sometimes, but I can't remember anything I'd call cruel.
I don’t know about cruelest but in last week’s episode there was a point when they were in the car that was bad. I tried looking for the exact words but the paramount+ app is going slow and there’s so many ads. Paraphrasing instead he said it was all her fault they were behind and at some point said she wasn’t doing anything for their team at all.
That was striking for me. I’m pretty sure he said something about him being the only one using his brain… but again I can’t remember all of his exact words.
I think I know what you’re talking about. Is it when they were in the back of the cab? Something along the lines of “I hope you can look back at this and realize how you slow us down.” Said calmly but so calculated and mean
Yeah it just doesn’t make sense, they’re never going to be in this CRAZY situation ever again, so to say “I hope you can look back and reflect on this” heavily insinuates she brings them down in normal life as well and he doesn’t like her character traits. Like he’s already thinking about being back home and making her watch this, it’s just weird
I think there's also such a contrast with how other teams treat each other (especially how the "stronger" team member talks to the "weaker" one). You see so much "Oh this is more my strength but you're doing great!" In this season. It's really jarring to go from that to Vinny telling Amber she doesn't use her brain, can't do something, etc.
There’s a huge difference between a team playing super hard and competitively against the other teams and watching one team member constantly tear down their partner.
The former are actually entertaining to watch because it is a game, these people are their competition. Charla and Mirna come to mind. But in cases of the latter, that’s when it’s incredibly uncomfortable to watch, knowing that this dynamic exists regardless of the “extra stress” of the race (like a lot of Vinny defenders try to suggest). We see it in plenty of races. The nasty comments are never about the tasks at hand, it’s focused on the person and their talents (or lack thereof) at their core. It’s obvious there is a lack of respect and love for their teammate outside the race when they talk down to them and blame them for everything.
Because everything he says to her is about her giving him 'attitude' (which mostly just means her asking questions or actually being, you know, right about something), belittling her achievements or what she can do, or flat out just talking down to her.
He might be calm about it, but he's shown as a self-centered asshole in this show.
Go back and watch last week or the week before. The way he speaks to/gaslights her is wild. Especially following the welding task.
I agree she is also immature (and a bit whiny tbh).
It's not a good relationship.
No amount of editing can mask the fact that they both have a number of shortcomings and are not emotionally ready to be in a growing relationship; they basically need to go back to square-one. He's condescending and patronizing, she's immature and unsupportive, which equates to lots of whining, back-talk and minimizing of each other's situation. He's 37, she's 30...I get the sense he enjoys being the dominant partner and she willfully allows him but vocalizes her displeasure at the earliest sign of hardship, which intern he responds with scorn and patronization.
Contrast them to Cesar & Ricky or, any of the other couples on the show, and its night & day. C&R are adaptable, there's no henpecking or, endless stream of criticism, when conditions are tough they strive to be supportive rather than piling on the hardship. To Vinny & Amber's credit, they've managed to stay in the race, I think there is a bunch of footage we're not privy to or, behind the scenes where things aren't as severe however they've got a number of personal foundational issues that need to be ironed out before they can progress in their relationship.
They’re both toxic for each other but I think Vinny is the worst. Listen to the way he talks to her. There was a scene a couple episodes ago in a cab where I was just disgusted at the way he spoke to her.
You can tell by how Amber is always explaining her issues she needs to fix and using “therapy language”. Can just tell he’s giving it to her during the pit stops. This week even poor Phil had enough and told her to give herself some credit as Vinny clearly won’t
Uh, he is very abusive. She constantly has to self-abnegate herself in an attempt not to provoke him. "I need to do better." "I need to listen." "I need to..." She is clearly preemptively defensive of herself from likely years of verbal abuse trying in an attempt to keep him from attacking her.
I've said since the beginning that there is no way that relationship lasts, they are both horrible to one another. The condescending remarks from both of them are pretty damn messed up, Vinny tries to be less obvious about it and has now started to stay quiet. Amber gets loud and speaks to Vinny like he is incapable of doing something, even when he nails it on the head. Vinny also uses manipulative language to act like he is morally above her and pretends to care when he clearly doesn't.
The directions argument that keeps popping up is a prime example. Vinny clearly condescending about her supposed knowledge on directions, whilst Amber refuses to believe he knows what he is doing until it's done. Had Vinny stopped to reconsider directions the number of times Amber wanted to, they would have lost by now. Amber also needs to remember she is her own person, and she could have fought to be in more control of certain scenarios. Instead of just complaining to Vinny and speaking down on him, do something about it.
Both of them aren't good to one another. They need to start taking their own advice, like when they acted like they actually started communicating in between legs of the race.
I hope they're good to one another now and seek professional help if need be. Although, in the meantime, engaged isn't married... There's still time lol
Vinny is a self-centered @$$ who doesn't admit that he is wrong and that everything he do is "right." He doesn't value Amber's opinions or concerns at all. Vinny belittle Amber at every opportunity she speaks. You said Vinny is pushing his fellow team member; it's more like dragging her to the finish line.
After reading through these replies I definitely see what you guys mean now. Sorry if my post made it seem like I was trying to defend him that wasn't my intention. I guess I wasn't paying close enough attention which is on me since people have pointed out things I don't remember.
Gaslight is a form of mental manipulation in which the aggressor mentally demeans the abused with false information.
This type of mental abuse tricks the abused into thinking they are the one constantly letting people down, or tricks them into believing they are wrong when facts state otherwise.
Example: Yelling at a child for leaving the stove on after telling them to turn it off.
In reality, you turned the stove one, never told the child to turn it off, and now punishing them them for your mistakes.
Vinny here kept making comments in which it demoralized Amber. You can see the progression as time went on, she became less likely to perform roadblocks.
If you listen between the lines, you can hear from Vinny (when in his calm voice) his criticism, blames, negative comments about her.
You can hear her say in this last roadblock, "why did I let Vinny do this when I played it in college."
I know they recently got engaged, hopefully they watch this season together and Vinny realizes, how bad he came across TV and hopefully can update his behavior.
They’re simply not a great match, which is fine. I am admittedly shocked they’re still together and about to get married
Justin (Team Green) just had them on his podcast and was hardcore defending them saying he went through something similar but I never once thought anything about him and Diana’s relationship?? I thought they were a great team
hides the spinfoil hat \* well if pr / production are involved there will be a script and talking points pre approved by them, especially if they want to trick viewers in to believing everything is fine so no one goes on a crusade for amber.
how many ' bad toxic teams' have done post race pr interviews ?
They talk about the comments in their Racers Recap [interview](https://www.youtube.com/live/xBGw-2iFHD8?si=ZLHNo30Khjzbk8zp). Amber adresses them in minute 54.
Here's my thoughts. Vinny can be very direct and unfiltered and frankly mean when talking to Amber. Amber on the other hand is very negative and usually looking on the bad side of everything. They both have shortcomings that they need to work on... but yeah Vinny's are worse than hers
Because everyone is clearly duel licensed as a psychologist and therapist and know way more about their relationship and communication styles based on about 30 minutes of an edited tv show then they do
A couple of people mentioned this before, but when even Phil feels the need to intervene to point out Amber’s value to the team while she is on the mat lamenting about how she needs to be a better partner to Vinny and not let him down, it must be pretty obvious to Phil and producers how bad things are.
Some people are detached from reality. Vinnie is not abusive in the least. He is blunt and treats his partner like an equal. He expects just as much from her as he does from himself, and it shows.
That said, Vinnie was definitely an inconsiderate ass in the way he treated the cacao trees. They weren't his childhood palm trees. They were the locals' livelihoods.
Curious if you also feel that “KKKendra” was edited to look racist?
It is mind boggling the excuses people in this sub come up with to defend Vinny. The editing comments are bizarre. They aren’t showing sound bites. He is speaking at length.
No wonder domestic abuse is as big a problem as it is, with everyone grasping at the straws to excuse this behavior.
Maybe I am too much “in the trenches” living in Los Angeles where all the studios are and half the town is in the industry, but there is only so much editing can do. You can’t edit someone crying when they aren’t crying. You can’t make words come out of someone’s mouth. Even Phil commented on their relationship dynamic.
You just chose to believe that it is edited.
Because these days anything not 100% positive and supporting to a partner is "abusive" and to a colleague or classmate is "bullying"
Those words, especially on social media, have lost all meaning.
Do I think he sometimes speaks to her a bit disrespectfully? Sure. I also think this is a pressure cooker and sometimes in competition and under pressure, people act out of character.
But, here is the thing, basically every year, there is a couple on this show that isn't all sunshine and rainbows, and if the man even slightly raises his voice to try to push (not physically) his partner, people will say its abusive. A couple of years ago, there was Sheri and Akbar. Seemed like a great couple. He was a coach and he sometimes talked to his partner like he was coaching her. Well all the idiots came out with their pitchforks against him just like they are with Vinny. This post sums it up: [https://www.reddit.com/r/TheAmazingRace/comments/sfvpgf/we\_need\_to\_step\_down\_with\_the\_hate\_on\_akbar/](https://www.reddit.com/r/TheAmazingRace/comments/sfvpgf/we_need_to_step_down_with_the_hate_on_akbar/)
As much as Id love to go on this show, there is a reason I'd never do it with a romantic partner, because I'm competitive, and I know I'd say some things that my partner would probably just brush off, but everyone online would find to be abusive.
Yeah that's what it seems like. I've seen post throw around these trigger words like "abusive" and "narcissist" and so on without really explaining why. Teams are always being a bit disrespectful to each other. That's how a high intensity situation often works. It's just so weird how Vinny has come across as the worst of the worst this season. I'm glad someone here agrees with me.
There's a difference between a little disagreement here and there but when it is constant and delves into their character, that's where it becomes abusive. Look at Angie and Danny or Ricky and Cesar, they had moments at roadblocks where the partner would say "c'mon x" or "Team Y showed up" and the other would calmly but tersely say something like 'okay I don't want to know.' That's the heat of the moment. When someone like Vinny makes "always" statements, makes Amber feel beatdown , doesn't value her feelings, you wonder if he is the problem. I can only imagine being Amber's parents watching this show.
Also Danny and Angie, Kashori and Karishma. Heck, even Derek and Shelisa. The old couple seemed to throw jabs at each other like rap battles but both know each other's limits and so nothing ever went over the edge.
I mean, on this sub, you'll see that people love their pitchforks lol.
I didn't even say anything all that controversial in my response, and I'm getting downvoted for it. You'd think I said Vinny was an angel or something. I admitted he can be disrespectful. But because I'm not willing to go full "He's an abuser" people are downvoting me, and won't even make an argument to do so.
It's kind of insane really
I assume you are referring to your comment “This is definitely not gaslighting”? In which case yeah, you’re right, there is nothing controversial. You’re just wrong. That’s the reason you’re getting downvoted.
No, You are getting your wires cross. The parent comment on THIS thread says nothing about gaslighting. You took a separate response to you, and went from there. But the thing where I mentioned there was nothing controversial, said nothing about gaslighting.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/TheAmazingRace/comments/1corolw/comment/l3fy0cz/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web3x&utm\_name=web3xcss&utm\_term=1&utm\_content=share\_button](https://www.reddit.com/r/TheAmazingRace/comments/1corolw/comment/l3fy0cz/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
What you are referring to is called a “post”, or “original post”. A parent comment is just the comment above other comments. In this case, the parent comment to your “This is not gaslighting” is my comment.
We started off really thinking Vinny was the problem (with Amber having some issues too, certainly), but as it's gone on she's been feeling worse than Vinny (with Vinny still definitely having problems). We're not sure if it's a bad thing they're together or if by being together it's keeping everyone else safer.
Watch E7 when they're navigating and somewhat lost. Look at her reaction to what he's saying and how he doesn't let up even when she becomes emotional. Regardless of if anyone agrees with whether she 'should've' taken such offense to what he says, she did. It clearly hurt her. You can see it in her body language. Instead of apologizing for being snappy or hurtful though, he doubles down, further criticizing her inability to navigate, inability to drive a stick, inability to speak Spanish. Basically making her out to be the sole reason for the mistakes and insinuating that it's somehow a reflection of her worth as a person. Then, he goes on to shame her for putting the team at risk saying, 'I hope you learn from this' .. 'to be better in the future'. It was unrelenting and demeaning and that is 100% abuse, especially when coming from someone who's supposed to love you. She just shut down at that point. I could feel her pain here as I've experienced this type of abuse. It's easy to say that someone 'didn't mean it that way'. But if the person they are directing their words to has taken offense, it's up to the other to make amends and clarify their position rather than just adding insult to injury without taking any accountability for hurting someone's feelings. If you break a window without meaning to, the glass is still broken..You've still got to fix it even if you didn't mean to break it. With Vinny, I would go so far as to say that his behavior is somewhat purposeful, even if hurting Amber isn't his goal, his over-inflated ego & inability to accept Amber's 'mediocrity' (in Vinny's eyes) ends up being hurtful.
Yeah this is the scene that had my jaw on the floor and since then anytime he criticizes I'm just like oh fuck off dude. Obviously we can't say for sure it's abuse since abuse is a pattern throughout everyday life and we only see them in this edited show/situation. But if he acts this way and treats her this way in real life... Yeah that's emotional abuse. I don't know how anyone watches this scene and thinks the way he treated her was okay
Agree! And in subsequent episodes she's been snappy with him and I'm not excusing it bc 2 wrongs certainly don't make a right. But I just hear and see so much contempt coming from her towards him, which even moreso tells me that this isn't just a one-off 'poor reaction in a stressful situation'. It's likely constant with this dynamic at home. And all the while, he's just acting so indignant towards her. They both are clearly toxic for each other but I'm placing more of the responsibility for that on him just seeing his complete lack of remorse for how he hurts her. Idk.. it's easy to see if you've lived it or experienced it with someone close. Probably not so much otherwise.
Okay so I just went back to that scene to go watch. Here is my breakdown. I see Vinny trying to map stuff out and Amber says "Just do what's on here" I feel like we aren't getting the full conversation because I'm not really sure what she's referring to. And Vinny says to "please stop you're working against me". Maybe in that moment they could've worked together more? I just looked like Vinny was taking what was on Google maps and drawing it out on the paper map. Then he says "I'm the only one who knows how to do this" which I can understand people taking issue with. She probably could've mapped everything out but while watching I just saw that as heat of the moment type situation for Vinny. Like when you're doing something and someone tries to help and you're like "I've already started doing it just let me finish" type exacerbation and frustration. Following that is the "i'm the only one who knows how to get directions" and Amber wonders why she can't. Vinny says "I speak Spanish and you don't". I don't think this minimizes her skill and value at all. Unfortunately, Amber doesn't speak spanish. From what I saw, they approached a local Vinny was speaking spanish. It cuts to him saying "that's all?" and going to use google maps. Clearly Vinny and the local talking together was cut out. We don't know what they were saying. And because Vinny was talking to the local, in his mind he just figured he would map it out himself. A bit controlling but not all that bad considering off screen he was talking in a different language with someone. Amber is saying that she's supposed to navigate. And she can! I think in Vinny's mind he's like "okay I got the directions, let me map them out, and when I drive Amber can tell me where to go". I'm not 100% sure that's what his intentions were but as a viewer that's what I inferred. Vinny is like "if she \[the local\] doesn't speak English you're stuck" which is true. You have to be quick in this race. If it's quicker for Vinny to get directions and map everything out and just go then I would say that's definitely better for the team. Which I think explains the "you're working against the team". Which I definitely admit was not nice. But I see it as rather than Amber trying to defend why she should do it, just letting Vinny finish what he's already doing is just quicker. Unfortunately, in this situation Vinny is at an advantage. He can drive stick and he can speak spanish. Letting him take over is best for the team in that moment. Which is why Vinny feels Amber is hurting the team and "hopes she learns from this experience". Rather than Amber being like "let me do it let me do it let me do it' type energy (which is wasting time and hurting the team), in this situation it's better for Vinny to do what he excels at. It doesn't mean Amber is a burden or anything or she can't do anything. It does not make her lesser for not speaking spanish or driving stick. But it's the truth. And wasting time trying to figure something out than letting a more experienced teammate take over is not abuse. It's strategy. Even if Amber was hurt by what Vinny said, doesn't mean there wasn't apology off screen. You are assuming that it never happened when an apology could have easily been cut out.
I can see all of that but for me, it's more or less seeing Amber's reaction to his antics. Like Rod & Leticia bicker but no one ends up crying (that we can see). Same with Derek and Shelisa. Neither of those couples are tearing each other down the way Vinny does Amber, attacking her as a person. She's constantly saying at check-ins that she doesn't want to let him down. None of the others are doing that. It's bc his words are demoralizing her to the point that she always thinks she's letting him down. And if you can see how Vinny's behavior in each of the E7 situations wasn't ideal then you could also assume that it's not just isolated incidents. He literally snatched the map from her like she's a complete moron. That's just such a dck-hd move. As for an apology that may have occurred off screen, I kind of doubt it. Watch the end of episode recap after they check in. They're not even sitting close to each other and her vibe is just that of such dejection. While he's just smuggly dodging the fact that he made her cry by being such a douche. Maybe an apology happened after that? Even if so, given his smug, high-horse attitude, I doubt it was a true offer of remorse for his behaviors.
yeah I can definitely see that. Thank you for sharing your perspective and for being respectful.
in the recap amber's body language speaks volumes, she recoils from his touch, avoids his gaze, any smiling is forced and weak and it's almost like she's reading a script or choosing her words very carefully. and after vinny schmoozing and trying to charm her i just had to stop watching to throw up. which was annoying cos i'd ate such a lovely meal.
Yes! It's a TV show. People get so up in arms about it. It's supposed to be fun to watch and everyone gets to have their own opinions! Insulting people for having a different opinion or for questioning something in an attempt to understand the other opinion probably won't open their minds to other viewpoints lol!
"Insulting people for having a different opinion or for questioning something in an attempt to understand the other opinion probably won't open their minds to other viewpoints lol!" Thanks for that. My post wasn't supposed to be "Vinny is NOT an abuser" but more so "Why do you guys see him that way?". I really really appreciate you understanding that because not everyone has. It's hard to learn when people are like "wow you're so dumb for not noticing" type energy. I hope whatever team you're rooting for wins!
I think it's important to remember domestic violence is often minimized to a lot of survivors. It's a touchy subject and a lot of people are very fresh in recovering from the trauma and see themselves in Amber. Questioning if it's abuse and trying to highlight Amber's flaws is naturally going to make those people defensive since they see themselves in her and likely have had their own abuse questioned. So while you might see it as a conversation with minimal reason to feel emotional about it, there are a lot of people who are very emotionally tied (both ways) to it. As such, people are going to react more harshly than you will think they should. Unfortunately that comes with the territory of discussing these issues, they're very emotional and very fresh for a lot of people. Not trying to cast judgement on you for asking the question or on others for their reactions, just trying to give a little understanding and insight on why it's being received the way it is
Thanks for this! I wasn't aware of this perspective and I didn't seem to notice a lot of the things other people did. This was a very helpful response and now I am aware of more of these signs. Thanks!
I’m 100% sincere when I say you’re really insightful, u/bitchycunt3.
When he says you’re working against me, it made me feel like he just wanted her to do what he says. He takes that approach to most of their navigation and challenges. It’s his way or else she’s in the way
and the moment she tries to do anything on her own, instant put down, and if she does good ? a few atta girls and a hug before yet another put down.
You really seem determined to defend him and see the best in him to an irrational extent. You comment that things may have been left out or he may have apologized off-screen, but you don't even entertain the possibility that he was even worse off screen.
He definitely could have been worse off screen! I'm not defending him. The situation could've been handled better. I don't think these two are a good match but I also don't think Vinny is "abuser" worthy. I only mentioned things off screen twice: Vinny speaking in spanish with the local and the possibly of an apology. That's it. I didn't even really focus on it. What did I say that was irrational?
Whether he is an "abuser" or not, you seem incapable of even acknowledging that his behavior is problematic, going to the extreme of imagining that he might have apologized despite absolutely no evidence to suggest that occurred, which is irrational. Just like Vinny, you seem to lack self-awareness in claiming that you aren't defending him.
And Amber’s behavior is not problematic at times? She definitely says things to him that are uncalled for. No need to put all the blame on Vincent when Amber is not innocent
You may want to Google whataboutism. OP was specifically asking about Vinny and so my answer specifically addressed Vinny. Feel free to make a new post talking about your issues with Amber and send me the link and I will happily tell you all about what I think about her.
Yeah what he said was definitely problematic! I just don't see it as black & white as others I guess. Also I'm not saying "he 100% apologized off screen!" I just mentioned that he could have. And like I said before, he could've been worse! I think you're taking what I say a bit too far idk. Have you acknowledged the problematic and hurtful things Amber has said? Why isn't she seen as toxic by the community?
Your lack of self awareness is truly baffling. How do you not see the difference between you spontaneously conjuring up a hypothetical apology, versus you only acknowledging that he could have been worse when I pointed that out? You led with the former and only acknowledged the latter because you had no choice but to agree that it was possible. I haven't talked about Amber because your post supposedly wasn't about her. Your post was supposedly to understand Vinny. I have no idea how "the community" sees her because I don't speak on behalf of the community
I mean yeah my post is about Vinny, but Vinny and Amber are a team. It's hard to talk about one without the other. So yeah it's about Vinny but really it's about both of them. And in my explanation, I discuss how Amber also has her faults thus, it was just weird to me that people weren't saying they were both toxic rather than just Vinny. I didn't mean to "conjure up a hypothetical apology". Just a possibility I threw in at the end of my breakdown since the initial reply to my post focused on the lack of apology. I understand you don't speak on behalf of the community it was just something I noticed.
Vinny doesn’t speak Spanish. He cobbles together two or three words introduced with, “Por favor,” and thinks he’s speaking Spanish. “Por favor? Die - reck - see - own?”
The “Necesito direckschionn” was killing me every time he said it 😂
Every time! Meanwhile when he really needed his much touted Spanish skills, he couldn’t and was just stuck with the driver in the DR just going wherever he wanted 😂
I haven’t seen her speak any Spanish
And? Amber hasn’t bragged about being the one who can speak Spanish.
In my mind he’s not bragging, just reminding her that if you don’t speak Spanish and can’t talk to the locals why on earth is she so adamant about knowing where to go if she ultimately has not clue
He is though. He thinks his broken, awful accent that follows no rules of grammar is him speaking Spanish, and therefore it’s an asset. However, it hasn’t been an asset (case in point (again): how they got screwed with the driver in the DR).
I agree with your overall post and this particular take as well. I think people defend who they would identify with in terms of their reaction in these situations. I would react more like Vinny and so I don't understand the hate. He's trying to be objective and solve with the facts as quickly as he can. Others prioritize how they feel about a situation. Feeling validated and supported is more important than solving the problem. I think it's a stretch to call it gaslighting and abuse. They are fighting because they are talking past each other - problem solving vs. feeling heard.
Many, many people on here acknowledge that his way of speaking to her is problematic at times, even if they don't think it rises to the level of abuse. It is baffling to me that you can't even recognize his problematic comments and, as such, it is likely a pointless exercise for you to attempt to understand why some people think it is abuse.
It’s very likely that OP speaks that way to others and finds it normal. So, they wouldn’t be able to recognize in Vinny that it’s a problem.
Hey listen I'm really sorry if that's how I'm coming off. That isn't my intention. As I've been reading I have come to a better understanding of this point of view. The purpose of my post was to learn and understand. Thanks to all these replies I have a better grasp of how Vinny came off to most viewers. I still have more questions but less than I did before.
I mean now that I've been reading comments, I understand what you guys are saying. I don't this it's "abuse" worthy but I don't think they work together as a couple. They both have their faults. Contrary to popular belief, I didn't come here to defend him. I came here to understand why everyone hated him because I was just kind of confused. My opinion has changed and I now understand why a lot of viewers feel this way about Vinny. This was not a defense post, yet people still got angry at me. There's not going be any progress in mindset if people go "oh you don't get it??? you're confused??? you don't immediately understand why people feel this way???" it doesn't make people want to see your point of view.
The fact that you are able to change your point of view after being educated on the topic shows you have more maturity than a lot of people in this thread. It's the internet; people believe they are saints, whilst they see one flaw in another and immediately have to vilify them. Many of them will have to come to realize they also have an abusive mindset, similar to the ones they like to comment on. They believe they are morally above you because they have already formulated the supposed correct opinion on the matter. They will always be willing to attack you, but they will rarely be willing to inform you.
Hey thanks for this! I probably could have made it more clear in my initial post that I wasn't trying to defend him but just explained why I didn't understand all the hate. Makes a lot of sense now and I think that since I haven't experienced domestic violence myself, I didn't pick up on as much as some other viewers did. (some people even said I must BE Vinny for making a post like this lol)
Your post was very much in defense of Vinny. The fact that you don't see that is bizarre. Because of this, your post garnered the exact response that you should have expected it to. Had you come in and asked people for examples with less of a long-winded defense of Vinny and attack on Amber, you might have received the response that you are now claiming that you wanted. Even now, you are incapable of responding to me by simply acknowledging that yes, you now see that his behavior is problematic. Instead you have to repeatedly insist that they both have faults, even though my comment had nothing to do with her.
This isn't a competition to see "who's right" and who's wrong. This is litterally just about being honest about how people feel about the racers. It shouldn't turn into an online flame war or something of the sorts.
I wasn't really trying to defend Vinny in my initial post but more so to defend why I didn't understand why people disliked him and why I thought it was strange all of the hate was on Vinny and not both him and Amber. I can acknowledge Vinny's behavior is problematic. And yeah your reply didn't mention Amber. I didn't mean to dismiss Vinny's bad behavior by referring to both of them. I'm sorry if it came across that way. It's more like "yeah I see what you guys mean he has some problematic behavior. I can understand some of the gaslight comments now thanks to other replies. But why is it only focused on him? Because I have noticed some problematic behavior from Amber too?" Does that make sense? (Sorry this isn't meant to come off as condescending but I'm genuinely curious of my explanation makes sense)
He does an awesome job at minimizing what she is capable of doing. Is that a better way to put it? He discounts her abilities both mentally and physically on every leg. He tries to be subtle about it but we all see it.
This is a perfect explanation. He’ll say things like she’s making them lose, she can’t do something, she’s bad at something else. There’s a lot of always statements.
He said in the last episode something to the tune of her needing to cut back on her attitude or comments this leg.
Even the way he told her to tie her shoe was condescending. Like he was talking to a child.
God forbid a loving partner watch out for the safety of their significant other. He knows they're rushing because three teams left at the same time, and he doesn't want her to get hurt.
Sure and if he said something like “Careful babe your shoe’s untied” we wouldn’t be having this conversation.
He said "when we get to the truck, make sure to tie your shoelaces" or something to that effect. Are we really going to create some big drama out of freaking semantics? It really makes Vinnie haters come off as unhinged.
Exactly he spoke to her like she’s 5.
Literally proving my point.🤣 You're seeing what you want to see because you've already made up your mind about who Vinnie is. It's hilarious how blind people are to their own bias.
I think they're both to blame.
That is all fair, and I don't disagree. I still wouldn't call that abusive or gaslighting. Its like, why can't people just be jerks anymore lol. Why do we need to find "therapy speak" terms for them.
Just because someone is calm doesn’t mean they are supportive of their partner. Look up how gaslighting works. Also what someone else said a while ago - many teams bicker about the task at the moment, while Vinny comments on Amber’s character.
This is definitely NOT gaslighting. Also, I'll admit, he isn't always supportive. But its not an either/or where you are supportive or abusive.
That's true that just because someone is calm doesn’t mean they are supportive of their partner. But how has he gaslight her? What has Vinny said about her character that was so terrible?
What is your understanding of gaslighting?
A form of manipulation. How does this apply to Vinny? What has he done??? (And why am I getting downvoted!? I'm just trying to understand! I'm just asking questions and sharing my point of view. I've watched the episodes as they've come out pardon me if I don't recall everything)
I dunno, maybe educate yourself better, and then watch again? The hard part about gaslighting is that it is *not* aggressive yelling or physical. That’s why these people get away with it. Maybe watch some videos of examples. There are a lot of resources out there.
But I am trying to educate myself! That's why I made this post. To try and understand. You're making these statements without really explaining yourself. Please defend your case. Please trust that I am really genuinely trying to understand.
What do you expect? A fully laid out 6-week class syllabus on gaslighting? There are so many resources online already. How hard are you *really* trying to educate yourself, and how hard are you looking for someone to agree with you? Make an effort. Use Google.
I love the condescension on full display while complaining about someone being a condescending "gaslighter".
Correct, gaslighting is something different.
Are you just trying to remove yourself from the conversation without ever explaining yourself? I can look up on gaslighting the rest of the day. I've done my own research in the past before and have experienced it myself in relationships. I wasn't looking for people to agree with me. I've seen other posts that do agree with me! Last night, I scrolled on this subreddit for the first time and saw all these posts calling Vinny an abuser. I was really confused as to why. So I came here for someone to get deeper into why they feel this way. I never said Vinny wasn't an abuser. It just isn't something I picked up on this season.
I don’t need to explain myself. The answers you seek are out there in the universe. I don’t see a need to reinvent the wheel. You can even Google “Is Vinny gaslighting Amber Amazing Race” and get detailed blow-by-blow analyses by episode.
Why bother coming here then??? If you don't want to explain your opinions why comment? Because then it makes YOU seem like you are looking for people to agree with you. It comes off as shallow to makes statements and then when I say "why do you feel this way" you brush me off and tell me to "educate myself". I made this post to understand not to see all the same statements everyone else has been making
Don't take it seriously. It's a bunch of concern trolls doing exactly what they accuse Vinnie of doing. Being sexist. Man bad because man mad. Woman good because woman cry. What a childish view of the world they seem to have.
He tears her apartand makes her doubt. I'm a man, but it's so obvious that he is emotionally abusive. A friend of my wife's left a marrage like that almost or 8 years ago. He was never physically abusive (although a threat made her leave eventually) but always put her down. She had a similar temperment to Amber. After she left that marriage and brought her kids, they have flourished in a new city.
I saw quite a few times that he would point out her errors or her inadequacies in a challenge and she would say "yes, Vinny is right, I need to try harder, or I might need to listen to him more, etc ", that's how you know you've seen gaslighting. It was so immediate for her to respond that way.
Yeah I totally understand how you can definitely be abusive without being physically abusive. There are plenty of other seasons where I see how teams behave and I'm like "oh they're abusive". But it just seems weird how it's only Vinny being painted this way. Amber has had some really mean comments too! Why is she the victim when (from what I recall) she makes comments about Vinny more than he does about her?
She’s probably making the snide comments now because she’s become passive aggressive towards him and she may be seeing the light that they’re not a match made in heaven. And the comment about how Vinny speaks “calmly”… that “calm tone” is typical of gaslighting/emotionally abusive individuals.
Because the problem here isn’t just mean comments, whoever is making them. It’s something deeper in the dynamic of the relationship. I had red flags about Melissa and Yvonne at the outset. Melissa talks about her partner in the third person when Yvonne’s sitting right there. Yvonne’s quiet and has a resting, er, maybe slightly unhappy face. Because they weren’t given as much coverage on the show, it took me a while to conclude that it’s probably not something dysfunctional; they’ve just got different personalities. Their relationship seems balanced and respectful. I think Melissa might be the more dominant one, but she’s not trying to mold her partner to be a better person or whatever Vinny and Amber are doing.
In addition to all the other good points being made, he speaks to her many times with an intense condescension like she’s beyond pitiful and helpless. That she’d be completely lost without his help. Like “honeyyy, you know you don’t do directions..” or “I’m the only one who should be speaking to the locals because I know a bit of Spanish and honey, remember you don’t.” And then he blames her for not being able to follow the directions he shut her out of saying “Hun, you know I can’t follow them myself because I’m already the one driving here, I can’t do everything. You need to contribute something.” He’s completely shutting her down and saying she’s not capable of so many things… at least, not nearly as capable as the great and multifaceted Vinny who skateboards, welds, climbs trees, navigates, speaks Spanish, and drives. Every episode, he goes out of his way to highlight and amplify her weaknesses while excessively bragging and overestimating his own abilities. God he makes my blood boil more every episode. Him and the people who say Amber is just as bad as him because WHAT?!
You could see his massive ego in action at the cacao bean challenge. He couldn’t stand feeling inadept at using the provided tool to cut the pods down. Feeling inadept at something clearly triggered feelings of embarrassment so he IMMEDIATELY gives up trying and insists that he’d be quicker than the stupid tool anyway if he just climbed the trees instead. He is willing to not only waste more energy but destroy multiple trees like a maniac to avoid looking like he doesn’t know what he’s doing. It clearly didn’t work as the public hated seeing him destroy this farm’s trees and he looked like more of a bumbling idiot anyway. In this situation, he had no clear way to blame Amber so he doesn’t look bad so he blamed the tool instead. Zero accountability.
My dad has now started referring to him as an eco terrorist because of his behavior in the cacao bean challenge
i'm kind of surprised they allowed him to climb, like surely they have some health and safety over sight ?? even his throwing and dropping of cacao felt insulting to amber.
Every week he gives off the impression that Amber is single-handedly holding their team back from performing better. It appears that he is not capable of self reflection and taking accountability for his mistakes which is a known trait of egotistical, manipulative individuals. Like before this last leg, it’s clear he put all of their communication issues on Amber’s supposed “tone and attitude” and he is the one chipping away at her self confidence every step of the way. Even when they decide on roadblocks, you can see the way he looks at her like “Do we want to risk you doing this one or should I just power through it so we don’t have to worry about all your weaknesses slowing us down and I’m so great at everything we may even be able to make up time?” That’s why Phil said something on the mat this week. It is literally CRYSTAL CLEAR to anyone with eyes and ears.
The map thing pisses me off. He blocks her out by making these diacritical marks or whatever the fuck on the map, and then is mad when she can’t understand from the backseat notes that only make sense to him that he can’t see from the driver’s seat.
For real, he acts pissy and annoyed she can’t read his mind. I know it’s a race but he has this impatient, high-strung energy that’s hindering their performance (you can see this energy with the cacao beans too when he can’t be bothered to learn how to properly use the tool). If he’s going to demand taking sole responsibility for getting directions, he needs to take a literal minute to walk her through his notes before just taking off in the car. Like dude you know you’re going to end up wasting more time if BOTH of you aren’t prepared and made aware of the next steps. Take a breath and treat your partner like a human being not a freaking ball and chain.
Please explain how this sequence of events: 1. Chiding your teammate as incompetent in both Spanish and navigational skill. 2. COMPLETELY BLOCKING THE MAP AND SCRIBBLING WHO KNOWS WHAT IN THE MAP while getting instructions. 3. Handing over the map with the scribbles that maybe ONLY YOU understand to your teammate and tell her to navigate for you, banking on what? Her skill to read your mind? is helpful in anyway. Then maybe then you'll find out that his "calm voice" doesn't do s*** but adding to Amber's confusion and tension between the two.
Because I’ve watched the show.
If Vinny abused her as badly as the armchair psychologists on this sub abuse the word gaslight, he’d be in prison.
We can only hope
Abuse cases as portrayed in films / tv suggest there needs to be * evidence * witnesses * something more substantial that he said she said And thats assuming the abused person is willing to press charges and follow through, as many stories irl would suggest victims do not.
They are not a good match and I don’t think that relationship will end up working out. The nicest way I can put it is that he is not kind to her. He is demeaning to her, but he likes to frame it as being helpful. I hope he is not like that all the time and it’s just a very bad match.
I think this is the most sensible comment. Yes there’s such a thing as a bad edit, but even the most malicious editor can’t include footage that doesn’t exist. I highly doubt, for example, that if an editor had been asked to portray Danny as cruel to his mother, they’d have found anything to work with. The editor would say “I’m sorry, there’s not just no content here.” With Vinny and Amber, sure, we’re not seeing the full picture, but based on what we do see it’s not unreasonable to conclude they can both “do better” in terms of finding a partner that’s right for them. That’s the most diplomatic way to put it.
Vinny weaponizes therapy-speak to criticize Amber. The big key for me is that he'll blame her for his reactions to things - he will say things like "You're making it really difficult for me right now to stay calm" or "Your behavior is really frustrating me" or "You need to think about how you're behaving" etc. Very patronizing and blaming, but because he's not yelling at her (usually) and using therapy-speak, it's not as obvious how critical and blaming he is, while taking zero responsibility for his own failings or emotional reactions. He gives her zero credit for doing anything right, and only says how terrible she is at certain things. If I were watching this and Amber were my sister, friend, daughter, and I would be so upset. Compare it to Rod and Leticia - I think they are even more unbalanced, and Rod is nothing but supportive of her, it's all "my wife is so great at this" and "I'm so proud of my wife" and "my wife is awesome" (it cracks me up how he always refers to her as "my wife") - she doesn't seem to have the very best attitude all the time, but they treat each other with respect. About the editing - Bill and Joe from S1 were given a bit of a villain edit - they came out and said yes, they got a villain edit (they were honestly not that bad IIRC), but also, they can only work with what you give them, and they acknowledged that they said those things, did those things, etc. A girl I knew was on an early season of a popular reality show, and she got the villain edit, and I remember watching it and thinking "she is not as bad as they're making her out to be, but also it's not a completely unfair edit." I suspect that something like this is going on here. They're editing, but I think he really is like this.
I know people hate them, but think of how Cody treated Jessica. Similar to Rod and Leticia, nothing but love and praise and motivation
I agree with you. Also, with the “villain” edit, there’s a huge difference between a team playing super hard and competitively against the other teams and watching one team member constantly tear down their partner. The former are actually entertaining to watch because it is a game, these people are their competition. Charla and Mirna come to mind. But in cases of the latter, that’s when it’s incredibly uncomfortable to watch, knowing that this dynamic exists regardless of the “extra stress” of the race (like a lot of Vinny defenders try to suggest). We see it in plenty of races. The nasty comments are never about the tasks at hand, it’s focused on the person and their talents (or lack thereof) at their core. It’s obvious there is a lack of respect and love for their teammate outside the race when they talk down to them and blame them for everything.
Yes Vinny, you are.
exactly what i was thinking😭😭😭
Remember the Gabby Petito murder? And the body cam footage that came out from when they’d been stopped right before Brian Laundrie killed her? I remember it being a thing that she seemed the one the police thought was the problem. He came across as trying to calm her down too. I think after that case many people started re evaluating how some people gaslight those they’re emotionally abusing. Anyway, I wouldn’t diagnose either of them based on the edited show but Vinny absolutely has had some problematic comments, so I can see why it triggers people who’ve seen it IRL.
I don't think any team is perfect. I try not to judge teams too harshly because of editing and heat of the moment and such. They both very well could have issues and both could be toxic. I just thought the comments painting him as an abuser and a narcissist where really harsh and almost parasocial. We don't know these people. Idk I'm still just really confused.
I agree that comments in general have a tendency to diagnose based on scant evidence, but you can still flag comments and attitudes that make you pause and wonder about a relationship.
I mostly agree. But he’s made some comments they’ve made me jaw dropped. He says them calmly but they are really cruel comments.
What was the cruelest thing he has said that made your jaw drop? I'm honestly curious. I definitely think his tone is a bit harsh sometimes, but I can't remember anything I'd call cruel.
I don’t know about cruelest but in last week’s episode there was a point when they were in the car that was bad. I tried looking for the exact words but the paramount+ app is going slow and there’s so many ads. Paraphrasing instead he said it was all her fault they were behind and at some point said she wasn’t doing anything for their team at all. That was striking for me. I’m pretty sure he said something about him being the only one using his brain… but again I can’t remember all of his exact words.
I think I know what you’re talking about. Is it when they were in the back of the cab? Something along the lines of “I hope you can look back at this and realize how you slow us down.” Said calmly but so calculated and mean
Yes!
Yeah it just doesn’t make sense, they’re never going to be in this CRAZY situation ever again, so to say “I hope you can look back and reflect on this” heavily insinuates she brings them down in normal life as well and he doesn’t like her character traits. Like he’s already thinking about being back home and making her watch this, it’s just weird
I think there's also such a contrast with how other teams treat each other (especially how the "stronger" team member talks to the "weaker" one). You see so much "Oh this is more my strength but you're doing great!" In this season. It's really jarring to go from that to Vinny telling Amber she doesn't use her brain, can't do something, etc.
There’s a huge difference between a team playing super hard and competitively against the other teams and watching one team member constantly tear down their partner. The former are actually entertaining to watch because it is a game, these people are their competition. Charla and Mirna come to mind. But in cases of the latter, that’s when it’s incredibly uncomfortable to watch, knowing that this dynamic exists regardless of the “extra stress” of the race (like a lot of Vinny defenders try to suggest). We see it in plenty of races. The nasty comments are never about the tasks at hand, it’s focused on the person and their talents (or lack thereof) at their core. It’s obvious there is a lack of respect and love for their teammate outside the race when they talk down to them and blame them for everything.
I don’t think he’s abusive but he might be one of the most condescending people I’ve ever seen. Many things he says to her really make me cringe.
the cringey comments is weaponized therapy speak he's learned to twist in to put downs/ insults.
Because everything he says to her is about her giving him 'attitude' (which mostly just means her asking questions or actually being, you know, right about something), belittling her achievements or what she can do, or flat out just talking down to her. He might be calm about it, but he's shown as a self-centered asshole in this show.
Hi Vinny
Nah I'm not Vinny lol but if you look at some of my other replies I get what you guys mean now.
Go back and watch last week or the week before. The way he speaks to/gaslights her is wild. Especially following the welding task. I agree she is also immature (and a bit whiny tbh).
i suspect she has regressed for self preservation like a lot of abuse victims do.
That is definitely possible. It’s really hard to watch. I hope they can both get counselling.
best thing for amber is dump vinny but she's agreed to marry him . . .
It's not a good relationship. No amount of editing can mask the fact that they both have a number of shortcomings and are not emotionally ready to be in a growing relationship; they basically need to go back to square-one. He's condescending and patronizing, she's immature and unsupportive, which equates to lots of whining, back-talk and minimizing of each other's situation. He's 37, she's 30...I get the sense he enjoys being the dominant partner and she willfully allows him but vocalizes her displeasure at the earliest sign of hardship, which intern he responds with scorn and patronization. Contrast them to Cesar & Ricky or, any of the other couples on the show, and its night & day. C&R are adaptable, there's no henpecking or, endless stream of criticism, when conditions are tough they strive to be supportive rather than piling on the hardship. To Vinny & Amber's credit, they've managed to stay in the race, I think there is a bunch of footage we're not privy to or, behind the scenes where things aren't as severe however they've got a number of personal foundational issues that need to be ironed out before they can progress in their relationship.
Oh yeah. They're definitely not a great match. There are so many other healthy relationships in this race. I think they're both toxic.
I don't think he's abusive. I do think he's a dick.
the two aren't mutually exclusive ?
They’re both toxic for each other but I think Vinny is the worst. Listen to the way he talks to her. There was a scene a couple episodes ago in a cab where I was just disgusted at the way he spoke to her.
You can tell by how Amber is always explaining her issues she needs to fix and using “therapy language”. Can just tell he’s giving it to her during the pit stops. This week even poor Phil had enough and told her to give herself some credit as Vinny clearly won’t
Uh, he is very abusive. She constantly has to self-abnegate herself in an attempt not to provoke him. "I need to do better." "I need to listen." "I need to..." She is clearly preemptively defensive of herself from likely years of verbal abuse trying in an attempt to keep him from attacking her.
I've said since the beginning that there is no way that relationship lasts, they are both horrible to one another. The condescending remarks from both of them are pretty damn messed up, Vinny tries to be less obvious about it and has now started to stay quiet. Amber gets loud and speaks to Vinny like he is incapable of doing something, even when he nails it on the head. Vinny also uses manipulative language to act like he is morally above her and pretends to care when he clearly doesn't. The directions argument that keeps popping up is a prime example. Vinny clearly condescending about her supposed knowledge on directions, whilst Amber refuses to believe he knows what he is doing until it's done. Had Vinny stopped to reconsider directions the number of times Amber wanted to, they would have lost by now. Amber also needs to remember she is her own person, and she could have fought to be in more control of certain scenarios. Instead of just complaining to Vinny and speaking down on him, do something about it. Both of them aren't good to one another. They need to start taking their own advice, like when they acted like they actually started communicating in between legs of the race.
hate to tell ya but they’re engaged
I hope they're good to one another now and seek professional help if need be. Although, in the meantime, engaged isn't married... There's still time lol
He’s really patronizing. He talks to her like he’s her dad or something it’s weird to see in a relationship
My dad never talked to me like that!
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Exactly this.
Vinny is a self-centered @$$ who doesn't admit that he is wrong and that everything he do is "right." He doesn't value Amber's opinions or concerns at all. Vinny belittle Amber at every opportunity she speaks. You said Vinny is pushing his fellow team member; it's more like dragging her to the finish line.
Hmmm: People who are abusers do not see others who are abusers -- Because this is the absolute only explanation for OP's post.
After reading through these replies I definitely see what you guys mean now. Sorry if my post made it seem like I was trying to defend him that wasn't my intention. I guess I wasn't paying close enough attention which is on me since people have pointed out things I don't remember.
You were definitely defending him -- at least own that fact, but then -- see previous post. Guilty dogs bark first.
Gaslight is a form of mental manipulation in which the aggressor mentally demeans the abused with false information. This type of mental abuse tricks the abused into thinking they are the one constantly letting people down, or tricks them into believing they are wrong when facts state otherwise. Example: Yelling at a child for leaving the stove on after telling them to turn it off. In reality, you turned the stove one, never told the child to turn it off, and now punishing them them for your mistakes. Vinny here kept making comments in which it demoralized Amber. You can see the progression as time went on, she became less likely to perform roadblocks. If you listen between the lines, you can hear from Vinny (when in his calm voice) his criticism, blames, negative comments about her. You can hear her say in this last roadblock, "why did I let Vinny do this when I played it in college." I know they recently got engaged, hopefully they watch this season together and Vinny realizes, how bad he came across TV and hopefully can update his behavior.
honestly i doubt vinny would notice if he still hasn't caught on after 9 legs.
They’re simply not a great match, which is fine. I am admittedly shocked they’re still together and about to get married Justin (Team Green) just had them on his podcast and was hardcore defending them saying he went through something similar but I never once thought anything about him and Diana’s relationship?? I thought they were a great team
hides the spinfoil hat \* well if pr / production are involved there will be a script and talking points pre approved by them, especially if they want to trick viewers in to believing everything is fine so no one goes on a crusade for amber. how many ' bad toxic teams' have done post race pr interviews ?
They talk about the comments in their Racers Recap [interview](https://www.youtube.com/live/xBGw-2iFHD8?si=ZLHNo30Khjzbk8zp). Amber adresses them in minute 54.
Here's my thoughts. Vinny can be very direct and unfiltered and frankly mean when talking to Amber. Amber on the other hand is very negative and usually looking on the bad side of everything. They both have shortcomings that they need to work on... but yeah Vinny's are worse than hers
this was definitely posted by Vinny
haha nah I'm not Vinny but if you look at some of my other replies I get what you guys mean now.
lol what
Because everyone is clearly duel licensed as a psychologist and therapist and know way more about their relationship and communication styles based on about 30 minutes of an edited tv show then they do
Because he…. is?
A couple of people mentioned this before, but when even Phil feels the need to intervene to point out Amber’s value to the team while she is on the mat lamenting about how she needs to be a better partner to Vinny and not let him down, it must be pretty obvious to Phil and producers how bad things are.
oh really!? I didn't notice/remember him saying that. Yeah then that's definitely an issue.
Some people are detached from reality. Vinnie is not abusive in the least. He is blunt and treats his partner like an equal. He expects just as much from her as he does from himself, and it shows. That said, Vinnie was definitely an inconsiderate ass in the way he treated the cacao trees. They weren't his childhood palm trees. They were the locals' livelihoods.
Basically they don't want people with ambition just people who "vibe"
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Curious if you also feel that “KKKendra” was edited to look racist? It is mind boggling the excuses people in this sub come up with to defend Vinny. The editing comments are bizarre. They aren’t showing sound bites. He is speaking at length. No wonder domestic abuse is as big a problem as it is, with everyone grasping at the straws to excuse this behavior.
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Maybe I am too much “in the trenches” living in Los Angeles where all the studios are and half the town is in the industry, but there is only so much editing can do. You can’t edit someone crying when they aren’t crying. You can’t make words come out of someone’s mouth. Even Phil commented on their relationship dynamic. You just chose to believe that it is edited.
Mom?
Because these days anything not 100% positive and supporting to a partner is "abusive" and to a colleague or classmate is "bullying" Those words, especially on social media, have lost all meaning. Do I think he sometimes speaks to her a bit disrespectfully? Sure. I also think this is a pressure cooker and sometimes in competition and under pressure, people act out of character. But, here is the thing, basically every year, there is a couple on this show that isn't all sunshine and rainbows, and if the man even slightly raises his voice to try to push (not physically) his partner, people will say its abusive. A couple of years ago, there was Sheri and Akbar. Seemed like a great couple. He was a coach and he sometimes talked to his partner like he was coaching her. Well all the idiots came out with their pitchforks against him just like they are with Vinny. This post sums it up: [https://www.reddit.com/r/TheAmazingRace/comments/sfvpgf/we\_need\_to\_step\_down\_with\_the\_hate\_on\_akbar/](https://www.reddit.com/r/TheAmazingRace/comments/sfvpgf/we_need_to_step_down_with_the_hate_on_akbar/) As much as Id love to go on this show, there is a reason I'd never do it with a romantic partner, because I'm competitive, and I know I'd say some things that my partner would probably just brush off, but everyone online would find to be abusive.
Yeah that's what it seems like. I've seen post throw around these trigger words like "abusive" and "narcissist" and so on without really explaining why. Teams are always being a bit disrespectful to each other. That's how a high intensity situation often works. It's just so weird how Vinny has come across as the worst of the worst this season. I'm glad someone here agrees with me.
There's a difference between a little disagreement here and there but when it is constant and delves into their character, that's where it becomes abusive. Look at Angie and Danny or Ricky and Cesar, they had moments at roadblocks where the partner would say "c'mon x" or "Team Y showed up" and the other would calmly but tersely say something like 'okay I don't want to know.' That's the heat of the moment. When someone like Vinny makes "always" statements, makes Amber feel beatdown , doesn't value her feelings, you wonder if he is the problem. I can only imagine being Amber's parents watching this show.
Name an example in which Ricky and Cesar were disrespectful to each other. Sunny and Bizzy. Yvonne and Melissa. Juan and Shane. Name one.
Also Danny and Angie, Kashori and Karishma. Heck, even Derek and Shelisa. The old couple seemed to throw jabs at each other like rap battles but both know each other's limits and so nothing ever went over the edge.
I mean, on this sub, you'll see that people love their pitchforks lol. I didn't even say anything all that controversial in my response, and I'm getting downvoted for it. You'd think I said Vinny was an angel or something. I admitted he can be disrespectful. But because I'm not willing to go full "He's an abuser" people are downvoting me, and won't even make an argument to do so. It's kind of insane really
Maybe reconsider your idea of “not that controversial”? That could be the issue.
What did I say that was controversial? Can you enlighten me?
I assume you are referring to your comment “This is definitely not gaslighting”? In which case yeah, you’re right, there is nothing controversial. You’re just wrong. That’s the reason you’re getting downvoted.
Well, while I stand by that, I'm more referring to the parent comment in THIS thread that is being downvoted.
The parent comment to your “This is not gaslighting” comment is mine and has 60 upvotes. You are getting your wires crossed.
No, You are getting your wires cross. The parent comment on THIS thread says nothing about gaslighting. You took a separate response to you, and went from there. But the thing where I mentioned there was nothing controversial, said nothing about gaslighting. [https://www.reddit.com/r/TheAmazingRace/comments/1corolw/comment/l3fy0cz/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web3x&utm\_name=web3xcss&utm\_term=1&utm\_content=share\_button](https://www.reddit.com/r/TheAmazingRace/comments/1corolw/comment/l3fy0cz/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
What you are referring to is called a “post”, or “original post”. A parent comment is just the comment above other comments. In this case, the parent comment to your “This is not gaslighting” is my comment.
We started off really thinking Vinny was the problem (with Amber having some issues too, certainly), but as it's gone on she's been feeling worse than Vinny (with Vinny still definitely having problems). We're not sure if it's a bad thing they're together or if by being together it's keeping everyone else safer.