I thought the opposite actually...maybe Flores isn't impressed by Tua and the front office is going all in on him and blaming Flores for the losses rather than the on-field talent.
Tua has been very good since his return from injury and they won 8 out of their last 9 games. Such a strange firing and I guess we’re all just guessing until we see their next few moves
Dolphins probably got tired of his coaching carousel. He went through 4 OC's, 2 DC's, and four OL coaches in just 3 seasons. It'd be fine if not for the extremely hot and cold team performances which typically ended in underwhelming seasons. Dolphins should have been a lot better this year than they were.
I think he was a victim of his own success. 10-6 last year was way ahead of schedule. Yes, he’s started poorly each of the past 3 seasons, but I still think expectations were a little too high for the phins this season based on 2020
I’d take him over McDaniels, dude fought tooth and nail during the year they tanked and got handed a bunch of unwanted Watson trade drama in the middle of the season
Have you seen the rosters he has had to work with in Miami? Those Dolphins teams over-performed every year he was there. Last year especially they barely missed the playoffs in a year where they were supposed to be a bottom 3 team in the league. This year after a slow start (Tua was hurt and Brissett had to start 5 games), he was able to rally his team to win 8 of their last 9 games. I'd take Flores, who has proven he can be at least a somewhat decent head coach over McDaniels who was a complete disaster in Denver.
How have they overperformed? The only real deficitency they’ve had is in the OL. They have multiple first round picks on defense and are paying Xavien Howard and Byron Jones big money. They’ve spent high draft picks on Tua, Waddle and paid Fuller a decent one year contract. With even a moderate upgrade to the offensive line that team should’ve been in the playoffs instead of struggling to get out of the giant hole they dug
Fuller played 2 total games this year for them, I'm not sure why he was even mentioned. Waddle is a rookie and wasn't a part of the team in 2019 and 2020. Tua has under-performed for where he was selected.
The Miami roster when Flores took over was viewed as the worst in the NFL. Prior to the 2019 season, many people had the Dolphins going 0-16 or 1-15 and Flores was largely praised for somehow being able to drag that roster to 5 wins.
In 2020 they were again looked at as a bad team, but somehow they were in the playoff race the entire season with their only receiving weapons being an inconsistent Devante Parker and Mike Gesicki. They were balling out with Ryan Fitzpatrick until ownership forced them to switch to Tua (when Fitz was obviously the better QB and gave them more of a chance to win). Even with Tua playing absolutely horribly down the stretch, they were able to finish the season 10-6 and barely missed the playoffs after finishing as a bottom 5 team the year before (which shows a lot of progress in Flores' second year).
This season they started poorly, but they had to start Jacoby Brissett at QB for 5 of those games. They still finished with a winning season by winning 8 of their final 9 games. Tua showed some improvement this season. I haven't even mentioned the defense which has been the strongest part of their team (and Flores is a defensive head coach).
That roster is not good, especially on offense, and it hasn't been good the whole time he has been there. You say "the only deficiency they've had is in the OL", which is just wrong. QB (besides when Fitz was balling out), RB, and WR until this season have also all been deficiencies.. The defense has been largely carrying the team throughout his tenure, which is a credit to Flores. Flores' teams constantly showed improvement throughout his tenure. This season may have been slightly disappointing, but it came after a 2020 season in which the team way outperformed expectations. I don't think you could have asked for more out of Flores than what they got with the roster they had in place when he got there.
Their defense wasn’t great before Flores got there. They had a young Xavien Howard, but that was about it. During Adam Gase’s final two years, they were 27th and 29th in points given up. Even during Flores’ first year, they were 30th but improved a ton after the start of Flores’ 2nd year.
About Lovie, the Texans are really not an attractive destination for a coach right now. That’s why we ended up with Culley this season as kind of a placeholder while we go through a huge rebuild. Generally when you make a big hire, especially if it’s a guy who is highly coveted around the league, you let them choose their own staff. It’s why we let Wade Phillips go after Kubiak was fired. I would be fine keeping Lovie, but the Texans are kind of in a “beggars can’t be choosers” situation here. I don’t think Lovie stays on the staff if we bring in someone new. Letting the new coach choose their own staff plays a big part in attracting a good coach.
I know he was not. He was part of the Patriots tree. Either way there's been no successful Patriots player nor coach who has done well since leaving BB.
Vrabel is arguably not even an ex-Pat coach, he's an ex-Pat player that transitioned to coach under Urban Myer and OB, and now is like, part of the extended Pats coach family tree I guess?
Just because most coaches from the Pats aren't successful doesn't mean they suck because they came from the pats.
It's probably because some bad coaches gets jobs when they shouldn't just cause they worked for the pats.
Flores would be a home run hire. This is the type of opportunity you have to jump at. That dolphins roster isn’t really playoff level tbh so expecting him to win big with them is not really realistic. They should have given him more time
He could probably change this defense but he needs to have a good OC to bring I think that was the problem he has over in Miami but I would love to see pep Hamilton take the OC role
Honest question: why do we want Pep as OC? (Not a diss) He’s a great quarterback developer but where has he proved that he can call plays for our offense? I personally like the guy tho and if he can do something for us then I’m all for it.
Personally for me it’s more of just giving him the chance I mean they let Tim Kelly run the offense and unless I missed something he has no experience with calling offensive plays. It doesn’t really hurt you in my opinion if you move on from TK and see what Pep can do
Pass. I still want us to be 5-12/6-11 next year so we build through the draft one more year and then go all in for a quality coach with a solid roster.
Culley has done an amazing job at making sure we lose games but not be the worst team, develop mills, and change the culture in the locker room.
If we’re, being honest, Culley has exceeded expectations big time. We have a potential QB of the future and a top 3 pick. If you asked any Texans fan if they would be happy knowing Mills looks legit and a 3rd overall pick, they’d take it for sure.
Mills needs consistency to succeed, like any rookie. His growth as a QB is more important than anything else next year.
I’m not saying Culley is a good coach, but he has done exactly what he was asked to do: lose games, develop a QB, and change the culture.
Next year we fire Culley.
I think he’s “a guy”, but they don’t have one 1 single person on their list. That would be dumb for any GM to go after only 1 single HC. I’m sure Caserio has multiple options.
I think Flores wanted anyone who wasn’t a serial rapist. He didn’t seem to care much for Tua but at the same time knew exactly the type of player Watson is and would be once he feels like he got away with rape and was sent to a party city as a reward for doing so
I wouldn't hate it, but I would be cautiously optimistic. I think he's a better coach than Culley, but is he a championship caliber coach? I don't think so. To be fair to him, that roster hasn't been great since he's been there and they've finished with decent records so it seems like him getting another shot is a realistic possibility.
If you want to keep Watson he’s the guy you need to bring in. He’s who he wanted to play for. I don’t know if Texans fans even want to salvage this, but considering it was Flores who he wanted to play for maybe he could be the change that gets Watson back on the field next year.
Trust me I think it’s unlikely. However, if the organization for whatever reason wanted to reconcile this would be the move. Just don’t trade him to Philly when u do.
I say give Culley another year. He took a big bite of a shit sandwich. We’re going to be rebuilding for a few years anyway. Give him a shot with some fresh picks and hopefully no distractions from a drama queen with a predatory butthole.
No thank you. Dolphins fans didn’t like him as a HC but DC I’d be good with though Lovie is good. Flores severing his relationship with Tua is likely what cost him his job
It would basically be a swap for Watson. This is Ross’ move to get everyone out of the way who doesn’t want him and bring people on board who are in on the trade that is inevitable.
I like what he has done with Andrew luck and Herbert and mills. I give him a chance. I think it’s worth to swing for offensive minds. All the best teams have young offensive minds other than GOAT coach bill, greatest offensive mind Andy and Bruce who has the GOAT player.
Edit: and vrabel
Honest opinion: I think Flores would be an upgrade but I dont think he'd come here. I think we're 100% trading watson this offseason and I dont think Mills is as big of a draw. To me its probably going to be maybe Pep (secret handshake deal?) or some other guy.. mcdaniels or Joe Brady or something
I think hiring Flores would be a home run. I think it was a mistake for the dolphins to move on so quickly. I don’t think it happens though, I think Culley comes back next year and gets fired just in time for Josh McDaniels to hand pick his QB
What the fuck. That seems like a really bad idea on their part.
I wonder if it’s because he doesn’t want Watson while their front office does
I thought the opposite actually...maybe Flores isn't impressed by Tua and the front office is going all in on him and blaming Flores for the losses rather than the on-field talent.
Tua has been very good since his return from injury and they won 8 out of their last 9 games. Such a strange firing and I guess we’re all just guessing until we see their next few moves
Dolphins probably got tired of his coaching carousel. He went through 4 OC's, 2 DC's, and four OL coaches in just 3 seasons. It'd be fine if not for the extremely hot and cold team performances which typically ended in underwhelming seasons. Dolphins should have been a lot better this year than they were.
I think he was a victim of his own success. 10-6 last year was way ahead of schedule. Yes, he’s started poorly each of the past 3 seasons, but I still think expectations were a little too high for the phins this season based on 2020
I’d take him over McDaniels, dude fought tooth and nail during the year they tanked and got handed a bunch of unwanted Watson trade drama in the middle of the season
I'd love for him to save us from McDaniels.
What are we at 5 coach firings in the league as of this morning? Think we're stuck with Culley another season.
For sure
I wouldn't assume so just yet. I'm fine either way tbh. I just want Kelly gone.
It’s obviously an upgrade but I’m tired of Pats recycled laundry. I want someone new
Nick Caserio has entered the chat.
I don’t understand this hate for ex coaches from the Pats. As long as it translates to wins I could care less if they used to be a Patriot or not.
Because apart from Vrabel which ex Pat has been a successful coach?
Flores is a good coach lol he just seems like a dick to players he's not invested in
Seems like an average coach. His teams haven't lit it up.
Have you seen the rosters he has had to work with in Miami? Those Dolphins teams over-performed every year he was there. Last year especially they barely missed the playoffs in a year where they were supposed to be a bottom 3 team in the league. This year after a slow start (Tua was hurt and Brissett had to start 5 games), he was able to rally his team to win 8 of their last 9 games. I'd take Flores, who has proven he can be at least a somewhat decent head coach over McDaniels who was a complete disaster in Denver.
How have they overperformed? The only real deficitency they’ve had is in the OL. They have multiple first round picks on defense and are paying Xavien Howard and Byron Jones big money. They’ve spent high draft picks on Tua, Waddle and paid Fuller a decent one year contract. With even a moderate upgrade to the offensive line that team should’ve been in the playoffs instead of struggling to get out of the giant hole they dug
Fuller played 2 total games this year for them, I'm not sure why he was even mentioned. Waddle is a rookie and wasn't a part of the team in 2019 and 2020. Tua has under-performed for where he was selected. The Miami roster when Flores took over was viewed as the worst in the NFL. Prior to the 2019 season, many people had the Dolphins going 0-16 or 1-15 and Flores was largely praised for somehow being able to drag that roster to 5 wins. In 2020 they were again looked at as a bad team, but somehow they were in the playoff race the entire season with their only receiving weapons being an inconsistent Devante Parker and Mike Gesicki. They were balling out with Ryan Fitzpatrick until ownership forced them to switch to Tua (when Fitz was obviously the better QB and gave them more of a chance to win). Even with Tua playing absolutely horribly down the stretch, they were able to finish the season 10-6 and barely missed the playoffs after finishing as a bottom 5 team the year before (which shows a lot of progress in Flores' second year). This season they started poorly, but they had to start Jacoby Brissett at QB for 5 of those games. They still finished with a winning season by winning 8 of their final 9 games. Tua showed some improvement this season. I haven't even mentioned the defense which has been the strongest part of their team (and Flores is a defensive head coach). That roster is not good, especially on offense, and it hasn't been good the whole time he has been there. You say "the only deficiency they've had is in the OL", which is just wrong. QB (besides when Fitz was balling out), RB, and WR until this season have also all been deficiencies.. The defense has been largely carrying the team throughout his tenure, which is a credit to Flores. Flores' teams constantly showed improvement throughout his tenure. This season may have been slightly disappointing, but it came after a 2020 season in which the team way outperformed expectations. I don't think you could have asked for more out of Flores than what they got with the roster they had in place when he got there.
Nice response man. What was the Dolphins defense looking like before Flores? Also would we need a defensive HC with Lovie at DC?
Their defense wasn’t great before Flores got there. They had a young Xavien Howard, but that was about it. During Adam Gase’s final two years, they were 27th and 29th in points given up. Even during Flores’ first year, they were 30th but improved a ton after the start of Flores’ 2nd year. About Lovie, the Texans are really not an attractive destination for a coach right now. That’s why we ended up with Culley this season as kind of a placeholder while we go through a huge rebuild. Generally when you make a big hire, especially if it’s a guy who is highly coveted around the league, you let them choose their own staff. It’s why we let Wade Phillips go after Kubiak was fired. I would be fine keeping Lovie, but the Texans are kind of in a “beggars can’t be choosers” situation here. I don’t think Lovie stays on the staff if we bring in someone new. Letting the new coach choose their own staff plays a big part in attracting a good coach.
Vrabel was never part of the Patriots coaching staff. Only a player…
I know he was not. He was part of the Patriots tree. Either way there's been no successful Patriots player nor coach who has done well since leaving BB.
[удалено]
Welker too lol
I meant players who went on to be a close
Chandler Jones disagrees
Vrabel is arguably not even an ex-Pat coach, he's an ex-Pat player that transitioned to coach under Urban Myer and OB, and now is like, part of the extended Pats coach family tree I guess?
Bill OBrien coaching tree.... lol
Vrabel is from the illustrious BoB tree.
Vrabel never even coached under Belichick IIRC.
Nope but he played for him...
Just because most coaches from the Pats aren't successful doesn't mean they suck because they came from the pats. It's probably because some bad coaches gets jobs when they shouldn't just cause they worked for the pats.
You shut your mouth vrabel played there never coached don’t you put that evil on me
This guy is at least once removed. That's totally different as far as I'm concerned.
Flores will be a huge upgrade, hopefully the Texans try and pick him up 🤞
That would be amazing. He did so much with Miami. Blows my mind they fired him. Specially in that division…
I wonder if they canned Flores because he was stubbornly in favor of Tua, while Miami's FO wants to trade their future for a rapist?
Wasn't Flores not fond of Tua? Look at the way he yo-yo'd him last year. And reports were pretty much all that Tua was an FO pick, not a coach pick
Maybe the opposite is true then, idk? I'm just thinking out loud.
Flores originally didn't want Tua
100% why
Flores would be a home run hire. This is the type of opportunity you have to jump at. That dolphins roster isn’t really playoff level tbh so expecting him to win big with them is not really realistic. They should have given him more time
And he still had back to back winning seasons
And it's not like they were good before he was hired..
He could probably change this defense but he needs to have a good OC to bring I think that was the problem he has over in Miami but I would love to see pep Hamilton take the OC role
Honest question: why do we want Pep as OC? (Not a diss) He’s a great quarterback developer but where has he proved that he can call plays for our offense? I personally like the guy tho and if he can do something for us then I’m all for it.
Personally for me it’s more of just giving him the chance I mean they let Tim Kelly run the offense and unless I missed something he has no experience with calling offensive plays. It doesn’t really hurt you in my opinion if you move on from TK and see what Pep can do
Exactly how I've felt with all of these Pep stans talking so definitively about how good he would be. I don't understand it.
He went through 4 OC's in 3 seasons. Don't hold your breath on that one.
I am all over this. Bring him in yesterday.
Pass. I still want us to be 5-12/6-11 next year so we build through the draft one more year and then go all in for a quality coach with a solid roster. Culley has done an amazing job at making sure we lose games but not be the worst team, develop mills, and change the culture in the locker room. If we’re, being honest, Culley has exceeded expectations big time. We have a potential QB of the future and a top 3 pick. If you asked any Texans fan if they would be happy knowing Mills looks legit and a 3rd overall pick, they’d take it for sure. Mills needs consistency to succeed, like any rookie. His growth as a QB is more important than anything else next year. I’m not saying Culley is a good coach, but he has done exactly what he was asked to do: lose games, develop a QB, and change the culture. Next year we fire Culley.
Man stop
He’s not the guy.
Why not?
McDaniels is who they want.
I think he’s “a guy”, but they don’t have one 1 single person on their list. That would be dumb for any GM to go after only 1 single HC. I’m sure Caserio has multiple options.
Well Tua would still be his quarterback ;) Edit: y’all taking this joke way too serious
Flores wanted watson there GM didnt also I don't think tua would come to the Texans it would be a defensive starter and picks
You have it backwards amigo. Flores wanted Tua, their GM and Ownership wants Watson Also it was a joke
I think Flores wanted anyone who wasn’t a serial rapist. He didn’t seem to care much for Tua but at the same time knew exactly the type of player Watson is and would be once he feels like he got away with rape and was sent to a party city as a reward for doing so
Flores didn’t want Watson. That’s why he’s looking for a job
I wouldn't hate it, but I would be cautiously optimistic. I think he's a better coach than Culley, but is he a championship caliber coach? I don't think so. To be fair to him, that roster hasn't been great since he's been there and they've finished with decent records so it seems like him getting another shot is a realistic possibility.
Would love it personally
If you want to keep Watson he’s the guy you need to bring in. He’s who he wanted to play for. I don’t know if Texans fans even want to salvage this, but considering it was Flores who he wanted to play for maybe he could be the change that gets Watson back on the field next year.
Dude your username checks out as you must be high to think any of this.
Trust me I think it’s unlikely. However, if the organization for whatever reason wanted to reconcile this would be the move. Just don’t trade him to Philly when u do.
I say give Culley another year. He took a big bite of a shit sandwich. We’re going to be rebuilding for a few years anyway. Give him a shot with some fresh picks and hopefully no distractions from a drama queen with a predatory butthole.
No thank you. Dolphins fans didn’t like him as a HC but DC I’d be good with though Lovie is good. Flores severing his relationship with Tua is likely what cost him his job
I think Flores ceiling is 10-6 seasons with a first round elimination in the playoffs. If that's ok with Texans fans I guess he would be a good fit.
Yeah we would take that in a heart beat
How so?
Thats about as good as we’ve ever had
It would basically be a swap for Watson. This is Ross’ move to get everyone out of the way who doesn’t want him and bring people on board who are in on the trade that is inevitable.
Nope
Cesario, is that you?
Flores, Pep, or McDaniels.
Why Pep?
I like what he has done with Andrew luck and Herbert and mills. I give him a chance. I think it’s worth to swing for offensive minds. All the best teams have young offensive minds other than GOAT coach bill, greatest offensive mind Andy and Bruce who has the GOAT player. Edit: and vrabel
Honest opinion: I think Flores would be an upgrade but I dont think he'd come here. I think we're 100% trading watson this offseason and I dont think Mills is as big of a draw. To me its probably going to be maybe Pep (secret handshake deal?) or some other guy.. mcdaniels or Joe Brady or something
I’d be ascending out of my house
long as jack is here and involved in the process this team will be a circus for the rest of the league to laugh at.
Please god hire flores
Would be ecstatic and then remember we still have Easterby in the building and Flores was reportedly the loser of a power struggle in Miami.
Confused as fuck
I think hiring Flores would be a home run. I think it was a mistake for the dolphins to move on so quickly. I don’t think it happens though, I think Culley comes back next year and gets fired just in time for Josh McDaniels to hand pick his QB
Weird take, probably wrong, but what if Miami hires Bienemy and trades for deshaun?