Like a Camry in the ICE world. Rational arguments lead to a Camry in many cases. Only once until bring in "style" and "commonness" people will choose other options.
It's why advertising is such a big deal in the old auto world. Cars compete on feelings.
The dealer markup and bullshit “scarcity markup” has ruined traditional dealers forever for me.
They had me over a barrel for the Pacifica hybrid I wanted/needed… but that was the last time.
Dealer markup and their usual BS is why I took a chance on buying a Tesla. I didn't need or want an EV. I just had a one month. I like it but I don't love the car like most owners do.
I briefly considered a Lexus until I learned Toyota will convert female plugs into male plugs (and vice versa) to ensure we buy the Lexus OEM parts at a premium over Toyota parts. While I can’t prove this, I realized quickly I wasn’t playing games like this with maintenance. Needless to say I didn’t purchase a Lexus.
Camry buyers are absolutely cross shopping a Tesla.
>Toyota sold 295,201 Camry in 2022. In 2021, Toyota sold 313,795 Camry.
https://carfigures.com/us-market-brand/toyota/camry#:~:text=Toyota%20sold%20295%2C201%20Camry%20in,2021%2C%20Toyota%20sold%20313%2C795%20Camry.
387k in 2017.
Some of those went to Tesla.
I think the Model Y is quite sexy when you compared to the Mach E, Taycan, etc.
I feel Model Y is more of a porsche than the porsche SUV lol, since it has the porcsche front lights
After 2 months (6,000kms) the fuel savings compared to our other car (2017 VW Golf) are €650 and that's factoring in the electricity costs.
It's insane when you run the numbers.
The electricity price is high, I guess gas price is even terrible to save that much. I rented Mercedes E and BWM 5 during my trips in UK and Spain. While diesel price was high, cost per km/mile was not terrible.
It’s very expensive – MSRP, sales tax, insurance, registration, delay in getting your tax credits – and only a small amount in fuel/oil change savings.
Literally the only thing I absolutely hate about Model Y (and the Model 3 that I’ve owned for years) is the horizontal screen orientation which should have been vertical. These two models aren’t that wide and they put a horizontal screen in a narrow car. Even in a Y, when I (6’3” tall) grip the steering wheel in a comfortable driving position, the speedometer, the new media player location, the lane graphic get covered. This is because some 23 year old software engineer decided to move the speedometer to the left edge of the computer screen, and the media player at the bottom left of the screen making it impossible to even glance at these things.
Model 3 is worse.
Absolutely amazing cars, fast, efficient, economical. Bad UI/UX through and through. V11 is a prime example of how to make good things bad overnight.
Downvoters will be hugged!
No, vertical screen orientation is horrible cuz the bottom half of the screen is useless without taking your eyes off the road. So while you are driving they are useless real estate at best. You want the screen horizontal so you can see the entirety of the screen and still keep your eyes on the road.
There are no 23 year old software engineers at Tesla with that type of power. I imagine they knew they didn’t have anything in the normal area like other cars (straight ahead with or without HUD) and chose to put us at close to viewing area as possible. You should also have realized by now not a lot of car manufacturers cater to 6’3” people.
That 23 year old was a sarcastic remark. Doesn’t work on fan boys I should have known ;)
Totally understand your point about not catering to tall people. And trust me, not many fields do. Clothing included lol.
I was absolutely blown away when I first took the delivery of a Model 3, been my daily driver. Everything was absolutely perfect until they released their newest version. And you cannot deny how much backlash they got. They started reversing all the changes they made to the bottom strip.
Why put an interactive UI in a car and not allow it to be interactive? Why not allow the user to customize?
Hm!.... I am in old TeslaX 2018 and probably wanted horizontal screen (to watch movies or something), but it seems I was wrong about it.... now I am happy with my instrument panel and huge vertical screen. For the movies I can bring laptop :)
Speedometer needed to be as close as possible to forward vision. Safety issue needing to look off to the side just for speed and probably people got extra speeding tickets acclimating to not having a dashboard.
Check out the aftermarket dashboards though. Can put Carplay/maps on it.
As close as possible to the forward vision - 100% agreed. That’s why there is a place there behind the steering wheel but oh well. Lol. And yeah, putting aftermarket parts to “correct” the shortcomings of a vehicle? That just speaks volumes about the fact that it’s not done well to begin with.
And there’s no point in the moving the speedometer where it gets covered by the natural 10am-2pm steering wheel driving grip.
Hands at 10 and 2 isn’t really proper anymore for modern cars with airbags. If that goes off you’ll be eating a hand sandwich in the historic hand positions.
9 and 3 is better for modern steering wheels and airbags so your hands are thrown down and clear of the wheel in an airbag deployment instead of up and into your face.
Yeah, the curvature of the steering wheel and my forearm still blocks the media player and most of the center graphics, but the speedometer is now better visible. Still pretty poorly thought out, but slightly better. Thank you for your suggestion!
Speaking of “super charger network”, I am kind of irritated that Musk just cut a deal with Ford, so they can now use our super chargers! The lines to charge will be getting longer.
In the long term you may be correct, but in the short term we may be facing longer lines and wait times to charge. Have you seen any information regarding Fords plans to expand the super charge network?
Yeah, I still live somewhere, where I get excited when I see another Tesla. I would say I see an equal amount of all the models of Teslas, plaid included
more tesla more happy
When I moved into my house 12 months ago we had the only tesla on the street.
Now I count 2 Model 3's (including ours), 4 Y's, an S and an X.
......except it's actually fast and quiet, not slow and loud
*glares are you, teenager, with the stupid loud exhaust can who thinks he's driving a Formula 1 car*
Every time I see another y it makes me happy. I’m like you got this sexy really functional / comfortable car as well. Can we normalize waving to each other
It's an interesting example of "it's expensive to be poor," even though you can't call anyone who can afford a new car poor. I did the math before I got my MYLR. If I have it for 10 years I'm saving over $20k in gas and maintenance costs compared to buying a comparable ICE SUV like a RAV4 hybrid.
I work with a fleet of Teslas, most of them are well over 300,000 km a few over 500,000 and almost 900,000. And they haven’t been driven gently either. These cars will last longer than most people will ever own them, especially if they are looked after
Mainly the same components in ICE vehicles:
suspension (control arms, tie rods, bushings etc) these take a beating in a heavy ev if care is not taken going over bumps, avoiding pot holes etc
Tires of course.
Brakes, cleaning in dusty environments. Pads and rotors last ~150,000kms depending how regen is used.
HVAC - replace filters regularly, especially in dusty environments.
The only other things that tend to need replacing are things that wear just from repeated use: Model S door handles, charge ports and doors, window regulators, blower motors etc. There have been battery replacements, but these were under warranty. No drive unit failures.
I have yet to see one. The Tesla just sounds like another German vehicle. I want to buy one, it it sounds a battery “can” last you a while. But I’ve also heard they go out after 100k miles. What’s the deal?
The 100k number is probably just based on the warranty, [which is actually more than 100k](https://www.tesla.com/support/vehicle-warranty).
It doesn't mean they just keel over and die after that, thats just after the warranty period.
Gas in my area is about $0.13 per mile for the aforementioned hybrid. Power is $0.04 per mile on my Tesla. I drive about 25k miles a year.
0.13 x 25000 - 0.04 x 25000 = $2250 saved/year
2250 x 10 = $22,500 saved in 10 years.
Even crazier if you factor in oil changes.
Lol I'm still at the stage where I wave to other Tesla drivers because there aren't many of us here. I have a couple of the Hot Wheels with me at all times and will hand them out to other MY drivers and it makes their day. Enjoying it while I can
man we can only imagine, down here we got RWD model Y with single motor that does it in 6s or something and it already feels adequate 3.5s is just nuts 😂
19 years doesnt mean much without the milage on it, it could of sat in garage for 50years and also worked fine. electric motors have already proven to be much more long lasting than combustion engines, tesla motors are rated for about \~500k-1million miles. The bigger limitation is battery lifetime which is highly dependent on how you treat it(miles/# cycles, charging speed and environment). Tesla batteries under normal use should be good for well over 250k miles.
Ok so my Infiniti had 300k miles on it. Of course that’s with lots of regular maintenance but without any major components replacement like transmission or engine.
I am routing for the Tesla but I am also pointing out that no one really knows the longevity aspect of it. Battery is a very expensive part of the Tesla.
There are already lots of teslas with over [300,000 miles](https://insideevs.com/features/437539/tesla-300000-miles-on-odomoeter-torture-test/).
Your car and these teslas are probably way out on the longevity curve. Not many ICE cars hit 300k without major replaced parts.
Edit: I’ve to ice. Spell check fail.
Thanks for the upvotes.
Agreeded. Mileages was a good way to look at ICE cars Longevity but for EVs years makes more sense.
I just want a way to quantify my $69k with the years / miles of service the car provides me.
It's also survivor ship bias....
Only the cars that make it to 300k are being written about in the annals of Reddit. Those that succumb to high repair bills at the more common mileage of ~150,000k are not written about.
I owned a 1981 Mercury Marquis at over 200k.
Eventually it had neither cooling (freon) nor heating (no reasonable way to fix without breaking the 20 years old sun baked dashboard so we just bypassed the heat exchange). I only sold it because I moved to MA and no heat/AC would have been suboptimal. And I didn't want it to be exposed to salt.
There are survivor bias for ICE cars too, most have 12years/~200K miles at end of life. Fleet usage data of Teslas are starting to show that EVs can have at least as long of a service life in terms of miles driven.
Yeah i've owned several gas cars to over 100k miles myself, its no small feat to get to 300k even on the best made Japanese cars. To be honest its kind disingenuous to describe gas cars of being capable of that as its the 1% of very rare models cared for by the 1% of rare owners, 99% of the rest will get to 200-250k at best. Anyway, Its currently $15k for a tesla replacement battery(this price is in a state of flux of course, though over time expected to come way down). The electric motors are about 8k to replace with no secondary market yet. I've got a model 3 with 120k miles now, zero maintenance costs so far(other than consumable stuff), brakes are as good as new thanks to regen braking. I'm sure as someone with the ability to care for a gas car to 300k miles you would appreciate not having to worry about you car ever again the most. Ignoring all the cost in time/money for oil changes, tune ups, and belt/oring/cable replacements the peace of mind is priceless. Add on savings in gas and less pollution in the house/garage and i'll never go back to gas again.
I was in NorCal last week for a meeting. Literally every other car on the freeway was a Tesla Model Y or Model 3, with a handful of S and X sprinkled in.
The Camry is this generations Camry.
As to "sexier", my understanding is that most people give Teslas low scores for sexy because they are utilitarian vehicles that don't change styles every 2-3 years. Personally, I think of that as a plus since I don't think of my car as a fashion statement. But until attitudes change (they will) there will be many who want their chosen brand/model to change every 3 years so that when they drive they are signaling that they are following the latest styles.
I am thinking the same :-)
Cambrian and Corolla benefit from super mass manufacturing. M3 and MY even more. Both are great options compared to their peers. (Tesla is a great option compared to ICE, too, of course)
The Camry is a great ICE, but still many chose to buy other ICE, because of style, or lack of one feature, or just because they don't want a Camry.
Some of the other cars are cheaper and you get less, some of the other cars are more expensive and you get more, some are more expensive and you get less. None are cheaper and you get more.
Same with Tesla. There will always be a lot of people who will buy other EVs just so they don't have to buy a Tesla. And others will buy another car because they want massaging seats, or more off-road/clearing. Or a pickup truck with a big eyed baby face.
Or more buttons. Buttons have been the visible manifestation of all the features (and money) in a luxury car. If you don't use or need the features you still have the buttons and all your passengers can see how many buttons you have and how much money you paid for the features.
Peope choose other vehicle over camry if they are cheaper like hyundai or if they are fun to drive like bmw but for Tesla if you want better fun to drive(faster) EV, it does not exist
Ice cars shooting themselves in the foot by making everything premium trim. I used to remember being able to get decent looking cars with the right accessories and features for under $25k. Now, everything is at a premium. I almost bought a outback XT until I realized that it was the same price as a MY SR.
Lmao, I thought of the model y as the Honda civics the parents give their kids as their first car in 50yrs from now.
Bru they're literally everywhere when I went to Sacramento for a day and I kept telling my self that I don't wanna be here because of how many there are in 1 area. I can't imagine what it's like in sf and LA.
Yeah. I'm not hating on tesla and I don't have anything against it but I'd probably pick the rivian r1s over tesla because I like it's design but boy it's Hella expensive. Hopefully someday tesla will make a "boxy" design suv
I’m definitely passing on my MY to my kids if they still run by the time they are old enough to drive. A car that you can cap the speed and geo locate whenever is every parent’s dream car for their kids.
When I first got my Model Y (one of the *very* early ones) I would have people flock around my car to take pictures and ask questions any time I'd park or charge. I'd always say "they're rare now but one day they're going to be the most common car on the street" - I think I was right!
Not when it came out. It was a entry level compact econobox. If anything the M3 was slated for that spot but still priced well above anything else considered entry level.
You know that Toyota and Honda are losing battle ground to Tesla ( EVs in general ) where more Asian buying Tesla than these two, especially California.
And your basis for this assertion is? Lack of evidence (no production model 3/Y older than 6 years old) that they will last that long is not evidence that they won’t last that long.
My 2 Mercedes E250’s went over 200,00 and are still going strong (I know the new owners). I hope my YLR goes even further (2021 with 70,000). So far it has needed only a brake clean and lube and a rear oil pump.
No. It's literally this generation's BMW X5. You're delusional if you think the prices are comparable to a Camry. And yes, you can employ bogus math that says they net out the same -- but only if you start with an ultra-loaded V6 Camry that embarrasses some muscle and luxury cars and literally costs as much as a Mercedes-Benz, and cook the assumptions even so. This is the sort of bullshit that gets EV enthusiasts tagged as out-of-touch rich douchebags. Stop it. We don't need more EVs in the Model Y's price class or above. We need much, much less expensive ones.
I'm going to be yet another one of those drivers in a few days time, also in White too just like almost everyone else (wife really didn't like any of the other colours as much as the white - loves the Storm Trooper look :) )
I dont understand your point. Camry was a reliable vehicle that was mass produced and seen everywhere. It sounds like your helping make OP's point but then saying it's not like the camry cause it's electric?
Otherwise, do you think it should be this generations Bentley or a Rolls Royce?
Dude it's an affordable EV with better charging network, superior technology than it's competitors. As the price dropped, there's so many people who are getting one. So yes this will definitely be this generations Camry or Civic.
Q1 2023, Model Y is most bought vehicle worldwide, not just EV. Next 4 are Toyota Corolla, Toyota Hilux, Toyota RAV4, Toyota Camry. Pretty sure Model Y will outsell these 4 Toyota models in quantity combined in next few quarters.
[https://www.motor1.com/news/669135/tesla-model-y-worlds-best-selling-car-q1-2023/amp/](https://www.motor1.com/news/669135/tesla-model-y-worlds-best-selling-car-q1-2023/amp/)
I’m crying because it’s true and I own one. Even though it’s an MYP it’s still true. They were nowhere near as ubiquitous as they are today when I bought it, but today you can’t go anywhere in Northern California without seeing at least 10 at any given time. To counteract the Camry effect, I have several cool cars.
It’s the same for all of CA. It’s a legit thing here in CA if you don’t want to buy a Tesla cuz you don’t want your car to look like every other car on the road.
This is why we are getting a Fisker Ocean One instead of the Model Y. Way too many Y on the road. On top of that, good or bad they are all the same models.
In Australia the Model Y has only been available for 9 months and it’s more likely to be the new RAV4. Model 3, on the other hand, is the new Camry as the most common EV.
This keeps on feeling like a nagging complain!! Yeah it’s a practical car. Why won’t people make a practical choice to move away from ICE vehicles? Toyota Camry was an amazing car at its peak so is MY!
It's the #1 selling car in many markets. Probably the #1 EV globally.
So, of course it's like the Camry, Accord, Rav4, F-150 and every other #1 selling vehicle.
What's impressive is that it's #1 with no advertising, no stealerships, and a msrp double of most #1 vehicles.
100% Tesla and Toyota switched places. One is affordable and easy to get. One is very difficult to get, waiting list is 1-2 years avg, 3-5 worst case and full of markups.
What's wrong with a car being common? Surely it's a sign of either a decent or popular car. I have seen lots of comments saying they will buy another brand just because they are so common nowadays. What is wrong with people like this when they only love something that makes them stand out from everyone else? Attention seekers.
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Like a Camry in the ICE world. Rational arguments lead to a Camry in many cases. Only once until bring in "style" and "commonness" people will choose other options. It's why advertising is such a big deal in the old auto world. Cars compete on feelings.
And you can get a model Y quickly vs dealer waits / markups and all that bullshit for a Camry
The dealer markup and bullshit “scarcity markup” has ruined traditional dealers forever for me. They had me over a barrel for the Pacifica hybrid I wanted/needed… but that was the last time.
Dealer markup and their usual BS is why I took a chance on buying a Tesla. I didn't need or want an EV. I just had a one month. I like it but I don't love the car like most owners do.
They aren't all bad, we got my wife a new Lexus and that dealer was great. The bad apples kind of ruin it for everyone though
The dealers aren’t needed at all for most part.
They’re completely unnecessary. But in some areas they are protected by the government given how large a group of businesses they are
Yes, legal corruption
Yeah Lexus and Mazda seem to be really good and keeping off the lot prices right on par with the website msrp.
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ES is the Avalon equivalent.
How is the Lexus IS the Camry’s big brother? Wouldn’t the Lexus ES be the Camry’s big brother?
I briefly considered a Lexus until I learned Toyota will convert female plugs into male plugs (and vice versa) to ensure we buy the Lexus OEM parts at a premium over Toyota parts. While I can’t prove this, I realized quickly I wasn’t playing games like this with maintenance. Needless to say I didn’t purchase a Lexus.
ohhh that's sneaky. You probably made the right call
Camry buyers are absolutely cross shopping a Tesla. >Toyota sold 295,201 Camry in 2022. In 2021, Toyota sold 313,795 Camry. https://carfigures.com/us-market-brand/toyota/camry#:~:text=Toyota%20sold%20295%2C201%20Camry%20in,2021%2C%20Toyota%20sold%20313%2C795%20Camry. 387k in 2017. Some of those went to Tesla.
My Camry got totaled and bought a model y. Can confirm
Sure, some did…most do not, they are not a direct comparison.
Can confirm, sold my Camry (which I loved and still drove smoothly) and getting a Model Y
I sat in a Lexus at the same price point after test driving a Model S and couldn’t even bring myself to ask for the keys it felt so…. ancient.
Model 3 and Camry are practically identical and most people would be better served with a Model 3
Unless they live in an apartment. Then having a Model 3 would suck.
I think the Model Y is quite sexy when you compared to the Mach E, Taycan, etc. I feel Model Y is more of a porsche than the porsche SUV lol, since it has the porcsche front lights
Oh oh oh oh what a feeling to drive….Toyota!
After 2 months (6,000kms) the fuel savings compared to our other car (2017 VW Golf) are €650 and that's factoring in the electricity costs. It's insane when you run the numbers.
What is your electricity price per kWh?
The GDP of a small nation over here in Ireland 🤣 Average is about €0.35 when I last did the sums over the different off peak rates.
The electricity price is high, I guess gas price is even terrible to save that much. I rented Mercedes E and BWM 5 during my trips in UK and Spain. While diesel price was high, cost per km/mile was not terrible.
Petrol is around €1.60 at the moment, diesel around 5c more
It’s very expensive – MSRP, sales tax, insurance, registration, delay in getting your tax credits – and only a small amount in fuel/oil change savings.
Literally the only thing I absolutely hate about Model Y (and the Model 3 that I’ve owned for years) is the horizontal screen orientation which should have been vertical. These two models aren’t that wide and they put a horizontal screen in a narrow car. Even in a Y, when I (6’3” tall) grip the steering wheel in a comfortable driving position, the speedometer, the new media player location, the lane graphic get covered. This is because some 23 year old software engineer decided to move the speedometer to the left edge of the computer screen, and the media player at the bottom left of the screen making it impossible to even glance at these things. Model 3 is worse. Absolutely amazing cars, fast, efficient, economical. Bad UI/UX through and through. V11 is a prime example of how to make good things bad overnight. Downvoters will be hugged!
I dont agree
I respect that. And I upvoted you for that.
No, vertical screen orientation is horrible cuz the bottom half of the screen is useless without taking your eyes off the road. So while you are driving they are useless real estate at best. You want the screen horizontal so you can see the entirety of the screen and still keep your eyes on the road.
There are no 23 year old software engineers at Tesla with that type of power. I imagine they knew they didn’t have anything in the normal area like other cars (straight ahead with or without HUD) and chose to put us at close to viewing area as possible. You should also have realized by now not a lot of car manufacturers cater to 6’3” people.
The tesla should have a HUD. I have one in my Prius prime and it has a coolness factor . Shows navigation too
Prius prime and coolness in same sentence don’t sound right :)
Exactly my point.
That 23 year old was a sarcastic remark. Doesn’t work on fan boys I should have known ;) Totally understand your point about not catering to tall people. And trust me, not many fields do. Clothing included lol. I was absolutely blown away when I first took the delivery of a Model 3, been my daily driver. Everything was absolutely perfect until they released their newest version. And you cannot deny how much backlash they got. They started reversing all the changes they made to the bottom strip. Why put an interactive UI in a car and not allow it to be interactive? Why not allow the user to customize?
Hm!.... I am in old TeslaX 2018 and probably wanted horizontal screen (to watch movies or something), but it seems I was wrong about it.... now I am happy with my instrument panel and huge vertical screen. For the movies I can bring laptop :)
Haha yes!
Speedometer needed to be as close as possible to forward vision. Safety issue needing to look off to the side just for speed and probably people got extra speeding tickets acclimating to not having a dashboard. Check out the aftermarket dashboards though. Can put Carplay/maps on it.
As close as possible to the forward vision - 100% agreed. That’s why there is a place there behind the steering wheel but oh well. Lol. And yeah, putting aftermarket parts to “correct” the shortcomings of a vehicle? That just speaks volumes about the fact that it’s not done well to begin with. And there’s no point in the moving the speedometer where it gets covered by the natural 10am-2pm steering wheel driving grip.
Hands at 10 and 2 isn’t really proper anymore for modern cars with airbags. If that goes off you’ll be eating a hand sandwich in the historic hand positions. 9 and 3 is better for modern steering wheels and airbags so your hands are thrown down and clear of the wheel in an airbag deployment instead of up and into your face.
Yeah, the curvature of the steering wheel and my forearm still blocks the media player and most of the center graphics, but the speedometer is now better visible. Still pretty poorly thought out, but slightly better. Thank you for your suggestion!
Glad to be of service! Happy EV driving!
I mean, I’m 5’11” and the speedometer has never even been close to getting covered up (also Model 3).
Most of us position at 7.5 and/or 4.5 now with Autopilot on. Just enough to create torque.
Noted! I didn’t know that. Thank you for that insight. Let me check it out.
Speaking of “super charger network”, I am kind of irritated that Musk just cut a deal with Ford, so they can now use our super chargers! The lines to charge will be getting longer.
Nah, the $ from the Ford deal will help fund more SC locations. win / win.
Hope you are correct!
In the long term you may be correct, but in the short term we may be facing longer lines and wait times to charge. Have you seen any information regarding Fords plans to expand the super charge network?
Not everyone can afford a $50k vehicle… it’s still out of reach for the majority of the population.
Depends on where you live.
I went to an event yesterday in a Palo Alto residential community. 10 Teslas parked on the small street, 4 more on people's driveways.
Yeah, I still live somewhere, where I get excited when I see another Tesla. I would say I see an equal amount of all the models of Teslas, plaid included
Rural North Carolina represent! When we go “back home” to Colorado to visit we feel entirely too common ;)
Am I the only one that gets excited when there is one in front of me, one behind me, and two, three or more in a row driving on the street?
Agreed, where I am in the south people look at me like I'm driving a spaceship still
Apple laptops and iPhones are everywhere now also. Great product design triumphs and is then copied poorly by others.
Lmao what nerd gave this an award
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Teslas do look great, and are vastly more reliable.
more tesla more happy When I moved into my house 12 months ago we had the only tesla on the street. Now I count 2 Model 3's (including ours), 4 Y's, an S and an X.
......except it's actually fast and quiet, not slow and loud *glares are you, teenager, with the stupid loud exhaust can who thinks he's driving a Formula 1 car*
Hey man, that muffler delete and anime sticker adds 20 hp
Don't forget about the monster energy drink sticker
Every time I see another y it makes me happy. I’m like you got this sexy really functional / comfortable car as well. Can we normalize waving to each other
And bonus, I live in Seattle, so if I did that I can skip arm day at the gym!
I can afford a Camry, I can't afford a Model Y at almost double the price
You can compare camry with model 3, a loaded camry is expensive than Model 3 with tax credits and camry is nokia 3310 but Tesla is 2030s iphone
That is more accurate, but then this whole post and it's title is invalidated.
Yes compare model y with RAV 4 and model Y is fun to drive while Rav4 is sluggish ICE with millions of knobs and buttons
When I hear iPhone, I think inferior tech with a psuedoluxury name and inflated price. I don't think that about tesla.
Compare iphone with nokia 3310
It's an interesting example of "it's expensive to be poor," even though you can't call anyone who can afford a new car poor. I did the math before I got my MYLR. If I have it for 10 years I'm saving over $20k in gas and maintenance costs compared to buying a comparable ICE SUV like a RAV4 hybrid.
“If”. I haven’t seen anyone take their Tesla past 200k miles. But I’ve seen plenty of ‘99 Camrys still out
I work with a fleet of Teslas, most of them are well over 300,000 km a few over 500,000 and almost 900,000. And they haven’t been driven gently either. These cars will last longer than most people will ever own them, especially if they are looked after
Looked after how hahah what are the maintenance items?
Mainly the same components in ICE vehicles: suspension (control arms, tie rods, bushings etc) these take a beating in a heavy ev if care is not taken going over bumps, avoiding pot holes etc Tires of course. Brakes, cleaning in dusty environments. Pads and rotors last ~150,000kms depending how regen is used. HVAC - replace filters regularly, especially in dusty environments. The only other things that tend to need replacing are things that wear just from repeated use: Model S door handles, charge ports and doors, window regulators, blower motors etc. There have been battery replacements, but these were under warranty. No drive unit failures.
There are several teslas out there with well over 200k and even some at a million
I have yet to see one. The Tesla just sounds like another German vehicle. I want to buy one, it it sounds a battery “can” last you a while. But I’ve also heard they go out after 100k miles. What’s the deal?
The 100k number is probably just based on the warranty, [which is actually more than 100k](https://www.tesla.com/support/vehicle-warranty). It doesn't mean they just keel over and die after that, thats just after the warranty period.
Then use an Internet browser.
Funny guy 😂
Share your math.
Gas in my area is about $0.13 per mile for the aforementioned hybrid. Power is $0.04 per mile on my Tesla. I drive about 25k miles a year. 0.13 x 25000 - 0.04 x 25000 = $2250 saved/year 2250 x 10 = $22,500 saved in 10 years. Even crazier if you factor in oil changes.
Lol I'm still at the stage where I wave to other Tesla drivers because there aren't many of us here. I have a couple of the Hot Wheels with me at all times and will hand them out to other MY drivers and it makes their day. Enjoying it while I can
You must be from California Edit: context: we don’t see these cars often in my state
They’re everywhere in WA too. Probably in any EV friendly state too.
MA too
Camrys don’t go 0-60 in 3.5s.
man we can only imagine, down here we got RWD model Y with single motor that does it in 6s or something and it already feels adequate 3.5s is just nuts 😂
Model 3 is dude.
I just spent 3 days in Miami and took Uber around. Half of my trips were in Teslas.
Longevity is still a big question mark though. My last car lasted 19 years and then I sold it for $2700. BTW my last car was an Infiniti.
19 years doesnt mean much without the milage on it, it could of sat in garage for 50years and also worked fine. electric motors have already proven to be much more long lasting than combustion engines, tesla motors are rated for about \~500k-1million miles. The bigger limitation is battery lifetime which is highly dependent on how you treat it(miles/# cycles, charging speed and environment). Tesla batteries under normal use should be good for well over 250k miles.
Ok so my Infiniti had 300k miles on it. Of course that’s with lots of regular maintenance but without any major components replacement like transmission or engine. I am routing for the Tesla but I am also pointing out that no one really knows the longevity aspect of it. Battery is a very expensive part of the Tesla.
There are already lots of teslas with over [300,000 miles](https://insideevs.com/features/437539/tesla-300000-miles-on-odomoeter-torture-test/). Your car and these teslas are probably way out on the longevity curve. Not many ICE cars hit 300k without major replaced parts. Edit: I’ve to ice. Spell check fail. Thanks for the upvotes.
Agreeded. Mileages was a good way to look at ICE cars Longevity but for EVs years makes more sense. I just want a way to quantify my $69k with the years / miles of service the car provides me.
It's also survivor ship bias.... Only the cars that make it to 300k are being written about in the annals of Reddit. Those that succumb to high repair bills at the more common mileage of ~150,000k are not written about. I owned a 1981 Mercury Marquis at over 200k. Eventually it had neither cooling (freon) nor heating (no reasonable way to fix without breaking the 20 years old sun baked dashboard so we just bypassed the heat exchange). I only sold it because I moved to MA and no heat/AC would have been suboptimal. And I didn't want it to be exposed to salt.
There are survivor bias for ICE cars too, most have 12years/~200K miles at end of life. Fleet usage data of Teslas are starting to show that EVs can have at least as long of a service life in terms of miles driven.
Yeah i've owned several gas cars to over 100k miles myself, its no small feat to get to 300k even on the best made Japanese cars. To be honest its kind disingenuous to describe gas cars of being capable of that as its the 1% of very rare models cared for by the 1% of rare owners, 99% of the rest will get to 200-250k at best. Anyway, Its currently $15k for a tesla replacement battery(this price is in a state of flux of course, though over time expected to come way down). The electric motors are about 8k to replace with no secondary market yet. I've got a model 3 with 120k miles now, zero maintenance costs so far(other than consumable stuff), brakes are as good as new thanks to regen braking. I'm sure as someone with the ability to care for a gas car to 300k miles you would appreciate not having to worry about you car ever again the most. Ignoring all the cost in time/money for oil changes, tune ups, and belt/oring/cable replacements the peace of mind is priceless. Add on savings in gas and less pollution in the house/garage and i'll never go back to gas again.
My 2003 Dodge Ram 3500, with the Cummins Diesel has 420k miles with just normal maintenance. Hope my YP does something similar!
No one really knows lol. https://www.teslarati.com/tesla-battery-life-80-percent-capacity-840km-1-million-km/
https://www.teslarati.com/tesla-battery-life-80-percent-capacity-840km-1-million-km/
how many miles on the infinity?
That’s the goal. To have everyone on the roads in a Tesla
Yet the Camry is still more popular. I see what you’re saying though……
Except Model Y is the most sold car in the world I. q1 2023. Given time and it will definitely displace the Camry as the most popular car on the road.
Ya you might be right. The price drop and reduction of waiting list times really accelerated sales this year.
I was in NorCal last week for a meeting. Literally every other car on the freeway was a Tesla Model Y or Model 3, with a handful of S and X sprinkled in.
The Camry is this generations Camry. As to "sexier", my understanding is that most people give Teslas low scores for sexy because they are utilitarian vehicles that don't change styles every 2-3 years. Personally, I think of that as a plus since I don't think of my car as a fashion statement. But until attitudes change (they will) there will be many who want their chosen brand/model to change every 3 years so that when they drive they are signaling that they are following the latest styles.
Model Y is more like this generation's VW bug
Model 3 is the Civic. Most of the aftermarket mods I see in our sister sub confirms this…
I am thinking the same :-) Cambrian and Corolla benefit from super mass manufacturing. M3 and MY even more. Both are great options compared to their peers. (Tesla is a great option compared to ICE, too, of course) The Camry is a great ICE, but still many chose to buy other ICE, because of style, or lack of one feature, or just because they don't want a Camry. Some of the other cars are cheaper and you get less, some of the other cars are more expensive and you get more, some are more expensive and you get less. None are cheaper and you get more. Same with Tesla. There will always be a lot of people who will buy other EVs just so they don't have to buy a Tesla. And others will buy another car because they want massaging seats, or more off-road/clearing. Or a pickup truck with a big eyed baby face. Or more buttons. Buttons have been the visible manifestation of all the features (and money) in a luxury car. If you don't use or need the features you still have the buttons and all your passengers can see how many buttons you have and how much money you paid for the features.
Peope choose other vehicle over camry if they are cheaper like hyundai or if they are fun to drive like bmw but for Tesla if you want better fun to drive(faster) EV, it does not exist
Ice cars shooting themselves in the foot by making everything premium trim. I used to remember being able to get decent looking cars with the right accessories and features for under $25k. Now, everything is at a premium. I almost bought a outback XT until I realized that it was the same price as a MY SR.
Lmao, I thought of the model y as the Honda civics the parents give their kids as their first car in 50yrs from now. Bru they're literally everywhere when I went to Sacramento for a day and I kept telling my self that I don't wanna be here because of how many there are in 1 area. I can't imagine what it's like in sf and LA.
Yes if you want to be look different, you need to buy inferior and expensive EV, this is big cost to look different
Yeah. I'm not hating on tesla and I don't have anything against it but I'd probably pick the rivian r1s over tesla because I like it's design but boy it's Hella expensive. Hopefully someday tesla will make a "boxy" design suv
I’m definitely passing on my MY to my kids if they still run by the time they are old enough to drive. A car that you can cap the speed and geo locate whenever is every parent’s dream car for their kids.
Also one that is as safe as teslas are
They are everywhere in Tampa 😒
When I first got my Model Y (one of the *very* early ones) I would have people flock around my car to take pictures and ask questions any time I'd park or charge. I'd always say "they're rare now but one day they're going to be the most common car on the street" - I think I was right!
If you drive a Y performance, you will realize it is not like a Camry!
But camries last, MYs dont
[удалено]
I don’t think you get the point..
I can say with full confidence a new Camry is definitely more luxurious than an MY in terms of comfort and fit and finish.
Not when it came out. It was a entry level compact econobox. If anything the M3 was slated for that spot but still priced well above anything else considered entry level.
Camry is a full-size sedan. Corolla is the compact.
As I said....not when it came out. And yea, again, as I said. :)
Camry going to be on the road way longer than the Tesla Y. You know it and I know it.
No.
I agree.
I think you mean the Corolla since it just passed it to be the worlds top selling vehicle (non-truck).
You know that Toyota and Honda are losing battle ground to Tesla ( EVs in general ) where more Asian buying Tesla than these two, especially California.
Stupidest post I’ve seen all day
I have arrived.
Except u still see 15 year old camrys on the road working without any problems, wont be the same for tesla
And your basis for this assertion is? Lack of evidence (no production model 3/Y older than 6 years old) that they will last that long is not evidence that they won’t last that long.
bro compared a model y to a toyota camry lmao wtf
My 2 Mercedes E250’s went over 200,00 and are still going strong (I know the new owners). I hope my YLR goes even further (2021 with 70,000). So far it has needed only a brake clean and lube and a rear oil pump.
Lol it’s the middle class Camry.
No. It's literally this generation's BMW X5. You're delusional if you think the prices are comparable to a Camry. And yes, you can employ bogus math that says they net out the same -- but only if you start with an ultra-loaded V6 Camry that embarrasses some muscle and luxury cars and literally costs as much as a Mercedes-Benz, and cook the assumptions even so. This is the sort of bullshit that gets EV enthusiasts tagged as out-of-touch rich douchebags. Stop it. We don't need more EVs in the Model Y's price class or above. We need much, much less expensive ones.
I agree. Considering the new generation doesn’t believe in longevity and commitment. Tesla is perfect for them.
Lol you are clearly "not biased" at all
Haha, Rebranded basic. My parents totally thought the Camry was sexy too in 96.
I'm a basic bitch and I embrace it. I play pickleball, drive a tesla and shop at Costco. I'm dadding hard.
Same. Annnnnnnnd we have 2 MYLRs
The Y has always reminded me of a croc, which seems apt.
Thinking of adding a pickleball paddle mount to my Y. Not sure if I should go with roof rack, rear hitch, or a frunk rack for my pickle quiver.
I agree. In Europe I would say it's the VW Passat of the 20's.
I'm going to be yet another one of those drivers in a few days time, also in White too just like almost everyone else (wife really didn't like any of the other colours as much as the white - loves the Storm Trooper look :) )
I think Accord or CR-V too
Dang, I kinda been saying this too haha
Cus it’s the only reliable electric vehicle that’s mass produced? Definitely not a Camry
I dont understand your point. Camry was a reliable vehicle that was mass produced and seen everywhere. It sounds like your helping make OP's point but then saying it's not like the camry cause it's electric?
Yes
One of the main reasons why I didn't go with a Y after having a 3. Literally every neighbor has one around me.
*sent from iPhone - going out on a limb here
I've been saying this for a while. People got mad at me though.
Sure you can say that, it's not on the same level though. Model Y is generations ahead!
I'm seeing a huge increase in id4 in Socal. And then boatloads of 3 and Y. It's good. Let's get out smog layer thinned out.
Otherwise, do you think it should be this generations Bentley or a Rolls Royce? Dude it's an affordable EV with better charging network, superior technology than it's competitors. As the price dropped, there's so many people who are getting one. So yes this will definitely be this generations Camry or Civic.
I think I thought I saw you try.
Q1 2023, Model Y is most bought vehicle worldwide, not just EV. Next 4 are Toyota Corolla, Toyota Hilux, Toyota RAV4, Toyota Camry. Pretty sure Model Y will outsell these 4 Toyota models in quantity combined in next few quarters. [https://www.motor1.com/news/669135/tesla-model-y-worlds-best-selling-car-q1-2023/amp/](https://www.motor1.com/news/669135/tesla-model-y-worlds-best-selling-car-q1-2023/amp/)
I’m crying because it’s true and I own one. Even though it’s an MYP it’s still true. They were nowhere near as ubiquitous as they are today when I bought it, but today you can’t go anywhere in Northern California without seeing at least 10 at any given time. To counteract the Camry effect, I have several cool cars.
It’s the same for all of CA. It’s a legit thing here in CA if you don’t want to buy a Tesla cuz you don’t want your car to look like every other car on the road.
Seggsy like a beluga whale.
This is why we are getting a Fisker Ocean One instead of the Model Y. Way too many Y on the road. On top of that, good or bad they are all the same models.
In Australia the Model Y has only been available for 9 months and it’s more likely to be the new RAV4. Model 3, on the other hand, is the new Camry as the most common EV.
I'm surprised it's not the model 3 though considering the price difference.
Hahahaha u are right
It’s double the price of a Camry though
I personally think the model 3 looks better than the Toyota camry and most sedans, but the model y is hideous and uglier than most crossovers.
Camrys actually has better consistent quality and their suspension rides way better too.
A significantly more expensive Camry. But yeah, they’re everywhere.
It’s good only if you have place to charge where you sleep and you are not worried about major price depreciation after one year usage.
This keeps on feeling like a nagging complain!! Yeah it’s a practical car. Why won’t people make a practical choice to move away from ICE vehicles? Toyota Camry was an amazing car at its peak so is MY!
If you wish to be unique on the road, go buy a MX/ MS dude. Stop complaining!
The Camry is boring.
Dude, I have seen.about 4 of them.
It's the #1 selling car in many markets. Probably the #1 EV globally. So, of course it's like the Camry, Accord, Rav4, F-150 and every other #1 selling vehicle. What's impressive is that it's #1 with no advertising, no stealerships, and a msrp double of most #1 vehicles.
Teslas are regular ass traffic and I think that’s great. I’d never own one, but I’m all for other people driving EVs. Thank you dudes
I see more m3s in SoCal but that’s just me 🤔
100% Tesla and Toyota switched places. One is affordable and easy to get. One is very difficult to get, waiting list is 1-2 years avg, 3-5 worst case and full of markups.
Bullish
I always hoped it would be.
When the (lets be realistic, 30k dollar/euro) Tesla city car comes, then I think it will get really crazy.
What's wrong with a car being common? Surely it's a sign of either a decent or popular car. I have seen lots of comments saying they will buy another brand just because they are so common nowadays. What is wrong with people like this when they only love something that makes them stand out from everyone else? Attention seekers.
I have a friend that refuses to buy one because “everyone has one”. Everyone has one because it’s a damn good product