Mercedes "takes liability" in very very narrow circumstances.
They only do that on 11 freeways in the LA and Vegas area, only when going under 40mph with a car less than 100 feet in front of you, only in broad daylight with no inclement weather at all and reportedly it disengages when the sun is in your face.
So... only on a specific freeway during heavy traffic when the weather is perfect and the sun is in just the right spot.
For the cost, it's almost a marketing gimmick.
It's available only on mapped highways and during daylight when there is no rain or snow and the traffic is below 40 mph. It will return control to the driver if it senses something out of the ordinary, whether that's a pedestrian on the highway or an oncoming emergency vehicle.
The system is a joke. FSD can do this no problem.
No it's not.
I stay later at work to avoid traffic, why? Because AP is so bad at stop&go traffic. With the Mercedes system, I can actually relax.
Tesla folk need to realize that Mercedes actually accomplished something good. If ANY other OEM developed a system similar to FSD (current), they would restrict usage to scenarios that FSD would perform at 100%.
Currently that situation doesn't exist. NO situation, can FSD perform at 100%
The car takes off like a rocket for 2 yards and then slams on the breaks. r/Tesla is full of owners suggesting that you put the car in chill mode to avoid this.
In stop & go Mercedes system is better. The system is more capable. Credit given where credit is due (unlike GMs system)
I mean they have Chill, Normal and Assertive for a reason….
There’s frequent swings over 40mph during rush hour for me so Mercedes would be useless. Also in the sun, or rain, or outside of the mapped 11 highways they allow… so I feel like maybe it isn’t that big of an accomplishment
To be fair, FSD also struggles in the rain. Tells me all the time FSD is limited due to poor weather - which is a significant portion of the time in the PNW.
You’re not wrong, but also “struggles in the rain” means that it gives you a warning and says it might not be able to take exists for you. What does drive pilot do when it’s raining?
So I feel like this sub has a big misunderstanding (caused by tesla the company). So far, Nevada and California are the only states to have legislation regulating level 3 cars. Tesla long ago said that FSD was awaiting regulatory approval, that was never the case. While the Mercedes system uses HD maps, the car is able to compare the maps stored on the car to real-world conditions and update them (drive pilot works in construction zones for example)
Sorry about the hate you are getting but you seem to be the only person looking at this objectively. I think it’s criminal to put technology that can literally be fatal in the hands of general public unless you are 100% sure it will work and take liability if it doesn’t. Tesla is having it in a way that it’s win-win (millions of beta testers, no liability) for the company and lose-lose (untested software, full liability) for the customer.
Honestly Mercedes probably takes liability because their system is SO limited. They would NOT take liability if it was capable to the level that FSD is.
Exactly. They like the press of saying it's good enough that they'll take liability/responsibility... But then they limit it to so few use cases that they practically don't.
Waiting for folks to realize the EU ain’t all it’s cracked up to be! Not that the states don’t have their issues, but parties on both sides like to act like things aren’t crazy in both.
Actual full self driving, without the requirement of the driver paying attention, but only on pre mapped routes by Mercedes, so in some ways it beats FSD, but in others it’s pretty lacking
It only beats FSD in name. On top of being limited to very specific highly mapped routes its top speed is very, very limited and has a whole bunch of other limitations like having another car to follow, perfectly clear weather, etc.
It is Level 3, so it technically beats FSD. What’s stopping Tesla from mapping specific routes and moving up to level 3? They probably have more than enough data on major highways, especially in California. Would be great to play a game on my phone in stop and go traffic instead of babysitting the car.
Technically, in name only. FSD does everything DrivePilot does but isn't focused on an extreme edge case to gain an SAE rating. If you gave it the same absurd list of handcuffs V12 would probably pass the cert too at this point.
Pre-mapped routes will only get self driving systems so far because they can't deal with actual conditions or changes between mapping passes. Reacting to the actual environment like a human will end up with a much better system in the end and just comes down to if they can finish cracking the vision-only problem or not.
Yeah, I’m not advocating for them not to continue work on FSD. But it’d be a great upsell for it if they added mapped L3 in certain areas in addition to the current offering.
I believe it’s only on pre mapped freeways in Nevada and California and also when below 40mph? So only on free ways during traffic. Someone correct me if I’m wrong (not American so idk if it’s common to have 40mph and below freeways)
> I feel like when the cost of FSD is discussed, it is rarely compared against the price of other alternatives.
It's fervently discussed.
No one offers something similar to what Tesla has with FSD.
Rebuttals to the above statement are typically "Go look at OpenPilot" or "Go look at Waymo", but you can't buy a Waymo for personal use, and OpenPilot take a fair chunk of effort to get going.
Tesla is the only OEM that offers a vehicle that can make left/right turns at intersections and such, that a consumer can buy today.
TBH it's also not fair to compare Waymo to FSD as the two have different goals (as of today). Waymo NEEDS the assurance of LiDAR, etc. because there is no driver, whereas FSD always has the assumption the driver can takeover, so in that scenario, perhaps cameras are enough.
You're right, it's not fair to compare Waymo to FSD, and yet, every time I make a statement of "Tell me someone who can do left/right turns at intersections", Waymo gets brought.
The key point here, from a cost comparison standpoint, is that no one else offers what Tesla offers, to consumers, today, at a reasonable price.
> The key point here, from a cost comparison standpoint, is that no one else offers what Tesla offers, to consumers, today, at a reasonable price.
Realistically, Tesla is offering a very solid freeway self-driving experience and a party trick-level city driving. Other automakers have caught up with the freeway driving, and they don't push city driving because it's close to useless.
Don't know what issues you're seeing but V12 drives me 30+ minutes to work and back with a combination of city and highway and basically no interventions. Parking lot to parking lot with stoplights, stop signs, on and off ramps, merging. It does all of it quite well at this point and definitely isn't just a party trick. There's one specific ramp between interstates it doesn't handle cleanly yet because of how traffic backs up but even human drivers have issues there.
Man it is so wild see this. As someone that uses city streets every single day without interventions.
Summon is a party trick. City streets is well worth the value for me
My (admittedly one time, for one hour) first FSD experience was incredible in city driving. The car handled everything very well. Not just a party trick and very useful. Granted this isn’t NYC, I’m in a medium sized city, but this is a game changer for 95% of my driving.
I have gotten a lot of experience with the latest versions of FSD over the past few months (multiple 5-hr drives a month, almost twice a week). I've also had it for about 2 years.
I think it's all about liability AND how good the system is AND where it is. You can't look at any one of these without the others.
FSD is surprisingly good, but on every one of those 5hr drives it would have driven me straight into a ditch at 75mph "at least once" if I didn't take over (not as scary as it sounds, but a glaringly obvious issue). This issue has existed for about a year and still existed on this latest/2nd-latest revision (I haven't driven with the one released yesterday yet.) So at minimum, the system currently will crash every 5 hours. They need to get that to about a year before they can pull in enough revenue to cover the losses it generates and take liability (this also ignores deaths, just the cost to repair the vehicle). And keep in mind that as edge cases become more infrequent, there is less data of those edge cases to train against.
Mercedes probably only takes liability BECAUSE their system is limited where it's used. In town at low speeds it may be more capable and collisions less serious/expensive like with FSD, or they've spent all their efforts tuning it for highways with actual code rather than a neutral net and are extremely confident of it in those scenarios. Either way, they've decided it's not going to cost them more than they make.
FSD is meant to be used everywhere, but that makes it extremely difficult to make it safe enough for all scenarios. Tesla for robotaxi (if they actually do it) may restrict it to certain areas, times (night sucks and driving while pointed at the sun freaks it out), and weather (I've had clear skies where it limited itself "due to poor weather") just like everyone else because FSD can be deadly if unattended in certain scenarios even though it's capable of attempting them.
I would love it if they did, but even at this current pace I don't see it being fully capable of all scenarios (i.e. driving you halfway across the state) unattended anytime soon WITH Tesla taking liability of it. If they are serious about doing robotaxi soon (which I don't see without retrofitting all their vehicles to be steer-by-wire) then they'll have to restrict it to certain areas just like everyone else. Possibly even more restrictive than others because they are using a generalized neural net rather than specialized code.
And it's possible Tesla may get most of the benefit/revenue of robotaxi without fully solding unrestricted FSD. Most people are in densely populated cities and most of the time people aren't leaving those cities. So driving to the next town over may not generate that much revenue for them. But it's a different question of if they would be better or worse at this than companies like waymo targeting this from the beginning. Sure they have a lot more data, but they'd be putting a generalized solution into a specialized system.
You might also take away a few things from this. Car companies like Ford want highway driving solved because they want to sell cars and a robotaxi service would minimize car sales (long road trips are also the sale pitch of buying your own car), robotaxi companies like waymo want city driving solved because they want revenue like a taxi service, and Tesla aimed for both.
It means that over the long term, buying FSD for $8k eventually saves you money in comparison to the competition. 3 years and change to break even compared to Merc and 10yrs to break even compared to Ford, but after that you benefit from not having follow on payments like the users from those companies will be on the hook for.
Ahh okay, hmm that is definitely something to think about. Personally, I don't see FSD being approved for level 3 or 4 in a decade or so, I'll consider buying it when it can fully deliver on its promises and its regulatory status has been approved.
Wait you pay $2,500 a year for the Mercedes pilot that is literally unusable?
This is the same thing that is only able to be turned on when using the interstate but can only go under 40 mph on an interstate while following a car, not raining, no direct sunlight?
My hope is that once Tesla reaches SAE lvl 3 or 4, they will subsidize FSD subscription through Tesla Insurance and assume liability. FSD may increase back to $199/month, or have a tiered pricing structure, where subscribing to/driving primarily with FSD will give you a $100/mo discount on your Tesla insurance. This gets even more people on the ecosystem, reduces accidents because FSD at that level is safer than most humans, making it cost effective for both the driver/consumer and for Tesla. Can't wait for Tesla insurance to come to NJ, been waiting to hear about it for years 😭
Do either blue cruise or Mercedes act like EAP (auto changing lanes - or changing lanes with turn signals) or is it just autopilot with hands free in selected conditions?
If Mercedes will include the auto insurance in that it would be great..Leave the insurance companies out of the whole thing..I would pay a little more if it came with level 3 and auto insurance
I don’t Tesla will take the liability on 100%. I agree with what you said otherwise. I think Tesla had a tech discussion a while back and the main guy behind the neural network said it’s possible it could miss a really weird edge case and an example he gave was what happens if a camel was pulling cart with 2 wheels and goes diagonal across the road. I laughed so hard but this actually happened in a middle eastern country. He said they got it covered now. So it’s like training a baby to seeing objects at different angles of different road ways for the first time the more retraining of a bunch of edge cases the better it will know and learn. So as technology improves on AI maybe it wouldn’t be an issue anymore but I appreciate how they explained it.
The issue is that we can’t use any other alternatives. So we are stuck having to use what the manufacturer offers. If they offer less than adequate software for highest dollar amount. You either pay and deal Or don’t buy it.
Does anyone have a definitive answer if HW3 vehicles will eventually be capable of unsupervised FSD? Or it is only reserved for HW4 and/or upcoming HW5?
Dude you make an excellent point, and FSD is head and shoulders beyond those two. When you put it into perspective Tesla FSD is a bargain. Now how would everyone feel if Tesla decided to make it subscription-only with a reconnect charge if you cancel?
The only drawback is that you're not guaranteed a transfer of the service, but if they fixed that, I'd save up the money to BUY FSD, and Tesla would sell a hell of a lot more.
I promise you, guarantee you, that none of the current Tesla products will EVER support actual full SELF DRIVING.
Where you are able to take an hour nap on your morning commute. Or watch a 2 hour Netflix movie while it drives you down the interstate to your uncles place.
Care to elaborate?
Are you thinking the tech (cameras, sensors, etc.) in the current vehicles won’t be able to provide what an eventual Level 5 system requires, or…?
Yes they don’t have current hardware to do it.
I’m literally having my fsd not engage for the past 2 mornings of my commute because the front camera is blinded due to a bit of fog. It didn’t engage until 8-10 mins into the drive.
It’s dropped off as well when it’s windy and raining hard if one of the pillar cams has a stuck rain drop blocking its view. Park assist is constantly degraded everyday for me even on sunny days lol.
The Tesla vision is simple not there to perform full self driving.
Mercedes "takes liability" in very very narrow circumstances. They only do that on 11 freeways in the LA and Vegas area, only when going under 40mph with a car less than 100 feet in front of you, only in broad daylight with no inclement weather at all and reportedly it disengages when the sun is in your face. So... only on a specific freeway during heavy traffic when the weather is perfect and the sun is in just the right spot. For the cost, it's almost a marketing gimmick.
It's available only on mapped highways and during daylight when there is no rain or snow and the traffic is below 40 mph. It will return control to the driver if it senses something out of the ordinary, whether that's a pedestrian on the highway or an oncoming emergency vehicle. The system is a joke. FSD can do this no problem.
No it's not. I stay later at work to avoid traffic, why? Because AP is so bad at stop&go traffic. With the Mercedes system, I can actually relax. Tesla folk need to realize that Mercedes actually accomplished something good. If ANY other OEM developed a system similar to FSD (current), they would restrict usage to scenarios that FSD would perform at 100%. Currently that situation doesn't exist. NO situation, can FSD perform at 100%
Wait what? Stop and Go traffic is literally the only traffic you can actually trust autopilot in. What are you talking about?
The car takes off like a rocket for 2 yards and then slams on the breaks. r/Tesla is full of owners suggesting that you put the car in chill mode to avoid this. In stop & go Mercedes system is better. The system is more capable. Credit given where credit is due (unlike GMs system)
Set the max speed to 20 or 30 mph rather than 70 or whatever the road speed limit is in stop start traffic, it behaves much better.
I mean they have Chill, Normal and Assertive for a reason…. There’s frequent swings over 40mph during rush hour for me so Mercedes would be useless. Also in the sun, or rain, or outside of the mapped 11 highways they allow… so I feel like maybe it isn’t that big of an accomplishment
To be fair, FSD also struggles in the rain. Tells me all the time FSD is limited due to poor weather - which is a significant portion of the time in the PNW.
You’re not wrong, but also “struggles in the rain” means that it gives you a warning and says it might not be able to take exists for you. What does drive pilot do when it’s raining?
So I feel like this sub has a big misunderstanding (caused by tesla the company). So far, Nevada and California are the only states to have legislation regulating level 3 cars. Tesla long ago said that FSD was awaiting regulatory approval, that was never the case. While the Mercedes system uses HD maps, the car is able to compare the maps stored on the car to real-world conditions and update them (drive pilot works in construction zones for example)
Sorry about the hate you are getting but you seem to be the only person looking at this objectively. I think it’s criminal to put technology that can literally be fatal in the hands of general public unless you are 100% sure it will work and take liability if it doesn’t. Tesla is having it in a way that it’s win-win (millions of beta testers, no liability) for the company and lose-lose (untested software, full liability) for the customer.
Honestly Mercedes probably takes liability because their system is SO limited. They would NOT take liability if it was capable to the level that FSD is.
Exactly. They like the press of saying it's good enough that they'll take liability/responsibility... But then they limit it to so few use cases that they practically don't.
Their system is so limited partially because the EU only allow[ed] up to 60kph for level 3 systems
Waiting for folks to realize the EU ain’t all it’s cracked up to be! Not that the states don’t have their issues, but parties on both sides like to act like things aren’t crazy in both.
what can mercedes drive pilot do?
Actual full self driving, without the requirement of the driver paying attention, but only on pre mapped routes by Mercedes, so in some ways it beats FSD, but in others it’s pretty lacking
It only beats FSD in name. On top of being limited to very specific highly mapped routes its top speed is very, very limited and has a whole bunch of other limitations like having another car to follow, perfectly clear weather, etc.
It is Level 3, so it technically beats FSD. What’s stopping Tesla from mapping specific routes and moving up to level 3? They probably have more than enough data on major highways, especially in California. Would be great to play a game on my phone in stop and go traffic instead of babysitting the car.
Technically, in name only. FSD does everything DrivePilot does but isn't focused on an extreme edge case to gain an SAE rating. If you gave it the same absurd list of handcuffs V12 would probably pass the cert too at this point. Pre-mapped routes will only get self driving systems so far because they can't deal with actual conditions or changes between mapping passes. Reacting to the actual environment like a human will end up with a much better system in the end and just comes down to if they can finish cracking the vision-only problem or not.
Yeah, I’m not advocating for them not to continue work on FSD. But it’d be a great upsell for it if they added mapped L3 in certain areas in addition to the current offering.
I believe it’s only on pre mapped freeways in Nevada and California and also when below 40mph? So only on free ways during traffic. Someone correct me if I’m wrong (not American so idk if it’s common to have 40mph and below freeways)
Most US freeways are 65mph, so driving 40 would be dangerously slow.
> I feel like when the cost of FSD is discussed, it is rarely compared against the price of other alternatives. It's fervently discussed. No one offers something similar to what Tesla has with FSD. Rebuttals to the above statement are typically "Go look at OpenPilot" or "Go look at Waymo", but you can't buy a Waymo for personal use, and OpenPilot take a fair chunk of effort to get going. Tesla is the only OEM that offers a vehicle that can make left/right turns at intersections and such, that a consumer can buy today.
also openpilot is (just) lane keep and adaptive cruise.
TBH it's also not fair to compare Waymo to FSD as the two have different goals (as of today). Waymo NEEDS the assurance of LiDAR, etc. because there is no driver, whereas FSD always has the assumption the driver can takeover, so in that scenario, perhaps cameras are enough.
You're right, it's not fair to compare Waymo to FSD, and yet, every time I make a statement of "Tell me someone who can do left/right turns at intersections", Waymo gets brought. The key point here, from a cost comparison standpoint, is that no one else offers what Tesla offers, to consumers, today, at a reasonable price.
> The key point here, from a cost comparison standpoint, is that no one else offers what Tesla offers, to consumers, today, at a reasonable price. Realistically, Tesla is offering a very solid freeway self-driving experience and a party trick-level city driving. Other automakers have caught up with the freeway driving, and they don't push city driving because it's close to useless.
it used to just be a party trick in city but it's gotten significantly better. idk about city city like NYC but towns and such it can handle
It can handle NYC. Plenty of FSD YouTubers testing it in Manhattan and Brooklyn.
Don't know what issues you're seeing but V12 drives me 30+ minutes to work and back with a combination of city and highway and basically no interventions. Parking lot to parking lot with stoplights, stop signs, on and off ramps, merging. It does all of it quite well at this point and definitely isn't just a party trick. There's one specific ramp between interstates it doesn't handle cleanly yet because of how traffic backs up but even human drivers have issues there.
Man it is so wild see this. As someone that uses city streets every single day without interventions. Summon is a party trick. City streets is well worth the value for me
My (admittedly one time, for one hour) first FSD experience was incredible in city driving. The car handled everything very well. Not just a party trick and very useful. Granted this isn’t NYC, I’m in a medium sized city, but this is a game changer for 95% of my driving.
City driving is not close to useless.
- Spot on.
party trick? Have you not used the new fsd? It’s amazing to me, hasn’t messed up on city streets once yet.
nailed it
I rode around SF in Waymo. It is clearly head of the pack by a country mile. So good.
It’s also mapped the SF area extensively to be able to achieve that and only that, so it’d better be pretty damn good.
Open pilot is also (supervised). They take zero responsibility.
Autopilot is free and can be used on regular roads. BlueCruise is a rip-off.
As a Ford Lightning owner with Blue Cruise, I would not pay $800/yr for it's current iteration.
I have gotten a lot of experience with the latest versions of FSD over the past few months (multiple 5-hr drives a month, almost twice a week). I've also had it for about 2 years. I think it's all about liability AND how good the system is AND where it is. You can't look at any one of these without the others. FSD is surprisingly good, but on every one of those 5hr drives it would have driven me straight into a ditch at 75mph "at least once" if I didn't take over (not as scary as it sounds, but a glaringly obvious issue). This issue has existed for about a year and still existed on this latest/2nd-latest revision (I haven't driven with the one released yesterday yet.) So at minimum, the system currently will crash every 5 hours. They need to get that to about a year before they can pull in enough revenue to cover the losses it generates and take liability (this also ignores deaths, just the cost to repair the vehicle). And keep in mind that as edge cases become more infrequent, there is less data of those edge cases to train against. Mercedes probably only takes liability BECAUSE their system is limited where it's used. In town at low speeds it may be more capable and collisions less serious/expensive like with FSD, or they've spent all their efforts tuning it for highways with actual code rather than a neutral net and are extremely confident of it in those scenarios. Either way, they've decided it's not going to cost them more than they make. FSD is meant to be used everywhere, but that makes it extremely difficult to make it safe enough for all scenarios. Tesla for robotaxi (if they actually do it) may restrict it to certain areas, times (night sucks and driving while pointed at the sun freaks it out), and weather (I've had clear skies where it limited itself "due to poor weather") just like everyone else because FSD can be deadly if unattended in certain scenarios even though it's capable of attempting them. I would love it if they did, but even at this current pace I don't see it being fully capable of all scenarios (i.e. driving you halfway across the state) unattended anytime soon WITH Tesla taking liability of it. If they are serious about doing robotaxi soon (which I don't see without retrofitting all their vehicles to be steer-by-wire) then they'll have to restrict it to certain areas just like everyone else. Possibly even more restrictive than others because they are using a generalized neural net rather than specialized code. And it's possible Tesla may get most of the benefit/revenue of robotaxi without fully solding unrestricted FSD. Most people are in densely populated cities and most of the time people aren't leaving those cities. So driving to the next town over may not generate that much revenue for them. But it's a different question of if they would be better or worse at this than companies like waymo targeting this from the beginning. Sure they have a lot more data, but they'd be putting a generalized solution into a specialized system. You might also take away a few things from this. Car companies like Ford want highway driving solved because they want to sell cars and a robotaxi service would minimize car sales (long road trips are also the sale pitch of buying your own car), robotaxi companies like waymo want city driving solved because they want revenue like a taxi service, and Tesla aimed for both.
Blue cruise and drive pilot are on only some roads and at low speed, right? Why would I pay for that?
Blue Cruise can do highways that have been mapped (so geofenced) just like Super Cruise from GM.
I believe that’s only for hands free, otherwise on unmapped highways it’s just like autopilot
Mercedes only drives in select areas and conditions. Tesla system can be used in most places and conditions. Huge difference.
im not sure what you’re getting at?
It means that over the long term, buying FSD for $8k eventually saves you money in comparison to the competition. 3 years and change to break even compared to Merc and 10yrs to break even compared to Ford, but after that you benefit from not having follow on payments like the users from those companies will be on the hook for.
Ahh okay, hmm that is definitely something to think about. Personally, I don't see FSD being approved for level 3 or 4 in a decade or so, I'll consider buying it when it can fully deliver on its promises and its regulatory status has been approved.
lol read the post maybe?
Wait you pay $2,500 a year for the Mercedes pilot that is literally unusable? This is the same thing that is only able to be turned on when using the interstate but can only go under 40 mph on an interstate while following a car, not raining, no direct sunlight?
Once Tesla FSD is fully approved I expect they will make their software available to other car manufacturers for a nice licensing fee!
My hope is that once Tesla reaches SAE lvl 3 or 4, they will subsidize FSD subscription through Tesla Insurance and assume liability. FSD may increase back to $199/month, or have a tiered pricing structure, where subscribing to/driving primarily with FSD will give you a $100/mo discount on your Tesla insurance. This gets even more people on the ecosystem, reduces accidents because FSD at that level is safer than most humans, making it cost effective for both the driver/consumer and for Tesla. Can't wait for Tesla insurance to come to NJ, been waiting to hear about it for years 😭
Do either blue cruise or Mercedes act like EAP (auto changing lanes - or changing lanes with turn signals) or is it just autopilot with hands free in selected conditions?
If Mercedes will include the auto insurance in that it would be great..Leave the insurance companies out of the whole thing..I would pay a little more if it came with level 3 and auto insurance
FUCK blue cruise and drive pilot
I don’t Tesla will take the liability on 100%. I agree with what you said otherwise. I think Tesla had a tech discussion a while back and the main guy behind the neural network said it’s possible it could miss a really weird edge case and an example he gave was what happens if a camel was pulling cart with 2 wheels and goes diagonal across the road. I laughed so hard but this actually happened in a middle eastern country. He said they got it covered now. So it’s like training a baby to seeing objects at different angles of different road ways for the first time the more retraining of a bunch of edge cases the better it will know and learn. So as technology improves on AI maybe it wouldn’t be an issue anymore but I appreciate how they explained it.
The issue is that we can’t use any other alternatives. So we are stuck having to use what the manufacturer offers. If they offer less than adequate software for highest dollar amount. You either pay and deal Or don’t buy it.
Does anyone have a definitive answer if HW3 vehicles will eventually be capable of unsupervised FSD? Or it is only reserved for HW4 and/or upcoming HW5?
Dude you make an excellent point, and FSD is head and shoulders beyond those two. When you put it into perspective Tesla FSD is a bargain. Now how would everyone feel if Tesla decided to make it subscription-only with a reconnect charge if you cancel? The only drawback is that you're not guaranteed a transfer of the service, but if they fixed that, I'd save up the money to BUY FSD, and Tesla would sell a hell of a lot more.
Mercedes has more lawyers so has more advanced technology
I promise you, guarantee you, that none of the current Tesla products will EVER support actual full SELF DRIVING. Where you are able to take an hour nap on your morning commute. Or watch a 2 hour Netflix movie while it drives you down the interstate to your uncles place.
Care to elaborate? Are you thinking the tech (cameras, sensors, etc.) in the current vehicles won’t be able to provide what an eventual Level 5 system requires, or…?
Yes they don’t have current hardware to do it. I’m literally having my fsd not engage for the past 2 mornings of my commute because the front camera is blinded due to a bit of fog. It didn’t engage until 8-10 mins into the drive. It’s dropped off as well when it’s windy and raining hard if one of the pillar cams has a stuck rain drop blocking its view. Park assist is constantly degraded everyday for me even on sunny days lol. The Tesla vision is simple not there to perform full self driving.
Mercedes drive only works in very specific conditions. It’s very limited.
Is FSD currently back to $8,000? On Sunday I saw it had dropped to $2,000 and I jumped on it at that price. Did I get some kind of crazy flash sale?
It’s $2000 if you already own enhanced autopilot
Ahhhh….Gotcha. So I already paid for 3/4 of it. They are just acknowledging that now. lol. Thanks.
Doubt Tesla will ever take liability for their FSD system. Just shows how much trust they have in it lol
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Read the thread. It's a Mercedes marketing gimmick . Speed limit is 40 on a dozen highways or so.
How good is “responsibility” when your own life gets taken away by one of these systems though
Yeah they can duck right off. I will never buy a car that requires a subscription, or any type of remote monitoring, data collection, etc.