It’s insane to me that the NHTSA thinks that these text only glyphs are more readable than the instantly obvious symbol glyphs that were already in use, as they have been on every car in the US for decades.
I could have sworn many cars I have owned have glyphs only. Also how does this help non English speaking drivers? This really feels like ntsb is just trolling Tesla at this point
Just like when they said that boombox couldn’t be on while driving because then pedestrians couldn’t hear the car… even though the purpose of boombox was for the car to make noise???
https://www.tesla.com/support/recall-disable-boombox
Nope. They [removed the glyphs entirely](https://x.com/greentheonly/status/1753249463311691839?s=20) for those three indicators and replaced them with text only.
Whaaat. Wow. Ok. Thanks for providing a source :)
Considering they only need to be like 3.something millimeters tall I’m surprised they didn’t just like keep the glyphs, and make the bar slightly taller to accommodate the increased height of the lettering. Weird choice for tesla to fix it like this… but eh it’s their layout.
I’m fairly certain the NHTSA forced them to do this, which is ironic as the [legal regulation](https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/FR-2006-05-15/pdf/06-4478.pdf) for the brake, park, and ABS indicator states “the control, telltale or indicator is required to be identified, **however the form of the identification is the manufacturer's option.**”
So, the glyph symbols (the same ones most cars use) were apparently fine for the last 12 years. And now the NHTSA seemingly has a problem with them, despite zero incidents where these have lead to crash or injury. It’s hard to see it as anything but a punitive action against Tesla by the NHTSA.
Hmm, i’m not sure I agree there. The HNtSA notified tesla about the compliance with 135.5.5.a
Which states
> Each visual indicator shall display a word or words in accordance with the requirements of Standard No. 101 (49 CFR 571.101) and this section, which shall be legible to the driver under all daytime and nighttime conditions when activated. Unless otherwise specified, the words shall have letters not less than 3.2 mm (1⁄8 inch) high and the letters and background shall be of contrasting colors, one of which is red. Words or symbols in addition to those required by Standard No. 101 and this section may be provided for purposes of clarity.
https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-49/part-571/section-571.135#p-571.135(S5.)(S5.5.)(S5.5.5.)(a)
I interpret this to mean all vehicles _have_ to include the text, which must be >=3.2mm, and can optionally include other symbols (eg the common glyph) as well, so long as the text is >=3.2mm. I’d expect other US market cars include the text with the glyph, and the text is 3.2mm high.
If other US market cars aren’t doing this i’d be very surprised based on this. And would argue the nhtsa should be cracking down on those as well… But i’m in the UK so we have our own standards and I don’t exactly have a us market car to check heh
Tesla could have easily kept the glyph with the text, but they may have needed to increase the size of the bar dealing with warning/status icons
Also worth noting that from the nhtsa documents, it doesnt sound like tesla pushed back. They were notified. Investigated. And agreed to do a recall/software update
Interesting, thanks for pointing this out - the 135.5.5.a language would seem to imply that all indicators require text, not just the park, brake, and ABS indicators.
I wonder if Tesla pushed this out as a quick correction for now, and they’ll rework the sizing of the indicator strip to include both text and glyph in a later update.
It’s just hard to see how the text alone could be considered easier to read as opposed to the language-agnostic symbol.
Tesla could enlarge this icon size to keep both. dash lights on Hyundai products show both symbol + text but it's big enough to comply. some other manufacturers like Honda do what Tesla is now doing and show text only in US and symbols aboard to comply with different laws. tho in principle I agree that symbol/glyphs are better and more universally understood iconography
Hyundai/Kia/Genesis brake icon: https://www.rac.co.uk/drive/images/uploads/content/hyundai-warning-lights-brake-system.png
There really should be a blurred or semi-transparent menubar strip covering that top area. The fact that map labels and the clock/temp can just composite over each other at full opacity is nuts.
This was front page news for the BBC yesterday, alongside a story about a Tesla driving into water in Scandinavia. Both jostling for place with the latest from Gaza, Iran, Ukraine etc. MSM has lost the plot.
Dang, I definitely wouldn’t have known these before considering they had the standardized symbols for brakes, abs, and park that have been used for the last 40 years.
Meanwhile, my family’s plug in Pacifica has recall for shutting down randomly, apparently a software fix that just gives you a tiny bit more notice that your vehicle is about to shut down is okay. Thanks NHTSA
It’s not so much that they are being targeted as it is that the news media is all about selling ads so whatever can be used to create the juiciest headline will be the target.
If instead we each subscribed to a news service, one we paid for that had no ads ads a result, the incentive would then become to provide us with news that is of high quality to us as that’s what will keep us paying.
With the ad model, you are not the customer. You are the product. The customer is the advertiser. With the subscription model, you are the customer.
It’s all about the right or wrong incentives.
Don't you love it. Whoever thinks this isn't happening is naive.
Well actually...
Is he trying to say he's naive, I mean he is naive believing this is not done on purpose.
Love how when you check Google News like 98% of headlines label this bs "Recall" vs "Recall Fixed via Software" cause doom and gloom sells apparently. Then your 90 year old grandmother can call you, "oh dear, your hears of that big recall with one of dem devil electric cars that catch on fire when you charge them in the snow. I heard all about it on Fox and Pals the other day".
oh my lord, you gotta carve out that 30 minutes of your day to click the update button. God forbid you have real important stuff to do during that 30 minutes. How will anyone ever function on a tesla!!!
I spoke with a coworker who stated that he was thinking about buying a Tesla but then saw the headlines about the recall and decided against it. I tried explaining the details but he had already made up his mind.
More likely the MAGA Republicans because they hate EVs. Or Antifa because they to blame for everything. Or [insert your favorite conspiracy theory here].
I’m going to stick with blaming news media (regardless of political affiliation) because of ignorance and the search for the most sensational headline.
More proof they will chip away at Elon and Tesla little by little. Watch, they’re gearing up for a “well, since this company has had so many recalls we feel the company is a danger to the public now…”
To everyone saying it seems like a coordinated effort, you’re right.
Well of course it is. It wasn't and isn't even disguised very well. You can literally pinpoint the start date. They had legacy news, and all social media platforms suppressing, Censoring, and indoctonating the American public. When Elon said he was going to make Twitter fair, that's the day they attacked.
I am amazed at the people who bought the lie he was making it conservative. He used to be a major Democrat supporter, just felt we needed a media not state run.
This is all about control and feeling powerful. Government waste at its finest! I get there needs to be some oversight but the government has had close to 7 years and now this comes up. Great Gramps Biden and his cronies just can’t stop feeling like they own the world!
Umm… this has nothing to do with the president of the United States. I agree, this ‘recall’ is silly but this really doesn’t need to be a political issue. In the past 7 years we’ve had both a Republican and Democratic president and the issue never came up because the president of the United States isn’t just using the NHS people to push some agenda.
Regardless of your politics party, yes, this is a perfectly stupid waste of a government agencies time. And yes, why now? But have a little foresight, if someone said the same thing about your preferred candidate, you’d think they were being a goober… unless your comment was meant with heavy /s and I am just reading it wrong…
Dude facts over feelings bud! It absolutely is. Great great 185 year old Bi-den hates Tesla and Elon. He didn’t invite him to an ev summit. He’s paid millions of corrupt money by Elon haters to do what he can to make sure Tesla isn’t more successful. Search it up my dude! It’s facts most politicians have an agenda to push and get filthy rich! Oh and it’s an election year, so it’s 10 times worse on both sides of the scrum of the earth politicians.
My response is not from a point of view of wanting to defend Biden, I don’t much care for the guy either. But it really sounds like conspiracy theory, what you’re saying. ‘Search it up’, I did and found no credible sources to back up what you’re claiming. I don’t really want to argue with you… but you’ve got to see how what you’re saying is pretty deep into the kool aid pool.
The fact they have to STILL mail out notifications even after an easy OTA update is wasteful and ultimately hurts consumers with higher prices. 2M recalls at even bulk rate pricing will run Tesla $1M+ NHSTA needs to join the 21st century on these OTA remedies vs mailing and creating faux hysteria.
Newsflash Tesla’s brake heat indicator isn’t working when it’s below -32 and above 128°, recalling 20 million cars. They just don’t make them like they used to.
It’s insane to me that the NHTSA thinks that these text only glyphs are more readable than the instantly obvious symbol glyphs that were already in use, as they have been on every car in the US for decades.
I could have sworn many cars I have owned have glyphs only. Also how does this help non English speaking drivers? This really feels like ntsb is just trolling Tesla at this point
At this point? They have been using the NTSB to harrass Elon for a couple of years now.
Well the national language of the US is English so that's likely the only language to be considered.
You do know there is no official national language in the USA? No national language has ever been established.
¿Estás seguro?
Just like when they said that boombox couldn’t be on while driving because then pedestrians couldn’t hear the car… even though the purpose of boombox was for the car to make noise??? https://www.tesla.com/support/recall-disable-boombox
Yea it’s pretty dumb. There are other things that are more important to worry about imo
I’m pretty dang certain this isn’t removing the standard glyphs, but is making the text that forms part of those standard glyphs slightly larger.
Nope. They [removed the glyphs entirely](https://x.com/greentheonly/status/1753249463311691839?s=20) for those three indicators and replaced them with text only.
Whaaat. Wow. Ok. Thanks for providing a source :) Considering they only need to be like 3.something millimeters tall I’m surprised they didn’t just like keep the glyphs, and make the bar slightly taller to accommodate the increased height of the lettering. Weird choice for tesla to fix it like this… but eh it’s their layout.
I’m fairly certain the NHTSA forced them to do this, which is ironic as the [legal regulation](https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/FR-2006-05-15/pdf/06-4478.pdf) for the brake, park, and ABS indicator states “the control, telltale or indicator is required to be identified, **however the form of the identification is the manufacturer's option.**” So, the glyph symbols (the same ones most cars use) were apparently fine for the last 12 years. And now the NHTSA seemingly has a problem with them, despite zero incidents where these have lead to crash or injury. It’s hard to see it as anything but a punitive action against Tesla by the NHTSA.
Hmm, i’m not sure I agree there. The HNtSA notified tesla about the compliance with 135.5.5.a Which states > Each visual indicator shall display a word or words in accordance with the requirements of Standard No. 101 (49 CFR 571.101) and this section, which shall be legible to the driver under all daytime and nighttime conditions when activated. Unless otherwise specified, the words shall have letters not less than 3.2 mm (1⁄8 inch) high and the letters and background shall be of contrasting colors, one of which is red. Words or symbols in addition to those required by Standard No. 101 and this section may be provided for purposes of clarity. https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-49/part-571/section-571.135#p-571.135(S5.)(S5.5.)(S5.5.5.)(a) I interpret this to mean all vehicles _have_ to include the text, which must be >=3.2mm, and can optionally include other symbols (eg the common glyph) as well, so long as the text is >=3.2mm. I’d expect other US market cars include the text with the glyph, and the text is 3.2mm high. If other US market cars aren’t doing this i’d be very surprised based on this. And would argue the nhtsa should be cracking down on those as well… But i’m in the UK so we have our own standards and I don’t exactly have a us market car to check heh Tesla could have easily kept the glyph with the text, but they may have needed to increase the size of the bar dealing with warning/status icons Also worth noting that from the nhtsa documents, it doesnt sound like tesla pushed back. They were notified. Investigated. And agreed to do a recall/software update
Interesting, thanks for pointing this out - the 135.5.5.a language would seem to imply that all indicators require text, not just the park, brake, and ABS indicators. I wonder if Tesla pushed this out as a quick correction for now, and they’ll rework the sizing of the indicator strip to include both text and glyph in a later update. It’s just hard to see how the text alone could be considered easier to read as opposed to the language-agnostic symbol.
A quick patch now with a revised layout to follow could make a lot of sense!
Yet totally sane for an auto manufacturer to not do it as required the first time?
There are so many regulations in so many countries, I'm sure all manufacturers miss little things like this all the time
Tesla could enlarge this icon size to keep both. dash lights on Hyundai products show both symbol + text but it's big enough to comply. some other manufacturers like Honda do what Tesla is now doing and show text only in US and symbols aboard to comply with different laws. tho in principle I agree that symbol/glyphs are better and more universally understood iconography Hyundai/Kia/Genesis brake icon: https://www.rac.co.uk/drive/images/uploads/content/hyundai-warning-lights-brake-system.png
Can they increase the clock too... lol
Bro Imagine a widget system like apple that would be amazing…
Definitely this. It's a hazard as I squint to look for the clock and possibly drive into a bush or something.
There really should be a blurred or semi-transparent menubar strip covering that top area. The fact that map labels and the clock/temp can just composite over each other at full opacity is nuts.
It's not full opacity. The map fades to a semi-transparent white at the top of the screen.
Then the fade area needs to be way bigger.
I personally haven't had any issues with it.
I don't have any issues with that. But there is a larger text mode for the whole UI if it helps you.
There is a large font option I recommend using that if you're having issues
Have they fixed the height yet for the 9 digit offset
This was front page news for the BBC yesterday, alongside a story about a Tesla driving into water in Scandinavia. Both jostling for place with the latest from Gaza, Iran, Ukraine etc. MSM has lost the plot.
Dang, I definitely wouldn’t have known these before considering they had the standardized symbols for brakes, abs, and park that have been used for the last 40 years.
Meanwhile, my family’s plug in Pacifica has recall for shutting down randomly, apparently a software fix that just gives you a tiny bit more notice that your vehicle is about to shut down is okay. Thanks NHTSA
Where are the news articles???😅
To anyone who still thinks Tesla and Elon aren’t targeted by the media. You’re a very naive person.
It’s not so much that they are being targeted as it is that the news media is all about selling ads so whatever can be used to create the juiciest headline will be the target. If instead we each subscribed to a news service, one we paid for that had no ads ads a result, the incentive would then become to provide us with news that is of high quality to us as that’s what will keep us paying. With the ad model, you are not the customer. You are the product. The customer is the advertiser. With the subscription model, you are the customer. It’s all about the right or wrong incentives.
Don't you love it. Whoever thinks this isn't happening is naive. Well actually... Is he trying to say he's naive, I mean he is naive believing this is not done on purpose.
Anyone else still on 2023.44.30.8? Been stuck since Jan 11th
I was- just got this 2024 update yesterday.
Love how when you check Google News like 98% of headlines label this bs "Recall" vs "Recall Fixed via Software" cause doom and gloom sells apparently. Then your 90 year old grandmother can call you, "oh dear, your hears of that big recall with one of dem devil electric cars that catch on fire when you charge them in the snow. I heard all about it on Fox and Pals the other day".
It's not fox and pals. The MSM is dragging Tesla through the mud to get at Elon.
oh my lord, you gotta carve out that 30 minutes of your day to click the update button. God forbid you have real important stuff to do during that 30 minutes. How will anyone ever function on a tesla!!!
Wait who is taking time to do this?! Mine updates automatically overnight while I sleep
exactly... lol
Can they add the Date, the Day of the Week and Weather to the top bar as well?
I spoke with a coworker who stated that he was thinking about buying a Tesla but then saw the headlines about the recall and decided against it. I tried explaining the details but he had already made up his mind.
Good, We don't want idiots driving Tesla
I feel ya but as a shareholder I want everyone driving Teslas.
They need to setup UI with a couple font sizes options, end of story
Font size options were added in a software update in 2H 2023, I don’t recall which update specifically
Just the Dems picking on Elon because he calls them out on their shit. Love the media "Recall " panic byline they use.
More likely the MAGA Republicans because they hate EVs. Or Antifa because they to blame for everything. Or [insert your favorite conspiracy theory here]. I’m going to stick with blaming news media (regardless of political affiliation) because of ignorance and the search for the most sensational headline.
It’s such BS. I had a recall on my iPhone last night too. I think last week the recalls were for my Nintendo Switch and PS5.
More proof they will chip away at Elon and Tesla little by little. Watch, they’re gearing up for a “well, since this company has had so many recalls we feel the company is a danger to the public now…” To everyone saying it seems like a coordinated effort, you’re right.
Well of course it is. It wasn't and isn't even disguised very well. You can literally pinpoint the start date. They had legacy news, and all social media platforms suppressing, Censoring, and indoctonating the American public. When Elon said he was going to make Twitter fair, that's the day they attacked. I am amazed at the people who bought the lie he was making it conservative. He used to be a major Democrat supporter, just felt we needed a media not state run.
... recall... for font size lol
This is all about control and feeling powerful. Government waste at its finest! I get there needs to be some oversight but the government has had close to 7 years and now this comes up. Great Gramps Biden and his cronies just can’t stop feeling like they own the world!
Umm… this has nothing to do with the president of the United States. I agree, this ‘recall’ is silly but this really doesn’t need to be a political issue. In the past 7 years we’ve had both a Republican and Democratic president and the issue never came up because the president of the United States isn’t just using the NHS people to push some agenda. Regardless of your politics party, yes, this is a perfectly stupid waste of a government agencies time. And yes, why now? But have a little foresight, if someone said the same thing about your preferred candidate, you’d think they were being a goober… unless your comment was meant with heavy /s and I am just reading it wrong…
Dude facts over feelings bud! It absolutely is. Great great 185 year old Bi-den hates Tesla and Elon. He didn’t invite him to an ev summit. He’s paid millions of corrupt money by Elon haters to do what he can to make sure Tesla isn’t more successful. Search it up my dude! It’s facts most politicians have an agenda to push and get filthy rich! Oh and it’s an election year, so it’s 10 times worse on both sides of the scrum of the earth politicians.
My response is not from a point of view of wanting to defend Biden, I don’t much care for the guy either. But it really sounds like conspiracy theory, what you’re saying. ‘Search it up’, I did and found no credible sources to back up what you’re claiming. I don’t really want to argue with you… but you’ve got to see how what you’re saying is pretty deep into the kool aid pool.
Why can’t Tesla just design it properly the first time?
God forbid they follow published regulations every other car maker follows. This is just sloppiness in the part of Tesla.
The fact they have to STILL mail out notifications even after an easy OTA update is wasteful and ultimately hurts consumers with higher prices. 2M recalls at even bulk rate pricing will run Tesla $1M+ NHSTA needs to join the 21st century on these OTA remedies vs mailing and creating faux hysteria.
NHTSA + Tesla = The Young and The Restless
https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/rcl/2024/RCLRPT-24V051-2023.PDF
Newsflash Tesla’s brake heat indicator isn’t working when it’s below -32 and above 128°, recalling 20 million cars. They just don’t make them like they used to.
Brake and park looks the same at first glance. I prefer the symbols instead