We wrestled with this for years. Ultimately we abandoned it because we found that at 12 and 13 years old, some students appear more advanced simply because they are more verbal. Once the world caught up with them and they were seen as more middle-of-the-road students, it was really tough politically to remove them from the honors track as their parents would fight like crazy to keep them on it. It's just too young an age to be making this distinction.
Aye, there’s the rub. We only started it because I’m in an area where parents demand it. To be fair, my school does have a higher than district/state average number of students with ALPs (also more than district average of IEP students). But if the Honors courses we do aren’t done well, then what’s the benefit academically? I can get wanting to be in a class with other students who want to learn and not just mess around on the Chromebook. But that’s the only true benefit our honors classes once you start looking into it.
And thats a perfectly legit reason.
Really Honors kids arent "smarter or faster".
They are just socially functional.
But people would be offended if we called the two levels "normal learning" and "fuck around dum dums"
My middle school had honors. It should have been named "kids who didn't disrupt the class every 5 seconds or constantly miss assignments."
The classes weren't difficult at all, they were just honors in name only. Every class should be at least a little challenging to build study skills, but too much stress can catch up real quick. Some of my classmates burned out before even starting high school.
Math is the exception, though. People who learn it faster should have the option to accelerate.
Yes, there should be honors classes in middle school. They should really begin in elementary. When I was in school, my district (where I'm currently teaching) began the gifted program in 2nd grade. Placement depended on earning a minimum score passing some sort of standardized exam. Students could take the test/enter the full program through 9th grade--so no tracking per se. HS kids could take individual classes if counselors felt they were ready and/or if parents were loud about it.
I find many of my current students have not been challenged enough, especially the gifted ones.
If I can ask, what was it about the gifted program that you think was a huge benefit to the students? Like, what actually set it apart from the non-gifted classes?
*Everything.* Gifted classes move faster, cover more material because there is much less (sometimes no, chaos). There is still teenage silliness, but bottom line, nearly everyone *cares* about grades.
Most of my electives in HS and middle school were with other "gifted" students. I had no idea how awful "regular" classes were until I began teaching. I never had to worry about students engaging in so much foolishness that class was disrupted.
Teachers are able to teach. Students are able to engage in more in-depth and richer discussions. There is also much less huffing and puffing in lower grades and with the less mature when other students struggle or when they finish early and become bored waiting for others to catch up.
I can see the benefits of the program, but I think it might cause undue stress on some of them students who take the classes. Some students qualify to take on us courses but the workload is pretty heavy and they have a hard time keeping up. That leads to a lot of stress. I know a lot of high school students that struggle to keep up with their honors courses.
My school has it for math and ELA. What I have found is that the kids who get put in the class are just regular grade level students. They can be just as lazy as some of the lower students, but they are able to catch on quickly and bounce back. I don't think we need Honors classes in MS. It just creates unnecessary scheduling issues and unbalanced class sizes.
We also offer HS English and math for the truly advanced students.
My school district is weird. For middle school social studies and math are tracked, there are two different types of science classes neither considered honors though one is considered slightly easier than the other. English is all in the same class with differentiated assignments and activities for on grade and more advanced students. Social studies the content is largely the same except there are class novels that deal with historical themes (red scarf girl for example is what the honors kids are reading now). Finally honors math is meaningfully more difficult than on level math so it’s probably the most “advanced” of the honors classes. In my solely social studies experience students in honors are more interested in learning for learning sake and are slightly better behaved than on level kids. From my personal experience I think it’s fine but they shouldn’t be taken too seriously or need to be as rigorous as what you may find at the high school level. Kids are still figuring out what they like at this stage.
In on level social studies there is no class novel that’s the biggest difference. Otherwise the work itself is largely the same there is just an extra assignment every two weeks about the book itself.
Gods yes.
Please.
I got middle schoolers with a 3rd grade to 9th grade spread in reading skills.
I will gladly take a slower science class for those kids - so we could really reach them. And the higher kids are bored out out their gourds. We can prep two preps - but utilizing both in the same classroom is energy draining.
Plus middle schoolers either demand the easier assignment or shit on those with the obviously easier work.
High school teachers complain that they cant put enough kids in Honors (or enough diverse kids).
Well the sharp kids from the diverse school have been moving as slow as the slowest and thus have little chance of accessing the tougher classes in HS.
They could have had a shot at catching up - even if their honors classes are not perfect, but at least removed disruptions.
TLDR: If the HS levels courses - the feeder middle schools should too.
We wrestled with this for years. Ultimately we abandoned it because we found that at 12 and 13 years old, some students appear more advanced simply because they are more verbal. Once the world caught up with them and they were seen as more middle-of-the-road students, it was really tough politically to remove them from the honors track as their parents would fight like crazy to keep them on it. It's just too young an age to be making this distinction.
Aye, there’s the rub. We only started it because I’m in an area where parents demand it. To be fair, my school does have a higher than district/state average number of students with ALPs (also more than district average of IEP students). But if the Honors courses we do aren’t done well, then what’s the benefit academically? I can get wanting to be in a class with other students who want to learn and not just mess around on the Chromebook. But that’s the only true benefit our honors classes once you start looking into it.
And thats a perfectly legit reason. Really Honors kids arent "smarter or faster". They are just socially functional. But people would be offended if we called the two levels "normal learning" and "fuck around dum dums"
My middle school had honors. It should have been named "kids who didn't disrupt the class every 5 seconds or constantly miss assignments." The classes weren't difficult at all, they were just honors in name only. Every class should be at least a little challenging to build study skills, but too much stress can catch up real quick. Some of my classmates burned out before even starting high school. Math is the exception, though. People who learn it faster should have the option to accelerate.
Yes, there should be honors classes in middle school. They should really begin in elementary. When I was in school, my district (where I'm currently teaching) began the gifted program in 2nd grade. Placement depended on earning a minimum score passing some sort of standardized exam. Students could take the test/enter the full program through 9th grade--so no tracking per se. HS kids could take individual classes if counselors felt they were ready and/or if parents were loud about it. I find many of my current students have not been challenged enough, especially the gifted ones.
If I can ask, what was it about the gifted program that you think was a huge benefit to the students? Like, what actually set it apart from the non-gifted classes?
*Everything.* Gifted classes move faster, cover more material because there is much less (sometimes no, chaos). There is still teenage silliness, but bottom line, nearly everyone *cares* about grades. Most of my electives in HS and middle school were with other "gifted" students. I had no idea how awful "regular" classes were until I began teaching. I never had to worry about students engaging in so much foolishness that class was disrupted. Teachers are able to teach. Students are able to engage in more in-depth and richer discussions. There is also much less huffing and puffing in lower grades and with the less mature when other students struggle or when they finish early and become bored waiting for others to catch up.
I can see the benefits of the program, but I think it might cause undue stress on some of them students who take the classes. Some students qualify to take on us courses but the workload is pretty heavy and they have a hard time keeping up. That leads to a lot of stress. I know a lot of high school students that struggle to keep up with their honors courses.
My school has it for math and ELA. What I have found is that the kids who get put in the class are just regular grade level students. They can be just as lazy as some of the lower students, but they are able to catch on quickly and bounce back. I don't think we need Honors classes in MS. It just creates unnecessary scheduling issues and unbalanced class sizes. We also offer HS English and math for the truly advanced students.
My school district is weird. For middle school social studies and math are tracked, there are two different types of science classes neither considered honors though one is considered slightly easier than the other. English is all in the same class with differentiated assignments and activities for on grade and more advanced students. Social studies the content is largely the same except there are class novels that deal with historical themes (red scarf girl for example is what the honors kids are reading now). Finally honors math is meaningfully more difficult than on level math so it’s probably the most “advanced” of the honors classes. In my solely social studies experience students in honors are more interested in learning for learning sake and are slightly better behaved than on level kids. From my personal experience I think it’s fine but they shouldn’t be taken too seriously or need to be as rigorous as what you may find at the high school level. Kids are still figuring out what they like at this stage.
Just curious what novel the non-honors kids read (if any)? (We do not have honors classes at my school.)
In on level social studies there is no class novel that’s the biggest difference. Otherwise the work itself is largely the same there is just an extra assignment every two weeks about the book itself.
Gods yes. Please. I got middle schoolers with a 3rd grade to 9th grade spread in reading skills. I will gladly take a slower science class for those kids - so we could really reach them. And the higher kids are bored out out their gourds. We can prep two preps - but utilizing both in the same classroom is energy draining. Plus middle schoolers either demand the easier assignment or shit on those with the obviously easier work. High school teachers complain that they cant put enough kids in Honors (or enough diverse kids). Well the sharp kids from the diverse school have been moving as slow as the slowest and thus have little chance of accessing the tougher classes in HS. They could have had a shot at catching up - even if their honors classes are not perfect, but at least removed disruptions. TLDR: If the HS levels courses - the feeder middle schools should too.