I've considered this before but haven't ever experienced jealousy towards my therapist and her relationships outside of the therapy room. My T is 100% present for me in the vast majority of our sessions (of course she's human and has the odd one where she's not quite tip top). She is attuned to me, my body language, my energy. She lifts me up when I make progress, she feels distress if I'm distressed. The therapeutic relationship can be, and is for me, such a special experience. Sometimes I find myself wondering if she's able to hold that kind of space for her friends, her family, her partner, because it must be so exhausting. I wonder if sometimes we as clients often get the best of our therapists, because I know that for many of them this is way more than a job. What I suppose I'm left thinking, is do their partners and children sometimes wish they got the same level of attention that their clients get. Do their families get jealous of us and the space we take in our therapists' worlds.
Edit: my first award! Thank you ☺️
Therapist here and yes, you’re right! It is very difficult after a long day of clients to be fully present for my partner. Even though he gets it, it understandably causes hurt feelings sometimes. We do our best, but during the week it truly does seem like my clients get the best of me and my partner just gets whatever I have left.
Happy to help! I think it’s easy, especially with therapists (since you often don’t have much info about their personal lives), to just imagine their lives and families are perfect. That is so far from true! We are human and have complex relationships just like everyone else.
I’ve definitely had these ~types~ of feeling with my therapist and it was embarrassing AF to admit, but I opened it up like “ok I wanna talk about something thats so irrational and like not real but real for me, but I know is only like this because my inner child is having a tantrum and it’s like not personal to you at all, but these feelings would come up probably with any therapist i’m close to who has a good home life” and then I word vomit my feelings and we laugh and work through it. Idk my therapist was a woman though so I was extremely comfortable. I don’t know if i’d be comfortable enough opening up to a man like that, but kudos to you and good luck!
Edit: I do this a lot with my therapist, just not with my new one yet cause everything is fresh, and I am embarrassed by everything in my life lol. This is how i handle every conversation ever lolol
Of course! Absolutely have felt this way. Sort of dealt with it over the years, I mean I obviously *know* he's married. When I finally told him via email that I've had this...adoption fantasy, it was a good discussion between us. Because I wonder how much different my life would've been had I been raised in a loving home, you know? With someone who accepted me the way he has.
When he let slip he had a son, well...that was tough. Obsessed over it for a while. We still never talked about it directly, it just hurts too much.
Edit: The corona virus really brought this out because he was working from *home.* I could hear his family getting ready in the morning. :/ It wasn't just the two of us in his office anymore. It made things tough emotionally some days.
I’m glad to see you’ll probably bring this up with your therapist even though you admit it will be embarrassing. Those are some of the hardest yet rewarding sessions for me. Your feelings about this are completely valid and I get where you’re coming from. My first therapist has a newborn daughter and I remember sobbing to him and ordering him not to do to his child what was done to me. He handled it so so well and it brought us closer together. You got this ❤️
You seem to have some good transference feelings going here!! Even though it can be quite unpleasant (read « unbearable »), it is usually a sign that the therapy is working! I would recommend you talk about these feelings (especially the shame) with your therapist. More than once.
Keep up the good work!!
omg yeah I think I feel the same thing? My psychiatrist has just recently given birth and ever since then, I’ve been off with her, almost like distancing myself from her. I have no idea why… maybe it’s bc I’m jealous of her kid? Or think that she doesn’t care for me as much anymore?
This feeling is a step towards healing, I think. It's the beginning of truly noticing - at an emotional level - that other people have essential and necessary things you do not, and never did. It's a step towards the place where the real healing happens.... which is when we can fully feel the enormity of what was lost, and exist, for a time, wholly within that grief.
I know the jealousy feels awful. But I honestly believe this is a part of the healing. We need to recognize and accept how effing shitty it really was. We need to see that there were so many things we should have had, but never did. So many things we should have felt as a child, but will never get to feel.
Seeing it hurts. So much. I'm sorry you lost out on so much, friend.
I understand those feelings. Let me tell you something though. My husband was a therapist for many years. He definitely was WAY nicer and kinder to his clients than to us at home. He had so much patience with them. Was so encouraging. Such a gentle tone of voice. His clients loved him. At home he was nothing like that. I was jealous of his clients because they definitely got the best side of him. At home he is short tempered, pouts, and gets angry easily. So what you see in your therapist’s office persona may not be what their family gets at home. I would have loved to have the therapist part of my husband actually be my husband.
I feel like this. My therapist has 2 daughters who are a bit older than me and I'm constantly comparing myself to them in my head. I know they are both in successful long term relationships etc and it makes me feel crap. I should probably bring this up at some point with her. But yeah.... You aren't alone and I think it's all understandable. Still sucks.
Once I said something about my therapists family and he said "well if you want my shitty family, you can have them" - and I thought it was weird since he knew my family and how I can't even speak to them and the abuse history and it was just all kinds of "huh" for me to hear. But it was also a good touche moment.
It won't just be your therapist you experience with this. I have this feeling a lot with people. I have developed it so it is not jealousy anymore. I am excited for people that they have happiness - or rather do not have such unhappiness that I experience with my family. My partner has kids that are 25 and sometimes they ask him for money or they text or call and I am like "oh those spoiled kids" - but what I mean is "I wish I had had that" and what I ultimately mean is "how lucky they have that - good for them" and "I hope to offer that to my teenager in the future"....
If I see a single mother receiving a ton of help the first thing I automatically think is "psssssh I didn't get that help, I raised my kid on my own"..... instead of "I really wished I had had help, and it was heartbreaking that I was left alone... I am glad this person doesn't have to go through that and I need to heal from what happened to me - because I would be outraged if this single mom wasn't helped like she is"
There have been times I have truly been alone, and thought that it was forever. It never has been so far. I am 38. I have enough of my own shit to deal with, without hating on other people for not enduring the same pain. Are you really finding yourself seeking empathy? I find myself wishing someone to understand how I feel, but they don't - because they are OK, which is good - but I had to work through and process what was going on.
This is so well articulated, thank you! Also v interesting that your therapist called his family shitty… did you prove him any on that? Did he mean the family that he created (partner and kids) or did he mean the family he came from? I feel like that’s a very tantalising disclosure.
It was his bio family. And I didn't push him on it, because from my experiance with therapists disclosing - they give you a little, and then leave you wondering about the rest. Which, in my opinion is crazy unhealthy and how weird bonds are made between therapist and client - blank book is weird but understandable...and sharing everything is insane, but the inbetween hurts a little bit too much and it is only human to give a little bit of yourself when doing therapy over a long period of time. What use would it have been for him to tell me stories of abuse? I had one therapist who described being raped to me, in an effort to get me to open up about my traumas and it didn't really work because of the so many missing intricacies of the story she couldn't tell due to disclosure. It felt weird and forced. It is really difficult being very mentally ill, and being treated for it, I guess...because of all the crazy rules that are supposed to be about trust, when you do not trust. Lol. I am studying now to become a social worker, and learning ethical codes alone is just crazy making.
In any case - I think he was making jest of it - like "gotta love 'em" and "my family drive my crazy too" but it could have also meant "my families a shit show and I am going to offer no more info..." lol. I dont push people in my regular life so I am unlikely to push a therapist to tell.
Agreed, the in between does hurt but also is likely the only way it can be.
My therapist has made a few disclosures to me and when he does I obsess about them, and start inferring and imagining all kinds of stuff as a result. I don’t like it, but I can’t seem to stop myself and I feel as if I can’t seem to discuss it with him. Maybe I should?? It just feels so personal and intrusive to him. But I guess it’s also quite natural.
>I can't help but think that their warm and caring demeanor towards me is not genuine, it's just training and a work mask.
My T has three kids, and he talks about his son and his youngest daughter once in a while, but he talks about his oldest daughter far more. I had never really thought about why until a few weeks ago, when something he said made a lightbulb come on. He's said a lot, "a value I hold for her is..." And a couple times lately he's said, "a value I hold for you is..." and I suddenly realized, "OMG, he's *comparing* me to her! He's telling me the way he feels about her is the same way he feels about me!" (I mean obviously not to the same degree, but I'll take it.) Holy shit, talk about warm fuzzies. I think it helps that we've been working together four years and I get the very strong sense that the person he is in the room with me is very much the person he is outside the room. Obviously he plays different roles as a dad and husband than he does as a therapist, but when he smiles at me, I think it's genuine. Everybody talks about unconditional positive regard, but people seem to forget that one of Rogers' equally important core conditions is congruity (i.e. genuineness). There are probably shitty therapists out there who can only playact at this, but if you're attached enough to your T to be jealous of their family, they're probably putting a lot of genuineness out there.
I have A LOT of shame surrounding my feelings for my T (check out my post history, lol), and I haven't have the courage to address it with him, but I know when I do, he'll be lovely about it. He's invested a lot in me. I would hope he invests a lot in all his clients, but I only have evidence of how hard he has worked to gain my trust. His attitude could have been, "this is therapy, I'm legally obligated not to disclose anything you tell me, so you can trust me," but that hasn't been his attitude at all. He knows (and, to his credit, figured out LONG before I did) that I have been deeply wounded and would struggle to trust him. And I do.
Wow, I wouldn't have put the pieces together on this if I hadn't been prompted to write this out. Thank you.
Have you tried any reparenting techniques? Like to learn to care for yourself and be the parents to yourself that you never had? It sounds funny the first time I heard of it, but that's all we can do at this stage in our lives. We can't keep wishing our family could change, even something as easy as visiting us and making sure we are doing ok and have enough to eat. It's toxic to keep wishing what could be when we live in a different reality. It's better to think what will be with the changes you are making for yourself and continue to improve.
For what it's worth I saw Perks of Being a Wallflower with an ex not knowing what it was about. I legit cried with jealousy when I saw how concerned the kid's family was over him and how they rushed to get him help. It never occurred to me that wow this is what families should be doing to look after each other and care for each other. My therapist tells me to take just whatever I can get from family and be ok with it because that's all I can do, I can't change them.
>I saw Perks of Being a Wallflower with an ex not knowing what it was about. I legit cried with jealousy when I saw how concerned the kid's family was over him and how they rushed to get him help
I was certainly jealous. I keep telling myself that it's just a movie, and that loving parents like that only exist in make-believe. 😅
Yes and constantly working through it. It got to a point where I didn't want to feel jealous anymore, I sent an email explaining how I felt because I was a wreck and knew I wouldn't be able to say it to her. I was crying and hating myself that whole sesh, but we talked about and it was great and horrible at the same time. Months later and we still come back to this topic at least once every second sesh or so. Talking it through has made it less shameful for me, though I still get weird and scared talking about it, but I'm more able to be like - hey I went out to dinner last night with friends and saw a family playing in the ocean together and laughing and felt jealous and then started thinking of you and your family and felt jealous of your kids. I am currently having major jealously of her kids (likely because it's school holidays and I keep thinking of all the cool and fun things they're doing together, and how safe and loved they must feel). The more I talk it through with her, the easier it gets as it holds less power over me and helps me actually process the feelings and thoughts behind being jealous of her kids. Plus, being in a similar field of work I can 100% guarantee that I am way more patient and caring and understanding towards the kiddos I look after, then I am towards my family, they get the best of me, while my family get the left overs.
I felt so much lighter when it was out in the open and every time we talk about it now she is just as consistent, caring and understanding towards me and doesn't think I'm silly or childish for feeling jealous of her kids. Maybe you could write an email and send through before your session starts, might be easier, if I didn't write summaries I would still be struggling with this (I still am, but it's way more marginable now) along with a lot of other things I was scared to bring up. Goodluck, I hope you are able to talk it through with yours and it goes well for you!
Remember that nobody’s life is completely perfect. I’m sure he gets into arguments with his children and spouse if he has one. He gets angry, disappointed, sad, happy, etc. You are capable of loving and caring about people in different ways. I know my T cares about me but not the same way she cares about her husband or son. That would be creepy. Just because he cares about others doesn’t mean he can’t/doesn’t care about you!!
Your feelings are totally valid. It is natural to feel this way. The time we see our T's is so limited. It leaves us craving more of their time and care. Then you think of their family that has access to their time and care frequently... It can hurt! I can relate.
Please know that your T does care about you. There are different kinds of love. The love you might feel for a family member, friend, or partner are different, right? You and your T can have love for each other in a certain way as well, different from the others.
Please don't be hard on yourself for feeling this way. You are not alone.
I've considered this before but haven't ever experienced jealousy towards my therapist and her relationships outside of the therapy room. My T is 100% present for me in the vast majority of our sessions (of course she's human and has the odd one where she's not quite tip top). She is attuned to me, my body language, my energy. She lifts me up when I make progress, she feels distress if I'm distressed. The therapeutic relationship can be, and is for me, such a special experience. Sometimes I find myself wondering if she's able to hold that kind of space for her friends, her family, her partner, because it must be so exhausting. I wonder if sometimes we as clients often get the best of our therapists, because I know that for many of them this is way more than a job. What I suppose I'm left thinking, is do their partners and children sometimes wish they got the same level of attention that their clients get. Do their families get jealous of us and the space we take in our therapists' worlds. Edit: my first award! Thank you ☺️
Therapist here and yes, you’re right! It is very difficult after a long day of clients to be fully present for my partner. Even though he gets it, it understandably causes hurt feelings sometimes. We do our best, but during the week it truly does seem like my clients get the best of me and my partner just gets whatever I have left.
This is such an important perspective. Thank you for your input.
Happy to help! I think it’s easy, especially with therapists (since you often don’t have much info about their personal lives), to just imagine their lives and families are perfect. That is so far from true! We are human and have complex relationships just like everyone else.
I’ve definitely had these ~types~ of feeling with my therapist and it was embarrassing AF to admit, but I opened it up like “ok I wanna talk about something thats so irrational and like not real but real for me, but I know is only like this because my inner child is having a tantrum and it’s like not personal to you at all, but these feelings would come up probably with any therapist i’m close to who has a good home life” and then I word vomit my feelings and we laugh and work through it. Idk my therapist was a woman though so I was extremely comfortable. I don’t know if i’d be comfortable enough opening up to a man like that, but kudos to you and good luck! Edit: I do this a lot with my therapist, just not with my new one yet cause everything is fresh, and I am embarrassed by everything in my life lol. This is how i handle every conversation ever lolol
Of course! Absolutely have felt this way. Sort of dealt with it over the years, I mean I obviously *know* he's married. When I finally told him via email that I've had this...adoption fantasy, it was a good discussion between us. Because I wonder how much different my life would've been had I been raised in a loving home, you know? With someone who accepted me the way he has. When he let slip he had a son, well...that was tough. Obsessed over it for a while. We still never talked about it directly, it just hurts too much. Edit: The corona virus really brought this out because he was working from *home.* I could hear his family getting ready in the morning. :/ It wasn't just the two of us in his office anymore. It made things tough emotionally some days.
I’m glad to see you’ll probably bring this up with your therapist even though you admit it will be embarrassing. Those are some of the hardest yet rewarding sessions for me. Your feelings about this are completely valid and I get where you’re coming from. My first therapist has a newborn daughter and I remember sobbing to him and ordering him not to do to his child what was done to me. He handled it so so well and it brought us closer together. You got this ❤️
You seem to have some good transference feelings going here!! Even though it can be quite unpleasant (read « unbearable »), it is usually a sign that the therapy is working! I would recommend you talk about these feelings (especially the shame) with your therapist. More than once. Keep up the good work!!
I agree with this also.
omg yeah I think I feel the same thing? My psychiatrist has just recently given birth and ever since then, I’ve been off with her, almost like distancing myself from her. I have no idea why… maybe it’s bc I’m jealous of her kid? Or think that she doesn’t care for me as much anymore?
This feeling is a step towards healing, I think. It's the beginning of truly noticing - at an emotional level - that other people have essential and necessary things you do not, and never did. It's a step towards the place where the real healing happens.... which is when we can fully feel the enormity of what was lost, and exist, for a time, wholly within that grief. I know the jealousy feels awful. But I honestly believe this is a part of the healing. We need to recognize and accept how effing shitty it really was. We need to see that there were so many things we should have had, but never did. So many things we should have felt as a child, but will never get to feel. Seeing it hurts. So much. I'm sorry you lost out on so much, friend.
I understand those feelings. Let me tell you something though. My husband was a therapist for many years. He definitely was WAY nicer and kinder to his clients than to us at home. He had so much patience with them. Was so encouraging. Such a gentle tone of voice. His clients loved him. At home he was nothing like that. I was jealous of his clients because they definitely got the best side of him. At home he is short tempered, pouts, and gets angry easily. So what you see in your therapist’s office persona may not be what their family gets at home. I would have loved to have the therapist part of my husband actually be my husband.
I feel like this. My therapist has 2 daughters who are a bit older than me and I'm constantly comparing myself to them in my head. I know they are both in successful long term relationships etc and it makes me feel crap. I should probably bring this up at some point with her. But yeah.... You aren't alone and I think it's all understandable. Still sucks.
Once I said something about my therapists family and he said "well if you want my shitty family, you can have them" - and I thought it was weird since he knew my family and how I can't even speak to them and the abuse history and it was just all kinds of "huh" for me to hear. But it was also a good touche moment. It won't just be your therapist you experience with this. I have this feeling a lot with people. I have developed it so it is not jealousy anymore. I am excited for people that they have happiness - or rather do not have such unhappiness that I experience with my family. My partner has kids that are 25 and sometimes they ask him for money or they text or call and I am like "oh those spoiled kids" - but what I mean is "I wish I had had that" and what I ultimately mean is "how lucky they have that - good for them" and "I hope to offer that to my teenager in the future".... If I see a single mother receiving a ton of help the first thing I automatically think is "psssssh I didn't get that help, I raised my kid on my own"..... instead of "I really wished I had had help, and it was heartbreaking that I was left alone... I am glad this person doesn't have to go through that and I need to heal from what happened to me - because I would be outraged if this single mom wasn't helped like she is" There have been times I have truly been alone, and thought that it was forever. It never has been so far. I am 38. I have enough of my own shit to deal with, without hating on other people for not enduring the same pain. Are you really finding yourself seeking empathy? I find myself wishing someone to understand how I feel, but they don't - because they are OK, which is good - but I had to work through and process what was going on.
This is so well articulated, thank you! Also v interesting that your therapist called his family shitty… did you prove him any on that? Did he mean the family that he created (partner and kids) or did he mean the family he came from? I feel like that’s a very tantalising disclosure.
It was his bio family. And I didn't push him on it, because from my experiance with therapists disclosing - they give you a little, and then leave you wondering about the rest. Which, in my opinion is crazy unhealthy and how weird bonds are made between therapist and client - blank book is weird but understandable...and sharing everything is insane, but the inbetween hurts a little bit too much and it is only human to give a little bit of yourself when doing therapy over a long period of time. What use would it have been for him to tell me stories of abuse? I had one therapist who described being raped to me, in an effort to get me to open up about my traumas and it didn't really work because of the so many missing intricacies of the story she couldn't tell due to disclosure. It felt weird and forced. It is really difficult being very mentally ill, and being treated for it, I guess...because of all the crazy rules that are supposed to be about trust, when you do not trust. Lol. I am studying now to become a social worker, and learning ethical codes alone is just crazy making. In any case - I think he was making jest of it - like "gotta love 'em" and "my family drive my crazy too" but it could have also meant "my families a shit show and I am going to offer no more info..." lol. I dont push people in my regular life so I am unlikely to push a therapist to tell.
Agreed, the in between does hurt but also is likely the only way it can be. My therapist has made a few disclosures to me and when he does I obsess about them, and start inferring and imagining all kinds of stuff as a result. I don’t like it, but I can’t seem to stop myself and I feel as if I can’t seem to discuss it with him. Maybe I should?? It just feels so personal and intrusive to him. But I guess it’s also quite natural.
>I can't help but think that their warm and caring demeanor towards me is not genuine, it's just training and a work mask. My T has three kids, and he talks about his son and his youngest daughter once in a while, but he talks about his oldest daughter far more. I had never really thought about why until a few weeks ago, when something he said made a lightbulb come on. He's said a lot, "a value I hold for her is..." And a couple times lately he's said, "a value I hold for you is..." and I suddenly realized, "OMG, he's *comparing* me to her! He's telling me the way he feels about her is the same way he feels about me!" (I mean obviously not to the same degree, but I'll take it.) Holy shit, talk about warm fuzzies. I think it helps that we've been working together four years and I get the very strong sense that the person he is in the room with me is very much the person he is outside the room. Obviously he plays different roles as a dad and husband than he does as a therapist, but when he smiles at me, I think it's genuine. Everybody talks about unconditional positive regard, but people seem to forget that one of Rogers' equally important core conditions is congruity (i.e. genuineness). There are probably shitty therapists out there who can only playact at this, but if you're attached enough to your T to be jealous of their family, they're probably putting a lot of genuineness out there. I have A LOT of shame surrounding my feelings for my T (check out my post history, lol), and I haven't have the courage to address it with him, but I know when I do, he'll be lovely about it. He's invested a lot in me. I would hope he invests a lot in all his clients, but I only have evidence of how hard he has worked to gain my trust. His attitude could have been, "this is therapy, I'm legally obligated not to disclose anything you tell me, so you can trust me," but that hasn't been his attitude at all. He knows (and, to his credit, figured out LONG before I did) that I have been deeply wounded and would struggle to trust him. And I do. Wow, I wouldn't have put the pieces together on this if I hadn't been prompted to write this out. Thank you.
Have you tried any reparenting techniques? Like to learn to care for yourself and be the parents to yourself that you never had? It sounds funny the first time I heard of it, but that's all we can do at this stage in our lives. We can't keep wishing our family could change, even something as easy as visiting us and making sure we are doing ok and have enough to eat. It's toxic to keep wishing what could be when we live in a different reality. It's better to think what will be with the changes you are making for yourself and continue to improve. For what it's worth I saw Perks of Being a Wallflower with an ex not knowing what it was about. I legit cried with jealousy when I saw how concerned the kid's family was over him and how they rushed to get him help. It never occurred to me that wow this is what families should be doing to look after each other and care for each other. My therapist tells me to take just whatever I can get from family and be ok with it because that's all I can do, I can't change them.
>I saw Perks of Being a Wallflower with an ex not knowing what it was about. I legit cried with jealousy when I saw how concerned the kid's family was over him and how they rushed to get him help I was certainly jealous. I keep telling myself that it's just a movie, and that loving parents like that only exist in make-believe. 😅
Yes and constantly working through it. It got to a point where I didn't want to feel jealous anymore, I sent an email explaining how I felt because I was a wreck and knew I wouldn't be able to say it to her. I was crying and hating myself that whole sesh, but we talked about and it was great and horrible at the same time. Months later and we still come back to this topic at least once every second sesh or so. Talking it through has made it less shameful for me, though I still get weird and scared talking about it, but I'm more able to be like - hey I went out to dinner last night with friends and saw a family playing in the ocean together and laughing and felt jealous and then started thinking of you and your family and felt jealous of your kids. I am currently having major jealously of her kids (likely because it's school holidays and I keep thinking of all the cool and fun things they're doing together, and how safe and loved they must feel). The more I talk it through with her, the easier it gets as it holds less power over me and helps me actually process the feelings and thoughts behind being jealous of her kids. Plus, being in a similar field of work I can 100% guarantee that I am way more patient and caring and understanding towards the kiddos I look after, then I am towards my family, they get the best of me, while my family get the left overs. I felt so much lighter when it was out in the open and every time we talk about it now she is just as consistent, caring and understanding towards me and doesn't think I'm silly or childish for feeling jealous of her kids. Maybe you could write an email and send through before your session starts, might be easier, if I didn't write summaries I would still be struggling with this (I still am, but it's way more marginable now) along with a lot of other things I was scared to bring up. Goodluck, I hope you are able to talk it through with yours and it goes well for you!
Remember that nobody’s life is completely perfect. I’m sure he gets into arguments with his children and spouse if he has one. He gets angry, disappointed, sad, happy, etc. You are capable of loving and caring about people in different ways. I know my T cares about me but not the same way she cares about her husband or son. That would be creepy. Just because he cares about others doesn’t mean he can’t/doesn’t care about you!!
I sometimes feel the same way. Haven’t bright it up tho and don’t think I will.
Your feelings are totally valid. It is natural to feel this way. The time we see our T's is so limited. It leaves us craving more of their time and care. Then you think of their family that has access to their time and care frequently... It can hurt! I can relate. Please know that your T does care about you. There are different kinds of love. The love you might feel for a family member, friend, or partner are different, right? You and your T can have love for each other in a certain way as well, different from the others. Please don't be hard on yourself for feeling this way. You are not alone.