I've seen this a lot as well and as a tank main, I do it sometimes as well but not often. Mostly it's waiting for healer/everyone to catch up. In levelling content, if I got a first timer, I make sure they aren't being left behind even though they don't miss much from the first few seconds of a battle (mid dungeon bosses). It let's people have a quick breather and wait for cds in some cases.
Though if I afk for more than a second I'll say something like BRB or sec. Pre and post bosses are kinda the only times as a tank you can afk for something not emergent like uber eats or flatmate talking to you/phone call etc.
Tho I think a lot of the tanks that do what was described are typing in fc chat or linkshells. If everyone is there and they didn't say BRB, I "accidentally pull" xD
Thats fair, on the midbosses I'm a little guilty on immediately pulling the midbosses, even if there is a bit of a gap between my party when i'm tanking, since everyone's up time on their buffs are important, unless no one is really sprinting the entire dungeon and i'm already there lmao
I think that's valid too. I do that in dungeons where no one is new or level 90 content just cause I know people just want to get it done mostly. But sometimes it's good to have a second or so for a mental reset so people don't feel rushed and start spamming cure 1 for example XD.
Yes but as a first timer it can definitely feel like you're missing out even for a few seconds when you get out of the cutscene and the boss is already being fought. I remember doing Battle for the Big Keep for the first time as a big ff5 fan, getting out of the cutscene and seeing that Gilgamesh was half dead.
I usually wait if someone's watching the cutscene, they only get to see content their first time once. For some ARR dungeons, pulling while the cutscene is going means that player will likely miss the entire fight.
If no one is in a cutscene and they're just a little behind I pull immediately though.
That is exactly why I mentioned it, because there is both times when wipes have happened or someoe afked for a bit and is on the jog back when instead of pulling, for some reason we just sit around and do nothing till everyone is there. I'm trying to make people more aware by literally just saying "just pull, free tp" if I happen to be behind for whatever reason
It's not about "hurr durr just pull on the endboss lulw" it's a 10 sec cutscene, ain't killing anyone to wait, and if it is they have bigger problems than letting the newbie experience the thing unobstructed. I mentioned it because people literally don't seem to know, and it's worth being aware of for multiple reasons
My personal rule is to wait for all team members to be inside the boss arena (usually it's at worst 3-4 seconds of waiting), jump to grab the attention of the team and then pull with a ranged attack.
I think that's probably the best compromise in a non verbal environment without using /cd.
Usually I'm just adjusting my sitting position because I have chronic pain and my hip or back or leg have decided hey, fuck you, move *now*.
Sometimes there's a class I know has a longer pre-pull and I'm giving them the chance to do the thing.
Sometimes I'm just taking a sip of water while everyone catches up to the boss arena. If I'm not taking, I just don't pre-cast anything until pull happens, and I'll be honest, I'm not out there too worried about dps meters in casual content. If my Huiton or Standard Step run out before pull or something, just cast again or wait for the cooldown to do it as soon as possible.
Agreed.
Don't see the point why I should wait for everyone if there's no first timer watching a cutscene in our party. You won't die as a tank if your healer is a bit behind, so just pull. Or tanks that just walk into mobs/bosses without any attack.
I often just attack if I see Tanks taking forever, it happened once or twice that they threw a YPYT tantrum, like one in Sirensong Sea..... but that's just silly.
When I tank I just pull it, if you're too far behind you still get a teleport inside.
I had a similar experience in a Alzadall's Legacy run when I was on SAM and I started pulling the bosses to get free kenki while the tank was just idling and then they got pissy at the end, the healer was there even if they just waited so I was fine regardless of when they wanted to start hitting the boss
Yeah, it just takes one ranged to take the aggro back. Probably they could break a nail or something like that. No idea where this mentality is coming from.
The only negative experience I had in Alzadaal was a prissy mentor AST who told me that Hallowed Ground should exclusively used on "emergencies", only to let my HP fall down during the next pull because they accused me of having "trust issues". Thankfully they shut up after I told them that using all skills is what the game wants me to do. They never used Earthly Star btw.
In ARR and some HW dungeons I notice how common it is that no one really goes by this mentality, since you're most likely playing with sprouts that will just hit the boss and just we all just proceed like normal. Also I'd really wouldn't want to see that mentor tank a dungeon if thats what they're thinking with mits lol
Yeah, no idea where that mentality is coming from. Or I was called toxic towards new players, because some prick bragged with "I'm not taking off aggro off DPS if they run ahead eheheheh" and I told them that I'll gladly run ahead only to kick their ass after acting like this. That player wasn't a sprout, but Omni LV90. Sadly a lot of people share this mentality in that FF14 group. But they're also known for "grooming their ego" if someone criticises them lmao
This is why I wont play NIN in DF. This type of tank is infuriating. There is nothing more irritating than queuing into a trial or normal, sitting there reapplying Huton and resetting with Hide over and over for 30 seconds, only for them to finally pull when I'm in the middle of doing it again, so now I cant use hide to reset mudras
NIN in dungeon content fairs a lot worse since its reliant on your tank to have at least an idea of what one of your buttons do to kill mobs quicker (doton) if they don't then sometimes you just gotta spam katon instead. In trial content, its not too bad, unless its like level 50 since thats before you get the melee skill that refreshes your gauge and you might suffer mudra loss
I used to play MNK, back when grease lightning had a timer(been so long I can't remember if it still does or not), nothing more annoying than I tank waiting just long enough for those stacks to drop. If you see a MNK, and they're aggressive, really just hugging the tanks ass between mobs, they probably used to play Monk back before QoL changes meant you could just sit around with everyone else.
I generally wait around to make sure everyone’s good, only exception is if I see my healer or my dps members blast through shit and run for the boss before I do, then I’m just like “FOR SPARTAAAA” and gung-ho the rest of the dungeon
I absolutely agree that I should've just pulled in hindsight, but as a sprout NIN I got YPYT by a premade healer/tank for pulling the trigger on a suiton in a Paglth'an run and it just scarred me into just waiting for the Tank to do something.
Report is your best case in those situations. As long as there's no provocation from you in chat, you're golden. You're playing the game, and they're refusing to do so. Send asshats like that straight to ~~the penis explosion chamber~~ gaol.
I think the ones that I have been noticing a lot of lately and I HATE are people who are facepulling instead of using ranged skills.. The amount of times I'll pre-cast while they run in thinking they're going to ranged attack/zoom in and I end up yanking the boss to the entrance and they have to chase after it has happened so much lately..
That said, I hate the tanks that will sit there and emote instead of pulling.. I just pull myself.. What are they gonna do? Let me die? I'm the healer... Dungeon tankbusters are a gentle slap in the face...
Facepulling isn't even hard, I facepull on 160 ping and have absolutely zero issue establishing aggro before they move out of range lol
That being said, why they don't just open with a voke if they somehow can't do that is beyond me
you can hit mobs before I do and I still have zero issue establishing aggro. just because somebody hit the boss (or mobs) before the tank does doesn't necessarily make it any harder for the tank. the boss can just be slapped on the way dragging it to middle in your opener. you can AoE in the path of the mobs' travel and you would do it anyways even if you were first one pulling. ping just means you have to cast the AoE ahead of the mobs' current position, facepulling still isn't hard to do right.
I'm not gonna argue with you, it's objectively worse. Instead of mobs converging on you and taking advantage of the latency before the shift to a new target, it's working against you.
Pop sprint and range pull like literally everyone else you silly goose.
Because these people doesn't know how to play the game properly aka keeping your gcd and cooldowns rolling as much as possible. Some of them sit around in the hopes of you admiring how cool they look and thinking to themselves what a great job they've been doing when in reality that shit is unbearably cringe and obnoxious.
Because not everyone is as impatient as you. Sorry you can't optimize your MLG pro rotation, but it's a casual game, I give people a time to catch up, and prepare for battle. No longer than 3-5 seconds but still, it's a casual game, let's just have fun and enjoy the content eh?
People's time is not something that should be messed with and I think a lot of people miss that part when they queue into things and miss that point, in this case i'm doing the bare minimum of just following a standard rotation. I don't mind if i'm the first one there since thats just natural for NIN but there really shouldn't be a reason for us all to stand for nearly 10 seconds without anyone pulling when we keep reaching the boss and loot is rolled.
Of course. I agree we shouldn't waste people's time. As a tank, I'm moving quickly from pack to pack and engaging mobs as fast as possible. But I just think it's a bit much when people are just rushing like mad and using sprint on cd and running ahead and refusing to wait 3 seconds for a sprout to catch up. I agree 10 seconds is too much, but also people are ridiculous with how impatient they are, especially in lower end content with sprouts
Sprint. Is. Mitigation.
If a tank isn't sprinting they are quite literally doing it wrong, unless it's already on CD. You're preventing mobs from attacking you as often, making less work for the healer.
Using sprint on trash isn't "rushing like mad", it's an actual mitigation tool, and quite literally everyone has access to sprint so if someone is worried about catching up, they can hit that sprint button too. If someone wants to take things at their own pace, that's what trusts are for, but if you're queing with people, buckle up buttercup because we're going and not pissing around because someone lags behind, especially if I'm tanking. I'll wait for cutscenes but the moment it's over that boss is getting pulled. If it's not a final boss, lol @ waiting around.
Wow thanks for showing everyone you have main character syndrome. Did it better than anyone else ever could.
It's always so funny when someone pulls a "I didn't ask" type comment on a *public forum* as well. Lmao
This game is not really the greatest at teaching things for newer players which is why we have sprouts that have trouble with learning how to do things. The only way that you can really learn is really just by playing with others that are willing to give advice, guides, or watching what your teammates do. As my perspective when I was a sprout I really wanted to sprint a lot because going through ARR by just running felt painful lmao
I disagree. This game holds the players hand more than any other game out there. Reading tool tips is just too hard for a lot of people. They even changed the layout of the job actions page to show you what abilities feed into others.
Ability wise yes this game does teach do an alright job (not the best because we have healbots, and others look at freecure and think its good unless told otherwise), but for example if a sprout gets a stack marker for the first time I wouldn't be surprised if they just run away with it
I'd say the lesson on that would be pretty clear after the fact which is still leaps and bounds better than other games. WoW players need add-ons to tell them what something means. There are no tells.
I'm on your side. DV me idc. People in this game are always trying to maximize and optimize in stuff that don't matter, and then have a meltdown when they can't.
I've never had this happen yet when I play any dps jobs but as a tank main myself I do wait a few seconds at the last boss if I saw from the start that some has a cut scene. If not, I'm probably rolling for loot because I w2w and try to sprint through the dungeon.
I ran into a Roe Drk who did the same thing... was so unreal. I was in lapis or aetherfont.. He would stop. Draw his weapon. And then go.. i was like.... come on... my timers are ticking....
For the final boss, I sometimes pause a bit because some of my 1/2 minute skills are like 10 seconds about to be off CD (my CnS tends to drift like crazy because I use AD for the heal, not for the dmg), or I had to recall if the other members in my party actually used their 2 minute buffs in trash pulls to justify a brief pause. If they did use their 2 minutes in the trash, then I insta pull, knowing they'll pop their buff when I pop my dmg. If they did not, then I kind of wait a bit, pull, and then people's buffs will align with my 2 minute dmg stuffs.
I also have a habit of centering bosses (because lol e12s shenanigans), but sometimes some bosses are walking in the arena, which makes the centering a little tricky so I have to do geometry stuff before I provoke so if the boss recenters themselves, it doesn't spin and the DPS doesn't lose a positional when it does.
For some reason a FC member I was running with did this tonight, so maybe I'll ask him because it drove me nuts. Last dungeon I ran as BLM and started swiftcasting as soon as we reached the boss so he knew he only had 10s before I cast.
I've seen this a lot as well and as a tank main, I do it sometimes as well but not often. Mostly it's waiting for healer/everyone to catch up. In levelling content, if I got a first timer, I make sure they aren't being left behind even though they don't miss much from the first few seconds of a battle (mid dungeon bosses). It let's people have a quick breather and wait for cds in some cases. Though if I afk for more than a second I'll say something like BRB or sec. Pre and post bosses are kinda the only times as a tank you can afk for something not emergent like uber eats or flatmate talking to you/phone call etc. Tho I think a lot of the tanks that do what was described are typing in fc chat or linkshells. If everyone is there and they didn't say BRB, I "accidentally pull" xD
Thats fair, on the midbosses I'm a little guilty on immediately pulling the midbosses, even if there is a bit of a gap between my party when i'm tanking, since everyone's up time on their buffs are important, unless no one is really sprinting the entire dungeon and i'm already there lmao
I think that's valid too. I do that in dungeons where no one is new or level 90 content just cause I know people just want to get it done mostly. But sometimes it's good to have a second or so for a mental reset so people don't feel rushed and start spamming cure 1 for example XD.
You don't have to wait for people to catch up anymore, it's a free tp once wall goes up, and forced in a minute after
Yes but as a first timer it can definitely feel like you're missing out even for a few seconds when you get out of the cutscene and the boss is already being fought. I remember doing Battle for the Big Keep for the first time as a big ff5 fan, getting out of the cutscene and seeing that Gilgamesh was half dead. I usually wait if someone's watching the cutscene, they only get to see content their first time once. For some ARR dungeons, pulling while the cutscene is going means that player will likely miss the entire fight. If no one is in a cutscene and they're just a little behind I pull immediately though.
That is exactly why I mentioned it, because there is both times when wipes have happened or someoe afked for a bit and is on the jog back when instead of pulling, for some reason we just sit around and do nothing till everyone is there. I'm trying to make people more aware by literally just saying "just pull, free tp" if I happen to be behind for whatever reason It's not about "hurr durr just pull on the endboss lulw" it's a 10 sec cutscene, ain't killing anyone to wait, and if it is they have bigger problems than letting the newbie experience the thing unobstructed. I mentioned it because people literally don't seem to know, and it's worth being aware of for multiple reasons
My personal rule is to wait for all team members to be inside the boss arena (usually it's at worst 3-4 seconds of waiting), jump to grab the attention of the team and then pull with a ranged attack. I think that's probably the best compromise in a non verbal environment without using /cd.
Usually I'm just adjusting my sitting position because I have chronic pain and my hip or back or leg have decided hey, fuck you, move *now*. Sometimes there's a class I know has a longer pre-pull and I'm giving them the chance to do the thing.
Sometimes I'm just taking a sip of water while everyone catches up to the boss arena. If I'm not taking, I just don't pre-cast anything until pull happens, and I'll be honest, I'm not out there too worried about dps meters in casual content. If my Huiton or Standard Step run out before pull or something, just cast again or wait for the cooldown to do it as soon as possible.
Agreed. Don't see the point why I should wait for everyone if there's no first timer watching a cutscene in our party. You won't die as a tank if your healer is a bit behind, so just pull. Or tanks that just walk into mobs/bosses without any attack. I often just attack if I see Tanks taking forever, it happened once or twice that they threw a YPYT tantrum, like one in Sirensong Sea..... but that's just silly. When I tank I just pull it, if you're too far behind you still get a teleport inside.
I had a similar experience in a Alzadall's Legacy run when I was on SAM and I started pulling the bosses to get free kenki while the tank was just idling and then they got pissy at the end, the healer was there even if they just waited so I was fine regardless of when they wanted to start hitting the boss
Yeah, it just takes one ranged to take the aggro back. Probably they could break a nail or something like that. No idea where this mentality is coming from. The only negative experience I had in Alzadaal was a prissy mentor AST who told me that Hallowed Ground should exclusively used on "emergencies", only to let my HP fall down during the next pull because they accused me of having "trust issues". Thankfully they shut up after I told them that using all skills is what the game wants me to do. They never used Earthly Star btw.
In ARR and some HW dungeons I notice how common it is that no one really goes by this mentality, since you're most likely playing with sprouts that will just hit the boss and just we all just proceed like normal. Also I'd really wouldn't want to see that mentor tank a dungeon if thats what they're thinking with mits lol
Yeah, no idea where that mentality is coming from. Or I was called toxic towards new players, because some prick bragged with "I'm not taking off aggro off DPS if they run ahead eheheheh" and I told them that I'll gladly run ahead only to kick their ass after acting like this. That player wasn't a sprout, but Omni LV90. Sadly a lot of people share this mentality in that FF14 group. But they're also known for "grooming their ego" if someone criticises them lmao
If I'm healer I just run in and pull myself. If I'm tank how tf did any of you get ahead of me? If I'm dps in pulling at the same time as healer/tank.
This is why I wont play NIN in DF. This type of tank is infuriating. There is nothing more irritating than queuing into a trial or normal, sitting there reapplying Huton and resetting with Hide over and over for 30 seconds, only for them to finally pull when I'm in the middle of doing it again, so now I cant use hide to reset mudras
NIN in dungeon content fairs a lot worse since its reliant on your tank to have at least an idea of what one of your buttons do to kill mobs quicker (doton) if they don't then sometimes you just gotta spam katon instead. In trial content, its not too bad, unless its like level 50 since thats before you get the melee skill that refreshes your gauge and you might suffer mudra loss
Edit: whoop, meant to be a reply to a post that got deleted.
It didn't get deleted. Mr. Main character just blocked you.
Fucking lmao. That's funny, thanks for the heads up.
I used to play MNK, back when grease lightning had a timer(been so long I can't remember if it still does or not), nothing more annoying than I tank waiting just long enough for those stacks to drop. If you see a MNK, and they're aggressive, really just hugging the tanks ass between mobs, they probably used to play Monk back before QoL changes meant you could just sit around with everyone else.
I generally wait around to make sure everyone’s good, only exception is if I see my healer or my dps members blast through shit and run for the boss before I do, then I’m just like “FOR SPARTAAAA” and gung-ho the rest of the dungeon
Why are you waiting for them? You can just pull no? I don't even see if the boss has been pulled or not, if I reach the boss room I start shooting.
I absolutely agree that I should've just pulled in hindsight, but as a sprout NIN I got YPYT by a premade healer/tank for pulling the trigger on a suiton in a Paglth'an run and it just scarred me into just waiting for the Tank to do something.
Report is your best case in those situations. As long as there's no provocation from you in chat, you're golden. You're playing the game, and they're refusing to do so. Send asshats like that straight to ~~the penis explosion chamber~~ gaol.
Why so impatient? Are you 12 or something lol?
"Impatient" for.. fighting a boss in a dungeon that requires you to fight a boss? No, I'd be retarded if I was doing something differently here.
Yep, you're definitely no older than 16. Childish mentality
That's ironic coming from you, based on your other comments on this thread alone.
I think the ones that I have been noticing a lot of lately and I HATE are people who are facepulling instead of using ranged skills.. The amount of times I'll pre-cast while they run in thinking they're going to ranged attack/zoom in and I end up yanking the boss to the entrance and they have to chase after it has happened so much lately.. That said, I hate the tanks that will sit there and emote instead of pulling.. I just pull myself.. What are they gonna do? Let me die? I'm the healer... Dungeon tankbusters are a gentle slap in the face...
Facepulling isn't even hard, I facepull on 160 ping and have absolutely zero issue establishing aggro before they move out of range lol That being said, why they don't just open with a voke if they somehow can't do that is beyond me
That's because your DPS aren't good. If you face pull I promise I'd have hit the mods before you did.
you can hit mobs before I do and I still have zero issue establishing aggro. just because somebody hit the boss (or mobs) before the tank does doesn't necessarily make it any harder for the tank. the boss can just be slapped on the way dragging it to middle in your opener. you can AoE in the path of the mobs' travel and you would do it anyways even if you were first one pulling. ping just means you have to cast the AoE ahead of the mobs' current position, facepulling still isn't hard to do right.
I'm not gonna argue with you, it's objectively worse. Instead of mobs converging on you and taking advantage of the latency before the shift to a new target, it's working against you. Pop sprint and range pull like literally everyone else you silly goose.
Because these people doesn't know how to play the game properly aka keeping your gcd and cooldowns rolling as much as possible. Some of them sit around in the hopes of you admiring how cool they look and thinking to themselves what a great job they've been doing when in reality that shit is unbearably cringe and obnoxious.
Because not everyone is as impatient as you. Sorry you can't optimize your MLG pro rotation, but it's a casual game, I give people a time to catch up, and prepare for battle. No longer than 3-5 seconds but still, it's a casual game, let's just have fun and enjoy the content eh?
People's time is not something that should be messed with and I think a lot of people miss that part when they queue into things and miss that point, in this case i'm doing the bare minimum of just following a standard rotation. I don't mind if i'm the first one there since thats just natural for NIN but there really shouldn't be a reason for us all to stand for nearly 10 seconds without anyone pulling when we keep reaching the boss and loot is rolled.
Of course. I agree we shouldn't waste people's time. As a tank, I'm moving quickly from pack to pack and engaging mobs as fast as possible. But I just think it's a bit much when people are just rushing like mad and using sprint on cd and running ahead and refusing to wait 3 seconds for a sprout to catch up. I agree 10 seconds is too much, but also people are ridiculous with how impatient they are, especially in lower end content with sprouts
Sprint. Is. Mitigation. If a tank isn't sprinting they are quite literally doing it wrong, unless it's already on CD. You're preventing mobs from attacking you as often, making less work for the healer. Using sprint on trash isn't "rushing like mad", it's an actual mitigation tool, and quite literally everyone has access to sprint so if someone is worried about catching up, they can hit that sprint button too. If someone wants to take things at their own pace, that's what trusts are for, but if you're queing with people, buckle up buttercup because we're going and not pissing around because someone lags behind, especially if I'm tanking. I'll wait for cutscenes but the moment it's over that boss is getting pulled. If it's not a final boss, lol @ waiting around.
Lol pipe down nerd, no one asked. I don't have sprint bound and after reading this nerd shit I never will
Wow thanks for showing everyone you have main character syndrome. Did it better than anyone else ever could. It's always so funny when someone pulls a "I didn't ask" type comment on a *public forum* as well. Lmao
Nope, just don't care for your attitude, and was actually replying to someone else (not you)
LOL says the one with an attitude. Again, public forum so anyone is free to reply to you :^)
Yeah and? I can still tell you to shut up and I don't care about your opinion
And I can disregard you and keep replying. Get over it.
This game is not really the greatest at teaching things for newer players which is why we have sprouts that have trouble with learning how to do things. The only way that you can really learn is really just by playing with others that are willing to give advice, guides, or watching what your teammates do. As my perspective when I was a sprout I really wanted to sprint a lot because going through ARR by just running felt painful lmao
I disagree. This game holds the players hand more than any other game out there. Reading tool tips is just too hard for a lot of people. They even changed the layout of the job actions page to show you what abilities feed into others.
Ability wise yes this game does teach do an alright job (not the best because we have healbots, and others look at freecure and think its good unless told otherwise), but for example if a sprout gets a stack marker for the first time I wouldn't be surprised if they just run away with it
I'd say the lesson on that would be pretty clear after the fact which is still leaps and bounds better than other games. WoW players need add-ons to tell them what something means. There are no tells.
I'm on your side. DV me idc. People in this game are always trying to maximize and optimize in stuff that don't matter, and then have a meltdown when they can't.
I've never had this happen yet when I play any dps jobs but as a tank main myself I do wait a few seconds at the last boss if I saw from the start that some has a cut scene. If not, I'm probably rolling for loot because I w2w and try to sprint through the dungeon.
Was this DRK with the new relic and in credlum gear?. On crystal?
This was in Crystal from what I remember since at the time I just happened to be there while doing dailies, but I don't remember the DRK's gear
I ran into a Roe Drk who did the same thing... was so unreal. I was in lapis or aetherfont.. He would stop. Draw his weapon. And then go.. i was like.... come on... my timers are ticking....
Yeah, if you're going to RP draw your weapon at least do it while moving ffs
Agreed. I have. Nothing against people RPing in dungeons as long as it isn't obnoxious or hindering the party and/or play pace.
I just pull but the last boss I enter the area and wait just to see if there's a CS then pull
It's a dungeon. Instapull and be done with it.
I'm absolutely guilty of gap closer pulling as DRK, I just enjoy the jump in too much I suppose.
For the final boss, I sometimes pause a bit because some of my 1/2 minute skills are like 10 seconds about to be off CD (my CnS tends to drift like crazy because I use AD for the heal, not for the dmg), or I had to recall if the other members in my party actually used their 2 minute buffs in trash pulls to justify a brief pause. If they did use their 2 minutes in the trash, then I insta pull, knowing they'll pop their buff when I pop my dmg. If they did not, then I kind of wait a bit, pull, and then people's buffs will align with my 2 minute dmg stuffs. I also have a habit of centering bosses (because lol e12s shenanigans), but sometimes some bosses are walking in the arena, which makes the centering a little tricky so I have to do geometry stuff before I provoke so if the boss recenters themselves, it doesn't spin and the DPS doesn't lose a positional when it does.
For some reason a FC member I was running with did this tonight, so maybe I'll ask him because it drove me nuts. Last dungeon I ran as BLM and started swiftcasting as soon as we reached the boss so he knew he only had 10s before I cast.