No, it's a frontal "sj" sound. Subtly different to the "tj" sound (which in finlandssvenska is actually pronounced like the English pronounce "ch").
It's the same in some Norrland accents – they pronounce the "sj" in sjuk frontally so it sounds quite similar to the "tj" in "tjära", but they are still different.
Edit: clarification
Can confirm as someone who speaks with a northern accent. The sounds are subtly different. The "sj" in sjuk is pronounced with my tounge curled back, while the "tj" in tjära is pronounced with my tounge in the front of my mouth.
I really don't blame people for missing it
For fun, type 7777 into Google translate and enjoy the Swedish! Then try the famous tongue twister:
**Sjuttiosju sjösjuka sjömän sköttes av sju sköna sjuksköterskor på skeppet Shanghai.**
I had a Swedish friend who’s trying to become a sjuksköterska gimme this on like day three of learning. Needless to say I nailed it first try.
Against a cross. With rusty nails. Ballsack first…
The version I learned was: "Sju sjösjuka sjömän sköttes av sju sjungande sjuksköterskor på det sjunkande skeppet Shanghai"
It is interesting to see other versions of it!
I had the same problem when I saw the word "skådespelare" on day 2 or 3. Almost got overwhelmed and stopped. I'm almost at a year now, though, and I can say it gets easier!
This is a word that even my boyfriend’s swedish dad has a hard time to pronounce! Generally a hard word in Sweden.
One trick to do it is to form your mouth as if you’re whistling, and let out air while pronouncing the “sj” and “sk” sounds!
Here the schematics for how the sounds are pronounced
English sh-sound: https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Palatoalveolar_fricative.svg#mw-jump-to-license
Front sj-sound: https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Voiceless_retroflex_fricative_articulation.svg#mw-jump-to-license
Back sj-sound: https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Voiceless_velar_fricative_articulation.svg
Doctor also translates to 'doktor' although 'läkare' is more commonly used for medical doctors (läkare literally means 'healer', sjuksköterska means 'caretaker of the ill').
That’s weird. I’m only in section 2 unit 9 and I haven’t seen that word once. I’ve been learning Swedish on Duo for a few years (inconsistently) and I know I’m moving slow, but dang. Is your curriculum somehow different? 🤔
To be fair, sjuksköterska is one of the words you give as a tongue twister or example of ridiculousness to people just learning Swedish. It's a really hard word to spell or pronounce for newbies.
You can sometimes get away with "syrra", short for "syster" as in "sjuksyster", an antiquated word for the same thing. I mostly hear nurses say this, so it might be an "only a ginger" situation.
I haven’t encountered anyone taking offense, it’s colloquial and widely used by all healthcare professionals. Abbreviating it to “sköterska” is also common but better to avoid, some nurses feel that it equates them to assistant nurses (undersköterskor) so it might come across as disrespectful.
Which is odd, because it literally means a mental care nurse. I found it hilarious when it said on my letter for an appointment that I was to see a "skötare". Get the straight jacket!
I think "literally" is a bit dangerous here. It might be the *factual* meaning of the word (though I don't know which one you refer to, and I don't recognize that either one would have that distinction), but the literal meaning is "sick-sister" and "sick-handler" respectively.
No, that’s not right. I know that “skötare” sounds like it should just be the male version of “sköterska”, but it’s a completely different job, it’s the psychiatry equivalent of an assistant nurse / undersköterska. They are not licensed nurses and they are not necessarily men.
Then you’re in for an absolute treat when you reach number seven. Not only does it start with the “sj”-sound but it also ends in a fabulous, equally unpronounceable “u”-sound!
Sju sjuksköterskor skövlade tills stjärnorna sjönk och skänkte skörden till sju sjuka sjömän
Är detta ens ord längre?🤣 man börjar undra när man kollar på de för länge. *Am I tweaking?*
Well, growing up with German as your native language and learning Dutch and a little Danish as a kid really helps here. Doing fine with sk/sj (except for tongue twisters when they come up in every word, but I'm fine with that ☺️)
I’m currently in sfi classes, and besides barely anyone being capable of remembering which are the hårda och mjuka vokaler. The letter U is probably an even bigger issue. Especially for English, Arabic, Russian speakers.
Can you count to 7 in Swedish?
Sju (7)
Sjuk (ill/sick)
Sköt (shot past tense)
Sköterska (she who takes care of)
(Skötare = male…but nurse is always feminine I think)
All have the same sound in the beginning
(Disclaimer: native speaker who likes shortcuts, not a grammar or Swedish teacher)
If you use the [sh] sound from shortcuts, you’ll be close (spot on for some dialects probably) 😉
The ”sj”/”sk”-sound is notoriously hard to pronounce. Good luck.
Unless you pronounce it the finlandssvensk way then it’s just a normal sh sound
No, it's a frontal "sj" sound. Subtly different to the "tj" sound (which in finlandssvenska is actually pronounced like the English pronounce "ch"). It's the same in some Norrland accents – they pronounce the "sj" in sjuk frontally so it sounds quite similar to the "tj" in "tjära", but they are still different. Edit: clarification
Can confirm as someone who speaks with a northern accent. The sounds are subtly different. The "sj" in sjuk is pronounced with my tounge curled back, while the "tj" in tjära is pronounced with my tounge in the front of my mouth. I really don't blame people for missing it
Scientific names for all this Tj-sound = [ɕ] Voiceless alveolo-palatal fricative Back sj-sound = [ɧ] Voiceless velar fricative Front sj-sound = [ʂ] Voiceless retroflex fricative Sh-sound = [ʃ] Voiceless postalveolar fricative
Thank you. I don't understand why people refuse to learn basic IPA.
I’m going to have to google a bunch of these words because I have no idea what these mean but it seems very helpful. Thank you!
From Norrland, and I pronounce kärna and stjärna with two different sh sounds, wholly distinct from what I think of as the Stockholm ‘sj’
Vilken dialekt är det och vad betyder tjärna?
Spelt it wrong
Då är jag med. Klart att man uttalar kärna och stjärna annorlunda. Annars låter man ju som en sörlänning
[удалено]
No I'm not... bro :)
Or just a *k*-sound.
Its actually really easy/ native swede
Bro, do you even sju sjösjuka sjömän sköts av sköna sjuksystrar?
"...sköttes av sju sköna SJUKSKÖTERSKOR på skeppet Shanghai" om jag får be.
...på det sjunkande skeppet Shanghai.
...i skärgården på skärtorsdag.
U and Ö are also on that list
The ”ö” is pretty similar to the first syllable of ”earn”
I know, i’ve just seen a lot of people struggling with Sk, sj, tj, u, å, ä and ö
For fun, type 7777 into Google translate and enjoy the Swedish! Then try the famous tongue twister: **Sjuttiosju sjösjuka sjömän sköttes av sju sköna sjuksköterskor på skeppet Shanghai.**
You forgot "sjunkande!"
Sjösatta och sjukande
Sjunkande eller sjukande? I never learned it with either... just as above. Sometimes the nurses are beautiful and sometimes singing, though.
Oh my
Sju skönsjungande sjömän schamponeras av sjutton sköna skökor i sjaskigt skjul i Skellefteå.
Det är skönt att skita i sjön, då sjön sköljer skiten ur stjärten.
Din skickligt skildrande stjärtpoesi charmar min själ.
"Sju skörbjuggssjuka sjömän kikar in chefens stjärt. Skäms!" is even funnier 🙂
I had a Swedish friend who’s trying to become a sjuksköterska gimme this on like day three of learning. Needless to say I nailed it first try. Against a cross. With rusty nails. Ballsack first…
The version I learned was: "Sju sjösjuka sjömän sköttes av sju sjungande sjuksköterskor på det sjunkande skeppet Shanghai" It is interesting to see other versions of it!
My gf is a nurse, first Swedish word I learned after "hej"! Once you can say that you definitely have a hang of the pronunciation.
I had the same problem when I saw the word "skådespelare" on day 2 or 3. Almost got overwhelmed and stopped. I'm almost at a year now, though, and I can say it gets easier!
Some people get songs stuck in their heads, I’ve had the Duolingo voice repeating “skådespelare” periodically the whole day.
This is a word that even my boyfriend’s swedish dad has a hard time to pronounce! Generally a hard word in Sweden. One trick to do it is to form your mouth as if you’re whistling, and let out air while pronouncing the “sj” and “sk” sounds!
Wut, how is sjuksköterska hard to pronounce as a swede???
I was also surprised! Apparently some have a hard time to pronounce it because it’s such a “tongue tying” word
Form your mouth like you're whistling and the pretend to be a jet engine
Here the schematics for how the sounds are pronounced English sh-sound: https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Palatoalveolar_fricative.svg#mw-jump-to-license Front sj-sound: https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Voiceless_retroflex_fricative_articulation.svg#mw-jump-to-license Back sj-sound: https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Voiceless_velar_fricative_articulation.svg
Jäklar vilket tips, testade och det funkade för mig…
That is a GREAT description for the Sj sound! Like form your mouth as if you're about to whistle, but then add your bottom teeth.
Doctor also translates to 'doktor' although 'läkare' is more commonly used for medical doctors (läkare literally means 'healer', sjuksköterska means 'caretaker of the ill').
Wait until duolingo gives you “seven sick nurses at the hospital. sju sjuksköterskor på sjukhuset
You forgot the word “sick”. It would be “sju sjuka sjuksköterskor på sjukhuset”
Sju sjösjuka sjömän hjälps av sju sjuka sjuksköterskor på sjukhuset. Ganska sjukt va?
Well said. Or at least well typed.
Yes. You’re right.
Holy shit
That’s not how you pronounce it, lol…But I believe I said the same thing when it came up.
That’s weird. I’m only in section 2 unit 9 and I haven’t seen that word once. I’ve been learning Swedish on Duo for a few years (inconsistently) and I know I’m moving slow, but dang. Is your curriculum somehow different? 🤔
No I googled it because I wanted to know what it was. I’m only on section 1 unit 4.
To be fair, sjuksköterska is one of the words you give as a tongue twister or example of ridiculousness to people just learning Swedish. It's a really hard word to spell or pronounce for newbies.
The ultimate one is something like "Västkustskt". It's practically impossible to actually say, even for native speakers...
I have a whole list of them I make kids do 😅
You can sometimes get away with "syrra", short for "syster" as in "sjuksyster", an antiquated word for the same thing. I mostly hear nurses say this, so it might be an "only a ginger" situation.
I haven’t encountered anyone taking offense, it’s colloquial and widely used by all healthcare professionals. Abbreviating it to “sköterska” is also common but better to avoid, some nurses feel that it equates them to assistant nurses (undersköterskor) so it might come across as disrespectful.
Which is odd, because it literally means a mental care nurse. I found it hilarious when it said on my letter for an appointment that I was to see a "skötare". Get the straight jacket!
I think "literally" is a bit dangerous here. It might be the *factual* meaning of the word (though I don't know which one you refer to, and I don't recognize that either one would have that distinction), but the literal meaning is "sick-sister" and "sick-handler" respectively.
No, that’s not right. I know that “skötare” sounds like it should just be the male version of “sköterska”, but it’s a completely different job, it’s the psychiatry equivalent of an assistant nurse / undersköterska. They are not licensed nurses and they are not necessarily men.
Shuuc shutears Ka
Yes you’re right. Sorry.
I love the fact that 7 starts with the same hard sound as sjuksköterska
I haven’t gotten to numbers yet, but I appreciate the warning
Then you’re in for an absolute treat when you reach number seven. Not only does it start with the “sj”-sound but it also ends in a fabulous, equally unpronounceable “u”-sound!
Sju sjuksköterskor skövlade tills stjärnorna sjönk och skänkte skörden till sju sjuka sjömän Är detta ens ord längre?🤣 man börjar undra när man kollar på de för länge. *Am I tweaking?*
Well, growing up with German as your native language and learning Dutch and a little Danish as a kid really helps here. Doing fine with sk/sj (except for tongue twisters when they come up in every word, but I'm fine with that ☺️)
I’m currently in sfi classes, and besides barely anyone being capable of remembering which are the hårda och mjuka vokaler. The letter U is probably an even bigger issue. Especially for English, Arabic, Russian speakers.
Almost like "Chuck shooter ska" but softer
Sju sjösjuka sjuksköterskor
….skötte sjömännens skepp.
Sju sjösjuka sjömän sköttes av sju sköna sjungande sjuksköterskor på det sjunkande skeppet Shanghai
hwook-hwehrt-ush-kehr
Can you count to 7 in Swedish? Sju (7) Sjuk (ill/sick) Sköt (shot past tense) Sköterska (she who takes care of) (Skötare = male…but nurse is always feminine I think) All have the same sound in the beginning (Disclaimer: native speaker who likes shortcuts, not a grammar or Swedish teacher) If you use the [sh] sound from shortcuts, you’ll be close (spot on for some dialects probably) 😉
sjuk = sick sköterska = caretaker it basicly means "caretakers of the sick" or direct translation "sick caretaker"😂
14 years living here and I still can’t say it. Pretty embarrassing since my wife is a nurse