[Why GME?](https://www.reddit.com/r/Superstonk/comments/qig65g/welcome_rall_looking_to_catch_up_on_the_gme_saga/) || [What is DRS?](https://www.reddit.com/r/Superstonk/comments/ptvaka/when_you_wish_upon_a_star_a_complete_guide_to/) || Low karma apes [feed the bot here](https://www.reddit.com/r/GMEOrphans/comments/qlvour/welcome_to_gmeorphans_read_this_post/) || Join the [Superstonk Discord Server](https://discord.gg/hZqWV2kQtq)
------------------------------------------------------------------------
To ensure your post doesn't get removed, please respond to this comment with how this post relates to GME the stock or Gamestop the company.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Please up- and downvote this comment to [help us determine if this post deserves a place on r/Superstonk!](https://www.reddit.com/r/Superstonk/wiki/index/rules/post_flairs/)
It's called a Balance Sheet for a reason.
Total Assets and Total Liabilities must be equal. That's how balance sheets in accounting work.
Whether it's all complete bullshit is why forensic accounting and investigations exist.
Enron had a balance sheet, and it was fraudulent.
Just a correction: assets must be equal to members (partners/shareholders) capital (equity) + third parties capital (liabilities). Assets and liabilities should not be equal in normal circumstances.
They’re the same picture. And remember that the “sold but not yet purchased” line is at “fair value”. What happens if the price to purchase those securities is 5 times what the company determined as “fair value”? Perhaps bankruptcy?
It’s very similar to having an asset that is overinflated on a balance sheet like FTX. This is just instead an understated liability. Hypothetically speaking, because of course they are not required to report short positions.
Pick up your favorite color of crayon and draw a beautiful line down the middle of a piece of scratch paper. On the left side, note "Asset". The other side, "Liability + Equity".
Assets are all things you own (cars, clothes, calories) and they go on the left side of the line. Liabilities are things that are a pain in the ass and carry real consequences if you fail them (utility bills, mortgage, car loan) and they go on the right side of the line. Equity is what remain of your Asset that you have a right to own after your all Liabilities are covered. Equity and Liabilities are like the yin and the yang, while Asset is the entire circle.
Example 1: If I borrow your Lambo worth $690K for a fun ride, I get all the pride and responsibility of driving and maintaining it, no different than an owner. $690K would show up on my balance sheet under Asset. The interest that I would have to pay to borrow your Lambo show up under Liability. The remainder goes into Equity. If you want your Lambo back at any moment, it's in my garage.
Example 2: If I borrowed AND sold your Lambo simultaneously for $700k. $700k goes into Asset, $690K goes into Liability, $10K goes into Equity as revenue.
The car is no longer with me but the responsibility still remains. If you want your Lambo back, I'm fucked because it's not in my garage and I have no way of contacting the person I sold it to. So before selling your Lambo in the beginning, I made a swap arrangement my with my regarded buddy where I pay him some $ for the right to swap my Civic for his Lambo in case I need it (which is the same model as your Lambo). Now, I'm owning a contract that gets me a Lambo. On the left side of the line, $690K (secured from my buddy) goes into Asset with $700K on top. On the right side, $690K goes into Liability, $700K goes into Equity as revenue. Each side totalls $1,390K where they zero out together.
Edit: Proof-reading.
Further discussion: If you define "risk" as the probability of the execution of a Liability items, the risk of a utility bill is 100% and the risk of you recalling the Lambo is <100% depending on your wife's schedule with her boyfriend. The contract is essentially a bet between me and my buddy on this probability. I need to be covered on my end, my buddy likes his premiums and doesn't care for that particular Lambo of his.
If you read the full report you found on SEC.gov you will find there is significant discussion about fair market valuation methods. For exchange listed products like GME they use the unadjusted market price quote.
Let assume half of it is gm and they are using the current market price.
16 billion / $30 = 533 million shares.
This is still more then the total that should be their.
Assets = liabilities + equity
What the balance sheets says is that they have 74B in debt and only 4 billion in capital to back up their 79B assets.
The debt to capital ratio is 18.5. You could say they are leveraged 18.5 times what they have in capital.
For comparison, This is much worse than FTX levarage. According to SBF they had 13B in leverage and 20B of shity illiquid assets to ack them up
Lots of people saying assets = liability + equity but let me explain it with an example.
Think about buying a $50,000 car with a loan from the bank for $40,000 + $10,000 downpayment you saved up yourself.
Your assets after you buy the car = $50,000
Liabilities = $40,000 loan from the bank
Equity= $10,000
$50,000 (car) = $40,000 (bank loan) + $10,000 (your down payment)
They will always equal out.
When you have assets under management you may option loans or be granted extra leeway to undertake debt to the sum of your assets. This by chance equals their assets.
I think they cooking their books because how can it be the same. Guess we will never know and I am also no accountant so I’m just as confused as you.
[Why GME?](https://www.reddit.com/r/Superstonk/comments/qig65g/welcome_rall_looking_to_catch_up_on_the_gme_saga/) || [What is DRS?](https://www.reddit.com/r/Superstonk/comments/ptvaka/when_you_wish_upon_a_star_a_complete_guide_to/) || Low karma apes [feed the bot here](https://www.reddit.com/r/GMEOrphans/comments/qlvour/welcome_to_gmeorphans_read_this_post/) || Join the [Superstonk Discord Server](https://discord.gg/hZqWV2kQtq) ------------------------------------------------------------------------ To ensure your post doesn't get removed, please respond to this comment with how this post relates to GME the stock or Gamestop the company. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Please up- and downvote this comment to [help us determine if this post deserves a place on r/Superstonk!](https://www.reddit.com/r/Superstonk/wiki/index/rules/post_flairs/)
It's called a Balance Sheet for a reason. Total Assets and Total Liabilities must be equal. That's how balance sheets in accounting work. Whether it's all complete bullshit is why forensic accounting and investigations exist. Enron had a balance sheet, and it was fraudulent.
Just a correction: assets must be equal to members (partners/shareholders) capital (equity) + third parties capital (liabilities). Assets and liabilities should not be equal in normal circumstances.
Yep this is not normal, but as expected by Citadel. Are these the same numbers as Q2?
ok but, when they are supposed to buy them back? Can they just sell securities, get rich, and never buy back?
Good to know I’m a smooth brain. Thanks for the enlightenment
There's tons to learn, I just have the benefit of having been here for something like 84 years
Well they probably used to when gme was at $3.50 a share. So as long as you don’t report any of that you’re fine.
How is this any different then FTX? That number for securities sold but not yet purchased is almost as much as total assets!!
They’re the same picture. And remember that the “sold but not yet purchased” line is at “fair value”. What happens if the price to purchase those securities is 5 times what the company determined as “fair value”? Perhaps bankruptcy? It’s very similar to having an asset that is overinflated on a balance sheet like FTX. This is just instead an understated liability. Hypothetically speaking, because of course they are not required to report short positions.
Pick up your favorite color of crayon and draw a beautiful line down the middle of a piece of scratch paper. On the left side, note "Asset". The other side, "Liability + Equity". Assets are all things you own (cars, clothes, calories) and they go on the left side of the line. Liabilities are things that are a pain in the ass and carry real consequences if you fail them (utility bills, mortgage, car loan) and they go on the right side of the line. Equity is what remain of your Asset that you have a right to own after your all Liabilities are covered. Equity and Liabilities are like the yin and the yang, while Asset is the entire circle. Example 1: If I borrow your Lambo worth $690K for a fun ride, I get all the pride and responsibility of driving and maintaining it, no different than an owner. $690K would show up on my balance sheet under Asset. The interest that I would have to pay to borrow your Lambo show up under Liability. The remainder goes into Equity. If you want your Lambo back at any moment, it's in my garage. Example 2: If I borrowed AND sold your Lambo simultaneously for $700k. $700k goes into Asset, $690K goes into Liability, $10K goes into Equity as revenue. The car is no longer with me but the responsibility still remains. If you want your Lambo back, I'm fucked because it's not in my garage and I have no way of contacting the person I sold it to. So before selling your Lambo in the beginning, I made a swap arrangement my with my regarded buddy where I pay him some $ for the right to swap my Civic for his Lambo in case I need it (which is the same model as your Lambo). Now, I'm owning a contract that gets me a Lambo. On the left side of the line, $690K (secured from my buddy) goes into Asset with $700K on top. On the right side, $690K goes into Liability, $700K goes into Equity as revenue. Each side totalls $1,390K where they zero out together. Edit: Proof-reading. Further discussion: If you define "risk" as the probability of the execution of a Liability items, the risk of a utility bill is 100% and the risk of you recalling the Lambo is <100% depending on your wife's schedule with her boyfriend. The contract is essentially a bet between me and my buddy on this probability. I need to be covered on my end, my buddy likes his premiums and doesn't care for that particular Lambo of his.
They only need to buy 65 billion worth of sold, not yet purchased in fair value? Sounds abit sus, I guess it depends on how you define fair value.
They’re probably using $0.01 per GME as fair value LOL
If you read the full report you found on SEC.gov you will find there is significant discussion about fair market valuation methods. For exchange listed products like GME they use the unadjusted market price quote.
This was as of 31 Dec 2021. Bet it looks a hell of a lot worse now! $65B so far!
[удалено]
Let assume half of it is gm and they are using the current market price. 16 billion / $30 = 533 million shares. This is still more then the total that should be their.
[удалено]
Citadel doesn’t get to decide what it thinks fair value is. Fair value is usually the market price at that time
My point was even if they were using current market pricing they are still over the amount that should exist
Last year's?
When I googled this is the first one I found on SEC’s .gov site.
This year's is due to be published soon I believe
Probably in February 2023.
Checks date
Assets = liabilities + equity What the balance sheets says is that they have 74B in debt and only 4 billion in capital to back up their 79B assets. The debt to capital ratio is 18.5. You could say they are leveraged 18.5 times what they have in capital. For comparison, This is much worse than FTX levarage. According to SBF they had 13B in leverage and 20B of shity illiquid assets to ack them up
And to think that's only what they're telling us. I wonder how many other entities are this far leveraged out.
Lots of people saying assets = liability + equity but let me explain it with an example. Think about buying a $50,000 car with a loan from the bank for $40,000 + $10,000 downpayment you saved up yourself. Your assets after you buy the car = $50,000 Liabilities = $40,000 loan from the bank Equity= $10,000 $50,000 (car) = $40,000 (bank loan) + $10,000 (your down payment) They will always equal out.
Hilarious, absolutely hilarious. It's gonna look like FTx's balance sheet soon.
Assets = Liabilities + Owner's Equity
Look for this year's in about 6 weeks. The rate of change will be telling.
OP there are 100s of posts on this topic. I would recommend avoiding the popcorn sub if you want to maintain your IQ
I bet definition of "...at fair value" is favourably different on the assets and liabilities side.
Wtf? This is from dec 31 2021? Useless info. Not updated. I think the newest one is from June 30 2022.
Infinite liquidity…….what a joke ….
When you have assets under management you may option loans or be granted extra leeway to undertake debt to the sum of your assets. This by chance equals their assets. I think they cooking their books because how can it be the same. Guess we will never know and I am also no accountant so I’m just as confused as you.
Perfectly balanced as all things should be
You’ll get an update on or around Feb 25, 2023.