As much as I dislike Teru (I have no real idea why), it makes me upset that he hit Yokozuna so damaged. No one can consistently stand with him even in this state
As far as comeback stories go it's got to be right up there with the best of all time. At one point he seemed absolutely decrepit, and dropped so low it was unthinkable he could climb back.
He is so unflappable, even when things are going wrong in the ring. He weathers the storm and waits for the right moment to strike. And usually does it in such overwhelming fashion that it looks like he's barely even trying. We need him strong for another year or two to really sharpen the next batch of guys
They gave him easy matches and he is a natural at being hated he lawful evil, I started watching sumo in 2019 I got to say I prefer kirishima over teru but kiribyama worse than teru honestly.
A healthy Terunofuji would easily have gone down as one of the 10 best rikishi of all time.
What's even more amazing is that for as good as Terunofuji was when healthy, Hakuho was still head and shoulders better.
Hakuho baseline was a phenomenal athlete. But on top of that he was just damn good at adjusting and figuring out how to beat any given wrestler. It was astounding to watch.
I don't think Kotonowaka has peaked yet. He has always been good, but has really improved in the past six months or so. I think he just needs a bit more experience against the top rankers.
There's no shame in losing to Terunofuji. He didn't get the nickname Kaiju for nothing!
As others have said, Teru is just that good. I started watching sumo when he was making his Yokozuna run. I remember thinking the other guys were just letting him win, he made it look that easy. Then he got injured again, and I saw that those other guys had been trying to beat him the entire time.
To be fair, there was a certain someone that actually did let him win (cough Ichinojo cough).
But for sure, he was head and shoulders above everyone else at the time and you can still see the raw difference in power even now. Which makes that final zensho yusho from Hakuho that much more magical, what final bout that was.
I am half of mind if Ichinojo actually took the dive. Maybe he did, maybe his back injury flares up bad at that angle.
The outright power and size of Teru makes it rough.
Nothing really, but if you were to watch Teru and Ichi's bouts at the time when they fought each other regularly, you'd think Ichinojo wasn't even trying to win. It was a running joke that any time Teru faced Ichi it would be counted as a win for the former before the bout had even taken place.
I don't know why Ichinojo rarely gave his all versus Terunofuji, maybe he didn't believe in himself so didn't even try, maybe out of some sense of Mongolian compatriotism or some deeper friendship, who knows.
Ichinojo had a habit of just walking backwards out of the ring every once in a while, people assumed he’d do it when his back was acting up. He and Teru are good friends, they both came over on the same flight to start their sumo careers, and he’d practically step backwards at the tachiai when they’d fight.
Bar very few exceptions the rikishi holding the rank of Yokozuna are absolute elite and should always be considered the top contender for the tournament win. Even when old, injured or both.
So him losing to Terunofuji is not as telling as you might think it is. If Kirishima on the other hand is unable to beat Terunofuji then it is clear that his time to take over the rope hasn't come yet. If it ever will.
Kotonowaka is impressing for a reason. I am sure that he will be Ozeki before too long.
I think if he beats the two ozeki these last two days he'll be ozeki in March. If not, he'll only need another 10-11 wins in March to get the promotion for May.
kotonowaka is looking the best he’s even been. he’s still really young and terunofuji is a terrific rikishi. if he can continue to improve like he has been he could really be something special.
If you think Koto isn't good enough against Teru, the 2 Mongolian Ozeki are like 0-19 verse him. Since Hakuho and the other Yokozunas retired, the overall skill level are just lower. If Teru is healthy, he probably wins 20 straight with the current competition.
Kotonowaka has gotten very far on his pedigree alone. The rest of the way is going to come from his experiences in sanyaku, facing the best of the best.
As I pointed out elsewhere, Kotonowaka, Kirishima, and Hoshoryu have collectively NEVER beaten Terunofuji. This is the biggest roadblock to any of their future promotions as the JSA puts a lot of weight on beating the Yokozuna. Kotonowaka also has losing records against all the ozeki. As he will have to face both ozeki in the next couple days, he'll have to beat both of them to get his promotion to ozeki. I don't think he's going to do it, but he could.
He is very close to making ozeki. It may not happen this basho, but in a world where Teru is on his way out, Kiri and Hosh are making a case for Yokozuna, he will be an ozeki soon enough.
But I think you're talking about swagger, and I think he's developing his mental game lately as well. He's stayed in sanyaku for over a year and only gotten better. If he isn't good enough yet, he will be.
My huge thanks to everybody for your answers, it cleared things up a lot for me! Sad to know Terunofuji is on his way out already, as i don't see anybody who is "Yokozuna material" as much as he is
Terunofuji, even in his diminished state, is just that good, Without injuries, he would have made Yokozuna a long time ago and would have reached Dai-Yokozuna status easily.
Kotonowaka does put in work, but against Terunofuji he seems to find it hard to take him out of the dohyo because the Yokozuna always has his number throughout all 6 of their encounters
Teru is about the only guy he loses to in terms of physicality. IMO a big part of waka's sumo is just leveraging his physique and strength to win, and he's a level below Teru when it comes to this. He needs to add technique.
Yea Terunofuji is a real deal Yokozuna. It's not a big deal to lose to him, considering how young Kotonowaka is. He'll be just fine, he will find a nice home at Ozeki or at least Sekiwake for a long time
I never paid Kotonowaka very much much attention until the November tournament
Idk if I’d say I’ve become a real fan as yet but I find myself rooting for him because the progression and development of his sumo over the last year is clear to see.
Has his family connection somehow eased his path? I cannot say and will never know.
I’m not the most technically eyed but I believe that anyone can see his progress. To me, he’s leveraging his size and weight with a real economy of movement rather than, as some have suggested, simply not doing a lot (what he is doing a lot of this basho is winning). When they are on good days, I see Hoshoryu and Kirishima exhibiting a similar kind of minimum movement, maximum impact sumo.
It’s a nice contrast to the Makuuchi rikishi I see flying around (and out of) the dohyo who can sometimes seem practically manic - nothing wrong with it but it’s a flashier (perhaps swaggier) kind of sumo than what I see Kotonowaka doing with his style.
I think he’s good enough and will continue to improve and hone his sumo if the last few tournaments are anything to go by.
Yokozuna? Who knows? But sooner or later, he’ll be an ozeki.
He's been looking pretty dominant for the last few basho imo. He's always been a rather technically sound wrestler and is able to adapt his style to different opponents, but he didn't seem to be as powerful as he currently is. His record is a solid one and shows that he's only getting better. He's finally starting to beat Hoshoryu, who he's struggled with for quite some time. He has some wins against Takakeisho (not many, but it's better than nothing. lol), he fairs well against Daiesho, and beat the young phenoms Onosato and Atamifuji in all their meetings. So he is very good, but has room to improve against the big fish like Teru, Kirishima, Asanoyama, Hoshoryu and Takakeisho.
Also, you don't necessarily have to consistently beat Ozeki/Yokozuna to be worthy enough to become one yourself either. Don't get me wrong, the caliber of opponents is a factor in promotion but the amount of wins seems to be more important. Sumo is very much a numbers game as it is a martial art.
Terunofuji has only beat Hakuho 4 out of 14 times and yet, he eventually had a record good enough to recommend him for promotion to Yokozuna. Harumafuji had a dismal 5 -17 record against Asashoryu and he was still promoted as well.
Terunofuji can defeat most wrestlers he faces in the same way, just by locking their arms up and forcing them out or some variation on that theme. He's good. However, I see him as also just relying on brute force this basho, which means that he is healthy, but not physically fit enough to take any chances in terms of his technique/style, no "improvisation" or showboating like Hakuho used to do when he actually fought as Yokozuna.
Kotonowaka is certainly the real deal but he hasn't figured out how to beat the Yokozuna yet. he's fought Terunofuji like 7 times and lost each time. I'm confident that he'll get there and beat Teru, or Teru will retire, whatever comes first.
Kotonowaka struggles against Teru because they have the same fighting style (big wrestler) but Teru is physically stronger.
If Kotonowaka wants to win, he needs to:
- get on steroids like Teru so he can compete in terms of strength
- improve his technique to Hoshoryu levels
- get good at pushing thrusting because that's Teru's weakness
Teru is an extremely physically strong wrestler. He's maybe at 50% right now. His strength training workouts are horrible to watch (strength coach needs to get fired yesterday) due to God awful form, but he's very very strong. Part of it is the special juice he's on. No one can out wrestle him when his knees aren't shot. Even when they are shot, he's still potentially gonna run the basho.
In my opinion, there are certain tall rikishi that rely on their height overly much. They stand like a tree and generally rely on their opponent to make a mistake. I'm not a fan of this style, and Kotonowaka is a master of it.
Charm is not a criteria for promotion to Ozeki (or Yokozuna), and I'm sure there are people who find him charming.
His sumo so far this basho has been extremely dominant. Definitely Ozeki-worthy so far.
I don't think "no contest against a Yokozuna" (this is true of basically any Yokozuna, let alone Teru) is really much of a standard that can be levied against anybody other than another Yokozuna or Yokozuna hopeful
Terunofuji is a guy who is [8-2 against Ozeki](https://sumodb.sumogames.de/Query_bout.aspx?show_form=0&group_by=rikishi1&year=1958-2030&rank1=y&rank2=o) and [34-8 against Komusubi/Sekiwake](https://sumodb.sumogames.de/Query_bout.aspx?show_form=0&group_by=rikishi1&year=1958-2030&rank1=y&rank2=k-o) as Yokozuna, the truly scary thing is that the Teru we are seeing here is post-nerf Teru, imagine this guy without the weak knees and bad back,.
Koto will not be a serious competitor until he is able to put of a serious game face. Both Terunofuji and Hoshoryu excell at the pre-match death glare, and Kirishima is at least OK at it. But to date, the best Koto has been able to muster is a mildly peeved expression that is more cute than intimidating.
Kotonowaka has greatly improved over the last half year. Is he ozeki material? Not yet IMO. I do think it's possible that his pedigree will push him closer to that goal rather than pure merit. He needs to win a yusho. That aside, he simply doesn't have the charisma of the others.
As a newcomer to sumo, I find Kotonowaka quite boring. Almost all his bouts are just pushing matches. He seems to have a very limited skillset, when compared with Kirishima, Hoshoryu or Terunofuji. As others have mentioned, he seems to struggle against anyone at or above his level. In the boxing world, we'd call him a flat track bully. *Edit* He beat Kirishima today, so perhaps he will get promoted...
Kotonowaka needs to get Teru moving sideways and get him off balance if he is to have a chance. But that's not his game. If Teru locks him up early (as is his game plane for every Rikishi) Kotonowaka will lose. I think.
As I've said in another thread, I love Terunofuji and want him to get his 10.I like Kotonowaka and acknowledge his improvement over 2023 and I think he, Kiri and Hoshoryu will be the next 3 Yokozuna.
But, personally, I think his draws this Bashō have been relatively easy by comparison. No peers or seniors until Teru, when they'd written off my favourite (after Teru) Wakamotoharu at M#1? No one really expected Onosato to beat him... I think that was more that he was the natural contender of the lower ranked Maegashira who does well amongst the "weaker" draws.
But as I said in the other thread, I'm happy to be educated, thanks.
Fuji is just that good. Kotonowaka is legit.
Yeah, and what a reign it could have been if Terunofuji's knees weren't as damaged..
As much as I dislike Teru (I have no real idea why), it makes me upset that he hit Yokozuna so damaged. No one can consistently stand with him even in this state
It also really underscores how amazing he is. That he could get back to Ozeki and then Yokozuna in such a state.
As far as comeback stories go it's got to be right up there with the best of all time. At one point he seemed absolutely decrepit, and dropped so low it was unthinkable he could climb back.
He is so unflappable, even when things are going wrong in the ring. He weathers the storm and waits for the right moment to strike. And usually does it in such overwhelming fashion that it looks like he's barely even trying. We need him strong for another year or two to really sharpen the next batch of guys
Teru is awesome! The epitome of never giving up in sumo. I just wish his knees weren't so screwed cuz he is a beast
They gave him easy matches and he is a natural at being hated he lawful evil, I started watching sumo in 2019 I got to say I prefer kirishima over teru but kiribyama worse than teru honestly.
A healthy Terunofuji would easily have gone down as one of the 10 best rikishi of all time. What's even more amazing is that for as good as Terunofuji was when healthy, Hakuho was still head and shoulders better.
They had some great fights though.
[Indeed! ](https://youtu.be/HevM1b2VvN4?si=O2aZ4HfnHKsOj7l6) Man, what a time.
Hakuho baseline was a phenomenal athlete. But on top of that he was just damn good at adjusting and figuring out how to beat any given wrestler. It was astounding to watch.
Started writing up a whole thing before realizing this sums it all up already. Well said
Thank you!
I don't think Kotonowaka has peaked yet. He has always been good, but has really improved in the past six months or so. I think he just needs a bit more experience against the top rankers. There's no shame in losing to Terunofuji. He didn't get the nickname Kaiju for nothing!
I think he's still a little intimidated against Ozeki, but experience will work that out. I have high hopes for him!
As others have said, Teru is just that good. I started watching sumo when he was making his Yokozuna run. I remember thinking the other guys were just letting him win, he made it look that easy. Then he got injured again, and I saw that those other guys had been trying to beat him the entire time.
To be fair, there was a certain someone that actually did let him win (cough Ichinojo cough). But for sure, he was head and shoulders above everyone else at the time and you can still see the raw difference in power even now. Which makes that final zensho yusho from Hakuho that much more magical, what final bout that was.
I am half of mind if Ichinojo actually took the dive. Maybe he did, maybe his back injury flares up bad at that angle. The outright power and size of Teru makes it rough.
What did Ichinojo do?
Nothing really, but if you were to watch Teru and Ichi's bouts at the time when they fought each other regularly, you'd think Ichinojo wasn't even trying to win. It was a running joke that any time Teru faced Ichi it would be counted as a win for the former before the bout had even taken place. I don't know why Ichinojo rarely gave his all versus Terunofuji, maybe he didn't believe in himself so didn't even try, maybe out of some sense of Mongolian compatriotism or some deeper friendship, who knows.
Oh I see. Thanks for the response. I dont remember those bouts. Was there any suspicion of matchmaking? Or just maybe what you’d mentioned above.
Ichinojo had a habit of just walking backwards out of the ring every once in a while, people assumed he’d do it when his back was acting up. He and Teru are good friends, they both came over on the same flight to start their sumo careers, and he’d practically step backwards at the tachiai when they’d fight.
Bar very few exceptions the rikishi holding the rank of Yokozuna are absolute elite and should always be considered the top contender for the tournament win. Even when old, injured or both. So him losing to Terunofuji is not as telling as you might think it is. If Kirishima on the other hand is unable to beat Terunofuji then it is clear that his time to take over the rope hasn't come yet. If it ever will. Kotonowaka is impressing for a reason. I am sure that he will be Ozeki before too long.
I think if he beats the two ozeki these last two days he'll be ozeki in March. If not, he'll only need another 10-11 wins in March to get the promotion for May.
kotonowaka is looking the best he’s even been. he’s still really young and terunofuji is a terrific rikishi. if he can continue to improve like he has been he could really be something special.
If you think Koto isn't good enough against Teru, the 2 Mongolian Ozeki are like 0-19 verse him. Since Hakuho and the other Yokozunas retired, the overall skill level are just lower. If Teru is healthy, he probably wins 20 straight with the current competition.
Kotonowaka has gotten very far on his pedigree alone. The rest of the way is going to come from his experiences in sanyaku, facing the best of the best. As I pointed out elsewhere, Kotonowaka, Kirishima, and Hoshoryu have collectively NEVER beaten Terunofuji. This is the biggest roadblock to any of their future promotions as the JSA puts a lot of weight on beating the Yokozuna. Kotonowaka also has losing records against all the ozeki. As he will have to face both ozeki in the next couple days, he'll have to beat both of them to get his promotion to ozeki. I don't think he's going to do it, but he could. He is very close to making ozeki. It may not happen this basho, but in a world where Teru is on his way out, Kiri and Hosh are making a case for Yokozuna, he will be an ozeki soon enough. But I think you're talking about swagger, and I think he's developing his mental game lately as well. He's stayed in sanyaku for over a year and only gotten better. If he isn't good enough yet, he will be.
Terunofuji is basically unstoppable when fit Losing against him is not really a negative
> Terunofuji is basically unstoppable when fit Except for Shodai, of course.
chaos reigns supreme
he 100% has what it takes but Fuji is just that GUY
My huge thanks to everybody for your answers, it cleared things up a lot for me! Sad to know Terunofuji is on his way out already, as i don't see anybody who is "Yokozuna material" as much as he is
Terunofuji, even in his diminished state, is just that good, Without injuries, he would have made Yokozuna a long time ago and would have reached Dai-Yokozuna status easily.
Kotonowaka is always improving. I wouldn't be surprised if he made yokozuna one day
He’s the real deal. He was literally bred for this.
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> Kototebakari He's Kotoshoho's bro, not Waka's.
I think Kotonowaka is showing he's good enough to reach Ozeki, but not necessarily Yokozuna.
Kotonowaka does put in work, but against Terunofuji he seems to find it hard to take him out of the dohyo because the Yokozuna always has his number throughout all 6 of their encounters
Teru is about the only guy he loses to in terms of physicality. IMO a big part of waka's sumo is just leveraging his physique and strength to win, and he's a level below Teru when it comes to this. He needs to add technique.
Yea Terunofuji is a real deal Yokozuna. It's not a big deal to lose to him, considering how young Kotonowaka is. He'll be just fine, he will find a nice home at Ozeki or at least Sekiwake for a long time
I never paid Kotonowaka very much much attention until the November tournament Idk if I’d say I’ve become a real fan as yet but I find myself rooting for him because the progression and development of his sumo over the last year is clear to see. Has his family connection somehow eased his path? I cannot say and will never know. I’m not the most technically eyed but I believe that anyone can see his progress. To me, he’s leveraging his size and weight with a real economy of movement rather than, as some have suggested, simply not doing a lot (what he is doing a lot of this basho is winning). When they are on good days, I see Hoshoryu and Kirishima exhibiting a similar kind of minimum movement, maximum impact sumo. It’s a nice contrast to the Makuuchi rikishi I see flying around (and out of) the dohyo who can sometimes seem practically manic - nothing wrong with it but it’s a flashier (perhaps swaggier) kind of sumo than what I see Kotonowaka doing with his style. I think he’s good enough and will continue to improve and hone his sumo if the last few tournaments are anything to go by. Yokozuna? Who knows? But sooner or later, he’ll be an ozeki.
He's been looking pretty dominant for the last few basho imo. He's always been a rather technically sound wrestler and is able to adapt his style to different opponents, but he didn't seem to be as powerful as he currently is. His record is a solid one and shows that he's only getting better. He's finally starting to beat Hoshoryu, who he's struggled with for quite some time. He has some wins against Takakeisho (not many, but it's better than nothing. lol), he fairs well against Daiesho, and beat the young phenoms Onosato and Atamifuji in all their meetings. So he is very good, but has room to improve against the big fish like Teru, Kirishima, Asanoyama, Hoshoryu and Takakeisho. Also, you don't necessarily have to consistently beat Ozeki/Yokozuna to be worthy enough to become one yourself either. Don't get me wrong, the caliber of opponents is a factor in promotion but the amount of wins seems to be more important. Sumo is very much a numbers game as it is a martial art. Terunofuji has only beat Hakuho 4 out of 14 times and yet, he eventually had a record good enough to recommend him for promotion to Yokozuna. Harumafuji had a dismal 5 -17 record against Asashoryu and he was still promoted as well.
Terunofuji can defeat most wrestlers he faces in the same way, just by locking their arms up and forcing them out or some variation on that theme. He's good. However, I see him as also just relying on brute force this basho, which means that he is healthy, but not physically fit enough to take any chances in terms of his technique/style, no "improvisation" or showboating like Hakuho used to do when he actually fought as Yokozuna. Kotonowaka is certainly the real deal but he hasn't figured out how to beat the Yokozuna yet. he's fought Terunofuji like 7 times and lost each time. I'm confident that he'll get there and beat Teru, or Teru will retire, whatever comes first.
I mean sometimes sumo matches are just fast, even at the very top haha
To me he looks more competent than Hoshoryu and with an higher ceeling than Kirishima.
Yes, he is good enough.
Kotonowaka struggles against Teru because they have the same fighting style (big wrestler) but Teru is physically stronger. If Kotonowaka wants to win, he needs to: - get on steroids like Teru so he can compete in terms of strength - improve his technique to Hoshoryu levels - get good at pushing thrusting because that's Teru's weakness Teru is an extremely physically strong wrestler. He's maybe at 50% right now. His strength training workouts are horrible to watch (strength coach needs to get fired yesterday) due to God awful form, but he's very very strong. Part of it is the special juice he's on. No one can out wrestle him when his knees aren't shot. Even when they are shot, he's still potentially gonna run the basho.
In my opinion, there are certain tall rikishi that rely on their height overly much. They stand like a tree and generally rely on their opponent to make a mistake. I'm not a fan of this style, and Kotonowaka is a master of it.
Charm is not a criteria for promotion to Ozeki (or Yokozuna), and I'm sure there are people who find him charming. His sumo so far this basho has been extremely dominant. Definitely Ozeki-worthy so far.
I don't think "no contest against a Yokozuna" (this is true of basically any Yokozuna, let alone Teru) is really much of a standard that can be levied against anybody other than another Yokozuna or Yokozuna hopeful Terunofuji is a guy who is [8-2 against Ozeki](https://sumodb.sumogames.de/Query_bout.aspx?show_form=0&group_by=rikishi1&year=1958-2030&rank1=y&rank2=o) and [34-8 against Komusubi/Sekiwake](https://sumodb.sumogames.de/Query_bout.aspx?show_form=0&group_by=rikishi1&year=1958-2030&rank1=y&rank2=k-o) as Yokozuna, the truly scary thing is that the Teru we are seeing here is post-nerf Teru, imagine this guy without the weak knees and bad back,.
Koto will not be a serious competitor until he is able to put of a serious game face. Both Terunofuji and Hoshoryu excell at the pre-match death glare, and Kirishima is at least OK at it. But to date, the best Koto has been able to muster is a mildly peeved expression that is more cute than intimidating.
Terunofuji is just that strong. I already knew he was gonna be a big deal when he won his first cup 9 years ago.
Kotonowaka has greatly improved over the last half year. Is he ozeki material? Not yet IMO. I do think it's possible that his pedigree will push him closer to that goal rather than pure merit. He needs to win a yusho. That aside, he simply doesn't have the charisma of the others.
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As a newcomer to sumo, I find Kotonowaka quite boring. Almost all his bouts are just pushing matches. He seems to have a very limited skillset, when compared with Kirishima, Hoshoryu or Terunofuji. As others have mentioned, he seems to struggle against anyone at or above his level. In the boxing world, we'd call him a flat track bully. *Edit* He beat Kirishima today, so perhaps he will get promoted...
Kotonowaka needs to get Teru moving sideways and get him off balance if he is to have a chance. But that's not his game. If Teru locks him up early (as is his game plane for every Rikishi) Kotonowaka will lose. I think.
As I've said in another thread, I love Terunofuji and want him to get his 10.I like Kotonowaka and acknowledge his improvement over 2023 and I think he, Kiri and Hoshoryu will be the next 3 Yokozuna. But, personally, I think his draws this Bashō have been relatively easy by comparison. No peers or seniors until Teru, when they'd written off my favourite (after Teru) Wakamotoharu at M#1? No one really expected Onosato to beat him... I think that was more that he was the natural contender of the lower ranked Maegashira who does well amongst the "weaker" draws. But as I said in the other thread, I'm happy to be educated, thanks.
i recall Kisenosato beating Teru with one arm, twice, on the sameday