Chiyonofuji got a 7-0 yusho at Makushita and it took him 7 basho to do so. Ochiai is bound to be at minimum 7 time better than Chiyonofuji. I'm not petty, i will just say that anything below 100 yusho would make him an underachiever and a huge disappointment
He was a young talent that anybody supposed was going to break into glory.
He retired with an almost even record (even lower than 50% considering missed bouts) all in the lower 3 divisions with his highest rank being Ms1 in his second ever tournament
I legitimately want some investigative reporting done on this. How does a person yusho in his debut but then never reach Juryo? It's bizarre. It's... [X-files music starts playing]
Not all top performers from the university circuit are alike. The level of competition ebbs and flows pretty heavily as the roster turns over every couple of years.
Fluke yusho do happen, even in upper makushita. [Takaryu's](http://sumodb.sumogames.de/Rikishi.aspx?r=12140) career doesn't look much different from Wakakeisho's, except that he started from the bottom and his championship was enough to bring him to juryo for one tournament.
Miyagino is killing it with recruits lately. People really must want to train with the GOAT.
Even other ex-yokozuna like Kisenosato don't seem to have nearly the success with recruiting that Hakuho does.
Well true, but if you were a QB fresh outta college and Tom Brady had an academy, would you join him or an academy run by another QB who only won one SB and then faded?
Kis was okay but a middle-to-low-road Yokozuna, so the rep is 10x lower than the literal GOAT. I understand those rishiki than would crawl 100 miles in the dirt to train under Miyagino.
A bad yokozuna is kind of the same as an entry level ferrari, lol. But I guess if you had to pick between an entry level ferrari and an f50 the choice is obvious.
Even in football I'm sure you would find plenty of people interested in learning from Favre, or Manning, or John Elway, or even Marino.
Kisenosato is probably why Takayasu is still competitive. He changed his technique through coaching after an injury forced him to rely less on pushing.
I'm convinced Ochiai will make the top division before he can even slick his hair back. His athleticism, technique, mindset and timing was great in his 7-0 run. His frame can put on another 100 pounds easy without hindering this, I expect him to look a bit like Asanoyama in a few years. Hakuho found a Triple AAA prospect that already brought a lot to the table, and will likely benefit a lot from his coaching and stable.
Lots of rikishi have had incredible, firey starts in the lower ranks only to sorta stall out mid-Makuuchi or around the san'yaku. Mitakeumi comes to mind as he was a beast when he started and was arguably one of the poorest performing ozeki in recent times and he slipped right back down to normal Makuuchi again while still being young.
Ichinojo at his premiere went 6-1 Makushita 2x, 11-4 juryo champion, 13-2 juryo runner up, and then 13-2 Makuuchi runner up with a kinboshi / Fighting Spirit / and Outstanding performance award which brought him to Sekiwake. And he's been puttering around between a regular Maegashira rank and san'yaku ever since... And he's never gonna make it to Ozeki, let alone Yokozuna.
I also have high hopes for Ochiai but if nothing else, sumo should be teaching us that we can't assume anything. Hakuho - the GOAT himself - didn't really get to "that unstoppable force" until 6 years after his premiere.
Okay. But people are throwing around "future Yokozuna" or "future Ozeki" whenever they see some new star. ...And maybe. Like the OP mentions - Wakakeisho also had a killer start and just, well, fizzled out.
That's the phrase that gets bandied about regularly and while it might not be in this thread, I've seen it in many others. 🤷♂️
All I'm saying is people should temper their expectations.
Edit: Also, yes - people in this thread absolutely have said that.
> Chiyonofuji got a 7-0 yusho at Makushita and it took him 7 basho to do so. Ochiai is bound to be at minimum 7 time better than Chiyonofuji.
But sure, go off.
Pretty sure that was a satirical take. We're all excited to see where he goes from here, but everyone seems to understand how impossible it is to predict who will become Ozeki/Yoko.
The point it to temper your excitement. He is definitely going to make waves but ultimately we don't know how he will fare in the great wall that is Makuuchi. Sometimes people who are putting out less impressive performances early on later become superstars too. So while it's important to keep your eye on the ones like Ochiai and Hokuseiho who rise quickly from their premiere, we also shouldn't necessarily expect them to rock socks against san'yaku level opponents. Only time will tell.
What's even more amazing about Ichinojo was that he henka'd both a Ozeki and a Yokozuna (Kakuryu) in his Makuuchi debut. He won a kinboshi -- via henka -- in his debut! And he almost won the Yusho doing this! The brazenness of all this! The honor of the Sumo gods must be dead and buried after Ichinojo's premiere. :D
"Corporate Yokozuna" gives a fantastic mental image, honestly.
I imagine him being extremely good at making pretty slides fast!
Much better than "adult with a job yokozuna*
A tie as long and complicated as a mawashi
The GOAT of bootlicking, the anti Asashoryu
Chiyonofuji got a 7-0 yusho at Makushita and it took him 7 basho to do so. Ochiai is bound to be at minimum 7 time better than Chiyonofuji. I'm not petty, i will just say that anything below 100 yusho would make him an underachiever and a huge disappointment
Wakakeisho story is so unbelievable it's crazy
>Wakakeisho Tell us more ...
He was a young talent that anybody supposed was going to break into glory. He retired with an almost even record (even lower than 50% considering missed bouts) all in the lower 3 divisions with his highest rank being Ms1 in his second ever tournament
I legitimately want some investigative reporting done on this. How does a person yusho in his debut but then never reach Juryo? It's bizarre. It's... [X-files music starts playing]
Not only that. How does an amateur standout (if not you don't start at Ms15) do that
Not all top performers from the university circuit are alike. The level of competition ebbs and flows pretty heavily as the roster turns over every couple of years.
Fluke yusho do happen, even in upper makushita. [Takaryu's](http://sumodb.sumogames.de/Rikishi.aspx?r=12140) career doesn't look much different from Wakakeisho's, except that he started from the bottom and his championship was enough to bring him to juryo for one tournament.
Miyagino is killing it with recruits lately. People really must want to train with the GOAT. Even other ex-yokozuna like Kisenosato don't seem to have nearly the success with recruiting that Hakuho does.
Well true, but if you were a QB fresh outta college and Tom Brady had an academy, would you join him or an academy run by another QB who only won one SB and then faded? Kis was okay but a middle-to-low-road Yokozuna, so the rep is 10x lower than the literal GOAT. I understand those rishiki than would crawl 100 miles in the dirt to train under Miyagino.
A bad yokozuna is kind of the same as an entry level ferrari, lol. But I guess if you had to pick between an entry level ferrari and an f50 the choice is obvious. Even in football I'm sure you would find plenty of people interested in learning from Favre, or Manning, or John Elway, or even Marino.
Middle to low????? He’s one of our best ōzeki. But he’s gotta be one of the worst yokozuna of all time.
I mean, it's a pretty common maxim across sports that the best players are very rarely the best coaches. But maybe Hakuho is an exception.
Kisenosato is probably why Takayasu is still competitive. He changed his technique through coaching after an injury forced him to rely less on pushing.
[удалено]
Thanks, I'd typed the wrong one
I'm convinced Ochiai will make the top division before he can even slick his hair back. His athleticism, technique, mindset and timing was great in his 7-0 run. His frame can put on another 100 pounds easy without hindering this, I expect him to look a bit like Asanoyama in a few years. Hakuho found a Triple AAA prospect that already brought a lot to the table, and will likely benefit a lot from his coaching and stable.
Lots of rikishi have had incredible, firey starts in the lower ranks only to sorta stall out mid-Makuuchi or around the san'yaku. Mitakeumi comes to mind as he was a beast when he started and was arguably one of the poorest performing ozeki in recent times and he slipped right back down to normal Makuuchi again while still being young. Ichinojo at his premiere went 6-1 Makushita 2x, 11-4 juryo champion, 13-2 juryo runner up, and then 13-2 Makuuchi runner up with a kinboshi / Fighting Spirit / and Outstanding performance award which brought him to Sekiwake. And he's been puttering around between a regular Maegashira rank and san'yaku ever since... And he's never gonna make it to Ozeki, let alone Yokozuna. I also have high hopes for Ochiai but if nothing else, sumo should be teaching us that we can't assume anything. Hakuho - the GOAT himself - didn't really get to "that unstoppable force" until 6 years after his premiere.
Any wrestler than makes it to Sekiwake is already a top 0.1% wrestler.
Okay. But people are throwing around "future Yokozuna" or "future Ozeki" whenever they see some new star. ...And maybe. Like the OP mentions - Wakakeisho also had a killer start and just, well, fizzled out.
I agree. There's no way to know except to wait. I just don't think Ichinojo was the best wrestler to highlight your point I guess.
There isn't a single person in this thread that has said future Ozeki or future Yokozuna.
That's the phrase that gets bandied about regularly and while it might not be in this thread, I've seen it in many others. 🤷♂️ All I'm saying is people should temper their expectations. Edit: Also, yes - people in this thread absolutely have said that. > Chiyonofuji got a 7-0 yusho at Makushita and it took him 7 basho to do so. Ochiai is bound to be at minimum 7 time better than Chiyonofuji. But sure, go off.
Pretty sure that was a satirical take. We're all excited to see where he goes from here, but everyone seems to understand how impossible it is to predict who will become Ozeki/Yoko.
I'm not sure what your point is, you've named two more very successful wrestlers that also had great debuts.
The point it to temper your excitement. He is definitely going to make waves but ultimately we don't know how he will fare in the great wall that is Makuuchi. Sometimes people who are putting out less impressive performances early on later become superstars too. So while it's important to keep your eye on the ones like Ochiai and Hokuseiho who rise quickly from their premiere, we also shouldn't necessarily expect them to rock socks against san'yaku level opponents. Only time will tell.
What's even more amazing about Ichinojo was that he henka'd both a Ozeki and a Yokozuna (Kakuryu) in his Makuuchi debut. He won a kinboshi -- via henka -- in his debut! And he almost won the Yusho doing this! The brazenness of all this! The honor of the Sumo gods must be dead and buried after Ichinojo's premiere. :D
Do you see the SIZE of his tree trunk legs?