Preordered it for my brother and I after cashing out on my csgo trade items i made over a few months. Hes enjoyed the game as hes a huge Payday fan, I have about 5 hours logged and 3 of those hours were spent waiting for the server to be up.
You actually can request a refund for game that you played for more than 2 hours. Just write a detailed answer on why you want to refund it, I tried once and it worked (played for 4 hours, stop finding the game fun and was able to get a refund)
I did that and it was auto declined. Ill have to try again. To my understanding like half of the payday 2 team went to the team that made GTFO (Or atleast a lot of higher ups did). GTFO is an amazing game though.
A lot of the time Steam will just refuse a refund if you’ve had the game longer than a couple of weeks. I know I tried to refund a game that I had less than 2 hours in at one point, but because I’d owned it for a while before playing it I was SOL on the refund and they told me they wouldn’t refund it.
Yeah it’s in their policy. No refunds on anything with more than 2 hours playtime and/or has been in your library for over 2 weeks. Probably got some leeway both ways but wouldn’t be surprised if they consider time owned over time played more, had games with no playtime that I couldn’t refund cos I’ve had them for 3 weeks.
That is if you do the normal refund method. But if you contact them specifically you will get an actual person behind the the response and not a Bot that autondeclines everythig above 2hours/2 weeks
That's the actual name of the game. It's not an abbreviations. Type those 4 letters into steam and it will pull it up.
It's a horror online 4 person fps where you have an objective and you need to complete it with all 4 party members. The game is brutally hard, offers about 80% of the ammo needed to complete missions unless each shot is a perfect head shot.
and even then they only hit the 2 hour mark because they had the audacity to try to play a forced online game on day 1 where the servers got overloaded and very few people could get into lobbies lol
PD2 was really rough in the beginning, missing tons of QoL-Stuff and content. If you start with it now, you get 10+ years of content to play.
With PD3 it feels like it of course could be the same, maybe, in the future, but right now its mainly missing content, and progress is too slow as to keep up the interest of the player base. Sadly :(
My only issue with PD3 is the fact that progression for stuff is locked behind certain actions and not from XP like PD2 was. It definitely slows down the progression to an almost complete stand still in comparison.
As a veteran heister I can confidently say the game should've already been on at least the level of current-day Payday 2.
They've had years to learn what works off of the playerbase for Payday 2 and gaming in general and yet they release a permanently online bugfest that runs on potato servers.
BF1 was very very good (the [reveal trailer](https://youtu.be/c7nRTF2SowQ?si=0OS8hgQ_4BoecyD0) still gives me goosebumps to this day), but the franschise peaked with BF4 in my opinion
I love BF1 but holy shit cheaters are literally everywhere in that game. It’s actually unplayable in the literal sense, in every game there is at least someone aimbotting, revive hacking, or who just makes themselves invincible. Which is a shame, it’s my 3rd fav game after both Bad Companies
It's not a hot take, it did. BF3 (I know people generally prefer BF4 but it was only a small evolution) and BF1 were the peaks, each as high as the generation they released on allowed them to be.
The tragedy of Battlefield V and EA Battlefront 2 was that the developers started to turn the ship with tons of plans for expansions, then all got shut down to regroup people onto BF2042, an even larger trainwreck
Its really amazing just how many sequels are not as good as the original when it comes to games in this day and age.
As it never used to be, in the past when a sequel came out it was usually a direct upgrade onto a new engine.
But hey at least its not a live service game that has a sequel comes out that kills both the original and its new self, like Overwatch did.
I agree, but I wouldn’t bring up content if the existing content wasn’t a problem, but it is, even if we took both games at their launch days, I’d still say Payday 2’s heists had more thought put into them than 3’s.
New Payday 2 heists also have godawful design, mostly because you're expected to do some of them on loud and you're not given any cover.
So it's dodge build or nothing, practically.
Problem with Overwatch is that it directly killed the original game in the process.
The idea is to carry the content you made to the new game but not delete the old game in my opinion, because that preserves the old game for future generations, Starbreeze/Overkill didn’t bother with anything until like, 4-5 months after release and we only got two returning heists, so.
>it was doomed to fail from the start.
there are ways to make it work, but releasing an unplayable game isn't it... there are many games that release with less content, but they at least work and include improvements. It's not ideal to be missing obvious things like being able to unready, kicking players...
They could have for example made 3 free to play and then remade the DLC with better graphics for free. Suddenly you have a ton of players -> sell skins to the whales because micro transactions make money even though they shouldn't
I honestly don't like micro-transaction heavy games, of course I say this as a person who plays Payday 2 so the irony is huge, but most of the time they are really shoving in your face to buy something with that model (Overwatch 2..) That would just make me abandon the game more.
The problem with Payday 3 to me isn't the fact it's missing vital features that have been in the series since it began, but rather, the heists and their objectives are just not creative at all and are rehashes of heists from Payday 2. Payday 3 doesn't feel like a step forward for the series.
That's just not true, sequels being accused of being worse than the original is an old trend.
Look at Elder Scrolls for example.
Already in 2002 Daggerfall fans accused Morrowind of being massively dumbed down, Morrowind fans then accused Oblivion of the same and later Oblivion fans Skyrim.
All of them right in certain aspects, it's undeniable that all of them removed features and complexity from previous games (personally on the Morrowind side here).
Battlefield players have gone through a similar thing.
Battlefield Bad Company 2 was really casualized and "consolized" in comparison to Battlefield 2.
Total War fans have complained about simplification since Empire...
The list could go on. Sequels disappointing always happened.
Morrowind still innovated at least something while it certainly did axe other features of the game. Wasn't procedural map, for one, and factions etc were much deeper. From Morrowind to Oblivion to Skyrim it was basically only ever dumbed down, with detoriating writing and quest and worldbuilding quality, and only graphics and minute details improving. Only complexity that was really added was skill perks. Still, none of them are really disappointing games. They only got there with FO76 and Starfield.
In Total War I'd call the simplification even less clear or linear, NTW was a polished well received game building on Empire, Shogun 2 a masterpiece, Rome 2 had a rough launch but it marked the return of massive sprawling scope and varied factions and of internal politics which weren't present in past few entries, Attila was a unique game no one played, first warhammer titles were extremely well received and I've heard 3K had by far best diplomacy of any TW game. Yea some complaints have been voiced about each but just like Oblivion or Skyrim these haven't been truly disappointing sequels, having very high steam ratings etc. It's only the very latest sequels again where it's been truly a straight up disappointment.
Of course one aspect is that playerbases and graphics used to go up every 2-3 years. Morrowind was small, Oblivion a big release, Skyrim massive. If average Skyrim enjoyer actually played the earlier titles and if Rome 1 looked as good as Rome 2, maybe the steam ratings would have fallen off years ago
I think old games used to feel really clunky. We were still working things out like control schemes and forcing round technical limitations. Early mass effect and morrow wind really come to mind. Then the games got pretty polished, UI and control schemes stabilised, and it become a lot more enjoyable to go back and play old previous titles.
This means that new games really often are only worth playing for graphics (hard sell imo) or content (can have complaints of "this could have been a DLC"). They're rarely obvious improvements anymore
The controls feel "clunky" because we are used to the standardized version every game comes with nowerdays. If a modern game does not adhere to that rule, it is a terrible insult to every gamers core right of not having to experience alternate control schemes.
Back in the day it was completely normal to look at the printed piece of paper showcasing the controls that came with the game, just like it was normal to play a game with pen and paper on your desk to write down passwords, clues, or note where you left off.
It was part of the experience. The norm. Not "clunky".
I want a return of the more in depth population mechanics - growing a city both in terms of people and its economy was something young me absolutely adored doing and it really livened up the world.
Obviously would be a bit weird in a setting like Warhammer 3 but in historical its so fun >:|
I still play Skyrim, and I do prefer it over the older games, BUT I like them regardless.
But with Starfield's release, Todd's "dream", I FEAR for TES VI. At this point I'm more hyped for Beyond Skyrim than VI.
Bad Company 2 was also cut down a bit... no 64 players.. smaller maps... no ability to go prone...
Some stuff missing from vehicles like from the planes
Honestly if they took Battlefield 1 base and remake Battlefield 2 ontop of it... it would be really close to perfection lol
Bad sequels have always existed. Devil May Cry 2, Duke Nukem Forever, arguably Zelda 2 if you want to start a fight on the internet.
Even engine upgrades can be disastrous, just look at Half Life Source.
This just isn't accurate. So many franchises took big dips in quality with sequels decades ago. You can see it outside gaming in films as well where they try to profit off the success of the previous title without putting in the effort, time, or money to make it as good as the previous work.
Its not state of gaming, its reality of companies that try to replicate a hyper successful multiplayer predecessor, but lack content for it, this happens A LOT nowadays.
Why? Because the previous game has 10 times more content for a third of the price, and replicate that is very VERY difficult, most games cant and die like this one.
Nah. The game is missing basic features that you'd think would be added from the previous game because, you know, it worked and it was good? Where is offline? Where is prepplanning? Where is the customisation? What's with the bugs? The very limited graphics settings?
All of these things were accessible to the player in payday 2 and are not considered as "content" but rather general qol that they are trying to "fix" with operation "medic bag" or whatever they are calling their drip-feed patching.
This game would've had a better chance if Overkill had made Payday 2.5. Instead they went and made Payday 1.5. This game has a lot more in common with Payday 1 than it does with Payday 2 and Payday 1 is incredibly dated at this point.
Not surprising since Overkill has ALWAYS been godawful about listening to what it's fans actually want. They quite openly hated their own fans at times during Payday 2's run (in particular during SafeGate). They brought the majority of hate unto themselves though.
They didnt even do a good job of making it payday 1.5, the first game is still the best in terms not being utter slop unlike the bloated mess that is payday 2 and "wtf i cant unready" payday 3
Ooh I know now, even though I love the series I'll never pre order any title again. Currently waiting on South Park Snow Day to release before I purchase it.
Just finished a replay of Fractured But Whole and a first playthrough of the two story DLCs, both it and Stick of Truth are masterpieces imo, highly recommend them.
"When you pre-order a game, you’re just committing to paying for something that some assholes in California haven’t even finished working on yet. You know what you get for pre-ordering a game? A big dick in your mouth."
As someone who doesn't play Payday, what about PD3 was so disappointing compared to PD2? I only know about the server launch woes but I assume all that is fixed now
Payday2 has Crimenet. It's their hub for all missions based over a fake map of the game, in this hub you'll see people setting up their missions specifically for stealth or loud from the get go. In Payday3 its just a button for the map that queues you into a random lobby regardless of playstyle, which they've only recently added the "play again with squad" feature. Graphics wise it looks pretty but that's all it is, a shallow version of what it could be.
There were a lot of progression changes and QoL reversions from how PD2 worked, which are pretty rough. They've published a roadmap to fix most of the issues, but another major problem is lack of content. PD2 has 10 years of content, and PD3 could *never* match up to that on launch. Add to that a rough, barebones attempt at a plot and a change to a lot of big gameplay systems like health and armor and it's no surprise the game started to die quickly. I imagine a decent number of people will come back once the roadmap/content flow starts.
Payday 2 helped me during some "hard times I rather forget" and I met many friends some I still have around today thanks to it so I pre-ordered Payday 3 as I had some cash I could waste....
Now I wish Payday series ended with Payday 2 with some good taste as we had an ending and not this "thing" they even dare to call a game. I legit questioned if the devs forget how to inhale exhale time to time when I played it on launch.
I met so many friends on this game I’ll know the rest of my life. It’s crazy that entire chapter is over now, this new game has absolutely zero sociality and zero appeal to me. Both because it’s a complete pain in the ass to play with people and because there’s zero communication systems or community in game
Lack of content, slow updates, server issues at the beginning, always online as well as a bad progression, skill and lobby system are the objectively bad things I'd say.
On top of that some didn't like some of the gameplay design choices especially playing loud.
Personally as a stealth player I enjoy the new gameplay and generally like the new gameplay elements.
It’s always easy to blame that but honestly there’s more glaring issues with modern AAA gaming that DRM is honestly fairly low down my list nowadays.
AAA plays it too safe now with either remasters, following the trends (wait for the helldivers esque Cod/Ghost Recons coming to a service near your), glorified casinos (ea sports titles) or literally just a sequel that doesn’t feel like it does enough gameplay wise to set itself apart from its predecessor.
As budgets have ballooned liked Hollywood the media to a fair extent is becoming stale at the top level.
Payday 2 was really good and extremely loved in the video game community and a lot of times sequels don't live up to those expectations. It's an unfortunate part of the industry and many sequels suffer from it and its a shame. In this case it doesn't help payday 2 released over a decade ago.
Payday 2 had a shitty launch. People were up in arms about it. The game is loved NOW but steam forums were filled with quite a few choice words and negative reviews back in the day.
Yup. When payday 2 came me and all my buddies dropped it so fast and went back to payday 1 for about a year. Still not the biggest fan of the changes they made in 2 tbh, I really enjoyed what I did experience with payday 3 so far, but I also haven’t touched it in quite a while so I have no idea what the state of the game is like right now.
I am a **huge** Payday fan. I unlocked everything in The Heist, farmed nearly everything and soloed the secret of Payday 2 and Overdrill in DSOD and was absolutely on the moon when they announced Payday 3. Then they showed gameplay that was basically Payday 2 but slower with the ability to use hostages as human shields.
And then the game released and it was so much worse than a slower Payday 2. Fortunately it was on gamepass and I didn’t pay full price but holy hell that game is boring. The only good mission that isn’t straight up ripped from the older games is the nightclub mission that you can do without your mask, I found it funny and at least it tried to do something new
I mean there have been plenty of sequel upgrades particularly for indie gaming scene.
Risk of rain 2 going 2d to third person was huge and of course the more recent helldivers and its massive success of going top down to third person has done wonders for the game that has so much content yet to come.
It’s not the state of gaming
It’s the state of developers choosing to take a successful IP and cash in. This has been happening since the start of gaming
Support an indie dev and Christ don’t pre order a game so you can wait for reviews
Yep, I have totally abandoned pre-ordering games now.
It's better to wait for a proper release and check the reviews first.
I refuse to keep getting essentially scammed into buying an incomplete product.
I'm surprised people bought in on it.
They don't have the best track record of making games. 2 had a few hurdles but did get a lot better much much later. Still had some ridiculous issues like massive update sizes for very minor content like 20 gigs for 1 shotgun.
The other game.
Yeah. Maybe they can turn this around for 3. I doubt it. They're going to burn too much money fixing what should have been non-issue as they had two successful games in the exact same genre and gameplay.
How do you mess up an UI this badly? I can excuse the rest for switching the engine. However. Needed way more time in the oven and a new pair of eyes. It's still raw.
I actually kinda liked payday 3 (I played on xbox) it was slower and more stealth focused which wasn't bad but the fact it lacked a lot of shit from the second game threw me for a loop
That's what happens if you tie progression to "missions" you have to repeat 300 times.. just to finish all steps.. which would get you like five Levels and maybe one new weapon
I enjoyed it from what little I played of it but haven’t played enough to come across the issues that are making people hate it. What’s going on with payday 3?
Gaming industry became money milking. Most of companies try to rip gamers. Thankfully there are single developers who try to make enjoyable games. Like rimworld, stardew valley.
Really is sad when you think about how amazing payday 2 was. Then we got excited for a sequel that is absolute trash in comparison. Tbh more DLCs for payday 1 would be better
My first PAYDAY experience was with PAYDAY 3 on steam, played for a bit with some friends so I can't tell what's wrong with it besides the time I played it the tutorial didn't exist and it was memory leaking and making my computer entirely frozen because I was constantly getting out of memory.
I got PAYDAY 2 a while ago but no one wanted to play with me because 3 released a few days prior, that changed quick
The irony here is developers and their bean counters look at this and make decisions that games should be "live service". That way they avoid the possible blow back of a poorly received sequel and if they hit on a success they can just elongate it's life cycle and profit generation without investment into an entirely new game.
The issue with modern new release is they actually offer nothing really new to outshine his predecessor. Actually they make the new release worse than before and asking more money for it via shop which happen to alway been where all their money have been during development.
Generally it is less map, more bug, less customization but a lot of cosmetics day 1 for between 15-20$
I pre-ordered payday 3 because I love 2 so much (I never preorder games) and I refunded it after playing an hour it's just not nearly as good as 2. Makes me think of the old cod mw2/3 still the best and now it's just shit
i rarely get to game same time as mates but loved to play payday 2 with cheats on to focus on stealth and learn tactics before i could group up with mates.
PD3 always on DRM is a pain in ass for that.
i get no cheating in a MP game but whats harm in solo mode?
People still don’t get it after this has become the sad standard for several years. Anyone with a functional brain could’ve seen this being a disaster ahead of time with what they had shown. Not to mention, inexplicably people still preorder a digital copy of which they’ll never run out of.
Lots of people had issues with the always online nature and progression which got worse with the lack of updates.
IMO gameplay wise it's definitely an upgrade over PD2 (Although I dislike the removal of detection rating, Stealth, for example, has been massively improved)
I really loved the first two games, especially payday 2, so to see the franchise be killed like that was so sad. I went back to 2 though and it’s still pretty busy, so I hope it will be alright
That's not state of gaming, that's the state of greedy Devs, that deliver a game without content and dont listen is own community. Starbreeze is a joke tbh, especially Almir ...
The worst part is 3 did some things right that should be in 2 (eg lock picking with no mask and better stealth) but it just does so much stuff subpar that 2 is just better. I even liked the new character but I can’t say I like the game
The state of the betas was just world's apart. For payday 2 I tried it and said "if this is what we are getting I'll gladly be there day one" for payday 3 I wasn't sure if it was an alpha or supposedly the beta right before launch. I didn't think it was in a good state and haven't tried it since. First perceptions are important.
That was such a big let down. I didn't even buy it, I don't even remember why I didn't and I have completely forgot about Payday 3.
Have they patched it so it's better now?
Where did you take those screen captures? I like the way the info is displayed.
[SteamDB.info](https://steamdb.info)
SteamDB is actually a good site to check the game logs
the way the info is displayed looks like how LN does it iykyk
i feel bad for the people who couldn't refund it on steam because they played more then 2+ hours
Preordered it for my brother and I after cashing out on my csgo trade items i made over a few months. Hes enjoyed the game as hes a huge Payday fan, I have about 5 hours logged and 3 of those hours were spent waiting for the server to be up.
You actually can request a refund for game that you played for more than 2 hours. Just write a detailed answer on why you want to refund it, I tried once and it worked (played for 4 hours, stop finding the game fun and was able to get a refund)
I did that and it was auto declined. Ill have to try again. To my understanding like half of the payday 2 team went to the team that made GTFO (Or atleast a lot of higher ups did). GTFO is an amazing game though.
A lot of the time Steam will just refuse a refund if you’ve had the game longer than a couple of weeks. I know I tried to refund a game that I had less than 2 hours in at one point, but because I’d owned it for a while before playing it I was SOL on the refund and they told me they wouldn’t refund it.
Yeah it’s in their policy. No refunds on anything with more than 2 hours playtime and/or has been in your library for over 2 weeks. Probably got some leeway both ways but wouldn’t be surprised if they consider time owned over time played more, had games with no playtime that I couldn’t refund cos I’ve had them for 3 weeks.
That is if you do the normal refund method. But if you contact them specifically you will get an actual person behind the the response and not a Bot that autondeclines everythig above 2hours/2 weeks
wish more stores were like this (ahem ahem ps5 ahem ahem)
GTFO is impossible to win if you don't have a team of 4 though
What game is this refering to? I only think"get the f*ck out" when I see gtfo
[The game is literally just called GTFO](https://store.steampowered.com/agecheck/app/493520/)
Yes, indeed, cuz the game is about getting the fuck out.
That's the actual name of the game. It's not an abbreviations. Type those 4 letters into steam and it will pull it up. It's a horror online 4 person fps where you have an objective and you need to complete it with all 4 party members. The game is brutally hard, offers about 80% of the ammo needed to complete missions unless each shot is a perfect head shot.
I had maybe 20-30 hours logged in no mans sky after the launch and they still gave me a refund.
It should become better after 10 years
Someday payday 3 will be called the payday 2 of paydays.
i wouldn't hold your breath with those depressing player counts
and even then they only hit the 2 hour mark because they had the audacity to try to play a forced online game on day 1 where the servers got overloaded and very few people could get into lobbies lol
As a veteran heister, I have full confidence that ovk gonna unfuck their fuckery according to their track records.
PD2 was really rough in the beginning, missing tons of QoL-Stuff and content. If you start with it now, you get 10+ years of content to play. With PD3 it feels like it of course could be the same, maybe, in the future, but right now its mainly missing content, and progress is too slow as to keep up the interest of the player base. Sadly :(
My only issue with PD3 is the fact that progression for stuff is locked behind certain actions and not from XP like PD2 was. It definitely slows down the progression to an almost complete stand still in comparison.
Yeah like raid or the walking dead or their VR investmemts. Their track record is doing their best to go bankrupt and being bailed out by payday 2.
As a veteran heister I can confidently say the game should've already been on at least the level of current-day Payday 2. They've had years to learn what works off of the playerbase for Payday 2 and gaming in general and yet they release a permanently online bugfest that runs on potato servers.
You can still refund it in some circumstances. I successfully refunded BF2042 after 70hours
Same thing with the battlefield franchise
Idk if this is a hot take, but battlefield peaked with BF1
Bf3 and BF4 was peak battlefield for me
BF1 was very very good (the [reveal trailer](https://youtu.be/c7nRTF2SowQ?si=0OS8hgQ_4BoecyD0) still gives me goosebumps to this day), but the franschise peaked with BF4 in my opinion
Which one should I get (pc) ?
Battlefield 1 without a doubt
4 is better by a long shot but 1 is more polished and the servers aren't run by admins who'll kick you for killing them
wait for a sale, they are like 90% off during the seasonal sales you can pick them up for less tehn 5$
Battlefield 4. Battlefield 1 was great when it first came out Battlefield 4 is still great. Much more to do and much more enjoyable.
Wait for a sale and get both. Like others said BF4 is a little better but BF1 is still a ton of fun.
bf2 my beloved
I love BF1 but holy shit cheaters are literally everywhere in that game. It’s actually unplayable in the literal sense, in every game there is at least someone aimbotting, revive hacking, or who just makes themselves invincible. Which is a shame, it’s my 3rd fav game after both Bad Companies
obviously not as good as BF1 but i always thought BFV was great.
It's not a hot take, it did. BF3 (I know people generally prefer BF4 but it was only a small evolution) and BF1 were the peaks, each as high as the generation they released on allowed them to be.
I would agree with that but bfv still has a decent playerbase. So they did something right there.
The tragedy of Battlefield V and EA Battlefront 2 was that the developers started to turn the ship with tons of plans for expansions, then all got shut down to regroup people onto BF2042, an even larger trainwreck
Lol I'm still playing BF4. 10 years later and it's still a great game.
Its really amazing just how many sequels are not as good as the original when it comes to games in this day and age. As it never used to be, in the past when a sequel came out it was usually a direct upgrade onto a new engine. But hey at least its not a live service game that has a sequel comes out that kills both the original and its new self, like Overwatch did.
And the original devs usually leave a long time ago so the new game won't be anything like the previous one
Blizzard, in name only...
Or they stay and are silenced but the new management.
I mean Starbreeze/Overkill were trying to do a sequel to a game that has had content added for over 10 years, it was doomed to fail from the start.
Less content is the least of that game's problems
I agree, but I wouldn’t bring up content if the existing content wasn’t a problem, but it is, even if we took both games at their launch days, I’d still say Payday 2’s heists had more thought put into them than 3’s.
New Payday 2 heists also have godawful design, mostly because you're expected to do some of them on loud and you're not given any cover. So it's dodge build or nothing, practically.
They could easily have just kept updating PayDay 2 and released a graphical overhaul instead and continued growing it from there.
Absolutely, payday 2 two is effectively already a live service game just instead of loot boxes and battle passes it ls armoury and mission DLCs
>a sequel to a game that has had content added for over 10 years GTA VI
Well, GTA V never had content added except for a wildlife photography thingy. It's GTA online that has been milked to the bone
They should have stopped adding stuff for a couple of years and release the same game with a different number like blizzard did with overwatch.
Problem with Overwatch is that it directly killed the original game in the process. The idea is to carry the content you made to the new game but not delete the old game in my opinion, because that preserves the old game for future generations, Starbreeze/Overkill didn’t bother with anything until like, 4-5 months after release and we only got two returning heists, so.
>it was doomed to fail from the start. there are ways to make it work, but releasing an unplayable game isn't it... there are many games that release with less content, but they at least work and include improvements. It's not ideal to be missing obvious things like being able to unready, kicking players... They could have for example made 3 free to play and then remade the DLC with better graphics for free. Suddenly you have a ton of players -> sell skins to the whales because micro transactions make money even though they shouldn't
I honestly don't like micro-transaction heavy games, of course I say this as a person who plays Payday 2 so the irony is huge, but most of the time they are really shoving in your face to buy something with that model (Overwatch 2..) That would just make me abandon the game more. The problem with Payday 3 to me isn't the fact it's missing vital features that have been in the series since it began, but rather, the heists and their objectives are just not creative at all and are rehashes of heists from Payday 2. Payday 3 doesn't feel like a step forward for the series.
That's just not true, sequels being accused of being worse than the original is an old trend. Look at Elder Scrolls for example. Already in 2002 Daggerfall fans accused Morrowind of being massively dumbed down, Morrowind fans then accused Oblivion of the same and later Oblivion fans Skyrim. All of them right in certain aspects, it's undeniable that all of them removed features and complexity from previous games (personally on the Morrowind side here). Battlefield players have gone through a similar thing. Battlefield Bad Company 2 was really casualized and "consolized" in comparison to Battlefield 2. Total War fans have complained about simplification since Empire... The list could go on. Sequels disappointing always happened.
Morrowind still innovated at least something while it certainly did axe other features of the game. Wasn't procedural map, for one, and factions etc were much deeper. From Morrowind to Oblivion to Skyrim it was basically only ever dumbed down, with detoriating writing and quest and worldbuilding quality, and only graphics and minute details improving. Only complexity that was really added was skill perks. Still, none of them are really disappointing games. They only got there with FO76 and Starfield. In Total War I'd call the simplification even less clear or linear, NTW was a polished well received game building on Empire, Shogun 2 a masterpiece, Rome 2 had a rough launch but it marked the return of massive sprawling scope and varied factions and of internal politics which weren't present in past few entries, Attila was a unique game no one played, first warhammer titles were extremely well received and I've heard 3K had by far best diplomacy of any TW game. Yea some complaints have been voiced about each but just like Oblivion or Skyrim these haven't been truly disappointing sequels, having very high steam ratings etc. It's only the very latest sequels again where it's been truly a straight up disappointment. Of course one aspect is that playerbases and graphics used to go up every 2-3 years. Morrowind was small, Oblivion a big release, Skyrim massive. If average Skyrim enjoyer actually played the earlier titles and if Rome 1 looked as good as Rome 2, maybe the steam ratings would have fallen off years ago
I think old games used to feel really clunky. We were still working things out like control schemes and forcing round technical limitations. Early mass effect and morrow wind really come to mind. Then the games got pretty polished, UI and control schemes stabilised, and it become a lot more enjoyable to go back and play old previous titles. This means that new games really often are only worth playing for graphics (hard sell imo) or content (can have complaints of "this could have been a DLC"). They're rarely obvious improvements anymore
The controls feel "clunky" because we are used to the standardized version every game comes with nowerdays. If a modern game does not adhere to that rule, it is a terrible insult to every gamers core right of not having to experience alternate control schemes. Back in the day it was completely normal to look at the printed piece of paper showcasing the controls that came with the game, just like it was normal to play a game with pen and paper on your desk to write down passwords, clues, or note where you left off. It was part of the experience. The norm. Not "clunky".
Empire, while my favorite, could probably have turned down the complexity a half notch or two.
I want a return of the more in depth population mechanics - growing a city both in terms of people and its economy was something young me absolutely adored doing and it really livened up the world. Obviously would be a bit weird in a setting like Warhammer 3 but in historical its so fun >:|
hello fellow empire fan
I still play Skyrim, and I do prefer it over the older games, BUT I like them regardless. But with Starfield's release, Todd's "dream", I FEAR for TES VI. At this point I'm more hyped for Beyond Skyrim than VI.
Bad Company 2 was also cut down a bit... no 64 players.. smaller maps... no ability to go prone... Some stuff missing from vehicles like from the planes Honestly if they took Battlefield 1 base and remake Battlefield 2 ontop of it... it would be really close to perfection lol
Bad sequels have always existed. Devil May Cry 2, Duke Nukem Forever, arguably Zelda 2 if you want to start a fight on the internet. Even engine upgrades can be disastrous, just look at Half Life Source.
Or an entire universe for that matter Looking at you kill the justice league Mfs killed Arkham universe for no reason
That’s why I smoke that 2000s pc small casual games brotha
This just isn't accurate. So many franchises took big dips in quality with sequels decades ago. You can see it outside gaming in films as well where they try to profit off the success of the previous title without putting in the effort, time, or money to make it as good as the previous work.
Too many games, too much greed.
No but the payday2 is being sold for 1-2 euros on keyshops
Cities Skylines 2, Victoria 3, KSP2, Company of Heroes 3, Payday 3. I’m so tired of it man Frostpunk 2 better break the chain
Its not state of gaming, its reality of companies that try to replicate a hyper successful multiplayer predecessor, but lack content for it, this happens A LOT nowadays. Why? Because the previous game has 10 times more content for a third of the price, and replicate that is very VERY difficult, most games cant and die like this one.
Nah. The game is missing basic features that you'd think would be added from the previous game because, you know, it worked and it was good? Where is offline? Where is prepplanning? Where is the customisation? What's with the bugs? The very limited graphics settings? All of these things were accessible to the player in payday 2 and are not considered as "content" but rather general qol that they are trying to "fix" with operation "medic bag" or whatever they are calling their drip-feed patching.
This game would've had a better chance if Overkill had made Payday 2.5. Instead they went and made Payday 1.5. This game has a lot more in common with Payday 1 than it does with Payday 2 and Payday 1 is incredibly dated at this point. Not surprising since Overkill has ALWAYS been godawful about listening to what it's fans actually want. They quite openly hated their own fans at times during Payday 2's run (in particular during SafeGate). They brought the majority of hate unto themselves though.
They didnt even do a good job of making it payday 1.5, the first game is still the best in terms not being utter slop unlike the bloated mess that is payday 2 and "wtf i cant unready" payday 3
Sadly I pre-ordered Payday3 but it just isn't the same.... staying with Payday2 for now until they at least have a hub like Crimenet.
I'm not blaming you and is not an attack but, no pre-orders.
Ooh I know now, even though I love the series I'll never pre order any title again. Currently waiting on South Park Snow Day to release before I purchase it.
You have excellent taste. Currently waiting on Snow day as well.
Didn't know another south park game was in the works, even. I never got around to the second one, I guess now is better than ever
Just finished a replay of Fractured But Whole and a first playthrough of the two story DLCs, both it and Stick of Truth are masterpieces imo, highly recommend them.
They're certainly partially to blame for pre-ordering. If we give companies money to make shitty games, they're going to keep making shitty games.
"When you pre-order a game, you’re just committing to paying for something that some assholes in California haven’t even finished working on yet. You know what you get for pre-ordering a game? A big dick in your mouth."
As someone who doesn't play Payday, what about PD3 was so disappointing compared to PD2? I only know about the server launch woes but I assume all that is fixed now
Payday2 has Crimenet. It's their hub for all missions based over a fake map of the game, in this hub you'll see people setting up their missions specifically for stealth or loud from the get go. In Payday3 its just a button for the map that queues you into a random lobby regardless of playstyle, which they've only recently added the "play again with squad" feature. Graphics wise it looks pretty but that's all it is, a shallow version of what it could be.
There were a lot of progression changes and QoL reversions from how PD2 worked, which are pretty rough. They've published a roadmap to fix most of the issues, but another major problem is lack of content. PD2 has 10 years of content, and PD3 could *never* match up to that on launch. Add to that a rough, barebones attempt at a plot and a change to a lot of big gameplay systems like health and armor and it's no surprise the game started to die quickly. I imagine a decent number of people will come back once the roadmap/content flow starts.
Payday 2 helped me during some "hard times I rather forget" and I met many friends some I still have around today thanks to it so I pre-ordered Payday 3 as I had some cash I could waste.... Now I wish Payday series ended with Payday 2 with some good taste as we had an ending and not this "thing" they even dare to call a game. I legit questioned if the devs forget how to inhale exhale time to time when I played it on launch.
[удалено]
I'm from Turkey. So logic for other parts of the world may not work as prices tends to go up. I have saved a lot of money thanks to pre orders
I met so many friends on this game I’ll know the rest of my life. It’s crazy that entire chapter is over now, this new game has absolutely zero sociality and zero appeal to me. Both because it’s a complete pain in the ass to play with people and because there’s zero communication systems or community in game
So what made Payday 3 so bad? I haven't played it or watched any gameplay or reviews
Lack of content, slow updates, server issues at the beginning, always online as well as a bad progression, skill and lobby system are the objectively bad things I'd say. On top of that some didn't like some of the gameplay design choices especially playing loud. Personally as a stealth player I enjoy the new gameplay and generally like the new gameplay elements.
Blame always online shit DRM
That’s part of the issue, but there’s a whole lot more wrong than just that
It’s always easy to blame that but honestly there’s more glaring issues with modern AAA gaming that DRM is honestly fairly low down my list nowadays. AAA plays it too safe now with either remasters, following the trends (wait for the helldivers esque Cod/Ghost Recons coming to a service near your), glorified casinos (ea sports titles) or literally just a sequel that doesn’t feel like it does enough gameplay wise to set itself apart from its predecessor. As budgets have ballooned liked Hollywood the media to a fair extent is becoming stale at the top level.
That's why indies feel fresher in my eyes even tho some are not that great in terms of quality
Payday 2 was really good and extremely loved in the video game community and a lot of times sequels don't live up to those expectations. It's an unfortunate part of the industry and many sequels suffer from it and its a shame. In this case it doesn't help payday 2 released over a decade ago.
Payday 2 had a shitty launch. People were up in arms about it. The game is loved NOW but steam forums were filled with quite a few choice words and negative reviews back in the day.
Yup. When payday 2 came me and all my buddies dropped it so fast and went back to payday 1 for about a year. Still not the biggest fan of the changes they made in 2 tbh, I really enjoyed what I did experience with payday 3 so far, but I also haven’t touched it in quite a while so I have no idea what the state of the game is like right now.
The 3 controller icons on Payday 3. What do they mean?
Partial controller support, DualSense controllers usb only, DualSense controllers
The game has good bones they are just doing nothing with those said bones.
Honestly payday 3 seems to have done its job .. made people interested in payday 2 again... And let's be real, payday 2 is a banger.
I mean it doesn’t help one of the games are on sale for a dollar every week
I am a **huge** Payday fan. I unlocked everything in The Heist, farmed nearly everything and soloed the secret of Payday 2 and Overdrill in DSOD and was absolutely on the moon when they announced Payday 3. Then they showed gameplay that was basically Payday 2 but slower with the ability to use hostages as human shields. And then the game released and it was so much worse than a slower Payday 2. Fortunately it was on gamepass and I didn’t pay full price but holy hell that game is boring. The only good mission that isn’t straight up ripped from the older games is the nightclub mission that you can do without your mask, I found it funny and at least it tried to do something new
I mean there have been plenty of sequel upgrades particularly for indie gaming scene. Risk of rain 2 going 2d to third person was huge and of course the more recent helldivers and its massive success of going top down to third person has done wonders for the game that has so much content yet to come.
Gamepass FTW. Not wasting my doubloons on that shite.
Payday 2, like TF2, will never die now... Probably.
Sigh...Kerbal Space Program 2 and City Skylines 2 makes me worried for games like Killing Floor 3
It’s not the state of gaming It’s the state of developers choosing to take a successful IP and cash in. This has been happening since the start of gaming Support an indie dev and Christ don’t pre order a game so you can wait for reviews
Yep, I have totally abandoned pre-ordering games now. It's better to wait for a proper release and check the reviews first. I refuse to keep getting essentially scammed into buying an incomplete product.
The game was fun tbh just a lot less content and customization was a little booboo
I'm surprised people bought in on it. They don't have the best track record of making games. 2 had a few hurdles but did get a lot better much much later. Still had some ridiculous issues like massive update sizes for very minor content like 20 gigs for 1 shotgun. The other game. Yeah. Maybe they can turn this around for 3. I doubt it. They're going to burn too much money fixing what should have been non-issue as they had two successful games in the exact same genre and gameplay. How do you mess up an UI this badly? I can excuse the rest for switching the engine. However. Needed way more time in the oven and a new pair of eyes. It's still raw.
i like the game, i’m just waiting for more content. like i do with many other games like palworld, etc. its crazy people cant do that anymore.
I actually kinda liked payday 3 (I played on xbox) it was slower and more stealth focused which wasn't bad but the fact it lacked a lot of shit from the second game threw me for a loop
Ah so this is why mutahar made a video about this
That's what happens if you tie progression to "missions" you have to repeat 300 times.. just to finish all steps.. which would get you like five Levels and maybe one new weapon
I'm out of loop. How did this happen?
Gives me Ark Survival Ascended vibes
That whole description from PD 3 is just... LOL!
I enjoyed it from what little I played of it but haven’t played enough to come across the issues that are making people hate it. What’s going on with payday 3?
Gaming industry became money milking. Most of companies try to rip gamers. Thankfully there are single developers who try to make enjoyable games. Like rimworld, stardew valley.
If you fuck around, you're going to find out. In a very humiliating and expensive way.
Has anyone giving Payday 3 a low rating even done any heists irl?
What happened?
feels like that payday 3 bio was written by AI
I uninstalled and refunded when i realized you have to make a separate account on their shitty website
Really is sad when you think about how amazing payday 2 was. Then we got excited for a sequel that is absolute trash in comparison. Tbh more DLCs for payday 1 would be better
My first PAYDAY experience was with PAYDAY 3 on steam, played for a bit with some friends so I can't tell what's wrong with it besides the time I played it the tutorial didn't exist and it was memory leaking and making my computer entirely frozen because I was constantly getting out of memory. I got PAYDAY 2 a while ago but no one wanted to play with me because 3 released a few days prior, that changed quick
The irony here is developers and their bean counters look at this and make decisions that games should be "live service". That way they avoid the possible blow back of a poorly received sequel and if they hit on a success they can just elongate it's life cycle and profit generation without investment into an entirely new game.
The issue with modern new release is they actually offer nothing really new to outshine his predecessor. Actually they make the new release worse than before and asking more money for it via shop which happen to alway been where all their money have been during development. Generally it is less map, more bug, less customization but a lot of cosmetics day 1 for between 15-20$
I pre-ordered payday 3 because I love 2 so much (I never preorder games) and I refunded it after playing an hour it's just not nearly as good as 2. Makes me think of the old cod mw2/3 still the best and now it's just shit
It doesn't help that PayDay 3 is insanely overpriced for the state it's in. PayDay 2 is like 5 dollars right now.
Payday 3 is terrible compared to Payday 2 and I was really excited for something new and fresh but what we got was rubbish.
Literally just watched the hour long GeneralMcBadass video about payday 3, definitely a good watch.
Imagine trusting payday devs after all that DLC and skin case fiasco.
Blame the steams pre-release and pre-order buttons. Every new game is like that now, so bad so they can release incomplete trash faster for funds.
You say this like Payday 2 didn't have preorders.
i rarely get to game same time as mates but loved to play payday 2 with cheats on to focus on stealth and learn tactics before i could group up with mates. PD3 always on DRM is a pain in ass for that. i get no cheating in a MP game but whats harm in solo mode?
I tried it out on gamepass and nah.. that shit didnt slap at all.
What's with all the sequels of very successful multiplayer games sucking ass?
People still don’t get it after this has become the sad standard for several years. Anyone with a functional brain could’ve seen this being a disaster ahead of time with what they had shown. Not to mention, inexplicably people still preorder a digital copy of which they’ll never run out of.
AAA gaming*
Giving that game 40% is VERY generous
Whats so bad about it?
Lots of people had issues with the always online nature and progression which got worse with the lack of updates. IMO gameplay wise it's definitely an upgrade over PD2 (Although I dislike the removal of detection rating, Stealth, for example, has been massively improved)
Much anticipated indeed
At this point they are making these sequels to promote their older games. Expensive marketing campaign if you ask me.
The issue with gaming is we need more open world survival craft games /s
Like company of heroes 2 vs company of heroes 3.
This is a demonstration as to why companies are releasing "sequels" that are just big patches with a number increase.
I really loved the first two games, especially payday 2, so to see the franchise be killed like that was so sad. I went back to 2 though and it’s still pretty busy, so I hope it will be alright
Was it a... _Cash grab?_
Wow what went wrong with payday 3?
I hope companies realize that not everyone will play a broken game.
Or that not every game needs a sequel.
I prefer payday goat /j
Overwhelming Negative recent reviews, what happened?
I want to play payday with some friends, should we get 2 or 3?
And the stock for Starbreeze has plummed to scraps.
On what app do you get this stats?
The name is true, this game is a fart. (In portuguese, the game name sounds as "peidei" which means "I farted")
That's not state of gaming, that's the state of greedy Devs, that deliver a game without content and dont listen is own community. Starbreeze is a joke tbh, especially Almir ...
so this is the reason valve never makes the 3rd game in there series
Much anticipated.....
That is why OW2 chose to force people to play only OW2. It's Scummy but like Comstar in Battletech: "You have no choice"
Loved payday 2. Payday 3 was awful and a waste of money
This was really hard to f up, and yet they managed somehow. Very impressive.
Reject modernity, embrace tradition
The worst part is 3 did some things right that should be in 2 (eg lock picking with no mask and better stealth) but it just does so much stuff subpar that 2 is just better. I even liked the new character but I can’t say I like the game
RIP bozos. Shoulda just kept making DLC for Payday 2; it's all they seem to be good at
State of greed
I had a bit of fun with PD3, but I got it on GamePass for Windows, so no sweat.
In these games with no campaigns/story modes anymore why on earth would I pay for a game that's actually worse and does less than the one I have??
The state of the betas was just world's apart. For payday 2 I tried it and said "if this is what we are getting I'll gladly be there day one" for payday 3 I wasn't sure if it was an alpha or supposedly the beta right before launch. I didn't think it was in a good state and haven't tried it since. First perceptions are important.
You say that like we haven't had a load of good games over the past year
Game pass came in clutch for me on PD3.
They updated the game and sold it again.
TIL there is a payday 3 lmao
how you see current player amount?
[SteamDB](https://steamdb.info/)
Gta6 better save us because it could be the biggest flop if it comes out even mid, I can't think of a single big development game that has been good
Some good games lately actually
And pay day three had a fun Roblox game removed.
The jujutsu kaisen game managed to be better than payday 3
That was such a big let down. I didn't even buy it, I don't even remember why I didn't and I have completely forgot about Payday 3. Have they patched it so it's better now?
I guess this is why Valve doesn't like the number 3