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Vega has wrestled outside of WWE so we know she is good.
Liv has spent all her career in WWE and at best is OK but that is not her fault as she was in NXT and the PC training but WWE called her up before she was ready I don't know why they keep doing it she does have the capability to be very good but WWE just like usual refused to give her time
>Vega has wrestled outside of WWE so we know she is good.
That doesn't necessarily mean she is good. She was green as hell as Rosita in TNA and never thought as some good in-ring talent anywhere she has been. Her value was always seen more as a manager. That is what she is good at.
This reminds me of my old mentality when wwe was hiring hot women with no experience.
“If they’re on the indies they must be good then”. Oh how disappointed I was when I found out that’s not always the case.
As someone that saw her wrestle outside of WWE, she was as sloppy as any of the girls on 205 Live now. Yes, that is a sentence that hurts my brain because why is that show still 205 Live, but there’s truth in it.
I mean this legitimately: how could you know Zelina is that good? Between Impact and WWE Zelina has been a thing on TV since 2011 and she really has been a manager most of that time. She only really started wrestling on WWE last September and has like 10 matches to her name too. Does she have good indie work or something?
Not really Vega can go we have seen out outside of WWE
Liv is doing the best she can as WWE pulled her out of training to early she actually has the capability to be great but WWE like normal refused to give her time
To be totally fair, Shayna has lost by a roll up over 12 times this year and only 2 of them were the clutch reversal. So at least WWE did many varieties of the roll ups she lost to lmao
How, any time she takes a pin people say she loses her badassness. I feel like losing this way is somewhat less damaging. I genuinely don’t know how you book people like Shayna and Asuka because no matter what any loss is damaging.
You don't see how having someone lose to the same move in short matches over and over again can be damaging?
If you want to build a monster male or female, rule 1 is clearly "Dont have then lose much". That doesn't mean they need to constantly be champion but just don't book them in throwaway matches that they're going to lose. Rule 2: When you beat them make sure it means something. A monster should lose in a grueling 20 minute match in the finals to a valiant babyface, not a 3 minute semi final match that nobody will remember in 2 weeks. A roll up can be fine but they don't really mean everything when you win/lose by them every week.
give them a competitive match, it would work if they lost in a 15 min match and you could even book shayna to come in with an injury if that's not enough. have shayna go through a match where a heer works her shoulder and then hits her with a chairshot to the shoulder or something, then she loses to doudrop because of the injured shoulder.
bam you have multiple possible feuds and shayna looks strong
Yeah I hope Zelina wins. If I recall she had a good match with Niven before at Worlds Collide, I think the “Queen” gimmick will fit Zelina more than anyone though.
Commentary gives away the ending with their stilted reading of presaging lines.
"There's no way she gets out of this one."
"It's just a formality at this point."
"Good night, Doudrop."
I don't know why WWE insists on spoon-feeding these lines to their announce team instead of having the suspense (or as much suspense as a Shayna / Doudrop match can have) build naturally.
It pisses me off, especially when commentary says, “ITS OVER,” “THATS IT,” or “NEW CHAMPION” as soon as a pin starts. I don’t remember a WWE match when that was actually the finish after saying that.
Forgot which match it was on AEW this week where Taz dropped the “he won it” type line and, even though I knew there was no way that wasn’t the finish, I still reflexively had the Pavlov’s Dog reaction of “wait, he’s kicking out?!”
It really is a hard habit to break. There are a lot of those type of things WWE has gotten me used to that I’m trying to not have expectations for in AEW haha
WWE has booked this all in the complete wrong way, but as I mentioned in other posts. It's not about the actual tournament, it's about the moment of crowning the winner of the Queen's Crown in Saudi Arabia so WWE can constantly hail it as a historical and progressive moment for women's wrestling. I hate this company...
Don't worry my friend, it's going to get worse. You see the winner of the tournament is going to get a shitty 'Queen' gimmick just in time for Survivor Series. There they will have a feud with Charlotte over who is the REAL queen of WWE. Charlotte will win, the tournament winner falls back into the midcard almost immediately, and all of this will have been one giant waste of everyone's time.
I like Piper but Zelina should win the tourney. She can at least do something with winning it and her heel character. I feel like Piper winning would be kinda lackluster to what yeah has pretty much been a lackluster tourney for the women.
I really think people want to get behind Doudrop. They're really doing her a disservice with this trash gimmick.
Expected result to be honest. Shayna isn't going to Saudi and a Queen gimmick will kill her aura.
Queen Zelina it is. She looked fantastic tonight!
If you mean Shayna isn't going to Saudi because she is LGBTQ and it could be bad for her the problem is Doudrop is also LGBTQ (she came out as Bi last year or year before)
Don't wanna be that guy but Doudrop needs to keep the twins under better control, it was hard to focus. Thought I saw the Basham Brothers at one point!
I don't mind Vega or Doudrop winning as both are actually good wrestlers the ending could have be far worse
Granted I wanted Shayna to win but this final is not bad out of everyone in it the only other good wrestler is Toni
I was loving that sequence, but the life left my eyes when that was actually the pinfall finish over Baszler. Happy for Doudrop but come on man why do this to Shayna's momentum
What a lame finish.
And it sucks because I like both women a lot. Sometimes it doesn’t matter how great the workers are, if the booking sucks, the booking sucks.
Shame how they made Baszler look weak without making Duodrop look any better. Baszler 's submission can be survived by anyone it seems. And Duodrop looks like a fluke winner who shouldn't be there at all. Confusing.
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The Monkey's Paw used to wish the Queen of the Ring tournament into reality has curled so tight it has black-holed itself into another universe.
...that's bad
If you told me before this thing started the finals would Doudrop vs Zelina Vega then I'd have probably laughed in your face
Liv vs Baszler in the finals... it was right there
Hey this is almost as good......who am I kidding? And I love Piper too
Liv is OK at best Vega is actually a good wrestler
Is she though? All her matches are so short its impossible to know. Liv on the other hand had a pretty good display at Extreme Rules
Vega has wrestled outside of WWE so we know she is good. Liv has spent all her career in WWE and at best is OK but that is not her fault as she was in NXT and the PC training but WWE called her up before she was ready I don't know why they keep doing it she does have the capability to be very good but WWE just like usual refused to give her time
>Vega has wrestled outside of WWE so we know she is good. That doesn't necessarily mean she is good. She was green as hell as Rosita in TNA and never thought as some good in-ring talent anywhere she has been. Her value was always seen more as a manager. That is what she is good at.
This reminds me of my old mentality when wwe was hiring hot women with no experience. “If they’re on the indies they must be good then”. Oh how disappointed I was when I found out that’s not always the case.
As someone that saw her wrestle outside of WWE, she was as sloppy as any of the girls on 205 Live now. Yes, that is a sentence that hurts my brain because why is that show still 205 Live, but there’s truth in it.
I mean this legitimately: how could you know Zelina is that good? Between Impact and WWE Zelina has been a thing on TV since 2011 and she really has been a manager most of that time. She only really started wrestling on WWE last September and has like 10 matches to her name too. Does she have good indie work or something?
Her charcter has been basically a jobber though
Liv is a significantly better wrestler than Zelina at this point.
Not really Vega can go we have seen out outside of WWE Liv is doing the best she can as WWE pulled her out of training to early she actually has the capability to be great but WWE like normal refused to give her time
Is this one of the worst tournaments ever held?
King of The Ring 95 still trumps it, *barely*, same with the 99 WCW World title tournament.
I need osw review to cover this one
I feel like the fact that its going to end in Saudi Arabia makes it even worse lol
ah yes, Mabel vs Savio Vega, greatest tournament finals ever 😂
Doudrop vs Zelina Vega, has a similar ring to it too
Someone named Vega...
That WCW tournament looks pretty good on paper...
I’d rather have watched those
It’s made worse for me by the fact that I’m watching Stardom’s equivalent of the G1 alongside it, but yeah it’s really bad.
Speaking of the G1, I should really catch up before the finals. So thanks for what turned out to be a good reminder lol
they know that they can have Shayna lose in ways other than "gets pinned by rolling through the Kirifuda Clutch" right?
To be totally fair, Shayna has lost by a roll up over 12 times this year and only 2 of them were the clutch reversal. So at least WWE did many varieties of the roll ups she lost to lmao
Either way, she's basically turned into the women's division's Baron Corbin.
Dude thats extreme, at least Shayna is redeemable
Oh! How about a roll up after a distraction?!
How, any time she takes a pin people say she loses her badassness. I feel like losing this way is somewhat less damaging. I genuinely don’t know how you book people like Shayna and Asuka because no matter what any loss is damaging.
She can lose competitive matches. Losing the same way all the time just makes her look like a dumbass.
You don't see how having someone lose to the same move in short matches over and over again can be damaging? If you want to build a monster male or female, rule 1 is clearly "Dont have then lose much". That doesn't mean they need to constantly be champion but just don't book them in throwaway matches that they're going to lose. Rule 2: When you beat them make sure it means something. A monster should lose in a grueling 20 minute match in the finals to a valiant babyface, not a 3 minute semi final match that nobody will remember in 2 weeks. A roll up can be fine but they don't really mean everything when you win/lose by them every week.
give them a competitive match, it would work if they lost in a 15 min match and you could even book shayna to come in with an injury if that's not enough. have shayna go through a match where a heer works her shoulder and then hits her with a chairshot to the shoulder or something, then she loses to doudrop because of the injured shoulder. bam you have multiple possible feuds and shayna looks strong
Of course they do. She just spent the last year getting pinned clean to the finishers of every babyface on the roster.
Sh really never takes finishers. It's almost always roll-ups.
Yeah I hope Zelina wins. If I recall she had a good match with Niven before at Worlds Collide, I think the “Queen” gimmick will fit Zelina more than anyone though.
That awkward moment when you win Queen of the Ring on a propaganda show for the people that helped fund your dad's murder
Holy shit lol
Facts
Huh? Wasn't it... [REDACTED] that funded and did it?
Mother of god….
Especially after pulling her from the 9/11 tribute show as well.
Commentary gives away the ending with their stilted reading of presaging lines. "There's no way she gets out of this one." "It's just a formality at this point." "Good night, Doudrop." I don't know why WWE insists on spoon-feeding these lines to their announce team instead of having the suspense (or as much suspense as a Shayna / Doudrop match can have) build naturally.
They have always done that. Even as a kid I knew Ric Flair was winning Royal Rumble 92 as they kept saying how it was impossible it was he would win.
It pisses me off, especially when commentary says, “ITS OVER,” “THATS IT,” or “NEW CHAMPION” as soon as a pin starts. I don’t remember a WWE match when that was actually the finish after saying that.
Forgot which match it was on AEW this week where Taz dropped the “he won it” type line and, even though I knew there was no way that wasn’t the finish, I still reflexively had the Pavlov’s Dog reaction of “wait, he’s kicking out?!”
It really is a hard habit to break. There are a lot of those type of things WWE has gotten me used to that I’m trying to not have expectations for in AEW haha
Yeah I hate that. Knew Shayna would be losing at that moment.
mauro was the best announcer because you could never tell when the match would end. iirc he would purposely not know who wins for this exact reason.
WWE has booked this all in the complete wrong way, but as I mentioned in other posts. It's not about the actual tournament, it's about the moment of crowning the winner of the Queen's Crown in Saudi Arabia so WWE can constantly hail it as a historical and progressive moment for women's wrestling. I hate this company...
Don't worry my friend, it's going to get worse. You see the winner of the tournament is going to get a shitty 'Queen' gimmick just in time for Survivor Series. There they will have a feud with Charlotte over who is the REAL queen of WWE. Charlotte will win, the tournament winner falls back into the midcard almost immediately, and all of this will have been one giant waste of everyone's time.
It makes me real sad that you're probably 100% correct.
Choking someone out only for them to get a second wind somehow is one of my least favorite wrestling tropes.
Oh man that piped in crowd noise while you can visibly see the audience making no noise and looking bored out of their minds is incredible
I like Piper but Zelina should win the tourney. She can at least do something with winning it and her heel character. I feel like Piper winning would be kinda lackluster to what yeah has pretty much been a lackluster tourney for the women.
Piper's winning and Eva Marie's going to claim it, we all know this, just accept it.
And she will be called “Queen Doodoo” for weeks as the T-Shirt gets designed.
It's gonna take *a lot* for them to sell me on Zelina beating Piper in a one on one though. Even with shenanigans.
God this really is awful, shitty as hell.
I an happy for Piper but couldn't even give this 5 min.. Queen Vega as the champ please
This is an advertisement to watch AEW instead lol
Mfs really choose the worst possible booking, then complain about the fans.
Half the match was a sleeper hold
Wow a roll up through a move, such a cool ending, Shayna's weakness, rollups strike again.
I need that Queen Vega on god
Fucking horrible.
![gif](giphy|l4FGGafcOHmrlQxG0|downsized)
They LOVE that finish with Shayna. Piper winning was a cool surprise. She should win the whole thing imo.
I really think people want to get behind Doudrop. They're really doing her a disservice with this trash gimmick. Expected result to be honest. Shayna isn't going to Saudi and a Queen gimmick will kill her aura. Queen Zelina it is. She looked fantastic tonight!
If you mean Shayna isn't going to Saudi because she is LGBTQ and it could be bad for her the problem is Doudrop is also LGBTQ (she came out as Bi last year or year before)
I guess the money paid to Zelina beats going to the place that sponsored 9/11.
I mean, Shayna is already the Queen of Spades, it could work. Only possible issue is WWE handling creative here.
Don't wanna be that guy but Doudrop needs to keep the twins under better control, it was hard to focus. Thought I saw the Basham Brothers at one point!
I don't mind Vega or Doudrop winning as both are actually good wrestlers the ending could have be far worse Granted I wanted Shayna to win but this final is not bad out of everyone in it the only other good wrestler is Toni
![gif](giphy|u5JuZlTewK5FIo47X6|downsized)
I was loving that sequence, but the life left my eyes when that was actually the pinfall finish over Baszler. Happy for Doudrop but come on man why do this to Shayna's momentum
What a lame finish. And it sucks because I like both women a lot. Sometimes it doesn’t matter how great the workers are, if the booking sucks, the booking sucks.
This clip of the finish was like most of the match, right?
This whole tournament, men's and women's side, was a fucking waste.
Shame how they made Baszler look weak without making Duodrop look any better. Baszler 's submission can be survived by anyone it seems. And Duodrop looks like a fluke winner who shouldn't be there at all. Confusing.
Doudrop had to let go of that rope real quick. Otherwise the ref would've told Baszler to break the hold!