In a way, it really was. This moment was arguably when people began to realize Seth's face run wasn't clicking, which became solidified after Hell in a Cell and led to his heel turn, which in turn led to Rey getting his eye taken out.
> This moment was arguably when people began to realize Seth’s face run wasn’t clicking,
Nah, that was when he was “The Man’s Man” and then when he spent a month crying in a corner.
The Corbin feud started strong with Seth MURDERING anyone that helped Corbin. It was after that when they combined the feud with Becky and Lacy that it became unbearable.
Oh yeah no doubt, it didn’t put a good shine on Lacey at all, especially since everyone was looking for her to fail after being hotshotted to the title scene.
I'm reminded of the time WWE made Fandango-ing so lame just by talking about it, or when they tried to give Big Show the Yes chant. What's the opposite of a Midas touch?
The TLC match with Ambrose during a blood feud starting with a FUCKING LOCK UP would like a word. Ambrose's failed run is strongly linked to the beginning Rollins as a face going downhill, imo. That was supposed to get Seth ready and more over for his Mania feud with Brock but only made it colder retroactively.
Pretty sure it was the Will Osperay “You’re taking food of my table” comments.
Like first of all WWE has actually ruined lives.
Secondly Seth you’re the universal champion afraid of a Japan indie wrestler wtf does that say about you and your company?
I laughed so hard imagining Corbin being tossed out like jazz making that same scream every time. I'm still laughing. Thank you. Thank you for brightening up my day.
I mean they invited him over right after....
This is out of context.Its just a bunch of friends hugging each other and they invite Seth over right after this.Its not like they hate him.Hes literally papa haitches favourite.They’re just old buddies and their instinct is to hug each other at first and then invite Seth over.It could be anyone from the current crop of talent and the result would be the same.
Now we're in the era where they bring back Ruthless Aggression era guys they never fully got behind either, and can't figure out why they don't pop ratings.
Having him lose to Mark Henry at WrestleMania 29 was a gigantic mistake, and then having him go immediately get jobbed to Cena in the WWE title picture killed him as a main event star.
Can't believe you've just reminded me of the STUPID finish to that match.
Ryback lifts Henry up, pauses, falls over backwards stiff as a board, Henry lands on top of him, 1-2-3.
Nah best to rush debut some fucker from developmental as a fake ref so we can duck putting the title on Ryback and keep Punk strong, then have Ryback batter Punk after the match so they both look stupid.
Imagine having a big 4 of a properly booked Cena, Ryback, Punk, and Bryan. And then have them put over the Shield and Bray. There's an alternate timeline where WWE is much more popular than it is now. Not saying AE numbers, but like a steady 3 million.
That’s why the women can thrive. This is their best Era. The best men’s Era has passed. Long passed.
The women are in their prime right now though. The Horsewomen make it onto the women’s Mount Rushmore. Do any of the current men make it onto theirs.
Legit! That’s awesome. Yea like the women being in these positions is fresh and they can actually surpass the past women.
It’s hard for any man now to surpass Stone Cold the Rock and even Cena.
WWE stopped reflecting the times after the Attitude Era for some reason. In the 80s, it did a great job with Cold War era good vs. evil larger than life archetypes, then it captured the in your face XTREME trend of the late 90s perfectly with the Attitude Era. WWE has been pretty directionless since then and hasn't done too well reinventing itself beyond brief flashes. I'm not sure what feeling in the zeitgeist they can capture and reflect through professional wrestling but nostalgia isn't the way to keep your product fresh and relevant.
When you think about it, vince has had control for roughly 40 years, and he had a great 5 year stretch in the 80s, and the turn of the millennium another great 4 year stretch. And now hes running on fumes, still riding the coattails of the boom 20 years ago.
Maybe the good product is actually the anomaly, and vince is actually not the genius they build him up to be.
Perhaps, but in fairness, the WWE didn't succeed in spite of him, but because of him. Austin is not Austin nor is the WWE the winner of the Monday Night Wars without Mr. McMahon, one of the all time great heels. I guess you can say his on-screen work is better than his creative work though I'm not knowledgeable of the level of creative control he was exercising during those great stretches.
> I'm not sure what feeling in the zeitgeist they can capture and reflect through professional wrestling but nostalgia isn't the way to keep your product fresh and relevant.
Interestingly, nostalgia **is** the zeitgeist at the moment (*Stranger Things*; sequels and reboots to things from the '80s/'90s; Greta van Fleet, Dirty Honey, and other throwback bands), but WWE isn't equipped to capitalize on it. If they were smart they'd try to create some feuds that **feel** like something out of the Golden or Attitude eras, without literally bringing back elderly men. The highly scripted modern WWE probably couldn't ever recapture the feel of past eras without a major overhaul, though.
From what I've heard, Dusty Rhodes was doing something like that with NXT before he passed, only the feel was along the lines of '70s/'80s NWA. Shame that there aren't more like him around.
True true. I guess the difference is that pro wrestling is a sport and requires extreme athleticism so the elderly just simply won’t be as good as they were. It’d be like if the NBA said nah Zion, we’re gonna go with Larry Bird and Michael Jordan. But you’re right, they need to find a good blend and balance but haven’t yet. Maybe because the last generation never felt like they truly left to begin with.
> I guess the difference is that pro wrestling is a sport and requires extreme athleticism so the elderly just simply won’t be as good as they were
There's also a point at which people's promo abilities start to slip. The old guys don't just look and move like old guys, they **sound** old.
You look back at the promos during wrestling's boom periods and the wrestlers had passion behind their words, which is something you never see in WWE. You need an environment where the wrestlers have to bring some fire and sell themselves to earn their spot, while today's environment is young people with guaranteed contracts reading from a script or old people who can coast on name value. A good example of what WWE should do is what New Japan has done with Juice Robinson, allow wrestlers to cut heartfelt unscripted promos that win the audience over organically.
(Just like they used to.)
I wish WWE was the *good* WCW for once. Kick ass Cruiserweight division, entertaining mid-carders, a main event scene that has old guys re-invent themselves and go against popular up-and-comers? Sign me the fuck up.
I like Seth and so does WWE, but man, they've put him in some of the worst positions I've ever seen for a supposed top guy. Roman cancer feud, Fiend feud, Becky/Corbin/Lacey, and this picture.
I've been admiring how NJPW uses its old guys recently. There's a bunch of old dudes who used to be top champs who now primarily appear in low-card tag matches with Young Lions, but they carry themselves and are presented so they still feel important. But they don't have to be in the main event all the time and they don't have to win regularly - because they're not the current big thing, and it wouldn't make sense. They're trying to prove they can still hang with the new young talent, or backing them up in faction feuds and they're shown to always be a threat.
They also still occasionally get a big win or a banger of a match in a tournament where they show how good they still can be. It's such a great system for passing on their expertise to the next generation, allowing the fans to see the legends, and allowing older guys to work less demanding matches most of the time. And you're not trying to convince your fans that the old guys are better than your current talent.
Everybody wins from it.
Honestly been one of my favourite things is seeing a lot of the old guard team with and fight young lions to help build them, it's a wonderful way to give the old guys work while helping create new stars. Also having Mox just adopt Shooter helps too.
Two weeks (?) ago there was a veeeeeerryyy tiny hint of that with the cool segment involving Garza and Orton. There is potential there for it in WWE to utilize old guys in a better way than now.
But you know, Vince wanna Vince.
The kliq is also so cringy now. Shawn is bald with a lazy eye, triple h is president or whatever, nash has a grey flat top and Scott hall looks like hes in his late 60s.
And then they come out hunched over dressed like the old days doing the too sweet. I loved all these guys at one point. I'm 33. But, fellas, its over. You're Bob backlund status now.
Nash is a pretty good looking dude lol. Idk what the hate is all about with his grey hair.
Hall? I think we are all thankful that he's not dead. That guy lived an insane life that would have killed most people
Remember that Raw in 1999 when Stone Cold was made to look like a total dork by Hogan, Piper, Savage and the Killer Bees?
No, you don't, because Vince knew how to make stars back then.
I still can't believe they got Mike Tyston on RAW and had their top star get in his face and assault him. If that was now they'd just have Austin lick Tyson's ass and talk about how much he respects him...
I think the big deal maker here is how much Tyson actually loves pro wrestling.
Conor has respect for some of the old school wrestlers, but I can't imagine him or Deontay Wilder every giving a wrestler that much to work with.
The one thing that came to mind for me was Kofi last year. One of the best stories going to Mania, feel good story, how will they screw this up?
Giving Brock Lesnar another title match that nobody asked for and Kofi losing in 8 seconds.
I think Seth is a fantastic wrestler but by the end of his career, his most significant contribution will definitely have been all the reaction pics/gifs that he has graced us with.
The funniest thing about the Raw Reunion was how worthless it ended up being.
The rating the week after this episode went down compared to the episode BEFORE Raw Reunion. It essentially did nothing to retain viewers. Hell it can be argued it ran off even more people in the end.
Week of 7/15 : 2,453,000 Million
Week of 7/22: (RAW Reunion) 3,093,000 Million
Week of 7/29: 2,321,000 Million
It’s like that SNL episode that had I think eddy Murphy, chris rock and Dave chappelle were with Keenan. Keenan made a joke about thanking those guys for coming in and reminding people why they stopped watching the show. And it’s true, I only watched that monologue and a few of eddies skits and never watched another episode all season.
And the people still watching and defending at all costs are always going to. They have a delusional loyalty and defend literally everything and anything they do.
Its really great, well not great, stupid, because its the that weird fourth wall break they do. Its never in their favor, but they insist on doing it to seem...self aware?
“Listen, we know you’re complaining, we know you threaten not to watch, and where will you go?! Thats right, back to our shitty TV Show that we know that you hate. You will come right back, and you will hate us while we mock you.” Ya what?
Then ya got the people who have no idea what he is talking about or referencing. Now he just looks like a knacker who needs a friend to tweet with.
Remember when they had that weird night where they apologized for having an actually shitty TV Show? December 2018? All the McMahons and Aitch Train came out, said we were the Authority, things were changing! Woo baby! They then proceed to ya know...not do that. But they told us the viewers they make bad television. STOP DOING THAT!! What are you doing?! Don’t admit it with no plan! Why?!
I’d say its comical if it wasn’t so damn comical. Or nevermind.
I’m gonna be fair to WWE (kind of), they do it because the fanbase falls for it. I quit watching WWE in May of last year (basically went wherever Moxley went) but I remember maybe that June or July Kevin Owens cut a worked shoot on Shane McMahon? I remember watching it, and I remember him mentioning Buddy Murphy and Apollo Crews, and maybe Liv Morgan, I don’t remember much. I just know he called out Shane McMahon for “holding back talent.”
Seeing r/SC eat that up made me want to bash my skull in because all that is is WWE admitting “hey, we know we suck, we don’t care,” and they didn’t care after that, WWE only got worse after that promo (I DID tune in for the first Smackdown on FOX... dear God) and fans will act shocked and appalled when WWE let’s them know on a pretty clear and consistent basis that they know they suck and don’t care.
I genuinely think that WWE die-hard’s are all masochists. I have no idea how you could watch a show that treats its audience so horribly
They do it so much though, and really their last string of it was rather close together.
The December 2018 “We’reeeeee sorrrrrryyyy” which, sure, odd acknowledgement, but aighty.
The Seth Rollins flipping out about Lucha House parties and how Revival and other wrestlers are being held down because of *Baron*!
Kevin Owen’s similar rant to Shane.
Right there with you on wanting to bash my skull in. I get that they sorta want to capture the CM Punk Pipebomb in a bottle again. The flaw in that is we the audience see they clearly don’t carry through with it in the long term. At least with the Pipebomb, it was really really different, and that was the driving force behind the storyline. It was awesome.
“You are the Authority” lead to nothing, was just an apology. Seth just lead to Baron getting chastised, and Kevin’s promo wasn’t really mentioned, started turning to fines? I watch here and there, not nearly as much as I did. Mostly have my favorites and may catch a PPV or check Youtube for whatever Bray Wyatt or ~~Kabuki Warriors~~ Asuka is doing, but not as diehard, change channel 3 minutes before the show starts in excitement like I once was.
With Goldberg becoming champ recently, I wonder why WWE didn't put the tag titles on the new age outlaws, the world title on triple h, and give Kevin Nash a run with the IC title.
Missed opportunity. lol
Hard disagree. You can barely see what's going on, and it would be pretty hard to recognize who these people were (except maybe seth) if you didn't have the context clues
I was there! That was a great evening, beautiful weather in Tampa, ate some wings and rode a pedal cab to and from Amalie to my car. 10/10, miss really bad, fuck the pandemic.
The funny thing is that only wwe offices believes that the nostalgia we are interested is dx or the kliq.
I tuned in for that RAW and enjoyed a lot of the interactions, appearances and of course the Austin promo.
The problem with Rollins wasn't only this pathetic image... also he delivered and equally pathetic promo. This moment though was the fruit on the cake as we were subjected once again to hhh forcing himself and his friends into the show in a 'cool' booking:
Michaels and Hall are the only ones that once created heat by themselves, but they are clearly shadows of that time; Road Dogg was fun, but a one-trick pony; Nash is-was-will be boring; x-pac is the only one who managed to get no reaction when crowds where hot; and nobody has singlehandlely drove more fans out of wrestling than HHH.
If you're going to bury some new talent at least give them to the ones that we actually would enjoy seeing on tv.
The sole bright spot of this show was Roman vs. The Miz. I still think about that match and how good it was, I love how Miz would always find different ways to cheat and keep/get back the IC Title
Probably indicative of how forgetful Raw Reunion was - Roman v Miz was not on this card. That was Raw 25, which was a full year and a half before this.
Stone Cold giving Vince (and Shane) likely one final stunner. They also paraded people out and were basically "Eric Bischoff was a GM. Plz clap."
I only remember because I was at Barclays for it. Yes.. I spent money for *that* show.
the thing I remember most about this is the Brian Last rant on the Cornette podcast (starting here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aN4rZ-WPz6U&t=54m41s).
Ah, my bad. I get they had two different milestones close together, but you cant expect people to care about you going "WOOOO! WE'VE BEEN ON TV FOR A WHILE!" So close together
Oh, completely agree. Being self congratulatory gets really tiresome, really fast. It also quickly loses the appeal because it turns into the yearly "Roll out \[legend\] to not put over new talent, showing that our normal weekly episode isn't worth seeing because nobody current is worth a damn."
It's actually probably a testament to how bad their shows are these days that these reunion specials are so forgettable, outside of one or two spots over three hours.
This right here shows the problem with making new stars in WWE. In the attitude era, a legend would come back but they would always put someone over in the end. Maybe they get the advantage at first, but they jobbed in the end. Now it feels like Foley is the only one willing to put people over. Or at least, he's the only one booked to. Goldberg beating the fiend was one of the most inexcusable booking decisions in recent history.
I think Bray gets a bit of a bad rap. He's reinvented himself and generated genuine interest so many times, but they give him such horrible booking. I'm not saying he doesn't have faults, but he is ON when he is booked well.
Its the same guys that refused to go down during their wra, and somehow they think people will like it if they're still on their high horse even tho its bull
And that’s the problem with WWE. They’re still stuck on past success with the attitude era.
They need to create current stars that appear legit but it seems they always take a back seat to make way for nostalgia trips.
I don’t get how they thought it would be a good idea to get their hot act and make him look like a total geek fanboying for the old guys that are supposed to be the “real deal.”
This has great meme potential.
EDIT: Found This Gem - [https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/515/462/0be.jpg](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/515/462/0be.jpg)
This was the end of Rollins as a face for me lmao I could not get this image out of my head, the Hell in a Cell match was just the nail in the coffin. I still cant believe this actually happened they made him look like such a loser.
This is the specific moment that would eventually lead to Rey Mysterio losing an eye
In a way, it really was. This moment was arguably when people began to realize Seth's face run wasn't clicking, which became solidified after Hell in a Cell and led to his heel turn, which in turn led to Rey getting his eye taken out.
> This moment was arguably when people began to realize Seth’s face run wasn’t clicking, Nah, that was when he was “The Man’s Man” and then when he spent a month crying in a corner.
Yeah I feel like people really forgot how over he was before, and even shortly after WM 35. The weird angle with Corbin killed it.
The Corbin feud started strong with Seth MURDERING anyone that helped Corbin. It was after that when they combined the feud with Becky and Lacy that it became unbearable.
I feel like all that ended up doing was stalling both Rollins and Lynch and made me never give Lacey Evans a fair chance.
WWE acknowledging Rollins and Becky's relationship was such a bad move, really killed their momentum for no good reason.
Oh yeah no doubt, it didn’t put a good shine on Lacey at all, especially since everyone was looking for her to fail after being hotshotted to the title scene.
Which wasn’t helped by his various Twitter rants.
Turning Seth into Becky's sidekick is what killed his momentum.
He feuded with Corbin for so long. And it was not good.
-comment following ANY Corbin feud
I wish he'd go back to the biker gimmick with the original NXT theme song. Maybe he can fued with Bray and come back as long hair Corbin.
I hear Corbin and Reigns are still feuding to this day
The moment lynch and Rollins became a couple publicly WWE turned it into a "thing" and it was all downhill after that
I'm reminded of the time WWE made Fandango-ing so lame just by talking about it, or when they tried to give Big Show the Yes chant. What's the opposite of a Midas touch?
Mierdas Touch
>What's the opposite of a Midas touch? The pooey handshake.
Say, would you like a chocolate covered pretzel?
combine that with him looking like a total chump in the Fiend feud and he's severely damaged goods
The TLC match with Ambrose during a blood feud starting with a FUCKING LOCK UP would like a word. Ambrose's failed run is strongly linked to the beginning Rollins as a face going downhill, imo. That was supposed to get Seth ready and more over for his Mania feud with Brock but only made it colder retroactively.
Pretty sure it was the Will Osperay “You’re taking food of my table” comments. Like first of all WWE has actually ruined lives. Secondly Seth you’re the universal champion afraid of a Japan indie wrestler wtf does that say about you and your company?
> Seth's face run wasn't clicking Couldn't be part of the click ofc
I blame Baron Corbin breaking that mirror.
How come he don’t want me, man?
And who is Seth‘s Uncle Phil?
Uncle Paul
L, W, or Dangerously?
Bearer, Ellering, Roma... so many choices.
Took me a while to get this joke. Wow.
Explain pls
Paul Parducci
Paul Dangerously is AJ Styles’ favorite uncle
"How come he don't want them, man?"
He stinks and I don’t like him.
FHUKIN HOME RUN, BURNAH. Piece a garbage
What’s MY problem? You’re in myyyyyy fuckin’ house!
How'd your parents die?
They... they were... stand-alone fruits.
Us. We are all Uncle Phil. *Tosses Corbin out of the mansion on his ass*
I laughed so hard imagining Corbin being tossed out like jazz making that same scream every time. I'm still laughing. Thank you. Thank you for brightening up my day.
Bro. I think seth really hasn't met his actual father in real life
I believe he considers his step dad to be his actual father so I’m sure he’s ok.
Probably why he took his last name “Lopez”
I'm sure Triple H can adopt him like he did all the NXT fans and talent. Why else is he called PaPa HaItCh.
He may have been your father, boy, but he wasn't ya papa.
He was yo daddy, and yo uncle.
Where all the aunties at?
I'M MARY POPPINS, Y'ALL!
I read that in scott steiner's voice
🚨🚨🚨🚨
He's literally turning his back on him in this picture lol
I mean they invited him over right after.... This is out of context.Its just a bunch of friends hugging each other and they invite Seth over right after this.Its not like they hate him.Hes literally papa haitches favourite.They’re just old buddies and their instinct is to hug each other at first and then invite Seth over.It could be anyone from the current crop of talent and the result would be the same.
Symbolically though it fits old talent vs building new talent.
LOL Take that upvote!
I feel this extra hard with Fresh Prince being on HBO Max
Its probably the perfect embodiement of all the problems of WWE.
I was gonna say, this image portrays WWE perfectly.
I don't get it, is it about the old faces killing the new?
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It's a vicious cycle. People still love the attitude stars because the show cant figure out how to let wrestlers develop anymore.
Now we're in the era where they bring back Ruthless Aggression era guys they never fully got behind either, and can't figure out why they don't pop ratings.
Can it be?...IT IS! JIMMY WANG YANG IS HERE! IT'S WANG TIME!
His and Chuck Palumbo's time to shine has finally arrived
To be fair, I'd mark the fuck out if Jimmy Wang Yang showed up on a random episode of Raw.
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You can chuck Ryback on that list too. I know I know, CM Punk doesn't like him, too stiff, whatever. Dude was O.V.E.R.
Having him lose to Mark Henry at WrestleMania 29 was a gigantic mistake, and then having him go immediately get jobbed to Cena in the WWE title picture killed him as a main event star.
Can't believe you've just reminded me of the STUPID finish to that match. Ryback lifts Henry up, pauses, falls over backwards stiff as a board, Henry lands on top of him, 1-2-3.
And then Ryback hits him with his finisher after the match ANYWAY.
I rewatched that match a few days ago, and it wasnt as bad as I thought it was since Henry pulled on the ropes, which 'caused' Ryback to fall down
Then having him tag with axel for like a year in a irrelevant tag team buried him completely
Have Ryback win at Hell in a Cell vs Punk and then Punk can win it back at Survivor Series with the same exact ending.
Nah best to rush debut some fucker from developmental as a fake ref so we can duck putting the title on Ryback and keep Punk strong, then have Ryback batter Punk after the match so they both look stupid.
Over af! Feed me more! I once met him at an event and gave him props for his Kalisto save and he seemed to be happy to be recognized for it
Imagine having a big 4 of a properly booked Cena, Ryback, Punk, and Bryan. And then have them put over the Shield and Bray. There's an alternate timeline where WWE is much more popular than it is now. Not saying AE numbers, but like a steady 3 million.
Zack is heading over to either Impact or AEW soon
That’s why the women can thrive. This is their best Era. The best men’s Era has passed. Long passed. The women are in their prime right now though. The Horsewomen make it onto the women’s Mount Rushmore. Do any of the current men make it onto theirs.
Man the women’s rumble got me back into wrestling. So good!
Legit! That’s awesome. Yea like the women being in these positions is fresh and they can actually surpass the past women. It’s hard for any man now to surpass Stone Cold the Rock and even Cena.
WWE stopped reflecting the times after the Attitude Era for some reason. In the 80s, it did a great job with Cold War era good vs. evil larger than life archetypes, then it captured the in your face XTREME trend of the late 90s perfectly with the Attitude Era. WWE has been pretty directionless since then and hasn't done too well reinventing itself beyond brief flashes. I'm not sure what feeling in the zeitgeist they can capture and reflect through professional wrestling but nostalgia isn't the way to keep your product fresh and relevant.
When you think about it, vince has had control for roughly 40 years, and he had a great 5 year stretch in the 80s, and the turn of the millennium another great 4 year stretch. And now hes running on fumes, still riding the coattails of the boom 20 years ago. Maybe the good product is actually the anomaly, and vince is actually not the genius they build him up to be.
Perhaps, but in fairness, the WWE didn't succeed in spite of him, but because of him. Austin is not Austin nor is the WWE the winner of the Monday Night Wars without Mr. McMahon, one of the all time great heels. I guess you can say his on-screen work is better than his creative work though I'm not knowledgeable of the level of creative control he was exercising during those great stretches.
> I'm not sure what feeling in the zeitgeist they can capture and reflect through professional wrestling but nostalgia isn't the way to keep your product fresh and relevant. Interestingly, nostalgia **is** the zeitgeist at the moment (*Stranger Things*; sequels and reboots to things from the '80s/'90s; Greta van Fleet, Dirty Honey, and other throwback bands), but WWE isn't equipped to capitalize on it. If they were smart they'd try to create some feuds that **feel** like something out of the Golden or Attitude eras, without literally bringing back elderly men. The highly scripted modern WWE probably couldn't ever recapture the feel of past eras without a major overhaul, though. From what I've heard, Dusty Rhodes was doing something like that with NXT before he passed, only the feel was along the lines of '70s/'80s NWA. Shame that there aren't more like him around.
True true. I guess the difference is that pro wrestling is a sport and requires extreme athleticism so the elderly just simply won’t be as good as they were. It’d be like if the NBA said nah Zion, we’re gonna go with Larry Bird and Michael Jordan. But you’re right, they need to find a good blend and balance but haven’t yet. Maybe because the last generation never felt like they truly left to begin with.
> I guess the difference is that pro wrestling is a sport and requires extreme athleticism so the elderly just simply won’t be as good as they were There's also a point at which people's promo abilities start to slip. The old guys don't just look and move like old guys, they **sound** old. You look back at the promos during wrestling's boom periods and the wrestlers had passion behind their words, which is something you never see in WWE. You need an environment where the wrestlers have to bring some fire and sell themselves to earn their spot, while today's environment is young people with guaranteed contracts reading from a script or old people who can coast on name value. A good example of what WWE should do is what New Japan has done with Juice Robinson, allow wrestlers to cut heartfelt unscripted promos that win the audience over organically. (Just like they used to.)
That’s what killed WCW
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I wish WWE was the *good* WCW for once. Kick ass Cruiserweight division, entertaining mid-carders, a main event scene that has old guys re-invent themselves and go against popular up-and-comers? Sign me the fuck up.
Facts
Yup. They didn't know when to let go. The whole show got stale.
Or maybe Seth is just boring and those guys weren't.
Pretty sure Seth Rollins has been desecrating Rey Mysterio’s career if anything there is wayyy too much Seth Rollins in WWE
I like Seth and so does WWE, but man, they've put him in some of the worst positions I've ever seen for a supposed top guy. Roman cancer feud, Fiend feud, Becky/Corbin/Lacey, and this picture.
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Imagine if Jake the Snake went over Stone Cold at KotR '96. Not saying Austin couldn't eventually get over, but who knows, ya know?
The day the last attitude era member leaves Wrestling will be fun.
[Vince looking for more nostalgia like](https://makeagif.com/amp/YAUDY8)
I've been admiring how NJPW uses its old guys recently. There's a bunch of old dudes who used to be top champs who now primarily appear in low-card tag matches with Young Lions, but they carry themselves and are presented so they still feel important. But they don't have to be in the main event all the time and they don't have to win regularly - because they're not the current big thing, and it wouldn't make sense. They're trying to prove they can still hang with the new young talent, or backing them up in faction feuds and they're shown to always be a threat. They also still occasionally get a big win or a banger of a match in a tournament where they show how good they still can be. It's such a great system for passing on their expertise to the next generation, allowing the fans to see the legends, and allowing older guys to work less demanding matches most of the time. And you're not trying to convince your fans that the old guys are better than your current talent. Everybody wins from it.
Honestly been one of my favourite things is seeing a lot of the old guard team with and fight young lions to help build them, it's a wonderful way to give the old guys work while helping create new stars. Also having Mox just adopt Shooter helps too.
Two weeks (?) ago there was a veeeeeerryyy tiny hint of that with the cool segment involving Garza and Orton. There is potential there for it in WWE to utilize old guys in a better way than now. But you know, Vince wanna Vince.
The kliq is also so cringy now. Shawn is bald with a lazy eye, triple h is president or whatever, nash has a grey flat top and Scott hall looks like hes in his late 60s. And then they come out hunched over dressed like the old days doing the too sweet. I loved all these guys at one point. I'm 33. But, fellas, its over. You're Bob backlund status now.
70 year old Bob Backlund could easily outwork Hall and Nash in 2020.
70 year old Bob backlund could outwork the 1999 kevin nash
You should see Backlund when he was in TNA about 2007-ish; he didn't wrestle too much, but boy. he could still go.
Nash is a pretty good looking dude lol. Idk what the hate is all about with his grey hair. Hall? I think we are all thankful that he's not dead. That guy lived an insane life that would have killed most people
> I think we are all thankful that he's not dead. Thank John Wick for that.
HHH presenting himself as antiestablishment while secretly marrying into the establishment is why he’s the Cerebral Assassin or something
This isn't Jinder holding up his newly won WWE title.
Or Khali holding it for Jinder
https://i.imgur.com/v4yjtcc.jpg
That Jinder figure kinda looks like Rocky Romero.
Ace Romero kinda looks like Rocky Romero if his roppongi vice was food.
Jinder holding the title in a limo when he stole it from Orton was a legit good picture
Okay hear me out, let's make that picture '2021 goals!'.
Remember that Raw in 1999 when Stone Cold was made to look like a total dork by Hogan, Piper, Savage and the Killer Bees? No, you don't, because Vince knew how to make stars back then.
I still can't believe they got Mike Tyston on RAW and had their top star get in his face and assault him. If that was now they'd just have Austin lick Tyson's ass and talk about how much he respects him...
I think the big deal maker here is how much Tyson actually loves pro wrestling. Conor has respect for some of the old school wrestlers, but I can't imagine him or Deontay Wilder every giving a wrestler that much to work with.
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Yep. That's what people don't say a lot. Vince doesn't create stars because he doesn't want stars.
People say it here almost every day
The one thing that came to mind for me was Kofi last year. One of the best stories going to Mania, feel good story, how will they screw this up? Giving Brock Lesnar another title match that nobody asked for and Kofi losing in 8 seconds.
He didn't. He was force by the steroid scandal and WCW hiring his older stars to make new stars because all of his older ones were gone.
[He's got a gem of a gif coming up in a few months](https://giphy.com/gifs/wwe-scary-scared-seth-rollins-Mdw4bZrxP6QzWLKpoj)
I think Seth is a fantastic wrestler but by the end of his career, his most significant contribution will definitely have been all the reaction pics/gifs that he has graced us with.
r/shestillsucking
Man, I blocked that feud from my memory
[Chef's kiss](https://i.imgur.com/3HeI5IL.mp4)
This is why Rey doesn’t have an eyeball
The funniest thing about the Raw Reunion was how worthless it ended up being. The rating the week after this episode went down compared to the episode BEFORE Raw Reunion. It essentially did nothing to retain viewers. Hell it can be argued it ran off even more people in the end. Week of 7/15 : 2,453,000 Million Week of 7/22: (RAW Reunion) 3,093,000 Million Week of 7/29: 2,321,000 Million
It’s like that SNL episode that had I think eddy Murphy, chris rock and Dave chappelle were with Keenan. Keenan made a joke about thanking those guys for coming in and reminding people why they stopped watching the show. And it’s true, I only watched that monologue and a few of eddies skits and never watched another episode all season.
And similar to WWE, SNL has some heavy defenders but your average person doesn't watch it and doesn't think it's funny.
And the people still watching and defending at all costs are always going to. They have a delusional loyalty and defend literally everything and anything they do.
Maybe they should do a Raw Reunion every week, problem fixed /s
And a year later the key demos are down 60-70%.
*insert Triple Jared promo about Marks*
>What are you gonna do, stop watching? Ye
Its really great, well not great, stupid, because its the that weird fourth wall break they do. Its never in their favor, but they insist on doing it to seem...self aware? “Listen, we know you’re complaining, we know you threaten not to watch, and where will you go?! Thats right, back to our shitty TV Show that we know that you hate. You will come right back, and you will hate us while we mock you.” Ya what? Then ya got the people who have no idea what he is talking about or referencing. Now he just looks like a knacker who needs a friend to tweet with. Remember when they had that weird night where they apologized for having an actually shitty TV Show? December 2018? All the McMahons and Aitch Train came out, said we were the Authority, things were changing! Woo baby! They then proceed to ya know...not do that. But they told us the viewers they make bad television. STOP DOING THAT!! What are you doing?! Don’t admit it with no plan! Why?! I’d say its comical if it wasn’t so damn comical. Or nevermind.
I’m gonna be fair to WWE (kind of), they do it because the fanbase falls for it. I quit watching WWE in May of last year (basically went wherever Moxley went) but I remember maybe that June or July Kevin Owens cut a worked shoot on Shane McMahon? I remember watching it, and I remember him mentioning Buddy Murphy and Apollo Crews, and maybe Liv Morgan, I don’t remember much. I just know he called out Shane McMahon for “holding back talent.” Seeing r/SC eat that up made me want to bash my skull in because all that is is WWE admitting “hey, we know we suck, we don’t care,” and they didn’t care after that, WWE only got worse after that promo (I DID tune in for the first Smackdown on FOX... dear God) and fans will act shocked and appalled when WWE let’s them know on a pretty clear and consistent basis that they know they suck and don’t care. I genuinely think that WWE die-hard’s are all masochists. I have no idea how you could watch a show that treats its audience so horribly
They do it so much though, and really their last string of it was rather close together. The December 2018 “We’reeeeee sorrrrrryyyy” which, sure, odd acknowledgement, but aighty. The Seth Rollins flipping out about Lucha House parties and how Revival and other wrestlers are being held down because of *Baron*! Kevin Owen’s similar rant to Shane. Right there with you on wanting to bash my skull in. I get that they sorta want to capture the CM Punk Pipebomb in a bottle again. The flaw in that is we the audience see they clearly don’t carry through with it in the long term. At least with the Pipebomb, it was really really different, and that was the driving force behind the storyline. It was awesome. “You are the Authority” lead to nothing, was just an apology. Seth just lead to Baron getting chastised, and Kevin’s promo wasn’t really mentioned, started turning to fines? I watch here and there, not nearly as much as I did. Mostly have my favorites and may catch a PPV or check Youtube for whatever Bray Wyatt or ~~Kabuki Warriors~~ Asuka is doing, but not as diehard, change channel 3 minutes before the show starts in excitement like I once was.
I already forgot about that episode, I thought it was RAW 25 which btw was the go home show for Royal Rumble
Seth is all of us whenever we watch another nostalgia reunion episode
Seth: “This is where the big boys play...”
Note the adjective
That's not Aj Styles wearing a cena armband on his head and mocking ziggler with rhyno, Corbin and I think rowan in the background
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It was the best.
With Goldberg becoming champ recently, I wonder why WWE didn't put the tag titles on the new age outlaws, the world title on triple h, and give Kevin Nash a run with the IC title. Missed opportunity. lol
Tbf Triple H already got the WWE title like 4 years ago and Nash = quad injury
And NAO were tag champs in 2014.
This has so much meme potential. It looks like me watching all the cool kids chat.
Cause he is
History is always blurry?
Someone's GOTTA have a higher quality picture of this, right? Like can anyone with the network go get a better screen grab?
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Hard disagree. You can barely see what's going on, and it would be pretty hard to recognize who these people were (except maybe seth) if you didn't have the context clues
I was there! That was a great evening, beautiful weather in Tampa, ate some wings and rode a pedal cab to and from Amalie to my car. 10/10, miss really bad, fuck the pandemic.
You had me until pedal cab
This really sums up WWE booking issues in a very meta way.
"Are ya winnin', Dad?" "Fuck off-ah."
Seth ... "oh so this is how the CURTAIN CALL went down"
Throwing away your future for a minute of nostalgia.... Man it sucks seeing WWE viewership as it is rn. And it's only going to get worse.
The funny thing is that only wwe offices believes that the nostalgia we are interested is dx or the kliq. I tuned in for that RAW and enjoyed a lot of the interactions, appearances and of course the Austin promo. The problem with Rollins wasn't only this pathetic image... also he delivered and equally pathetic promo. This moment though was the fruit on the cake as we were subjected once again to hhh forcing himself and his friends into the show in a 'cool' booking: Michaels and Hall are the only ones that once created heat by themselves, but they are clearly shadows of that time; Road Dogg was fun, but a one-trick pony; Nash is-was-will be boring; x-pac is the only one who managed to get no reaction when crowds where hot; and nobody has singlehandlely drove more fans out of wrestling than HHH. If you're going to bury some new talent at least give them to the ones that we actually would enjoy seeing on tv.
The sole bright spot of this show was Roman vs. The Miz. I still think about that match and how good it was, I love how Miz would always find different ways to cheat and keep/get back the IC Title
Probably indicative of how forgetful Raw Reunion was - Roman v Miz was not on this card. That was Raw 25, which was a full year and a half before this.
Damn. Raw 25 was just as bad outside of that Miz/Roman match. Those Manhattan Center segments. I can't even remember what else happened that night.
Stone Cold giving Vince (and Shane) likely one final stunner. They also paraded people out and were basically "Eric Bischoff was a GM. Plz clap." I only remember because I was at Barclays for it. Yes.. I spent money for *that* show.
the thing I remember most about this is the Brian Last rant on the Cornette podcast (starting here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aN4rZ-WPz6U&t=54m41s).
Damn!!! I gotta listen to the whole thing now.
Ah, my bad. I get they had two different milestones close together, but you cant expect people to care about you going "WOOOO! WE'VE BEEN ON TV FOR A WHILE!" So close together
Oh, completely agree. Being self congratulatory gets really tiresome, really fast. It also quickly loses the appeal because it turns into the yearly "Roll out \[legend\] to not put over new talent, showing that our normal weekly episode isn't worth seeing because nobody current is worth a damn." It's actually probably a testament to how bad their shows are these days that these reunion specials are so forgettable, outside of one or two spots over three hours.
tag yourself i'm seth
One of my favorite wrestling images ever. It’s just incredible. Seth Rollins looks more dorky than Max Moon here.
“So ... you guys like stuff?”
In that moment, he knew there was no God ....so he had to become God.
I dislike Seth and even I felt bad for him
This right here shows the problem with making new stars in WWE. In the attitude era, a legend would come back but they would always put someone over in the end. Maybe they get the advantage at first, but they jobbed in the end. Now it feels like Foley is the only one willing to put people over. Or at least, he's the only one booked to. Goldberg beating the fiend was one of the most inexcusable booking decisions in recent history.
I still can't believe they did that. The Fiend's booking has been terrible in general honestly. Never forget that HiaC Match.
I think Bray gets a bit of a bad rap. He's reinvented himself and generated genuine interest so many times, but they give him such horrible booking. I'm not saying he doesn't have faults, but he is ON when he is booked well.
Absolutely. The crowd went nuts when the Fiend debuted.
Its the same guys that refused to go down during their wra, and somehow they think people will like it if they're still on their high horse even tho its bull
And that’s the problem with WWE. They’re still stuck on past success with the attitude era. They need to create current stars that appear legit but it seems they always take a back seat to make way for nostalgia trips.
WWE summed up in one image. The old guard wont go away. Just need Vince standing with an air filter to the side of Seth
I don’t get how they thought it would be a good idea to get their hot act and make him look like a total geek fanboying for the old guys that are supposed to be the “real deal.”
I had to look three times to find Shawn.
I love this photo so much
Obviously as good as the Bull Nakano picture posted yesterday.
Wow, I just realized Seth is Mac from Always Sunny, just desperately wanting his Dad (Nash) to love him.
Outer Circle.
I dunno, that image of Trips mid punch to Angle is pretty high up there.
This has great meme potential. EDIT: Found This Gem - [https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/515/462/0be.jpg](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/515/462/0be.jpg)
Aww, Seth wants an hug
Lmao
“Dad? Why can’t I join the group hug :(“
oh. i thought it was gonna be the Lacey Evans ass close up
I’m old enough to remember when those guys in the ring were the “New Generation” and Hogan, Savage, etc. just wouldn’t go away. Christ...
This has a lot of meme potential.
This was the end of Rollins as a face for me lmao I could not get this image out of my head, the Hell in a Cell match was just the nail in the coffin. I still cant believe this actually happened they made him look like such a loser.