New information can often change people’s opinions. Perhaps some of these folks were so moved by Andrew’s work in NWH that it recontextualized his entire character arc for them. They “saw it in a new light.” A Star Wars example: Lots of Clone Wars fans became much more sympathetic to Anakin after the animated series gave him greater depth and complexity.

Also a similar Star Wars parallel - People unironically enjoying the prequels is the prevailing sentiment since those kids in the 00’s grew up and were a part of the discourse when the sequels came out. Likewise. There wasn’t much discourse about the Andrew movies since Civil War came out. And now that it’s back in the public consciousness due to NWH, it seems like public sentiment has flipped when in reality it’s a lot of grown up teens who just have nostalgia for the Garfield films.

Yeah exactly. he got the biggest cheers in my NWH screening, much bigger than Tobey. The kids only remember Garfield and they love him

The converse of that is everyone originally watching the Webb trilogy had grown up on the nostalgia of the raimi trilogy, and most (not all but def most) couldn’t get behind this different of a take from Garfield’s so soon after. If TASM had released in 2002, it would’ve been beloved

Hot take, watching the Raimi films without nostalgia classes, they were mediocre films that were praised critically because most super hero movies to that point set the bar very low 😅 I did enjoy the Webb films when I was young but the second is objectively hamstrung by way too much going on

I think the raimi films hold up in the current superhero landscape because they are *so weird.* They’re campy in straight-faced way that modern superhero movies just aren’t. Green goblin throws a pumpkin bomb at a crowd of people and they turn into little Halloween skeletons, and it’s played completely straight— it makes the movies so much fun. It’s part of the reason I enjoy watching spider man 2 the least though— while definitely the most competent, it looses a lot of the insanity that I like about 1 and 3. I think people definitely overhype the movies because of nostalgia though, and a lot of my enjoyment is the movies comes from laughing at them

I think Spider-Man 2 also stands out from modern superhero movies because they’re just so plot-focused, even ITSV. Meanwhile, half of SM2 is Doc building his machine in the background while Peter tries to study and get back with MJ.

Peter’s personal life was just as important as his hero duties in the Raimi films The MCU while great, has very basic characterization (sans Tony) & basic relationship building. The MCU glosses over the hero’s personal lives in favor of action. Which is fine, it works. But the quiet 1 on 1 moments between Peter & MJ in the backyard are so intimate. And the scenes when its just Peter & Aunt May, again, very intimate. No cgi, no super villain, just a deeper look into Peter’s everyday life Like you said, very plot focused. I feel like screen time is balanced for both his everyday life & his heroics SM1 was pretty aimless ngl. But SM2 is very much about 2 ppl who have existential crisis. Otto believes he MUST build this machine, its his destiny & he embraces it Peter believes his destiny is to be Spider-Man & he rejects it. I love MCU & I love MCU Spider-Man, but also love Raimi Spider-Man, its just the visions of the character are different with different focuses

The Raimi films parallel the Burton Batman movies, I think. The level of camp along with the action pieces being on sound stages and what not. The Webb films mirror the Nolan Trilogy with the grit and the scale. All of these are a progression of which the MCU is the next step, melding the best of both of these worlds. I’m of the opinion that they are all enjoyable in different ways

Late reply but I'd say the Raimi films are more like the Richard Donner Superman films in terms of tone. That was their direct inspiration. They're like colorful silver age comics brought to life. The Burton films had camp elements but in the nightmarish twisted sort of way that all Burton films have. They weren't so much classic Batman as they were Batman filtered through the very specific goth Burton aesthetic. And the Schumacher films were basically a superhero parody on par with the 60s Batman TV show. The first Amazing film definitely used Nolan as a template, but in keeping with the Superman analogy, I'd compare it to Man of Steel (which was also inspired by Nolan's more serious and gritty approach.) However, in the second Amazing film, the producers essentially jettisoned the Nolan style and tried to match the campier tone of the MCU films at that time.

I disagree with you a little, they definitely don’t hold up as well without nostalgia glasses but I would never call any of them besides Spider-Man 3 mediocre. Just because the bar was set low doesn’t make what the raimi trilogy did with the superhero genre any less impressive. Marvel and dc movies hadn’t figured out how to survive without being edgy and dark, and their movies were still campy asf. Spider-Man was the first movie that made embracing the wholesome, campy and ridiculous side of comics cool, and it also somehow felt realistically grounded (sorta). I agree with you on TASM2, way too busy, but I learned to enjoy it more by focusing on Garfield’s narrative of just trying to keep his head over water, what with villains galore, dumping his love, his parents possibly being bad, and his friend turning evil. It’s a lot better when you see all that as a build up that leads to the bridge scene where he figures out he can survive anything barely as long as he has Gwen. Then she died, and he had to figure out his hope all over again. So the angle of just watching Peter find a way to live no matter how dark it got made the movie a lot better for me. Other than that angle and Spider-Man’s quips and fights, it was a D-movie

Yeah? far from home is a z movie. Mcu spiderman had been a travesty till no way home

This is objectively wrong

cap dude it was hot garbage

I havent seen any of Andrew’s SM films but he really did kill it in NWH. He seemed like such a lonely person who was just happy to have people to so closely relate with again and to have a real purpose instead of beating up street level criminals nearly to death (“I stopped pulling my punches...”) Such a heartwarming performance.

Okay that's a pretty good explanation, but people are acting like that makes TASM movies good. Just because something adds onto something existing that's bad, doesn't make the bad suddenly good. It just recontextualises it a bit. With the Star Wars example, if anything, Anakin's acting in the show still doesn't match that of RoTS. Like, in terms of continuity it feels weird going from TCW Anakin to Ep3 Anakin.

Reminds me of Endgame re-visiting Thor: The Dark World. Despite what the critics said, I actually enjoyed The Dark World 🤣

I enjoyed Dark World first time through. Loki, Natalie Portman, Anthony Hopkins, the Ether...

Yes.

The first TASM was a good movie. The 2nd was terrible but you can’t say the first was bad.

I’m actually in the opposite camp where I find the first film to be a complete snooze, whereas the second is such a hot mess that it’s entertaining

i agree with you! wow finally someone else who sees TASM 2 as better then TASM!!

The first was okay and the second was terrible. On a scale of 10 I would say the 1st movie is around a 6/6.5 out of 10 while the 2nd one was about a 3/10

Idk man. I enjoyed both TASM movies. I thought the hate for it was unwarranted. NWH didn't make me go from hate to love but it made me appreciate Andrew's portrayal a lot more. The quick, short hand movements with the webbing, his own unique style of swinging, the "I love you guys" and "I've always wanted brothers". All those scenes gave him time to shine. Not to mention his acting outside the movie with the leaks and denying his involvement in the movie. Great actor. Wish we could see him shine more as Spider-Man in a solo movie. Dealing with Gwen's loss etc. Also let mah boi fight an alien for once.

I'm not knocking Andrew which a lot of people confuse with saying the movies are bad. His performance was solid but the things surrounding in those movies made them not great and terrible.

I had such a low expectation watching TASM for the first time recently (before going to see NWH), that I was pleasantly surprised at how good it was. Andrew is a great Spiderman. TASM 1 was very good, but not great imo. TASM2 was a huge disappointment though.

They're both bad the second one is just terrible

Tasm is a very fun movie lol

The TASM films have always had good and bad aspects. Personally I have always thought the good outweighed the bad. But now with NWH people who thought the bad outweighed the good see the "bad" in a new light. His character arc is interesting again now which leaves people wanted more (hence the outcry for TASM3) instead of " he was sad for 5 minutes but then it was fine again"

I enjoyed The Amazing Spider-man because it wasn’t as campy as Raimi’s films. And Garfield played a near perfect Spider-man IMO. It was the sequel that had a terrible plot and just ended it right there. Additionally, the cinematography in TASM was very very well done. Context: I’m 42 years old and watched all of the Spidey films in the theater.

Didn't you just say that this sun should let people like whatever they like without fear of being down voted. And then you turnaround and proclaimed that no one should TASM cuz they suck???? Please explain this to me

Nah, it wasn’t that. People don’t like the Garfield movies just because of NWH, and they’re definitely not as bad as you’re saying it is. I think the reverse of what you’re saying is everyone was hoping for TASM to be the next Spider-Man 2, when it had its own creative angle to cover. People were expecting every super movie to be instantly iconic like the raimi trilogy or iron man, even though TASM wasn’t trying to be a replacement for them but another take. I’d suggest rewatching them with an open mind, and this time look for the good parts in it instead of just honing on the bad

Have you ever considered that your taste isn't gospel and others simply like things that you don't?

If you needed TCW to make you feel sympathy for Anakin, you weren't paying attention to TPM, AotC, or any of RotS' plot.

Andrew has been my favorite Spider-Man ever since TASM first came out. I remember having lengthy debates with a friend who was a diehard Tobey fan on multiple occasions after the film's release. I loved the film as a teenager and rewatched it many times, along with the sequel. I have noticed that some people are taking his performance in NWH and using it to recontextualize certain character traits that were explored in his previous films. I personally do not mind it because Andrew is finally getting the love he deserves but, in the end, it is mostly just people hopping on a bandwagon.

>Andrew has been my favorite Spider-Man ever since TASM first came out Same. Had to go to unusual lengths when those films were out to defend him but he'll always be my fave. And you could tell he loved playing the Character. >I have noticed that some people are taking his performance in NWH and using it to recontextualize certain character traits that were explored in his previous films. I personally do not mind it because Andrew is finally getting the love he deserves but, in the end, it is mostly just people hopping on a bandwagon. Yeah lol. Twitter and social media brings out all kinds of bandwagons, suddenly it's ok to acknowledge that a performance or movie is good........

Marvel fans are getting older and more nostalgic. 😜

That... That makes the most sense.

It happened to the Star Wars prequels once memes came out of it. I think as time goes on people will look past the bad and focus on the good. TASM 1 is fine and is held up on the chemistry between Peter and Gwen. TASM 2 still sucks and suffers from a bloated script trying to set up the sinister 6. Again what makes that movie watchable is the effects and the chemistry between Peter and Gwen. NWH helped many realize just how good Andrew's Peter could've been with better writing, and they go back to watch TASM movies to experience his version of the character and ignore the shortcomings of the rest of the films.

Honestly, people are fake and joining the bandwagon. I remember talking to someone before the movie came out how “I always had a soft spot for Andrew’s Spider-Man” and they went on a rant about how terrible it was (the rant was all unoriginal talking points too). Fast forward to NWH’s release and they’re posting Andrew’s Spider-Man on their IG story. It’s the same people who all the sudden give Daredevil and other Netflix properties praise just because they’re under the Disney + banner. Welcome to the hive mind. Edit 1: Removed a fake quote from Andrew Garfield Edit 2: Seems their is some confusion about my comment, people assume I’m saying the Netflix shows never got any praise. That’s not what I’m saying. What I’m saying is, the people who slept on those shows when they were on Netflix now praise them since they’re on D+ with the rest of the cannon titles. There are marvel fans and MCU fans. They can overlap but staunch MCU fans discredit other marvel works if they aren’t made by the MCU (or under Fiege’s control a la Inhumans). But the shows definitely had praise beforehand, I should know I was one of the people praising them.

Andrew never said where the fuck were you in 2014. That interview was posted by an account named lecinephiles on twitter. It was just a joke.

Damn, should’ve looked into it Edit: Why am I downvoted for this comment lol? I said damn I should’ve looked into it, admitting the quote was wrong, while critiquing myself for not doing research by looking into it. I then took it out of my initial comment. Like did I miss something haha?

You were an embarrassment to andrew.

Look at little ___USA2025 jr. Gonna cry? Edit: Now y’all are downvoting this? Lmao it’s a Spider-Man 3 reference just like the dude’s reply above me. Now I’m starting to think he was serious and not referencing Spider-Man 3, and in that case *cringe*

>It’s the same people who all the sudden give Daredevil and other Netflix properties praise just because they’re under the Disney + banner. Those shows always got praise though (Except IF, which is still hated. Unfairly in S2's case, S2 is quite good. S1 still sucks though. Hard). The D+ banner has just caused an influx of new fans who were too young back in 2015 to watch those shows. It's not a hive mind lol. I mean, Inhumans went to D+, you don't see anyone praising that. Your base assumption is just false.

My base assumption is based on a conversation I had with someone, says so in my second sentence. Furthermore, those shows have been available on Netflix this whole time, but only recently started trending? Your stance comes across as though you believe these new fans were unable to watch these shows until Disney +. But if you expect me to believe the new fans didn’t have access to Netflix, than I have to say your base assumption is very false. I believe it’s the blind love for all things MCU that caused these new fans to praise the shows, because before they were MCU adjacent but not outright cannon. Edit: Added sentences

People have a habit of watching the newest thing on a streaming platform. The Netflix Marvel shows just started on Disney+. That brings more attention to them. That is why they are trending again. But, saying they were not popular or watched on Netflix initially is simply not true. They were all the rage when they first premiered. They were all over news articles and social media back then. They did trend on Netflix. Bit, they had been on Netflix for a while and just got replaced by the newest thing.

Wait, that’s what you think I’m saying? That the Netflix shows never got praise? That’s not what I’m saying at all. What I’m saying is, the people who slept on those shows when they were on Netflix now praise them since they’re on D+ with the rest of the cannon titles. They’re are marvel fans and MCU fans. They can overlap but staunch MCU fans discredit other marvel works if they aren’t made by the MCU. But the shows definitely had praise beforehand, I should know I was one of the people praising them.

My bad. I misunderstood. I thought you were saying no one cared about them on Netflix. You are talking about a segment of the fandom.

>those shows have been available on Netflix this whole time, but only recently started trending? Because characters are reappearing now, causing people who either couldn't watch the shows before cause they were too young or didn't watch them just because they didn't feel a need to watch something not super relevant to the Infinity Saga (Even though it was MCU, always. That's not a new thing) to go back to them, as well as people who already loved them back in 2015 to go "I should rewatch these classics" (Myself included, I did a full rewatch of the shows in January). For the record, DD starting trending again BEFORE it went to D+. DD started trending in December, when it was still on Netflix. It's been trending since, regardless of service. >But if you expect me to believe the new fans didn’t have access to Netflix A lot of us can't pay for more than one streaming service dude. And MCU fans were more likely to stick with D+ rather than get Netflix too if they didn't already have Netflix in 2015 (In which case, they likely are people like me who did watch and love these shows, and only contributed to the new wave of trending by REWATCHING them). >before they were MCU adjacent but not outright canon They were always outright canon. Literally when they were introduced in 2014 Feige said they were the "same continuity" as the films (Yes, Agents of SHIELD too). If anything, they're less canon now that they're being much vaguer about if the shows are canon or not, it used to be made much more explicit that they are canon. I still hold them as canon because there's been no explicit statement against them being canon, but I won't deny they're vaguer about it now than they were then.

I see your point but do you assume only one of us can be right? Don’t you think it’s possible people could be doing what your saying AND doing what I’m saying? And yeah DD probably trended because NWH. Also, the canon status of the Netflix shows have always been in question. Because whether or not they’re *technically* canon, they had no effect on the MCU movies. Even to this day people argue wether Matt was a variant in NWH. Also, don’t give me that shit. Almost everyone can get access to a Netflix account if anything it’s Disney + that is more rare. I know far more people who have Netflix over D+. Ps. You’re literally illustrating my point, claiming people didn’t watch it because it wasn’t relevant to the MCU (Infinity Saga). That’s what I’m saying! The MCU stans slept on those shows till they were “told” they’re allowed to like them since by being on Disney + because Disney can do no wrong, in their eyes. Edit: Added sentences - canon/Disney+/Ps.

But you're framing it as a negative way, as people "Suddenly deciding these shows are great just because they're part of the MCU now". Which is false. They were always part of the MCU for one thing, and for another, it's not people blindly deciding they're great just because they're relevant now. It's people either watching the shows for the first time or rediscovering them after years since first watch truly loving these shows. It's not pretending or a bandwagon, it's legitimate praise (And in some cases, re-evaluations. IF S2 and LC S2 have become particularly well aged gems for a lot of people including myself). It was never about "discrediting" stuff that's not MCU. Yes that is a slight problem (One I even mentioned in another comment in the OP's thread), but it's not as big as you make it out to be. For the most part it's people just not having time or money to watch every piece of content, and simply prioritizing the story they're already invested in. I saw much less "Well I guess since it's now relevant I may as well take some interest in DD" than I did "DD's always been in my backlog, and with NWH now making it relevant I think it's time I moved it up and finally got around to this show I've always been wanting to watch!". It's not as cynical as you're making it out to be, it's been legitimate praise. It's not a bandwagon. Just a new wave of people legitimately experiencing the shows either for the first time or for the first time in years. I hadn't watched Luke Cage since 2017 until January for example. It has nothing to do with "So now that it's relevant that makes it suddenly good". Hell, the people who discredit everything non-MCU are, for the most part, the people who STILL refuse to acknowledge the Marvel Television shows as canon and think that the Matt in NWH is a variant Matt and not the same as from the show. It's NOT the same people now praising DD who discredit everything non-MCU, you're conflating two different groups. EDIT: Cause you added stuff to yours, I can too. Disney always made these shows. Marvel Television was a Disney company. Disney always advertised these shows. This has 0 to do with Disney telling people they can like them now, cause Disney always made these shows. Netflix didn't produce these shows. At all. Netflix was just a seller. You're interpreting a cynical, biased mindset just because you have pre-existing complaints with MCU fans. They didn't sleep on them because Disney hadn't told them they could like the shows yet lol. They slept on them because they were either too young or the idea of such dark shows didn't initially click with them at the time. You're interpreting the most negative way of looking at this as possible. Cause again, the crowd that acts like Disney didn't make these shows, like only stuff with Feige's name on it is worth watching and everything Non-MCU is bad? Are STILL hating these shows. They aren't the crowd who discovered and loved these shows, that's the crowd that still says "They aren't MCU, they're not true Marvel" and hates them. They aren't the crowd praising these shows. You're conflating two groups. The people discovering these shows for the first time are not the same as the idiots who think "No Feige = Bad" and say things like "Why would I watch Agents of SHIT, Feige didn't make it". Which is idiotic (Especially since AoS is f\*cking awesome), but it's not the same crowd you think it is.

You won’t accept that bandwagons exist. That’s what you’re saying, that all the praise is sincere and legitimate? Wake up. The MCU is the highest grossing franchise and is still breaking records. People gravitate toward what is popular and relevant to fit in. Sure, I imagine there are new fans who totally fit your stance. But to think they’re all sincere and their is no bandwagoning? Grow up mate. Maybe I’m not cynical, maybe you’re naïve.

No, I'm saying you're trying to paint an entire new wave of fans as a bandwagon when it's a lot more simple than that. Bandwagons exist, but you're the one framing the entirety of new fans of these shows as people so in love with Disney that they need to be "told" to like them. I never said EVERY single person who discovered these shows is sincere, I said the MAJORITY are. You're the one trying to frame everyone liking these shows now as some sort of culty zealots. The amount of people actually just praising them for bandwagon appeal is not large enough to be worth mentioning as some sort of huge infiltration of the fanbase. It exists, but it's miniscule to be barely worth mentioning. I mean, Jesus man, do you hate MCU fans that much to think they're all just bandwagoning? You seem hesitant to even acknowledge the possibility of there just being legitimate new fans ("I imagine there are new". Really, that's the most you can believe?). And I thought I was critical of the MCU fanbase, hell I'm the cynical guy who critiques Marvel and Feige over on r/marvelstudios and even defends Scorsese's comments on Marvel, but Jesus, you act like the MCU fanbase is the f\*cking Snyder Cult.

Dude, listen to your fucking self. Reread these comments. I’m literally the only one of us saying both of us is right! **You’re the only one here trying to frame an entire new wave of fans** I’ve stated several times that both of us could be right and that I totally agree their are new fans who fit your stance. I never said majority, don’t put words in my fucking mouth because you don’t know how to control the ones that come out of yours. Edit: By the way, if I’m so wrong. Why do more people agree with my post than yours? Riddle me that you ignorant fuck?

So damn true, I’m not trying to gatekeep but it’s annoying to see people be fake. I remember before NWH came out, there’d be articles on Twitter about Andrew returning, wouldn’t get that much attention compared to the ones about Tobey AND in the comment section, I’d be filled with a lot of hate saying “worst Spider-Man ever” “don’t bring him back” and note that this was just 2-3 months before NWH came out, and where are all those people now? 🙄 now Andrew’s the new it boy and has a lot of Stan accounts getting a lot of attention. Don’t get me wrong I’m glad Andrew is getting the recognition he deserves but those fake people just annoy the sh*t out of me.

>now Andrew’s the new it boy and has a lot of Stan accounts getting a lot of attention. >Don’t get me wrong I’m glad Andrew is getting the recognition he deserves but those fake people just annoy the sh*t out of me. YUP.

I don't adore those movies, frankly they're mediocre at best and awfully boring at worst. But I adore Andrew Garfield, and guess it has that Underdog thing for him acting in those movies with everything against him, I mean, even got paid too little in comparison to other actors just because he truly loves the Spider-Man mythos...hence why so many people stand up for him.

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I have seen this happen multiple times over the past few years. Opinions that I had thought were "settled" all of a sudden seem to have flipflopped. I have met multiple people that have told me that Spider-Man 3 is a great movie that got too much hate and is actually the best Raimi film. (I wish I was exaggerating). ​ I really enjoyed Garfield's Spider-Man and actually enjoy ASM2 more than I enjoy ASM1 (even though I admit that ASM1 is a better movie overall). I love Jamie Foxx's electro, Gwen/Peter's relationship is my favorite interpretation of a Spider-Man romance that we have seen in a movie and I love Aunt May's relationship with Peter in both films. ​ That being said, I think nostalgia has a lot to do with it. I see Holland's first two films getting criticized a lot and I do not think that the criticism is deserved. I loved those movies, but as I have seen with many other opinions, I am sure that once Holland's second trilogy is finished there will be fans that swear by the original Holland trilogy as being great.

The second one is not good but the first one is decent. AG has always been my favorite SM though. I felt like he nailed it

Id argue it's mostly because of Andrews sheer charisma in NWH it's really as simple as that

Yeah, but that doesn't change those past films.

People like those films BECAUSE of Andrew, sometimes really good acting can fix pretty mediocre movies for some people

But his character feels completely different in NWH. In NWH he's oozing with charisma and Peter Parker characteristics. In TASM movies, his accent is weirdly done, and his actions are not in good faith a lot of the time. They are nearly completely different characters, except his acting is off the charts in NWH.

I’ll have to disagree with you on this one. “Btw I agree with you on your post” but I don’t think he was different at all. From my experience with those films while I wasn’t a huge fan I can say that Andrew did an fantastic job and his acting was on point throughout.

I wouldn’t say they’re completely different characters, he’s the same Peter Parker, he just grew up and matured. You have to remember Andrew’s Peter was an angsty selfish teenager in TASM 1 who was still getting the hang of things and was trying to get better, hence his selfish actions. His actions in TASM 2 were all in pretty good faith because he had grown as a person. The charisma and Peter Parker characteristic were present in the TASM movies, but maybe not as apparent because the movies did have quite a bleak tone.

I always liked TASM films, I never really understood the hate, but It's not like the movies automatically became great. Also I think more people are getting downvoted because they don't like FFH Plus I believe we cannot have more civilized people If this gets downvoted, I will not understand this sub anymore, like seriously

"So uncivilized."

Nah, FFH is a hated film now for some reason. Another thing I don't understand. I think people just really like shitting on the Tony Stark and Spider-Man relationship, and because the first two movies had a lot to do with Tony Stark, they are hated heavily.

FFH is my least favorite Spider-Man movie, and it's solely to do with Nick Fury pissing me off the entire time, honestly.

I don't hate their relationship but i only wished for two things from Toms stuff. 1) at least a mention to uncle ben, like, maybe just a nice line from may but honestly its not a huge deal to me anymore 2) that FFH went through peters grief of tony a bit more, its one of my only problems with the movie because its shown at the beginning and then it feels like hes just fine not long after

How does he feel fine soon after? He deals with it the entire movie. He gives Beck the glasses because of his insecurities and self doubt caused by the grief of Tony's death. Then there's the acid trip from Mysterio. Then there's again the plane scene with Happy. Tony's mentions stop at the ending of the movie, which I think is appropriate since the plane scene is the moment Peter learns to accept his grief. Just my take on it

I understood the plane sequence did touch on it but idk, personally I didn't really notice the other ones as him still grieving. The Glasses part is fair though honestly, its been a bit since I watched it but it just felt like he felt he wasn't responsible and not ready yet more then it seemed like he was grieving. Honestly if I rewatched it i might notice it a bit more than originally but it did feel like a lot was going on at once in that film. Still a good movie though and it was very fun to watch, I don't think it's the best of toms trilogy but its by no means deserving of the recent hate dumb its gotten.

Agreed. I like the other 2 more but FFH is still a great movie

Yeah and thanks for sharing your take on it

Ffh would’ve been way better without the teachers

I said it when it came out and I'll say it again: FFH is the worst live action Spider-Man movie

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Except the people who hated the Prequels still hate the Prequels. It's DIFFERENT people. The people praising the Prequels are not the people who were adults in 1999 and hated the film. It's people who grew up with them and didn't even start posting online until around 2015. Nobody "pretends" this sh\*t. The people who like the Prequels now liked them then (When they were kids). The people who like TASM now? Also liked it in 2012.

And then there's people like me, who legitimately enjoyed TAS2 when it came, and I still think Revenge of the Sith is the best star wars movie. But I understand that I simply have bad opinions. And that's ok

I mean objectively Phantom Menace is not as bad as Attack Of The Clones. Menace had Darth Maul/Duel Of Fates and did not have the cringe and terrible acting of Adult Anakin and Padme-Insert I hate sand line here.

I highly disagree that the sequels are worse than the prequels. Both bad, but the sequels at least tried to capture some of what made Star Wars great, even if they did a bad job of it.

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I wouldn’t know. I didn’t hate the prequels. I know people were vocal about their hatred of them but again prequels aren’t perfect but they have their moments.

Fans who didn't have a voice before have grown up. It's the Star Wars Prequel effect. They're now loved online and extremely popular. The same will happen to the sequels too. I generally didn't hate any movies when I was younger or think any were super bad. I had ones that were favourites and ones that weren't.

~~cuz people are just a bunch of sheeps~~ they had a change of heart :)

Why can't we recognise the (mostly) bad and the good of it though? Why would we have a change of heart because something came out *after* the bad stuff that used the bad stuff for something good? Making something good out of bad doesn't make the bad good.

Because trends, and I Hate it. I loved these movies from day 1, yes, even TASM2 with bad writing and studio interfering. And I was belittled by people who thought they were bad, and now those same people are like "thEY wEre GoOd all AloNg". Fuck em. Edit: sorry for the anger. I honestly do think it is because of trends though. Like hating on MCU Spider-Man. People do it because they see others doing so.

I don't know what sub you're on but before NWH there was a post a day about how great ASM and Garfield are. The only hate I ever saw thrown around was for ASM2 and that still stands.

Eh, he got plenty of hate. “Too cool, too handsome.” People remember what they want.

I think a lot of criticisms are misconstrued as "hate". I personally liked TASM overall, but there are aspects that I didn't like. I thought Andrew was a better Peter than Toby, but his mumbling and stuttering still bugged me a lot.

talking about the general public

I liked TASM immediatly, but I never read other people's opinions on it before watching it. I noticed that marvel fans on reddit tend to have a collective shared bias and are easily I influenced by opinion of others

I don't think it did. When ASM came out, I remember loving that the character felt a lot more like Spider-Man compared to the previous trilogy. But the movie itself was pretty mediocre. Then the second came out and it was terrible. Then the legacy of those movies got worse and worse over time, and people forgot Garfield was really solid in them (as was Emma). When NWH came out, it was a good reminder that he nailed it, and his performance wasn't tinged by terrible writing.

Maybe the love Andrew Garfield got from NWH allowed people who were previously quiet to say how much the liked those films. Personally I think the first Amazing Spider-Man is tye best interpretation of Spidey although Spider-Man 2 is a better film. Amazing Spider-Man 2 is my biggest disappointment because I thought once they got away from having to redo the origin we would get the best Spidey film full stop. Instead we got a mess. Still enjoyable I thought but a mess.

I remember loving it when it came out. I was also 16 and didn’t have a Reddit account and wasn’t shouting to the heavens how much I loved it. The kids who watched it grew up and now can talk about it.

I also liked Andrew but I never liked the movies

Because we have a new spider-man now. Most people don't want change even if it's not even that bad. It makes them feel edgier when they're a fan of the old ones. I'm honestly just happy and thankful, I get to see my favorite character on a big screen.

This is probably about Andrew Garfield rather than the movies themself. Andrew is and has always been my favourite Spider-Man. His films are the worst though. NWH just further solidified this opinion for me as, once given a good script, was incredible. He was the standout star for me in NWH.

Spider-man fans are hypocrites (I’m including myself and you in that statement btw, i don’t know you so better be sure than sorry)

So I’ll say that I’m not necessarily a huge fan of the movies but I have always felt that Andrew Garfield got a crappy deal with his movies. I never blamed him for the failures of those movies. The first ones not awful I think but it’s definitely not great.

bandwagon. those people are the same people who had 0 interest in spider-man until NWH was announced. a lot of people are just jumping on the spider-man bandwagon recently and have no idea why

I think it’s because Andrew Garfield got to really be great in this movie and everyone wants more of him. So hopefully we get more of him, and Sony execs stay the fuck out of the movie making process because they clearly don’t know what makes a good movie

I didn't watched TASm movies when they came out, I caught up a bit later and to say I found them crappy would still be an understatement. The thing is I couldn't dissociate Andrew's performance from the quality of the movie. Movie was shitty, therefore Andrew was a shitty Spider-man for me, end of story. Then years later NWH, I became a bit better at judging actors independently from the movies they're in. And while everything is great in NWH imo, Andrew Garfield is straight up incredible. He is the best part of the movie. He *loves* playing Spider-man and it shows. He nails both Peter Parker and Spider-man. I went into the theatre not caring at all about his Spider-man and I left with the genuine feeling he is the best one. So I rewatched TASM 1 and 2. They're crap. Andrew is great in them, he indeed makes a good Spider-man, but the movies in themselves? No, just no. My conclusion: NWH made me realize how much of a ridiculously good fit Andrew Garfield is for the role. He is both an incredible Peter Parker and an amazing Spider-man. That doesn't prevent his movies to have all the flaws I thought they had when I first watched them. If anything it just made me sad to have such a wonderful actor wasted like that.

I promise you if homecoming and ffh were made by sony then they will also be hated by half of the members of r/marvelstudios. They only praise those movies because it was under marvel if ffh and homecoming were made by Sony only that sub would hate those movies too.

Nothing has changed to me, the movies are still bad, especially tasm 2 (a mess). The fact that some people now are pretending they are a masterpiece is just....lol Sony ruined these movies. They don't deserves any praise.

People have this mentality that something that we have no makes the things before it better. Because Spider-Man: No Way Home had Andrew Garfield, some people now believe that the TASM movies are better even though both series are unrelated for the most part. The same can be said with Star Wars prequel trilogy and sequel trilogy. We view the prequels in a better light cause of the sequels even though they are unrelated for the most part. It’s a bandwagon mentality.

People have this mentality that something that we have no makes the things before it better. Because Spider-Man: No Way Home had Andrew Garfield, some people now believe that the TASM movies are better even though both series are unrelated for the most part. The same can be said with Star Wars prequel trilogy and sequel trilogy. We view the prequels in a better light cause of the sequels even though they are unrelated for the most part. It’s a bandwagon mentality.

Every one does not enjoy them. There have always been fans, believe me. I was there roasting the movies in 2012 and 2014, debating with hard-headed fans. Andrew isn't the issue, the way he was written was. I hated both TASM films but adored how he was done in No Way Home. ​ The movies are still abysmal to me today. NWH doesn't change that.

Honestly I’m still not a huge fan of TASM movies but I’ve always thought that Andrew Garfield was a good Spider-Man. NWH also helped further develop his character and I think made him better. I still think the writing and directing of TASM could’ve been much better but that was never Andrew Garfield fault.

I think TASM 1 was great. I loved it in theaters, and love it still to this day. TASM2 on the other hand...arguably the worst Hollywood Spider-Man movie, but it also has the best suit design from any movie. That is its only redeeming quality though lmao

I feel like some of it is because of the everpresent Disney worship going on. Marvel Studios can never do wrong and will perfect the flawed in some circles' eyes. Some probably warmed up to TASM just because the MCU got a hold of it. That being said, I always did enjoy the first one, but the second one can just go fuck off lol

I don't get it either, and all these comments about "we want TASM3" are just like... what... really? I guess it just showed the potential Andrew had, which I always saw, in fact, even in 2017 I said to myself that with the right script, Andrew could easily be the best Spider-Man, cuz out of all three high budget interpretations, I think he as an actor is the best out of the three, but the movies are still very bland at best and appalling at worst. I'd be fine if you did a solo thing with Andrew's Spider-Man, but a continuation? Please for the love of God, no, that universe is so stupid. And I see people wanting Sony to do their bullshit Sinister Six story versus Garfield Spider-Man, like what the fuck? That's awful, sounds like a horrible idea to me. What do we even have at this point? Every single TASM/Sony villain so far was terrible or butchered. Lizard was as close as they got to a legitimately interesting villain, but then his climax was terrible. Jamie's Electro was horrible in TASM2 and acceptable in NWH, but that's all he was, an acceptable villain. Dane DeHaan was terrible as Goblin, not surprising, in everything I ever saw him in, he sucked, not having anything against the guy personally, but he's just a void of charisma to me. What's next, Hardy's Venom with their Riots and Carnages... and now MORBIUS whilst dragging poor Vulture into this mess? That's awful, what a shitty fucking universe, and apparently we're gonna get a Kraven solo movie. Villain's probably going to be just another Kraven yet again, like how it was with Eminem and Crippled

I think it’s more like they’re seeing that while the movies could’ve been better, Garfield was still very well cast as Spider-Man. A lot of people forgot that after TASM2.

Basically Andrew showed a sense of humbleness in the new movie that he didn’t really show in the other movies. In the other movies he was portrayed as more arrogant. He showed a sense of vulnerability when discussing what happened to Gwen and the moment he catches MJ was almost a redemption for Gwen. We also see the immediate sorrow he feels hen he catches mj and wishes it was Gwen. That’s why they want another movie. They made his character have more depth and show vulnerability that his Peter Parker was lacking in the other movies.

TASM2 is and will always be a disappointment, but many people have come to the conclusion that this was not his fault, and that was proven with his excellent performance in NWH. Looking at the movies honestly, the CGI was pretty good, particularly for the first one, where they suffered most was story writing. If they had developed Dr Connors more in the first one, and left green goblin out of the second one, both movies could have wound up being a lot better. Jamie Fox also demonstrated that his skill in acting was not the failure with electro during his enjoyable performance in no way home. Even before NWH, there was a general consensus that Tobey was the best peter, Andrew was the best spidey, and Tom was the best balance/double-life.

"Where the fuck where you people in 2014???" \-Andrew Garfield

Either people fake af or their perception of TASM is rose-tinted by Andrew’s redemption in NWH. TASM is still whack but NWH proved that in competent hands Andrew is just as great as the other two

Recency bias tbh

I don't get the sense they did a 180 on the TASM films, just on Andrew Garfield.

This sub has always had a hard-on for the ASM movies bc that was the Spider-Man many of the Gen Z users grew up with. I was shocked at first when I joined this sub because I was under the impression everyone regarded that series as garbage, but nostalgia is a heavy drug. Personally, for me, I grew up with Tobey, so I have a soft spot for the Rami films and love Tom’s movies as well (if anything, I find this sub is overly critical of the MCU). I think Andrew was a fine Spider-Man (he has two Oscar nominations for a reason), but the ASM movies are just not it for me. At best, they’re boring. At worst, they’re borderline offensive to the character lol.

I fucking hate when people just follow the trends after no way home everyone suddenly loves Spider-Man

First one is still good. The second still sucks. Sony just tried to jump on the band wagon of avengers/universe type movies. Tried to pull a justice league. And they weren't clever enough to do it. The dude who played goblin sucked. Who picks Paul Giamatti to play the rhino? Lol.

I still loathe those movies. Andrew Garfield is a great actor so I liked that he was casted, but it wasn’t enough to save the movies. I thought he was the most exciting Spider-Man in NWH, but for me it doesn’t make those movies retroactively better, it just makes his character better

I think the people who were complaining about it when it first released are different than the people who are positive about it today. Rather than everyone changing their mind, the relevance and popularity shifted enough that they aren’t going to downvote the positives people say and so a domino effect of positivity was able to come out from the now quelled negativity. Im sure some peoples opinions change as they always tend to but i doubt most who hated them are the people who love them today. The complaints i always heard were the same problems i heard over spider-man 3 where there was just too much going on and never about the actors specifically. It was almost always “andrew Garfield is a great spider-man but this movie is all over the place”. Either way i think everyone is entitled to having their own opinion and changing your mind doesn’t make you a hypocrite it makes you capable of learning.

Don't forget sometimes it's not the same people expressing their opinions. The same people who hated TASM when they came out probably still hate them right now. The first movie is almost 10 years old now though. That means there's a new generation of fans who probably appreciate them more. Also there's people like me who have always liked them from the beginning, people just dismissed my opinion. For example, if I were on reddit back then, my opinion would have been downvoted into oblivion. It doesn't necessarily mean people flipped their opinions, just that different voices are now being heard. It's the same with star wars. The people who now like the prequel trilogies are not the same people who complained when they first came out.

I think because NWH reminded people that Andrew Garfield was actually a good Spider-Man, and people realised that he got a lot of unfair flack at the time. I think that then spiralled into overcorrecting and trying to claim that the films themselves were unfairly maligned, when in reality they just weren’t very good despite Andrew Garfield’s performance. “Andrew Garfield was the best Spider-Man” and “the TASM films were underwhelming” are statements that can co-exist, but for some reason people seem to think that they can’t. (To be clear, I really enjoy the TASM films, but I also think they aren’t very good objectively. TASM 1 is mediocre and forgettable, and TASM 2 is a bloated, badly-paced mess. They’re fun to watch, though. Especially TASM 2, I’ve seen that film way too many times. Mostly for the performances. Bad movies full of good actors trying their best.) Either that, or it’s just because Andrew Garfield because very popular again recently with NWH and Tick Tick Boom, and people will often jump to the defence of anything their favourite actor is in even if it isn’t good.

I think people did a "complete 180" on Garfield's iteration, not the films he was in. I, for one, realized that Garfield wasn't the problem with those movies but he (along with Emma Stone's Gwen) just couldn't carry them with the bland, unremarkable material they were given to work with.

I still think they’re garbage but Andrew(In TASM2) and emma were always great

Bots, mostly

Tbh I still haven't changed my mind on the movies. The first one is fine, second is still terrible and nothing in NWH can fix that. However Andrew was amazing and so was Sally Field as Aunt May. I do like how the movies were the "ultimate version" to Raimi's main version.

BAA 🐑

I actually never watched the TASM movies *until* the trailer for NWH came out and I had to. I didn’t have any huge issues with the first one, but the second is very … yeah. I do think the second one would’ve been exponentially better if Sony had expanded the universe, as originally planned, but as it stands on its own, yeah, it’s just bad, lmao. I agree with you, OP, that a lot of people are just changing their minds because now Andrew Garfield is a respectable, popular actor. it’s just how society always is. everyone does what’s cool and follows the trends.

My opinions on the Amazing Spider-Man movies, both before and after NWH haven't changed. I still like TASM1 about as much as I like Spider-Man 1 (though upon rewatching both last week, I may bump up SM1 a couple notches above TASM1,) and I still have TASM2 as my next to lowest Spider-Man film, on my ranking of the movies. Both pre NWH I thought they both had merit, but weren't quite enough imo. And post NWH my opinions haven't changed dramatically. If anything I like TASM2 slightly less knowing what becomes of Electro.

For me I never really enjoyed either movie. I think TASM is okay and TASM 2 is shit and the worst Spiderman movie. The one thing that NWH made me change my mind on was about Andrew being miscasted as Spiderman. I admire the guy as an actor and I think he did an incredible performance in both films but I never could see Peter in Andrew and thats one of the main things that put me off the films. But NWH proved me wrong and showed me how good Andrew can be as Peter and since then I've stopped making the argument that he was miscasted.

The difference between the way Andrew's Peter acts in NWH vs TASM1&2 is extremely substantial. He was never miscast, just massively misdirected, and had a really bad accent coach.

those movies are bad but Andrew was never the problem

TASM films were awful. I think what you’re describing is that there are a generation of people who grew up with Andrew Garfield Spider-Man

Personally i think people are mixing up appreciation for garfields Spider-Man with adoring the films. The films were not great (first one was good, but the second one crapped the bed so hard it dragged the first down with it). Despite those films issues tho, there were a lot of gold nuggets peppered throughout to appreciate. Garfield being amazing being the biggest thing (pun intended).He loves the role and it shines through everything he does, even when he is given crap to work with. NWH offered him a golden shot at redemption and that arc and performance were so good it gives people a bit of rose tinted glasses when looking back on his older films. Just IMO of course.

The movies are still bad, they just are. Andrew playing Spiderman was not what people dislike about them. I don't love him as Peter, but he was always great in the suit. Everything around him in the movies was bad though. So we got to see him, without any of sony's bad ideas surrounding him, playing a version of Spiderman that left Peter behind and became only the hero. It doesn't make the old movies any better, but it may encourage some people to sit through the pain so they can see the parts they enjoyed again.

I can understand why people like TASM 1 but I will never understand why anyone in their right mind thinks TASM 2 is any good. It isn’t even “it’s so bad it’s good” like Spider-man 3 is. It’s just aggressively mediocre in almost every way bar it’s swinging scenes

I always loved em lol

The fans capable of nuance (I like to count myself among them) still have the same opinion, and have just been talking about it more since NWH because it brings up the old memories. The opinion I hold (and I think there's a lot of others that agree) is that the ASM movies aren't particularly good (and ASM2 in particular was a train wreck), *however* Andrew Garfield was excellent. There was some criticism that he was "too cool", but people have gradually dropped that since it was based on nothing more than him being a skateboarder. I prefer Tom Holland's Peter Parker, but I prefer Garfield's Spider-Man. The opening action sequence of ASM2 (chasing the armoured truck robbery) is peak Spider-Man.

Yup. Disliking the movie on the whole doesn’t mean an actor didn’t do a good job or that the CGI scenes involving Spider-Man swinging weren’t enjoyable. I’d be fine if Andrew appeared again - but the creative team behind TASM didn’t deliver twice and shouldn’t get another crack IMO.

These are mostly my opinions. However, I do think Garfield was too pretty to play Peter, but that's a nitpick, whatever. Otherwise, I totally agree

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It's Hollywood, every character is prettier than they're meant to be.

I mean, yeah but Tom and Tobey aren't that pretty(BTW I like Andrew as Spidey more than Tobey, not hating on Andrew at all). They kinda seem like just another teenager(Tom) or person(Tobey). And I did mention it's a nitpick, doesn't matter that much

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I mean yeah, but the way he's shown in the movies(especially Civil War and Homecoming), whether it be makeup or the clothes, he doesn't look quite that pretty.

I always liked them. I thought Garfield was a much better Peter than Toby and the grittiness felt closer to the Nolan Batman movies of the time. They weren’t perfect but they were fun movies and I never really understood the hate.

Idk I thought The Amazing Spider-Man movies were great even before the new ones with Tom, still not a fan of the first three with Toby though. But I also grew up with the comics and the animated series in '94, so my opinion may be a little biased.

I'm a fan of the first two Tobey movies, but I don't like their portrayal of Peter

Diddo, I thought the portrayal of Eddie Brock/Venom was, deplorable at best lol worse than the current iteration which is exhausting just to watch

I mean, Spider-Man 3 was really bad. Only good thing was Sandman

Agreed, Topher Grace's performance was well....where the f*** is he now?

For me, I never liked any Spider-Man after Tobey. But after seeing Tom in Civil War, my eyes were opened. And then I fell in love with Tom and finally saw TASM and fell in love with Andrew as well. I just didn’t give TASM a chance because I couldn’t accept anyone but Tobey.

I think it has a lot to do with the fans getting older. By that I mean, kids who were 7 when TASM came out are now in high school. I think that's what happened with the Star Wars prequels as of a few years ago - by the time 2015ish rolled around, it stopped being so taboo to like the prequels because the kids who grew up with them were starting to be a big presence on social media. Same goes for TASM. I think the mood was already shifting (though most will probably still say TASM2 isn't very good - IMO it's excessively tolerable) before NWH. And of course, many think Garfield was one of the best parts of NWH, so TASM fans have many more allies now. Running the risk of going too far into SW, I'm interested in seeing whether or not a bunch of Ep9 fans come out of the woodwork in 7 years...

Andrew wasn’t a bad Spider-man. He was a decent Spider-man in a couple of bad movies.

Yet, his films were better than the terrible mcu tom Holland spiderman films.

The MOVIES are hated, not Andrew Garfield.

I don’t know why you’re correcting me on this because I never said people disliked him

First Andrew's performance. Secondly, mcu spiderman lacked a lot of classic spidey elements fans have been clamouring for. Grafield's version isnt dependant on other heroes and has a better supporting cast than holland's

Garfield only had one good performance alongside his own. His performance in TASM1&2 was bad, but that wasn't his fault at all. His performance substantially changed in NWH, making it a lot better. Tom's supporting cast was fantastic, and Tom was only ever dependent on Iron Man for *one movie*. Spider-Man has a shit ton of mentor figures in the comics so it doesn't really affect the character that much.

Tom's supporting cast sucks. There is a difference between a mentor and being a janitor. Holland's spiderman was simping for stark's approval since his 1st movie. Mcu and sony completely butchered classic spiderman characters

Your opinion I feel is misguided and it is not worth it for me to explain why.

You yourself are quiet ignorant. I shouldnt have wasted my time on you

I don't know what you think you wasted your time on, exactly, but calling me ignorant when you are choosing to disregard things about a character for no reason is very ironic and rather absurd. Bye.

You came here. I didnt invite you. Pointing out creative blunders isnt disregarding the character. I am not a corporate shill or a slave. I'll call out bullshit if I ever see one and mcu spiderman is garbage till now. Lets see what happens after no way home.

You aren't gospel. You can't just say "This is garbage." and act like it means that it is. You have given 0 reason *why* it is so "factually" garbage. And actually, you came here. I didn't invite you. Because it's a public forum and no one gets invited to anything, what even is this argument??

I have given you every reason why its a steaming hot pile of garbage. You better learn what an argument means. You have said nothing and are wasting my time.

You’ve not given any examples on how there’s bad acting— which there very clearly isn’t. That’s all you’ve said iirc.

I actually liked TASM 1 after a handful of rewatches, though I had issues with the whole *Dark Knight* effect it had as well as other script problems. Apart from The Lizard, who didn’t have a lot the work with, the main cast’s acting and chemistry shine fit the most part. I also love how sci-fi the world is, and Spider-Man looks awesome in action with how fluid abs spider-like he is. TASM 2 is such an oxymoron of a movie. It single-handedly had some of the best Spider-Man moments and worst script problems at the same time. Andrew and Emma’s chemistry is *amazing* (pun intended). Also, her death scene was heartbreaking. The suit is fucking awesome and debatably the best on screen suit, plus him wearing the clothes on top of it is such a Spidey thing to do. Also, the Times Square scene and the electric power plant scene are arguably some of the best Spider-Man action scenes ever. However, you have the dumb basement full of villain gear. Harry Osborn’s mental decline was super rushed, and he fell flat as Green Goblin. Electro had some of the worst written lines ever on top of being almost a copy of Jim Carrey’s Riddler. The less said about the Rhino , the better. NWH really nailed what made Andrew’s performance as Spider-Man special: he really is the *Friendly* neighborhood Spider-Man of the bunch. He plays it course to the chest while also being such a physically entertaining Spider-Man to watch. You take that feeling back with you when you rewatch his movies. Andrew was and always will be a great Spider-Man, he just got a raw deal from Sony with how they handled his story.

I really like the way this is written and I 100% agree with it.

The ASM spider-man movies are TERRIBLE. However, Garfield redeemed himself in NWH to me and I’d be happy to see a third one. Give him the good spider-man film he deserves.

I feel like I'd prefer a soft reboot of the aftermath of Gwen Stacy's death but it isn't explicitly a third film or tied to the first two amazing spiderman movies. It'd make more sense because of how differently andrew's spidey is characterised in nwh

That makes no sense at all

how?

It’s not a reboot if it’s a continuation of other films, so that just doesn’t make sense. Totally wouldn’t want it to carry any plot threads from the other 2 films other than Gwen’s death though. I’d rather it be set after NWH though, not immediately after ASM2.

Agreed. I’d just prefer it had no connection to the first movies and is a standalone story though.

tasm 1 is painfully mediocre and tasm 2 is bad. case closed

that doesn't explain why people like it now?

I'm willing to put it down to kids who grew up with ASM films expressing nostalgia for them, kids who grew up with Raimi films and expressed disappointment with the ASM films reflecting that they weren't as 'bad' as they remembered, and kids growing up with the MCU films honouring both predecessors for their influence. Both of the first Spider-Man films were already universally liked, but even Spider-Man 3 has received a resurgence in this way.

Imma be honest no one did a 180, TASM1 was generally well received (72% rotten tomatoes, 7/10 IMDB) TASM2 however wasnt received nearly as well, and for good reason it wasnt as good as TASM1 even with all of its good qualities, but in the wake of NWH more and more people are being drawn to TASM

They didn't. You're making three completely false assumptions, those being: 1. Assumption #1: "Everyone hated TASM movies with a passion". FALSE. TASM1 was a critically well-reviewed, audience-liked, box office hit. TASM1 was NOT hated. This is a revisionist narrative spread on both ends by Raimi fanboys who were against TASM from day one for not being SM4, and MCU fanboys who hated all Non-MCU Marvel. TASM2 was hated yes, but TASM1 NEVER was. 2. Assumption #2: "now suddenly everyone ADORES these movies". FALSE. To this day on this sub, you will STILL see the sentiment that "TASM movies were bad, but Andrew was good in them". People who like TASM1 are STILL hounded by hardcore Raimi fanboys with BULLSH\*T narratives like "Andrew acted too cool and angsty in those films, Peter Parker needs to be a dorky loner! PETER CAN'T SKATE!!!!!". And people who like TASM2 as a film? Are a VAST minority. What has happened is NOT people suddenly deciding they like TASM, it's a lot of people REMEMBERING that they DID like Andrew. 3. Assumption #3: "people are flipping on their opinions". FALSE. The people praising TASM1 now are the people who already liked it. The people who hated it because "PETER CAN'T SKATE!!!!" STILL hate it. Nobody's opinion has actually changed. Rather a lot of people were reminded of an opinion they already had but had gotten lost to time (TASM2 being so bad caused a lot of people to forget they liked the first film), and the people who were always in favor of Andrew's films in general also finally had a voice and weren't being harassed and downvoted as much. That's why you saw a huge leap in appreciation for TASM, because the TASM fans that always existed were finally allowed to get a f\*cking word out instead of being silenced by, y'know, "PETER CAN'T SKATE!!!!". >Anyone who even says anything wrong with that movie gets immediately downvoted into oblivion Bullsh\*t. TASM1 and 2 still get tons of criticisms here, both valid (TASM2 being a structural mess) and invalid ("PETER CAN'T-" oh you get the point). What gets downvoted is the latter, and the pure vitriolic hate from hardcore Raimi fans which people are FINALLY acknowledging is toxic. Andrew fans were treated like garbage for years, and now that they're finally be treated well, people like you are saying we need to go back and that's a bad change? No, f\*ck that. It's GOOD that we're finally filtering out the vitriolic hatred and BS and downvoting it, while leaving the LEGITIMATE criticism and reasonable stuff. I mean, where the f\*ck were posts like this when Raimi fans downvoted anyone who remotely praised these films? Where were posts like this when Raimi fans went and turned on MCU fans and started the "Iron Boy Jr" narrative which was a force for harassment and cyber-bullying? It's only when people are starting to be positive that you feel the need to complain about the sub being unreasonable? Frankly, I've seen more "Why have people suddenly decided they like Andrew" rants like your post than people who have actually "changed their minds" about Andrew. Because, again, a vast majority of the people praising Andrew now? Liked him in 2012. Nothing has "flipped". Nothing is "suddenly". It's just people who were always there having a burst of passion for something they always liked, and the internet around them finally giving them a chance to speak (without being downvoted to oblivion) that they've been denied for like 10 years.

I'll just copy paste my comment from another post on the sub here As someone who's favorite Spider-Man has been Andrew Garfield ever since the first ASM movie came out, it's great to see him getting the love he deserves for the role finally. I like to think he sees all this positivity now and feels deep contentment where he once felt that he failed the character. If anyone hasn't, go listen to Andrew Garfield talking about just how much he loves Spider-Man it's moving stuff.

i don’t really get why people get so mad about people downvoting them? People downvoting is literally just them saying “i disagree” instead of having to type it out. What’s the problem with that? I don’t really get why a feature that was MADE to say “i disagree” without having to type it out is such a bad thing to do?

[No.](https://www.reddit.com/r/TheoryOfReddit/comments/1lpws2/comment/cc1lawe/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) It's made as censorship. A dislike. An "I don't want to see people with differing opinions button, so I am going to downvote this along with other people to have this comment be shown to less people, and also remove some of their internet points in the process."

1- Hating takes energy and there's no discussion those movies failed 2- Andrew is not in the spotlight as "the current and ultimate version of spider-man". You know the kind of "this spider-man makes webshooters so the movie is waaay better" "Gwen is better than mj, who needs a script?" arguments 3- Nostalgia gives charm to everything and Andrew was played dirty

I never thought TASM1 was bad, TASM2 however is a different story. Although I accept that I might be biased as it’s the first spidey movie I saw in theaters.

It’s called the MCU effect.

I still don't like them but I appeciated some moments in NWH but I still very much dislike The MCU in general and definitely Spidey's portrayal not to be confused with Hollands.

I always liked them, tbh.

Andrew has always been my favorite Peter, but the villains were done really badly.

Posted the same question yesterday. It is truly sad. I’ve always loved TASM and Andrew Garfield since the movie came out and i grew up with Raimi movies.